hugely agree with the 2nd paragraph, these results can't be generalized to the larger group of ketogenic dieters but it is anyway

On dietary saturated fat: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/gc18orp7u9ushH0.html

"Was that Carnivore Kid guy with a six pack and a 95% clogged windowmaker artery a lean mass hyper-responder?" - No he wasn't. I actually chatted with Michael R. after the event. Sad case. He went 'carnivore' AFTER he found out he had advanced disease. He has a strong family history and actually a mutation in one of the ANGPTL proteins involved in our LEM model to explain LMHR. In my convos with Michael I was clear that, while I couldn't give medical advice, his was a case in which I would have accepted treatment and - thought I didn't tell him this - were I him with his coronary findings I probably would be eating more tempeh and less buttered steak. His story has been distorted for propaganda, which is sad. Sorry not going to get to all your points... time pressed... trying to drive though some replies. Thanks for watching!

Average age of the study subjects is 55.

just seams to me that hes starting with a desperate need to find a result. that if you eat tons of sat fat but exercise and stay lean your not increasing your risk of heart disease. why would you get on a diet like that.

Thanks for this!

Thanks for this reply!!!

I would be very interested to hear whether you ate a lot of oats and various other grains when you were eating vegan? It sounds like you might have cealiac disease.

@@annwilliams6438 I do not. Have been tested

Interesting numbers. Can anyone answer my question if I'm a LMHR? I've always been very lean and quite muscular. Can eat whatever I want without gaining weight even without exercise. The slightest gain i weight is concentrated around the abdomen. I'm for sure a TOFI (Thin Outside Fat Inside) Normal healthy diet with carbs; Tot.chol 6,5 LDL 4,5 HDL 0,6 Trig 2 In attempts to increase my HDL I've tried a LCHF-diet/ketosis. My HDL-levels is raised but is still too low; Tot.chol 8 LDL 6 HDL 0,8-0,9 Trig 1,5 - 2 My lipids differ from the criteria LMHR with a low HDL. Any thoughts? Am I insulinresistent?

What did you eat on keto?

Isn't it interesting that Dayspring refuses to acknowledge I exist? In the past year+ on Twitter he's not replied to even one of my questions. I even had a Tweet naming him specifically w/ >200K impressions... and not a single comment

@@nicknorwitzPhD You’re only 2 degrees of separation away from Tom Dayspring, who I believe now works at Peter Attia’s clinic. Your associate Dave Feldman has been on Peter’s podcast. Perhaps try a more personal approach to contacting him through Dave and Peter?

@@brucerubenstein7843 I've tried several ways: direct question, intermediary messaging, etc. He's aware I exist. When he's prepared to chat he knows how to find me.

@@nicknorwitzPhDIn my mind this is clear evidence of 2 things, being 1. An inability to come up with a satisfactory answer and knowing it, and 2. An irrational and / or emotional attachment to the status quo.

Try popping all the food you eat on cronometer to see if you have any micro nutrient deficiencies of your diet.

Congratulations on the progress!

@@janco333 Thanks for the idea, I'm also planning on getting blood work done at the 6 and 12 month markers.

@@eugenetswong Thank you!

You're welcome. 😄@@williamdixon4936

Can you explain a bit more what you mean by "dose response eating"? Sounds interesting, thanks.

Two weeks ago my total cholesterol was 274, I went full plant based, just had cholesterol tested again today, came back 185. It is incredible how bad meat and dairy is.

sounds like it could be that your keto diet as accidentally an elimination diet for foods that you were sensitive to. Have you tried doing a proper elimination diet and slowly reintroducing foods, tracking them as you do to try and determine what specifically is causing GI issues?

@@MB10097 it could also save them from other diseases: on average, all-cause mortality seems lowest with an LDL level of about 150mg/dl, or 4 mmol/l, and HDL of about 75 mg/dl, or 1.9 mmol/l, and the risks go up faster the lower the numbers. LDL seems to vary quite a lot between individuals though, and is likely more of a marker than a cause of disease (which explains why all-cause mortality does not improve with statins). Plant sterols can also be used to lower LDL, but it is unknown to me whether that is actually beneficial, at least I haven't seen any long term data, unlike with statins.

@@sandywendelfred8260 It's no accident that removing factory food and going whole food, low carb, make you healthy. Health has only gone down as factorys making food increased

smart choice! It works because it's natural.

Stick to you diet. Use olive oil instead of saturated fats, and there are always cholesterol tablets to take if all else fails.

Great logic. It's called "confirmation bias". Dietary extremes (vegan and carnivore) are very vulnerable to it...both appear to have mental blocks to alternative info and research. Sick people seem to have success with "elimination diets" of which vegan and carnivore are both examples

6 years ago, stress induced IBS was diagnosed, cut things out added stuff back. Stable, for 4 years on pescatarian diet, with much reduced refined carbs. Then, one bad flare up and a diagnosis if inflammatory bowel disease. I am now on a mainly vegetarian diet, carbs pretty much inline with traditional food pyramid. All bread is now high quality grains and home baked. All symptoms gone. It seems to me the modern highly processed diet is not good for longevity and not good for coping with personal stress or emotional trauma. Our gut becomes sensitised by the toxic crap in modern food and we get to a point where even foods that are good for us cause inflammation.

Regarding Gil, I really like his open-minded approach. It’s pretty clear after you watch him for a while that he is vegan or nearly vegan, but I see him talk all the time about doing what works for oneself and how plenty of different foods can be part of a healthy dietary pattern.

I mean if you're eating keto and your LDL is low, great, if it's high, great

Yeah, I no longer worry about lipids. I am more concerned with insulin resistance and blood sugar levels. As long as we don't eat sugar or processed foods, most of us should do fine.

You're making an assumption that LDL still matters. I would argue it may not matter. The medical community may be wrong about it. It wouldn't be the first time.

But it also kind of supports the idea that LDL is not causal, but triglycerides, right? Not a confirmation, but definitely a smoking gun.

Thank you!

Hope you enjoy it

Thanks! I wasn't smart enough either and had to do a lot of work to understand their model and study.

@@PlantChompers you definitely put the work in and it didn't go unrecognized!

@@nicknorwitzPhD Why don't you talk to Dr. Avi?

If you don't have any specific issues that deserve some tuning or experimentation, a standard mediterranean-style diet is the safest bet. It contains all you need and leaves room for variation.

but how is your blood sugar??? you add these carbs you are susceptible to getting diabetes, i would stay keto, mediterranean is to much carbs

@@joesylvia607 it seems like everyone in the US is obsessed with diabetes, everything is about extremes there. If you eat sensibly you don't need to worry about that, nothing wrong with carbs for most people

DYOR. I have and discovered a lot of people have been carno/keto for years with no problems. Cholesterol was high. I think the medical community needs a reset on cholesterol. More and more evidence coming out is challenging the current establishment beliefs.

that's an eating disorder@@joesylvia607

Appreciate it :)

Because its not Cholesterol that causes the damage. The Cholestetol is part of the repair mechanism so it shows up like a scab shows up from a cut on your arm. Lions and other obligate carnivores blood is loaded with lipids and cholesterol and yet they dont have plugged up damaged arteries.

This study is determining if this type of cohort has more plaque and baseline than controls, and if after a year there is more or less plaque progression than normal or in other cohorts. If it turns out to be much less plaque than expected, then it would suggest that the ldl is only damaging in a non LMHR context

@@CashMoneyMoore Rather that "... the high LDL-c is not damaging to arteries in LMHRs". There can be, and are, other scenarios where LDL-c is harmless as well, which the study does not address. I have been hyped for the study since well before it started. This question of the formation of plaques and other lipid deposits is very confusing. For example: do LMHRs get xanthomas or xanthelasma? What is really going on at the molecular level at the border between blood and arterial wall?

lol, me too! :)

He said the study day will measure both soft and hard plaque

Appreciate it

Thank you!

This confused me too. Oreos are highly processed and high in saturated fat. Would make more sense to use a low-fat whole food carb sources.

​@MB-yu6ir possibly. Definitely seems like he is setting it up to fail. No one in the plant based community thinks things like oreos are healthy.

1:14:50 He explains why he chose Oreos. It draws more attention to his experiment and (hopefully) makes it more clear that the experiment isn't a health intervention, its more in the realm of a diagnostic for his LMHR phenotype.

@@williamdixon4936 Thanks! Perhaps I should’ve watched the entire video before commenting. Perhaps it'll all make sense once I have.

@@el-bov8034 absolutely, its a reasonable concern! Hope you enjoy the rest of the interview, I sure did :)

Thanks!

What image did you have of him and why?

@@saintwithatie Unscientific “low carb hack”. I think we need to get out of tribal echo chambers and have open dialogue.

Well... thanks for admitting you were swayed by a false narrative. I'm not so bothered by the rumors and lies with concern to my ego... but I think it undermines good discussion. If someone wants to raise an accusation, I feel that's fair but it needs to be concrete, direct, and supported by evidence, e.g. 1:21:52.

that's brilliant! I went WFPB but with a little bit of oil and salt 4 years ago. I didn't have too much weight to lose, but I lost a couple of kilos. The more I think about the more sense it makes: for health, for the animals, for the planet.

My BMI runs between 18 and 19 so definitely lean.

Why not eliminate all meat?

@@JakeRichardsong Why?

How did it affect your trigs and HDL? I'm asking because my LDL went up a lot when I changed to low carb but my trigs decreased and my HDL increased. I am still a little bit overweight. All my other blood results are within the "normal" ranges, I'm now insulin sensitive and my liver tests are good. Thank you.

This is because clinical trials look at averages over many people and only look at one change in isolation. When you look at trials where results for each participant is shown, you can see this more clearly. On any given dietary change (keto, vegan, low fat, fasting, etc) you will have some people improve (usually most people - if the dietary change results in less processed food and fewer calories) and others get worse.

Most clinical trials are not scientific. In fact if you research it most of them are wrong or very flawed.

Dude you don’t know what you are talking about 😂

@@AdAm-cw3gi actually I do. Tell me why folks with lower LDLs still get heart attacks - from a 2009 UCLA study: Specifically, these patients had low-density lipoprotein (LDL) cholesterol levels that met current guidelines, and close to half had LDL levels classified in guidelines as optimal (less than 100 mg/dL). "Almost 75 percent of heart attack patients fell within recommended targets for LDL cholesterol, demonstrating that the current guidelines may not be low enough to cut heart attack risk in most who could benefit," said Dr. Gregg C. Fonarow, Eliot Corday Professor of Cardiovascular Medicine and Science at the David Geffen School of Medicine at UCLA and the study's principal investigator." ... Researchers also found that more than half of patients hospitalized for a heart attack had high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol levels characterized as poor by the national guidelines. ________________________ This is in line with current research. So what's your LDL level? How about in relation to your HDL level? Low HDL is also a risk for disease. Your triglycerides are important too, as well your level of insulin resistance. That same study stated "the risk of cardiovascular events increases substantially with LDL levels above 40-60 mg/dL". If you LDLs are higher than that, are you going to go on a statin? The American Diabetes Association in 2023 is currently recommending LDLs below 70, and what to see it down around 50. So when I had my stroke I was pre-diabetic (insulin resistant) and had hypertension. My LDLs were great, though my HDL was lower than the minimum recommendation. My triglycerides were high. I wonder why I had an issue with such great LDL numbers though... So please tell me exactly where I'm wrong. Easy to say that from your keyboard. Making an argument is a little tougher.

No, this can never be tested experimentally as not all variables can be controlled.

That’s excellent re: being vegan in a non-vegan household. I’ve been trying to transition to WFPB but slip here and there because of all the non plant-based dishes I prepare - and all those non PB ingredients at home. And as someone who has epilepsy in their family I agree that this is a fascinating study. Revolutionary even.

What a lovely human response. Thank you

​​@@rambunctiousvegetableyeah...that's what i think when I see flesh... no longer appetizing... Diary doesn't make me as guilty as it should...but I'm still vegan ...for animals

​​@@rambunctiousvegetableHumans were hunter gatherers for hundreds of thousands of years. It's our evolutionary heritage and it's not wrong or evil. Stop denying our nature. The fact is most people find meat very delicious and nourishing and there's a good reason for that. It's an increadibly nutrient dense food. You won't change hundreds of thousands of years evolution in one generation. As for your care for animals, do you have any carnivorous pets? Do you feed them dead animals?

My ldl was pretty high like 112 and I ate a ton of fiber but I was getting fat like 180 lbs like 26 BMI. I am cycling 6 days a week now and no more junk fats(I am assuming they are the culprit) from stuff like sweets, pizzas, and oils. My tris were also high as yours. I also added healthy fats like you flax seeds and walnuts. Will see how it affects me in 5 months.

@@KrazyKrzysztof Exercise will definitely improve your health but won't impact much on weight. It takes insane amount of exercise to burn miniscule ammount of fat. Also exercise will make you hungrier, so calorie control is a must. When I was doing mild calorie restriction what worked for me was Salads and soluble fibre drink, which filled my stomach mostly and reduced my cooked food intake. I don't even grind my chia seeds, basil seeds, so they don't provide me much healthy fats. They're just convenient fiber sources.

@mitesh8utube for sure. I am just eating good food while minimizing any junk. I have reduced my servings and I measure my food for things like smoothies because it's easy to overeat on stuff like peanut butter. I am lifting every third day and doing a lot of cardio. It will take time but I'm looking much leaner and less bloated at 175 5 foot 10

⁠​⁠@@KrazyKrzysztofone great way to help lose weight is have a big salad before every meal. You won’t really have to deal with portion control then because your stomach will tell you that you are full sooner. Check our Dr. Greger’s book “How Not to Diet” it’s packed full of science backed information. A whole food plant based diet without added (or at least limited) salt, oil, and sugar is great. Dump the peanut butter in the trash and eat peanuts IMO. And chew your fruits and vegetables instead of drinking them, like with a salad before meals, it helps your brain get the signal that it had enough to eat unlike with drinking when you can easily chug down too much. This helped me lose the 50lbs I gained during the pandemic and kept it off.

Yes. You are right. For most people, psyllium husk intake as soluble fibre is good enough. 😊

congratulations. You seem to have a lucky set of genes

Happy for you but it’s an extraordinary claim you make at the end of your comment. First it is a rather arrogant, and it is confusing because I have read many other KZfaq commenters making similar claims. In reality there is no objective way you could know that you are either fitter (undefined term), or healthier (also undefined term) than everyone you meet unless you meet only a extreme subset of the population. I guess you never meet very young very fit healthy athletes. And why would you even make this comparison? If you are are fit and healthy that’s the objective irrespective of anyone else’s condition.

@@marcdaniels9079 ok it's age related, but my 33 yr old niece is literally killing herself. It is heartbreaking when it's younger siblings. Even with their oldest brother as an example, they are trapped by their eating habits and maybe sign up for Weightwatchers yet again.... People think of vegetables as a garnish. The dietary recommendations are ridiculously conservative. One day I will exercise enough to justify adding bread back into my diet.

@@anawilliams7342 my own family are overweight and sick.

And veggies are YUMMY

It is to see what happens to his LDL, that is all.

Looking forward to the study’s results. Love this conversation. Do you think you’re having a harder time understanding, because you’re a bit resistant to the information presented? I agree, though, that this information doesn’t have to negate how and what you want to eat.

@@bonnieo8 yep you’ve got me pegged…oh wait nope, there is no definitive data yet.

I feel the same. No clear on what to take away from this for non-lmhr

Not sure if they get to it in here, but lots of LMHR have shown that adding 50-100g of carbs (with or without replacing the fat calories) significantly drop those LDLs.

FWIW I've been LMHR on as high at 40g fiber. It does have an impact (on me) but net carbs more so... far more so... hence the Oreos (in part)

Thank you for sharing. Can you elaborate: which metabolic parameter is impacted by fiber? LDL, glucose, etc? @@nicknorwitzPhD

@@justinhale5693 Sure. LDL tends to drop, although fiber type matters. I did a YT video on this a while back (kzfaq.info/get/bejne/paiDrbKSq9y7d58.html) In the short-term fiber rich foods may have an acute effect on increasing glucose area under the curve, but in a mixed diet condition the chronic effect tends to be lowering.

" then we have everyone with high LDL, thinking they LMHR" - not if we communicate clearly. But the responsibility here is on both sides. Those - not to be named - who use the term "LDL denier" do more of the inappropriate clumping than those interested in LMHR

Everything gets misunderstood, no matter what.

@@nicknorwitzPhD I expect it to be widely miss-used. Remember the Time "Butter is Back" cover. I wouldn't be surprised if Time has a "Cholesterol doesn't matter" cover...

That's my worry too. The LDL deniers will pick this up and use it in their propaganda.

@@MB10097 Can a glance be frightening? There are idiots everywhere, so what?

It's not irritable bowel syndrome, it's inflammatory bowel disease. After diagnosis I tried a least a dozen diets to help manage it, including low FODMAP, SCD, whole food vegetarian and vegan etc. Only a ketogenic diet has helped me. I would not generalize my experience, but since you asked...

Daniel from Lifting Vegan Logic had Crohn's disease and has been vegan for years. He has no symptoms whatsoever at this point and pretty amazing physique, too. Plant based diet is like heaven to me and I did low carb for 6 years which was pure nightmare. There is no one diet fits all.

@@Rose_Ou I am happy for you both! There is not one diet for everyone, I entirely agree! FWIW, I would love to have a platter of sweet potato with figs and goat cheese every now and then, but I'll do what I need to do for now to live life. If that means less sweet potato and more eggs, ago oil mayo, fatty fish (and maybe even some bugs sprinkled in - we didn't talk about entomophagy, but I'm a fan!), so be it! But if someone is thriving on Tempeh, Brussels and avocado, who am I to tell them otherwise.

Nick has inflammatory bowel disease, so he switched to a Keto diet after trying everything else and his symptoms significantly improved (I’m truly happy that he’s found a solution that offers him a better quality of life). But, now he’s latched-on to Dave’s LMHR nonsense to help ease his worries about developing cardiovascular disease from eating Keto.

Thank you. I'm also glad he found a way to ease his symptoms and agree he turned his anecdotal story into something that can make him stand out.

umm a lot of the lmhr are not young, by the way. You have taken the 50% out of context. Yes, you are missing something as you haven't listened to the video properly. He says he could probably walk into a gym and turn 50% of the people there into lmhr. He did not say anything about 50% of the population should be keto.

Point taken. I listened to it at double speed, so probably miss things.

LDL of about 150mg/dl, or 4 mmol/l, seems to be optimal, on average. From what I've read and heard of statins, their efficacy in terms of overall mortality, and the side effects, I'd never start them myself.

If you started eating keto, your lipids would probably go through the roof. Just make sure to avoid sugars and processed foods and get regular exercise to keep as healthy as possible. I refuse to take statins again.

They are stating that proper responsible communication of their research should prevent what you are inferring. Bless them, they are wrong, as anyone who has taken even a passing glance at keto chat threads knows. I hope that community's ideas don't end up _corrupting_ their communication about their research.

It's very simple My Aldi has everything I need right in front of the door. But I make room for canned beans and tomatoes. Walking past the weird pink stuff to get to the hummus is a bit unsettling. I wonder sometimes how I'm viewed as I pay for two huge IKEA totes of veggies.

When you say you both seem to be doing well, are you referring to health markers like LDL, or generally feeling well?

​@@CharlieFader We are both feeling well, and most of our bio-markers are good, but his LDL-C's are dimed while mine are in the cellar. There are SFA in all whole foods so they can't be avoided, but whereas I do my best to keep my SFA intake low, he embraces them. I'm worried about his SFA and dietary cholesterol intake. I believe that he's consuming considerably more than optimal, but he's believes differently so there you have it. I suppose I subscribe to the Grandmother Diet which is, "Eat you vegetables and lay off the meat!"

@@joecaner that’s to be expected I guess. And what is his reasoning for choosing a high SFA intake?

@@CharlieFader I’m sure you’re familiar with the justification. He believes that a high meat, low carb is the diet humans evolved eating and the reason that moderns in industrialized nations are getting sicker and fatter is because they’ve strayed from their natural diets. He’s experienced inflammatory pain, and this diet has ameliorated these symptoms and he has been able to obtain and maintain a healthy weight so he received benefits from this dietary pattern. His sources seem questionable and anecdotal, but it’s difficult to argue with success. Mindful of this, I do my best to engage him in conversations about research that recommend the benefit of lower SFA and dietary cholesterol intake, but it’s a nuanced and emotionally charged topic, and I am an engineer while he is an MD so I need to tread carefully when stating my case. I am well read and researching natural ways to avoid and treat health problems is a passion for me, but he is a doctor after all and this is his profession. He is deserving of respect for his training. It’s tricky.

@@joecaner yes, I expected something like that. Him being an MD and using such a justification is even more bizarre though.

My friends over at switch4good did a fascinating episode on the plant-based penis! kzfaq.info/get/bejne/fNigibGhteCql40.html

​@@PlantChomperssmashing.

👍

Thanks to you, I just read that study. It doesn't seem to say anything whatsoever about keto? It talks about, as the study title implies, 'high protein diets.' And while the study defines the diet of the 'treatment group,' the 'high protein diet' is left undefined, with no mention of its composition made. It is left undefined because the so-called 'high protein group' went and did whatever they felt like. To cite the study; "At the conclusion of the study, it became apparent that 10 of the 26 individuals, despite receiving dietary instruction as outlined below, had adopted a high-protein diet throughout the study." And they apparently didn't adhere to whatever mystery diet they went with? To cite the study; "Patients who went on high-protein diets reported varying degrees of satisfaction. Family reports typically reflected initial patient satisfaction, the patients getting to eat foods they 'enjoyed' along with initial weight loss, but difficulty sustaining the dietary pattern for the entire year. Instead patients tended to adhere to the diet for several months at a time, return to prior eating habits, and then return again in an effort to lose weight." They also treated each individual with medication based on their blood work; "Medical management was individualized based on the blood work obtained every 6 weeks. Independent adjustment of medications was made as a result of each patient’s blood work and was not based on the patients dietary habits. Table I shows the treatment guidelines employed. For example, a patient with elevated triglycerides and lipoprotein (a) would be treated with fenofibrate while a patient with only elevated lipoprotein (a) would receive Lovastatin." And treated patients with medication for any other issues they might have; "Patients with anginal symptoms were treated with standard drug regimens including the use of long-acting nitroglycerine (Imdur, Ismo), slow calcium channel antagonists (Procardia XL, Diltiazem,), Beta--blocker (Tenormin, Atenolol), L-arginine (endothelial dysfunction), and macrolide antibiotics (Biaxin) for elevated C-RP with acute-phase antibodies to H. pylori, C. pneumoniae, or S. pneumoniae. " This study is useless for drawing any conclusion about keto, if only because it isn't about keto. As an aside; There's a small oddity in the study. Look at the first quote I have from the study. "At the conclusion of the study" they found out that 10 of the 26 were on their own diet throughout the study. But in the third quote from the study it says "Independent adjustment of medications was made as a result of each patient's blood work and was not based on the patients dietary habits." Why would they specify that? If they 'found out at the end' it would be literally impossible to 'treat their blood work based on the patients dietary habits.' Because how could they treat the blood work based on the patients dietary habits, if they didn't know their patients had changed dietary habits 'til the end? Thanks for the clarification, I guess? Now we're safe from the misapprehension that the study authors used their time machine to inform their prior selves about the diet change.

According to him, he did try.

he tried vegan, but that's different from a low fat no oil whole food plant based diet. you can be 200 pounds overweight and sick with all kinds of things on a diet that's just vegan. @@what.the.bleep.do.i.eat.

I've tried. Unfortunately, WFPB did not work. When I say I tried... I do mean WFPB 0 UPF >6 weeks. I wish it did work. I honestly would love to chow on sweet potato with figs

@@nicknorwitzPhD I'm with you Nick. I would prefer a more plant heavy diet too but my IBS makes it essentially impossible. I really appreciate your research and your Mediterranean Keto book. I don't have to be fully Keto, just lower carb but I'm really trying to do it in a healthier way because I'm also not trying to speed run a heart attack. Cheers!

@@nicknorwitzPhDI’m with you, I daydream of baked potatoes piled high with beans, corn, fresh peas, bowls of oatmeal, rice and vegetables, and on and on. Those foods gave me over 30 years of painful digestion that put me to bed for days at a time with a heating pad. I wanted so much to be a starchivore or even just wfpb. No medical intervention and even abdominal surgery made a bit of difference. Like you, I cheer people who thrive with eating that way and I will fight for their right to continue without being maligned.

If LDL-C (LDL Cholesterol) levels are high, it's a near certainty that both LDL particle (LDL-P) and ApoB levels are high. This has been the case with the general LMHR population given the bloodwork we've seen to date.

Has been well into 300s. Trends with the LDL-C in general… enough so that it’s very high

Exactly. Show me the LMHR data after 20 years of 500+ LDL. I'll wait.

@@Amshatelia88 if they can show no plaque build up after a year or two, and in multiple age groups, there is no reason to assume a significant change in longer term follow-up, though it would be interesting nonetheless

oh no, he has never pushed this idea as a sure thing - he also emphasises that it is a hypothesis. He also says don't take his word for it, but that he is trying to learn more.

@@leenysnell8804 - unfortunately many low-carbers have been referencing Dave for a long time to justify their high-choleserol levels. Until the science is done they are risking their health on a hypothesis

@@yogiyoda if that is the case they are going against Dave's advice. In any case if they are whole food based they are still doing much more for their health than if they stayed on a diet full of processed foods.

@@leenysnell8804 - Maybe, depending on their particular situation, it's possible the low-carb diet drastically raising blood markers might be more dangerous

You are one easily swayed fellow. The study isn’t done yet. Usually several studies has to be done…

Maybe the lab made a mistake? My results are quite stable over time

and no change of diet and/or weight? My lab results are very stable for the past decade. What about LDL? HDL levels are pretty much meaningless.

@CharlieFader i am at my target weight. i gain 5 lbs, lose 5 lbs gain 5 lose 5. lol LDL was 190 last time. i quit all dairy so curios to see if that has an effect. all other markers are excellent, dropped all meds.

@@sharkair2839 so when hdl lowered and trigs rose, what happened to ldl levels?

Some very interesting stuff coming out of Harvard with keto diets for serious mental health. Check out Chris Palmer - this is using ketones as food for brain instead of glucose. Fascinating stuff!

@@leenysnell8804 If you have his book look on the first couple pages... you'll see I wrote an endorsement. Chris is a friend.

Prior to the rise of agriculture 10-12 kya the human diet would have necessarily been low carb as not a lot of readily available high carb plants present in the wild. Couple that with food scarcity and it’s my hypothesis that ketosis would have been a state humans would have been in for significant periods of time. Carbs when consumed would have been fruit or maybe honey for a short period of the year when it was in season and ripe. Those living in higher latitudes particularly during ice ages much like the modern inuit would have had little access to plant foods. We can infer a lot from this information

If I had to consume baby blood to live comfortably, I would choose the alternative.

Not required, but decreasing sat fat doesn't necessarily have a big impact on LDL-C in LMHR, a point we make

Everything on a low carb diet typically improves except LDL. hba1c, blood pressure, weight etc. etc.

much of the info is anticipatory. We have to wait 3-5 years after these have been properly studied and analysed objectively, without corporate interference.

@@CashMoneyMoore but why follow a diet that raises LDL? You can get improvements in all of them following a low saturated fat low carb diet.

@@CharlieFader saturated fat does not increase LDL

@@defeqel6537 it certainly does, it’s very clear.

Thanks!

bart kay has talked numerous times about LDL. i highly recommend checking him out. he does have lots of experience working in the field of nutrition and cardiology. basically.. there is zero evidence that high LDL is causal for any disease. no properly done interventional study exists proving the claims that high LDL is a problem. even in the context of FH, its not actually high LDL that causes disease and mortaIity but rather the inability to properly take up and utilize LDL. LDL is tightly regulated by the body according to what is going with your life. what makes that so are your genes. those genes have survived for hundreds of thousands of years, tightly regulating LDL according to the bodys needs. it would be ridiculous to assume that high LDL is somehow causal for disease when the body deliberately raises it when appropriate. exercise and losing body fat can raise LDL. does that mean exercise and losing body fat is absolutely bad 100% of the time? being sedentary and eating lots of sugar can lower LDL. does that mean we should be sedentary and eat lots of sugar everyday? i am not concerned about LDL. my genes were passed on to me from my ancestors hundreds of thousands of years ago. those genes that regulate LDL according to my needs know very well what theyre doing.