2015 tarmac comp $3000, $3800 in 2024 dollars. mech and rim brakes. 2024 tarmac comp $4500. di2 and disc brakes 2024 tarmac sport $3800. mech and disc brakes. just inflation

Faster and heavier don’t go together it’s the drugs that’s improved

@@Tarmaccyclocross actually, aero trumps weight 99% of the time.

@@happykanye I’m certain your example isn’t representative of the industry as a whole.

@@SecwetGwiwer cars didn’t actually get more expensive though. Bikes did sure, but cars got way better value for money. One of the few commodities that we are actually getting more for our money. Adjusting for inflation and ignoring the extremes of pricing, cars have stayed relatively the same since the 90s. However, cars are now significantly faster, more fuel efficient, safer, smarter, and more reliable. I.e. a Ford Mustang and Toyota Camry from the 90s pricing compared to now have relatively the same. The reason why cars feel more expensive is disposable income have dropped due to cost of living going up and other items going up higher than inflation.

French bikes still rule! I live in France and my Look 756 Optimum is boss! I also have elderly Peugeots with Simplex and Huret gears. Also, I mustn’t forget my Gitane Mach, 3 x chainwheel 1992 model, with Shimano GFX 7 speed. It has Columbus tubing and stainless spokes! I love silver on a bike. It shines in the hot sun! Black? Not so much.

Well, I guess most people don't replace their super expensive high end bike every year :)

I guess times have changed. Mid 2010s were about pretending to be a pro by hunting KOMs on Strava, whereas mid 2020s are about pretending to be a pro by riding absurdly priced disposable bikes that you can't adjust, fix, upgrade or maintain on your own anymore.

Good point. Surely your impression of local Strava is the most important metric.

@erich8258 good point I'm guessing you must have a much bigger data set than strava we could use?

@@erich8258 So... how's that new bike you just bought?

But with deep dish carbon 80s, now it's aero also

@@mmurmurjohnson2368 no thanks, we don’t ride in wind tunnels outside…

just need a threaded insert for a BSA BB and it is nothing more that most people will actually need. Still riding my 2009 Six Carbon (with stock gear levers) and my first release CAAD8 (Made in USA). The only trouble I know have is shortage of 10 sp groupset parts and scarces 23c tyres options...

I have a 2014 Supersix with the SRAM groupset, but I prefer the road feel of my 2001 Colnago C40. For a real magic carpet ride there was a titanium bike called the Ottrot. I believe it had a carbon fork. From a crotchty 70 year old who prefers rim brakes on road bikes and interchangeble components. This spring I've been almost exclusively riding a 1998 steel Colnago Technos. It's the only bike I have with a still working speedo. I've seen many trends come and go; it's all about the rider, not the bike. See you guys on the road!

100% mate

But only with SwissStop pads...

Agreed, and 99% of people complaining about how rim brakes are crap either only used stock pads and had no clue how to set up their brakes properly or they focus on the "carbon rims in the wet" argument, as if that was relevant for a significant number of bike users and for a significant amount of their riding experience. Oh, and rim wear? My Zondas have done over 20.000 km and over 200.000 m of ascent (and descent) including in the wet and their rims are barely worn. Easily good for at least as much more riding.

People don't complain about the stopping power on dry tarmac. They complain about stopping power in the wet, mud, or other suboptimal conditions. Further: With disk brakes, you do not have to re-build your expensive rims every couple of years. Instead you swap your brake rotors for 20 bucks each. When it comes to adjusting improvements, you'll get that from using hydraulics over cables. If you use hydraulic rim brakes, you'll have this advantage as well.

@@NevermindXY Eh? My wheels are 17 years old....

After adjusting for VAT and exchange I don't think that's a lot more than a $1,000 USD. Trek Domane AL2 R2000 and Trek Rim $999.99 Trek Domane AL2 Gen 4. R2000 & Tektro Mech Disc $1,199.99 Canyon Endurace 7 R7000 with Hyd Disc $1599 Canyon Endurace 7 R7100 with Hyd Disc $1,699 I think Tiagra is on it'a way out possibly. Nothing available in common sizes in the major brands I checked.

@@gk5891 That's true. Weight is another thing - spending a grand and still ending up with a bike closer to 10kg. There's a bike by a small UK manufacturer, Boardman SLR 8.9, which is Shimano 105, Carbon 8.9kg carbon frame, £1200. Not entirely sure it's available overseas but pretty tough to beat right now.

@@thomHD Riddle sent me a promotional for $1299 Aluminum and $1799 CF with R7100. Also the Van Rysel Aluminum is $1,199 with 105. If you start with a $4,649 Frameset like the Canyon Ultimate CFR it's going to be expensive with any groupset. When I can buy a new USA Ti Frameset for $1,150 its hard for me to justify 4x the money for glorified plastic.

Beautiful bikes. My CR1 was stolen a few years ago. I miss it. Black and silver. Super classy!

I beg to differ. I have two rim brake bikes and two disc brake bikes. I retired one rim brake bike the other day and the second will be on my rollers. it is an amazing bike, but after going for 30mm on my main bike it is no going back. it's slower and less comfortable. And I don't have the same confidence especially since the rim brake surface is worn on it. The world moves on.

@@GeirEivindMork I agree.

​@@GeirEivindMork you beg to differ yet you failed to answer any of the very valid points @sirpatrickbikes mentioned

@@11robotics "disc brakes making taking your bike apart more difficult" - no, it does not. I can change wheels equally fast or faster on my disc / through axel bike than on my old rim brake / qr. I got two wheelsets for both my disc brake bikes so I change them out every now and then. Never had any issues. "change stem" - I don't change my stem, because it is right for my use. but if I would like to, it is the exact same procedure on my bmc as it is on my rim brake storck since neither has an integrated cockpit. "pack your bike for a holiday" - I commute every day with my disc brake / electronic gearing bike and I can't fathom how it is harder on that than on my rim brake bikes. "battery operated vs mechanical" - my head unit tells me when it needs to be recharged, so outside of that I never have to worry about cable stretch. so in my four years of ownership of that bmc, I have had zero issues. I've done a few adjustments in my weekly services on my mehcanical bikes each season. Now that's not that much of a hassle, but compared to zero on electronical. But then there are the positives. With disc brakes I can run wider tires. and that is a game changer. my 25mm equipped storck feels rough compared to my 30mm equipped bmc. My brakes works perfectly no matter the weather - on my storck the brake track is so worn that if I were to keep it on the road I will cosider new rims. that will never happen on my disc brake bmc. I still have to check chain wear and lubricate, but outside of that - modern road bikes takes everything that annoyed me about bikes out of the equation. No longer will I go out on a ride just to listen to a slightly misaligned mech due to cable stretch again. My kids will have mechanical until they have proven they are active enough to warrant electronical, though. it is still a cost. BUT i do understand the purists. a perfectly adjusted higher end mechanical groupset is just lovely. traditional rim brake bikes look awesome. Nothing wrong with it. It is just that I don't appriciate that side of it in my daily riding. I want things to work day to day with as little hassle as possible, and electronic and disc brakes takes me closer to that.

@@GeirEivindMork - taking a bike apart means removing/replacing more than just your wheels, and a lot of people do that on a regular basis for various reasons (maintenance and deep cleaning, upgrades, transport, setup changes) - the stem change argument is indeed personal as some try out different bike fits during the lifetime of a bike, whereas others don't, and it only is a relevant argument if a (fully) integrated cockpit is used (which is clearly the case for the bike in this video) - commuting is not road cycling and the needs of a commuter and of the bike thereof are hardly relevant for the needs of a road biker, some of which actually travel on a regular basis by car/plane/train to nice places where they can enjoy their bike rides - cable stretch is the most absurdly overrated issue when it comes to mechanical groupsets, and if one doesn't understand how a barrel adjuster works or finds that too much of a hassle then they more than deserve to pay the absurd premium on electronic groupsets - I more than once forgot to recharge my head unit, my power meter, or even my smartphone before going out on long rides; the batteries of my speed sensor and of my HR monitor have died on me mid ride (but I always carry a spare for those); it was really annoying/inconvenient when they died on me or when I had to recharge them while riding - the most annoying bit being having to ride with my head unit in my back pocket while it charged from a power bank. The idea that I may forget to recharge my groupset and that it may stop working mid ride (which I also witnessed when riding with others), and I know it would happen eventually to me too, is completely unacceptable to me. And clearly much more of a hassle than turning a barrel adjuster every now and then to fine-tune my derailleur indexing.

My first one was made in 2008 or 2009 and the only obsolete part about it is tire clearance. 25 mm tires on 15 mm internal rim width is the widest I can go, I cannot use newer, wider wheels on this frameset. Now, I'm on a frameset ten years newer than my previous one, so I can switch to 19 mm internal rim width wheels (still on 25 mm tires, no need to go wider for the time being at least) whenever I'm ready.

Amen,my road bike 1998 Cannondale,put new tyres on it a few times ......

Definitely too expensive for me but way more beutiful imo (not in all cases - specialized tarmac)

@@mitchellsteindlernah even that’s a beauty

2010s Cannondales are the last ones that look good in terms of paintwork and branding design.

I changed more than my bike over 20 years

Discs allow much wider tyres, which on the awful UK roads is a bonus......Something which the disc naysayers always forget.

That happened to me - two mooses jumped across the narrow forest road and I nearly hit them. It was a cow moose and her calf, so I could have been in serious trouble. Instead they only stopped around 50 meters away and started eating leaves from small trees. The cow moose barely looked in my direction. My brakes really saved me. (MTB with disc brakes)

Yes, sitting here with a broken hip I can tell you. There was a pothole in the forest that I didn`t see. Although I would never go back for a rim brake on a mtb, it's mainly the driver that is causing the damage. On the road, in most conditions I prefer my rim brake bike, but I must admit on wet conditions the disc is better.

@@animalgarden825”mooses” isn’t a word. It’s always been two moose or one moose.

Forgot to mention, the frame was £500 on ebay.

Of the many bikes I get to ride on, none of them felt any more difficult to ride than the other, only compliance and their riding dynamics feel different.

Wider tyres and better brakes would quite arguably do this. Especially comparing riding with 32mm tyres rather than 23mm on bumpy roads.

Steel rusts dude lol what are you smoking 😅

Except disk brakes allow big tyres at lower pressure, so more rubber on the road both for braking & cornering + more comfort.

@@jonbroome9049 it’s the frames and not the rim brakes that make you can’t put bigger tires on. The rimbrake callipers fit a 28 and maybe bigger.

I would add that Campagnolo used in the past differentiated rim brakes to avoid blocking the rear wheels.. So rim brakes are not less powerful. Especially with ceramic rim coating.

You are underestimating the advantage in leverage that hydraulic actuation offers.

Stopping an object is about overcoming force and momentum. The only way to do so is applying energy to the overall system. Touch a disc rotor after a 10 mile descent. A rim brake applies ALL of that energy (heat) directly to the rim and tires. The ideal gas law dictates that heat translates to increased pressure. It's why tandems ran rear drums as a drag brake WAY BACK in the 90's. The tires would literally explode because the rims got hot and tire pressure ballooned from 90 psi to 150+

P.S if you look across strava a very small percentage of the rides over 50km with at least 400 meters of elevation gain have an average speed over 30kph.

That’s kind of the purpose of a “higher end” bike. Disc brakes are better for performance and it’s also harder to find high end carbon wheel sets that are compatible with rim brakes. There’s some great bikes with rim brakes (I have a caad-12)

The two technologies have quite different frame requirements, with disc brakes needing beefed up forks and the mounting points being different, so I'm not surprised they don't offer both in the same model.

As numerous posts have stated, already , the minute gains , in theory, in aero , shifting , disc and larger tires with modern bikes simply don't justify the MASSIVE difference in pricing and specifications compared to similar bikes from 10 + years ago. Cycling is the ULTIMATE sport of Pro / Con deliberations. Sure , disc brakes may provide a PRO choice in very slight advantage in certain circumstances, yet , a NEGATIVE in others. Just like mechanical vs electronic The debates are endless. What is relevant, especially for a dedicated Road Bike , are the SUPERB performance, comfort and handling performances of high end Road bikes from 2000 's to 2018 per disc era. 99% of cyclists needs are more then adequately met with these bikes. Over the last few years , I have been buying / selling AMAZING bikes and components from that era for a fraction of their Orginal price. I only source either " NOS " or lightly used examples. They are also way less expensive than a current GEN bike and better spec'd as well. www.pezcyclingnews.com " Readers RIGS " , recently featured an article on some of my bikes that fit this template . " The ULTIMATE ALTERNATIVE " Please share your experiences here

Yep, every few years they need to reinvent the wheel so they can make the old tech obsolete and force people onto the new tech if they want to upgrade. 9sp then 10,11,now 12sp. Oh no you can't have a 2x system! What you need is a 1x 13sp 10x50 cassette with a 40? on the front for the "aero gains". Honest! Bikes are just a couple of triangles joined together with a couple of circles underneath. Once you get close to "peak bike" you need to keep inventing things so marginal they hardly matter unless you're in the World Tour, and re-arranging things to keep things "new" and interesting.