There’s an overwhelming consensus that 1998 Mulan is NOT a Mary Sue. And I agree. Since I was a little girl, she inspired me not to give up.

Sex Education is incredibly written, especially when it comes to their female characters. They're allowed to be just as strong and developed as the male characters, as seen with Aimee in her sexual assault storyline, or Ruby, who softens when she begins dating Otis, only to get her heart broken by him.

Can you do a take on cheating/adultery in media and how it’s often glorified as an act of passionate “love” or glossed over as a little “mistake” rather than the damaging act of betrayal it is?

I dont think "likeable" should be an important trait to qualify as a nuanced character, I think the character works when their motives and actions are understandable and are in line within the context of the worldbuilding. Jessica Jones as a character is far from likeable, like she's a dick to almost everyone and isnt trying to be likeable. But you understand why she is like that, she feels realistic and her portrayal doesnt pull any punches, and I think thats why the character is well written and resonates well, despite having powers and is a very good P.I

i think my biggest issue with the so-called mary sues in marvel and star wars and other media with male-dominated fan bases is that these characters are marketed as feminist and groundbreaking for all women, and then it’s incredibly disappointing when these characters don’t speak to most women. it’s sexist to pick apart female characters more than their male counterparts, but it’s also sexist to write an unrealistic woman as the definitive woman when male characters are not written to be the definitive figure for men.

Maeve is into "Complex Female Characters", which is EXACTLY what she is. The show brilliantly makes all of their characters nuanced, and makes you find them realistic and relatable.

Lets not forgot the greatest Mary-Sue of all: Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way

Can we talk about how Sabrina in The Chilling Adventures of Sabrina is absolutely a ridiculously flawless character? Because my godddd it got really exhausting and removed any tension from the plot (already knew how anything and everything would turn out), and that stinks because I really enjoyed how the show was done, the characters, and just the overall vibe. The win for any and every challenge was just handed to her, and it just made the show so much less interesting.

My first non-Mary Sue character was actually the first female character I read : Hermione Granger. No, not impossibly gorgeous, powerful and likeable Emma Watson's version, but Hermione Granger from the books. She was whiny, bossy, and while being powerful and smart she was also flawed, judgemental and all, and not particularly pretty. Book Hermione was incredibly relatable as a know-it-all booksmart girl, and I'm glad I grew up with her.

Since this video mentioned Jo March, I’d like to point out that NONE of the March sisters could be called Mary Sues. Amy is as hot-headed as Jo, as well as vain, but she grows up to be savvy, ambitious, and self-assured. Meg is seemingly the perfect woman by the standards of her time, being ladylike, kind, and responsible, but she also longs for material things, which puts a damper on her marriage at times. The one who comes closest to Mary Sue-dom is, admittedly, Beth, but even she has her quirks and eccentricities, which Greta Gerwig beautifully highlights in the 2019 film, and she even has a (literal) fatal flaw- her selflessness.

Mary Sue is not about a female character without flaws, is about a character that is perfect in the majority of thing but when makes a mistake nobody around her call her out.

Maeve is such an Incredible character and probably the one with one of the saddest backstories in the show. It’s sad to see that because of ship wars, people started hating her.

The most complex female character I've seen in modern representation is Rebecca Bunch from Crazy Ex-Girlfriend. It was also an amazing representation of a woman with BPD who is taking control of her life, even if she slips up sometimes she's always doing her best.

It’s also worth noting a mary or gary sue also constitutes “a character from which the world revolves around or conspires to make miserable or succeed” not just a character without readily identifiable flaws

She's a woman in tight pants, heels and makeup fighting off bad guys while still having perfect hair.

I've listened to my brother talk about two female characters he hates. I'm pretty sure that if those characters had just presented as male, he would have loved them.

I think my issue with "Mary Sue" characters comes in cases like Twilight or even Gilmore Girls when girls are set up to attract all this male attention as a sort of wish fulfillment fantasy. First of all, the girls are not that compelling as people (and I don't think any one person is that compelling to have men of all different types fall in love with them all the time) so it doesn't make sense plot-wise, but it also reinforces the idea that womens' value and excitement in life comes from male validation. The fact that these girls are (even when they're written to be "girl next door") played by conventionally beautiful actresses also reinforces the idea that this value and excitement is only reserved for the very pretty.

I feel like Mary Sue has become a word for just "a female character i didn't enjoy" which is wack

I remember that massive hate that surrounded her character. In the context of the narrative, Anna Gunn’s character on Breaking Bad was unlikeable because she was seen as an obstacle compounded on the central character’s story, but I did take a step back and thought about why she did the things she does, her character, though flawed, wasn’t as horrible as her male counter, Cranston. While he’s doing everything to endanger his family, she’s doing everything to keep her children safe. While she doesn’t do this perfectly, but why does a female character have to be? Nobody is perfect, especially in the context of Breaking Bad, no matter how clever either might believe they are. I think there’s a lack of empathy when male critics tear apart female led movies/tv shows or strong female characters, and that most are reactionary against to surplus of male character driven media we’ve consumed for many many years. I don’t know if it’s that they can’t fathom a realized or stronger character than a man epitomized by a female or they can’t relate because they are female, but this video essay is a great discussion to navigate past and future media for female led or just female characters in general.

Would love to see you guys analyse Mabel Pines from Gravity Falls! Looking at a refreshing take on the girly girl character as very much interested in hyper femininity, but then also chaotic and goofy. Would also love to see you look at the hate a lot of the fans have of Mabel due to her choices and her selfishness. Would be so interesting to see! Please!!

I feel like Anne from Anne of Green Gables is also a great example of an inspiring, yet human, female character.

You can also have a character that you love to hate too. I am tired of the pressure to have female characters be likeable.

I think Daphne Blake's evolution throughout the years is a good example of a intelligent, kind, and talented character and how to avoid being a flat, one dimensional character.

I remember loving Hermione Granger, even more, every time she cried/felt defeated on-screen by something stupid that Ron did, cause it showed that me- that you can be the most intelligent, one of the most powerful and bravest witches in the world and still have boy problems with a 'seemingly' less cool boy than yourself. It just made her more human and more complex in addition to being the "brightest witch of her age" and just "harry's perfectly awesome best friend" or nerdy sidekick whose basically 99% of the reason why he's still alive.

I feel like Katniss isn’t a Mary Sue I love her character.

"Mary Sue" started off in fan-fiction as female protagonist who is an idealized author inset. Mary Sue has become "a female protagonist". Much like "Karen" started as a critique of racist white women and is now used as a critique of women. Taking away the specificity removes the validity of the term.

"the entire city looks like ratatouille" I just can't with this show.

Hot take: Rory Gilmore was originally written as a Mary Sue but as the show progressed and they actually showed her flaws, it made her a better character.

The character Beth Harmon from "The Queen's Gambit" would have been an amazing addition for analysis in this video.

I think that the reason why some female characters are so perfect at everything (especially in fanfictions) also comes from a desire for women to emulate the expectations society puts on them.

Maybe we could call them just “well written characters” instead?

The thing is Arya trained her entire life, while we didn’t see Rey train. Arya also needed help from time to time. She struggled when she was blind and definitely lost a lot during her training. She also made some foolish decisions from time to time.

Here are two key traits needed in a character to push them above being a Mary/Gary Sue: - An actual personality. - More than one flaw.

It's very weird to me how MarySue as became a "difficult type to understand" because, as someone who grue up in the world of fanfiction, MarySue as a very very clear definition. She is liked almost by everyone even though you dont really understand why, the love interest is always infatuated by her and especially, her "flaws" aren't really flaws, they are qualities disguised as flaws. She is a great mix between the manic pixie dream girl and a not like other girls.

Short version: A Mary Sue is an overpowered character without context or even real character. Examples can include Wesley Crusher from Star Trek and the male lead in Sword Art Online. Better versions of these characters include Chekov and Guts from Berserk. Yes they are overaccomplished characters but they also have context. Wesley was grandfathered onto the Enterprise when Chekov earned his way on. Sword Art Online features a bland gamer character who does everything perfectly while Guts is a guy who has been through hell and survived. Context!

I’ve seen a lot of criticisms of Never Have I ever with Devi and I’m tired of it. Whether you like her or not, Devi is an incredibly well done example of how to write a female character who is layered and complex. The conflict often revolves around her and she isn't just dragged from plot point to plot point. She is active in the choices she makes and then she has to face the consequences that come from those choices. She is allowed to be messy and while she is often not a good person, she's a good character and I appreciate how the show decided to go with a more nuanced take instead of just writing a smart, studious role model for young girls who is a beacon of perfection (Looking at you film hermione granger) She’s book smart while simultaneously making impulsive, stupid choices which is a lot more fun to watch.

yall should do a video on the "dramatic haircut trope" next!!

I agree about the male critic being especially harsh for female lead film. At this point I still don’t understand the hate on female lead superhero movie. It’s not like everything has to make for you. Can’t we just have them?

If Captain Marvel is a Mary Sue, then so is Superman, frankly. And Rey in "The Force Awakens" is basically Luke if the droids and Obi Wan never came into his life, especially as presented in the first two films, before they shoe-horned in her being a Palpatine.

Every time i hear Saorise Ronan say the line of "women.." i get on tears. I loved the women en sex ed! Specially Aimee

I’m sorry, but this is a term that has just lost all meaning. It started as a fanfiction term for a self insert character who warps the world she’s in until it’s now longer about anything in that world (and I’m not throwing shade- I also did that, once upon a time. Go forth and write your Mary Sues young fanfic writers- it’s a rite of passage for you all. Have fun). Now it’s just a term to throw at any female character that someone either doesn’t like, has writing problems attached to them, or seems to be overpowered (rightly or wrongly). Can we just start calling it poor writing and retire this term already?

I think one of the most important aspects to being a strong female character whilst avoiding the label of Mary Sue is if their strenght comes from making other (male) characters look ridiculous. If a team of men cannot solve an issue only for a random girl to come along and solve it within 10 minutes while also doing something else I'm not gonna care about them, just be annoyed by them

In a better universe, Rey isn't immediately great at piloting, doesn't understand the languages of species that aren't common to Jakku, doesn't inexplicably know more than Han Solo on how to fix and maintain the Millennium Falcon, doesn't know how to reverse Kylo Ren's mind reading or instantly know the Jedi Mind Trick without needing to wave her hand, loses a hand in her first lightsaber duel, suffers greatly for her fighting style of yelling and roaring (which is more of a Sith thing), isn't immediately loved by everyone on first impressions, doesn't beat Luke Skywalker, and isn't Palpatine's granddaughter

The best characters are those that are fleshed out and feel authentic. Characters that have everything resolved, that are liked by everyone (even their enemies), that don't grow and change, because they don't have obstacles, are boring regardless of gender. Writers need to realize that while a protagonist going through a power trip is fine from time to time, readers and audiences are drawn to those characters we can see ourselves reflected, flaws and all.

I still don't get why doesn't that same aply to men i mean just look at James bond the ultimate Gary stu

The only truly flawed and unlikable female character I can think of at the top of my head is Carrie Bradshaw

Korra was called a Mary Sue but it's astounding to me that she isn't liked more because she goes from a cocky immature and hot headed hero to a peace keeping, wise and incredibly strong and realized avatar. Sure she was annoying but she was a 16 year old teenage girl who was guarded her whole life and told what to do her whole life. Of course she was going to rebel. Korra also lost many times she had help she lost her connection to the past avatars but she also managed to do what Aang couldn't she brought the air benders back. She risked her life to save kuvira.

Mary sues can be male characters aswell Edit:i have provoked a gang war

I may be wrong but I feel like the modern version of Nancy Drew is imperfect as is human.

I just dislike the “Chosen One” trope in general when played straight. Male, Female, doesn’t matter. Unless you want to subvert it, there are enough of them. The ironic thing is that Rian Johnson went out of his way to retcon and fill out Rey’s character, but the fanboy Neckbeard backlash caused Disney to panic and go back to JJ Abrams’ “Strong Female character” pandering and nostalgia porn. Kudos to the Veronica Mars shout out. She was awesome.

I think the reason there are way more accusations of "mary su" than "gary stu" is also because for better or worse it seems like EVERY prominent female character who exists is scrutinized over what she represents about "women as a whole", in a way that male characters usually are not scrutinized, and it seems true from both conservative and liberal audiences. (and seems like you can say similar about minority characters) A male character can be just a character, for the most part, but every female character seems to be looked at as if they represent what the writers think about all women in general, and I think that contributes to the sexism and intimidation that some audience members demonstrate towards characters often described as "mary sues". If the writers created this "perfect, flawless" female hero who effortlessly saves the day and "shows up" all the other characters, it "must be" (sarcasm) because the writers secretly think women are better than men, thus "mary su" characters end up being labelled as "sexist towards men" just by virtue of existing and being "too perfect". Don't really see that kind of scrutiny towards male heroes and protags, even when they may be just as "flawless" as the female characters, because no one, for the most part, looks at your typical male hero and assumes "this hero represents what the writers think about all men, and men compared to women". Male characters can just "be", but every prominent female character is a political statement.

Jules from Euphoria is a great-example of a non-Mary Sue. She is the apple of multiple characters eyes, but is a complex character that evolves!

I remember having a discussion with my friends in high-school and we joked that the male version of a Mary Sue was a Micheal Cera. During the height of his fame it seemed that he was playing the part (specifically Scott Pilgrim). We decide that a Mary Sue had a flat character arch, was liked by many of the characters for no obvious season, and was more powerful/talented than any other character without doing any work for it. I also argued that Mary sues were in portant for audience inserts or chosen one character types. Harry Potter being a good (male) example of both.

If someone doesn't like a character because she was badly writtin or the movie didn't do her justice, they are allowed to criticize and not be labled as "sexist".

The problem with Rey is she's boring. Like everything else in the sequels, Rey was a victim of poor planning and terrible writing, but because so much revolves around her, she got most of the hate. I still believe that they had a perfect protagonist in Finn, but that potential was quickly wasted.

Honestly, I think you female writers should write all the Mary sues they want. Everyone should have fun creating power fantasies

In my mind, a Mary Sue has to fulfill 3 requirements ✔ Succeeds at everything ✔Liked by everyone who is good. ✔Gets almost all of the narrative attention. A lot less female characters fit this descriptions than it seems. Rey succeeds at everything and is likes by everyone good, but isnt always the center of focus.

Ellen Ripley, Sarah Connor, and Buffy Summers are my favorite characters and are Non-Mary Sue. All three have horrible situations dropped in their lap. They have their breakdowns and struggles but cowgirl the fuck up and take care of business.

Yep, this is going to be a spicy one. I could tell as soon as I read the title. Prepare yourselves for war. It is coming soon

Skylar was deliberately written to be reasonable and yet unlikable. This isn’t sexism it’s just clever story telling. None of her arguments or ideas were off kilter, but they interfered or found themselves at odds with Walts plans.

The concept of a "Mary Sue" is not legitimate. We only have this discussion about female characters, never male characters. The reason for that should be obvious. Most action heroes are ridiculously overpowered and have improbable skills because they are power fantasies. People want to imagine themselves being more powerful and capable. But for thousands of years, female characters who show agency at all were always villains, while "good" female characters properly waited for men to do things to them or for them. The idea of a female character showing agency and being presented as a hero is still very new and some people are having more trouble adapting to the change than others. How can we possibly spend this much time talking about Rey being a Mary Sue, but not, say, Superman? I stopped reading Superman comics as a child because it was too difficult to ever believe he was in any danger and that made his comic books boring to me, even as a gullible, impressionable child. Heck, even Luke Skywalker in that Mandalorian finale was more of a Mary Sue than Rey. The whole appeal of Luke as an action hero was that he failed a lot. He was complex, he was interesting, but that Mandalorian episode just turned him into a flawless killing machine. Jack Ryan has improbable amounts of applicable knowledge and skills, as does every action hero that is an obvious power fantasy of an author's out of control self image (e.g. Jack Reacher). And don't even get me started on the current wave of older male Mary Sue action heroes that are obviously intended as power fantasies for men my age who are having difficulty accepting getting old (e.g. Taken). I am sick and [bad word] tired of discussions about Mary Sue characters unless someone wants to have a serious discussion about the much larger number of male Mary Sue characters, or better still, talk about why we have this discussion with female characters but not male characters.

It always annoys me how so many people call Sylvie a Mary Sue literally just because they don't like her or the pairing. Her being able to beat a lot of people at once doesn't make her any more OP than the other heroes able to do the same thing.

Mulan in the live action remake is a Mary Sue

I loved this video, clicked so fast seeing Sylvie, Maeve and all the other great characters in the thumbnail and I'm glad I did. You articulated this so well and I'm immensely grateful to see you analyze some of my favorite characters, as well as what makes a well written character and mention a lot of my influences (like Lindsay Ellis and movies by great female filmmakers). It's not and won't be men complaining about Mary Sues that push filmmaking to go further. It's clear that what needs to be done is give opportunities to more women to make films and series and be critics and write these amazing characters that they do. I am eternally grateful to the women that helped brought my favorite characters to life and the women, that although are minorities now in these fields, I can look up to and feel represented and be hopeful about the future. That includes you making this video. Thank you.

Arya is not Mary sue. She practice the strike for thousand times and it's her especial skill.

The Mary Sue archetype isn’t exclusive to female characters, it’s just that the male variant isn’t often seen in western media. You can find male Mary Sue’s rampant in anime though and people hate them just as much. Protagonists need some type of flaw, some room for growth for a story to be truly enriching. Having someone who easily solves all the problems in the story doesn’t often lead to engaging content. It’s just wish fulfillment without any nutritional value.

Daisy IS 100% right about sexism within the Mary Sue character. Men and women can be Mary Sues and its PATHETIC when people call any girl who is too out of their league to be a Mary Sue... like a mary sue is a uncomplex character and etc. but think about complexities in a character, if they have them, they probably arent a mary sue.

I don’t understand why a lot of people view a character being a “Mary Sue” as a bad thing? No one questions it when some male characters are perfect beyond belief. So why is it bad for a female version of that to exist? It’s not like it’s stopping complex flawed female characters from being written. I think it’s good for a variety of character types to exist and be enjoyed.

I tend to judge the characters within the context of the overall intelligence of the show or movie. A movie like "Commando" isn't trying to be anything but a dumb action movie, so Arnold being invisible just makes sense. A movie like "The Matrix," on the other hand, presents itself as a "smart" action movie, which makes the one-dimensional-ness of Neo (as well as the million plot holes) stand out more. I think Mary Sues (and I use the term genderlessly) are more tolerable the less seriously the movie takes itself.

The reason why there isn't the same response for male characters being Mary Sue type characters is that there was never a push for giving "strong male respresentation". They just existed and those characters are just as criticized but not for the same reason as female ones who are being represented for their gender. No one ever said males are under represented, no one said men are never seen in a positive light, no one was ever trying to promote manhood. These Mary Sue character work on the premise if I make them female than everyone should love and respect them or they'll give them superficial things they think people will respect them for and worse is if that character unhumbly calls that a struggle. The criticism is bad writers can use that as a crutch to deflect criticism. If a person criticizes a Gary Stu you can't claim sexism.

Thank you very much. I loved how you put this and that you added a possible way out. i also love how it's mentioned that reason can die with labels. If we think of labels as "boxes" then yes, they can get sth. accross faster, maybe. But we cannot really tell what the quick response is about. If instead we talk about specific situations and setups of a character, we have a way better platform to figure out what is going on, on either side. That said: We still need labels sometimes to direct awareness towards the disregard of feminine principles in all humans of all (and no) genders. So it's good to have starting points. From there, the simple truth is: there are open people and fools. Lets invest more time into nuturing the former and our relationships to former. And the later have a higher chanc of following up. And we can still also indulge their and our growth with whatever excess energy we take from our abundance.

I love Carol Danvers in Captain Marvel. I like her a lot and I think she has a wonderful relationship with both Fury and Maria. Her learning to not be afraid of her emotions and unlock her full potential by embracing them was so powerful to watch.

Please apply this to "Cobra Kai". Everybody loves Johnny, so do I, they also love Miguel who is a lousy boyfriend. Instead a bunch of people totally hate Amanda, bc she worries about how to make a living, and her family being at risk, and wanting time with her husband, Sam is hated for having her own arc, trying to juggle the demands of peers, friends, school, boyfriend and father, she has flaws ... It is a prime wxample of how male characters with flaws are human and relatable, while female ones with flaws are bad, rotten ...

With Rey, I wonder how much of the anger at her is misplaced anger at the generally poor writing and handling of this latest trilogy. I would be interested in a story starring Rey with actual good writing. I think Star Wars fans do have the ability to like and accept a female charcater, look at Jyn Erso from Rogue One.

…sigh Rey is a Mary Sue, that was changed in Last Jedi, but then it was promptly undone in Rise of Skywalker. I also think that Luke is a very imperfect hero, lest we forget he struggles to understand the lessons Yoda teaches him, he LOSES his fight against Darth Vader in Empire, nearly fails to take down Vader and the Emperor because of his rage

Black Widow, Pepper Potts, Valkyrie, Gamora, Wasp, Jessica Jones are not Mary Sue. but when you call Captain Marvel as Mary Sue... "It is a sexist term that often arise in male dominated fandoms".

I think it’s important to remember that men can be Mary Sue characters too. I think to be a Mary Sue means that a character has too much power over the events of a story. In my opinion good writing means that if any character is removed from the story, their absence should equally change the outcome of that story. It is unfortunate that the term is so heavily gendered and inherently sexist because it does outline a valid criticism of poor writing and misunderstanding how to positively include representation.

I've seen a lot of hate towards Sylvie but I love and relate to her more than most female characters. 💛

It's 100% valid not to enjoy "mary sue" characters, but it is also valid to enjoy it! Wish-fulfillments are valid. A character doesn't need to be realistic or whatever for her to be enjoyable, sometimes you just wanna kick back and relax by watching someone who is super special and OP and perfect lmao.

This channel is on fire. Making A LOT of quality content and FAST. Bravo

I think my biggest problem with Ray isn't even that she's a Mary Sue, but how racist it is to marketing the biggest franchise in Hollywood with a black male protagonist, an original and interesting story of a jedi storm trooper, but then make it about a white protagonist, but nobody said anything because it's a woman...

I think my yardstick for a Mary Sue is does she have any flaws or make mistakes that she has to fix. If not, there is literally nowhere for her character growth to go. And that makes for a main character that is hard to take. What kind of story can you tell? (Once there was a girl. She was really amazing. If only other people understood that, life would be better. The end.) The example that I use is in the original Disney Mulan, she was just a girl who joined the army to save her father. She knew that she could die and that if she got caught, they'd go back and get her dad. She made mistakes. The whole point of "I'll Make a Man out of You," was how she couldn't keep up. When she overcome this, it was by using her brains, not her brawn. She found a way. (Like using the weights to climb the pole or creating an avalanche.) She ended up saving the Emperor by thinking around the problem. (What man would think to dress all those guys up like women?) In the new Mulan, she was born the chosen one with amazing powers. What was her risk in going to war? She knew she'd win and couldn't be hurt. She had other characters saying, "we just need to listen to her." She was perfect and if everyone would just understand that, she'd fix everything. Where is the growth? Where is the risk? Cartoon Mulan had to find her strengths before she was found out or died. Live Action Mulan just had to get the men out of the way. It's why I think a character like Buffy wasn't a Mary Sue. She had so many faults and had a lot of growing up to do. She needed to be taught how to slay, it didn't just come naturally. She fought her destiny, but she found her way. But Rey was IMO because she came perfect from her heritage and just knew how to save everyone. What growth space did she have? She was with Luke for like a week, then she knew better and ran off to save Ben. If there isn't a challenge to overcome a growth to be made it's a very boring story.

Beth Harmon from The Queen's Gambit is a great example of a non-Mary Sue

Straight up screw people who didn't like Skylar. She was brilliant and practical and reacting to a reeeeaaaaaally shitty thing her spouse CONTINUED doing to her.

I always heard it as "Larry Stu"

"Shallow, tokenistic representation of women." For example, the entire main cast of Ghostbusters 2016.

Thank you for the amazing video!

No offence but does anyone else think Daisy Scott and Keira Knightley sound similar?

Woman who plays a Mary Sue character gets annoyed when character is called a Mary Sue... What a shocker.

The neo character was called out as a "Mary sue" for the second and third matrix film we just didn't have the term to call him that, he was way too powerful, nothing challenged him, did all the impossible things. The highlight of those two movies was the highway scene because he wasn't in it

Well, that's 18 minutes of my life I'm not getting back.

My favourite non Mary-Sue is wand maximof and Rebecca bunch

I never see anyone complain about male characters being a "Gary Stu"...

Luke took three movies to become a Jedi and Rey in minutes. Gary Stu’s are just as bad so it is sexist to single out women. This is like classic royalty stories where a nobody is found and jumps to the top by existing. But its all fantasy entertainment, like junk food a little is ok

Rey is fairly called a mary sue. Luke doesn’t beat Vader until the end of the third film as he needs to train and have his arch. Rey beats kylo in the first film and succeeds in everything in the second film. It’s only in the third film where she is beaten by Kylo, and that is years after people started calling her a Mary Sue.

Something you kinda missed was undeserved power. It's especially apparent in Rey. She is shown being competent with the force without training by overpowering the trained Kylo Ren. Anakin/Vader THE CHOSEN ONE, had to train to become competent in the force. Luke trained under Kenobi and Yoda. It's an established fact in the star was universe that training is required to strengthen force abilities. Rey breaks established cannon to be powerful. That's why she's a Mary Sue. It's not just because she is strong

I don't mind calling rey a mary sue because all other protagonists from star wars are gary stus. In the end it is just a very shallow story with very well made worldbuilding 🤷

Male action film protagonists have always been derided as one-dimensional and boring…the difference is that Star Wars is a billion dollar franchise, and should have invested in decent scriptwriters capable of giving Rey some depth 🙄

Great video as always. I do think that Skyler's "flaws" are bit more grounded in the story than some of these others...but I also only watched Mad Men for Betty so I'm not the majority opinion. Two Ozark mentions in one week...am I going to have to finally watch it... Randomly, I'm curious what you guys would have to say about Silicon Valley and/or Veep. Keep up the great work.

please do a video next on coc (characters of color) on how to know they arn't the token character or "diversity characters". p.s awsome video