HVAC 075 crankcase heater, intro to refrigerant migration

  Рет қаралды 15,857

Love2HVAC with Ty Branaman

Love2HVAC with Ty Branaman

3 жыл бұрын

www.achrnews.com/articles/136...
hvacrschool.com/crankcase-hea...

Пікірлер: 41
@1971omi
@1971omi 3 жыл бұрын
Mr Ty you are such a awesome teacher hard to find people like you sharing their knowledge all these years with us. As a senior tech that gone to school and being in trade and teaching others you are my Hero If you ever come to Sacramento California My treat. God bless you 🙏.
@takethe101totarzana4
@takethe101totarzana4 3 жыл бұрын
Very cool. Excellent explanation of the crankcase heater and it's purpose. Thank you.
@ducharmehvactraining925
@ducharmehvactraining925 4 ай бұрын
great job TY!
@archiearon654
@archiearon654 3 жыл бұрын
Very informative and well explained! Thank you sharing your knowledge. Keep it up 👌
@lukealexander5742
@lukealexander5742 2 жыл бұрын
Excellent!!!
@WIlmylife
@WIlmylife 3 жыл бұрын
Golden information man. Thanks.
@DanO181919
@DanO181919 3 жыл бұрын
Nicely explained. 👍
@tpcoachfix
@tpcoachfix Жыл бұрын
I used to work on A C systems in buses. When we started using R134a we had a problem with liquid refrigerant migration back to the compressor, Carrier o5G, when the system was off. Upon the next startup of the system this liquid would break the Reed valves in the compressor. We had to add a check valve in the discharge line and a liquid solenoid valve upstream of the txv.
@jimbee169
@jimbee169 Жыл бұрын
Excellent video Grateful i found you! Like your other videos your explanations are excellent. One negative is you talk a little bit fast
@vake506
@vake506 3 жыл бұрын
👍👍awesome explanation. 🇬🇾🇬🇾🇬🇾🇬🇾
@ramchillarege1658
@ramchillarege1658 2 жыл бұрын
Excellent. Thanks.
@rolandodelapaz3970
@rolandodelapaz3970 3 жыл бұрын
Very nice tutorial besic i have an idea to know what is proposed about crank case heater. Thank you sir
@dakotasmith448
@dakotasmith448 3 жыл бұрын
You’re such a badass and this channel is so fucking awesome 🙏🙏🙏
@smkunz12
@smkunz12 2 жыл бұрын
If your unit doesn't have a crankcase heater - can we assume it uses that low current through the windings to keep the compressor warm in order to avoid refrigerant migration? You're videos are awesome btw - I'm just a homeowner but have already learned a bunch! Keep up the GREAT work!!😁
@love2hvac
@love2hvac 2 жыл бұрын
Few different ways 1 Crank case heaters that are always on, typically commerical. 2 Crack case heaters controlled by a thermostat on the line, like Trane and American standard. 3 crank case heater wired in series the windings and a single pole contactor like Carrier and Bryant. 4 a crank case heater with a relay. 5 I believe the one your referring to. using 2 run capacitors in parallel without a crank case heater. This also has a single pole contactor but one of the compressor run capacitors is wired before the contactor to allow some current to run threw the start winding to keep it warm. When the contactor closes now both capacitors are in the circuit in parallel to the start winding and the run winding now also has "power" and the compressor starts. You can't send the entire capacitor on the leg side because it would be to much for the start winding and burn it out (or burn the start winding insulation). I have not see the start winding only method used in a while. GE did this as I recall. Soo people think it's common but it's not so much.
@mickenright2721
@mickenright2721 3 жыл бұрын
An HVAC guy in a room that's 95 degrees...don't you know someone who can fix that? ;) Seriously, though---awesome stuff!
@love2hvac
@love2hvac 3 жыл бұрын
Right! I had to take the AC apart and cut it open to make these videos bahaha But really my "studio" is just the inside of a horse barn. Its just carpet over the stalls. 95 is nice, it gets well over 100 and I have to stop recording because the camera overheats and my shirt gets drenched. Years of working in the field, its nothing new. Thanks I appreciate the complement.
@1marcelfilms
@1marcelfilms 3 ай бұрын
So what happens on cars when the ac is turned on in the cold?
@realestateservicessaleshea99
@realestateservicessaleshea99 3 жыл бұрын
As always 👍🏻 🥃🥃🍺🍺🍺🍇🎳 Stay safe. Retired (werk'n) keyboard super tech. Wear your safety glasses.
@WhiteWakedNProud
@WhiteWakedNProud 5 ай бұрын
So i could ditch the board, set up a relay with crankcase heater contacts on NC And have my red wire from the tstat on normally open. Thank fully i live im the dessert where i migjt need defrost once a year. This is on a unit donated for my house from a job, i know doing this at a customers house would be last resort option
@garysmith9772
@garysmith9772 3 жыл бұрын
Let’s see if Ty knows the answer can you drain the liquid refrigerant from one cylinder to the other just by gravity only one tank suspended above the other top cylinder valves facing down. connected with a short hose ???? Yes
@bryanswanson5007
@bryanswanson5007 2 жыл бұрын
I have an interesting story related to this somewhat. At one of the schools i work at we have water furnace geo reversable chillers and after changing out a RV about a year ago, I was all done with repair and had system evacuated down to 350 or so (dont remember exact) and I was trying to see the oil level on one of the compressors but it was hard to see so for some reason i thought if i tapped on the glass with my nut driver i May see if theres oil that moves and i would know theres oil in there. As soon as i tapped the glass the oil imediatley foamed/bubbled like you mentioned and my vacuum shot up to idk lets say 2000 i cant remember, either way i lost my deep vac. I had never experienced this before and I knew that it was either refrigerant or moisture boiling out of the oil but im still confused to this day as to why it didnt boil off until i tapped that glass. Those chillers are installed in a mechanical room that stays about 75 or so degrees all year round but now Im wondering if maybe the CCH was shot. I too didnt think they are necesary when unit installed indoors. Has got me thinking now, i will check it next time i go there.
@love2hvac
@love2hvac 2 жыл бұрын
When your pulling a vacuum on a chiller it's beneficial to keep the water flowing. It also helps speed the process. Chillers typically have more oil. As the refregerant is boil out the temperature drops, and the viscosity of the oil gets thicker trapping more of refrigerant inside. Sometimes a tap or vibration is just enough to release a portion of it. Also the vibration of the water flowing helps do the same. Think of tapping the side of a soda bottle and seeing the bubbles release. This is also a great example of the importance of a decay test. Giving it time to raise the temp slightly and let any moisture or refrigerant boil out. As for cch, I would check on it. Even in a controlled environment, your suction will be low for the evaporator. Sounds like you are doing a great job! Excellent experience, thank you for sharing it!
@HVACRTECH-83
@HVACRTECH-83 Жыл бұрын
​@Love2HVAC with Ty Branaman I never seen your reply to this about a year ago now lol. Thanks for the reply. I agree with you 100% and makes perfect sense. Since that day, I now have a habit of tapping on the compressor shell while pulling system down multiple times throught evacuation. I've always done decay tests but that day showed me why it's needed and it showed me in a way that will be unforgettable and imprinted in my mind forever. I'd like to find one of those tank warmers you have but my supply houses never heard of them. I think that will help alot too in situations like these. The water flowing while evacuating would work better if the chiller was on its own loop. Although the slight vibration could help like you said, typically the systems I work on have multiple chillers so the water temp flowing through would be 42-45f generally thus wouldn't be a benefit temp wise with boiling the trapped vapor. The ambient temps are above that. But I'll play around with it. Thx again. I love watching your videos for the occasional refresher or the science behind things which was never taught to us correctly.
@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259
@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259 3 жыл бұрын
Is there a typical ambient temperature above which the crankcase heater is no longer needed? I've noticed "CCH Optional" is sometimes called out on the system schematics but I'd imagine you'd want the compressor to be the warmest system component whenever the compressor isn't running. What's your experience on a system that leaks down enough to cause the compressor to go out on thermal overload, is this likely to result is an acidic condition (say for an R22 system, for instance)?
@love2hvac
@love2hvac 3 жыл бұрын
Some units use a thermostat on one of the lines that controls the CCH. Moisture is the biggest cause for acid. As long as the discharge temperature did not exceed 225 the oil should still be good.
@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259
@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259 3 жыл бұрын
@@love2hvac Thanks, Ty ;) The CCH thermostat switches seem to measure ambient outdoor cabinet and cycle around 70F off / 60F on.
@anthonywilson951
@anthonywilson951 Жыл бұрын
Hey there Ty, did you happen to post any videos of the actual wiring portion of the crankcase heaters, been super intrigued with them lately, would love your take on it.
@love2hvac
@love2hvac Жыл бұрын
Crank case heaters are very important, probably the most underappreciated system accessory. They prevent flooded starts and slugging from refrigerant migration. Also prevents bearing as the refregerant washes the oil away. As for videos, I don't have any on them just yet. It's on my to do list.
@joehead1294
@joehead1294 Жыл бұрын
Is it true that system refrigerant capacity is the deciding factor as to if a CCH is needed on a scroll compressor? I have a heat pump with no CCH, came that way I believe. Shows a CCH on schematic, but copeland says some systems don't need them depending on amount of refrigerant. Any thoughts?
@love2hvac
@love2hvac Жыл бұрын
CCH is considered an accessory. To save initial cost it's not installed from the factory. Almost every compressor can benefit from CCH. After working for Copeland as a contract technical trainer I have learned just how overlooked the CCH is. Refrigerant migration is a BIG issue. It causes oil to wash out from the bearings and liquid slugging that breaks compressors. Add a crank case heater when ever possible! Simple components that save the life of compressors. It's probably the most overlooked accessory. Almost all classes if broken scroll sets are from liquid slugging at startup, which is from liquid migration during the off cycle.
@joehead1294
@joehead1294 Жыл бұрын
@@love2hvac Interesting and I would have to agree. Although Copeland claims scrolls can "handle" some liquid. By omitting the CCH, are they trying to boost SEER? Would it benefit my 26 year old Copeland scroll heat pump compressor to install a CCH? Or if I install one will it kill it because it never had one?
@l.crossjr
@l.crossjr Жыл бұрын
Is a crankase heater needed or recomended for a rotary compressor? I don't normally see them installed
@love2hvac
@love2hvac Жыл бұрын
Not for rotary
@HVACRTECH-83
@HVACRTECH-83 Жыл бұрын
Sorry if I missed something but I'm confused on your experience of hooking up multiple tanks together. I totally understand migration and pressure/temp relationships, I'm not confused on any of that. I work on very large comercial systems as well but never have hooked up multiple tanks in series. What is the benefit? Was the end plan to have your recovery machine pump into the large tall tank and then the smaller tanks would fill up naturally from the pressure differential between the system and the inlet to your recovery machine? I guess I just answered my own question lol. I've just never done it that way. I use the large tanks at times but I pump into it till about 80% and then stop the process and then hook up another one. Never had any tanks hooked up upstream of my recovery unit but now I'm wondering if I'm missing out lol. Would want to have a scale for each tank though and isolate the furthest tanks as soon as they reach 80% something I'm going to look into for sure
@love2hvac
@love2hvac Жыл бұрын
Never fill any tank over 80%. Don't hook multiple tanks in series.
@HVACRTECH-83
@HVACRTECH-83 Жыл бұрын
@@love2hvac well that was my question. I know how to fill recovery tanks but asked why you would put them in series. You didn't say not to do it in the video, you made it sound like you just didn't watch it close enough and overfilled the first 3 tanks. It wasn't clear, that's why I asked about it. Thx
@chefchutardo5215
@chefchutardo5215 11 ай бұрын
So does it always have to be on when the system is off. Or could we heat it up before starting ? Lets say its gonna be very cold outside for a few days or weeks. Could i just turn the crankcase heater on the day before restarting the system ? Or does the compressor always have to be hotter than the inside temperature even if off for a long time ?
@love2hvac
@love2hvac 11 ай бұрын
If it's off for a long time, have the CCh run 24-48 hrs before starting the compressor.
@chefchutardo5215
@chefchutardo5215 11 ай бұрын
@@love2hvac thanks ! I hear about scroll compressors all the time. But I guess rotary compressors have the same recommendations about the crank heater.
@p.hannadigeprageeth4651
@p.hannadigeprageeth4651 Жыл бұрын
T in rii I
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