I see guys friction weld HSS drills in steel plate all the time. :-)

A couple of points. First, as you're using a high carbon steel, you will have a hard and brittle joint. It wasn't quenched, but it's a small enough part, mounted in a giant steel & cast iron heatsink (the lathe), so it will cool very quickly. It would have been interesting to look at the failed welds with a microscope after etching to see the microstructure and see if you could discern the failure mode. Second, friction welding is a wonderful process for joining dissimilar metals, even on a lathe. Google an academic paper "Analysis of friction welding in conventional lathe machine" by B.Parandhaman et al, 2018 about joining aluminium and mild steel on a lathe about the same size as yours. Sorry, if I include an actual link then KZfaq deletes my comment.

LOL Its 12:11AM and I was about to log off, let the dog out(in which I go though my shop to do) and head to bed. Your comment at the end was spot on. altough Ive thought about doing this on both my knee mill and lathe. I just havent done it yet. Now I'll prob get in my shop early tomorrow to try it out.... after sweeping away all the sawdust on my equipment. XD

I like seeing a lathe that get use and is not kept immaculatly clean. Enjoyed the video.

Hi, last attempt looked satisfactory considering it was performed on a lathe, well done. Excellent on cross section. As a Friction Weld engineer and Metallurgist for 20 years for one of the world's top three Friction Welding companies hear in the UK, trying a reduced cross sectional area is the correct approach. For "Direct Drive Friction Welding" Based on 1/2 " (12.7 mm) OD X 3/8" (9.5 mm) ID, for a low carbon steel, we would use the following parameters: RPM - 3000 to 6000, rotating axial force of 800 pounds, forging force of 1600 pounds. Displacement during frictioning 0.140". Total length loss approximately 0.190". You are correct in that the rotation should stop quickly, but as long as you maintain the axial force, or increase it during deceleration, and maintain the forging force for 3 or more seconds to consolidate the bond,then you will have a successful weldment. Calculations are based on a surface speed of between 400 to 800 ft/Mon, forces of 4.5 and 9 Tons per square inch, and burn-off of 0.140".for solid bar reduce RPM by 40 to 50%.

"at the speeds i'm running that laythe would be kind of terrifying". for some reason the understatement of this is hilarious

Caterpillar Tractor developed this in the early 70s (to my best knowledge) to weld the piston shafts to the knuckles on their hydraulic cylinders. I was a metal shop teacher at the time (1971 to 1975) at the Central Bucks School District in Bucks County, PA. We duplicated it on a 12" Rockwell lathe. The kids got a big kick out of it. I tried, to the best of my ability, to duplicate current industrial practices in the shop. When I left to go into industry in 1975, the shop went dormant and was never used again. We did the experiment in 1973 or 1974.

Spinning tail stock holder with a brake. Hold the brake on until the weld starts, then let it spin - won't matter how fast you can turn off the lathe.

Back in '72' when I was in High School, we had a metal shop that would be an envy to any Machine shop. About 12 good size lathes, 4 or 5 milling machines, surface grinder, a large shaper, drill presses, a tool room, a small foundry and more I can't remember. One of the students wanted a long shaft drill bit, seems like it was about 3/4". He set it all up in a large lathe and performed the friction weld operation. I'll be darned if I can remember the outcome. :-) I just wanted to tell you about my HS machine shop. The only thing my kids had in HS were computers, not even a hand drill.

Good idea to mill the piece to show the weld through. 👍

We used to friction weld bananas together in the 60’s but its impossible to get straight ones nowadays so we tend to use cucumbers instead! Btw cool vid im gonna try this on the lathe at work!

Thanks for cutting it half to show how good weld it was. That was super interesting :)

You are correct. I did not know you could do that with a lathe! Thanks for posting this and sharing the cut-away.

I worked at a heavy wall drill pipe manufacture in Houston when I was kid and was amazed at friction welding, one the metalurligist gave me a cross section of a weld that they etched for testing. I couldn't believe there was a perfect straight line where the two materials met but no mixing of the two, it's hard to believe that this can hold an entire string of drilling tools!

You might want to consider a face shield in case molten metal is slung off the weld. Very good demo. We did this when I was in High School Machine Shop, 46 years ago.

I was demonstrating this back in 1972 in shop class at High school!

excellent! ... I took all my inch long scrap pieces of tubing and made one 10 foot long tube from them and it only took 9 days and saved me $5.38!

Me: "Yea i quite like video games and computers." KZfaq: "Hey we heard you like computers and video games. Here's some welding videos."

I'm just getting into machining and I gotta say, this is hands down one of the coolest tricks on the lathe I have seen so far, bravo sir...bravo👏👏👏

Perhaps instead of instantly stopping the chuck, the same effect could happen if the stationary piece was controllably released to follow its newly bonded counterpart. Like undoing the jacobs chuck in the tail stock just enough for it to spin freely before turning off the lathe.

1:44 Engage yer safety-squints!

That's what it always looks like when I'm trying to machine something...!

and at around the 10:00 mark I see your trial and error paid off ... looks looks like ya did a good job getting it to make a strong bond! and thanks for doing the cutting to do a cross section showing us how well the two pieces did or didn't bond

The inside view is so satisfying to see how uniform the weld is with no seam. Great video.

videos I've seen of friction welding they push the parts together for a greater distance and get way more spread in the softened material.... so push harder and push for longer, let that soft zone spread... they probably get it a fair bit hotter too.

Ok, you got it to work... Looks like it worked quite nicely. Love that you milled a cross section, looks pretty good.. now, etch it, see just how much is "weld", if it will show etched... I would think it should show.

Very cool. I've only read/heard about the process so seeing it done in a small shop on a lathe was interesting.thanks for sharing.

That is pretty awesome. I was considering putting a disk break on the back of mine to stop it faster but it looks like this will do the trick. Thanks for the upload.

I'm no metallurgist, just a 30+ year machinist who has studied these kind of things. I think it's an awesome process, honestly, and a great effort on that little lathe my man! It's incredible that you can take 4130, considered a low/medium carbon low alloyed steel and go from around 17/20 HrC up to almost 50 HrC without a quench. Also, from what I understand about friction welding is the post upset (of around .05-.100 when done correctly, I believe) force left holding the joint together when cooling is a necessary step. Could be wrong, of course, but that would be the only thing that I didn't notice you do in the video that I see other videos show. At any rate, great vid and great experiment. Subbed!

Hey, Arnold,I have been involved in this process welding shafts and turbine wheels together. The turbine wheel had a i.d. with a groove inside, groove about .300 wide. So roughly I.d. about .75, about .600 deep with a groove I.d about .85, groove width about .25 and the groove centered in the i.d. of the turbine wheel. The .75 i.d had a shoulder and then a drill point dia about .50 to .60.The shaft that went inside was about .740 dia, the shaft and wheel were brought together until cherry red as the shaft melted and filled the groove and then produced a upset raised area of material on the 2 outside diameters about .050-.100 wide then machine was shut down instantly, rpm was about 1500.

Definitely cool, thanks for doing that

Thanks for the video. I didn't know this was possible.

Great video, never knew you could friction weld on a lathe set up, thought you could only do that with massive pressures and speeds.

When I saw metal spinning and forming, that blew my mind. Especially how accurate they can make it for something that looks more of an art and less of a science.

This is how valves are attached to the stems for racing engines, however it’s a more complex operation. Pretty amazing.

Excellent video. This would be good in the home shop for perfect alignment of small diameter and or thin wall tubes as welding them can be tricky especially if you want the join to be almost invisible when your finished. Cheers Stuart 🇦🇺

i learned how to friction weld when I was in High school. Good to know.

Very Cool.......I'll wait till tomorrow to try it lol

Thanks for showing the cross-section, that was the cherry on the cake!

Neat video. I love experimental processes and the cut away is sweet. Thanks for your time and thoughts.

You're like a well mannered AvE, i like your channel my friend.

Don't know how I ended up here, I've never ever used a lathe, only welded once but I can appreciate a man's skill set. Great video but now I want a lathe, tools, etc.....

I stumbled upon this and couldn't help but watch! Fabulous demo of an unexpected use of a lathe. I did NOT know you could do that : ) Every time I watch a metalworking or woodworking video I feel both amazed at the skills on display and a tad resentful of the Scottish Education System chauvinism that said 40yrs ago 'you can only study Technical Subjects if you have something to Free Kick a football at'...but I see from the news that certain English Grammar schools are STILL living in Downton Abbey Era so some of the country's most talented future Mechanical Engineers, Woodturners & Architects have to wait 7yrs until after they've learned how to make Nationally Useful Lighter-Than-Air Soufflees before their careers can take off. The best gift I ever bought was made by a Female Blacksmith at Keltneyburn by Aberfeldy. Decades ago she apparently put a leather apron + gloves on her 5yr old daughter and told her "it's hot, be careful"; After first completing an Art Degree her daughter is now an established metalworking artist creating globally distributed magical Town & Farm Scuptural Art. It's the same biased attitude that causes 'men' to make peurile trolling Put-Down Comments on YT as blocks the door to aspiring Female Metalworkers. I guess when you're a man frightened of a little competition & threatened by those with the balls to go on camera, that's what you do.

Same method as they join turbine heads to shafts on turbochargers - thanks for the cross section - gives alot more info on the weld structure - nicely done!

many years ago i needed a long drill, so one of the machinest added a 18 in. rod to the drill an did this same trick i still have the drill, it really works. thank for the reminder

Nice video and interesting information. I've done the same process just for fun 😆

100% correct would go out to the shed and try this if my weigh it’s got up today spades ha ha Ha! Awesome job, subscribed

Confess I'd never thought of doing this. I was going to make up a plate with stand-offs, intended screwing -- maybe I'll try this first. Thanks for the inspiration.

First of all I thought you did an excellent job. Your approached it in a systematic manner making logical improvements until success. Also excellent idea to mill a cross section. Question, can this be done with nonferous metals and alloys such as brass, copper, and aluminum. With aluminum you would likely have to shield the point of friction in a CO2, or helium mixture. In the home environment I would think one could use a MIG or TIG gun without the electrode or wire, or detach the low pressure gas line going into the welder and have it blowing over the weld area. That would be a fun experiment? You could even try titanium with Argon?

Thanks for sharing this

First year apprentice stuff, Welding drills into the job etc...oh the joys ...

Worked in a shop for 15yrs. Wish I had videos of some of the ppl I tried to train on mill and lathe and the stuff they tore up

I’m quite sure this was on the list of one of the things not to do when I was an apprentice.

I tried this many years ago, on a 13" Clausing with a 6-jaw.

That was really cool friction welding

We actually had to do this as a last resort in engineering class. The project was each group had to make a RC car with supplied electronics and we could design the drive train and whatever else. We had a worm gear that we 3D printed (cause we didn’t have access to CNC mills) and believe it or not, the 3D printed worm gear worked... for a few minutes at least. Due to having a limited number of 3D printers and multiple groups needing to print parts, we weren’t able to print extra gears. But we found some test prints and actually friction welded them together to get us back up and running. For another few minutes.

Pretty interesting, I had a clue how it was done but never saw the real thing

Nice job, I use to bond POLYETHYLENE pipe together. 500* square||block iron . Be surprised at strength of joint. I've hit it with 2lb hammer, would not come apart.Geo Thermal pipe installations since 1984.

Many years ago I was a Schwinn bicycle dealer. When I went through my factory training, we were taught about some of the fabrication techniques used in the components. The front forks and one piece cranks were made by a company called Ashtabula, probably made in the city by the same name in Ohio. The forks were friction welded, the head tube to the cast or forged forks. I'm sure other items in the industry are made this way, don't know of them though. Jim

I appreciate what you do, so I'll leave this comment for support.

You could also etch the cut piece, might be cool to see what the etched area shows.

Dude... You just taught me a new trick!

Ha! I done this today at work!👍🏻👍🏻

my late grandfather showed me that when i was 10 yrs old. . .. . made a horrid sound it did. awsome video !!

Extend tube max distance in lathe , other tube in drill chuck, same length as in lathe chuck, spin, when welded, release with key the tail stock drill chuck.!! will cool more slowly and be stronger.!!

we did friction weld on rock mining drill steel. up to 2 inch diameter

Awesome little vid and experiment. Very enjoyable to watch.

managed to learn how to do this in college 1978, was the coolest process, ues dissimilar metal , and passed the bend and tension tests

lol. it use holder with brake system for doing friction welding. but nice too try.

that's the way way oilfield drill pipe is made the tool joints are made separate from the tube. then the tool joints are friction welded to the tube, then annealed and re heat treated then the ribbon is cut off inside and out and then EMI inspected.

Fresh out of engineering school I remember touring a plant that made valves for Ford engines where the valve heads were friction welded to the valve stems. They used an inertial method (rather than trying to quickly stop the part rotation once welded.)

I did this 25 years ago as a young engineer. Great fun on the night shift.

Flooded with an argon helium mixture and Purge the tube gas all the way around it and it'll be solid

Lining up could not be simpler mate 1 Place the outer section in the chuck weld face to chuck and then offer up the tool holder and clamp the piece. 2 Then undo the chuck and it should stay in good alignment, then withdraw the tool post 3 Place the second piece in the Chuck as per normal This way the 2 pieces should maintain the correct orientation with each other, I have done things very similar in my Lathe BUT it has an emergency stop and brake , so very effective and not imparting a crystalline structure from a slow stop.

Another Machinist channel to keep an eye on. Cool stuff man.

Fascinating. I have never seen this done before. Many thanks

What if we do rapid quenching for the weld area by pouring cold water when the weld is red hot? That will make the weld stronger right?

8:32 Yikes, that motor is in a bind, keeping pressure on the weld point and the reduced material was the key.

Pretty damn cool. thanks for sharing. I had read about friction welding but it is interesting to see it happen.

Very interesting, well done.

First thing that came to my mind was to shield this with Argon from a tig torch while the metal is fusing... 🤔

Are you the guy that keeps sending me emails about the secret to extending my shaft?

Excellent and well described demonstration, Thank You.

Well here it is after midnight and I’m going outback to my shop and trying this!😂😂

Just prior to stopping, break the piece loose in the tool holder and then shut down; not doing this is probably fracturing the weld.

You can stop any AC motor super fast by plugging it with half-wave DC.

I used to work for a friction welding outfit in Wisconsin in marketing. The machines are purpose built but they resemble very large lathes with a hydraulic press to combine the two rounds. We did axles for CAT and other heavy machinery as well as some of the drive shafts in Mercury Marine motors. They wanted to use a hollow shaft with a solid end for weight saving, but friction welding was the only process strong enough to work. The machines are awesome. The biggest one has stairs and can combine pieces that are up to 3 feet in diameter. The weld is throughout the entire surface instead of just the outside like you would get with traditional welding. The piece actually breaks before the weld does under stress tests. The heat and pressure for the largest machines is scary stuff, with up to 300 tons of pressure while spinning a 5 ton piece of metal. It is not for the feint of heart.

Wow, first time I have seen this, pretty cool, thanks for sharing,

"I lost my allen wrench" story of my life

Try the chuck then release the part in the tail stock chuck and let it spin..

I know it’s a simple concept, but I found this fascinating!!

I saw this done routinely down in a machine shop in Texas. I wasn't a machinist, just a laborer, but I think the beveled the ends for more surface contact. This was how they replaced the tooled ends on worn out drill pipe (oil wells) It didn't come apart.

That is the sketchiest way to light a dart I've ever seen

Great video mate 👍

I like your experimental work. and it works pretty well : )

Damn, thats pretty good! Thx from Soviet Union workers collective, blyat'!

4130 and 4140 are not "high carbon steels". These are medium carbon steels and at the low end of that range. High carbon steels are not very weldable.

Friction stir welding is the new craze in the automotive world both steel and aluminum

Really good video ! The information is good

Release the Drill Chuck when its glowing orange....easy.