Oh, I've been waiting for this one. Warwolf is a classic favourite for me, although with Trebs, you sometimes want to "rely" on their inaccuracy to blind hit some troops that are moving around.

Ok I guess I'll be "that guy" 2:05 Aztecs - Garland wars 2:53 Bengalis - Mahayana 3:44 Berbers - Maghrebi camels 4:17 Bohemians - Hussite reforms 5:09 Britons - Warwolf 6:06 Bulgarians - Bagains 7:03 Burgundians - Flemish revolution 7:49 Burmese - Manipur cavalry 8:52 Byzantines - Logistica 9:59 Celts - Furor celtica 10:54 Chinese - Rocketry 11:50 Cumans - Cuman mercenaries 12:44 Dravidians - Wootz steel 13:55 Ethiopians - Torsion engines 14:59 Franks - Chivalry 15:56 Goths - Perfusion 16:37 Gurjaras - Frontier guards 18:12 Hindustanis - Shatagni 19:19 Huns - Atheism 19:45 Incas - Fabric shields 20:43 Italians - Silk road 21:20 Japanese - Kataparuto 22:11 Khmer - Double crossbows 23:13 Koreans - Shinkichon 24:10 Lithuanians - Tower shields 25:20 Magyars - Recurve bow 26:37 Malay - Forced levy 27:56 Malians - Farimba 28:50 Mayans - El dorado 29:51 Mongols - Drill 30:42 Persians - Mahouts 31:11 Poles - Lechitic legacy 31:50 Portuguese - Arquebus 32:55 Saracens - Counterweights 33:22 Sicilians - Hauberk 34:18 Slavs - Druzhina 35:33 Spanish - Supremacy 36:24 Tatars - Timurid siegecraft 37:12 Teutons - Crenellations 38:25 Turks - Artillery 39:41 Vietnamese - Paper money 40:36 Vikings - Berserkergang

Flemish Revolution : S -Tier in power, D-Tier in design.

I've said before that Mahouts is just a tax on War Elephants. Just make it the civ bonus/make the damn things move faster and give the civ something else.

I've been playing a lot lately with dravidians and I can confirm WootzSteel is insane. Can beat easily any cavalry/infantry civ late.

thank you so much for having labels for your civs in the tier list!

Manipur Cavalry is really good ( and underappreciated) bc Burmese can a) answer opposing CA with Hussars and b) have a really good while unorthodox army composition of Manipur Hussars + Champs or Halbs (depending ont he enemy composition) which both have +3 attack. Usually double melee compositions suck vs massed ranged units of any kind but the Hussars make these trades really effective. It doesnt look like it but it does have a transformative character on the lategame performance. Id advocate for El Dorado to S-Tier. honestly I see this tech twice as often as Garland Wars. Which says something about these civs but in a lot of cases El Dorado is the only reason Mayans arent already dead by mid Castle Age when they fall behind for some reason. it feels dismissive to say Recurve bow is "only" another fletching. As Magyar id trade my Barracks, my Siege Workshoop and my Monastery for 2 more Fletchings. Hauberk still too fast and cheap a nice thing about Temurid Siegecraft that isnt advertised is that you are more often able to use a hill bonus. which is another SE damage upgrade on top.

If I am not wrong, I remember that Kipchak Mercernary has been changed that castles built after this tech can still train free E. Kipchak, unlike First Crusade that spawning is limited by amount of TC

Paper money is atrocious. 24 vils are roughly a relic. Considering the combined cost of the tech is at least around 450 gold, even at low wood prices, you need 15 minutes of payback time of 24 lumberjacks... Even if for some reason you are having a crazy amount of lumberjacks it looks bad, and then again why would you have that many lumberjacks. I wish this tech just didnt cost gold. Make it food and wood and then it makes some actual sense.

I really dont get why some techs dont inform about all bonuses we get. Like Logistica gives extra bonus damage for Catafaracts and Kataparuto with extra firerate. It makes those techs way worse that aktually are.

thanks for the new tierlist! need more

Thanks Ornlu, I needed this right now :))

I wish paper money were something more like, reduce unit gold costs by 10-20%. Or transfer it into an increased wood cost... Maybe even make it so that buying and selling wood at the market doesn't increase or decrease the price as quickly/give a +5-10 to selling price. Meaning earlier wood selling in Imperial could be a massive boost/power spike. Or even just give a good bonus to wood production or maybe even just make it so that Rattan archers get the +20% H.P. boost too alongside a regular extra bonus/boost such as reduce its wood cost.

Thanks for this useful review!

Love the videos Ornlu! Just one thing. Could you add some soft music on the background next time? I think it would emprove the quality of the videos. Have an awesome day.

Pretty sure Flemish Revolution is 1200 Food 650 Gold at the moment, making it the most expensive unique tech.

Everyone made such a big deal about Hussite Reforms when it came out, only to realize monks contribute nothing to a trash war so who cares. Honestly I think that just speaks to a very LEL/mid-ELO mindset that's obsessed with trash wars and overvalues anything that can make your gold stretch no matter how little it actually matters. The flip side being looking down on any civ with bad trash as being overall bad, main case in point being people who think Turks are worthless in late game because they don't understand that it's actually easy for Turks to keep a gold army in the field thanks to cav archers.

Drill makes siege tower the fastest land unit in the game (exclude cheat unit)

What an amazing Tierlist Ornlu! I agree with almost everything here. Maybe Chivalry in A Tier because Franks will always go Stable and yes like everyone else I would also say El Dorado S Tier. Loving the content ☺️

Thanks for the list

30:00 ahhhh yes my biggest fear. Late game Mongol Drill Siege Towers. Never can figure out how to play against them

hey guys its ornlu makes me as happy as hey guys spirit of the law here :D

I didn't know about the Atheism tech also lowering enemy relic gold income. I thought they just swapped the cost reduction for Spies/Treason with the victory countdown increase, but I guess the latter effect was always there. Either way it's at least something you'll tend to get some benefit from instead of the other two things being very situational. I've seen people make the point that the Huns are already so strong that they don't really need an extra boost from a better Imperial UT, but I feel like they could still cut the cost of the tech down to like half. Or maybe lean more into the actual namesake and add a small resistance against conversion or bonus damage against monks. Its also like the only UT that actually has a potential drawback too (even if a Hun player is unlikely to go for a Wonder or Relic victory themselves).

Hi Ornlu Thank you for this great tierlist! Love your insane insights and explanations! Also your criterisas are very clear. However, I have some suggestions with arguments: What are Mayans Eagle without Eldorado? This tech makes their late game very strong, it‘s a great meatshield and raids heavely. I also feel like Mayans would have nothing to break other Civs in Imp. They just cannot push slowly like other Archer Civs. For me S-Tier. Teutons UT is very overrated. It‘s easy to avoid: Trebs and Siege Rams still do fine. Furthermore, it‘s hardly seen in pro tournaments. Very situational! Imo Max C-Tier Top 3 Tier and especially B-Tier are a bit crowded. Might their be a little inflationary. What (B-Tier) UT could probably bit further down? One minor suggestion for your tierlists: order within the tier would be nice since you mention it anyway but still stick with the given order.

Also, I think the game needs a UT that will double the monk conversion warning volume for the opponents and change the conversion sound into Vululu. S-tier Unique Tech 11

It's been a year and a lot of civ have different unique tech now so will you make a new tier list?

In playing some 10x civ bonus games did I realize how weak of an upgrade paper money is. I'd put it in C tier as well, but honestly might consider putting it in D. When compared to other techs like burgundian vineyards, it really pales in comparison and does not generate as much gold as one might think

Fast imp Portuguese arquebus hand cannons are my favorite strat. Love my 45f/40g snipers

I think Warwolf is definitely S-tier. It single-handedly make Britons into a good imperial civ and a strong picks for maps like Golden Swamp which is camp-heavy, to the point I think it's civ-defining. One tech that makes you auto-win every treb war is insane value. Also counters BBC and mass skirm if the opponent doesn't micro them every 2s like a pro.

Hey, so you know, your background light (behind the left side of your head) comes off as very intense and blinding on an HDR monitor in particular. Might I recommend a change?

Imagine we get another civ and alphabetically it comes before Aztecs. It will ruin my early adulthood.

The techs description says some imperial techs are repeteable, but how can it be? As far I know there aren't repeteable techs in AOE. Or, is the a 3x mod?

Nitpick - Druzhina gives trample damage (flat 5 damage, ignores armour) not blast damage (% of headline damage, affected by armour)

El Dorado has to be S-tier, there's no other tech that almost doubles a units HP. It makes them so much more effective against cavalier in the later stages of the game.

I wish double crossbow also effect galleons, the Khmer empire was a naval power to begin with and they don’t even have shipwright anymore

I would have split the civ defining techs into two tiers personally. Stuff like Furior Celtoca and Wootz Steel isnt as good as Torsion Engines and Druzhina

F for the techs UTs that have left us for balance reasons... We miss you, Obsidian Arrows

I would argue Recurve Bow is S tier. It gives Magyars a win condition: get to late game. Without it, the civilization falls apart and free attack is the only bonus left. I would not give too much consideration to TGs, as the game is very different there.

Ornlu really loves infantry and despise cavalry lol

Celt eat TC.

Strongly disagree with your assessment on silk road, you need at least 10 trade carts to even pay off the gold cost of the tech, and you have most likely built a few before picking up the tech. Does saving a couple of hundred gold really help? Can only see it being useful if your trade get smashed and that is mostly GG. Compare that to getting 10 to 30 free cav archers with the Cumins.

I agree with almost everything but paper money, I think that belongs to D tier. It is imperial upgrade and you have to pay 350 golds upfront so your lumberjack can start generating gold super slowly. It is different from vineyard because you can start doing it from castle age and that farm is kind of infinite resources, wood run out fast, to pay off the cost of the tech you probably need 30 lumberjacks consistently chopping for half hour, there might not be tree anymore or you just already won at that point, wasting those golds which could've been used to accelerate your win. It does have use in forest nothing and some black forest game but the point is you typically don't have that many lumberjacks late game, unlike farmers, and wood as resources isn't as important as food late game, often 15-20 lumberjacks can provide enough wood for archer civs to function late game.

I don't think Drill is S- Tier. The upgrade is very good, but it is not good enough to win you a game on its own. Pretty much like you said with Mahayana it only helps when you get into a position you are alreedy good at. It is also completely useless when you don't happen to be in the offensive, but are on your back foot. A- Tier is justified, but definitly not S for me. Also I think El Dorado should be S- Tier. You mentioned that you don't necessarily go for eagles, but at some point you do that in pretty much every game and it helps in every situation in the offensive and defensive (unlike drill). Basically: swap these two and i am happy

Curious that all the civs in S-tier have round shields, but none of the ones in A-tier have...

Ornlu pronounces the polish "ch" in many ways EXCEPT the correct one.

Would “Warwolf” have broken into s-tier if it had been named “Warnlu”?

I think the byzantines just need two small tweaks to make them viable: make the elite cataphract upgrade give the extra bonus attack vs infantry and make logística affect all cavalry, turn down a little bit to 3 the trample damage if necessary

Hello Ornlu I’m curious about your opinion on the unique tech strongholds if The tech was changed To Building regeneration as well as faster firing speed for defensive buildings

I wish Dravidians get Gurjaras’ Team Bonus - Elephant units trained 25% faster

I think Flemish is definitely A tier. Yes it's stupid but it's a tech that can win games. Can't say the same about Manipur Cavalry for example.

Shinkichon is way too expensive given the limited effect in my opinion.

Mayans El Dorado is S Tier in my opinion. Only effects eagles but it is still civ defining. One of the strongest Units in the game and i think is the go to unit for mayans in late game in most games. Franks Chivalry A Tier for sure. It is a must tech in teamgames. You get it in imp right after cavalier and plate barding. It reduces the upgrade time of paladins from 170s to 102s. That is huge and can win games with that faster timing. Ontop of that you can reinforce your army faster. In 1v1 it is also very usefull. As Franks you usally end up with Axeman/HC, Halb, BBC/Trebs because your opponent will go pikes in castle age. And at some point you want to mix in light cav to raid and to distract. It helps alot. I actually think you want this tech in most games with Franks. Huns. Probably deserve F tier. It is basicly 105 premium.

Portuguese UT really only helps BBC, HCs are inaccurate so it doesnt help to track moving units much, very small increase for their BBTs. One tech, for really just one unit, not that great. Arquebus should do something different, i think.

Apart from the meme that is Flemish revolution, wooz steel might be the best tech in the game, too bad Dravidians have shit cav, (or good for civ balance)

I hate the one-time-use sort of unique techs, especially flemish revolution and I hope they get reworked in the future.

You didn't take into account the cost

Shitagni worse than logistics, no way. Outranging onagers and skirms is huge for HC's. El dorado lets mayans dominate eagle fights, and allows them to go toe to toe with cavaliers which is massive, easy S tier. Again with recurve bow, having +1 range against skirms and siege is massive for any ranged unit and too be honest much more useful than drills

Flemish is more expensive than Druzhina

I wonder how Bulgarians would feel if they lost halberdier but Bagains started affecting pikemen.

3:08 200+ 10% = 220 Villagers 🤫 ( not 222)

HAHA!

Terrible intuition regarding most of the techs, their cost and their usefulness in a standard RM or EW game. And I seriously don't understand how you can say knights are melee units and put Chivalry at B tier while you put Wootz steel as S tier even though Infantry are far worse. Frank eco and the cavalry with extra hp and los are quite valuable units. It'd probably be better if this tierlist is broken into 1v1 and TG separately. A lot of very important and useful techs have been rated low while very mediocre techs like Wootz steel have been hyped up. Hauberk, El Dorado, Tower shields, Fabric shields, Chivalry should move to S tier - these are techs which apply to the civ's meta composition and a MUST in most situations. Frontier Guards, Shatagni, Manipur cavalry, Flemish revolution, Bagains, Magrabhi camels and Rocketry should move to A tier as they're useful for their respective civ in many if not all situations. Garland wars, Torsion engines and forced levy should drop to A tier and Wootz steel, Druzinha to B tier.

Unique tech ranking. Haupberg (First Crusade) Yeomen (Warwolf) Logistica (Greek fire) Should be - Fireships damage adjacent ships. (Loses the useless+1 range buff) drive.google.com/file/d/1IC34QduLZ8kxOAw3PXFfAnbpilYrRcGl/view?usp=share_link Lechitic Legacy Hillforts (Tower shields but I want this for a new Messo civ) ‘’Skirmishers and spearmen move 10% faster’’ bonus should go to a new Mapuches/Tarascans civ that forms part of a New DLC. And the (Spearman-line and Skirmishers +2P armour) should go to the Zaputechs. In turn Lithuanians towershields tech applies to their crossbows and their sword line. . Great Wall (Rocketry) Magrebi Camels (Kasbah) Zealotry (Saracens ‘’Counterweights’’ tech should be replaced by a new tech; Arabian horses +10% cavalry speed.(Cavalry not Camelry) ) Atl-Atl (garland wars) Hul’che Javelineers Stirrups cav attack 33% faster (Bagains) Sword line +4 melee armour Silk armour (Timorid siegcraft) Ironclad / Crenelations Thalassocracy Celtic Strongholds (Furor Celtica should be changed to: Ram +40% HP and increased Ram speed) Chivalry - Should gain an added effect - when an enemy's health is reduced to 20% or less by a knight (Knight line or Hospitaller/Templar), there is a 35% chance of it converting to your side. Sepahi Recurve Bow (Corvinian Army) Cuman Mercenaries (Steppe Husbandry) Pavise Nomads (Nomad tech should give you the opportunity of packing up your tc and rebuild it for free. (Moving ox cart).) Frontier guards Fabrick Shields (Andean Sling) Yasama Eupseong (Tower Range) Tigui Inquisition (Supremacy should go to a more primitive ,vill/trash focus civ like an African/Messo civ) Fabric Shields (Andean Sling) Druzina (Detinets) Chatras Paiks Tusk swords Howdah Medical Corps Polish If they want to nerf Poland I would like it if Szlachta privileges gets nerfed and Lechitic Legacy or Winged Hussar get a slight cost reduction.

More tierlists less campaign play thrus. Why would I want to watch you playing campaigns I'll play it myself dawg. I'd even watch a tierlist of tierlists before that