Good video! The part about LoF weirdness at 14:30 thankfully is addressed in the rulebook on page 24, assuming I am understanding your meaning properly. "As long as any Trooper can draw LoF to its target, the target can draw LoF to its attacker as well, as long as the attacker is within the target’s front 180º arc."
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the correction and apologies for me missing that. I kind of feel that could have been a big ‘important/remember’ box under the main rule 😬
@Derpy-qg9hn3 жыл бұрын
I was wondering that the whole sections. "I know CB made a mess of N4 but, what about the tracers-work-both-ways rule?" was pretty much my exact thought process
@jasonsiegel38693 жыл бұрын
I agree with you on the "Corner-Cutting"... The example CB gave was very SPECIFIC about how to use the half base size for movement, and in this case, the Specific does not override the General. Good Call. Jason Vero Beach, FL U.S.A
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Woo hoo!! Looks as though IJW is backing up this interpretation as well so hopefully the corner-cutting ends.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Something like a bike couldn’t shimmy around the corner, they’d be hurtling around at full speed so would need to take a wide arc. But how do you make rules for the speed someone’s travelling? Their intent in being sneaky or drawing attention to themselves? Adding narrative to rules is fun, but it can’t be effectively implemented without making the game complex. Finding a grey area and justifying it with a narrative element isn’t in the spirit of the game if it’s bending a rule to suit an advantage.
@buckcherry25643 жыл бұрын
The half-base thing is clearly not their intention, but it is allowed by the rules. I would just avoid playing with that person. As a TO, I would just shoot it down from the start. Impetuous, As long as they end closer to the DZ than they started, without moving backwards (to shuffle around a building or so) it is fine. Id overlook a "stuck" trooper. As for the getting in contact...if more than one is in range, pick one. TBH, I have always though impetuous being optional was the mistake. LOF: yeah...it makes sense, like keyhole shooting...but we fall back to "if the shooter can see the target, the target can see the shooter (unless the 180deg thing, or what not)" Old rule, but solid. Guided: Yup, you can use it and it is subpar. Other GMLs are D15 AP+EXP (3 hits instead of just shock). It is kinda neat you can take 2 and coordinated fire them. Tohaa can do 4, but they cant mark stuff well.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Good call I reckon with what you’ve said as your rulings I’d enjoy having you as a TO in any tournament. Good to have sound ruling applied!
@RalfSchemmann3 жыл бұрын
Yes, Guided does create those kinds of attack (the Missile Launcher remotes also have a AP+EXP attack that becomes a template attack), but everybody under the template does get a ARO to dodge. From the rule, for when a unit gets an ARO: "It is affected by a Template Weapon, or is the target of a Hacking Program or other Comms Attack." The Dodge will be at -3 (dodging a template weapon without LoF to the attacker). Also, are you misinterpreting shock ammo? If I understand it correctly, it only makes a trooper immediately dead if he falls unconscious (preventing his revival). It does not kill a 2 Wnd model outright, if it only suffers 1 Wnd.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Oh I may have misremembered shock. I thought as soon as it loses a wound it dies. I’ll have to check that. So with a multi-unconscious model or a model with NWI they’d ignore the effect of shock?
@headchime92173 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer If the model has dogged or NWI then shock would force them to skip that state and just die. That's because dogged and NWI are types of unconscious. Shock is the reason why having 1W + NWI is much worse than 2W. However a lot of NWI models have shock immunity.
@Andinel3 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer The way Shock is worded in N4 is that if the unit would enter the Unconscious state, it instead goes to Dead. Multi-wound models are only affected on their last wound if they aren’t shock immune, and most are.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
How does NWI interact with that. Are they fine?
@RalfSchemmann3 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer Nope, they are not. From the Wiki: "Shock Ammunition cancels the Unconscious State of Troopers using this Special Skill [NWI], and they pass directly to Dead State."
@Grummelfaltenkopf3 жыл бұрын
Ok, fast and dirty my interpretations: 1. no gap, no squeeze (if there is enough room around something you move around) what I would like to see is that this is not only on width, but also on heights, but that is a totally different topic. 2. you end up nearer to the Enemy deployment you are fine. Never move towards your own DZ. That means nearly horizontal movement is fine. 3. you see me, I see you, as long as you are in my front arc. 4. the Template is given to any weapon on every possible profile. span-o-pplies trigger interesting situations also. And the template is important ruleswise, because it is 1 of 3 triggers of Dodge.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Agree with you completely!
@ruisilva70912 жыл бұрын
Thank you for making those videos for the community. I believe that Corvus Belli clarified the 'cut corner' abuse on the FAQs & Errata: Q: While using Move or Climb, can you move 'through' a corner, in the same way that you can move through a space that's half the width of the Trooper's base? A: No. If the space is wide enough for the Trooper's full base, you must use the full base. Example at the bottom of the page here: infinitythewiki.com/Move With my interpretation of the impetuous movement rule, I believe that the movement should always be towards the Enemy Deployment Zone. Sure that can be any point of the Deployment Zone, but I think that you should be able to draw a straight line from the movement starting position and the line drawn by the movement (that should always be the full movement value) should point towards the enemy Deploy Zone that only has the maximum of 48" width. So I don't think that a nearly horizontal movement would classify as a movement 'towards the Enemy Deployment Zone'. On the account of the guided, shouldn't you ignore all MODs, with the exception of the negative ones of ECM? Even those that boost you damage? Keep up the awesome work.
@the_infinitygamer Жыл бұрын
You are correct on both of those fronts. Sadly/luckily my video was done before the FAQ that covered these points 😃
@headchime92173 жыл бұрын
Re: Impetuous. It's already been ruled you don't need to take the shortest path towards the enemy deployment zone or an enemy. That's RAW and RAI. They left out the word nearest on purpose. It's supposed to be flexible, and not as rigid as it was in N3. I'm pretty sure CB have already ruled on this. It's fine. If you want to go 3" to the side and 1" further forward, and only end up 1" closer - fine. That's no problem. Re: LOF. If a trooper can draw LOF to a target then the target can automatically draw LOF back, if the enemy is within the front arc. Can't remember which page this is on. Re: Guided. Yeah, sure. It is very good, and it's supposed to be. Ariadna can't use spotlight though so they need to expose themselves to enemy fire to get something targeted. You can always dodge a template that comes from outside LOF. That's explicitly WHY guided uses a template. So you get a PH-3 to dodge the templates from guided. The other versions of guided remotes are better. 'Just a missile launcher, nothing to write home about'?! Bro, any hit from a guided missile forces 3 saves with AP ammunition. It kills virtually anything. I also just want to make sure you understad how shock ammo works - it does NOT instantly kill any model without shock immunity that takes a wound. It means that if a model without shock immunity would go unconscious it dies instead. If it had two wounds and takes one then it goes to one wound and lives. If it has one wound and goes unconscious then it dies. It doesn't insta-kill. It just skips the unconscious state.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the clarification around shock. I did have that wrong and I guess that’s because I mostly play against single wound models. The LOF thing is page 24 others have said and I guess I was too focused on reading the rule I didn’t read around it to see if other pages had interactions on there that cleared it up. I haven’t seen any clarification from CB on impetuous. There’s a thread on the forum that I haven’t checked in a couple of weeks admittedly but that was started with the purpose of clearing up some ambiguity on impetuous.
@headchime92173 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer There are still big ambiguities around what 'doubling back' meant. I'm not sure they're sorted. However the argument about not requiring to move towards the nearest part of the deployment zone, or the nearest enemy has been addressed by HellLois. You're not required to. You don't need to take the shortest path. So the rule has been cleared up a little.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
That makes me so happy. I wanted that to be the case but some other have been very convincing that it’s nearest regardless of what the rule says!
@TylerProvick3 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer I think the part that they are missing is saying that the trooper cannot change directions except to avoid or clear obstacles. If you pick the corner of their deployment zone you cannot zig-zag towards it through empty terrain. Leaves a little room for abuse because people can bonk into terrain to take more movement to go around it in order to slow themselves down. Also, if it's faster to go over low obstacles that then expose them to AROs, is that forced?
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I agree, there’s a lot that’s open to interpretation at present.
@Koby198413 жыл бұрын
I would say you could vault a wall if it was less than half the height of your Silhouette, but cutting a solid wall is cheating, regardless of if you think it is in the rules or not. The half base rule is for getting through narrow gaps, not cutting corners.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I agree! 😃
@dnte6662 жыл бұрын
This is y I love board games. U discuss what ur discrepancies are and adjust the gameplay. If homie wants to cut corners than it means u can cut corners. Tournaments get a ref to rule in on it. Easy. Ur major concerns for balance are unit specific rules.
@the_infinitygamer2 жыл бұрын
That’s all very true!
@xraytheman3 жыл бұрын
had that cutting corners also being used against me to pass enemy models that would normally block the way. Felt all kinds of wrong.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I agree, I think it’s a dirty trick.
@omnitheus54423 жыл бұрын
That sucks man. I would have TOed that crap out
@danbearss87352 жыл бұрын
I agree that the move is illegal, but for a different reason. The rules state that you must always be in contact with the surface on which you intend to move. For a player to cut the corner in the way shown, they would have had to rise to the top of the wall to make such a move. They would then lose contact with the surface they want to move over.
@the_infinitygamer2 жыл бұрын
Although the same could be said for squeezing through a gap - your base isn’t in contact with the surface for all of that move 😃
@stori32753 жыл бұрын
Dodging templates out of line of sight is -3 even if the unit getting clipped isn't the declared target. (against guided or a large template weapon in the back). Dodger can ignore the -3 mod if it has sixth sense on their profile or are in a 4+ fireteam.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Sounds about right.
@stori32753 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer With spot light and FO being reaction skills now, I think your right to value guided. I'm fairly certain you can combine shooting BS attack (guided) weapons with other shooting attacks too, which is nice
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I’m not sure about that but don’t have the rules to hand. I do like guided. It’s a nice way of getting something off an objective from out of line of sight.
@felixstein26943 жыл бұрын
Guided is available on all ML drones, which then fires DMG 14 EXP+AP templates on 18s. Uragan is not nearly on that level tbh ^^
@arrik13 жыл бұрын
He missed guided multi sniper rifles from the Shasvastii Box troopers. All the ammo of multi weapons at DAM 15.
@betts87423 жыл бұрын
As for the template on nearby troopers without los, one of the requirements or triggers for being able to dodge is if you're affected by a template so they would also be able to ftf dodge at -3 for no los.
@betts87423 жыл бұрын
On another note I found the BS Attack guided template rule more interesting for the Nox troop in Shas with a multi sniper. Turning that DA or AP/Shock round into an impact template is quite powerful and your range is board-wide. I don't play Shas but it seems like a powerful 22 pts where they have access to better HDs than Ariadna.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I didn’t realise it had the BS Guided skill
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
True but a -3 dodge versus a BS18/19 (with rem driver) is not a great match up for the target.
@petergreen18753 жыл бұрын
I've been looking at ways to optimize coordinated orders, and was wondering about coordinating BS guided attacks. I want to make sure I'm not abusing the rules by doing it: The rules say the burst of a guided attack will always be 1, but with coordinated orders the sense is that each attacker has its own burst value (always B1 unless it is the spearhead), so I think you could still do up to 4 guided attacks in one order. It would still eat up 4 (or however many shots you take) of your 5-guided-shots-per-turn limit. So, all you would be doing is conserving orders (and maybe limiting ARO opportunities) at the expense of a command token? I also assume that you could mix regular BS attacks and BS guided attacks because guided isn't a separate skill, just a tag that only applies to the particular shooter making the BS attack? Each shooter in any coordinated order always has its own mods and shot requirements (which is why coordinated orders can be such a hassle...). So theoretically you could do a coordinated Move+BS attack, reposition 2 troopers to shoot, one at B2, one at B1, and add 2 guided attacks for a total of 5 shots, two of which are at +6 and have blast templates? And it would leave you with 2 troops with LoF of the target if it manages to survive (which a TAG easily could, or if someone crits on a dodge roll).
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
You’d need to check that REMs can be part of a coordinated order. I know peripherals can’t and don’t have the rules handy to check.
@sombreromuller23803 жыл бұрын
We had a lomger discussion about that movement thing. It is not safe how to play it, but I will not allow it on my tournament
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
You won’t allow people to cut corners or are you talking about impetuous movement?
@sombreromuller23803 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer cut corners. the impetues thing is another story, but i dont see it as a big deal
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Interesting that you would allow it. Would you also allow people to cut corners on buildings while climbing onto a roof?
@sombreromuller23803 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer probably only if the roof has a little wall. then u can ignore that 1 inch wall and threat it like scatter. but on a flat wall no
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Absolutely agree on ignoring the small walls etc. Do you see a difference between different corners on a building?
@nielsjensen41853 жыл бұрын
Rule 1: RAW, if the object is taller than their silhouette they have to climb it to get over it and the Movement stops if the unit wants to move over unless it has Climb Plus. If the wall is lower than S2 they can vault over it, doing so also exposes them to ARO on that segment if anyone can see them. What he did, if the wall was taller than S2, would be ignoring the context of the movement rule and only looking at one thing in isolation to get his desired effect. Rule 3: I would use the rule from N3 that if you can fire at me then I would be able to fire back, as long as other visual rules were fulfilled. They would never able to see the Trooper so no ARO, unless attacked.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Is vaulting (going over an object less that your S value) going to make the model taller? I always thought the model stayed the same height but I don’t know that it’s clear in the rules. Yes fully agree, that is pretty clear I hope!
@nielsjensen41853 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer Yes, look up Vault on the Wiki. It describes the whole interaction. The relevant part to the height of the model when Vaulting is in Section 3, paragraph 2. I've pasted it below for convenience. "This vertical movement is not taken into account when measuring how far the Trooper moves, but the Trooper counts as moving up and over the obstacle for the purposes of LoF."
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
That makes perfect sense and actually came up in my most recent game.
@petergreen18753 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer It seems a bit odd with motorcycles, which can only jump horizontally or vertically down, but since vaulting isn't jumping, we play them like we play any other vaulting troopers. Is that how the rest of you would call it too?
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Yeah I guess a motorcycle could vault something even though the physics seems off 😂
@TexasFriedCriminal3 жыл бұрын
LoF: 3x3mm minimum is satisfied by a 1x10mm strip as 3x3=9 < 1x10=10. Also, 3x3mm is not a measure of volume, which is three dimensional, but of surface.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
The way the rule is written it’s that you have to see 3x3mm, which is a square.
@andrewscheppler14683 жыл бұрын
For the movement ruling, how are you leaving out "any surface they move on"? I'll agree that they can cut the corner of the walls if the walls are low enough that they could jump over (without causing additional movement requirement). You are not moving on the surface of the wall, unless you're Spiderman, otherwise in order to cut that corner.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
So you’re anti corner cutting?
@andrewscheppler14683 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer Sorry, thought it was implied. I do not think, according to the rules, that you can cut corners unless you have a way to be on the actual wall surface. You are not on a surface when you clip the wall corner, so I don't really see how someone can twist the rule to make this work - without just out right cheating or abusing the rules as written. ; )
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Got you. I’m on the same page as you but it’s interesting how many people like the ideas of cutting a corner.
@MajorBorris3 жыл бұрын
My friend and I used to argue about this kind of stuff all the time for games until we just came to the conclusion that the rule only says what it say and it does nothing extra.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
That’s a good point - one we can all learn from I think!
@nathancollier70863 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the video! I agree that the Uragan is good, but I don't think it's better than your average missile bot. (Other than points.) For example, a Clipper Dronbot is shooting in guided mode on an 18 using Dam 14 AP+EXP! I think that's much scarier than a Dam 15 AP+Shock hit in my opinion. Guided became a lot more viable in N4.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I painted myself into a corner by messing up how shock works and agree with you. A standard missile with continuous damage is excellent 😁
@spartacusjsmith3 жыл бұрын
Yeah a missile is by far more dangerous being EXP+AP (not continuous damage, you’re thinking of Rocket Launchers)
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I thought explosive was like fire?? Shows how often I use it. Oh no now I remember, it’s 3 saves.
@spartacusjsmith3 жыл бұрын
The ambiguity on impetuous is deliberate. You’re reading too much into it, just move towards an enemy or dz by whichever way you want, the old n3 thing of closest enemy is gone to allow players more agency. I don’t believe that’s a bad thing
@spartacusjsmith3 жыл бұрын
In addition I do believe it needs a bit of clarification regards what doubling back means but I believe the requirement to move your full distance mitigates a lot of fuckery. Especially with bikes who are seeing a resurgence in N4, in part, thanks to the impetuous rules
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Ok so you think the freedoms is the intent. I would love that to be the case and that’s definitely how it reads but I didn’t find it clear that that was the intent. Especially as others on the forum and FB have been really adamant that it’s nearest regardless of what the rules say.
@spartacusjsmith3 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer well people on the forums and fb need to stop thinking n3 and move with the times 😂
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Hahaha that’s the absolute truth!!
@obyiscushobbyandgaming3 жыл бұрын
@@spartacusjsmith I agree, it seems clear that the intent is that you don't need to go to closest unless they are a movement skill away (a lot of people keep saying ZoC which is wrong). The part that needs clarifying is the doubling back part, because the rule abuse people have pointed out that techically you can move back and forth at an ever so slight angle, essentially not moving forward at all without retracing your pathing. To avoid this I hope they faq doubling back to no part of your silhouette ever passing over a point where the silhouette previously passed over
@TylerProvick3 жыл бұрын
Cutting corners: I would accept any ruling from Corvus Belli, but I can see this being intended and accepted. We don't have giant round bases we need to get around corners in real life so while your interpretation is clean and how I play, I think that it really increases friction on terrain which isn't necessarily right.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I think it gets worse the bigger the base in question. And with TAGs becoming a bigger part of the game I’d like to see them take the longer route. Ian Wood seems to have clarified this at the highest non-CB level as not being the intention and that units can’t cut corners.
@eugenemcardle78462 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer I'm assuming everyone here has already seen the FAQ, but for anyone who hasn't this is explicitly addressed there. If there is a space big enough for the models full base, then it cannot use the cutting corners option and must take the longer path.
@the_infinitygamer2 жыл бұрын
Glad it was addressed in the FAQ
@timh32593 жыл бұрын
If I got you right I understood, that you say that if a guided missle hits a unit it gets a dodge (-3) because LoF is missing. And if a second unit is standing right next to it, it dosen't get a dodge? I think the second part is not right, since the second model is affected by a template and therefore get's a dodge as well (Requirement of Dodge: They are affected by a Template Weapon)
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
You are correct. If you’re hit by a template weapon. Regardless of whether you’re the target or not you still can dodge. This was my mistake.
@jasonsiegel38692 жыл бұрын
Hey Infinity Gamer... How about a video on Impetuous units and how to better use them strategically.. And maybe a Co-Op type video if you happen to be friends with that Vault guy down there in y'all's country.. he's a real good talking book, but his verbage and tone and inflection of tone aren't (in my opinion) as practiced as yours.. You see, in my opinion, where you are a humble gamer, and often apologize if you get anything wrong, Vaul comes across as being "In the Know".. and there's nothing wrong with that, but I, personally, tend to fall asleep during his videos, not because of the content, but his lack of tonal modification, i.e.inflection of tone.. where you are upbeat and motivated, he is not.. But I the arena of confidence in rules knowledge he is quite knowledgeable.. So, in my opinion.. I believe the two of y'all, whether buddies or not, could literally benefit from each other.. There, I said it.. now I'm read for dishes, pots and pans and the occasional Cat to be chucked at me... But before anyone gets too mad at me, please note that I have been gaming since June 1984, and miniature gaming Since October 1992 when I graduated from Basic Training. The U.S. Armed Forces loves using miniature pieces to represent strategies before an Op.. which quite literally got me into WH40K in 1996, when I got out of the USAF, and went home to Army National Guard Infantry, 53rs Support.. So, because of my time in the Military, I know a thing or two on... You guessed it.. Speeches.. specifically, something we American Service Members call.. Death by PowerPoint.. so we have to learn how to speak in a classroom setting so as too keep the troops motivated. You sir, could teach a class on this.. every time I watch your videos, I go set up the game table in my Den and have to play a game of N4 with one of my sons. So, anyway... Thank you for letting me share my Opinion, Strength, and Hopes, that in my opinion are New Zealand's best representatives for Infinity N4. Good Night, and Good Luck, Sincerely, Jason13
@the_infinitygamer2 жыл бұрын
Thanks so much Jason! I really appreciate your kind words and having only met with Vaul on a couple of occasions can confirm that he has a wealth of knowledge on the game we all love. One day our creative paths may cross! I’m hoping to go to another national event soon and will hopefully get to play against (and learn from) him first hand.
@goudevincent28853 жыл бұрын
Discussing it on French forum Guard shenanigans and spec ops combo are much more concerning... 12BTS + Bio Immunity are tough
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
The whole Guard thing is pretty interesting and a new mechanic which needs more games to understand.
@Lucian0283 жыл бұрын
I struggled to understand and I still don't get what the guided part was about.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Sorry Monteg, must be me waffling 😁
@Lucian0283 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer I did rewatch it. Was it about firing guided with non circular profile? It literally says that in attack description. It's not that strong. I disagree with it, here's why: - I see the biggest advantage of having guided missile, repeater network and a bunch of hackers for spotlight in forcing your opponent to spend orders on reset in his turn or face a missile in yours. Not the attack itself. - As already mentioned here somewhere, Guided bots in N4 changed their smart missiles (ap+da) for regular missile launchers (ap+exp, since any guided attack is a template). It is way beyond 'not special' in my opinion. - AP+Exp is much better than AP+Shock. Shock will only kill unconsious models, while Exp gives you 3 arm rolls which outshines 1 arm roll on Uragan completely. - It's still one FtF roll, you can't rely on it. - Ariadna gets very little from new guided attacks since they can only place a Targeted state via Forward Observer with LOF. You can similarly say that TAK is strong since it can stack 4 guided bots and coordinate attack 4 shots at once. Although, regarding BS16 on traktor missile bot - yeah, you can finally shoot something if you really have to.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
All your points are excellent of course! You’re right, my mistake around shock hasn’t helped my assessment as it’s not as powerful as I thought it was. A coordinated guided attack would be particularly painful and repeaters and spotlighting is now very good if you have it. I plan on lists with at least two repeaters and pitchers. Need to actually get into a game and figure out if guided is as good on paper as it seems!
@changboyz3 жыл бұрын
I think the line of fire rule advantage would actually be really hard in an actual game because how would you convince your partner that there was line of fire but the window back to your model was less than 3 mil.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I did think that but it would be possible. Turns out it doesn’t matter as page 24 has a line that says if LOF is reciprocal for the target so long as the attacker is in the front arc.
@spartacusjsmith3 жыл бұрын
Reciprocal LoF kicks in If you can see me, I can see you Also LoF from you has to be 3x3mm so you cannot draw LoF to anything unless 3x3mm of your silhouette can see 3x3mm of your target
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Page 24 does say that if you can see me I can see you so long as you’re in the firing arc but it’s not a requirement to have more than 3mmx3mm of yourself visible to shoot 😃
@utc1843 жыл бұрын
At 15:00, Don't they also clearly state in the rules that if a model is being shot at, the other model should also be able to shoot back as long as it is in their front arc?
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Correct - sadly I can’t update the video but that’s been addressed in the comments 😃
@jacobprimeaux26523 жыл бұрын
I think the vagueness of the Impetuous rule is so vague, it has to be intentional. If I'm guessing their intent, its to tone down the idea of Impetuous from berserkers rushing straight into gunfire to just being so eager for the fight that they refuse to back up. So they still are raring to get to the enemy (since they refuse to backtrack) they just aren't as single minded, nor quite so suicidal.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I think that’s a really good interpretation actually. Bloodthirsty without being suicidal is definitely how it comes across To be honest, having to use full movement often means bikes and other impetuous troopers will be seen anyway so they may end up being shot!
@bbtdltd80813 жыл бұрын
I would disagree with you on the 1st exploit - Its not something I would have thought of but just because I hadn't thought of it doesn't obfuscate the concept that your miniatures are moving in a dynamic fashion and are able to hug walls and squeeze through tight gaps in fact the more I consider it blundering round a wall with the widest arc of travel available seems thematically the opposite of a tight skirmish game heavily focused on use of cover - IMO this should be the canonical method of moving around a corner - the disadvantage should be you reduce your arc of fire by half in doing so as it is now filled with wall to represent your action - now my new house rule thanks :) Regarding LOF that seems really gamified - I would think if you can shoot at a model while within its front arc logically it can shoot back at you. The other two seem legit to me - particularly the last one as its rewarding a player that has thought about their unit composition and logically follows that an Artillery unit being guided by a spotter is a lethal combination while being within the explicit text of the rules.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
That’s fair enough I guess TOs can give different rulings on the same interpretation. Until it’s explicitly ruled out then it’s open to either 😄
@bbtdltd80813 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer great video btw really well thought out points - enjoyed it a lot
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Thanks so much I always appreciate the feedback.
@septymesk77213 жыл бұрын
Question: is the rule carried over from N3 that said if one model has LOS to another, then they both have LOS to each other ? I know it was there in N3, but I didn't go looking for it in N4
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Yes, Page 24. Luckily someone else pointed it out as a correction to the video content 😄
@goudevincent28853 жыл бұрын
About impetuous movement I don't see it as vague. It's not N3 that's all, so you CAN move just half inch toward enemy deployment zone. The goal of N4 is to make the game much more fluent, removing constraints helps playing quickly those impetuous orders without so much planning as in N3.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I think you’re right and that most people will eventually come around to the N4 version. I think people are used to porting over previous editions to make sense of new wording but I think it’s different this time.
@obyiscushobbyandgaming3 жыл бұрын
You still need to move you full first move value though
@Shypa2 жыл бұрын
Any rule "bending" action shoumd be allowed. Even if they are obviously againts the idea of the rule. That's the only way to make sure this misleading rule description will be clarified in N5.
@the_infinitygamer2 жыл бұрын
Or in an FAQ. N5 is likely a few years away so we should look for tidy ups as soon as possible.
@changboyz3 жыл бұрын
I think your ruling on impetuous is not only correct it is not only allowed it is exactly what raw imply.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Ok so you’re in favour of free movement on impetuous. That’s good to know because others on Facebook haven’t agreed!!
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I thought so too but then you hear some people and they’re blinkered into thinking it must be being written incorrectly
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
😂😂😂
@goudevincent28853 жыл бұрын
When N3 came out some people where furious with the lack of dispersion from Grenade. Impetuous is the new Grenade :p
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Hahaha I love this analogy
@gman15153 жыл бұрын
The method you show for moving around the corner isn't the most effective legal move either. Sticking to the corner and having your model "roll" around it would be shorter as well, and potentially avoids breaking cover. The corner cutting method isn't a really impactful amount shorter than that method Mathematical explanation for why the roll method is shorter. To roll around the corner you essentially trace 1/4th of the circumference of the base. .25x2πr. using the same method shown in the video you instead from the same point move directly in the x direction one radius and then down 1 radius. Ie you move the diameter of the base. Some simple math shows that using the roll method would be about 25% shorter than the straight lines legal method.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
That was a lot of advance left math for me!! I pretty much use base widths for movement as a 28mm is an inch pretty much.
@gman15153 жыл бұрын
@@the_infinitygamer fair enough. To just put it in simpler terms you cut slightly more than a quarter inch off your movement if the guy hugs the corner instead of moving in 2 straight lines, leaving the corner cutter with a half inch advantage at max.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
That makes a lot more sense! I’m hoping that more people are aware of cornet cutting now and try to avoid doing it. There’s been so many times where a fraction of an inch has made a huge difference and it’s easy to cheat those sort of margins.
@stephenelder26523 жыл бұрын
I don't know or really care how the ads are allocated on KZfaq, but there were far too many on this video and I found it unwatchable.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Sorry Stephen! I usually just let KZfaq decide but have actually trimmed a few when I can.
@TexasFriedCriminal3 жыл бұрын
In general, for all rules, interpretation should follow this constraint: Only those interpretation of concepts (e.g. the concept of surface) are acceptable as can be generally arrived at by the vast majority of players in a quick and easy manner, that is to say concepts should be treated, as far as possible to mean what the self-evidently mean in everyday discourse. Any interpretation that seems clever and that you had to arrive at by turning things around in your head most likely does not satisfy this constraint and should therefore not be accepted. Example: In issue 1, surface as something to walk on meaning the corners of building seems unlikely to fit this criterion as we do not walk usually on corners of buildings. Surface rather self-evidently means the vertical part that a sufficiently small person could walk on. That surface is sufficiently wide according to the movement rule.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I’m not sure I understood any of that 😬
@Jonaswesen3 жыл бұрын
I really like your content, but 15 commercials when you cant reach your device to skip them was kind of painful.
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
Point taken - won’t let the system auto-place too many next time 😃
@andreastucchi61913 жыл бұрын
Apart the ignorance of defining a volume in mm^2...in your example, if u expose 2,5×25mm^2 is well above the 3x3mm^2 minimum area. How you are supposed to measure such a requirement is beyond any comprehension, tough...
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
That’s the thing, it’s not mm2 it’s written in the rules as a 3mm x 3mm it’s a big difference. 2.9mm x 3.1mm is 3mm2 but not the 3mm x 3mm requirement 😆 but anyway, you’re right. It would be almost impossible to achieve this if it wasn’t overwritten by page 24.
@omnitheus54423 жыл бұрын
Wow sounds like the books and rules need a native English speaker's guidance to sort this stuff out...
@the_infinitygamer3 жыл бұрын
I don’t think it would hurt to give a few people from different countries early access to ensure the rule wording is clear. With anything if you’re focused on something it’s hard to spot the mistakes. There are very few here but playtesting ahead of release with ‘externals’ might be good.
@hayseshouhda5730 Жыл бұрын
You mic is way too quiet in this vid unfortunately.