I live in Raleigh and when I moved here, I thought maybe I could take a train since trains didn't come to my small town. Even in a city like Raleigh, every time I have looked into a train, it takes forever, it costs as much a plane, and you have to get on the train in the middle of the night. Not worth it.

THIS. I looked into taking a sleeper train to San Francisco...$1700 per person!! WTF?? Who has that money or time? Or I could take the $100 flight, still expensive and a huge hassle, but it's not like a months worth of bills, car payments, and utilities.

Way more. Way way more. Nowadays.

Same here in the UK I can get the sleeper train for £150 ($190) from Inverness (North of Scotland) to London and that includes your own cabin to sleep in.

Yikes...I wish there were good train rides. Especially since planes 'cause so much pollution, whereas some kinds of trains don't. On a selfish note, planes literally give me migraines or at least headaches, major sensory overload, even with noise-canceling headphones, plugs, the works. Just not pleasant tbh.

Good point!

Yeah, my parents' town doesn't even have Uber. And the bus service only has like 2 buses and it literally takes longer than walking to get anywhere.

Even IF you're in a major city you might well need a car to get around. Most of our public transit systems kinda suck, and I say this as someone who doesn't drive.

That’s what I was going to say. If you fly to a non major city without a subway, you’re going to be out the cost of a high priced rental car. Even the crappiest cars are expensive!

I was in Tokyo in March and there were like 7-year-olds using the train by themselves (and Tokyo is safe enough for them to do that). Honestly I think that's really cool - the train system gives a lot more independence to children, elderly and disabled people, and anyone who can't or doesn't want to drive. Anyway, yeah, I'm just as obsessed with the trains in Tokyo

Well, Japanese trains are known for being the best in the world!

When I was a kid in Shreveport, Louisiana the electric trolley system was great. Fir 15 cents you could go anywhere in the city easily. Then they switched to diesel busses and it went downhill from there. To much politics screws everything up.

I second the train system in Europe!!! Germany and The Netherlands both had similar to what you’re talking about. I was surprised that in Romania, not so much and Sweden not so much… at least in the places I went. But almost everywhere we needed to be was within walking distance.

French metro is a sh*t place. There are better metro systems in the world and way more nicr and comfortable to be there

This! I grew up in a family that would take two week road trips with our camper. We could prepare our own meals and sleep 10 people comfortably my parent's and grand parent's campers. So much cheaper than eating out and getting a hotel (obviously you do have to pay for the camper but they were also more affordable then). I love just going on road trips for this reason and enjoy long car rides. I enjoy flying to, but with all the security and everything it feels more stressful than just hopping in your car and going somewhere!

@@rettathompson1222 I’ve never been Rving, but I’ve driven from the Midwest to Texas, Florida, South Carolina numerous times. I like being able to impulsively stop and try a new restaurant or see a new city. I also like trains and planes, but growing up in a family that preferred to travel by car, it’s very relaxing to me. Also I can really dive into some audio books! :)

yesss. I bought a motorhome for exactly this. It saves us so much money over hotels

Yes! Road tripping is fun when you have the time for it.

Yeah and play some music and eat snacks in the car! Keep going until either someone has to pee or we run out of gas.

You can go cross country with Amtrak.

@@HimmiefanBut not necessarily directly. All the corridors connect. Large swathes of the country do not have stations or lines.

@@Himmiefan Unfortunately the only reason I can see to do that is for the novelty....based on cost, convenience, reliability, etc., if you just want to get from A to B it doesn't make sense to take Amtrak. (I would love to do a train trip like this sometime but I will basically have to win the lottery before I can justify doing it.)

@@kray3883there are a few specific scenarios when taking Amtrack is reasonable. There’s a line that goes from Chicago to New Orleans, maybe a bit farther in either direction. There are daily/nightly trains that go up and down, so if you went to college in one city on the route and were from another city on the route not too far, it’s not usually much longer than driving and may be cheaper than a flight. For example, there’s an overnight train from Urbana-Champaign, Indiana to Memphis, Tennessee that’s about 8 hours every night. If you wanted to go from Urbana-Champaign to New Orleans, however, it would probably take about 16 hours and be comparable in cost to a flight and take longer than driving.

​@@Himmiefanthat is technically true, but not feasible in practice. It only works if you happen to be starting and ending at very select locations. Even the booking system is archaic and infuriating. And it seemed to me that you could be aiming for a location directly on a line, but there's no stop within an hour of there in either direction. Amtrak's website specifically says that all stops are not listed on their route maps, but WHY?! Why would you not list them? I spent three hours trying to plan a trip and then said screw it. Tldr: I envy Europe's train system.

The saddest part is that it used to be easy and inexpensive to travel, and back when U.S. workers had more rights (before the 80s) it was a lot easier to get the time off to travel. Like everything else, baby boomers even destroyed the American road trip.

​@@carljones9640 I wouldn't blame that all on baby boomers, the oldest of them would only have been 34, and the youngest 16 in 1980. The people in power for much of the 80s - like Reagan - who oversaw a lot of de-regulation, cutting back on social programs, weakening laws upholding workers rights, etc... were mostly from generations prior to the Boomers.

Yeah we never travel it's just not a thing we do and I have an issue with getting sick when I am in the car for long periods of time so yeah that's y too

Same. I'm from South Carolina and now live in NC and I have only been to New England out of those places and it was quite an undertaking to go. I once drove from Clemson, SC to Boston and it took like 20 hours.

​@@amandabaker4678 That's how it usually works. The eras people associate with certain generations are usually defined by created media, and the largest consumers of media (who have the greatest sense of nostalgia for the generation later) are young: 0-30. But the producers of the media and steering of cultural (and political/economic) direction are generally older, from the last generation: 30-60+.

Same here - Canada! Visitors think they can drive to visit Vancouver from Toronto and maybe throw in the Maritime provinces along the Atlantic in a week. Um, nope

Yes I bet this is all applicable to Australia too!! Australia is freaking massive.

I did a train journey around Australia. Not as cheap as flying economy but cheaper than business class and I got to see the country.

Yeah trains within most cities, all good. Between cities, almost nonexistent. Especially between NSW and QLD since QLD decided to have narrow-gauge trains instead of standard gauge. No double-deckers trains!

With Australia it feels like it’s be even worse. Like, if you’re trying to drive across Australia, and your car breaks down, you’re more likely to be totally in the middle of nowhere, w/nowhere to go to than in the US. And if you are ill-prepared, you might be genuinely in danger.

I flew into Milan and went from Milan to Venice by train with Milanese friend and was OVER THE MOON about how fast and how close it was. It's unbelievable to me that everything is so easy to get to!

I've taken Amtrak in the US. It's slower than driving or flying and more expensive. Taking the trains in Europe felt like going to an amusement park ride due to the novelty. Most cities have poor to non-existant public transportation too. Having a car here isn't truly optional in most places. Mobility is greatly limited without one. We just get used to relying on it for all lengths of trips. 2000 miles round trip is about my max to drive.

Any time I see taking a train is faster than driving I get so so excited. That never happens here

Expecially since us Italians make fun of Trenitalia as the worst company out there. With bashed broken down smelly trains that are never on time. But that applies more to regional trains from experience.

I don't know about that, I seem to remember it being about the same price or even slightly more than a plane ticket in 2002 to go from Chicago to Denver on Amtrak and we most certainly were pulling a mail car in the back.

@@mystica-subs *Before planes were a huge economic aspect. 2002 isnt the same as 1850s - to 1970s.

I wish you all the best traveling with your animals!

We did those long trips to because it was cheaper. Mind you we were going from northern Italy (Genova) to southern Italy (Reggio di Calabria) by car which was a 10+ hour drive with stops because it was me, my brother and my parents to go visit my dad's family there. It's stressful more so on the parents as us kids would fall asleep in the car. And my dad usually left late at night to avoid traffic. He had to do it last year when he moved closer to us and it was even worse as he tried to pack all of his stuff and didn't manage to grab all of it. And even forgot some things like the duvet and other stuff. Needless to say he's going to hate going back to grab more stuff this summer. But who knows maybe both me and my brother can go with him to help and see the family as he only lives 50 minutes away from us.

I don’t know about that accident, could you please give me some more information about that?

A train derailed and leaked harmful chemicals into the environment.

@@shereadsmysteries thanks, that helps me find more information about it online. Trails derailing happens in other countries as well. At least two trains derailed in Germany just this year. One freight train and one regional train for people (near Garmisch-Partenkirchen). Several people died in these accidents. But at least they searched for the reasons I tried to make sure no other train will derail for this reason.

@@jennyh4025 and the train accident here in Ohio was done on purpose

@@rerejones9095What??! 😢

Dis

Except for the part where many people live 3 to 4 hours from an airport, yeah. Most people live within two hours of an airport, but TSA lines + connections + layovers suck up SO MUCH time

I live in Portland and desperately want to do that trip but it costs so much and I feel like if I'm gonna do it I'd want a roomette. I really wish Amtrak was more useful. But there have been improvements, I know where I am some of the money from the infrastructure bill went to adding more frequency on the cascades so at least it's something.

Same with many places in America. Unless you go to a big city, you want your own car or a rental

Ooh, yes that too!

Melbourne has a good public transport system. I didn’t drive as that whole “keep to the left when turning right” for trams is confusing. I got a train to Geelong and then bus to Apollo Bay, so even outside of the city it’s pretty good. Unless you’re staying on a farm in the north of the state then a car isn’t really needed. In the USA I had to drive as there was no choice, not even in large towns

@@Vonononie I mean Sydney has good public transport in the centre and it's not like there aren't any regional trains and buses, they're just so far apart in time that driving would have the time. I don't know about regional transport in Victoria, but I would expect it's not just the north that you would need a car, e.g. the great Ocean road area anywhere along the coast really. And for the locals, i've heard some of the new suburbs have very little public transport, so if U wanted to visit a friend who lived there or stay with them there on your trip, public transport again becomes a problem. I agree that the hook turn thing freaks me out so I would probably stay with public transport in Melbourne City, the trams definitely helps.

Where did you get that figure about 80% of the population living within an hour of a major metro area???? That’s just patently false. Even if you just consider the geography of the US, that’s completely impossible.

I once drove across West Texas, through New Mexico, Arizona, Colorado and Utah. The Texas portion was the WORST. The rest had changed in scenery and we stopped in some gorgeous national parks. West Texas has none of those things. It was exciting to see a windmill or barn because that was at least SOMETHING in a bunch of flat fields of nothing.

​@@candacechavigne556080 percent of Americans live in metro areas according to the 2020 census. That's 265,149,027 Americans out of 331,449,281 Americans. 66,300,254 Americans live in rural areas. A relevant question is how many of those Americans in metro areas have nearby airports that can get them most places directly (without a layover) and without costing an arm and a leg.

This comment isn’t exactly accurate. Most major cities in the US, and even a lot of small towns, WERE constructed around railway stations and rail lines. These eventually became defunct or were destroyed for the interstate system, but a huge number of cities in the US were built around their rail transportation connections. The best example is St. Louis: ever wondered why they have that big ass metal arch? Because during the era of the transcontinental railroad, STL had hundreds of trains going West to California and other Western states every day. STL was the “Gateway to the Pacific”, hence the arch.

also the freeway between dallas and fort worth is a merger based death trap

Europe has (slightly) bigger land area than the US, according to World Atlas

Yes! And we like to have our cars once we get to where we are going.

We used to. Those truck stops have mostly been dismantled as well

😂 I'm from the Midwest and underestimated how large Colorado is. There was so much we didn't get to do because I tried to pack so much into my itinerary!

Well, Europe is not much smaller.... Try to go from Helsinki to Lisbon... Or from Dublin to Athens

@@BICIeCOMPUTERconGabrielebut those are different countries. Most Americans plan trips to Europe around just a couple countries, often choosing to visit only one.

@@MysticOceanDollies Ok just like an European that plans a visit only, let's say, in California.

@@BICIeCOMPUTERconGabriele Europe is actually bigger than the US

Europe is broken into many countries. So each country does its thing when designing railways. Each country is really small and when you put all the railways and even roads together, it adds up to far less distance than you would have in the US. The USA is ONE country the size of Europe. So it's responsible for laying track across land the size of the entirety of Europe- cost, labour, materials etc, the sheer distance of it all. It's easier to do in Europe because you have many countries sharing this task. Also, because it is so big, there is a lot of nothing where no one lives. The distances are huge, and who is going to maintain all of this? The US already doesn't maintain the railways it does have. It's really not feasible. It's like when people say to me as an Ausssie why is there no railway from Perth to Sydney? Because it's thousands of kilometres of desert where no one lives. How do you maintain thousands of kilometres of track in the desert where no one lives? For a two day train journey? It's really not feasible or cost effective. (Sorry for all the edits, formatting on mobile is a task and a half)

​@@vintagebroadwaystar3473🎯

This is the thing people don’t understand when they fantasize about how trains system in Us should be like Europe. People don’t understand and realize just absolute sheer size of the country. And like you said, population density plays an outsized role in deciding where and when it makes sense to connect two cities. Not to mention, if it is done federally vs state fundings that’s huge task and bureaucratic work in and of itself. Like you said, who is going to maintain literally thousands of kilometers of rail lines where literally no one lives? Oh and when that system is not maintained or efficient, people already will complain about how crappy it is. Well guess what, context is freaking totally different. It’s like people can not really think in terms context at all. The policy and system that works in one context, the exact same thing can not work in completely different context. Other thing people don’t understand about public transportation in US, is the structure of US is distributed. That means, each county within state has it’s own funding that goes towards transportation and some comes from federal grants. Each counties need is different along with tax structure for these services. Anything centralized ends up being adisaster. It’s much easier to update/remove stuff at local level ( county level) even though it feels slower, federally controlled system will be soooo sooo much slower. As much as people complain about public transportation in US, had it been fully federally controlled , it would have been far far worse, I.e. Amtrak system. we also don’t think backwards, this excerpt from Rory Sutherland is a brilliant example of thinking backwards. We need this type of thinking more in public debates. “And are railways all that great? Pinkos seem to love mass transit and hate cars. But the problem with mass transit is that such modes of transport operate on a hub and spoke system, which necessarily concentrates added value at the hubs and nodes. By contrast the car, the taxi and the van, which move independently, are almost certainly far better at creating and dispersing wealth and employment to people over a wide area, rather than enriching city-centre landowners. We assume that the postwar US had a lot of cars because it was rich. But the reverse is also true: it became rich because it had a lot of cars. If we really wanted to boost the economy, HS2 would be a road.” - Rory Sutherland

Thing is the USA once had an amazing, world leading, rail network but it was ripped up and replaced with interstate. It amazes me that Americans will say “we are too big to have a connecting train system which covers all states” but will ignore the fact you have a comprehensive interstate system, with compatible rules and designs all over the USA. The country isn’t willing to build railway infrastructure as people claim it’s subsidising the rail industry but are happy for multiple billions to be paid by the tax payers to subsidise the automotive industry by building and maintaining roads. Choice of travel is freedom

@@Vonononieexactly!!!! We could definitely do it if the political willpower was there

*cries in German* That differs from country to country. Germany - almost never on time, trains often get cancelled completely. The infrastructure and the trains themselves are amazing! Which makes it even more frustrating that they can’t seem to get it work. In France in the other hand, I have never seen a single train that was late. Their trains are worse IME, but punctuality is amazing.

So true. We always need to plan extra time for delays when going by train. Plus broken air-conditioners, people drinking on the train, lack of toilets in smaller stations etc.

💯

its only an 18hr drive though, i'd rather drive and be able to stop and enjoy things along the way than pay all that money for a train I can almost promise is going to be late

Oh, a short trip?

I want to take the California Zephyr route from Chicago to just outside San Francisco. I understand the scenery is gorgeous.