Innovating on a Shoestring

Innovating on a Shoestring | TKD

Рет қаралды 20,748

6 ай бұрын

Improving the mobility of infantry support guns by mounting them on a wheeled or tracked chassis was a concept that arose following the end of the First World War. The Germans developed the most successful implementation of this concept with the series of vehicles known as Sturmgeschütz (assault gun). This also created a misconception that they were the only ones who tried to develop such a vehicle, however, other armies in Europe also showed an interest. Economical and industrial limitations often meant that not many of these projects went beyond a simple proposal. Poland, however, was one of the few nations that actually put some resources and time into developing these vehicles, albeit in limited scope.
Join this channel to get access to exclusive perks:
/ @tanksencyclopediayt
If you liked this video, please consider donating on Patreon or Paypal!
Patreon: / tankartfund
Paypal: www.paypal.com/paypalme/tanke...
Article: tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/po...
Sources:
J. Prenatt (2015) The Polish armor of the Blitzkrieg, Osprey Publishing
Działko piechoty 47mm wz.1925 “Pocisk” - Piotr Zarzycki Wielki Leksykon Uzbrojenia Wrzesień 1939 Volume 82. Edipresse Polska S.A. 2016
J. Korbal, Prototype self-propelled guns TKD - Nowa Technika Wojskowa - Numer Specjalny 5/2020
A. Lüdeke (2007) Waffentechnik im Zweiten Weltkrieg, Parragon Books.
derela.republika.pl/armcarpl.htm
Reddit: / tankencyclopedia
TE Shop: www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/Goo...
Our website: www.tanks-encyclopedia.com
Gaming News Website: www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/games/
Facebook: / tanksencyclopedia
Twitter: / tanksenc
Discord: / discord
Email: tanks.encyclopedia@gmail.com
An article by MarkoPantelic and Jarosław Iwańczuk
Narrated by Captain Pineapple
Edited by Thundershark
Sound edited by Captain Pineapple

Пікірлер: 102

@cybernetic_crocodile8462 6 ай бұрын

The situation of Poland in interwar period was suboptimal to say the least. After the country reappeared on the maps, it was destroyed by the WW I and in the state of total organisational mess. They barely had enough money and industrial capabilities to make modern weapons, while having to be ready to fight USSR and potentially Germany. The worst part is, that just as they finally managed to built enough industrial infrastructure and get engineering capabilities to built weapons able to stand up to their enemies, they got invaded from both sides. Truly, the Polish curse of being in terrible spot never fails.

@sewersquid3761 6 ай бұрын

The funny thing is if you compare the 7TP to other armoured vehicles at the time when it was built it was really good, especially considering the economic and industrial capabilities at the time like you were saying. And as they were attacked from both sides and occupied by both regimes, as the Poles said, "occupied, but never conquered" their fighting spirit is truly inspirational🇵🇱

@cybernetic_crocodile8462 6 ай бұрын

@@sewersquid3761 I still think, that Polish high command made a terrible mistake by not continuing production of 7TP and introducing its better variant, 9TP. Sure, in 1939 even the latter wouldn't be fantastic, but it still could be effective, especially in bigger numbers. They could have more than 1000 of them by that time. They would surely be a lot of help in war effort. Instead, they were too focused on future projects, like 14TP, which sure, would provide them with good machines, but were just prototypes or projects in 1939.

@dragooons176 6 ай бұрын

That's the problem with hindsight. For even the most wealthy and industrially gifted nations, you get a choice in an era where tech is rapidly advancing. you can either keep making tanks in batches every few years so you are always able to with enough of a leadup mass produce a relevant tank from a now existing and proven design, or you can put all your eggs in one basket and hope that the tank you do commit to is going to stay relevant once/if war breaks out. Poland simply chose to gamble that they could go with another batch run before hard committing. Most nations in WWII had taken the same gamble in the same way and didn't do quite fantastically. The rare exceptions like the Czechs who mass produced a relevant tank in the right time got removed largely due to diplomacy and appeasement. Even the Russians were caught with very very very few actually relevant tanks ready and only managed to make good on the batch system turned mass serialization by pure time, blood, and vast tracts of terrible infrastructure land. @@cybernetic_crocodile8462

@CatNibbles 6 ай бұрын

Even if it were a mistake it really wouldn't have mattered in the end. They would have needed everything to hold off either the Germans or Russians. There's no way they could hold off both when the time came to it

@TheArklyte 6 ай бұрын

Not really. Poland had made very poor choices with its foreign relations. Moreover they had no capacity to actually produce tanks, airplanes and ships in any sufficient number, but at the same time wanted to have all 3 at the same time. Which they couldn't afford. Moreover their efforts were sabotaged by insane idea that everything produced needs to be polish designed and be part of national pride. They had some success stories that weren't obsolete by 1939 and even some that were competitive, but they had no real chance at producing any of those in sufficient numbers. I'd say that the biggest waste and folly of polish tank industry was the 10TP/14TP dream. Essentially it was an attempt to get domestic BT-7M. Do you like being in BT-7M in 1939? Being inside BT or T-26 tanks was not very comfortable idea even in Spain two years prior. And considering that 9TP was still inferior to modifications soviets done to Vickers 6 ton with their T-26, you can see how great those tanks were by theor perfomance in Winter War against force that had no sufficient quantity ie barely at all of their own tanks, AT guns and other tank busting methods. Tbh Poland had much higher success probability if it had cut off tanks and fleet completely and concentrated efforts on production of modified versions of licensed small arms, artillery and planes. Wouldn't have been enough anyway and that problem could have been solved only by different foreign policy. P.S.: yes, 9TP was inferior to T-26. While welding was a good attempt, T-26 had already impoved armamanets and engine over base vehicle far beyond polish modernization. And they produced 12k of those. And they performed poorly in Spain and Finland.

@gilanbarona9814 6 ай бұрын

I like Chopin's Military Polonaise in the background. It is about a Polish armoured vehicle's history after all.

@maltadevnull 5 ай бұрын

Beautiful

@sewersquid3761 6 ай бұрын

you would not believe I'm working on a1/72 scale model of this thing

@Willy_Tepes 6 ай бұрын

I want a full scale RC version in carbon fiber and kevlar, with a Dushka and encrypted coms. Yeah, and make it amphibious please.

@gusgone4527 6 ай бұрын

@@Willy_Tepes Me too but it also must have a boiling vessel to make tea.

@sewersquid3761 6 ай бұрын

@@Willy_Tepesfunnily enough Poland did make an amphibious tank called "PZInz 130" Sadly it was not made of Kevlar 😔

@chpet1655 6 ай бұрын

Good luck ! A good project indeed

@mondriaa 6 ай бұрын

same, are you also building the FtF model?

@M65V19 6 ай бұрын

Cobson we did it! We achived TKD!

@archonp.385 6 ай бұрын

Based

@ivan5595 4 ай бұрын

Total means total

@OasisTypeZaku 6 ай бұрын

I never understood why they didn't simply make mortar vehicles out of them. Lighter, simpler, and just about as effective, the only 2 features it would be lacking is anti-tank capability and the ability to fire in flat trajectories. Other than that it would be the perfect light and inexpensive artillery vehicle they needed. Cool little vehicle none the less! I wouldn't mind having one just to tool around in! Edit: Depending on the mortar size, it could have possessed better range and effectiveness than a 47mm projectile in an artillery role. However, it would be next to uselss against armor.

@Galvars 6 ай бұрын

Mortars had not been popular thing in interwar Polish Army. 81mm wz. 1931 mortar was slowly entering service from 1935, it was relatively large for such chassis.

@Willy_Tepes 6 ай бұрын

Their role will soon be filed by armored, tracked or wheeled drones. In and out fast, light armor, decent firepower. The closest stop gap we've had since the 60's is the Technical and Humvee or off road buggies.

@OasisTypeZaku 6 ай бұрын

@@Galvars I was thinking that exact size, but if it's too large to fit in the chassis, bummer. It's a shame they weren't more popular; they'd have made excellent fast-moving light artillery.

@genericpersonx333 6 ай бұрын

Thing is that mortars are not actually more effective for engaging many kinds of bunkers and other common field fortifications. Mortars were great for indirect fire and area suppression, but when it came to directly knocking out bunkers, trenches, and other positions, many nations found that small direct-fire cannons, like the French 37mm mle.1916 and the German 7.5 cm le.IG 18, more effective for supporting infantry assaults. Infantry guns could get more consistent direct hits on positions, either destroying them outright or better suppressing them. Since the infantry guns were putting their shells much closer to the targets, infantry could get closer to the positions before the guns had to cease fire. Even today, we continue to use many weapons that are spiritual or literal successors to the infantry gun of the early 20th century.

@OasisTypeZaku 6 ай бұрын

@@genericpersonx333 dealing with fortifications would be another disadvantaged on the part of mortars. They don't have the capability to deal with hardened pill boxes or bunkers. Plunging fire does little to reinforced concrete, even if it is high explosive and the accuracy is atrocious. That's the reason why they built vehicles like the StuG; assault guns are better providing a mobile platform for cannons that have better accuracy and energy.

@arozin6773 6 ай бұрын

Tankettes are so cute

@Willy_Tepes 6 ай бұрын

Imagine the inferiority complex when being passed on the road by self propelled artillery.

@arozin6773 6 ай бұрын

@@Willy_Tepes I like to imagine SPAs have a ''don't talk to me or my son ever again'' mentality, in regards to tankettes.

@sewersquid3761 6 ай бұрын

Top 5 tanks for me❤

@johnfrench1239 6 ай бұрын

Not if you are in one😮😂

@eltenda 6 ай бұрын

Excellent video

@BenyNukem 6 ай бұрын

I'm impressed with the depth of the research in this video, well done Tank Encyclopedia!

@SkylinerPL 6 ай бұрын

"It's so cute"

@wpick 6 ай бұрын

They need to make the vehicle bigger as well as the capability to mount a bigger caliber gun in the future.

@sewersquid3761 6 ай бұрын

They were working on a design called "14TP" which would have been enough to mount a decent AT gun, for the time. But of course the invasion of Poland stopped any potential development 😢

@ptonpc 6 ай бұрын

There is a saying "Got to p*ss with the c*ck you have" In other words, while it would have been better to have made a bigger vehicle, they did not have the resources to do so.

@sewersquid3761 6 ай бұрын

Just to clarify I'm not saying they were working on an AT variant of the 14TP, I'm just making up theories on what could have been

@teslashark 6 ай бұрын

@@sewersquid3761 Honestly, the Vickers/7TP can be an okay AT carrier too.

@chavan1 6 ай бұрын

@@sewersquid3761 Correction: the "14TP" was actually called "12TP", which was found out in the recent years. The "14TP" nickname was most likely made up by Polish historian Janusz Magnuski, who based it on the weight planned at one of the stages of development. The information about 12TP comes from a Polish magazine called "Technika Wojskowa Historia", specifically from issues 5/2021 and 1/2023

@dcross6360 6 ай бұрын

Even a 20 mm on the TK would be deadly

@Hamzat22 6 ай бұрын

And it was. There was a model armed with a 20 mm auto cannon.

@herkulespoirot2697 6 ай бұрын

TKD was not the only Polish attempt to develop a self-propelled gun in the 1930s, another one was TKS-D.

@teslashark 6 ай бұрын

There's a few pictures of it near the end!

@Niinsa62 6 ай бұрын

I found this because I was looking for info on the 1:35 plastic scale model of a TKS that I've started building. Sort of. I've just unpacked it yet, and trying to figure out if a 1:35 scale model of a tank is supposed to be this small... 🙂 Having seen the modern day replica TKS showing off its agility in this video, I get it. It really is small! I'm impressed by the Polish, by the way. They managed to fight off the Russians back in 1920. And they seem to have that spirit in them still, they will not back down from bullies.

@oliwer23pl95 6 ай бұрын

1:00 Infantry review or in polish Przegląd Piechoty was not a document but a by month specialist military magazine that run from 1928 to 1939, digitized copies of sayed magazine can be found online in polish if you speek sayed language. it's a Colectors item now a days, if someone has a original copy you know they are a WW2 polish history nerd

@bwilliams463 6 ай бұрын

Excellent vid. Very informative.

@nanab256 5 ай бұрын

3:05 "small cannon" is much better translation

@vladislavshevchenko9970 5 ай бұрын

A fast lightly armored low profile with an mg and an ATGM Tankente would be a perfect vehicle on the modern battlefield. Super cheap, good vision, hard to detect, has a good firepower to ambush 1-2 tanks and get the hell out as fast as possible and has just enough armor to withstand infantry small arms fire and shrapnel from big guns. Much better, than carrying those ATGM's on foot or on trucks.

@Narses_the_aremnian 6 ай бұрын

Poland suffers

@CARL_093 6 ай бұрын

thanks bro

@warhawk4494 6 ай бұрын

We need a video on the Australian 2pdr universal carrier.

@polishscribe674 6 ай бұрын

200mm autocannon. Who gets the joke?

@sewersquid3761 6 ай бұрын

Joke? No joke, very real, I learnt it from a KZfaq video once

@user-oi4xx1jp6k 6 ай бұрын

Yarnhub

@firefox5926 4 ай бұрын

4:15 the only thing i can think of more terrifying would be one of these or something of this size armed with a 40mm bofors...

@ivan5595 4 ай бұрын

Nice tank name

@willmarlatt1307 6 ай бұрын

Suggestion for Canadian tanks (not sure if it. Been covered)

@theromanorder 6 ай бұрын

Please do audio versions of whats on your website

@jayfelsberg1931 6 ай бұрын

3:15 - ❤❤❤❤❤

@merafirewing6591 4 ай бұрын

This should be added to War Thunder for the memes.

@doolittlegeorge 5 ай бұрын

Germany discovered "economics" for War machines quite quickly by conquering its neighbors. That included not just vast amounts of foreign made war machines all for *THEIR* War against Nazi 3rd Reich Germany (starting with Poland) but also all of the planning and intellectual effort that went into that to include the actual Factory most famously Skoda. Stug-3 was very much not economic but purpose built for high end military work from Day One. Panzer 38(t) on the other hand was crude but effective entry level Tank far superior to anything but the USA Americans were trying at the time namely an "every day driver" combat vehicle. GB Bren Carrier was right up there, though with 1940 Germany capturing thousands of those after Dunkirk and clearly being inspired by the Bren anyways.

@Miceman_Bonanza 5 ай бұрын

TKD????? You know what i mean.

@ivan5595 4 ай бұрын

Would solve a lot of problems

@Serbian-Templar 5 ай бұрын

Just looking what kinds of shitty guns there were for Anti tank purpose just goes to shed some light on how menacing early t34 and even worse,kv1's were to face (if they didnt break down due to reliability issues that is) long 75's and other spicy high power guns just weren'taround or readly awaiable yet,but that changed when 1942 rolled around.

@Daily_Joe2nd 6 ай бұрын

Gaijin when?

@TallDude73 6 ай бұрын

6:27 - the rate of fire per minute was 15? That's an autocannon.

@paulthiessen6444 6 ай бұрын

Not really. It’s only a 37mm. Pretty easy to reload fast

@gusgone4527 6 ай бұрын

@@paulthiessen6444 Even one handed!

@Galvars 6 ай бұрын

The "auto" part was based on how skilled loader was, as mentioned it was small gun with light round and fast operating breach. Such loader was able to put that 15 rounds in one minute but that was maximum human could do and only for, let's say one "burst" of energy. Small or not, it was tiring task.

@flarvin8945 6 ай бұрын

The RoF of 15 a minute, is an optimal rate. Which would be limited to a short burst at that rate, by a very skilled crew. The main limiting factor would be the amount of ammo within reach of the loader, as the ammo is relatively light, probably ~2kg. It is also just the rate of the gun in its general requirements, and not when installed in the TKD. As the gun requirements list 2 man crew, but the TDK only had 1 man operating it.

@petergray2712 6 ай бұрын

@@flarvin8945The Poles used the Bofors 37 mm gun, which fired an AP round that weighed 0.735 kg (1.62 lbs).

@ihorkorotchenko9732 5 ай бұрын

@alangordon3283 6 ай бұрын

Inspiration from the mighty Semple of Bob .

@user-sg8cg5lh3v 6 ай бұрын

Excellent documentary, well researched. However, the music is not needed and makes the film unwatchable. And please find a new robot for the voiceover!

@teslashark 6 ай бұрын

Robot? He's a cyborg!

@ZombieSexmachine 5 ай бұрын

Truly a weapon to surpass metal gear

@mg1342mg 6 ай бұрын

Just in case this isn't AI speech, need to work on several pronunciations.

@db2torial 6 ай бұрын

If you're refering to pronoucing Polish words and names they were fine (just with an foreign accent and too lenghty, which is understandable in my opinion). I was pleasently suprised by how "Polish" (polished, heh) they sounded.

@mixererunio1757 6 ай бұрын

Idea of TKD being used as a ammunition vehicle is just stupid. More likely the unit ran out of fuel and stripped the vehicle of the weapon and abandoned it

@Galvars 6 ай бұрын

To say it with such certainty without any evidence is no less stupid. Improvisation is the norm in every army, the chassis without weapons could be used as a transporter or tractor. It is legit theory, lack of proven explanation don't make it stupid, just like your theory is not legit just because you say so.

@chpet1655 6 ай бұрын

Reamed !!! Lol RE ARMED you mean that’s why u don’t use robots And btw way SIL AY ZEE AH

@TheArklyte 6 ай бұрын

The thing is... Poland had made very poor choices with its foreign relations. Moreover they had no capacity to actually produce tanks, airplanes and ships in any sufficient number, but at the same time wanted to have all 3 at the same time. Which they couldn't afford. Moreover their efforts were sabotaged by insane idea that everything produced needs to be polish designed and be part of national pride. They had some success stories that weren't obsolete by 1939 and even some that were competitive, but they had no real chance at producing any of those in sufficient numbers. I'd say that the biggest waste and folly of polish tank industry was the 10TP/14TP dream. Essentially it was an attempt to get domestic BT-7M. Do you like being in BT-7M in 1939? Being inside BT or T-26 tanks was not very comfortable idea even in Spain two years prior. And considering that 9TP was still inferior to modifications soviets done to Vickers 6 ton with their T-26, you can see how great those tanks were by theor perfomance in Winter War against force that had no sufficient quantity ie barely at all of their own tanks, AT guns and other tank busting methods. Tbh Poland had much higher success probability if it had cut off tanks and fleet completely and concentrated efforts on production of modified versions of licensed small arms, artillery and planes. Wouldn't have been enough anyway and that problem could have been solved only by different foreign policy. P.S.: yes, 9TP was inferior to T-26. While welding was a good attempt, T-26 had already impoved armamanets and engine over base vehicle far beyond polish modernization. And they produced 12k of those. And they performed poorly in Spain and Finland.