I am not prepared for a discussion about romance in Bionicle. I will only say this: It's not the Jedi way!

You underestimate my power!

DON'T TRY IT!!!

Obi-Wan Kenobi Thanks for the feedback! And haha hopefully not! That’s why I put out two conflicting videos to show both sides of the argument (and ultimately try to show that it really boils down to personal preference). At the very least, I hope this starts some discussion cause I’d love to hear people’s thoughts and opinions on this, given how much the two themes have in common

@@DuckBricks I totally see what you are trying to do and it was a genius move to make both a Ninjago top 10 list and a Bionicle Top 10 list. I just fear that most people will see the title of your video and have a knee jerk reaction of disliking it without actually watching your video. Passionate Bionicle fans will dislike this video on principal and passionate Ninjago fans will do the same to your Bionicle video. And I think your really like to dislike ratio is proof of that. And I know this is not your intention at all, you are trying to drive a nuanced discussion but in the emotional world of the internet, nuance is often lost on viewers.

That's a great point to bring up - I knew it would potentially stir up some controversy but hopefully people willing to participate in a good discussion will give it some time to consider the points - I myself am a huge fan of both, but can acknowledge how neither is perfect and both have pros and cons compared to each other. Regardless, I appreciate your comments and thanks for participating respectfully in the discussion! Hopefully you may like some of the other, less controversial stuff we put out as well :)

@@DuckBricks Oh I will absolutely check them out! I see a lot of potential with this channel of yours given how well you discussed the topic in the video above. But I see you have a lot of videos about set releases and stuff like that. That's fine and good but lots of other channels are already doing that. If you ask me, the real money is with these discussion videos here. Ninjago (and to a lesser degree Bionicle) is just itching for more analysis based channels to really explore the concepts and themes and I think you're the man for the job given your experience and insight on this video. The is a unfilled niche on KZfaq with the TTV podcasts being the only one who currently fill it. But there is lots of potential here and I think you could really take this channel places if you focus on Lego thematic discussions.

Obi-Wan Kenobi thank you for the kind comment, and I 100% agree - my partner and I are much more interested personally in the deep discussion videos, kinda like what TTV does with Bionicle, but we also recognize that a lot of people just want to see videos on news and whatnot, so we try to strike a balance. You might also notice we put out two different news videos for certain topics - one short and sweet, to let people who want to see those get the information, and one super in-depth and containing a ton of analysis and predictions, which we obviously love making a lot more and hopefully viewers who are super into LEGO will get value out of (like you, for instance!) Thanks for the constructive feedback and I look forward to seeing you around!

And bionicle is better in most of those ways

Yeah now they’re making sub and extra themes/set waves so I think they’re trying to preserve it and not make the show too long or repetitive, so they’re probably in it for the long game!

I heard, it’s such shocking and tragic news :(. Still trying to process it and this is a huge blow to Ninjago. Hope his family is doing ok

What...?😦😔

@Tesla-Effect yeah I know my aunt has passed away this week(she had corona)

That is a good point - it did start as a sub theme of Technic so it does make a lot of sense that the builds are really Technic-heavy. Thanks for commenting and glad you are enjoying!

Justin J. Marler yes, I am, and thanks for commenting! So cool to see this as I’ve been a fan of TTV for a long time and a continuous watcher of your videos. Really appreciate your help and thoughts on this - the goal of putting out two conflicting videos was to get a good discussion going and see what people’s thoughts would be, which I think was a relative success as I certainly got people commenting detailed thoughts! I’m really happy you watched it and greatly appreciate your thoughts as well. Thanks again!

Yeah haha, the point of making these videos were to encourage friendly discussion and analysis/comparisons between the two; that’s why I made two videos saying opposite things and released them at the same time in the first place

Oh yeah, S13 animation was top notch

FIrst of all, thanks for taking the time to share your detailed thoughts and point breakdowns! Appreciate it greatly! For 10 - yes, I can definitely concede that, and I think it's a wonder how the two films are even comparable given how one had such a massive budget and the others worked off of pretty small scale productions. I will have to reread the books again; it's been a while since I've read them all and will definitely keep an eye out for humor that Greg interjected; if I can recall correctly the most memorable line there to me was some sort of joke about Pohatu being orange in 08 which I found particularly meta and funny, so you definitely have a point there. And while I think music is certainly a lot of personal preference (I prefer the Ninjago music, for example), I think Ninjago also has a major bonus due to the fact that so much more music has been composed - besides the classic overture, none of the tracks from seasons 1-3 are quite as good as the fantastic tracks that came later in the show, so that's a big unfair advantage as well. 8 I guess I can see that to an extent, the commercials were really overdone compared to the story, but even the books and comics had a lot of needless cruelty and edginess that arguably were pretty distanced from the 01-03 vibe 7 yeah I think this really boils down to a matter of opinion. I love Bionicle's aesthetic in G1, but for me personally I find it hard to argue that you can't just simply do more things with CCBS without having to rely on technic, like every other large scale Bionicle build having technic frames (not that it's a bad thing, but it shows some limitations of the system). 4 I tried to differentiate tone and genre a little bit, but I agree there is some overlap. 3 I am definitely all for a theme growing up with its fans and becoming more mature, but imo it wasn't handled perfectly with Bionicle - a good example of growing up with your fans would probably be Ninjago's Oni Trilogy (but then again, they regressed back to the previous tone immediately afterwards so I'm not even sure what they learned from that) 2 Fair enough with Mata Nui, although he was less a character and more an entity in 01-08; it's not like Tahu was teleported to the new world or anything. I also firmly believe that the 09 reboot could have really worked out very well had it been given time to actually finish its arc and come full circle. They could have easily done several more years of Bionicle - three years worth of Bara Magna, arguably 2-3 years worth of "Reign of Shadows" to go over what was happening in the Matoran Universe, and then a final year or two to bring everything full circle would have been the ideal ending imo. But thanks again for your comments and hope you stick around to share more of your thoughts and opinions! We have a ton more videos scheduled like this that will potentially stir the pot but hopefully instigate some good discussion on LEGO like this!

I actual both agree and disagree with you one point 9. While Ninjago might have more humor, I was never bothered by how Bionicle didn't. I mean Bionicle was meant to be very serious and I'm fine with that. Humor might have distracted from the intense narrative and as a kid and even today, I really do appreciate how intense things got with Bionicle. But I think I disagree with you on saying that Bionicle had a better overall soundtrack. Ninjago has produced some of the best music I've ever heard for any animated cartoon. The sheer quality of their orchestral pieces is astounding. I linked some highlights below if you want to check them out: Overture - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/aK6knb1yq8qmcWQ.html Zane's Sacrifice - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/j6lgmKigsLacgZc.html Maybe I'm Departed - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/jNaZd71mxr3DhIE.html Harumi's Theme - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/hcmRa5ah1L7ahXU.html Which is not to say the Bionicle itself has produced some absolute bangers, but I think the sheer quantity and quality of Ninjago's 13 seasons of music outweighs Bionicle's soundtrack. Like Ninjago has so many iconic songs, they have actually managed to create leitmotifs where specific melodies are associated with specific character or events. That is some Star Wars levels of music right there! Here's one last link that shows how Ninjago used leitmotifs in season 8 with the description breaking down where each melody is used. It's some next level stuff! - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/g7CqfcZov66znIU.html

Obi-Wan Kenobi I’m 100% with you as well with Ninjago’s god-tier music; literally every season has several outstanding tracks - Akita Finds her Animal Form, The Serpentine Wars, The Time Blades, Tale of Morro, so so so many great tracks I can’t even count

@@DuckBricks Jay Vicent and Micheal Kramer need more awards for the stuff they do! They put in the work grinding out legendary song after legendary song, somebody's gotta stop them or my brain will explode from the greatness!!!

I never have actually heard the other Ninjago songs besides the main theme. Still gotta say I like Lhikan's sacrifice and The Legend of the Bionicle a little better. But again that is a matter of personal opinion.

Thanks so much! Appreciate it!

Hahaha at least it’s canon on Spherus Magna and with the Agori/Glatorian :)

@@DuckBricks hmmm yeaaaaah. Lets maybe not discuss thaaaat... XD

That’s a great point and I totally agree - I think both themes have their own merits, which is why I made a companion video to this talking about the flip side of things, why Bionicle is better than Ninjago - they’re both excellent pieces of LEGO’s legacy!

gotta disagree saying that they have unique pieces amkes them imune to being repetetive is kinda dumb. Not hating just saying.

Kubaxter yeah, there are organic bits (in some more than others) but essentially they are super advanced AI, hence no need for romance. I said “robots” to generalize with that short anecdote but yes, you are right

@@DuckBricks im not fan of this series but i can understend why some people can be mad on that

Thanks man, appreciate it and spread the word!

@@DuckBricks I have already asked 10 lego friends wonder if they subbed? And do you have a discord? Like a server

I do not at the moment but maybe I’ll consider starting one at some point for the most dedicated fans!

Haha glad you enjoyed yup I love both themes equally and wanted to make two conflicting videos on it

Fair enough haha, I guess the main focus had to be story-related because it’s a little hard to compare the sets given they used completely different building systems

Peter A. Michaelsen not quite, I’d say the Bionicle system is all the parts purely created for Bionicle, like limbs, weapons, torsos, and whatnot. Personally I think there’s a distinction to be made there, especially when you get into 2006 and the only technic parts you’d see in, say, an Inika build are the axles used to attach the heads and the pins for the armor. It’s not like CCBS, which is a clearly separate building system to anything else LEGO does, but it’s not quite just Technic either, I’d say. But I guess this could boil down to personal opinion as it’s never been explicitly stated as one or the other (although dropping the Technic branding very early on is pretty indicative)

You make a ton of good points here, but I do think a lot of this boils down to personal preference and opinion, which is why I made both these videos. For number 9, for example, I think humor's a pretty subjective thing: personally I really appreciate 4th wall breaking humor and while it would be out of place in Bionicle, it fits pretty well into Ninjago given the overall tone of the show, and a lot of the funniest moments come from humor like this. In terms of comparing building systems, I agree that they're very different, but at the end of the day, it's all LEGO, which is why I feel like it's a fair comparison to make. It's not like comparing, say, transformers and action figures to Bionicle, it's comparing two toylines from the same company that work together in the same system - and yeah, as mentioned, we get tons and tons of mechs and bikes in Ninjago, but it's not nearly to the extent that Bionicle did it. Every mech in Ninjago is very different from the next, and yes, a lot of this is because of the building system, but to me that's better than getting twelve identical builds like the Bohrok. For point three - yeah, totally agree there. The Oni Trilogy was building towards really great storytelling and a much more mature tone, and then season 11 comes around and resets it all. That being said, from a business standpoint, I get it - you want to keep getting new fans in to keep the theme relevant, instead of relying on an older fanbase who may outgrow it no matter how mature it gets. That being said, I do think there's a much better balance to be struck than what they attempted, and S13 was at least a step in the right direction. Ninjago has too many characters? That's more of a Bionicle problem. Yes, both franchises have arguably too many characters, but Ninjago has its core cast of six and that's really about it in terms of heavy story focus. Bionicle had hundreds and a story that spanned generations of heroes, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but certainly was very complex and definitely worse than Ninjago in that regard. Ninjago having no endgame seems to be true, I'll give you that. However, I don't think it's really designed to have an endgame. The "endgame" story wise was back in 2013 with the final battle, and anything else is really just extra stuff. Certain arcs have endgames, like the Oni Trilogy, but you're right - there's no overarching storyline or major arc in place like with Bionicle, which is definitely a point against it. In terms of Ninjago not having a fanbase or legacy when it's over, I'll have to disagree there - just look at how many kids grew up on Ninjago, and are completely dedicated to it as a theme. Does it have its flaws? Yeah, for sure. But it also has a very strong and loyal fanbase (sometimes a little too loyal when it comes to changes in the show format or theme), and even when it eventually ends (not likely for a while, given how LEGO considers it an evergreen theme and has done so since 2015), I'm willing to bet the fanbase will continue to last for years. Whether it will be as strong or large as the Bionicle fandom is anyone's guess, but I do believe it could reach or even surpass the post-cancellation Bionicle fandom whenever it eventually ends. It's not like Nexo Knights or Chima, which kids rarely really cared about when it was around - like to admit it or not, Ninjago is a juggernaut and basically a spiritual successor to Bionicle in terms of popularity. Thank you for leaving a detailed comment on the video and I hope you were able to enjoy both and see things from an alternate perspective!

As a hard-core njnjago fan I actually agree with a fair few of these things, like how the show never really goes anywhere and the forced jokes, and how the plot pretty much stays the same, but the ninjago community makes all the same points. I truly think that if the show continued with Wilfilm after the oni trilogy, most of the things you complained about would be gone, sadly the show was handed off to writers that dumbed the show down for 5 year olds (personally I don't even think they care about the show) I still watch the show but wildbrain has disgraced the series by amplifying its mistakes instead of fixing them. With every new season I am disappointed, even s13 (arguably the best wildbrain season yet) isn't that awesome, in short I agree with you... to an extent.

Oh my god …… you can tell this is a bonicle fan

as some one who has watched ninjago i'm glad we all agree that there are both good just ninjago has perfected what bioncle didn't because it's newer 11 years old but newer but bioncle tried robot romance and ninjago mastered that with zane and pixal

Its a opinion and he made a video about why bionicals is better at ninjago