Investing in vintage watches - a simple guideline in what NOT to buy.

Рет қаралды 15,500

2 ай бұрын

Look through the eyes of a watchmaker and share the passion of Kalle Slaap from team Chronoglide!
The best way to buy and sell is to know the factors that are important for vintage watches.
The best way to buy and sell with the best profit is to know what factors influence the value!
Tutorial on watch repair by watchmaker Kalle Slaap from Chronoglide, Vintage Watch repair specialists near Amsterdam.
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#watchrepair #watchmaking #watchmaker #howto #howtorepair #repairshop

Пікірлер: 91

@johnallen8146 2 ай бұрын

Such a great topic Kalle; i thank you for taking the time to explore it for our benefit. The best advice I have heard from a prominent American collector of vintage watches was "acquire knowledge before you acquire watches".

@zibbezabba2491 2 ай бұрын

I spent at least £1000 over the course of a year on vintage watches. Some good, some not so good. I bought some tools and worked out mainly through youtube videos how to take them apart and clean them. I destroyed a few of them in the process of course but it was the learning and hands on that I really enjoyed, despite the cost. I even managed to repair one or two. If I was going to buy anything decent I should know what I was getting into. How to know, without paying a third party for an evaluation/repair/service, whether I was buying junk or not. I have half a dozen or so decent vintage watches including a tudor oyster from the 1940s with the serial 10038, in excellent condition along with a few omegas from the same era. My tinkering taught me how to open a watch, check the movement is authentic, any other parts like the crown, hands, dial are original, without making a dogs breakfast out of it (which is very easy to do) The truth is, I love vintage watches from that era. The fact that they are still looking good and running well despite being decades older than myelf gives them a certain appeal.

@jamesgreig8796 Ай бұрын

Hi, I loved your reply. We seem to have the same enthusiasm and have gone through the same journey. I have bought and worked on some vintage watches that I bought online. I must admit I did make mistakes, but as you say, it is all part of the learning process, although at a cost. I have since built up a collection of watchmakers tools and have built my own watch using a Miyota movement, and designing the dial myself, quite challenging, but rewarding. Enjoy your hobby. 👍

@zibbezabba2491 Ай бұрын

@@jamesgreig8796 Hi, thanks for your comment. Yeah, it's a funny hobby to have . I wouldn't try doing work on anyone elses's watches though haha. Anything beyond the basic hour min sec movements and I'm lost. Also, whenI began getting interested, I had this mad idea in my head that lots of watch parts were interchangeable. Stems, crowns balaces etc. When I started I bought bags of junk watches thinking I could cannibalise them for repairs. 🤣🤣🤣So much to learn and so much money wasted on junk. I did build a watch myself based on a cloned seiko movement. It probably cast around £130 in total. I ended up spending money on about 4 or 5 sets of dials, hands or anthing else that was interchangable upping the total cost to around 200. I'm glad I got that out of my system 😆

@Antiqueexcavator Ай бұрын

I’m doing the same! I love the hobby and love doing minor repair.

@veganbutcherhackepeter Ай бұрын

I was lucky enough to acquire a vintage Omega Constellation from 1968 with a cal.564 movement in pristine condition about a year ago. Since then it's gone up more than 20% in value, but I am never going to sell it. Every time it's on my wrist and I look at it, I get a warm fuzzy feeling. It just makes me happy. The perfection and the craftsmanship of this precisely running more than 50 years old watch just fills me with joy. When my time has come, I'm going to pass it on to my son as a family heirloom.

@timaitken5539 2 ай бұрын

Excellent video !! I bought a 1766 Fusee that runs , I liked it so much I then bought another Fusee from 1802 that runs and keeps time , to me these are working pieces of art , the movements are incredibly beautiful !!

@jamesgreig8796 2 ай бұрын

Hi Kalle, another very interesting video. I took a chance and bought a rare, solid gold vintage (60s) Omega Seamaster De Ville, while in America from an Estate. It was a bit of a gamble and I was a little nervous. Visually, the watch was emasculate. On returning to the UK , I had the watch checked and serviced by a master watchmaker (expensive), but he did a fantastic job and confirmed that the movement and watch was authentic and in good condition. I was relieved and am very pleased with my purchase and have no intention of ever selling it. However, I was lucky. So, all ended well, but could have gone the other way.👍

@user-wv1pj6wh4h 2 ай бұрын

Just buy what you like, if you buy watches for business you may have problems.,

@chrishoyt7548 2 ай бұрын

Great vid Kalle, I use as dress watches an Omega 30TC Souvrain from Sweden 1943 with an excellent movement, solid, dial shows its age. Case excellent, I had it overhauled by a pro. I use it as a dress watch. Same for a 1953 manual wind Zenith Pilot, overhauled, excellent condition, solid movement, I say why buy new when these movements are just as good as today's movements. They are more to the heart of both companies. Regards, Chris

@zackackerman3180 2 ай бұрын

Always good advice from you Kalle. Thank you. Words of wisdom. Keep these videos coming. ♥

@boatdetective 2 ай бұрын

I'm very surprised Kalle did not mention the critical issue of parts availability. If you decide to go vintage Rolex or Omega- at least you can get them serviced! For all those who gush about Universal Polerouters- good luck trying to find a balance!

@travisogden9426 Ай бұрын

The brand is being properly revived this year

@simonclegg5301 2 ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and wisdom Kalle.

@SideWalkAstronomyNetherlands 2 ай бұрын

I just invested in a SKMEI, it costs less than €5, - and now I will wait 50 years :)

@melatomic Ай бұрын

😂😂😂

@dollarette 2 ай бұрын

Will never beat the S&P with dividends but watch dealing is satisfying and educational.

@24hourgmtchannel64 Ай бұрын

I've always wanted a 1959 - 1963 Rolex submariner. These four years Rolex was experimenting with crown guard shape and were pointed. It was the 5512 and the 5513 came out in 1962 so for only two years it was made with these pointed crown guards. The issue is I cannot bring myself to pay the $16k - $25k to get one.

@josevasquez1781 2 ай бұрын

Solid video, many things you pointed out I learned years back from a watchmaker in NYC, but it's great to know just in case I decide getting back into horological vintage watches, I can't stand crappy old watches not worth it.

@RoderikvanReekum 2 ай бұрын

I will be a millionaire soon if I sell my 60's RADO watch!

@WatchRestorationCottage 2 ай бұрын

Great advice Kalle. I'm scared to pull the trigger on a vintage Rolex, but videos like these give me more courage. Thanks!

@jan_de_witt 2 ай бұрын

The other thing to keep in mind is that watches have not outperformed the stock market over the long term. If you had bought a Patek Phillippe Nautilus in 1976 for only $1000 and sold it today for $100,000, you would still have made a larger profit if you had just invested in the stock market 😅

@manuelcorreia6448 2 ай бұрын

Really interesting perspective... Thank-you Kalle for sharing your thoughts, based on many years of experience!

@davidhayball9393 2 ай бұрын

As always something really interesting and informative, thank you, Kalle

@dodabartman123 2 ай бұрын

Luv your videos Kalle! Ebay has the best solution where they will send the watch to a certifed inspector for $50. Also I have been asking sellers for a timegrapher video. No video, no buy. I purchased a Omega Seamaster Deville from a guy in the Netherlands, the watch was perfect, but the US import process was a pain.

@DrJon-zf2xo 2 ай бұрын

Thanks for this lots of good advice. I would add that like other currencies Rolexes are counterfeited and they have become very good. They are good enough that even looking inside is not enough. If you buy a vintage Rolex for serious money you need to have Rolex check it. This is why Rolex serial numbers have many digits and use random generation. a "vintage" Rolex can be declared un repairable if counterfeit or if it has generic parts parts. I try to buy vintage watches with a story. It can be a provenance but mostly it is a good example of a model that changed the way watches are made. Examples are the first High Beat watches, a Rolex Oyster that got a Kew certificate (Which I am still looking for). Models from which many later versions develop.

@Omegaspeedmaster69 2 ай бұрын

Firstly great video! Most important element of a vintage watch of the obvious brands is the dial. Even if Rolex themselves could replicate a vintage dial and put it in a watch,such as a submariner,it still wouldn't be worth the same as the watch with the original dial. While watches are mechanical art,original dials are viewed like fine art,which cant be replaced or even repaired. Collector would rather have an honest dial,with age related mark's than a repaired,which is often noticed. Have heard about a professional art forger working on a rolex dial,but this is rare. Cases can be laser welded and parts can be easily replaced.

@watchwhisper 2 ай бұрын

Very wise advice thank you Kalle

@happyjim2 2 ай бұрын

Thank you so much for such an informative video absolutely brilliant Kalle.

@user-tj1eo8ey8r 2 күн бұрын

I have a Speed-master 321 105-03-64 that I have inherited. I am having a very difficult time finding someone who can service this watch in United States. Do you have any suggestions? I love your channel.

@kuyapipslago8657 2 ай бұрын

Yes correct👍 That's why I only choose the complicated watch when it's built.the many function double to triple layer. Chronograph, with many mini hands. Because the harder it is made, the better it is.

@tricster4u 2 ай бұрын

But harder to service and more expensive...

@petercallaghan4718 Ай бұрын

I have bought three Omega from the same shop, over some years, who own a watchmaking company who check the watch and service if needed before offering for sale. I have been fortunate to see the watches as they have just been up for sale, and all have been in really excellent condition (one steel constellation, one 18kt gold constellation, one steel geneve; first 1969, the other two 1970). Also bought a 1998 seamaster professional which Omega uk rebuilt and serviced first at a cost of £1450. I'm unsure if any of these are vintage watches, but they seem very high quality, keep great time, and are a joy to own and wear. Any roi seems quite unimportant in that respect, and none will be sold. I'm not tempted by rolex, due to inflated prices and hype (though I saw a nice 1960s Rolex Precision watch for sale in Capri recently).

@adfpv1153 2 ай бұрын

Great advice Kalle, thanks 😁👍

@RossFalkiner Ай бұрын

I love Watches from 1940”s to 1980”s just mechanical watches. My favourite so far ( apart from my Date Just from 1967 ) is my Universal Genève cal42 ultra thin. Love your videos. Thanks

@robertcalkjr.8325 2 ай бұрын

Thanks, Kalle. I don't buy a watch online unless the seller shows good photos of the movement inside it. And I check the movement myself when I receive it.

@thomasnuyts9725 2 ай бұрын

If you are into aesthetics, do not start collecting vintage watches, it will ruin you, although you will perish as a happy man. If you want to avoid getting ruined, marry a vintage watchmaker or his/ her son/ daughter and have several free services per year taken up in your marital contract, if you expect to buy a great vintage watch at a reasonable price, get yourself projected back into the nineteen 70ies/ 80ies/ 90ies and finally do not expect your heirs to be able to fully appreciate nor value your vintage watch collection, make up a plan B in the unlikely event of your untimely passing away. 😊

@equaliser2265 2 ай бұрын

18ct Gold Jaeger-LeCoultre 481 top grade engine, bumper, power reserve. Serviced by Jaeger-LeCoultre. Bought for £ 700 , service JLC £1300 total cost £2000 , valued by JLC £5000.

@rickymherbert2899 2 ай бұрын

I do not invest in watches for future profits what I do invest in is memories. Hence I have bought all of my children, two daughters and grand children (x3) a watch that is of their birth year. I won't say the brands but I did involved my grand children in the buying experience too. Hopefully those memories will keep me alive to them all when I depart on my final voyage.

@johnrieley1404 2 ай бұрын

Very nice analysis from your grand experience. Supply and demand reminded me of the Tulip mania of 1634 in your country where prices went sky high then fell to ground. Perceived prestige and emotion play into value.

@chowd.a.d.8309 2 ай бұрын

Thanks Calle. The value of a "thing" is told by how much somebody is willing to paying for it that specific moment. Everything is relative. The way you see the value depends on your point of view and context. All the best.

@ElderPinto254 2 ай бұрын

was weer een goeie kalle, badankt!!!

@user-fu1yp6lq2c 2 ай бұрын

you’re literally my comfort person i love you #nkuwan !

@gioc4596 2 ай бұрын

Thanks for the Great guidance. Love it. If I may what are the brands you recommend aside from known good like Rolex, Omega?

@amandagelien9612 2 ай бұрын

GO with Seiko you never go wrong and you can afford them🤩

@k__c__ 2 ай бұрын

I am not so sure about that, there are a few Indian guys producing Mumbai Specials ready to get newbie’s money.

@richardweston4493 2 ай бұрын

Nope, I recently tried getting a 90’s seiko repaired (new glass), at the main Seiko shop in my capital city and they ‘don’t repair old watches’. They steered me towards other watch repair shops. Without ongoing support and parts from the original manufacturer, I don’t see a bright future investing in anything Seiko.

@MichaelWilliams-mo1vv Ай бұрын

Maybe but there are a lot of used / vintage seikos out there with aftermarket or non original parts fitted.

@arts.4014 2 ай бұрын

Vintage is interesting - to invest, in addition to what you described, you must predict trends in style and desirability - the 'flavor of the month'. A simple example is pocket watches - they may be the best of the best, but with a few exceptions, don't come close in value to their wristwatch equivalent. Will the vintage watch you buy today be more desirable in a year? If you guess wrong - you lose. However, if you buy what you love, it doesn't matter as much.

@noteorius2797 2 ай бұрын

My experience is going to be thrift, antique stores and consignment shops, even estate sales, I’ve found some really good time pieces, mostly pocket watches as those are my favorites and my area of knowledge, I haven’t paid more then 100 dollars for even some railroad grades that sold for 300-400 later on

@hrachiag 2 ай бұрын

One maybe important thing with watches (like many other things): as long as you don’t sell it, it just costs you money 😂🤣 thanks Kalle!

@darenbyers4291 Ай бұрын

Lol collecting ! Been collecti g and selling everything you can thi k of my whole life since I was 13. Unfortunately 47 yrs later discovered watches. As i started yo sell everything else off i appreciated their size. Collecting something sm is good! Can carry a lot on a plane,so I will be linger held down by a collection of stuff lol. Sorry to ramble,so i started mainly collecting chronographs,now buy watches with certain/ less production numbers of movements!. What are your thoughts Kelle on the 349, its 1 if the ones i like too collect. Alone with v72,v23,v232,234 etc but the 349 is still overlooked more by collectors,as everyone understands the value in Valjoux 72, find its good option. Think have 7 349 chronos now,here in Canada most watch makers have never scene one. A legend in watchmaking here thought it was very good possibly equal too V72 possibly better any thoughts? Great videos by the way!

@igorr2d2 2 ай бұрын

eye opener

@walther9161 2 ай бұрын

My daily is a Heuer three sub Carrera. I got it for practically nothing … got it on eBay about 20 years ago. Had it serviced recently and it runs amazingly. I figure I made an 600-800 return based on its rare. 7736 valjoux and 73653 N. Never plan on selling it and wear it all the time.. so my only watch investment is my Heuer.. all others I have are just for fun.

@Frost-zy4nz 2 ай бұрын

A watch as a investment (like paintings) will not work in the vast majority of cases. Since a watch, unlike a picture or shares, involves very high maintenance costs, during the time you hold the item. Therefore, even if there is an increase in value over time, this is eaten up by the high maintenance costs you have to pay regularly.

@YJMusic72 2 ай бұрын

Hey Kalle, another great video! In this one you mention that the materials of which a Rolex is made are only worth about € 65. I was just wondering, because in my 30+ years as a watch enthousiast I have come across many different numbers, do you have a source for this? Thanks and keep upbthe good work!

@cacike4216 2 ай бұрын

I only buy, I think thats my problem, but sometimes im not sure and I buy another, you never know 😂😂😂

@johnpeters7003 2 ай бұрын

For me the value in a vintage watch is its story. So often the story gets lost. Then it’s just an old watch…even an old Rolex.

@jfdomega7938 2 ай бұрын

what about a painting. a painting is something that could be of an incredible amount of money yet the materials in cost is minuscule. look at poor old van gogh couldn't afford his paints yet look at the value of his art now. crazy!!! sometimes for him it was a choice between painting or eating. no wonder the poor sod went mad! interesting talk Kalle. thought provoking. i liked it.

@enriquehidalgo630 2 ай бұрын

I like vintage Longines. I know I cannot afford a 13ZN chronograph. I have been looking for a Longines that has a Cal. 310 (Frederic Piguet P21). I have not been successful. I am also looking for a vintage watch with the Frederic Piguet P71 with the offset rotor. Do you know what models of watches have these movements? Thank you.

@tricster4u 2 ай бұрын

What about a Longines Lindbergh with the last original In-house movement they ever produced 989.2 before they sold it to Lemania that was integrated into Breguet and developed nowadays beeing used even in their 30,40k range? It also has the history of the first pilot that crossed Antlantic from Paris to New York Charles Lindbergh. I bought one in a second when i read all these...

@williamevans9426 2 ай бұрын

I presume that if one is buying a vintage watch primarily as an investment, one really should not wear it too often, to preserve its condition. On another matter entirely, do you ever recondition tritium- or even radium-lumed dials and, if so, how do you set about handling the dial itself and any flaking evident under the crystal? Many thanks from Oxford, UK.

@stephenoliver1437 2 ай бұрын

Sold my 5513 from new in the nineties bad move new in eighties £269 value now going bonkers upward of twenty thousand crazy

@tomlopez9385 2 ай бұрын

To really invest in watches requires a huge amount of knowledge and some skill in buying them. There is also the considerable cost of having them worked on and not having the value impaired or even ruined by that work. As Kalle correctly points out there is this huge unknown as to what will be considered desirable five, ten or twenty years in the future. Buy watches for your own enjoyment and invest in some type of index fund.

@AntonyThorburn 2 ай бұрын

Could you fix a Longines Ladies Quartz ?n

@RoderikvanReekum 2 ай бұрын

I did not know Rolex produces so much watches a day! Good story.

@violinmke 2 ай бұрын

I only buy what I will wear. Btw have a repair go to guy because sooner or later youll have to get work done.

@fitetransport-eydj6203 2 ай бұрын

I totally agree with you 💯 but, I personally think it is a great marketing plan. IMO, the idea behind it is a gateway tool to introduce the brand to a younger generation.

@AntonyThorburn 2 ай бұрын

just like de beers with diamonds......

@leowatkins3718 2 ай бұрын

The star of my collection is the original Seiko warn by Napoleon at the battle of Waterloo. I was told it still works but I can't test it as they no longer make the batteries for it! Amazingly it is still accurate twice a day on the time and once a week on the day.

@Antiqueexcavator Ай бұрын

Wait! What?? I own the seiko worn by Napoleon at the battle of Waterloo! I even have a COA! I paid good money for it too! The previous owner swore his great great great grandfather actually took it off napoleons wrist at the autopsy. He bequeathed it to his great grandfather who did the same to his grandfather until he owned it. The COA is dated 1821 and notarized so I’m sure mine is the real one! I also have an early timex watch that belonged George Washington and was the one given to him by his father but subsequently taken back due to a cherry tree mishap! Yes, I have a COA for that as well. I’m no idiot. No COA, no deal! I love collecting antique watches that belonged to historical figures although it is a quite expensive hobby! If anyone has one please feel free to contact me!

@x201t 2 ай бұрын

Best investment: Buy the vintage watches that you enjoy to wear.

@CaptainJerry- 2 ай бұрын

I went from collecting watches to accumulating them. I have to stop! 17th century Netherlands, tulips were so valuable and in demand that they actually caused a craze. People were so obsessed with tulips, that they actually traded their valuables and paid thousands of guilder.

@think2023 2 ай бұрын

Vintage Vingt (ans) d'age Ie minimum twenty years of age. It may now connote value or quality....but the word denotes age only

@MichaelMitchell-vk9lk 2 ай бұрын

I only buy if I can clearly see the movement so I can make a decision

@orvillefindley8117 2 ай бұрын

That all sounds great if you have thousands to spend on certain vintage watches. I have a few vintage watches, all Japanese ! I think I'm doing ok considering what I payed. I have a Seiko Scubapro. Paid around £400 , probably worth about £4000 now. I have just bought a original Citizen bullhead chronograph from 1977. Paid £250, worth close to £1000. I have a very nice Citizen diver from 1977, completely original. Paid around £150, worth about £700. Looking a percentage in possible return on my investments, most people would conclude that I am doing far better than if I had invested thousands on a single watch. I would like to remind people, the fool and his money are easily parted ! 👍🤗

@marcellowoodford4048 2 ай бұрын

Thick,Black Coffee drunk to Excess causes Hair-Loss Butt...coffee-drinker's Bowels MOVE Spectacularly!

@sardendibs 2 ай бұрын

You won’t always get a nice ROI if you buy the “real gems” because, as you say, the market is emotional. What is considered a “real gem” today may not be so in five or ten years.

@SideWalkAstronomyNetherlands 2 ай бұрын

wijnoogst = vintage ... It had to come from the right vineyard to be of a good vintage... plus rain and sunshine, skills, soil...

@FunMushizzle 2 ай бұрын

For 98% of people investing in vintage watches will never make money. If it's a hobby, great like all hobbies enjoy it and don't worry about the money. If you plan to make money as an amateur watch maker by fixing vintage watches then you're not really in hobby territory anymore and everything in this video applies :)

@SideWalkAstronomyNetherlands 2 ай бұрын

@anoccasioalviewer 2 ай бұрын

A Rolex will buy a heck of a funeral…

@GrumblingForesight Ай бұрын

Im in no way a rich guy, just a regular working man. Because of the reasons you mentioned on this video, recently I’ve come to the realization that the only watches I can “afford” to buy are Rolexes (at whatever vintage I can afford) and maybe a few Omega models. Buying other brand’s watches will only expose me to potentially higher levels of depreciation in value that I simply can’t afford.

@phill.2924 Ай бұрын

So the bar you set for yourself with watches is that they must keep their value? That's just not the nature of 98% of the economics of watches. To each their own; not judging, but that shuts you out of dozens of watches that are very enjoyable to own. At least, given your self-described working man status, your collection won't grow too quickly.

@drbobsnightmare2521 2 ай бұрын

Investing in watches 😂😂 I'm sorry, do you want to buy an orange bridge in San Francisco?

@tonydilucente2342 2 ай бұрын

1. Branding.....2. Leads to demand.....3. I learned NOTHING.....

@allancrotch2953 2 ай бұрын

I have over my 68 years owned 6 Rolex a duoface le coultre Universal tri compax Gruen curvex I could go on but do not want to appear boastful .and anyway many went years ago to pay a divorce lawyer .I am also old enough to remember dirty dozen IWCs cymers ect being piled up in military surplus stores in the 1960s for 30 shillings (£1 50pence) and that wasnt much even then .2 weeks paper round money for a 12 year old. I did buy a new Timor for my 65th .But my main point is I still buy 1940s to 60s Swiss watches at vintage fairs antique/junk shops (A great shop 25 or so years ago in Amsterdam on the right of the main drag across from the rail station) I have a good watch repairer and my yard stick for valuing a purchase if in working order is price of a service + some I am talking Tissot Cymer Oris or the like.Power to your elbow long may watchmakers be around great channel thanks.

@LSZOE2001 2 ай бұрын

I have a question. Do watchmakers make extra micro adjustment holes in a clasp? Because I have a very cool metal G-shock but It only has 3 micro adjustment holes and I need 4 to make it fit better.😅