IONIQ 5 DC Fast Charging: 150 kW vs. 350 kW Session Comparison

Рет қаралды 32,315

2 жыл бұрын

This video compares fast charging sessions in a Hyundai IONIQ 5 on 150kW and 350kW charging stations... how much longer will HI5 drivers wait when they only have a 150kW unit available?
Our sessions comparing the two occurred quite far apart, in March (350kW) and now June (150kW), but both in EV-friendly temperatures around 70-80 degrees Fahrenheit (21-27 degrees Celsius). Hyundai's claim of 10-80% pretty much held up in our first session -- watch that one here: • Hyundai IONIQ 5: 10-80... -- but the 350kW option isn't always open or available.
So, is it really a disaster if a slower-charging EV is taking up that most powerful charge stall as you pull in this summer? Check out our results and see if you can cut them some slack!
#IONIQ5 #HyundaiIONIQ5 #ElectrifyAmerica
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Пікірлер: 95

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

If you're around at the start here, live chat feature is available during the video and there's a poll up to share how much longer you think it will take. Check it out and let us know your best guess!

@brianriebedriveselectric 2 жыл бұрын

Interesting! Thanks for the tests & comparisons.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching!

@vlad2838 2 жыл бұрын

Really helpful video. This is consistent with my EA experience with the I5 thus far. I’ll continue watching your channel!

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you, Vlad! Lots more IONIQ 5 stuff coming for sure, just need to find more time to edit. Appreciate the feedback and support!

@thewwcanadian 4 ай бұрын

Thanks for this video. Just bought an Ioniq 5 today. Picking it up on Thursday so love the video info. Keep making great content.

@plugandplayEV 4 ай бұрын

⚡🎉 That's huge, congratulations Tim! Excited to hear your first impressions.

@chrisgore2173 4 ай бұрын

Congrats Tim, I bought mine a few days ago. I friggin love it so far

@billcaulway9910 2 жыл бұрын

Very helpful as usual. Keep up the great work and thank you

@plugandplayEV Жыл бұрын

Thanks Bill, gave you a shout out in the latest video for the Tree House recommendation!

@EV3NTH888 2 жыл бұрын

perfect timing, I was just talking about the ioniq 5 and it's 350 kilowatt charging with a coworker, let's see the difference!

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Great to hear... hoping it stokes conversation and perhaps even surprises people!

@EV3NTH888 2 жыл бұрын

@@plugandplayEV I'm more informed than most about EVs, without watching the video I'm guessing the 0 to 100 percent would probably be very close with both chargers.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

@@EV3NTH888 Nailed it! The 150 to 350kW gap looks big as a number on paper, but the average charge rate shows the more accurate picture. ~240kW is a nice max for the EV6 and IONIQ 5 but it's not the whole story with charging, as you know.

@rzu7120 2 жыл бұрын

As I recall, the e-Tron only charges at a max 150kW, so no advantage to him to plug into the 350 station. I was hoping that someone would do this exact test after hearing Dave Conner on the Out of Spec channel (with his Ionic 5) complaining about people with slower-charging cars using the 350kW stations. It looks like if you're stuck at a 150kW station, and a 350 opens up, it's not even worth the time and effort to move to that station.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Right, unless there's some limitation where the eTron can't max out 150kW on those stations but can on a 350... like the Bolt not quite hitting 50kW on stations rated for it due to amperage limits. But even then, the advantage would be so small that a 150kW station should mostly be the go-to.

@Runtythestar 2 жыл бұрын

Another great video! We may be in the market to add an Ioniq 5 for my wife. Many MA dealers are charging markups. Curious which dealer you bought from if you didn't pay above MSRP?

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks! We found Pride Seekonk in the south of the state. Some of their inventory seems to be marked up now but they promised MSRP in writing for us back in February. Whole thing was really straightforward... no hard sell at any stage, beyond putting the deposit down to reserve the car.

@ouch1011 2 жыл бұрын

I’ve seen a peak of 178kw on a 150kw EA station my Ioniq5. I’ve also been at an EA station that peaked at 140kw (battery minimum temp was at 78deg, so plenty warm for peak speeds) It seems to depend on the specific charger model. For me personally, now that I’ve seen this test and done it myself and saw how minimal the time difference is, I usually just use a 150kw charger. Rarely am I ever in that much of a hurry, and if I can reduce battery wear and energy consumption a bit, it’s worth a couple extra minutes of my time.

@samusaran7317 2 жыл бұрын

Seems like my hunch was right about these cars. Awfully fast charging but somewhat inadequate cooling causing rapidgate and higher potential for battery degradation as the car ages.

@ouch1011 Жыл бұрын

The battery doesn’t really reach ridiculously high temperatures, so I’m not sure it’s really causing any excessive battery wear. In the time since I made the original post, I’ve also fast charged the battery (on 350kw) in over 100 deg weather and the charging performance is pretty consistent. The battery does get hot and it will sometimes reduce the charge rate a little earlier than it would if the battery were cooler, but it is nothing like the 50-75% speed reductions that were seen on some previous-generation EVs and still far less than some current generation EVs. The battery doesn’t even get as hot as my Tesla Model 3 battery used to, despite the fact that the Ioniq5 charges much faster (past 25%). That said, I do still prefer to charge on 150kw chargers because it is a little easier on the battery, reduces charging losses/inefficiency and only takes a few minutes longer if you’re charging up to higher SOC.

@samusaran7317 Жыл бұрын

@@ouch1011 What's the average max temperature you observed from a obd dongle?

@JohnSmith-uz3dt 3 ай бұрын

Ditto

@yt551217 10 ай бұрын

Thanks for your great videos and educating us. On my 2022 Ioniq5 I have commonly charged at 174 on a 150 EA station. But interestingly, on a 350 EA station (even after driving an hour, outside temp a seemingly perfect 75 deg, 10-20% starting), the highest speed I’ve obtained is 178. Do you frequently get the 220-240 the Ioniq5 is capable of or are the EA stations skimping?

@plugandplayEV 10 ай бұрын

Anecdotally around the Northeast/Midwest, more of the previous generation EA 350kW are derated to about half of their peak performance over the last six months. At least compared to when we first got the car and ran these tests. The big caveat there is that the latest generation dispensers (Signet and BTC Power hardware, with the single cable and more angular top design), has been rock solid in delivering 230-240kW when the car requests it. As more of those replace the old stuff, I think EGMP owners will see performance improvements and be a lot happier. And thanks for the support!

@lindsaydempsey5683 2 жыл бұрын

Great video, very informative. I'm now starting to think about trying to balance charge time with battery health and thinking that deliberately choosing 150 kW charging for the Ioniq 5 would be kinder to the battery, long term. For the two charging tests what was the increase in the Max Battery temperature indication from start to finish for the two different sessions? I expect that the temperature rise during the 150 kW session would be lower than the 350 kW session and therefore a little kinder to the battery on two counts, lower current flow and lower maximum temperature.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks! Although I didn't have full data set up for the 350kW session, it looks like the temperature is similar on both. Start average was 69F on the 350kW and it peaked at 109F, whereas the max here on the 150kW started around 78F and topped out at 115F. My takeaway is that either power level gets enough current flowing to heat up the pack to a point where the battery management software needs to go to work, so the lower power level won't be much kinder to the battery, if at all. There's probably a case to be made for using sub-100kW stations, however, if the driver has time. For all the complaints about the Bolt EV topping out at 55kW DCFC, degradation on packs with hundred of thousands of miles on them and regular fast charging is negligible.

@lindsaydempsey5683 2 жыл бұрын

@@plugandplayEV, thanks, a little different to what I was expecting and maybe 3F less in terms of temperature rise for the battery pack, so maybe some difference in the preferred direction, but not significant.

@ShawnGBR 22 күн бұрын

4:44 what’s funny about the car throttling at 103 to 104°F …that’s not some arbitrary number. Converted to Celsius, it throttles at exactly 40°C. The prime battery temperatures of 68 to 103°F are 20 to 40°C. It just makes more sense in Celsius as the rounded numbers, you can see why the engineers put those temperatures into the Battery Management System.

@plugandplayEV 22 күн бұрын

I don't think there was any assertion that it was "funny" or odd behavior, just noting when the throttle occurs for new users in the North American market.

@ShawnGBR 22 күн бұрын

@@plugandplayEV - I mean it's funny to me, because anyone that doesn't know the conversions might think the temperatures are a bit random but they're multiples of ten in the scale that engineers would use worldwide.

@plugandplayEV 22 күн бұрын

@@ShawnGBR Understood, thanks. I have a couple of later videos that go deeper into the temps and provide the comparative number in Celsius. The US bubble does sometime take over the topic, though, so I'll try to present those more consistently.

@eshellswell 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for comparison, some good thoughts on charger selection. Just curious, if it was a 10-60 test would the charge times see a larger spilt? I guess I’m assuming so since the Ionic 5 can really use the higher charge rates early in the charge cycle. Any chance you could make up some graphs for reference?

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Great suggestion, thanks. From memory as a start, I think we hit 60% around 11 minutes in on the 350kW, and around 16 minutes on the 150kW. So that first half of the charge is definitely a bit more of a gap to the 350, as you're getting the advantage of the max charge rate while the 150 is still ramping up (didn't hit its max until 67%). I'll pull together some graphs, add them to the video description, and update here when they're up.

@ShaneConder 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, but on the other side -- 30 to 80 -- the difference might be less. Unlike some of the folks you see on KZfaq who like to charge at just a few miles GoM, I prefer not to run it that close and will usually charge closer to 20-30% unless I know I'll have a backup (other than L2) if something is broken or busy. (And yes, in an ICE car, I refueled at quarter tank usually, if not higher.)

@coopie810 Жыл бұрын

Hey Steve, curious if you'll ever have access to and if you have any plans to test out an Ioniq 5 standard range trim and give your thoughts. I'm not a heavy traveler and would consider this model as a viable option. Not even sure the availability but just wanted to put it out there.

@plugandplayEV Жыл бұрын

Great minds think alike! I've actually only explored the base trim of the long range/RWD, as opposed to the standard range, for which I haven't seen any delivery reports as yet. If the opportunity arises to check one out and put it through its paces vs the larger pack versions, I'll jump all over it!

@vasileiospetropoulos2046 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching!

@ShaneConder 2 жыл бұрын

Twice now I’ve been to EA stations where both the 350 kW chargers have been in use by cars that can’t use them. The time difference isn’t huge - and is usually erased by the time it takes to finish up other business on the stop - snacks, toilets, kids, pets, etc - but it is something that EA could probably do more to help with. (except in states where they bill by time - they have no incentive to help there) In any case, same experience with the EV6. Charge rates on the 150 kW units are solid.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

I'd say it's more on the manufacturer to raise awareness around their individual model(s), as EA would have their work cut out trying to communicate peak charge rates and optimal use case for every model. Should an IONIQ 5 or EV6 give up the 350kW if a Taycan or eTron GT arrives, for example? I'd say no but perhaps there's a case to be made, comparing overall throughput. Overall, I'd like to think the realization of it being a few minutes difference should eventually convince EV drivers we don't need to freak out over a 350kW in use. The NEVI program is settling on 150kW stations, for the most part, and it seems to be the sweet spot for most users. I'm intending to see available 350kW stalls as a bonus on trips this summer, while planning for a 150kW at every stop.

@ShaneConder 2 жыл бұрын

@@plugandplayEV Yeah, in general I want to agree -- buyers education should be more. But these are coming from lots that can still send oil change reminders. 🤷 I think EA (and others) could do something like, using software, give a message like, "Hey, next time you should consider using the 150 kW chargers that were available when you arrived because while you were charging, some cars that could have used the extra power had to charge slower since your car, which can't use it, was taking up a slot." E.g. a gentle educational nudge/reminder. But, I also think stations could be smarter and power share better. If a station is wired for 1 MW peak output (2x 150kW and 2x 350 kW), maybe they can load balance across all four plugs to give the cars what they can use, since it's unlikely all 4 cars would be peak charging at once (and the e-GMP cars can technically only do 240 ish peak, anyway). That is to say, solve the problem with software and electronics and not have the consumer have to worry about it.

@iridium130m 2 жыл бұрын

I’d probably never use the 350kw then given the minimal advantage and perhaps be a little bit more gentle on the battery pack.

@samusaran7317 2 жыл бұрын

Bad design

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

I'll take advantage if one is available and the stop has nothing interesting around and/or flying solo. For stops with the fam or lots of amenities, though, 150 would be just fine.

@apollian 3 ай бұрын

What app is that your using? I'm picking up my Ioniq 5 next week.

@plugandplayEV 3 ай бұрын

Congratulations! 👏 The app is Torque Pro for Android. Car Scanner is another option with very similar functionality.

@bigretardhalo 2 жыл бұрын

Good info it would be neat to compare the two charge speeds on a hot day 100 degrees plus, not that they are easy to come by in the northern states.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, we might need to head south for those tests. And hailing from Britain, 100F+ days tend to be debilitating for me, so it's unlikely I'd be able to conduct the tests coherently in any case!

@bigretardhalo 2 жыл бұрын

😂 yeah they are generally best to avoid… thanks again for another useful real world test

@marcw.5492 19 күн бұрын

I must have missed the first 9 sessions, you speak as if we all own an EV and understand any of this. Thanks for you time - what city are you in ? what model is this you are charging ? SEL AWD ? USA ?

@plugandplayEV 19 күн бұрын

Thanks for the comment, always happy to answer questions. This is a 2022 AWD Ioniq 5 Limited (top trim) in the USA. Boston, Massachusetts, to be precise. Not sure what first nine sessions you refer to as this video is a couple of years old but, again, happy to add context if you can clarify with a time stamp when I mention it. Cheers!

@marcw.5492 3 күн бұрын

@@plugandplayEV Thanks - Its a whole new learning curve.... Im waiting for Aptera to deliver the solar charging car. Charging is just too difficult at this point, Im in an APT, and Im reading now of charging stations that do not work properly - pump to pump. ANd I have to use a Phone App, really no fun ! I am however all for fewer moving parts !

@be236 2 жыл бұрын

Nice comparison.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

@Thissandthat 10 ай бұрын

So the SOC displayed is the actual battery SOC? I know the mustang Mach-E has a fairly large buffer on either end of the battery to extend and protect battery life

@plugandplayEV 10 ай бұрын

There's a small variance, in the Ioniq 5 but presumably across all EGMP models, but yes, displayed SOC is much closer to actual than some other models. It won't die bang on 0%, as with most EVs, but it's not saving much for a later date either.

@Thissandthat 10 ай бұрын

@@plugandplayEV good to know! Thank you ☺️

@spicasky 7 ай бұрын

Great video. Just got Ionic5 and charged it 4 times now. At 150kw station and my car 50% full , I only get 39kw max from the station , weather was warm. Not sure why I didn't get at least 100kw.

@plugandplayEV 7 ай бұрын

Congratulations on your I5! Could be a couple of things with the power: 1) Charger could be derated due to a technical issue on the charge network's side, 2) pack temperature might still be off, even if it doesn't feel cold. The pack needs to be at 20C/69F to accept full power. Based on such a low power delivery, it's almost certainly an issue on the charger side. 39kW is too low, even if the pack is cold. Best bet is usually to try a different dispenser or check Plugshare ahead of time to identify problematic stations and pick an alternative.

@GeoffJohnson Жыл бұрын

Oddly enough I find the 350kW stations to be more inconsistent. When I'm on a 150kW in my Ioniq 5, it hovers around 140-150kW, but when I've used the 350kW it peaks at 230 but then quicky drops down to 120-130.

@plugandplayEV Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the perspective. I've found the I5 charge curve somewhat hard to get a handle on, because it appears to be based more on pack temperature than state of charge. Yes, there's some drop off as you got above 80%, but that's less important as it's still fast and most people will leave by 90%. 350kW hardware, where available, has been very good to us and only usually falls off to the 140-160kW range. The peak of 230kW+ is always nice to see but was more a novelty to enjoy for the first few months of ownership. The reality of our travel means we stop for 20-30 minutes at least, so the car is done regardless of whether we plug into a 150kW or a 350kW.

@Lynyrd_Evnyrd 2 жыл бұрын

Given my Tesla Model 3 LR can charge at up to 190kW on a 350kW 500 amp EA unit (I’ve seen 188kW on one with my CCS1 adapter) would you say it’s justifiable to take up a 350kW space for that? I don’t know for sure but I believe only the 350kW labeled chargers have the 500 amp current carrying capacity to reach 190kW while the other 150kW units only output 350 amps which would give us 400V users around 135kW peak. This same question applies to the EQS, will apply to the Lyriq and perhaps other 400V based cars that charge at a high amperage at around 200kW. The answer is a little more clear cut for the Model S Plaid which peaks at around 215kW due to its slightly higher voltage 450V pack and perhaps murkier for the Model 3 SR+ which peaks at 170kW on a 500 amp charger.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Yes, I think anything taking advantage of the increased power has justification to be on the 350kW unit. If I'm on there with the Ioniq 5 and a Taycan pulls up, I'm not going to jump off just because I'm pulling 170kW (after the step down) and the Porsche could pull 270kW. It should now be quick enough, IMO, that first come first served is followed and those arriving later can decide to either use the 150kW or wait for the 350kW to free up, depending on their EV's capability. A few extra minutes really shouldn't be a deal breaker for any current EV, as none can truly max out the 350kW units yet. The decisions and etiquette of those arriving first are what's really important, so Bolt and Leaf owners should stick to 150s where possible, all CCS models should use the CHAdeMO as a last option, and everyone should hopefully move on at the earliest opportunity.

@ouch1011 2 жыл бұрын

I would say no personally. The time difference would be literally a minute or two on a Tesla Model 3 since it can’t hold those higher charging speeds past about 30-35%. The majority of your charging session will be at less than 150kw.

@newscoulomb3705 2 жыл бұрын

Yes, I saw 170 kW on 150 kW units with the KIA EV6, and it doesn't seem to be too much of a difference using 150 kW vs 350 kW. This is going to be a much bigger deal for the Ford and GM EVs that will see a significant time differences when using 150 kW versus 350 kW.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Right. It's interesting to watch the shift and different tiers of fast charging emerging. Any thoughts on where the dust will settle in terms of power mix at a standard charge station? So if it's 1x350 / 3x150 now, what number of stations/power mix would you think is a good base for, say, the next five years?

@newscoulomb3705 2 жыл бұрын

@@plugandplayEV Frankly, I prefer EVgo's new "Ultium Ready" model, which is a mix of 350 kW and 100 kW units, but the majority favors 350 kW. So a six-charger site typically has four 350 kW and two 100 kW. So they are skipping 150 kW units altogether. That being said, I think we need to stop shooting for max power at sites altogether. The speed of the chargers on site should be dictated by the primary use case for the site or host business. That Ultium Ready configuration I mentioned best complements things like coffee shops, where some visit for 15 minutes while others visit for an hour or more. Convenience stores and travel plazas should almost exclusively be 350 kW, while sit-down and fast-food restaurants should probably focus on 100 kW to 150 kW units. Malls, outlets, grocery stores, etc. should emphasize 50 kW to 100 kW units.

@drmcallis 2 жыл бұрын

Good to know.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching 👍

@douglashempel8037 2 жыл бұрын

I've tried to educate people in a friendly way when at chargers, particularly if they're using the only ChaDEMo at many of these EA stations and especially if they're looking like they're walking away. The etiquette isn't well known yet...

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Good on ya. We try a mix of politeness and penalties ("could block someone out/wouldn't want you to get ticketed/towed") depending on the situation and haven't had any overly negative responses... yet!

@jfrenchws6 2 жыл бұрын

Wow I'm surprised at the time difference. You'd think the higher powered charger would be much faster. Perhaps 150kw chargers are the sweet spot for public charging?

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

I think the average charge rate is telling... 141kW on the 150 unit vs. 174kW on the 350 unit session. Yes, the I5 and EV6 will hit peaks around 240kW, but over the course of a 20-25 minute session it's much closer in terms of average power.

@jfrenchws6 2 жыл бұрын

@@plugandplayEV That's a great point. Perhaps charging speeds will become a more of a marketing term than an actual real life advantage.

@ShaneConder 2 жыл бұрын

To be fair, that's a 24% higher average charging rate on the 350 kW than on the 150 kW. That is pretty significant. (It's just not many minutes because both are pretty fast.) But, compared to other cars that are "only 150 kW" charging, could they achieve 141 kW average? Given my experience with the Leaf, I'd guess not, though there are probably exceptions. (Some cars have really strong charging curves that don't need higher peaks, which others are peaky but have lower lows.) I think advertising the average charge rate may become a selling point eventually rather than peak charge rates, because it is more telling on what the experience is actually like.

@battousaihimura 2 жыл бұрын

350kW helps if you want to do 10 to 50% sessions/quick stops

@TheTom2video Жыл бұрын

The difference between 150 kWh vs 350 kWh rapid charge is minimal. A couple of minutes longer on the 150 kWh. It maybe more feasible to charge at 150 kWh because you can preserve battery life

@plugandplayEV Жыл бұрын

Totally agree. I might prioritize a 350 when available out of interest to see the more varied charging curve, but in terms of time it's so close that either will do the job.

@MAGApepe Жыл бұрын

how do you get it free on EA ? some pre paid plan ?

@plugandplayEV Жыл бұрын

The complimentary charging comes with certain model purchases. Hyundai Ioniq 5 (and 6) both get free 30 minute sessions for two years, for example. Volkswagen ID. 4 was doing unlimited free charging for three years. Some get a set allowance capped by kWh, like the Fords and Kias. Totally depends on which model you buy and the agreements that manufacturers have in place with the charging network.

@MAGApepe Жыл бұрын

@@plugandplayEV oh amazing,, didnt know that :))

@tommckinney1489 2 жыл бұрын

Help me understand the math. If you ratio the average kW charging rate (234 vs 141), you get 1.66. So shouldn't it take 1.66 times longer for 150kW than 350kW? Should be around 31 minutes at 150kW?

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

234kW was the max on the 350kW session, while 174kW was the average. Can't see the vid for the moment... did I label them incorrectly?

@tommckinney1489 2 жыл бұрын

@@plugandplayEV oops. I read it incorrectly. The math works. thanks for the reply.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Phew, glad I didn't mess up the graphic as there's no editing/correcting after the fact here!

@Crybabehot 2 жыл бұрын

Why u don’t use level 3 charging?

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

We do. Left a reply to your other comment but level 3 is often used to refer to DC fast charging.

@markusssssss123 2 жыл бұрын

How long to charge with 100kw?

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Assuming the car holds close to the 100kW max for the full duration, a 10-80% should be around 35-40 minutes. But the only 100kW rated stations I'm aware of in our area are on the EVgo network, which could get pricey as most still charge fees per minute.

@danielroden9424 4 ай бұрын

that miles per kwh hurts. my kona ev has averaged 4.3 over the last 8000 miles. 2.9 is baaad

@plugandplayEV 4 ай бұрын

Yep, high 3s/low 4s was our benchmark efficiency in the Bolt EVs as well. Paying for the heavier, larger vehicle but the space and ride quality is worth the trade off, thus far, while charging speeds 3x quicker is a game-changer on long trips.

@michaelnuss1926 2 жыл бұрын

You have no idea how spoiled you are to first off be in possession of an Ioniq 5. Here in Canada it's really a far away dream. Secondly the free EA charging. No such thing here. Hyundai chose to stiff us on that one. No such deal with EC.

@plugandplayEV 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I do scratch my head on some of the decisions between two neighboring countries. Canadian buyers do have different requirements to, say, the lower half of the US, but northern US customers have similar needs. The limitation with Electrify Canada is that it's a much smaller initiative than EA and does seem to lag behind as a result. Looks like the Volkswagen models are the only ones that will see free charging offers up there for now.

@wgemini4422 2 жыл бұрын

I do think it's slightly cheaper in Canada. The configuration is also different. However, regardless the offer, it's just impossible to get. Wait time is over 2 years now.