Fun Fact: Brad Pitt injured his Achilles heel doing one of those jumps attacks, causing filming to be delayed for several months until he recovered. An actor playing Achilles injuring his Achilles heel, how poetic 😅

Let's not forget, Achilles, among others, was a demigod, so physically he was on another level

Someone charging at you at full sprint with a sword and determination in their eyes does look terrifying.

The makers of the movie where trying to interprete the description in the Illiad that describes Achilles as fighting in "a God-like manner", meaning he was fighting in a way that no normal mortal man would be capble of.

Little side note, you're now waiting and anticipating to react to the jump move. It kinda removes the element of surprise for an unconventional move

Happy to see Shad healthy and energetic enough to do this test. Hopefully he wasn’t too out of breath off camera. Loved this.

Shad strategy a 7:40 is flawless. He's tying Tyrinth out with the spears so that by the time he does a rel one, Shad can actually block him. Genius!

I would argue that the fact that you know what attack is coming is huge when it comes to defending it. I could totally see someone not ready for it get tagged by it's weirdness. Especially from a fast and precis guy.

Achilles also does his signature move at the beach landing when the Myrmidons reachvthe temple of Apollon!

To really test this, I think you should ask a local university to lend you a hurdler or volleyball/basketball player or something. Achilles' thing was always that he's a supernatural athlete, as much as a warrior, and a surprising amount of height/distance/speed could be enough to make the difference---he only has to surprise them once.

It seems like the armed version of a Superman punch. Might be worth looking at how and why those are used and bring that to a sword

Another thing is Shad when he was holding the shield was Anticipating the move and getting ready for it, the Guy in the Movie had NO Clue what was coming that act of surprise can make a Move like that very Effective.

I think Hector is also terrified doing the entire fight making him fight more passively! I like to believe that all the weird stuff archilles does is just to flex... he is a showman and doesn't feel like he is in any danger!

It's funny that Nate and Tyranth, at around 14:30, made mention of Hector gassing out during his duel with Achilles. This is significant, even with The Iliad, wherein Achilles had been sitting out for much of the battle. Hector, meanwhile, had been fighting since the arrival of the Greeks. It means that, barring blessings of the gods, Hector was on a back foot before the fight even got started.

"you'll wonder the underworld blind deaf and dumb and everyone will know this is Hector the fool who thought he killed Achilles"-Achilles

I think the most important thing about this move is how unexpected it was. Nobody would do this under normal circumstances, so it would catch anyone off guard.

one thing in favor of Achilles is that his opponents didn't know that he was going to do a jump attack, so many time you would't know how to position your shield or what to expect once makes the sidestep to the shield side

It's basically a superman punch but with a sword. If fighters can pull it off in real fights today, I'm pretty sure a very athletic and skilled warrior would be able to do so with his short sword

Watching MMA made me realize that jump attacks are generally not great, but when used properly it is a great distance closer, surprise attack and slight force multiplier. The risk you take for it is usually not worth taking, but often the enemy doesn't expect it and thus your openings aren't capitalized on while in the air or after landing. The main thing about duels, armed or unarmed, is that you have time to learn your opponent and you have time to make your enemy get used to certain attacks and overall pace. Jump attacks break the usual rhythm of the fight in such situations.

Out of curiosity, in the movie it seemed to me like Achilles was using the move to create or exploit particular angles of attack combatants wouldn't expect a less limber opponent to use. In combat when using a shield do fighters get a tendency to become complacent to attacks on the shield side especially when using larger shields? Of all the times he uses that move the only time it seemed pointless was in the initial Hector spear segment.

If I remember correctly, there is some mention in the Irish sagas of Cuchulain and Finn Mchuil of the salmon leap. Possibly a way of getting past a shield wall.

Also consider that Brad Pitt is half Nathan Jones' size, so he'd have a sizable speed and agility edge in getting past his guard and into his neck with his blade.

I always did love those fight breakdowns, i hope ther's a chance we can have another one. I don't know if they didnt perform well with the ratings but they are still great and entertaining.

Troy is a cinematic masterpiece whether the tactics used in it would work outside of a film or not? The Directors cut is amazing. lol

This video went far better than I thought it would.

The other thing that jumping does is that it hides your legs from counterattack, as seen at 15:05. Especially against an opponent who isn't expecting it, a jump attack with shield grab seems like it would be a viable tactic that wouldn't have too much risk other than the energy cost.

Gotta love how Shad and Tyranth banter with each other, and Tyranth clearly gets annoyed at Shad sometimes, but as soon as he thinks he might have hurt Shad at 16:27, he stops everything and ask if he's okay. Just goes to show the professionalism these guys have despite messing with each other.

I will say that this spear dodge with the charge and leap stab looks incredibly epic

As you get tired it gets harder and harder to lift the shield high and your speed starts to drop. Throw a few mid hits to get them in the rhythm of blocking mid then jump high and come over the top. I could see that working. Even just as a test to see how tired and slow they were, providing you could keep yourself safe doing it.

Achilles seemed like the type of guy who knew he was good enough to get away with theatrics, displaying just how incredible of a warrior he is, while it being somewhat functional in the context of what he’s trying to accomplish with the move.

The main advantage and characteristic of Achilles repeated over and over again in the Iliad (and in other Greek literature) was that he was "swift of foot". He was really fast and apparently had the stamina to support his lightning speed throughout the batttle. I guess his speed and stamina would make such a move easy and effective for him.

I saw Shad’s review of this fight scene and they are moving their shield away from their bodies all the time. Maybe if Achilles did the jumping attack at one of those times, he could have prevented Hector from blocking. Picture this: Hector has his shield to the side after missing an attack, and sees Achilles jumping towards him. He tries desperately to block with his shield, but is still moving it by the time the attack is about to land, so he doesn’t have much structure. This makes it easy for Achilles to push Hector’s shield down and stab him. I don’t know if this is realistic, so anyone who sees a flaw, feel free to point it out.

Achilles didn't fight like a mortal,he fought like a Demi -God! His movements looked more like dancing than actual fighting and he had the abilities to match his style. He and Heracles were the pinnacle of what a Human could be. That's why Achilles didn't wven broke a sweat the entire movie even against Hector with which he played rather than fight.

I can imagine someone with a dane axe doing a small jump before a downward strike would add a bit of gravity to the strike

Brad Pitt tore his achilles tendon in that first jump scene. Kind of ironic.

I also think there is some element of surprise here in the move. If someone didn’t think that attack was coming it probably would be much more effective.

As some have mentioned already, we do have a current real world modern example in MMA, often called the superman punch which has been seen used with both the run up and with a side step. After i saw troy i added a few of those in the spear/shield choreo i did for the ren fair here

The interesting thing is that all these jumping attacks were done with the opponent fully aware and expecting it, and they still seemed potentially effective. Boagrius was most likely caught completely unaware, so the odds of it working exactly as shown were pretty high. Hector was obviously good enough to fend it off twice, but even he might have been somewhat surprised by it the first time since it was hist first direct combat with Achilles.

Please dont hurt yourselves for content. As always be safe. Its one of the things i love about your channel. Enough "mess around" just enough to "find out". Stay awesome!

It's probably the first time ve watched one of your full-length videos, can i just say...i love how gloriously nerdy you guys are. Honestly warms my evil little heart

My .02... I do think the intent behind the move is a combination of style and intimidation. Style because damn does he look good doing it, and intimidation by delivering a hit to a shield that you know won't do anything, just to make the person worry about what would happen if they missed a block. This concept is something I used to use when fighting in the SCA. I fought axe and shield, and would purposely attack the opponent on the shield with more force just to make them fear that axe a little more, and from speaking with them afterward they all were intimidated by it. Now of course the jump needs to be more powerful for that to be a thing... but one part of that. If I recall he has his opposite leg lift and then has a full body torque at the top in those big jump thrusts which could be where the added power comes from. I didn't see any of you manage that part as dramatically as he does it in the movie. Something to consider at least! Though even assuming all that is true... still not something I would want to do against someone that was equal or better skilled than myself which also plays into Achilles' mentality.

I’m sure people in fighting shape could do much better lol 😂 great video gents

@15:05 "Get up, Prince of Troy. Get up. I won't let a stone take my glory."

That was AWSOME and EPIC! Great content!

That is an important issue... Thank for spending our time for this significant matter!

That looks so fun. Yall are really good jumpers!

You three lads give me mad classic top gear vibes. Very fun video, keep up the good work!

Something that came up on another's channel that I didn't get a response from. I thought the little flags/pennons on the ends of light cavalry lances would be decorative only as a secondary function, but primarily to stop over penetration in a charge. A piece of cloth or tassel would act as a soft brake to prevent penetration far beyond the spearhead and thus stop losing the lance in combat on a single would be kill. However, this wasn't mentioned as any of the possibilities for having a pennon at the end of a lance.

Here because I love the videos that you guys put out and because I want to help push your video with the algorithm

I'm gonna say it. Shad I understand with chronic fatigue, but y'all need to get on a calorie deficit. Dr. Mike Israetel from Renaissance Periodization has a great series on how to best go about that.

it makes sense from a character standpoint that his most flashy move is all style over substance (but there is still a little bit of substance because he was just that skilled a warrior/fighter)

Have to remember Achilles legendary speed coupled with his heritage. It is probably more intended to be like the lightning run shout from Skyrim (forget what its called).

It may look doable at first glance, but I think Brad twisted his ankle doing this jump delaying production, and during the Hector fight the jumps were performed by a professional jumper (you can even see his face if you freeze the frames at the right time)

I am enjoying these vids like never before!

Merry Christmas Shad Crew!

16:33 I rewatched this part over and over and can't stop laughing xDDD Peak slapstick comedy by Shad there, something about his intentionally floppy and awkward body movements here is just hillarious.

Great video guys!

I'd like to say, the Shadlands look absolutely stunning for a background during all this! I can only imagine how much better it'd look once the first castle comes into view when that happens.

That was an awesome presentation bois. :)

4:45 first test (Theses alot after this im not time stsmping) 8:15 thoughts 9:10 next one (mid fight jump) 9:40 thoughts 10:40 trying to do it as fast as possible and thoughts 11:50 trying to get over shelds wish jump 13:00 no jump but upp strike (Ive just relised this aounds like some of the basics of star wars lightsaber form ataru) 14:40 round 2 15:23 thoughts Final thoughts, good for agants tired weak oponits if you have the strength 16:39 stand vs jump (more fouse standing then jump 17:40 jump and push down on sheld can bring more force to disable there sheld and there rotastion moves it to the side My thoughts i may test: a jump slash not thrust may be good because as shad previously tested it delivers more force

Day like 100 of asking for a video on the misconceptions of Medieval weddings and how they can be incorporated into fantasy stories and roleplay that isn’t just copying Game of Thrones (which probably has the most realistic depiction on Medieval weddings)

I liek to believe that all the weird stuff archilles does is jsut to flex... he is a showman and doesn't feel like he is in danger!

Remember, the Achilles of legend was trained by Chiron the centaur. As impractical as some moves may be, those are the angles that a centaur would attack from.

Interesting, grabbing the shield does give an advantage and even a hit on the leg while it's off the ground could move the leg reducing the impact rather than one where it's solidly held on the ground. Their shields would also be heavier so harder to actually to get it up and hold it.

I love this fight. One of my favourite movie fights. Hector was one of my favourite characters. The little flourish that Achilles does after he cuts the top of Hectors thigh, when Hector goes to get Achilles foot. But he kicks it up. I actually used that move, or at least think of it and try to emulate the motion, when people would try to hook my ankle during a play.

15:15 "Get up, Prince of Troy! I won't let a stone steal my glory!"

Wow what a coincidence I just watched that movie yesterday! One of my all time favorites. Its so weird people dont mention it more often ...

Well, I'm shocked at how well the run and jump move worked. Do you have the time to step back at the last moment? That should be an easy way to counter it if you don't fall over. The rest went about as well as I expected, thanks to Shad and the boys trying all kinds of these silly things in the past. It is actually educational, not just hehe stick. That said, hehe stick.

Shad and Nate sparring always turns into 2 little kids fighting and I think it's adorable

Shad flying on the thumbnail got me. 😆

i think the angle you can get and pushing the sheild down make this situantioly useful risky but useful. if i had someone to spare with and it wasnt cold. id love to try this a bunch.

This might be what the salmon leap really was. The Romans say the Gauls jumped over the shields of their enemies. Maybe they did what Shad was doing; jumping, pulling the shield down, and go in for the kill.

Love how much fun they're having while making this video

This is great. I love the trio format. I hope Nate and Tyranth stick around for a long time.

Something to note in the movie is in the first scene achilles puts his hand on the bald guy's chest basically using his body to slow him down mid air

It's worth noting that Greek shields were not center-grip (at least, I don't think they were), so that would change both how the blow impacts the shield and how much effect grabbing and twisting it would have.

Tychilles showin out! lol Love to see it.

In the clip you showed, Achilles does not touch his opponent’s shield. He puts his hand on the guy’s shoulder as he reaches the highest point of his jump, apparently to get a little extra height to make the stab. The top of the guy’s shield was just below his own shoulder. Achilles could have just as easily stabbed the guy in the throat. I’m with Nate- the jump is pure style.

Great video

Shad rolling a spin and catch on the sword mid vid. Robocop style. So cool

I love this channel.

Oh yes! This is going to be such a good episode, I know already before watching :D I love this movie and mainly because I loved Achilles' moves, I thought the choreography was great and Brad Pitt did a fantastic job carrying it out. Always kinda hoped those moves can work even a little bit in real life :D

Great film.

Damn it! For a moment I thought you were going to test his armor.

Hahahaha Shad just locks on to the groin with the spear and throws a monkey wrench in the whole thing. I had to pause for a laugh.

I have found with my own experimentation jumping backwards and thrusting as a retreating attack works pretty well

You guys are awesome I’d love to do this as a living lol

Great video.

If only i could've been here for this one. Ive had this move down for years 😂😂😂

It’s so funny you put this video out as I literally just rewatched Troy the other night. Despite its lack of success at the box office I really loved this movie and actually wished they did a sort of sequel with Sean Bean as Odysseus in his own movie the Odyssey. I also really love the Hector scream as it always reminds me of Fingolfin screaming for Morgoth by the gates of Angband in the Silmarillion. As for Brad Pitts combat maneuvers I always found them cool yet comical. Thanks for making the video!

Looking good lads!

I'd love for you to test some of the fighting styles from a manga called Vinland Saga. In the beginning the main character uses dual wielding daggers and speed. Later on an antagonist uses a spear that's modified to separate into 2 spears. Check it out I think y'all would enjoy it.

11:51 its like watching 2 little boys play in the mud with stick swords just being boys.

It's more intimidation than a viable attack, because I'm not sure that bashing a someone's shield a bit harder makes much difference. But the jumper might topple the defender over, which is good.

I do find it funny that your finding fault with some of the Achilles moves but I think you might have forgotten that Achilles was a Demi God...

Honestly, even though you can tell it's totally impractical... the jumps still look pretty cool.

And please continue your story videos! I want to know what happens next!

i'll be blunt: love that you're using the sword and shield combo. hopefully you'll pair it with your larp Kite shield. and i hope you'll talk about shortsword a lot more - maybe leave that to Nate, since he's the expert in sword and shield combat. i also love that you're using the Novice II Shortsword (both it and the Norrick Shortsword remind me of Minecraft's Iron Sword).

This one was fun! Most of it is what I imagine would result from a job interview for stuntmen when given the question, "Now, can you Brad Pit? Show me."

15:05 Get up, prince of Troy, get up! I won't let a stone take my glory.