So we have officially found out just how little game you can get away with if you attach a skin market to it.

Never heard of this "Banana" game, so at first I thought it was silly nonsense game and thought "what's the harm in this?" Then Frost started talking about getting a banana out of it and selling the banana with all the talk of scarcity and speculation, and I thought "this is starting to sound like shit with NFTs" and then it clicked for me why people are hating on this.

"Companies taking advantage of idiots is fine, because it only hurts idiots." As someone who isn't Omniscient, I'll never defend this stance.

There is a reason to be more sceptical. A KZfaqr by the name of Jauwn did a deep dive into this game and the developers. The developers of this game are very closely related to another similar game that got one of the developers banned for running a pump-and-dump scheme. This game worked the EXACT same way as Banana does. Steer clear of this game.

Frost: "What makes you part with money on a regular basis that others would consider wasteful? Video games? Funko pops? MTG cards?" Me: *_"Pleasure food."_*

Place your bets on how fast Frost’s hundred dollar banana is gonna get bought

This is nothing new, just the logical extreme. This thing has existed on steam for as long as tradeable items and trading cards have existed. Asset flips take advantage of this too. The 1/3 cut devs get off any cards/items traded in the market, combined with the absolute massive size and speed of the steam market with bots means devs get a lot of nickles and dimes for little effort. This is just 0 effort, with a lot of nickles and dimes and some special sauce in "rare items" Tf2 went free because the cut steam gets off its market place is to much to hinder with a small price tag.

"Hundred dollar icy nana" Really just want to hear Frost read out all the nanas now

The worst part is that there's no way to talk about this garbage without helping it. You improved the market for these things the moment you posted the video, so did every other content creator who's talked about it. It's the nature of meme culture, some poor idiot fan is gonna buy your $100 banana, then they're gonna sell it for even more money to an even bigger idiot as "Frost's banana", and so on and so forth. It's sad.

Let's make a Second Wind game with Gamer Cowboy paper dolls where you click on a table horse to ward off Puritans.

I noticed this just browsing steamcharts and went down the rabbit hole discovering just how pointless it is. I assume it'll be one of those things that is gone in a month or two, but just like NFTs, no one wants to miss the boat on the next get rich quick scheme. Even if "rich" isn't quite enough to make a vending machine spit out a bag of chips.

I think its money laundering tbh

Radiohead said it best "You do it to yourself. Badowdow and that's what really hurts."-Yahtzee Crowshaw

It is a trap game, made by The Big Mice (not Disney) in order for players to ruin their mice so that they need to buy new ones.

Love the art put in to this presentation. Dislike the take. Not because I'm a Puritan cowboy. But rather because I've seen the damage scams do. Just because we don't understand the angle, doesn't mean an angle isn't there. Sure. Nobody HAS to fall in with a con game - the mark is often a willing participant. That doesn't mean a con isn't a con. It's just one aspect of how a scammer uses our innate instincts against us. A con will present itself as an opportunity rather than what it is - a scheme to bilk a mark. Someone is going to be left holding the bag. The more interesting thing here is what Steam can do about it. Not whether they SHOULD do something - a market loses trust if it becomes a haven for cons. But Steam has created the current system as it is - allowing this scam to run. To get a cut of the more shady business models of the game industry. And now Steam has nobody to blame but themselves.

My last comment on was, "It's a Skinner Box. Not a game with skinnerbox mechanics, just a Skinner Box." The player base for this game was probably reincarnated from lab rats. I guess you could say, it's like the Dive Kick of compulsion-based games. It takes away all the fluff and complexity and delivers only the core of what the game is.

When I was like 8 I thought "hey, what if I took this rock and said "hey, if you buy this rock from me for 1 euro, then you can resell it for 2 euros by saying to the next person that they can resell it for 3 euros". And even 8 year old me knew that this thought was silly. _Why are we living in the universe where my silly childish thoughts shape the world economy, and not the one my silly childish thoughts mean you can fly by jumping off a coffee table and quickly jump again in mid-air ?_

Its all "fun and non-games" and "they never hurt anyone" until steam becomes yet another google playstore and your frontpage is filled with "[Name of a thing]" clicker games. At least on this you technically could say it doesnt prey on peoples addictive personalities and need to gamble cos no one is buying those 100 dollar bananas. Yet.

"There is a balance to be found somewhere between Cowboys and Puritans." Nicely put

while it's not a scam and doesn't seem to technically be violating any ToS (and valve doesn't seem to be taking any action), this looks like it's opening up floodgates. there's already a dozen other copies and I expect more developers to follow suit and add steam community market items for the free hype/income. also the fact the dev is allowed to generate an infinite amount of super rare bananas just rubs me the wrong way - but that's just me I guess

Either people are really desperate to work below minimum wage with no benefit, or it's money laundering.

What makes Banana psychological horror? The marketplace aspect, of course.

Two thoughts spring to mind. The Banana game is listed as Psychological Horror. Yep, the psychological horror of end-stage capitalism where everything has a price and no one understands what real value is. And the comparison with NFTs is rather apt. A badly drawn banana has as much value as a badly drawn ape - but then, as is so rightly pointed out in the video, the price is what someone is willing to pay and that is a separate variable from intrinsic value. Of course, you can also argue that each banana is a work of art and so this game is creating artworks. Indeed, imagine a gallery filled with real works of art by famous artists all on the same theme and the auction value such paintings could ultimately accrue. Does that then put this scam in a different light, or simply highlight why art is such a fickle market in itself? Bottom line, this video made sure I didn't waste time, money, energy and the world's resources on getting involved in Banana. I can't digest them anyway.

I love that this shit is full of bots. It's almost as if rampant speculation will make your shit worse who would have guessed?

Personal responsibility, as a concept, is complex. You have to factor in power dynamics, alternatives, accurate information, mental ability, etc. If a company lies to you to get your money, who is at fault? The company for lying or you for not seeing through their lies? Then you fall into the trap of advertising. But good luck trying to get your money back from a company unethical enough to take it from you dishonestly in the first place.

I might be misremembering, but wasn’t the creator of the banana game kinda sketchy as well?

There's always money in the banana stand.

a virtual game of hot potato, where the last to hold it is the loser

Me, after buying booster packs that are 90% common garbage cards: "Looks like a scam to me."

You missed the actual problem, Frost: You are talking about everyone playing this game assuming they are adults capable of fully informed decisions. "Speculative market" is just a fancy term for a casino. And I get that there's no money out, and there's no way to quantify how much a game like this would influence gambling behavior or addiction. I think we can safely say best case it's not a good thing for kids to engage with a game like this, and there's way more potential downside than upside.

Yes. **Oh** you're talking about the banana game. Thought you were talking about CS: GO, DOTA 2, or any of the other loot box marketplace games that are in the top 20 or so most played games on Steam.

I like how honest every cold take is

I won't be held responsible if you find me in the supermarket endlessly poking all the bananas.

I'll be honest, I first thought that this whole "banana game" was just a metaphor Frost made up for TF2 to highlight the absurdities of that game lol I had to look it up in despair to realise it's real

"Banana" is working the Steam Market as _Valve intended._ See also: Valve own games with literal tens of thousands of farming bots that Valve is not clamping down on. Some of these have been doing their job for a decade now. It's also not the first "game" of this sort, nonsense drops and all. "Banana" just seems to be in the current meme zeitgeist.

The bigger question isn't whether or not it's a scam, the question is whether or not it's a money laundering scheme for the German far right. The actual developer of the game, their involvement in prior Steam trade fraud schemes, and their connections to German far-right organizations, are all things that everyone has been overlooking instead focusing on the "scam game" aspect. But to my understanding... there isn't an upfront cost for it. There is no scam other than what you create for yourself. The bigger question is what all this benefits, and the answers should be VERY alarming to anyone with a conscience.

another detail not covered with the speculation angle on this is the creator of the game has their Steam inventory hidden meaning they could have given themselves an entire stash of the various "no longer obtainable" bananas which then can then sell later if the market takes off

One thing worth noting - For every transaction taking place on the Steam marketplace, the developer gets a cut. It might be a cent a piece, but high volumes do add up quick.

I think it is embarrassing for Valve to have this "game" high on their most-played games chart with 90%+ bots.

It's a very minor bigger fool scheme. I just don't like that it encourages people to leave their PC running all the night for nothing. Waste of energy.

"It's the 80s we miss Reagan don't we." Made me snort in the middle of the office.

You do have something to lose. You lose time. Time that could have been spent earning money faster and more effectively if you are after a grift.

I only heard of this gane yesterday. I didn't know about the rest of this stuff though? Thought it was just a click game. But this other stuff, It's kinda, well, bananas! 😂 I'm sorry, I'll see myself out...

the whole Banana moral theater is just us barking at the wrong tree, there's a far deeper issue & the Nanner market is just a symptom of a far deeper issue regarding the Skin Marketplace

It proves once and for all that NFTs do not need the blockchain and never did. That's all these are.

yes. maybe. probably. it's classified

I wouldn't necessarily call it a scam, but I do think it's predatory. Preying on people's skinner-box instincts and then using that reward system to have them engage in speculative markets doesn't feel like something you do when you have the consumer's best interests at heart. And for the real meat of this "game" to be in that speculative market of those steam inventory items is more than a little gross to me. I'm not gonna engage in that, and far be it from me to tell others what to do with their money, but I think I recognize a rotten banana when I see one.

The Tell-Tale marker that always marks a scam is how they will promise you the world and then some. Just like NFTs. So let's look at this banana game. Apparently the developer has said that it's a collection game and you should not use this as a stock market. They have promised to eventually add the ability to change the banana skin to one of the skins you own. And add other standard clicker features. My source is the Spiffing Brit's video on this. Basically they're not even promising you'll make money. Is there a promising you will have an item in your steam inventory and that's it. So far this fails the quintessential litmus test for a scam as they promised very little more than what you already have.

Frost, honest question without sarcasm or irony on it: Would you have the same opinion if this game was made by EA, ABK, Epic, Microsoft? Would you call for speculative regulation from goverments if this was made by them?

Sad this is what it is cause I thought the game was a gaming take on the famous post modern art piece of the banana tapped to the wall. Maybe, in a way, it still is. At least with the impact it’s having at this moment.

I have heard of the game Banana, and don't call me Shirley

This video is amazing as always, but that auction at the end was just phenomenal! Also hearing Frost speak this quickly makes me wish for an Aprils fool fully ramblomatic with frost and cold case with Yahtzee

How do these get started? Who bought the first banana, and why?

Corvette owner here. 1) there's no way he didn't know that lever was there 2) He could have removed the roof from the inside and gotten out that way. All Corvettes after 1967 have either T tops or targas, unless it's a high performance model Sounds like he had a medical emergency and passed out in the car

What bugs me about this that I only heard about after watching this video is how it's just another in a long trend of the financialization of every aspect of human life. Why have free time when you canndrive for Uber? Why have a pension when you can have a 401k? Why play a game when you can spend your time trading skins? There's nothing in modern life that can't be reduced to a stock market.

... I have never heard of Banana and I'm not sure it's real rather than made up for this video. I'm not going to search for it on Steam because if it is real, it's only a matter of time until that spooky thing happens where suddenly I do notice it now that I'm aware of it. But I want to see how long. The idea of a given product's value becoming independent from the tangible factors of practical benefit, raw materials and labour cost is, nevertheless, something I can understand people being concerned and aggrieved by. It does open up some troubling avenues, in principle. The only problem is the horse already bolted several decades ago, and indeed it is now the principle on which all major Western economies operate. Magically making money multiply into more money, with little backing it up. I think people's real problem with Banana (and likewise NFTs etc etc) is much more ideologically fundamental than if it's a "scam" or not, they just don't know how else to express it.

I never thought a Frost video would suddenly make me think of a Little Big song: Now oh let me me see you go bananas Oh let me see you go... I'm gonna nuts right now I'm gonna, I'm gonna fruits right now I'm gonna lose my mind I'm gonna, I'm gonna lose my mind Go bananas, be like banana man Go bananas, be like banana man Go bananas, be like banana man Go bananas, be like banana man

Seems like it's just NFTs all over again

I don't think it's a scam I just think it's boring. Or at least a lot of busy work and gambling to get some free money.

We should also really be talking about Razer's collaboration event - such a large corporation partnering with a non-game like this is very suspect

They'll just get bored of getting 3 cent nanners eventually

this take seems unusually warm for you

I regularly part with money to buy more books. Then the shelves to store these books. It's a vicious loop, but knowing my parents' home, it's a hereditary disease.

The thing about the banana is it doesn't get any more brazen than that, and STILL there are people who thought investing couple hundred bucks in it, solely on the assumption that there is someone out there willing to dig themselves even deeper hole for no reason other than greed. That's almost admirable-

Zealously rejecting any forms of perceived malice only serves to blind future generations to its existence, potentially making them easier prey. Regulate malice where it can have widespread impact, and warn against in milder cases.

Some people wonder the harm and saying its just loot/nfts something not mentioned in the video devs get a cut of every sticker sold

Keep in mind that the lowest sale value is the local currency version of 3 cents. Steam gets their cut, and the developer also gets their cut. The lowest you can get is 1 cent. Or, your local equivalent of 1 cent. This can add up quite quickly if someone buys a lot of bananas with, say, stolen credit cards and a seller account.

This reminds me of MMO from SMBC Theater. The game was literally just clicking a button to try and get the highest score in the world. Each click was a point. That was it. With the video, they launched the button and had a leaderboard as a joke. Some people gave it a shot, but you got nothing out of it.

Yes it is a scam. And big game companies are going to copy it.

See, I could've sworn Steam didn't allow NFT games on their platform, yet here we are.

I'm surprised nobody has called the currency 'potassium'.

2:02 vaporwave. It's supposedly _90s_ themed but the theme originates in the early 2010s. Although it also incorporates 80s and 70s elevator music and occasionally claims to be 80s inspired it almost always mid-late 90s things and ancient Greek stuff. Basically it's the feeling of nostalgia as a music genre.

I don't know what defines a scam, but anything that presents itself as a "get rich quick" scheme is just a test for fools that hopefully get wiser after they deservedly lost (a lot of) money. Unless they are already very rich of course, then almost anything works.

this almost seems like a piece of satire that went all the way

"Can we have NFTs?" "We have NFTs at home"

> AI search engine trains on videos from content creators like Zach > AI response is very similar to Zach's advice > "no way! Copilot says what i always say!!"

Using the Paul Tassi song really threw me off for a second. Had to make sure I wasn't playing something in another tab

This seems like a good idea to make a marketplace scam. Find one kind of banana and buy ALL of that one kind. Then mark up the price to whatever you want

The number of times you’ve said banana just cracks me up

Well Banana has now hit the trifecta of Spiffing Brit, Belular News and now Cold Take.

Whether it's a scam or not, it does gross me out...

Honestly it seems almost like a strange money laundering scheme. Otherwise just baffled by how much it blew up.

"no one's going hurt" that's not true. No way the people dropping 100s or 1000s are doing it using money they earned from steam, that's coming out of pocket, and another way to say "speculation" is "gambling", and gambling can and does ruin lives. I'm not sure where to draw the line legally, but ethically, choosing to create a gambling product is well over the line imo. sure, for most people it's just a bit of fun, but for a lot of people it's an all-consuming addiction, in a way that isn't really true of video games or funkos or whatever (except of course those video games that have gambling elements, like gacha)

'That's how the Internet works.' That MGS2 Finale got to ya huh Frost?

This scratched an itch I had in the back of my brain for years now. Really ever since Valve introduced the market place, but specifically when Space Engineers introduced the system where the regular drops in an otherwise singleplayer (capable) game gave you the 'chance' of getting an item of variable desirability. It's like the D3 auction house thing, but without in-game buffs. Now, SE kinda stuck to what seemed like an unspoken agreement where it's all good, as long as you just don't attract too much attention to it, but it seemed weird - given the automation available in games like that (as opposed to Blizzard's closed circuit in D3) you could program a bot to automatically go to a drop, poke the button, and BAM.. 1ct item. Rinse and repeat. I don't think that's economically *viable* , but it's still a weird loophole. The most important thing here, though, is that like with all of these things, scam or not, it's Valve who controls the Steam trades and skims off the top like a Real World game of EVE Online, and they use your computer's processing power to generate extra income in a way that isn't as blatantly destructive and obvious as NFTs or Crypto. I kinda can't hate on it - it's really quite brilliant, and with some 130 million active users, that's passive money generation that so far pretty much everyone agreed to participate in... 'because shiny'. GGWP

I'd managed to miss Banana and assumed the pic was a My Friend Pedro reference.

I fear the ones with a long-term plan, and I fear the ones with no plan whatsoever.

Frost: "What makes you part with money on a regular basis that others would consider wasteful? Video games? Funko pops? MTG cards?" Video games, Transformers, Yu-Gi-Oh! cards. Basically the makers of Banana have found a loophole for NFT speculation. They didn't autogenerate thousands of completely unique combinations of predesigned template images, they just made a handful of bespoke images and marked them for rarity. You might not have a 100% one of a kind banana, but you will have the chance for one that maybe only 100 people will ever get. Then again, NFTs were never 100% unique - the same image but with the mouth open vs closed or the eye color being different isn't _really_ all that unique. Yes, it's the only one exactly like that, but if you don't care about minor details it may as well be completely the same. It's the same here - technically every single instance of the normal yellow banana has a unique identifier associated to it, meaning they are technically nonfungible. But who cares? Those IDs are internal to Valve's databases. You can't see them, and even if you could you wouldn't be able to understand it beyond "this is a unique number." Like the VIN on a Toyota Corolla, all you see is that it's a slightly nice looking if also kinda dumpy midsize sedan.

4:35 telltale signs of a man on the banana take

The spectrum line of commerce/donation(gambling being the middle) is exploring new venues of using a function as a substitute for feeling like someone is progressing in life.

I'd posit that the blood of virgins also has no intrinsic value.

It's Banana: the NFT

Saw the thumbnail and thought this was gonna be a deconstruction/reemergence of "My Friend Pedro".

I wonder if the real game isn't the banana itself, but the marketplace stuff that revolves around it. To me, that would be actual gambling, but maybe not. I remember people saying games like Magic the Gathering and Yu-Gi-Oh are actually two games. One is the battle itself, and the other is the collecting to build the deck itself. I can see this banana game being the second part. Now I know the developer didn't intend this, but I could see a game where this can be a mechanic without the real world money involved. Just some food for thought. -No1

I didn't even know about this game until you brought it up, Frost, and now all I can I think about is your, ahem, banana.

Holy crap that auction at the end got me good.

I'm much more of a believer in "If it looks like a scam, it probably is". If we're really stupid, we'll help the scam work just so we can find out what the scam is.

A hearty congratulations to Frost for making 3 cents off of a picture of a banana.

Here we are, having learned nothing from that Tulip-thing the Netherlands once did to themselves.

It's hard to imagine the developer making this "game" for any other reason than "let me test the card/marketplace features, it's not like more than 3 people will play this (me, mom, bot)".