Continue the chat on WatchCrunch: www.watchcrunch.com/Max/posts/the-most-hyped-watch-of-2023-45965

Picked one up in Switzerland on holiday. Black dial. Love everything about it! It’s handsome, comfortable, reliable and 120 hrs power reserve! The Genta redesign is what makes this extra special. Wait a year and buy it used. I’ll take the hit. But this is a personal investment and a memoir of my first trip to Switzerland.

I looked at the black one at my AD this week and put it on my wrist. Stainless steel like the mark xx pilot. Same size as the mark xx. Same movement as the mark xx. Yet 80% more expensive. I couldn’t see the value Oh I nearly forgot to mention, you just can’t buy it, you need to put your name on the expression of interest list. (I thought I was at the Rolex AD)

Just got on the list for the aqua! This is going to be collectors piece absolutely beautiful in every respect! A bargain in my opinion when you consider the current market, IWC deserves much more respect in the industry! Stunning!!!!!

I think it's impossible to get over the price issue with this release, no matter how well the case and bracelet are executed. The biggest challenge is trying to ignore the fact that the same caliber movement is used in multiple other IWC models, including the new Mark XX which more than 50% less expensive at MSRP. The new Ingenieur doesn't even show the movement off as the caseback is closed. So ultimately, you are paying nearly $6000 extra dollars for a slightly more complexed dial and an integrated bracelet. The Mark XX is a great watch already and if you buy it on a bracelet, you could say you have a cut-price Ingenieur. This is definitely a cash grab, fueled by the never ending integrated sports watch hype and new customers splurging in the hope that their new IWC will be the next Nautilus or Royal Oak retirement investment

Hi, just wanted to share my friend’s interesting thoughts which I too mostly agree with that try to incapsulate the hoopla surrounding this new Ingeniuer (paraphrasing a little): I'm predisposed to like the watch (being an physicist who’s work had to do with high magnetic fields). This new model is well-designed (Genta and all), quite a "slim" feeling overall profile, a comfortable bracelet, good technical specs (albeit not as ground breaking magnetic resistance a la Master Chronometer). However, upon hands-on with it, when you put it on and look at the watch in the mirror, there's no je ne sai quoi. The emotive connection that underpins your impulse to get the watch. It's not that it’s boring - it has the right level of details but it doesn't pop, like an Rolex bracelet or a GS textured dial. I’ll admit that the light play of the checkered-like dial is unique as it looks interestingly different from different angles of light. The round porthole design is, well, a round porthole design. A ceramic bezel, or heck a ceratanium version of the watch, with Richemont's silicon bits now that various patents on Si are expiring, would be magical. I am glad I am not alone with this view. I don't feel anything for this model despite the hype and I was wondering why. It's like someone with all the nice features but when put together, it just doesn't pop for me? It could be that the overall look of it; looks very standard and typical of an Ingenieur. It’s nothing jaw droppingly special that would blow your mind. It may just be me, but I think I like my watches to be able to answer "what's special with this watch that you decide to part $$$ for it?" It's relatively easy to answer other models such as the Santos Dumont, several Rolexes, SpeedMasters and so on. But this Ingenieur - it's special because it has exceptionally high magnetic resistance as it is designed for engineers, it has a 5-days PR, it wears well, and it's the third integrated bracelet design by Genta, just don't really cut it. Which will lead to question such as, “Around the same price range, what else can I get which could be better than this or can connect better with me?”. The Ingenieur, just needs to stand out more for other good reasons. I like it but the story behind it, might be just on “par”. I’ll just be blunt and say that if it was price much lower, at say USD$7.5-10k range, it would have been more acceptable at status Quo. I'm philosophically objecting to an "engineer's watch" without class-leading anti-magnetism, above all the other reasons, especially when Tudor and Omega have "standard" watches at 15,000 gauss resistance. (I realise this is a pedantic argument, academic even, but if we're not arguing about specs like dive limits and water resistance, where is the fun?)

Got the call for my aqua dial! 🎉 It is stunning! Love the design language and brushed and polished light play... it fits sleek like a Daytona and is even slimmer. Taking it out of the box was nothing like the videos. Has to be held to be fully appreciated so if you like it in the videos, you're going to be blown away in person.

Since I’m in the queue, this only heightens my enthusiasm. Also, I don’t mind the wait because I bought a Mark XV 18 years ago and have a great experience with their customer service department and now their Boutique.

Just tried this on at an AD today; honestly, once you have it on wrist you’ll realize why IWC is asking $12k - also, it now has a waitlist.

Beautiful watch. Unfortunately, to expensive and there are better options at that price point.

I’m amused reading all the usual complaints that the watch is overpriced largely based on the movement being used. I own the Aqua Ingenieur and the one thing it’s doing that really bothers me most is it’s had the effect of “downgrading” my Czapek Antartctique, which is double the price of the IWC because it has a “better” movement and is from an indie house, however the IWC is considerably better finished and arguably better looking too.

I’ve agreed with many of your videos Max, but not this time I’m afraid. I have a GO seventies panorama date which is also an integrated steel sports watch with an incredible design, superb finishing, amazing movement and a class leading micro adjustable bracelet. For half the price. And it’s twice the watch. Zenith’s defy is a similar watch to this and about a third of the price of the titanium version. From an excellent brand with great heritage. Christopher Ward’s 12 is literally ten times cheaper and I suspect it is not ten times worse. Quite possibly not too far behind. Forget the genta thing. Take that away for a second. Imagine this is a microbrand watch. 14k? Really?! Personally I don’t think heritage is an acceptable reason to grossly inflate the price of a watch by such an extreme amount. Apologies for any grievances caused. Not personal, just a humble opinion

I think it’s good, but the price will probably keep a lot of people away from it. $12k is still a lot of money. You could fly to Europe and visit IWC’s factory for a week for that kind of money. You could maybe even buy their 36mm pilot watch as well and still have money leftover!

IWC missed a great opportunity to revive the Ingenieur in a proper way! They should have put in an in-house movement, finished it well and exhibited through an open case back. They did none of that and to make matters worse, they then slapped a $12K price tag… what a joke!

Look, it’s a nice-looking watch. I’m sure it’s well made (although I still think it’s too large;38.5mm would have been perfect). However (here it comes), the movement is the same Baumatic 5-day movement you can get in a B&M for a quarter of the price (never mind its origins). And I’m sorry but the initials IWC meant something very rude in my school playground many years ago long before I’d heard if the brand. I simply can’t think past that 😂.

I've waited years for a modern version of the 76 original Ingenieur. Having handled one in person, this is the one watch released in 2023 I'll buy which I can actually get.

I would get the Zenith Defy, it has better and more interesting movement. It's also cheaper as well. Otherwise, I'd go for a grey market GP Laureato in this price range.

Let us not talk about prices. Given this is not going to be your only watch, convince me the IWC Ingénieur will make you happier than rocking a Ch Ward Twelve.

I'd love to see comparison between this and Alpine Eagle

I’m really struggling to see why a portugieser yacht club with steel bracelet isn’t better value at the price tbh. I do like this but comparing the two at the respective prices it’s really hard to see where the money has gone. Both will have the same levels of finishing and one is way more complex movement wise. It’s a lot for an integrated bracelet imo.

Firstly, awesome video and channel, subscribing now! I recently bought an IWC Big Pilot 43 and was close to getting this one instead, I think it’s worth the £10k, tried in on at IWC and it’s beautiful, I understand the criticism but I have a feeling this will be the best selling watch of the year. A lot of celebs have bought it. *Hot Take* I’d love to see IWC bridge the gap into luxury and make this in Rose Gold or full Yellow Gold one day with a champagne or off white dial 👌🏾

Fun fact: Gerald Genta also designed the Omega Seamaster Polaris line. Yes lot of then are quartz, but can get them for about $1000

Sorry, the price is a joke, and this video only further adds credibility to industry brands that are becoming infatuated with upscaling their offering prices without improving the product in kind.

I do like the watch, however its way too expensive for what it is. With only a three hander and date complication, this, in my opinion, should be max $7K. Definitely a pre-owned buy in the future, and let someone else take the initial hit.

I did not know the Ingenieur had a 120 hr power reserve. That is incredible and IWC is not doing a good job advertising this fact. For some, that power reserve is a game changer.

Let the secondary market dictate the true value of this watch.

Great take. Interested how you would feel about it if the genta name wasn’t attached.

I’m picking up the white one in a couple days I already put 30% deposit on it. Is it overpriced? Yes. Is it a nice watch? Yea it’s really nice and fits great on the wrist 😊

I'm still looking at the Christopher Ward Twelve.

I agree that this watch is well-executed in every aspect: design, ergonomics, movement specs. I’ll even go so far as to say it’s my favorite Genta-inspired modern IB watch. That doesn’t change the fact that it’s still a huge premium to pay for a bracelet that attaches to the case differently than IWC’s other models. A bracelet is not a horological feature, it’s a thing that secures a watch to your wrist. For this money, you could get complications, stunning movement decoration, or in some cases, a customized piece from an independent brand.

The problem isn't that the movement is off-the-shelf, it's that it's a crap movement. I had a Mark XX with that same movement that had to be serviced twice in its first 6 months. Forget COSC, IWC won't even publicly state an accuracy range for it at all. IWC took mine in under warranty when it was running more than 20 seconds off, but it still only managed 7 seconds a day after the full tear-down service. The movement also has also has a glitch where the minute-hand jumps when you pull out or push in the crown during setting, something IWC said was normal and wouldn't repair. I think it's totally legitimate to criticize dumping this movement--as you say, one available in $1k Baume & Mercier models-into a 5-figure IWC. It would be a legitimate criticism if a movement this unreliable and glitchy were in a Seiko 5.

Good call on the E46 M3 - in Alpine White its perfect. The aqua dial version in person is stunning 👍

I believe that IWC should have priced it around $20,000. It would work better as a price marketing strategy.

This video does a good job of explaining why this is a good watch … at $8500

I’d still like to see it in person, always having a Mark XX, it’s a pretty hard sell for double the money. Got the GP Laureato in green instead.

It's a great looking watch! Hopefully I'll get a chance to try one on, but that price point and non macro-adjustable clasp (so far) makes it doubtful I'll ever own one. Thanks for the review.

I’m sorry this video just tries to validate the recent practices of the watch industry in general. There has been a collective initiative by all the manufacturers to justify price increases and MSRP’s that are not in line with inflation or with what the previous generation of collectors is used to seeing in mid to high end watch releases. JLC is doing the same with their high price increases on their base Reverso small seconds which is now over $10k. That’s like a $3k -$4k increase in over as many years. And there is no way anyone should be paying more for this IWC than a Reverso. Don’t let them fool or gaslight you into thinking these watch price hikes are justified or worth it.

Hard to justify the purchase of this watch if one can get an unworn Sub Date in the grey market at the same price level which beats this watch on every level

I don't have the chance to spend one week with it but only 15-20 minutes in the boutique. Honestly it doesn't excite me especially with the whopping price tag and possibly "waiting list" game.

Great vid! Can you do a comparison vs the baumatic riviera (translucent saphire dials, not the one you pictured)? Likely the same 4K 120hr movement, +/- .5 seconds per day or less - better than my Omega Diver 300. I have the 42mm black dial and LOVE it on my 7.5" wrist.

Full disclosure. I’m a huge IWC fan. Own, or have owned, multiple Pilot, Portofino and Portugieser watches. The Ingenieur has yet to find a place in my collection. Is that about to change? The jury is still out. I’m waiting for it to be released to the boutiques before I decide. But my prejudice is that it’s overpriced by $2-2500. But then again, I paid 10 grand for a 43mm Big Pilot. So maybe it’s not. Stay tuned.

I tried on this watch at the boutique and it’s an amawesome creation. I really don’t care for integrated bracelet watches but this one fits like a glove. However the movement in this watch can be found in the IWC mark 20 and other watches at a much cheaper price. Great watch but the price cannot be justified

Good video and I think a direct comparison to a Girard Perregaux Laureato would be interesting!

I am very satisfied with your review

I’m starting to warm to it I have to admit. But ultimately I think the Zenith completely trumps it (especially when factoring in price)

A Tissot PRX automatic has most of the things that one does at a fraction of the price.

Question is why IWC didn't just cram in the 82000 series movements. It's fully inhouse AFAIK and would probably be a good place to start using them outside of their BP43's

This is a very beautiful watch. At the price it is if I could afford this watch I would be tempted to put my other watches away and wear just this watch.

My big giant Tudor GMT Chunkmaster Flex with 15mm slab sided thickness and only 70 hour Power Reserve will eat this Gentrafied homage for breakfast. All joking aside this is a nice watch with the dial, movement and 120 hour power reserve. Not sure why everyone is griping about the price , it seems to offer excellent value. The whole waitlist thing at dealers may make it seem more exclusive and it very well may increase in value. If Casio made a Nautilus this would be it.

Great video but IWC was a dollar short and a day late with joining the Genta remake train.

Great analysis. Thank you.

Really nice watch, if i had the money i would buy it. Iwc is a special brand, you will only understand when youve owned an iwc. Half the people on a budget flight wear Rolex nowadays, there is no exclusivity with Rolex anymore, they are everywhere and most are fake.

Great video. You just sold me on one

One of the biggest knocks on IWC is the price, especially for Flieger watches.

I know people gravitate toward novelties, but an extra $1,800 and you could buy an IWC Portugieser Yacht Club Chronograph on a bracelet. If required, I would just eat beans for awhile and get the Yacht Club.

Not sure if I will ever being willing to drop the cash but I love this watch (on black of course). Maybe one day.

good idea ! tooth pics much less likely to scratch that lovely strap. good review . it is a bit pricey id rather go for the portofino or portugeiser models chrono dials .

Good stuff max. Sweet shots too. I wasn’t blown away by it when handling it quickly. But I’m happy to be wrong if I could spend some Time with it. I don’t think it’s overly expensive but I feel they could have made it Under 10k and we would have seen a mega hit getting more new iwc clients

The most I'll pay for this watch is 🤔 $400.00 dollars yeah! that's it................

I’d love to know what somebody like Rodger Smith thinks about this. this is the whole issue with watch movements and discussions about movement manufacture. The truth of the matter is when you get to about 4000 English pounds you have reached a certain point where beyond that there is an awful lot of overpriced watches, JLC and grand Seiko might be different, but when it comes to a steel sports watch it’s ridiculous. It’s a fantastic watch with beautiful finishing, but it is a mass produced steel sports watch and that means it’s worth £6000.

Hmm..come on now, I think you are a little tentative in your critique for this one for reasons probably you won’t admit. I will say this new Ingenieur is a nice watch which I’ve seen in person but there is no getting around the price point. Whatever specs of the movement you stated for the Ingenieur, are the exact same as the Baumé & Mercier Riveira, which is also COSC certified. Secondly, perhaps you have left out the price comparison with the IWC Mark XX on bracelet. Again, exact same movement and material but the Ingenieur is 80% more expensive than the Mark XX MSRP.

Bruh…did they pay you to say this? For 10-14k you get an amazing Rolex. That’s the price point we’re talking about. Compare this one to the Omega Aquaterra in terms of quality, movement and price and explain to me why I would spend this money on a stainless steel watch?

Great review as always. You won me over on this watch, but, that movement 😢

True it doesn’t have a gold rotor because you’re not paying Patek money, but then again you’re not paying Baumé et Mercier money either so the movement shouldn’t be “off the shelf”, top or not! $12K+ should give you something that separates it from others in its collection or group.

Integrated bracelet design doesn't give you the ticket to demand any price you think you can charge , they got it all wrong, even the proportions are not right let alone thickness , even the lugs design is frankly out of place here . I think IWC missed a great opportunity .

I would get the IWC Mark XX on a bracelet instead. The Ingenieur is a nice watch, no question about it but not that much nicer in order to cost twice as much.

Reworking an already existing movement should never be called "in-house". Where do you draw the line? Is adding your own custom rotor to an otherwise unchanged movement also in-house? In-house should only be used for a movement that you designed and built yourself. Everything of it. Especially when you have the nerve the charge a few thousands extra because it is "in-house". A fool is easily parted with his money...

So tired of the integrated bracelet trend. I understand that IWC has crafted and great watch. Tired of the aesthetic. It feels played out, not unlike Tag Heuer in the 80s/ 90s… Just because a watch is exclusive due to it’s price doesn’t mean that the aesthetic is suitable. Not a fan of the PRX. I love Direnzo, but not a fan of their integrated offering…

I STILL don't get the price. Zenith Defy seems a better value for money to me.

No, its still incredibly overpriced. Stainless steel watches exceeding $3k is just ridiculous IMHO. And the fact that its an off the shelf movement, regardless of how high that shelf is, makes it even worse. So what exactly justifies the price tag?

I like your taste in cars. I owned an S2000 and a C6 Corvette over the years.

if you are merely likely the bluish tint dial and not so bothered by the integrated bracelet ,just get a Seiko Ginza LE alpinist (also mentioned previously in this channel by Max) .... maybe can get it around 2k dollars or even under. (despite the original retail at around or under 1K USD). no matter how good this watch mentioned here is , it ain't work 12K dollars period!

I didn’t say “this is an $8500 watch”. I said “this is a $5500 watch”.

just ordered the titanium model from boutique two weeks ago, was advised the ETA be 2024 Q2/Q3

Great video. I would love to see one in person and try one on. That always seems like the largest obstacle to anything I see online and have an interest in.

You mispelled E46. It's E36. Joking aside, beautiful presentation and watch! Thank you

Not a fan of this watch….but integrated bracelets don’t float my boat.

Nice presentation as always but for me IWC never interested me, I feel in general that IWC is way over priced for what you get. I stick with SINN for now. 😊

Perfect and lovely, but expensive I think, as well as the others. Bb54 for me by now. To your question: Could be overhyped becarse it is wanted to be appreciated? 3500€ could be overhyped..

Ugh..... it's so beautiful.

Oh my God, I made my comments before I’d watched all of this video and when I’d watched all of it I felt totally justified. This is a 6K Steel sports watch.

If glazing/d riding was a video.. “this wears better than a nautilus” 😭

Hoping they start shipping soon. I paid for Aqua on Mar 27 to get one of first 10 at my boutique. All watches are overpriced so that's not really a thing for me. Thanks for the macro video, it's been impossible to see this level of detail until now.

It doesn’t have silicon hairspring. Richemont was chastised before once already by swatch-rolex-patek consortium when they used silicon hairspring in 5 days baumatic. But they are allowed to use silicon pallet fork and escape wheel which is what is inside 32111.

Too much negativity here about price. There’s really not much that can compare design wise imo in the 11.5 price range. If you can’t afford it, move on. It’s really that simple. If you want a cheaper watch, get a Rolex. Even then, you’ll have people complaining about the price of a sub at 8.5. The Cartier Santos may be a better compromise. I love my Casio F91W-1 and wear it 4 days a week while I treat patients and enjoy 3 days of a lux watch. Let’s be real, anything more than that Casio and the concept of value is subjective. Just placed a deposit for the Ingenieur. I am excited for it! Fits perfectly on my 8.5in wrist. No need to take away links. It’s the first watch I’ve felt that fits my wrist perfectly. People from 6.5”-8.5” wrist reviewers have all said this which makes the watch sound very versatile and comfortable for an integrated bracelet watch. I’d gladly pay a few thousand more for that comfort, those lovely crown guards, the dial, and adding diversity to my collection.

Love this piece, but I respectfully disagree. All the positives of this watch still don’t justify the price.

Nice Video. I Love you work man.

Would love to know if this is 8 times better than the Christopher Ward 12? Perhaps an idea for a future video!!!👍

Sorry, I'm not convinced. I agree that each generation should be better than the previous. Raising the price by the amount they did is to me, still a money grab. Breguet recently did the same with the Type XX.

Hade a few Rolex on my wrist for some twenty year’s ended up with the yacht-master which I am happy with my one understated. But the brand is everywhere advertising on F1 or Wimbledon and to me not so special any more and to be honest they aren’t very customer friendly attitude. I am sick of so many bloggers ( not this channel) with so called experts who know nothing and I am looking for a different watch. I don’t collect watches I have my one on my wrist but high end been looking and to be honest only a few I would purchase this IWC ingenieur is they only one. Understated but if you know about watches you know as for price if I trade my Rolex in it’s not that expensive and taking that it probably need a service even better. But this IWC is in a class of it’s own …..And makes me happy after all we don’t own the watch we are just custodians of it.

This is a market case, I dont deny it looks great but inside their own brand, there is a previous ingenieur the IW 323906, with genta DNA, good specs. Take a look and price aside it makes us think......

I still prefer the GP Laureato's balance of angles and bevels, for my taste it's just the better watch with a finer movement.

makes the old (2000's) Ingenieur models seem like a good deal. looking to scoop titanium AMG model for under 4k

I might go for a GP Laureato instead of this IWC.

Which hype? As soon as IWC announced the price of this ingenieur, all potential hype vanished. If they wanted to be greedy they could have priced it at 9000CHF, but 12K??? Yeah sure 😂

JMHO - Price too high for what it is - prefer the GP Laureato which offers incredible value - particularly on the secondary market.

Does the bracelet did into your wrist? (4:27)

“Screw you Doug”! Priceless (subbed)

An OK looking watch for mine. That it sits aesthetically between PO and Nautilus is a meh for me as I'm not a fan of either. Compared rationally to the Mark XX it is clearly over-priced, and loving your videos as I always do, you haven't swayed me on this one, Max. I take your point on actually getting one in hand, but I'm not going to.

Too expensive. Great vid. Thnx