a Catholic and a Protestant walk into a bar... and have a genuinely good conversation!

When this series started, I was a Protestant. Now I’m Catholic and have a child named after a saint

"I never discuss anything except politics and religion. There is nothing else to discuss." - G.K. Chesterton

"Not at one point have you made me feel like I'm your enemy... That's so enjoyable because I just want to know". This exact moment, right here. That moment when you talk about something gracefully that the rest of the world is screaming their heads off about. That moment of two people giving each other the benefit of the doubt and talking about a deep issue. I agree with the smile they both had on their faces at that moment. It really does feel good. To have a genuine discussion instead of just wailing on each other with the logs sticking out of our eyes. Needs to happen more often so thank you Matt.

I thoroughly enjoyed this as a revert Catholic. Thanks for showing how to talk about difficult things in a respectful way. God Bless you both

I’d like to see more of Doctor Holmes here in the future. He’s made me seriously consider the suppositions of the Catholic faith.

19 months later, we finally made it.

I'm glad you addressed the heated topic, which is the waffle fries. And you did well on the video topic too. Really enjoyed the series, thank you

Literally a convo between the most Protestant looking man and the most catholic looking man in the world.

Thank you for wanting to hear and understand what the Catholic Church teaches.

This has been an amazing series! Thank you for sharing such an enlightening conversation Matt, it’s been great. As a Catholic, your approach to ecumenism and honest questioning has been very helpful. God Bless!

This was joy-inducing. Thank you. My daughter fell away from her faith for a while and now is back stronger than ever. It’s funny because she began watching your channel and in particular this discussion. She’d been doing a lot of reading and research and she loved your channel, but this conversation in particular. I had gone to visit her last year and she and I both wanted to share this video series with each other! lol We didn’t know each other had been watching it. She’s made her general confession with her parish priest, a very solid and orthodox young man. She’s been trying to go to daily Mass when her work and school schedule allows. And she’s now working with Catholic hospice and the chaplain for a Catholic hospital near where she lives. Thank you for conducting not only this conversation, but all your conversations with grace and love. You promote Christian unity and that is beautiful in this difficult life.

As a Catholic I'm so glad you did this series. I loved it immensely and Dr. Holmes is wonderful at explaining nuance in a very approachable way. Thank you both so much.

I'm a Catholic, and I have so much appreciated the content of this channel, especially when you speak to people of other traditions. This series has been awesome. It's great to see such healthy dialogue. This is what the world needs. Thank you Matt

I'm honestly a bit sad to see this series come to a close but I've really enjoyed it and I hope to see more conversations between yourself and Dr. Holmes at some point in the future. May God bless you both.

As a Protestant pastors/missionary kid, your videos are wonderful fodder for conversation I get to have with my friends and my wife. Your videos are much appreciated. I now look for opportunities to walk in and visit as many churches I can. I love that “high church’s” tend to be fairly open throughout the week. I wish more Protestant churches were as open to the public. I feel it could open the church to the community.

I have enjoyed these discussions. As a protestant who lives in an area where there is not a large population of Catholic's I am in the process of learning. I have worked with local Catholics in areas of ministry and have a respect for the demonstration of their faith. This past year travelling for work I have found that the Catholic Channel on radio and EWTN have been a refuge for me from the negativity that politics and the pandemic helped generate on even the entertainment and sports radio stations. Along with these videos my respect and consideration for those practicing the Catholic faith has grown. I have visited the local Parish and initiated a friendship with the local Priest who serves three Parish's in our rural community. Rather than arguing and debating to try to prove spiritual superiority if we could have open discussions it is such a refreshing approach.

Catholic here who has tuned into your channel a lot and been keeping up with your content: this is amazing and I love it! Keep it up and I can't wait to see more from you! God Bless you!

"we'll do it again sometime..." okay Matt, how about a quarterly, continuing series? You and Jeremy have done a ton of good by these conversations and I suspect a great number of your audience shares that sentiment. Christ's Peace, bro'!

Looooved this series! I’m a newish Christian and it’s been very informative and interesting!

Thanks you two. I'm not religious in any sense but have enjoyed being a fly on the wall for this series. No matter what we believe we can still hear each other out and be kind. Cheers!

The one final statement you made, and I paraphrase, "We all believe in the same God". That, my brother is the tie that binds, and something both Protestant and Catholic should share the embrace. I am a Catholic in the Bible belt, and I also enjoy conversations with many open minded Protestants, that are comfortable to have a conversation knowing I am not trying to convert them, but to understand our prospective denominations better. Thank you both for being True Christians in word and deed.

I wish there were more conversations like this. There used to be more angry conflict in place of conversations before our time, but now indifferentism reigns which is arguably worse.

I am a Catholic myself,thank you for your videos. This is a great video of two Christian brothers with different views on Christianity having a very respectful conversation. I personally am horrified at the things the Catholic church has done in the name of Christ. Thankfully that church went out a very long time ago. I apologise to all Christians of other faiths that our church did these things to other believers. On one hand the church was trying to defend its authority and stop what they believe was heretical. It will never excuse what the church did. I hope we can bring our belief in Jesus Christ together and share it as brothers and sisters in Jesus name. Thank you gentleman for showing how it is meant to be done.

Matt, thank you for making this! This series has just been so good, beautiful, and enlightening. It’s been an absolute pleasure to get to watch you guys hash it out and discuss everything!

Praying for Matt to realize the fullness of our faith and to come home to the Catholic Church.

Great and respectful conversation. As a Catholic I enjoyed this series. Congratulations.

I am married to a Catholic woman and we are raising our kids Catholic. I was raised Protestant (COC) and later became Atheist open to Agnosticism. I met my wife after that period of my life. I am beginning RCIA next month. I say all that to say this... It is mutually respectful conversations such as these that will further either initiative or purpose. To engage, believing another's agenda to be evil, will never end productively. To engage believing the other has no agenda is naïve, at best. To engage in an effort to better understand your own position by listening to another's is the birth of wisdom. I thank you both for your willingness to hear and to speak and to publish those interactions. If only we could meet in this manner politically... One must entertain the thought that we, even on opposing spectrums religiously, may be able to show an example to our leaders that "We, the People" have figured out how to get along. We're just waiting for them to catch up. If we could ever achieve that, I believe we would be on the right track to moving forward nationally and rejoining a global initiative for peace. You both set a fine example as well as the other guests on this channel and I thank you.

I love how Dr. H responds! He explains without excuses and he doesn't look for the speck in his friends eye. This is a really balanced approach to a very common objection.

"The practice and the art of substantive conversation about real things that matter." With master practitioners Whitman and Holmes! I'm from 'one side' of the convo and also never felt dissed.

Matt, this is what heaven will look like: everybody talking about the 500 assumptions we had on this side of life. From a Catholic, God bless you my friend.

Cried a wee bit at the end. Thanks for the convo! 🙏

I just finished this series and I wanted to say how much I enjoyed it and am sad to see it come to an end. I love when I’m able to see people have fruitful, civil, and intelligent discussions about topics that we often only engage in within our safe echo chambers. I enjoy your channel in general would very happily watch any more videos you two decide to make together in the future.

I am not a person of faith myself, but I am so happy that I found this channel! I am someone that is extremely interested in history and the parts Christianity has played in history are very important in my eyes. This channel is a magnificent source for someone like me to learn about important views on faith and views held by those of faith that may have defined the views of people hundreds of years ago. This adds so much more perspective to the history that I love to learn! Thank you so much for what you do!

Great video Matt realy enjoyed the series, would be great to see more conversation like this in the future :) keep up the great work !

Great series! I’ve genuinely enjoyed your curiosity and ecumenism as a Protestant Evangelical who also loves studying the faith. I feel that you are a kindred spirit in this way.

One of the best channels on YT. Thanks a lot brother.

Enjoyed this series so much. Thank you for the respectful conversation. God bless you.

@10.37 "If my people were in charge, we never would have done that" only they did. Look at the protestant treatment of the Irish - nailing the doors shut of houses in the middle of the night and setting fire to them as just one example.

Matthew this has been a thrill ride of a discussion's!! It's bitter sweet of a eating. Bitter being that it had to end. Hope there is something more you two could do. Best of whishes to the both of you God Bless.

I really appreciated Dr. Holmes' explanation of how our instincts were different in premodern times. The separation between religion and government and culture that we take for granted now is actually such a recent shift. And it makes sense that in a more premodern era when people were trying to have Catholic nations, what you do with people who threaten the catholicity of the country would lead to violence that was acceptable then but isn't now due to our ways of thinking. Thank you very much for this conversation that exposed me to a whole new point of view!

Great series Matt! You both embody the saying, "Wise men still seek Him."

May I interject a thought? In the context of the brutality of Christians in history (and not the just war topic), I believe we are NOT a nicer and less barbaric culture. In fact, we are more barbaric. In the middle ages, death and violence was meted out for an enemy--or law breaker. It was considered swift justice. Today, we destroy our own children in pursuit of our own happiness. We have lost all nobleness (even seeming) in our violence. We slaughter millions of the innocent unborn children a year and that is far more brutal than any other time in history. One quarter to one third of our population are killed via the womb by the child's own parents. Nothing in human history equals this. Going outside a Christian culture we can even go to the pagan societies and compare their child sacrifice to ours. While there WERE times children were sacrificed to the gods, again, this wasn't the decision of the parents, and it was done for the good of the people. They believe that IF they didn't sacrifice their children to the gods, they would all die. We are such a calloused and arrogant culture that we have deceived ourselves into thinking we have become a less barbaric and "nice" people. Not to justify true barbarity in the past, but we are incredibly white-washing our own culture if we think we have evolved in this arena.

Should do another one of these, can't find anything from Dr. Holmes on YT and I love these types of conversations. I learn the most seeing the differences hashed out like this, honestly.

Brother Matt, keep up this ministry of the Word in bite size form, it is wonderful and much needed, may the Lord Jesus Christ bless you

The joy you guys exhibit when you talk about this stuff is contagious. It really does conjure hope for building up the religious divide when seemingly very different Christians can have a peaceful, productive discussion.

Matt, I stumbled on your channel and find it to be absolutely fascinating! I am a born and raised, Catholic who is still devout to this day, as are my husband and kids. Dr Holmes is a brilliant man and is obviously an expert at explaining some very difficult nuances about our faith. I do think, however, you might want to reach out to a Jesuit and dig into their mindset. They come from a different place, a different headspace, and have incredible perspective on Catholicism. They are wonderful “teachers” of the church, and are practical in their approach. There is nothing like a good Jesuit sermon!!

Great video Matt!

Really great series, enjoyed it!!!

“Can we promote the practice and the art of substantive conversation about real things that matter?” 💞 Thank you both so much!

Dedicating my daily rosary to your conversion man. Let’s bring you home!

Matt, thank you so much for these videos. They are a joy to watch! Neither of you are proselytising, or wanting to win an argument at all costs, or getting so defensive that you want to tear each others heads off i.e. the "normal" interaction between Protestant and Catholic. How could it not be productive for two Christians to sit and sanely engage with each other about our common faith and our common humanity - having been made in the image of God, to know, love and serve Him? And what if we never agreed entirely on doctrine, but still achieved, by the grace of God, a loving, committed unity between brother and sister that would stun the world?

The final installment 😭. Why is this not open ended????? How about a be continued at least.....

Thank you .......... wonderful discussion Expecting more Parts ~~God bless ~~

sad the series is over. Love it!

Can't wait to watch.

I discovered your channel in January 2023. One suggestion I have is that with these several part videos include in the title some way to identify part one, part two, etc. I am trying to find part 3 right now but I have to open all of them.

love those talks. thanks Matt!

Matt, I join others in thanking you for an intelligent and sensitive approach to other communities of believers.

Wow, what a graceful conversation. I learned a lot, thanks!

Great job guys! It's been a real pleasure listening to you. 🍻

Thanks so much for these amazing dialogues!! Brilliant example of genuine ecumenical exchange that doesn’t give up on truth but is conducted in love and a deep hope that we might get closer to familial unity. God bless you Matt and thank you for your ministry

I really like what you are doing man! Great show and dialogue. Learned a lot from this. 👌🏻

Great series, Matt. As a former Landerite, I love seeing the Gannet Grill again and remembering epic Fourth of July's on Main Street. Thank you for the excellent conversation with Dr. Holmes and the humble spirit you both approached difficult topics with.

Hi Matt, Thank you and Dr. Holmes for your wonderful Catholic/ Protestant series, i was really blessed by the discussion, Thank You for your respectful and loving conversation. ...richard

Great series! If only all us Christians could sit down and ask thoughtful questions. In a loving caring way. My belief is absolute power no matter a state or religion will eventually aggress against those who disagree because it's a threat to their power.

It's been enjoyable listening to people versed in the history and your differences in thoughts. I'll have to get around to educating myself more on that aspect. I've read the NT for the first time, on many levels I feel inspired by God, Christ and the apostles. I look forward to learning more and revisiting the NT after reading the OT.

Great conversation!!

this was very enlightening thank you❤️

I just caught up on all these today bc i just found the channel so this is perfect!

I am still hoping for Part 5, where you actually eat your wings! But in all seriousness, wonderful and beautiful stuff - thank you!

Thoroughly enjoyed this series, was raised Catholic at 31 started attending Protestant church with my wife, now I feel I've been blessed with both after 32 years of attending Protestant churchs and now retired I am attending Mass during the week and Worship service's on Sunday. Thanks again for airing your series.

Literally so amazing to have an example of how to talk to people with differing opinions. I have leaned Protestant my whole life and I still do. But now, and after some conversations with my own friends and my own studies, I understand from the Catholic view. It seems like there has been a divide made between the two parties that has grown to something crazy.

Another one so soon? You're spoiling us, Matt!

I am just starting the video and I know this is about violence within the Catholic Church but it is kinda annoying that this topic is always brought up by protestants without acknowledging the tremendous amount of horrible violence in protestant circles like the protestant "inquisition"

As an atheist, from a Christian and Catholic family, this was a very educational series. Dialogue between people who dont always agree is definitely something society needs.

Hi Pastor Whitman and Dr. Holmes, I deeply respect both of you and appreciate your willingness to sit together and discuss all these things. Earnestly, thank you so much for doing so. May I ask each of you to clarify which point in the timeline you meant in the time of your conversation as modernity and today vs. what is in the past and no longer our time? There were references in your conversation to centuries past and antiquity, but some more clear boundary would help. I feel this distinction is important to make, as since the time of your conversation and now, there have been the uncovering of over a thousand unmarked graves and abusive and torturous treatment of indigenous children at many residential boarding schools on this continent. These schools were operated by Catholic and Protestant churches, under the consent and direction of both the USA and Canadian governments, for the express purpose of cultural destruction. Some of the survivors of those schools are still in the land of the living and are sharing their stories today. It's also important as there are some people of the cloth on both sides who have had recently recorded public messages indicating that they are for causing harm and death to fellow Creator-image-bearing humans, and they are not compelled to immediately cease such talk. Again, I appreciate your conversation and breaking bread with each other. This kind of thing is so vital to do in order to be One as our God is One.

I think the conversation at 14:30 is a worthwhile train of thought. Notably, character and pattern of life is unfailingly connected to the gospel message in the New Testament. Suffering for righteousness by a godless society is vindicated and puts it to shame. A mismatch between message and behavior results in an understandable criticism and resentment, especially when Christianity rises to places of political power.

I would love to hear a conversation like this with the other side of the great schism (Orthodox). This has been a great talk with a very knowledgeable person from the Catholic tradition!

Great video! There you go, two great topics for future discussion videos: christianity vs modernity and christian social thought. I believe the presbyterian and lutheran traditions have a pretty well developed theoretical framework for these matters. The catholic view is well defined with it's own manual about social doctrine. Orthodoxy obviously have a pretty clear teaching on church-state relations. I would enjoy a good sitdown to compare evangelical, high church protestant and catholic/orthodox POV's.

I loved this discussion

The whole series, like Matt's other work was full of compassion. However, this last question appeared to focus on violence from Catholics, without acknowledging the opposite too. There was violence and blood on all sides of this argument; however whoever was in power Protestant or Catholic, the violence was often for personal power grab reasons. The religion was not the reason, it may have been the excuse. the conflation of the religion being the focus I believe obscures the true purpose of those in power. Thanks Matt and Dr. Holmes for your continued work and exploration of these issues.

Refreshing to see respectful conversation. I think it is quite fair to say the Kings and Queens of Europe had a more than significant roll in these things. Ironically most people overwhelmingly sought to be tried for their offences by the Church courts because of fairer treatment and mercy they offered. Much of our judicial foundations are established by the Church during those times.

God bless you both

I was raised Protestant, in various denominations, and converted to Catholicism after I met my wife who was Catholic. After converting, I was amazed at the amount of negativity thrown my way from Protestant family and friends. It is just plain ignorance. I love what you are doing here Matt! I would love to see you and Matt Fradd have a conversation. When people ask about what is my religion, my answer has always been "Christian." The title of Protestant or Catholic does not define my relationship with the Lord, because Jesus is above all things. I pray for the day when ALL CHRISTIANS can be united. Seek first to understand and don't be scared to learn the reasons why we Christians do what we do. God Bless

this was wonderful.

Great conversation. Any chance you can tell us what brand of flannel that is?

Thank you for not including obnoxious chewing sounds in your videos. The mark of a true believer.

Time to see the whole conversation again in one seat...

Also as Catholic I learn so much from my Protestant Brothers and Sisters.

You should have included at least one bite at the end ;)

Let's be real we are here because we want to know what happened to those waffle fries. Where there eaten? were there not? WE NEED TO KNOW!! No but in all seriusness this was a great conversation I have been binge watching super interesting conversation after super interesting conversation. I come from a catholic background but I don't profess any faith.Still I find it fun to hear this good hearted conversations .

I'm super grateful to Dr. Holmes for jumping on the program! His first answer regarding a national religion and the "danger" of a diverging (my language) teacher who is picking up momentum seems oddly reminiscent of the rationale that ultimately sent Jesus to the cross, doesn't it? Or did I miss something?

Hi Matt I really enjoy your shows. I'm a Catholic and I find these shows with Jeremy really wonderful. Keith Nester is a recent convert to the Catholic Church and he has a growing KZfaq show called Catholic Feedback, (33) Catholic Feedback LIVE - KZfaq. I'm not sure why but I think you two should meet up and chat.

I think it was Emile Durkheim who said "all political discourse has its roots in religious discourse". I also think Dr Holmes missed a trick by not quoting from Vatican II "The Truth cannot impose itself except by virtue of its own truth, as it makes its entrance into the mind at once quietly and with power" Keep up the good work Matt

Really loved this 5 part series. Thanks In trying to answer the question of violence in the church, I would suggest we consider the progression of the theory for the use of violence in human history. 1)Hammurabi's Code of the Babylonian Empire from 1792-50 B.C.E. and Moses declaration of it in Lev. 24:19-21 "Anyone who injures their neighbor is to be injured in the same manner: fracture for fracture, eye for eye, tooth for tooth. The one who has inflicted the injury must suffer the same injury. Whoever kills an animal must make restitution, but whoever kills a human being is to be put to death." That is revenge can not be greater that the injury perpetrated. 2) The beatitudes of Jesus Mt 5:3-12 include; "Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God". And Mark 12:31 ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no commandment greater than these.” 3) Third Council of the Lateran in 1179 where the Church adopted rules that successfully limited when and where fighting could occur: Catholic forces (e.g. of warring barons) could not fight each other on Sundays, Thursdays, holidays, the entirety of Lent and Advent and other times, severely disrupting the conduct of wars. And in 1475, St Thomas Aquinas published his theory of just war. In Summa Theologica Aquinas asserted that it is not always a sin to wage war, and he set out criteria for a just war. According to Aquinas, three requirements must be met. Firstly, the war must be waged upon the command of a rightful sovereign. Secondly, the war needs to be waged for just cause, on account of some wrong the attacked have committed. Thirdly, warriors must have the right intent, namely to promote good and to avoid evil.[30][31] Aquinas came to the conclusion that a just war could be offensive and that injustice should not be tolerated so as to avoid war. Nevertheless, Aquinas argued that violence must only be used as a last resort. On the battlefield, violence was only justified to the extent it was necessary. Soldiers needed to avoid cruelty and a just war was limited by the conduct of just combatants. Aquinas argued that it was only in the pursuit of justice, that the good intention of a moral act could justify negative consequences, including the killing of the innocent during a war. 4) And finally in 1776, the Declaration of Independence declared: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.-That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, -That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness." Here finally, is a declaration that there is no government, no religion, no tribe, no person who has power over God given inalienable rights. Finally after almost 4000 years of thought, and what we now understand as natural law and have felt in out hearts, we human beings have proclaimed and codified. An yet, we have a long way to go to faithfully proclaim the truth of the teachings of Jesus Christ and the end of violence.

@MattWhitmanTMBH - I was wondering if you’ve considered doing a series where the table is turned and Dr. Holmes gets to ask about your Protestant beliefs? This was a great series and it would be exciting to see it continue but flipped so that you were answering the questions. I’m not sure if I’ve ever seen an interview like that. It seems like it’s always Catholics answering Protestant objections to their faith on the spot but not the other way around.

I would love to see a sit-down with Scott Hahn. I would love to hear the dialogue of a convert from Protestantism to Catholicism. What was the trigger point. Thanks guys! Loved this series!

Interesting take to hear from Dr Holmes. I have a study im doing regarding the Bible and church-state stuff. Its based on the historicist method of Bible Interpretation, i think it will certainly be interesting to those who like hearing different perspectives.. Daniel 7 vs 25 speaking of a ‘little horn’ says, “He shall speak pompous [blasphemous] words against the Most High, Shall persecute the saints of the Most High, And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time.” The time, times and half a time or 3 and a half years is the same as 42 months (3.5 years x 12 months). 42 months in Daniel's time were the same as 1260 days (42 months x 30 days) because a month has 30 days in the Jewish calendar. So the ‘time, times and half a time” or 3.5 years that the 'little horn' persecutes for is the same 1260 days. Now, if we apply the ‘day=year principle’ of Bible prophecy, the 1260 days would be 1260 years. So according to Daniel 7 vs 25, this little horn persecutes God’s people for 1260 years. The question now would be who is this little horn? It turns out there is a power that was given authority to be a ‘corrector of heretics’ in 533AD by the emperor Justinian and in 538AD this power started a series of persecutions, being backed by the Roman state and had dominance until the year 1798 when the head of this power was taken prisoner by the general Berthier (Napoleons general) and died in prison. The crazy thing is, this little horn was literally persecuting for 1260 years just like the Bible says. The next question is, does the same power “intend to change times and law”? Well, the same power literally says they changed the Sabbath day from Saturday to Sunday, but no one can change or alter what God has said in His Word except the little horn power described in Daniel 7 vs 25. This same power speaks blasphemous words against God according to Daniel 7 vs 25, so what is blasphemy? Making yourself God right? Well, that same power completely disregards the 2nd commandment and encourages people to bow down to idols/statues, despite God’s Word forbidding it. It also describes itself as “God on earth” and despite the Bible clearly saying only God can forgive sins, says they can forgive sins. There is only one power that can fit all these descriptions in Daniel 7 vs 25. Let’s identify this power, in 533AD it was Pope John II who was made “the corrector of heretics and the head of all churches”, subsequent to the start of Papal dominance and persecution (the inquisition, crusades etc.) which thrived for literally 1260 years just like the Bible says and ended in 1798 after Pope Pius VI was taken prisoner by Berthier and died in prison in 1799. Regarding changing God’s “times and law”, the Convert’s Catechism of Catholic Doctrine by Reverend Peter Giermann says: “Question: Which is the Sabbath day? Answer: Saturday is the Sabbath day. Question: Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday? Answer: We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church in the Council of Laodicea transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday.” Another quote from a Cardinal: “You may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we never sanctify.” Cardinal James Gibbons, The Faith of Our Fathers (1917 edition). No one can change God’s word except he who is blasphemous and thinks he is God, the Antichrist (NB - The Antichrist is NOT people that go to the Catholic church but the Papal System which deceives people through its teachings). Revelation 13 gives us further information about this little horn/Antichrist and what he is to do in the future and also mentions the period that the little horn/Papal System persecuted God’s people for (3.5 years/42months/1260days-years) (Revelation 13 vs 5). Regarding what the Antichrist will do in the end times, the Papal System says the mark of its ecclesiastical power is its ability to change God’s word, namely, how it ‘changed’ the Sabbath day from Saturday to Sunday, so in the end times, according to Bible prophecy, history will repeat itself and a union of church and state led by the Pope will force people to observe the Sabbath on the wrong day of worship - Sunday. This will be a MAJOR issue in the end times, but when it happens, remember that God says His Sabbath is the 7th day - Saturday (Exodus 20 vs 8 - 11). Lastly, if you think that everything I have said is false or its rubbish, that’s okay. The good thing is, there is a way to prove whether it’s false or true because I have mentioned what is to happen in the future - Sabbath issues and how people will be forced to worship on Sunday which isn't the day God instituted as the Sabbath, so when that starts happening, remember that God has told us in His word that it would happen and we ought to do what God says in His Word rather than what man says. May God bless whoever read this🙏🏾

Christianity is not only about an individualistic conversion of the private space, but also about a cultural and national conversation of the public space.