Exactly, that's how I feel too. If only we saw more of them interacting in a positive and romantic way.

I think in the end that's why people like them so much; they can imagine what they would be like as an actual couple vs seeing that played out and it lives into the fantasy element of it all. But for me, while I don't think it would be all that you know...ROMANTIC I do think it would be the most practical and realistic relationship. The poem states that they do go on to have several children don't even ask how that's possible, so the fact that that happens says a lot I think about their maturity level to decide to have children in whatever weird way they might have had them lol.

In the Pumpkin Queen book they explore their relationship a bit more. How she is hesitant on her title and leaving Halloween town. He tries to push her to expand her horizons. The book gets super mushy and romantic but sadly I don't see myself finishing it.

They’re probably like Danny Elfman and Bridget Fonda. Danny is too busy with his work to spend much time with her and she seems to be ok with that.

I'd say Jack's contribution to Sally is the same as his contribution to everyone in Halloween Town. He makes their lives exciting and gives them purpose. If Jack wasn't around to lead the charge then at some point the entire town would become afflicted with the same burnout that Jack experienced. He's the bulwark standing between them and boredom with the status quo that is their lives. We have no idea how long people live in Halloween town but it's probably fair to say that they've been doing this for decades at a minimum up to hundreds if not thousands of years. He's an absolutely essential cultural icon for all of them since he serves as a reminder of what they aspire to be and prevents the question of why they are doing it from ever coming up.

Masochist?

@@radiogobrrrrrrr1949 that's part of it but their relationship just works if you watch The Addams family cartoon series they go into more detail about the relationship Morticia said originally her sister was supposed to marry Gomez not her

I would click on a Gomez Morticia video so fast....

Yaas.

He did, but for the live action version (which is better as far as the two go)

I agree! I think it's more that he thinks she's taken and that he becomes infatuated with Christmas, but he obviously cares about her throughout the movie and values her as an individual. I do wish they had more screentime, but idk i personally thought it was pretty well done all things considered

I think though the only scenes we see of him appreciating her is 1. When Sally sneaks out to give him stuff for his experiments and when he’s about to thank her she’s gone before he has the chance. And 2. When Sally is trying to warn him about his Christmas but he assumes she’s talking about the Santa Claus costume and he thinks she’s being modest and has full confidence in her making it great.

Whatever Jack is the citizens hold him in complete reverence.

Jack is the official king of Halloween. They Mayor even says so in the film, "Jack I'm only an elected official, I can't make any decisions by myself." Which implies that Jack has the final say in what happens during Halloween in the real world and in Halloween Town, and isn't just the mayor being a bumbling buffoon.

SO TRUE

What’s this ? What’s THIS !? 😂😂😂

@@sabisweet There's Christmas everywhere!

OH MY GOD this is my new headcannon

Yeah, he mentioned it in the video.

I'm gonna start it this month!

That book feels like fanfiction

Awesome.👌🏼

@@rosykindbunny1313 let us know what you think about it!!

-The movie 🍿🎥

story of my life XD

No, he tried something new and realized it's not something that's really him.

Yeah, he mentioned the book in the video.

Same!!

Agreed. I was also pretty confused with it as a kid and barely even noticed that SHE also liked him in that way. I just sorta thought she thought he was an interesting person and followed him around because she was bored of being locked away. Jack never really noticed her outside of the things she could do for him. No different than how he directed the other members of the town to do various things with their talents. Definitely a good potential romance building point, but I don't feel like it achieved a romance deserving of the soliloquy at the end. The romance sorta feels slapped on and out of place by the end because you don't really get any sort of desire for romance AT ALL with Jack.

You should definitely read the book! It was approved by Tim burton and the novel really uproots the problems in sally and jacks relationship and improves them in my opinion, nicely! Some sweet stuff

While I like their relationship, I thought the same thing Like, what made him say "my feelings for you have came suddenly"

For real! As a kid the climatic romantic moment at the end was jarring! Even when Jack snaps out of his funk it wasn’t because of something he remembered she said or something she gave him. It’s a great movie overall but fell on developing the romantic subplot.

i think he always liked her and respected her, he usually trusted her with important tasks or confided in her but it finally clicked that he was fixating on something he couldn’t have when what he needed was right there in front of him. that’s how i always saw it as a kid since i loved this move to death

She got him when he was emotionally vulnerable+riding the high of giving up and retiring to the familiar.

There is supposed an epilogue of the movie but didn't get put in, they actually have kids together. You're able to listen to it on spotify.

To be fair, some people ARE that oblivious.

Rather than him being ADHD coded, I think you just relate to him, which is cool too.

@@liamorrison4484 OP prolly relates cause he's seeing the symptoms that got him(and me) ratted out to a doctor lolol. If that ain't ADHD coding, idk what is

So that's why I relate to him so much

He’s based heavily on Danny Elfman who wrote all the lyrics which the rest of the script was based on and sang all of his lines and related to his predicament being sick of his band Oingo Boingo and wanting to quit and do film composing instead. Danny said he would have definitely been diagnosed with ADHD if he were born in a younger generation. Oh and he’s finally returned to doing his rock star thing this year just as Jack returned to doing Halloween.

Same, and I too relate to having an identity crisis when my interests change-- like, who am I anymore if I'm super into this new thing? Am I even the same person? It can be super stressful

Finally someone said it

True, I think that's because people are used to seeing one sided relationships. She actually loves him, and he's just like 'meh'.

@@jl2280 tbh, comparing a movie and a novel in general is not fair game, movies have much less time to work with and can't directly show the inner thoughts of characters So yes, the statement in itself is true, but I think it can be said for almost every comparison between movie and novel outside of rare exceptions, novel characters are much more developed and complex on average

Perhaps more friends in the neighborly acquaintance kind of way. I have neighbors I've waved to regularly and made chit chat for YEARS , but I don't necessarily hang out with them on the regular, let alone bear my soul to them. Maybe Sally was more of that.

@@JupiterTarts THAT makes a lot of sense actually. Like even with my being in an apartment, I only know one neighbor, and just their first names. So I can see that sort of situation with Jack and Sally. Not to mention Jack is KIND of oblivious but I don't think he's MEAN about that either. I think a lot of people misinterpret the scene of Sally trying to tell Jack of her vision and Jack steamrolling her as him completely ignoring her. But it's clear he's hearing SOME of what she's saying but not all of it. Selective hearing at its finest lol. I feel like I'd love hanging out with Jack in real life, because he just seems like a nice guy overall. Very charming and dapper for a dead guy lol.

Remember the scene where Sally brought Jack food when he was thinking about Christmas? I think that’s a good representation of her taking care of Jack when everyone else was just keeping their distance. Jack doesn’t even seem surprised by it, and waves to Sally with a silent smile, instead of in his usually loud and welcoming manner. It’s not weird to imagine this isn’t the first time Sally brought food to Jack when he was busy and likely not taking care of himself. I can imagine this happened many times before, but Sally always left before Jack could talk to her. Also in the scene after Oogie Boogie is defeated, Jack figures out that Sally was down there because she was trying to help him, and he’s flabbergasted! Even saying “I can’t believe I never realised that you-“ before being interrupted by the Trick or Treat kids. Those scenes can tell us that that Sally was always there for Jack and he was never aware because he felt so alone. That moment of clarity for him after the Oogie Boogie fight was him thinking “I never realised how much you were actually by my side”. He saw Sally as a good friend before, but he never realised just how much she cared about his well-being to the point where she was even trying to prevent him from making mistakes. A big difference between Sally and the other villagers is that she’s the only one who goes against Jacks wishes, which shows that despite her love for Jack, she still isn’t going to everything he says, which just shows that this relationship wouldn’t take away her independence at all. But the reasons she goes against him isn’t like when she went against Dr Finklestein. She goes against him because she KNOWS his plan is stupid and she doesn’t want him to get hurt or make a big mistake. Jack sadly doesn’t realise she’s trying to help him because he’s too wrapped up in this whole thing and honestly nobody has ever said “no” to him before. Jack is surrounded by people who are just “yes-men” and he was still in the mindset that he was alone, so he didn’t suspect that Sally was ACTUALLY worried about him. Nobody really tells Jack if they’re worried about him, as shown by the Mayor when its revealed after Jacks “death” that he didn’t like the Christmas idea from the beginning, but he still fully encouraged it because it was Jacks idea, and it was also shown when the towns people were all wondering and worrying about Jack during “Jacks Obsession”, even worrying about him dying, but still left him alone and didn’t check on him. Sally was the only one who did! So when it’s revealed how much Sally cared for him and worried for him, to even go as far as try to warn him and stop him when nobody else would’ve, yeah I can see why Jack realises his feelings for Sally, the person who always cared for him but he never fully realised how much until now. As for Sally and her issues, the song she sings (Sallys Song) mentions how she would like to join in with everyone else and just be able to stand by Jack, but her worry for him and the vision she had of him destroying Christmas overtook that want. The song also highlights how her upbringing with Finkelstein made her feel insignificant, and that Jack could never love her back. She also calls him a “dear friend”, which just strengthens the fact that they have a history. Idk if people will have an issue with this, but Sally being loved by Jack is one of the ways she gains confidence at the end. The final scene has her slowly slipping away from the crowd and going off alone, like Jack did at the beginning of the movie. Sally is still not “part of the crowd” and she never really was, so she just disappears like always. When we see her sit on the top of the hill, she has a smile on her face and is plucking the petals of a flower, the same flower that manifested into a visions to her. That makes me think she was content and proud of herself, because what she did helped save her loved one and helped him realise his mistakes, and doesn’t regret any of it. And then we see Jack. For the first time, it’s Jack that approaches Sally. Jack calls her his “dearest friend” and asks if he’s allowed to sit by Sally, asks if she minds if he did. Sally said before that she wished she could stand by him but she doesn’t feel worthy, but now Jacks here, asking HER if he was allowed to sit by her. Jack says how he’d like to gaze at the stars with Sally, and Sally realises then that Jack loves her as well, as she joins in the song. They both sing about how they want to be together. They want to share experiences and do things TOGETHER. They both weren’t alone anymore. Both figures, both people who felt alone for so long, finally find eachother and happiness. And the song ends with them both saying that it was “simply meant to be”, contradicting what Sally said before when her insecurities made her think her and Jack would never be together, and how she regrets feeling the way she does. This end scene shows that she doesn’t regret her actions or feelings anymore. She doesn’t regret trying to stop Jacks Christmas because it helped him, and she doesn’t regret loving him because she realises that she can be loved back. Say what you want about these two, but sometimes someone loving and respecting you the same as you feel about them can help you realise that you are worth being loved. This movie is my favourite of all time and I’ll probably love it till the ends of the earth, and these two are no exception. Sorry if I rambled for too long and I hope I made sense.

Doesn’t Jack refer to everyone or the town as his friends?

@@laraschroeder5195 Beautiful comment (o´∀`o) I read the whole thing and I agree.

insightful

Really nice analysis!!

Idk if that’s a good thing.

@@Barakon all love is self love, empathy is seeing yourself in others

I know your comment is 9 months old and the video is 10 months old. But atleast oogie boogie was trying his best trying to be positive towards sally when she was starting to sew herself. But yes she definitely deserves better.

I dunno I still don't vibe with it. It came across like "wow you help me, I guess I like you back." Love needs to develop in some form or fashion otherwise it just comes across as infatuation. I dunno, maybe that's just me, but if I liked someone and I did nice things for them and suddenly they wanted me after they realised how useful I was.... I'd feel used.

@@LangkeeLongkee I don’t know if I’d see Sally feeling used though. I think the message is more that we strive for something more in life whenever sometimes you have to just look around. I mean if Jack DIDN’T get with Sally after all that she did for him, I’d be extremely pissed if I was her. I think the message is that Jack always cared about her but was too blind with his own life to see how much she cared about him. She never directly told him, he figured it out himself. And I think that’s more important than having that person tell you themselves.

@@katlyndobransky2419 I'm not saying she IS being used I'm saying your logic isn't foolproof. And you being extremely pissed off is weird.... It's giving nice guy. Someone isn't owned another person's affection for being nice to them or doing nice things for them. I dunno if you're in a relationship or how old you are but that's not how that works. And how could he always care about her he didn't know her. And if that's what they were trying to do it was poorly done because they never established he even saw her like truly saw her. It seemed like he went from knowing she existe and acknowledging her to "love of my life perhaps??????" in his own head and that's weird to me. Maybe it's because I'm gay, but I always found it weird in stories when a woman is pining and waiting around for a man to decide he wants her now for no particular reason. I also don't like Harry and Ginny from Harry Potter because Harry does the same thing, not until book 7 does he even mention remotely being into Ginny and it's when she's with other guys, that feels very childish to me. And granted he was a child but Jack and Sally aren't. And no I don't think it's more important because communication is important in a relationship. I told my girlfriend I wasn't sure what I was feeling, that she made me happy but I wasn't sure if it was infatuation, or I genuinely liked her like that, or what because I hadn't dated anyone in a while. She told me she felt the same way. We saw each other, marinated in our feelings to see what was going on and decided we do actually like each other and want to pursue something. We talked. Couples talk. I'm not saying everyone's relationship has to be like mine but relationships cannot function on waiting for someone to figure out how you're feeling and moving to suit, grown ups talk about their feelings and wants. Communication is key, your partner can't read your mind. You have to tell them what you want from them.

@@LangkeeLongkee your comment is both immature and mature. Immature because I’m not pissed at all. NBC was one of my childhood movies and I loved Jack and Sally as a kid, so I’m just giving my take. But you’re very mature because I understand your points and your feelings and I’m glad that you’re willing to share them. All relationships are different, and some people are happier with things some wouldn’t be happy with, if that makes sense. For example, Sally was too shy to tell Jack she liked him. Even at the end, she didn’t say anything because she was too afraid of rejection and self doubt. So the whole time she focused on what he wanted, not on what she wanted. Ever heard that actions speak louder than words, because that perfectly fits Sally. And I thought it was established that they were both friends, or at least knew about each other. Jack knew that Sally could sew, hence why he had her make his Santa suit. But at the same time he ignores her when she tries to warn him that his plan isn’t gonna work out, because Jack is narcissistic. He had great intentions, but refused to believe that he was wrong. I’m sorry if my comment made it seem like Jack was perfect because he’s not. He’s “human” just like everybody else. He even tells her that he never noticed that she cared so much because he was too focused on himself. He never asked Sally to do everything she did for him. And he couldn’t believe he was so blind to not see it. A lot of times relationships develop under very weird and strange circumstances. A lot of times out of hate, like Hermione and Harry. Love isn’t perfect, and it’s often times messy. I agree that Jack and Sally should’ve developed more, but there’s only so much you can show in a movie that had love as a sub plot. I still think it has a beautiful message. I recommend you watch Corpse Bride, which focuses completely on love and happiness, with dark themes behind it. Again, sorry if I seemed harsh in my reply, I get what you’re saying. I just slightly disagree on certain things. I understand why people are weirded out by this ship, but I loved them as a kid and still do now

@@katlyndobransky2419 well that's weird of you to claim I'm immature for such a reason since I never claimed you were pissed?????? And that is a trait that you should work to overcome. Especially when Jack is not someone who's good at naturally picking up what she wants, it took him all movie. That's not an excuse for not being able to communicate. I'm not saying she's a terrible person but it's still a flaw in the relationship. It wasn't EASY for me to talk to my girl, or for her to talk to me, and is not easy for anyone to talk to their partner about certain things. These things are hard sometimes but it comes with the territory of love. Sometimes you have to talk about it. Even if you're shy you need to have those conversations. Actions do speak louder than words but actions are not across the board, actions are vague, actions don't always mean one thing, behaviour can be misinterpreted. Words offer clarity when not in direct opposition to the action. Actions speaking louder than words is all based on assumptions. You believe actions over words when it's clear the words are lies. And no it wasn't established they were both friends. They rarely ever spoke. And I'm not sure if it would make it better or worse if they did, cause that would he wasn't cought up in the Christmas thing before and STILL never noticed Sally wanted him until he realised and decided he wanted her in the same breath until the very end of the film. Love is not perfect. I know that. I'm just saying I don't buy how genuine Jack's feelings are. There is only so much you can do in a subplot, but much more could have been done. There have been much more developed side romances. And the movie was on the slightly shorter end, if they needed more time to develop they could have used it. I understand it's a lot of money and time in stop motion but they had the resources. Not calling them lazy, I just think the writing for them is choppy. And I've seen Corpse Bride. I think it has a similar but not quite the same problem. Victoria and Victor weren't very fleshed out, and their chemistry wasn't there. As a child I liked Emily more, still kinda do, but as a kid I wanted Victor to end up with Emily. Now I get why he didn't, but I don't feel his chemistry with Victoria either. I get that he doesn't love Emily, and good don't marry her if she's not the one you love, but they got on much better imo, they seemed to have more heart.

I'd much rather hang out with Jack than Stolas though lol. There's SOMETHING about Jack that just always drew me to him as a character.

Yeah he was ironically kind of the “Villain” of his story in the movie now that I relooked into it. Not out of genuine malice but more like pure tunnel vision when he was obsessed with the Christmas-Halloween project. And Sally was the only person who tried getting his skeleton head out of his ass before things got worse.

Oooooh 🤔🤣👍

@@TheRibottoStudios Well Jack isn't supposed to be evil while Stolas kinda is by virtue of being part of Hell

I thought it was widely known that Vivziepop uses Tim Burton as a big influence.

marriage goals, those two.

Same

Danny Elfman should get credit too for writing all the lyrics which pretty much formed the basis of the story.

@@nuclearcatbaby1131 And he gets it for voicing Jack when he's singing

@@anthonyrodriguez4905 Yeah I saw him sing it live. And this year I’m going to see him sing his own music live.

@@nuclearcatbaby1131 cool!!

@@anthonyrodriguez4905 it's honestly impressive asf that there is NO difference in Jack's singing voice vs his speaking voice. Usually there's almost always SOME sort of tell, so when actors and singers can make that bridge seamless it's pretty special. Like with Jeremy Iron and Jim Cummings in The Lion King song Be Prepared there's NO visible tell you have to be told where one actor ended the song the other picked it up. THAT'S talent.

Hopefully that never gets spoken into existence 😟

DONT GIVE THEM IDEAS!!!😥😥😥

They won’t as long as Tim Burton and Danny Elfman are still alive.

YESSS!!!

I support this!

@@silomenezes2935 Me too! i watched it with one of my friends on New Years and had a conversation about the pairings. I kinda made my pairing with Victor and Emily (I'm into ships that are strange, but have potential) and made my case using the film's logic (Which is oozing Tim's weird imagination) to sort of justify my case and ALSO give Victoria some more time in the spotlight and have her DEVELOP a relationship. Would it make sense in the real world? No, but it has potential. (That and I can't stand arranged marriages without the couple spending time first before the wedding date)

He's gotta be touching on that one if he's doing spooky couples

I LOVE THAT MOVIE!

That is a can of worms he'll probably suffer through. Although, I can see him going Victor X Victoria

Yes, please Corpse Bride! It doesn't get the attention it deserves!

SO TRUE! Got my mom to watch that one last year, absolutely enjoyed it!

I really liked Nightmare Revisited.

I went to the last Nightmare concert where they had Weird Al Yankovic and Billie Eilish fill in for Catherine O’Hara’s parts.

@@nuclearcatbaby1131 aww man that sounds awesome

@@Tomha Yeah and I’m going to see the voice of Jack/composer and lyricist for the whole movie Danny Elfman do a rock concert for his own music this year

@beyond your imagination So is this lol. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/sK-hksKi2NfQf3U.html

@beyond your imagination bot

MO moo

Yess you are 100% right he doesn’t not listen to her he’s just doesn’t understanding what she is saying may people get that confused and he does value her ❤️🖤

Oogy’s revenge?

@RR Jokes on you, I got an ad before the video started so I technically didn't fall for the Rick roll.

Meanwhile, most of the people who have ACTUALLY watched the damn movie looking at you like the clown you are:

For now they’re cashing in on having the voice actors do live performances of the songs from the movie.

100%!!!

I would be all for that if any other company than disney made it

Lol

Yes. They were interrupted

Yes

…the video says that.

So this mean you can understand what I wrote? ''Mas que lindo dia. Isso é incrível?''

@@angellopes9353 Oui. Je comprend peu. But haven`t praticed Portuguese or Spicy Spanish much . My Beligum(French) is a little rusty, Mon doigt sur la gâchette me démange toujours. Ate Logo !