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DSA815 TG Basic Spectrum Analysis

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James Eagleson

James Eagleson

Күн бұрын

A Tutorial/Demo of basic spectrum monitoring using the inexpensive Rigol DSA815-TG Spectrum Analyzer. Basic settings. Noise Floor. Band setup... FM Broadcast Band. Modulation Spectrum. Max Hold. Two Meter Amateur Band Monitoring. Using the Preamp and Input Attenuators. Peak Table (up to 10). Peak Table Parameter settings. Saving a Screen Shot. Samples of future presentations. (Please excuse my cold in this video, by the way).
For more information about testing Cavity Filters, Duplexers, etc. please see my other videos on these topics. Also check out some videos I did for Telewave using both the DSA-815TG and an HP8711C Network Analyzer:
( www.telewave.c... )

Пікірлер: 33
@ipabrewerable
@ipabrewerable 9 жыл бұрын
James, I love your videos on the DSA815-TG. I ordered one and while I was waiting for it to arrive I watched some of your videos. When it came in I felt like I had been using it for awhile. You explain and demonstrate in a very clear and easy to understand way. Thanks for all the videos and help in getting me started. Jeff - K2AK
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 11 жыл бұрын
The whip antenna is 50 Ohms as is the Spectrum Analyzer. The cable from the rooftop antenna is directly connected to the analyzer though some folks recommend connecting it through a 50 Ohm -10dB Atttenuator Pad to ensure that the front end is not overloaded. I make certain that nothing is coming in higher than 10dBm and I don't make any transmissions from my own ham station when any antenna is connected to the analyzer's input! The closest other ham in my area is 1/4 mile away.
@NotSoLiberal
@NotSoLiberal 11 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the answers. I am in the market for a spectrum analyzer. I was debating whether I should get this model for basic radio stuff and your video settled it for me. I also won't be a dead fish in water when it arrives. I'm planning to read the manual though!
@ScottCasonRealtor
@ScottCasonRealtor 11 жыл бұрын
Any spectrum analyzer that shows occupied bandwidth and/or spurious emissions will work. I've used everything from an Anritsu MS2721A to my current Tek 495P. The 495 weighs as much as a VW Beetle and I'd like to get something smaller. The 815 would be much easier to transport for sure....and it goes down into the AM band. I may get one and try it out on a few local AM stations here. Thanks for your videos, they are very informative.
@barrygkx
@barrygkx 7 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the great demo. I learned a lot. Barry, KU3X
@Luzdemisojos
@Luzdemisojos 11 жыл бұрын
great demonstration, thanks
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 10 жыл бұрын
There may be an overload protection circuit but the DSA815 'IF' is actually probably just the output of the down-converter's mixer. Digital Signal Processing (DSP) is applied at this stage and the results are displayed accordingly. By mathematical means these results are also converted to dBm, dBuV, uV, or dBmV or whatever Unit of Measurement the DSA815 has been set to display.
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 11 жыл бұрын
Resolution Bandwidth (BW on the Rigol) adjusts the spectrum analyzer's receiver BW to 100, 300Hz, 1, 3, 10, 30kHz, etc up to 1MHz maximum. The noise output in a perfect receiver will be about -174dBm/Hz thus for 10Hz it will be 10dB higher at -164dBm (10LOG(10Hz/1Hz) etc. Thus a receiver that has 10kHz bandwidth would have a noise output of 10LOG(10,000Hz/1Hz) = 10*4 = 40dB greater than -174dBm or -134dBm. The Rx Noise Figure impacts this as well, but that is a different topic.
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 11 жыл бұрын
If left in AUTO for all controls (BW, VBW, Sweep, etc.), it will pick the best setting to properly display the signal levels, frequency, etc. You may, however, wish to change BW to lower the displayed noise level or to see individual peaks more clearly. If the Sweep is set to AUTO, it may automatically compensate by slowing down or speeding up. If BW is set to AUTO, BW will be selected to complement the Sweep.
@NotSoLiberal
@NotSoLiberal 11 жыл бұрын
Great video and great unit.
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 11 жыл бұрын
Train speed is like sweep rate. The faster it goes, the more difficult it is to hit the narrow door but a wider door isn't as difficult to jump into. This analogy isn't precise but may clarify the basic issue somewhat for you.
@ipabrewerable
@ipabrewerable 9 жыл бұрын
Jim, thanks for the very informative video. I have a DSA815-TG and love it. I have a question. I want to look at a local repeaters signal quality. I dont want to damage this Analyzer. The repeater is very close and transmits a pretty strong signal. Should I put an attenuator on the RF input of the analyzer and attach the antenna coax to that? I know there is attenuation built in but dont know if that is enough. I have 30dB and 50 dB attenuators. Thank you, Jeff K2AK
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 11 жыл бұрын
I don't know about occupied BW on an AM broadcast station, if by that you mean for FCC test purposes. Generally the FCC requires use of an approved list of equipment. If, however, you mean using the DSA815-TG to demonstrate interference problems, it can provide a JPEG picture of any issues you might be experiencing. You can use it down to 100Hz RBW and I think 9kHz is all the FCC requires. Use of the 10kHz or 3kHz RBW setting should suffice to show for over-modulation or splatter.
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 11 жыл бұрын
For most Amateur Radio work in the 50, 146, 446, and 1296 bands the DSA815-TG should be quite adequate to allow proper tune up of duplexer and notch filters. See my video showing the tune up of a Pass Notch Filter. The unit will show 80dB notch depth on the screen directly and is quite accurate when used at
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 11 жыл бұрын
Think about it in terms of a moving train car with a door opened wide versus one with a door opened only slightly. It is much easier to enter the wide door but the guy chasing you might also get in (i.e. noise). The accuracy required to hit the narrow door, however, takes more skill on your part. The sweeping analyzer window (BW) is like the train car door. Furthermore, you will know more accurately exactly where you entered the door if it is narrow... i.e. the resolution is better.
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 11 жыл бұрын
Span is the Start to Stop range. This makes no difference to the noise level EXCEPT THAT the Rigol may automatically adjust the RBW (resolution bandwidth) when Span is changed whenever it is set to Auto instead of Manual. If the RBW is set to Manual, it will stay at the same bandwidth regardless of Span thus the noise level will stay the same. The automatic settings are reasonable with the DSA815 but you may wish to have higher or lower resolution bandwidth for some measurements.
@AR15DCM
@AR15DCM 10 жыл бұрын
James, I am new to spectrum analyzers and was wondering if you can generate an RF signal to set the deviation of a FM transceiver? i.e... 1000KHz tone @ 3KHz divation. If so how would you do it with a 815-TG?
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 10 жыл бұрын
There is a MaxMixL, which I presume sets the Maximum Mixer Level. It can be accessed on Screen 2/2 of the AMPT menu. This is the same kind of control that many Agilent and HP analyzers have and may be what you mean by 'if gain'. This is likely part of the mixer IC. Beyond that, go to you'll need to go to rigolna(dot)com for contact information for Rigol Technical Support. I'm certain that their staff can provide the information that you need.
@KM3W
@KM3W 9 жыл бұрын
How would find the noise floor on the 220 band? I have noticed that the noise floor is higher on that band in my area...and I can't use the maximum sensitivity of my repeater. I have done a NF test and found 6.7 dB of noise.
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 9 жыл бұрын
KM3W USE CARE WHEN USING ANY SPECTRUM ANALYZER ON AN EXTERNAL ANTENNA ESPECIALLY AT A COMMUNICATIONS SITE. Don't use HT's or other transmitters in the immediate vicinity of the SA or any antenna attached to it. 1. With a 20 dB attenuator on the input to the DSA815, connect a small, 220 MHz whip antenna to your DSA815. This should protect the SA input from most signals on a transmit site providing you are NOT in the immediate vicinity of a transmit antenna (say, less than 10 feet away). 2. Search the spectrum from 0-1500 MHz to see if there are any signals above -30 dBm. Broadcast (FM, TV) and Trunked Radio systems will almost always be transmitting if they are present. Each of these can radiate noise given their high power levels. You might want to observe signal levels for a half hour or so by using the Trace Max Hold setting to catch anything that might only transmit once in a while just to make certain that there are no signals that might be too high in level hitting the Spectrum Analyzer. 3. Then and only then you can remove the external 20 dB attenuator, tune to your desired band, say 222-225 MHz and narrow up the Receive BW to 3 kHz. This should show a noise level around -83 dBm(18 uV). 4. Assuming that you saw no really strong signals (i.e. above -30 dBm), you should be able to go to the second AMPT screen and punch up the internal RF Preamp. You should notice the noise floor drop to about -107 dBm(1uV). (Note: I am assuming that Rigol has designed their internal preamp to compress at less than their +20dBm maximum level. Thus if there are no signals above -10dBm getting into the SA with the preamp on, its output level shouldn't exceed +10dBm.) If the noise level is any higher than this -107 dBm, you can assume that external noise is the culprit. Example: At my urban (San Jose) location on 220 MHz my background noise is below this level when connected to a 4 element, horizontal beam antenna. However if I point the antenna in certain directions where there are power poles and/or cross-connections between power lines, I do obtain excess noise. It isn't as bad on 220 MHz as it is on 144 MHz, but it is there. I am not quite certain what you mean by doing 'a NF test and found 6.7 dB of noise'. If this is the Noise Figure of the receiver, you probably have a system Noise Figure closer to 9-10 dB when duplexer and cable losses are also considered. Furthermore the impact of your own transmitter's noise output to the receiver's input depends entirely on the TX's initial output level at the RX frequency as well as the actual notch depth provided by the duplexer between the TX and RX. If you do find a noise level that is excessive you may wish to obtain a 222 MHz beam antenna to use to identify specific noise sources. I find that a well designed 5-element beam will have about 10 dBi of gain, can be handheld, and has a beam width that will allow locating noise sources. If a noise source is on your tower site the beam might even allow determining the vertical angle to the offending source assuming you have room enough to get far enough from the tower to get a reasonable look angle up and down the tower. Sort of a long response, I realize, but this kind of situation is more and more common these days and I've only scratched the surface of providing an adequate answer. Jim E WB6JNN
@ScottCasonRealtor
@ScottCasonRealtor 11 жыл бұрын
Jim do you know if anyone has taken occupied bandwidth measurements on AM broadcast stations with the 815?
@NotSoLiberal
@NotSoLiberal 11 жыл бұрын
Could you explain why reducing bandwidth reduced noise floor? Is BW the same as the span?
@gachutz
@gachutz 11 жыл бұрын
Our radio club is looking for a analyzer with tracker for basic ham radio testing and duplexer/notch filter tuning. We really do not want to spend 1000 dollars on some old used 20 year old hp and we were looking at the dsa815-tg. Would you recommend this? Since it seems to be very economical in price and is new.
@davideisenberger6197
@davideisenberger6197 7 жыл бұрын
Hi Jim! Just opened the box with the new Rigol DSA815. The only thing that came with it was the power cord and a small quick reference book of 2 pages. Did you receive a full manual and or a CD along with programming manual? I am asking to see what others got in the box.. Tnx Jim 73 de K8KEM
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 7 жыл бұрын
The manual can be downloaded from rigolna.com at: www.rigolna.com/products/spectrum-analyzers/dsa800/
@alebermudez94
@alebermudez94 7 жыл бұрын
Did you calculate the SNR in any of your experiments? thanks
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 7 жыл бұрын
I'm not certain I understand what you mean by SNR (Signal to Noise Ratio). SNR of a given signal? SNR of a particular measurement? Noise Figure of the DSA815? Please clarify.
@salcornacchia6510
@salcornacchia6510 9 жыл бұрын
I would like to know if the videos are downloadable. Thank You
@jimeagle1
@jimeagle1 9 жыл бұрын
I believe that there are several methods that can be used to download videos from You Tube. Check for instructions on how to do this by searching on Google or some other search engine.
@NotSoLiberal
@NotSoLiberal 11 жыл бұрын
Also if you could explain please if you can connect the antenna directly to the analyzer (after connecting BNCs) or you had to do some kind of impedance transformation
@beachsandinspector
@beachsandinspector 11 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the heads up on this spectrum analyser I intend to get this exact unit including the Tracking Generator, I have not used this sort of spectrum analyser, the last one was HP branded with almost all analog controls etc. As a ham here in VK6 I will treat myself to some decent test equipment now as I do not wish to borrow other hams equipment that mostly weighs far too much for me now to lift. I have some duplexers I need to sweep, so will look at your other videos. vk6ya / vk6zse
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