The pronation lift gets harder when wrist is kicked back due to the increase in leverage-arm from the center forearm rotation.

Wild thumbnail

Damm dat thumbnail be pulling us cultured folks😂

Rise > pronation > cup > rise Post > low hand > hook > post Scissors > paper > rock > scissors Up pressure > back pressure > side pressure > up pressure

I love this explanation. These are the high level tips we need.

The thumbnail is amazing 😂😂😂

That thumbnail is beyond perfect 😂❤

Matyushenko is expert at setting the hook with the chopping. His chopping is so good he beats most people with that motion alone, which is mostly for setting the hook but his side pressure and explosiveness in that move is so high

Thank you for creating an in depth analysis of this lift , now everyone knows how impressive Devon really is and why hes #1 for a reason

Your channel is so refreshing in the armwrestling universe bro. Keep up the great work! 💪

great video, heinous thumbnail🤣

I'd rather have a well-done 8-10min video like this only every week than the dozens of daily PEP/KA type of 1-3min low-effort, recycled low-info. vids that seem to be dominating the KZfaq Armwrestling "game" right now

I love this kind of videos, keep working my friend!🦾

Very informative. Actually learning something from your video's. I started training wrist ex because of you aswell

ur content always packed full of data, really good content👍 greetings from indonesia🇮🇩

The information you provided in this video is right and accurate, kudos.

Quality video my guy🔥🔥👍

Very good video man, love your work

Amazing content bro!

awesome vid - very well thought out

Some of the best videos in armwrestling found here! Love the style of video!

This channel is really good thanks for your effort. Don't know how i didn't find it earlier

Great video man

Very good video, explained in an entertaining way 👏 seems kinda hard to do it in this sport, you nailed it

now that's a thumbnail, good shit, keep improving

Really insightful. I've always understood that bending back the wrist is advantageous but I never understood why. It was kind of counterintuitive when I tried to analyze it, because in some positions the wrist-loser has a shorter lever, which should be an advantage. My best guess was the wrist-winning position allows for better muscle recruitment. Maybe that's still true, but it seems the biggest factor is the subtantial loss of pronation strength in the wrist-loser that makes the wrist-winner feel so much stronger. Also I love your use of published studies.

You're a really valuable content creator in the arm wrestling world, just wanted to say that.

Very useful video, thank you!

Just joined the channel thanks for the content!

Incredible video bro

Dude, best break down ive seen

Thanks for that, now I'm going to work on my pronation with a rotation.

Excellent insightful video! I think your work will be appreciated for decades and will pay dividends soon

Thanks for this great video : )

Your best video yet

Great video 👍

Also an idea for a video. that position Ermes stopped Levan in. I'm quite new to armwrestling, but at training, when someone gets close to pinning me too quickly, I give up my wrist and sort of pull/push with my lower forearm/wrist and sort of just clamp on with my fingers. I end up in basically the same position that Ermes stopped Levan in. Opponent fully cupped and pronated, but I can stop the match by giving up my wrist. I've even won a supermatch by jumping in a flop wrist press from there...if I'm quick enough. Easy to get pressed from there. hope that makes sense

Good vid!!

Ooo now with this video I’d love to see a kickback video and the importance of that for height and staying on the fingers/outside of a hook

I know where to come for proper analysis now. Love ya work mate.

THANK YOU! Finally someone saying how much that lift is harder with kick back wrist. Everyone copying Devon but noone does it correctly

That thumbnail is WILD lmao

good to have a scientist involved - great video

Underrated channel

Quality video

I am 13yo my probation lift with wrist kicked back is 20kg

Amazing Amazing broooooo

The observation about wrist flexion and pronation is correct. In order to prevent the wrist being bent back, opening up into an open-arm hook or top-roll is a preferred option. Losing any pronation due to wrist loss is not preferable to maintaining wrist and therefore pronation while giving up closed angles between at the shoulder and elbow. Double kings.

This is so good video thank you for your time and effort to make this video I like it so much 😍 I have 1 question though , what is a good pronation lift for a national level athlete ? 90kg category

Bro i fuckimg love your videos but it would be better to change camera angle to look more professional ❤

Great thumbnail😂

Awesome explanation, Greg! And the video's overall quality too.🤌🏼🤌🏼 The thumbnail is the cherry on top🤣

Daaaaang the thumbnail 😂😂😂😂

nice video. many gems here.. i feel like for hook, it is better to train pronation with cupped wrist. neutral wrist pronated movement is better to fight at the ready go position (the start) to get the height advantage. cupped wrist pronation activates pronator teres better so there is better stabilizer and muscle used compared to neutral

That's how Devon performs the lift, with his wrist kicked back a little bit. I don't think a lot of people realize that. He addressed it in one of his videos. So for him to lift the weight he's lifting with that form is pretty crazy.

I've 32 kilos only on pronation.(with wrist kickback) , and cupping is very important important for me. Even having higher number in lifts than my friends most of the time my pronation failed. It is then I found the importance of cupping and since then I've been doing great. And thanks for the tips against flop press I've been loosing to them a lot 😅.

I've also noticed that pronation lift gets significantly difficult while doing it in kicked back position but it always confused me as to what is the utility of doing so. For instance, I always curl my wrist in while I pronate during the top roll. So why not just do the lift in the curled in or neutral position and not with the wrist kicked back? As far as when it comes to wrist integrity and maintaining height, riser lift should be sufficient in my opinion.

Its also Forceapplication. if your wrist is flexed you remove force from the pronator. its not that its stronger there, its that you have less torque on the pronator. And also the Torque put on elbow flexor is less when the weight is closer to the fulcrum

great video! in my case i have stronger capping than pronation do you have any suggestions on how should i pull thanks.

Interesting

I honestly don't know why but i did 1 kg more in the pronation lift with my wrist kicked back than from a neutral position, 43kg bent back 42 kg neutral

Make a video about broken bone in arm wrestling

I mean, it does make Sense biomechanically as to why wrist flexion is stronger when you are supinated compared to when you are pronated in armwrestling. Your wrist deviates slightly towards the Ulnar when you try to fully flex your wrist and when you flex your wrist fully while being in a neutral Position this means that you give up your high Hand more or less and that makes it easier to get turned over. When you supinate right away you so Not run into this risk and can Access your Power right away. Liked the Video bro

I wonder if people realize that the idea of kicking your wrist back to gain height so that you can go sideways comes From Travis Bagent. Agent also discussed that your hand strength is increased when you kick your ass back a little bit which allows him to bite down on his opponent's thumb for better control. This is also something that Devon has implemented. Although they are similar in the structure of what they're trying to do to their opponent, they are obviously different in how they implement these two similar facets

5:27 the reason is very obvious, extending your wrist back extends the moment arm. For a channel which goes into this level of detail sometimes I feel you miss very obvious mechanical facts. In fact this can be verified by pushing downwards from a cable machine instead of pulling upwards with a strap wrapped such that it forces you to pronate. In this setup, extending your wrist has the opposite effect and its easier to do with an extended wrist rather than a cupped wrist.

Agree

I do the pronator in the block from 25 kg 4 to 12

I think the cup also blocks ur opponent's pronation. Without enough cupping strength, we cannot display our max pronation strength. Something to keep in mind is that cupping for toprollers is slightly different to hookers. Toprollers cup with their palm slightly facing down or away as opposed to hookers with palm facing up. P.S IMO it is easier for me to recover from cup training as the pronation lift tires out the wrist as well as the brachialis which further impacts ur back pressure training.

Alongside elbow felxion(bicep/briachials) training cupping and pronation ensures you get the strongest toproll. Look at levan, everyone talks about wrist curl, wrist curl and then they brush away pretty quickly his Devon pronation lift. Even if his cup got slightly weaker, if his elbow flexor and pronation got stronger i think he might be in a better position to toproll Devon then before if he was facing the old Devon, the new one ww'll see about it.

So the lift should be fine eith wrist out or in ?? Left me confused

Would u say that altho the cup is stronger in the supinated positon, the opponents pronation is als stronger in that position, and it kinda evens out? Cause i feel way more comfortable if someone fights my pronation with their cup initating from their little finger and supination, as to them initiating their cup from their pointer finger and kind of high hooking me

The thumbnail is cursed 😂

So in the Devon larrat pronation lift, I think I've got like 95 lb, in the Todd hutching side pressure lift, somewhere around 105lbs. Cupping using a two and a1/4-in spinning handle I think I'm somewhere around 100 lb, and back pressure Gasparini style, Something like 70 lb.

What about Travis Bagnent's style rise and pronate and no cup.. that's also my move I can't cup lol

The thumbnail😂

Damn bro! 40kg easy, my max is 42.5kg. Great video as well, amped up to train now

Yes, so what about how hard you squeeze someones hand? Does it matter? If i have a grip strength unmatched does it correlate and transition into arm wrestling?

🔥🔥🔥

That thumbnail 😂😂😂

Funny, noticed that this was flagged as not safe for work.. and I was wondering why, till I saw the thumbnail. 😁

My current numbers is 50kg for pronation,55kg for wrist curl (45° angle with a fat grip)..id say,i have a pretty okay numbers..but my weakest part is containment..my single arm deadlift is only 56kg..i bet u guys can do more..what do u think is the average number on single arm deadlift for pro level?

Good video, I appreciate the kind of analysis you are doing here. I will look further into the studies, but it sounds like those studies are not taking into account how we all build our bodies according to how we use them. A study that just looks at averages across a population, while valuable, says nothing intrinsically about the physics of the movements. We need better models to understand animal movement, Newtonian physics is sorely lacking. Biologically, small changes to the muscles, ligaments, bones, and connective tissue occur over time in alignment with how our bodies are used. Example: if you have practiced cupping and pronation together (toprolling, for instance) those movements will be stronger together. The positions you train the isometrically applied strengths in will be stronger. Isometric strength involves a LOT more than just muscles. As a massage therapist, I am generally stronger in pronation with wrist kicked back than wrist flexed. This is disadvantageous in arm wrestling and I am working on training my body to be good in both. Most importantly, you would love looking into tensegrity systems and the role of connective tissue in the body, as well as biological laws with as moore’s law, Davies law, and Wolff’s law. Regarding the changes bodies undergo through the bones, nerves, and muscles/ligaments. It will change your view of the body and allow for greater alignment between what we experience and what academic studies show. Generally, most academic studies seem to be WAY behind the cutting edge, testing outdated models again and again like they don’t care about truth or discovery, just on doing an acceptable form a research that can uses the right dogma and format to get published and bolster their career goals. Few are rocking the boat, and our science is suffering a slow death. Feels like polishing the brass on the titanic.

why wasn't I used as an example of flop presser 😢

Lifting "pronation" with a cupped wrist is a backpressure lift, not a pronation lift

So we are right to say that Levan’s 80kg lift is not as good as Devon’s 75kg lift due to the form?

6:06 So if Devon can do 73 kilos on pronation kicked back, what more if he's in a cupped position? Since neutral/extended grip is 25% weaker than a flexed one?😏

This channel is the shit

Well ik people who have last there hand but still have pronation and there for they win the match like devon vs Gorge Devons cupping was back but still had pronation therefor won

Thumbnail 😂

I don´t understand this: 0:08 on the table cupping is used to turn 0:12 your opponent Palm up and expose their 0:15 arm while pronation is used to prevent 0:19 that from happening Always thought it´s other way arround: pronation used to turn - cup used to prevent that

Is there a PHD for arm wrestling?

hot thumbnail.

Its obvious how kicked back wrist makes promation lift harder

I love this approach. Too many of the big names in this sport are a bit "gym-bro"-types.

Qulaity vidoe my friend😂❤

Cobra invented toproll?

bro u literally look like kyndergali ongarbayev

Side go brrr 😂

Being honest, i believe that my pronation is stronger than my cupping, but i don't deny that my cupping is neither strong, i believe that, 'cause i ussually train more my pronation than my cupping at least with mire quantity of exercises, because to cupping i only do, (flexion(curl) de muñeca), i do not know how to say it in english, pardon me, but well, thats all, goodbye and, good night, have all a nice rest and a good morning.

Great video just one ques But if we are weaker while kicking back the Wrist.. Then why is it used to pronate more nd avoid a hook (during a match)