Pulp magazine "Weird Tales" introduced truly cosmic horror to sci fi and fantasy, but it also left a legacy of some of the more troubling elements still lingering in the genre.

"my work sucks. you have no right to judge my work. all of your writers are terrible." yep! that's Lovecraft!

Imagine buying a magazine expecting something erotic like the cover only to be greeted with an H.P Lovecraft story

A remarkable thing about Lovecraft is, towards the end of his life, when he was able to go out and really see the world (he began traveling to Florida and Quebec as his social anxiety was better coped with) he began to condemn his earlier, reactionary views, and even called himself a jackass in a letter: "What a complacent, self-assured, egocentric jackass I was in those days! . . . I can the better understand the inert blindness and defiant ignorance of the reactionaries from having been one of them. I know how smugly ignorant I was. . . . It's hard to have done all one's growing up since 33-but that's a damn sight better than not growing up at all." -HPL in a letter to C. L. Moore, February 7 1937 It was also Howard who challenged Lovecraft on his views, and overall helped mold him as a person in his later years.

"There are a lot of good reasons why you shouldn't publish my stories. If you find a reason you _should,_ no freaking editing. P.S. Your other writers suck, but A for effort I guess." I've been wondering what's wrong with my pitches to publishers, but now it's so clear! Lovecraft sure had the world figured out, huh?

Fun fact about the covers shown, they were made by a woman named Margaret Brundage. It's a shame that for her work that not even you guys mentioned her.

Lovecraft and Howard once collaborated on a story with three other authors called "Challenge from beyond". Each author wrote a part of the story and passed it on to the next and it really exemplifies the difference in how the two approached their work. The story is basically about a guy who finds a weird old rock that starts doing some supernatural shit to him. Lovecraft then reveals that the rock is actually an alien machine meant to swap the minds of who ever picked it up with that of an alien from a distant world who would then study the world's culture and prepare to conquer it. So now there's a worm alien in the guys body and the guy himself is now trapped in a worm body on an alien world. Howard then writes about how the guy then realized that all the moral codes that restrained him back on earth were really just his own concern for his reputation, and now that everyone he had ever known was gone he had nothing holding him back. So determined to experience life as a worm alien to its fullest he lets go of all hesitation and beats the worm scientists around him to death before running off to kidnap the worm alien's god and become the ruler of that world.

Weird Tales. Innovators of the clickbait thumbnail.

Robert E. Howard's suicide destroyed Lovecraft, which quickened his death from cancer not long after.

What I love about Howard's female characters isn't that he made some of them stereotypically heroic, head-chopping shield maidens, but the ones that, despite how hard their position is, don't panic and bravely play their part in their own salvation. A good example of this is Muriela in Jewels of Gwahlur. Despite being in mortal danger, she manages to play an ancient godess convincingly, which helps save both her and Conan.

Howard turned Sword and Sorcery from Three Musketeers to Dungeons and Dragons

Weird Tales magazine: *Sigh* we can't get any good spooky stories Lovecraft: Hold my eldritch horror

Poor Robert Howard. "Why do you write like you're running out of time?"

“Here, (Howard) could mash together cultures, places, and historical periods as he wanted” Cue picture of Aku, from Samurai Jack, standing behind a few buildings examples as if he’s just part of the scenery.

A quote to live by: you can greatly admire and be inspired by a person's works and yet still know when to call them out on the questionable conventions they name their cats by

Conan being know for his strength is deep misunderstanding of his character. In many stories he was far from being the strongest man. While he was significantly stronger and tougher than most, what defined him was his presence of mind and swiftness both physically and mentally. That combined with his high aggression potential (as opposed to being an aggressive jackass in general) made him a fierce and focused killing machine.

Lovecraft here looks like he’s seen the shit he writes about.

“All fled all done, so lift me on the pyre. The feast is over and the lamps expire” Robert E Howard’s suicide note.

I really really like the theme music for Extra Sci Fi.... it is peaceful and mysterious and techno and well done. I wish it was a bit longer.

I always wonder what could have become of Lovecraft if he had lived longer. There is a very interesting documentary about him that really helped change my view of how he came to be who he was. He was a social recluse, incredibly scared of the outside world even from a young age. He lived through the books of his grandfather. Some say his xenophobia and rascism is a product of his time, but that is not true. His only contact with society were the books of his grandfather and his family, and moreover, his family was horrible and his early life unhealthy and tragic. He was rather a product of his *grandfathers* time and of mental issues. The man had immense psychological problems of exactly the kind that create a positive feedback loop with his believes. But what is fascinating about him is the change that begun in him when he met his wife. Describing her actually sounds like what one would assume is Lovecrafts worst nightmare. She was a jewish immigrant from Ukraine, a widow with children, open and extroverted, emmancipated and a successful business woman, fashion designer and journalist and a woman that like to travel. He was deathly afraid to even leave his home town. But for her sake he left it and went to New York with her. He hated the place and the melting pot it was was like pouring a constant fuel on the fires of his fears and insecurities and the marriage broke after two years because of financial troubles, spacial seperation and alienation. But the man got better. During his lifetime, he never really got over his xenophobia, but the impact on his work started to shift. It didn't disappear, but knowing all of what happened and all of what he thought I think I can see a slow shift. It seems like his relationship with Sonia initially changes his outlook, but living in New York was too much for him and brought back most of his former fears. But after digesting the seperation and getting back to his known and beloved home I feel like he got a lot better about it. The time after his divorce was marked by a clear downshift in writing output, as was the time after Howards suicide, but I think, as sad as that may be, after every hardship his perspective shifted a little bit. I don't know if he could have ever gotten over it, but I feel he made the most progress when he was at his lowest. I got the feeling he also got a lot more accepting of making money off his work towards the very very end. His friends always tried to convince him but he saw himself as inferior and pathetic, unworthy of mass attention, never publishing some of his best work. Reading all the correspondences and what else we know from the time around his death, I feel like he died before he might have done some of his best and potentially not rasicst work. Some of his friends certainly thought so. He was on the verge of making money and getting recognized. A lot of the process had already started, but the first *real* wave of recognition and and monetary success came shortly after his death. Seeing the progression in his writing skills and his views, as well as his self-acceptance of his work, I can absolutely see him actually writing a novel he is not too deathly ashamed of publishing. Or maybe not. Maybe he would allways have stayed a xenophobe, but it is fun to speculate.

One of my favourite things about Lovecraft, is that through his life, he deeply regretted the racism he spewed in his youth. He married a Jewish woman, he publically stated his great shame for stories like Shadow over Innsmouth on account of their racist messages, and his later works have a lot less of that shit tucked between the pages. He was not a perfect man, he had many faults and flaws, but he realized that he had them, and tried to make amends before his death.

"Pop consciousness" Can we appreciate this term for a second

In regards to Grimdark. Grimdark is not a genre, it's a descriptor. One born of a marketing slogan to describe the nature of the setting (that it is grim and dark). You can have a Grimdark war story in the future alongside a Grimdark story about modern day crime.

Also, chainmail bikinis weren't invented till the seventies, but I guess that could have been figurative language on your part.

4:57 "Long ago, in a distant land, I, Aku, the shapeshifting master of darkness unleashed an unspeakable evil! But a foolish samurai warrior stepped forth to oppose..." Yeah, in a place like that, that could totally happen.

I'm reading Conan stories for the first time, having grown up watching Conan animated series. Reading the first story I already saw the influence of cosmic horror, a term the author actually uses in the story. He describes a dream Conan had where he crawls to dark tunnels with alien symbols where he meats a dead prophet that makes his sword magic. Also a creature/demon that he fights that sounds out of a Lovecraft story. I'm very excited to read the following stories.

If your watching in 2023, it is the 100th anniversary of Weird Tales Magazine.

You mention that Red Sonja is a creation of Howard, but she's actually a 1973 creation of Roy Thomas and Barry Windsor Smith for Marvel Comics. Howard did make a character called "Red Sonya of Rogatino" who served as inspiration for the latter, but they are distinct.

I actually kind of like the tropes Howard helped establish. I just find them fun.

Sad part is that most people recognize his name by one of two categories: The Cthulhu or his racism. I recognize him by his writing. His stories, although old, still make my heart tick faster.

4:45 That should be "North Wind", not "West Wind".

"Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu." Translation: "In his house at R'lyeh dead Cthulhu waits dreaming."

"Greetings from Arkham" GG Extra Sci-fi.

After seeing several other channels touch on the subjects of Lovecraft and Howard, I have to commend you for keeping it primarily on the writing and how it influenced the genre rather than beating us over the head every minute with how horrible these writers were as human beings. You touched on it and kept it moving. Well done.

Oh Ya! My favorite HoTS character Sonya just got more interesting.

Howard's red sonja was a pistol packing inquisitor more a kind to a 40k hero then chainmail bikini heroine.

*Gimme Five* *all five...*

As a giant Mike Mignola fan I approve of this episode :D

I LOVE that you guys have been discussing the pulps. I love researching old pulp stories, and have found nobody on KZfaq does a good job explaining em' quite like y'all do. Keep up the great work!

I’m sure you guys at EC have heard of or even worked with Tale Foundry, but for those who are unfamiliar, if you like this series you’ll love their stuff!

DID SOMEONE SAY GRIMDARK!

what another great episode I may not be a fan of Lovecraft but I can not deny his influence in many works that ended up affecting me indirectly and Howard? Howard is my boy I loved too many of his stories in my youth with realizing he was responsible and even now as an adult this episode continues to educate me on him good stuff can't wait for those individual episodes!

For the last year have been reading the collection of Conan short stories while also at times playing the Conan MMO casually.

Rober E Howard was a genius- a man ahead of his time.

Lovecraft is my favorite author of all time. I'm not kidding, I have most of his works.

Love him, but racist as hell. Read all his works too. Really is the foundation of my favorite game, Bloodborne

Great film about Robert Howard's life. "The Whole Wide World" starring Vincent D'Onofrio. 😎

You know this is why I love this channel, it may glorify some unknown artist but it never glances over the flaws of these forgotten relics. Keep writing, drawing, or editing extracredits

_Lovecraft is a master of horror indeed. He does have a vision of the other side of horror..._

4:57 "Long ago in a distant land, I Aku, the shape-shifting master of darkness..." Thank you Extra Credits for confirming that Samurai Jack and Conan the Barbarian are contemporaries.

This was the episode I was looking forward to most. Thanks kindly for doing it!

1:35 Thank you for my new Wallpaper. And also thank you for doing this series. I love it! And I am learning about so many great guys. My to-read pile is growing bigger every episode.

"A Singular Strike!" for Extra Credits/Sci Fi

"weird tales", also known as "the magical adventures of Howard & Howard"

Robert E Howard didn't invent Red Sonja. He created Dark Agnes de Chastillon, Red Sonja of Red Sonya of Rogatino. And C L Moore created Jirel of Joiry. These three characters served as the combined inspiration for the character Red Sonja who first appeared in the comics.

I am so glad Howard got some due in this episode. His works are simultaneously universally-known and completely overlooked. If anyone wants to read some of the classier Conan stories, I recommend the Tower of the Elephant, Red Nails, Rogues in the House, and especially, ESPECIALLY Beyond the Black River (Howard's personal favorite of the Conan stories, and one of the few to omit sexuality entirely). Additionally, the Dark Horse Comics Conan series (starting with "The Frost Giant's Daughter and Other Stories") is excellent, though it falls off a bit later. It expands on Howard's stories in a way that maintains that witty edge that keeps Conan from being the cartoon hunk that he's so commonly misinterpreted as.

Love the percentile dice for sanity roll! Last time I played Call of Cthulu, my dice wouldn't roll anything lower than a 90! 🤣 At one point in the game, I even called my roll, "97", then rolled a 97!

Great episode, Extra Credits! I'm really liking this new series of yours. I hope you keep up with the good work! :D I only have one question, and that is in regards to your comment on the 'damsel in distress' trope. Why do you think it's such a bad thing? I agree that the excessive nudity displayed on the Weird Tales covers didn't help much to give the archetype a good name, but, from what I've studied, this archetype is much more older than the invention of Weird Tales. One needs to look no further than the work of C. G. Jung to find out how expansive and significant the story of the 'damsel in distress' truly is. It's one of the most recurrent themes in cultures across the world (not just the Western ones). And besides, if sexism is what you're worried of, I don't see any reason why you would call this archetype sexist or misogynist. To me, the story has always been one of sacrifice for that which we deeply love and respect (a woman or damsel being just about the perfect symbol to describe that sort of meaning). Anyways, that's just my personal thoughts. I'd love to know what you, guys, think about it. Maybe a really nice and interesting conversation can spring out of this. So with that said, good luck, Extra Credits! I wish you all the best! :)

"How to Bar Bar" hahahaha

Cant wait for the deep dive on lovecraft. Really love this series, please keep it up!

I guess it's somewhat appropriate that the darker elements brought to the horror and fantasy/sci- fi genres would also introduce many of the more distateful elements with, with all the implications it entails, if that makes sense? These dark and brooding worlds with their dark and brooding themes, casting upon themselves elements that were very lurid and questionable themselves, possibly reflecting the views of the world of the time, and echoing over to ours -- like phantoms and poltergeists -- unable, and perhaps unwilling even, to let go. Haunting the minds of the vulnerable, seeping into the empty spaces in our brains, taking root and blooming full with time and effort, god unwilling. In that's just some food for thought, though.

Great video! Hyperborea is actually the land beyond (huper) the north wind (Boreas).

I remember one of Matt Colville's videos talking about how the Rogue class in D&D is almost a better depiction of Conan than the Barbarian. He might have liked to smash things with a giant sword when he felt that was practical, but he also liked to outwit his enemies and could carefully search out and disarm traps if the situation called for it.

Lovecraft and Howard are 2 of my favorite authors. Even with the issues they had which sometimes creep into their books I still always enjoy reading the stories they wrote.

In my Weird Fantasy collection, there are some pretty cool stories, my two personal favorites are a story where 18/19 century slavers are themselves captured by aliens to be enslaved, but when the alien cops close in on the alien ship, the slavers are jettisoned out of the airlock to die and dispose of the evidence. The other is a story where a race of unstoppable aliens, which is indestructible, extremely fast, acute senses, and reproduce asexually, lands in a meteor and destroy humanity.

Conan-->Mako-->Samurai Jack. Makes sense.

My favorite Lovecraft homage would probably be Alan Moore’s comic book series ‘Providence’ which covers Lovecraft and his legacy and contribution to horror and dark fantasy but at the same time doesn’t shy away from addressing Lovecraft’s xenophobia and gives us a warts and all portrayal of the man and his legacy in Moore’s story of an NYC reporter who goes to investigate some strange occurrences in New England in the early 20th century and gets far more than he bargained for. A must read for any Lovecraft fans out there.

Great work, as always. Please keep it up. This channel is so sorely needed.

The H P Lovecraft Literary Podcast (www.hppodcraft.com) is a pretty great podcast that goes over all of Lovecraft's work with each week dissecting a different story and placing it within the history of Lovecraft's work. After they finish the Lovecraft stuff, they move on to other weird authors that were either contemporaries or who inspired Lovecraft. I recommend anyone interested in weird ficition to check it out.

@Extra Credits: You forgot some facts about Lovecraft: Both his parents were congenitally insane. They were possibly cousins, too. They had both spent time being locked into Sanitariums. They both had knife fights with eachother in the Kitchen, before being locked-away again. Howard was taken care of by nannies, and the house staff, mostly. It's in this environment of both deprivation, and sheer terror, is what fueled his writings.Where else could someone come up with the garbled-spittle of such words as: *'Shub Niggorath!* Then, suddenly, after the death of both parents, the family fortune had been spent, and now Howard was on his own. He was forced to live in one of the worst, dire slums of Brooklyn N.Y.: *Redhook....* But that is another story! *_>:|_*

Loved this episode! Great job on it. I am a huge Lovecraft fan and hope to see a more in depth episode.

You guys are doing a great job and I love your art style, keep up the good work.

To show you the power of Flex tape! I woke up Azathoth in half!

2:57 That new editor looks... familiar.

I'm just going to say, thanks to you guys, I discovered Lovecraft a few years ago. Thank you so much 💕

I start off every day with "Time to get spooky!"

Racism used to be a normal thing back then and while racism is bad, I don't think we should judge the past with today's glasses. Still a great video and also one of the best you have made. Have a good one

Robert E. Howard Philiphs Lovecraft

EC covering my favorite genres of fiction. Stoked for next week!

When you read the stories from Howard about Conan the Barabarian you indeed doesnt imagine Arnold Schwarzenegger but instead an oil-worker from the Mid-West.

Please tell me about noir. Problem Sleuth has been kinda a gateway for me into the noir aesthetic but I should really dive in.

To give an idea how racist Lovecraft was: he was considered racist during his lifetime. Meaning, for the standards of 1900s America, he was still considered pretty racist. He also once wrote an essay on why he likes cats, and used it to take a shot at black people. So, yeah, dude had his race issues. Heck of a writer though.

I love that you got right the sort of dice you would use to roll for sanity.

Damn. This series is not only fun and mind-nourishing to watch, it's giving me a BIG understanding of where clichés and tropes of our pop culture come from and the very foundations of sci-fi literature! Love it, love it, LOVE IT!

It is nice to look back on such influences and admire their works. And though their are these less than desirable effects, ideas, and troupes from these writers. We must rember that even these ideas can be used to benfit a story. And to teach a lesson of what once was. We should neither refuse or excuse simply accept what was was.

It's refreshing to me that you acknowledge the negatives of Lovecraft and Weird Tales, so many brush over any negative aspects of these stories.

4:57 I spy with my little eye an Aku. Thanks for telling us more about Weird Tales, Lovecraft, Ron E.Howard and company.

How can every video get me more pumped for the series?

5:02 Akuuuuuuu!

Rolled a 91 for sanity? Ouch......

Great video! One of the most interesting things about Howard is how good he was at plagiarizing himself and how doing so showed how fickle were the editors of the time as the same story written in different genres or in very similar genres with different character names could be both rejected and accepted by an assortment of editors. Many authors reuse their own ideas in new works, but Howard was truly a genius at the art.

1:47 I can hear the narrator from the Darkest Dungeon games/Audio Lovecraft novels telling me this and it's wonderful

Excellent video. You summarize history in a very understandable manner. I appreciate that this video went on to look at the less ideal implications of these two men. Without demonizing the men, it aptly acknowledged their faults and the repercussions of their actions within the context of their time periods. This is how history should be taught.

The great lord Cthulhu

I only just noticed she-ra was one of the things they show Robert E Howard inspired.

I knew two weeks ago when I saw Lord Dunsany's name that Lovecraft and his circle was going to pop up in this series before too long.

Haha aku hiding in Howard's cultural mixing.

Fun fact: "The Shadow Over Innsmouth", a story in which a man discovers he is descended from vile and horrible creatures with fish-like faces was written soon after Lovecraft found out that his grandmother was Welsh.

Shout out to the artist for this episode! I kept pausing so I wouldn't miss the little details. Great job!

I literally have my Lovecraft essay due tomorrow. Thanks for the ideas guys!