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Interesting discussion, thanks. Much like the Pantone "Colour of the Year", there is always a current "anti nutrient" or two. The most recent one seems to be oxalates, which replaced lectins, which replaced phytates, which replaced thallium in rice, which replaced goitrogens, and so on. My main takeaway is that these diets did have the beneficial effect of removing low quality aspects of mostly plant based diets (refined carbohydrates like white bread and pizza dough, excess salt etc.).

Thanks Ari and your hosts for this pretty interesting interview. I would have liked you to talk about oxalates. Perharps next time. I look forward to hearing a New episode from you and your Red pen reviews' guests.

Such a good and necessary discussion. Hope you get lots of viewers

I was very pleased to see the title of this conversation, and enjoyed it somewhat. I’m a longtime listener and always respect your curiosity and courage to talk about things that are controversial. This is no exception. I should say that maybe my only somewhat enjoyment is out of your control in that honestly requires them to only say what can be supported, and that the topic still stands in need of much more study. As a person who suffers from a long standing chronic illness (Lyme disease) I am determined to leave no stone unturned in pursuit of healing, so naturally diet is a big factor for me. I was encouraged to hear that you have also tied it all. But after all my experimentation I’m still not sure what the answer is. Seems like we still need to be careful about lectins? I did try carnivore. I lasted 9 days and felt worse and hated everything I ate. I’m a natural plant eater. It’s what my body wants. I’m an avid gardener and strive to eat as much as I can from my garden. However, my husband and I also raise grass fed beef and pastured poultry. In the end, I guess I’m thankful for the knowledge that Red Pen Reviews is a thing. One final question though: regarding LDL and CHD. I thought the Lipid Hypothesis has been proven wrong. I thought animal fats have been cleared as not harmful. Pretty sure one of your guests recommended polyunsaturated fats. 🤔

I hear mention regarding cardiovascular events that almost 50% of events happen with individuals who have low LDL too. Not just those with high LDL. Is this statement accurate? I am just trying to figure out what the truth is, but it seems we don't have the whole picture just yet and pinning the risk factor on one thing based on observational studies (as so many in the youtube sphere does) seems to cause more confusion. Hopefully we will learn more about this now that meat based diets are growing as more people struggle with health issues. There is something in our modern lifestyle which causes so many to have metabolic issues and auto-immune diseases, and I don't think it's the red meat. The processed foods seem like a much bigger factor, and many of the research papers don't separate processed meats from clean meats. Doing research on individuals who eats processed meats (i.e McDonalds, deli meats, etc), vs those who eat clean quality meat seems redundant and doesn't present the actual truth. This is why I feel there is so much misinformation coming from both sides. Making it incredibly hard to figure out what's actually true. And there are too many cherry picked, with exclusion of lots of data at times. I remember there being a paper where they excluded roughly 17 countries to push an agenda. Sadly I don't remember which it was. I'm also very curious if it's not actually the plant foods themselves, but the toxins in soil, environment in general, pesticides etc which are causing a lot of the issues for so many who struggle with plant foods. Another thought is, could we all have varying degree of capacity to actually handle these different foods? Also, if the inuits and other tribes are able to have meat dominant diets without lots of cardiovascular disease, why would it be different for the rest of us.

I really enjoyed this podcast and the insight brought forward. As somebody who’s bounced around to many diets in my lifetime, I always come back to a more centred or moderate perspective. Keep up the great work Ari!

Thanks for bringing this to your audience. This is such a confusing topic and so individualistic. Wanted to call the sound to your attention on this podcast. It is not optimal, very low.

I believe that, we humans, have a tendency to go to extremes. Eg: if “abc” is good for me, then MORE or ALL “abc” must be better, or best for me AND everyone else. I believe that reason and a more modest approach might work better. Regarding diet, it seems more reasonable to understand that there were times when we gorged ourselves on meat, after a successful hunt, during the seasons when fruits and vegetables were not in season. During times when they were, we probably ate what was available in the area that we lived. There must also have been times when we went without any food and that’s what would have brought on those periods of heightened energy, clarity of mind and well being. Those states of being were not permanent. They were just needed in order to figure out where and how to get more nutrition. Also, I believe that people from tropical climates had adapted to eating a diet that would not be the same or as healthy for people that were adapted to eating according to what was available in colder climates. This is why, I believe that we need to become more aware of how our individual body reacts to various foods. Another issue that I find today that was nonexistent to our ancestors. This is the way we produce “food” today. It seems the methods of mass production of our foods, brings about a more unhealthy and unnatural source of nutrition.

Ari, I humbly request that you and I have a conversation about the plant vs meat subject. I have lived as a walking medical experiment. Certain very specific things I have observed during all my experimentations (+-40 years..) might be of interest to you....

Ari,you sound like you are visiting my village in southern Italy.......very far away,crackling voice.....not ver ear friendly.......

I was confused by Ari's comment about meat potentially having a negative impact on telomeres, because in another TEB podcast heard recently about protein, it was stated that the body does not absorb vegetarian protein as effectively as animal protein. I don't have a weight problem, just trying to eat for energy and longevity, and getting a bit confused

AMEN DOCTOER THANK YOU.

Thank you so much! 70 yo woman so very confused I don't know what to eat so I'm vegetarian. God bless you. I just can't read anymore books!!!!

That's a misleading cover quote. Pre-agricultural societies were never vegetarian. It's also known that most such societies sought meat preferentially. The rare exceptions were those, like the Inuit, who had extremely limited access to plant foods. Guyenet knows all of this; he's written about it on his old blog. That said, the discussion itself was high quality.

They’ve attacked water as well. Now we should be consuming structured water.

I love the Red Pen reviews. But, apparently, they are not still reviewing books. I have a long list of books that I wish they would review!

Love the content of your youtube channel. I am like you as you suggested in the interview where you have tried all the diets that you think is the correct one. I am on the verge of going carnivore and have been moving that way over 15 years after being vegetarian then vegan then got type 2 diabetes then just started eating whole foods and then not type 2 anymore. Went to low carb then Keto and feel better each step. Finally got to a good weight by prioritizing protein and now feel like I need to try more fat so may still try carnivore but will give up carbs just a while to see if there is a difference. I really think I will come off it cause all the other carnivores seem to get theirselves better and then bring carbs back in slowly. The only question I have is when they review the books and on the evidence is how sound is the evidence because of the bias of the industry that is supplying the research, or did I just believe the idea that kelloggs, coke and all these other corporate companies that have the money to support their products with paid for scientific reviews in their favor. I wish there was more unbiased research on all these topics.

@TheEnergyBlueprint Awesome... Can one drink the water used to boil legumes? Will that water contain antinutrients? Thanks!

I wish the discussion of Paul Saladino had included his comments that ALL plants have created "barriers" to man eating them..especially re greens like Kale.

Diet answer is simple: Natural wild plant and raw animal food that is local to your area, that has received the same sunlight as your body. The main issue we face is that we now live an indoor life suffering from sunlight deficiency. This is the cause of issues we blame on meat for instance. The artificial light is a driver of modern disease. Also eating only cooked meat has nothing to do with being carnivore, that diet is a trend for people to feel superior to others.

Where's the paleoanthropologist who has looked at this? There are some. My layman's take away from them is that human precursors were plant based but closer to us in time humans are omnivore. But wild animal foods are not the same at all as industrially raised animals.

It's time to invest in a good microphone.

Its hard for me to take someone seriously (not you, your guest) who is with a straight face mocking the idea that tap water is a bad thing to drink. It just shows how ingrained they are by "true science" - I agree that Lectins & Carnivore are stupid but its hard for me to get on board with people who are supposed to be the group looking at othe rpeoples studies. If we just take industry study that claims tap water is fine to drink when theres tons of 3rd party tesitng of tap water showing how bad it is, just absurd. It would make me very skeptical on these 2's opinion on other topics that Im not in agreement with them going into it

I think the second speaker needs to look at Ben Bikmans work on Sat fat, and Malcolm Kendricks tbe clot thickens. I cant listen to anymore.