Ah Lord Shad is here. All hail king Shad

My very pleasure and really great choice of topic! I'm glad you liked my reply and keep up the good work!

@@metatronyt You guys should definitely do a video together as you both bring so much knowledge to the table!

Why nobody mentions the signature signficant influence of the Arab world and muslim world. Those info are primarily originally come from Muslim world in Baghdad or Granada or Damascus or Cairo or Isfahan. The monks and Catholic church until 1650s it just copy Muslim world science and discoveries for most of the time. Even the Americans is discovered first by the Muslims in Spain and later by Ottoman Empire before Columbus did ,but they didn't act abone it. Columbus used the Muslims maps and guides to reach America. A topic like this is a must to mention the superpowers of the time around Europe of the Muslim world, due to their massive science and the true Golden age that Europe is based it is science on and Industrial revolution and modern day. It can't be overstated how important to mention the link and influence as well as the context properly. The bible verses are not wrong if you are talking about the universe in all, the monks just deal it with something they can't understand yet. Earth here means the 7th heaven or lowest heaven or from human perspective first heaven bottom. Heaven i would say in sometime it means a universe or in other aspects it can means near God area where the angels or the heaven where the guardians and the price for the believers in God of mankind. Heven too can refer to the sky as well. It depends on the context. The Church didn't fight knowledge but they did fight many sciences from Muslim world and they did hide science from non church officials and high Nobility to control the masses. The idea that the church didn't fight science is also a misconception. You need to be in the middle. They fought science infront of the common folk whom most are not educated in academic.

@@metatronyt Why nobody mentions the signature signficant influence of the Arab world and muslim world. Those info are primarily originally come from Muslim world in Baghdad or Granada or Damascus or Cairo or Isfahan. The monks and Catholic church until 1650s it just copy Muslim world science and discoveries for most of the time. Even the Americans is discovered first by the Muslims in Spain and later by Ottoman Empire before Columbus did ,but they didn't act abone it. Columbus used the Muslims maps and guides to reach America. A topic like this is a must to mention the superpowers of the time around Europe of the Muslim world, due to their massive science and the true Golden age that Europe is based it is science on and Industrial revolution and modern day. It can't be overstated how important to mention the link and influence as well as the context properly. The bible verses are not wrong if you are talking about the universe in all, the monks just deal it with something they can't understand yet. Earth here means the 7th heaven or lowest heaven or from human perspective first heaven bottom. Heaven i would say in sometime it means a universe or in other aspects it can means near God area where the angels or the heaven where the guardians and the price for the believers in God of mankind. Heven too can refer to the sky as well. It depends on the context. The Church didn't fight knowledge but they did fight many sciences from Muslim world and they did hide science from non church officials and high Nobility to control the masses. The idea that the church didn't fight science is also a misconception. You need to be in the middle. They fought science infront of the common folk whom most are not educated in academic.

Feelings feelings everywhere but not a drop of sense.

@@twuandixon8675 bullshit. There is sense everywhere. You are just scared because the world hurts your feelings on a daily basis.

In other words Humans don’t change.

That is exactly what I thought. I mean physiks is so interesting. However when they apply Math to it it mostly doesnt Work. They have to round a lot. Which indicates that physiks is flawed. My physicsteacher in Highshool Said 7 is round about 12.

@@Blunderbussy no, you're just being a classic internet idiot. I stand by my statement, feelings get us nowhere, everyone has different ones right? Hence why you jumped straight in yours with zero thought 😂 dime a dozen.

And we still use the expression "all corners of the world" tho we all know it is spherical. That's just stupid

There are also Biblical phrases which call the world round/spherical, but the exact transaction will probably depend on who is translating it.

@@cp1cupcake "He sits upon the circle of the earth". Interestingly, I think the Four Cardinal Directions are really only relevant on a spherical earth. On the pizza model, east and west have to curve to make it around the flatnet. East and West cannot be a straight line - EVEN THOUGH WE PERCEIVE THEM AS STRAIGHT. Sound familiar?

I think its a reference to maps

@@laninthomasma8814 the original hebrew word here better translates to "round." It could technically refer to a circle, but could just as easily refer to a sphere or other round shape. So it doesn't prove that Christians or Jews necessarily believed in a Flat Earth. Not to mention that ancient Greeks, as early as the 3rd or 4th century BC believed the Earth was round, and even accurately measured the circumference of the Earth centuries before Christ was born. Also Noah's Global Flood isn't compatible with the Flat Earth theory.

My major at university was history...you just stated something far more profound than any of my professors ever did.

Feeling superior to our ancestors was a popular fashion in the Victorian Era. If there's one thing we can learn from them, it's not to assume your own age is the pinnacle of reason and technology.

@@wolf1066 on the contrary, the Victorians overly romanticised their ancestors

@@juliantheapostate8295 They romanticised some *aspects* of their ancestors - but not their ability at science and technology. The Victorians actively made fake historical artefacts - like torture devices that were never actually used, chastity belts which were also never used... the catalogue of Victorian forgeries of historical things is quite extensive.

Except that there was more ignorance and superstition simply because there was less education.

@@уроки_итальянского_с_мартино ну, адаптировались, что сказать. Надо почаще летать домой.

We speak with our hands as much as our mouths, that is a pretty known fact.

@@lolloblue9646 How to you silence an Itallian? Bind his hands. @Nikoslav Чем замолчать Итальянец? Захвати его руки.

English people gesticulate a lot more nowadays though. So he doesn't really stand out that much I'd say😁

Virgin flat earther: Earth is flatarinooooo Soyjack globe earther: nooooo, scietists say it's globe, nooooo Chad Medieval peasant: WIFE! It's harvest time already, bring me my scythe!

Away with you, vile begger. IT'S ALMOST HARVESTING SEASON.

Please show us a well illustrated model of the globe with real bent water, rocks, sand, upside down buildings, cars et cetera. Greetings from Canada

I was forerunner enough that we had a science teacher who ran the planetarium at the high school who taught about this to all of us 3rd graders on our field trip.

brilliant observation

great explanation. I never thought of that before...

Agreed. Excellent observation.

Excellent point. I was not aware of the _globus cruciger_ but, yes, you would be quite right: if the most common representation of the Earth was of a globe, then that's the idea they would have had.

That's what I was thinking, that's a pretty clear example that most every Christian going to Mass would've seen

Honestly, i love this community, and how different youtubers just casually reply to eachother when they want clarify, correct, or add to the topic.

One word.... Machinations!

Seriously, many history KZfaqrs treat it as a dialogue. Which I believe all good history is! When we reason things out as a community, we get much closer to the truth(generally). Watch Vsauce's video on the future of reason. Fascinating stuff.

It's almost as if the scientific method is applied by people and working quite well, enabling fact based, civil dialogue. Shocking. :) And yes, the historical community, on or off youtube, is pretty awesome.

Respectful dialog and rebuttal is both useful and a thrill as it is so often in short supply. If nothing else, this whole exchange and the material in it is a useful check on our egos. That may be worth almost as much as the particular facts.

If i remember correctly my school book had the wrong version, my teacher probobly known about that and just skipped that part. Something something this text is not quite accurate. While i´m old.. we still talk about books written in the early 90-tys (possibly late 80-tys)

Always thought (as an adult) that Christofer Columbus must have had a gifted publicist I mean, look, Vikings discovered Eskimos and, possibly, coast dwelling originalamercans after settling Greenland and camping out on the NE seacoast.

@@andypanda4927 columbus is not know because he was the first to discover america, but because he was g The last. Aftet that the world changed.

Let me guess you must be in a country were Columbus is celebrated.

@@TorianTammas Indeed, I'm from a country that has made Columbus part of our national mythology, to the point where teaching the actual facts about him and his voyage are a bit taboo.

I don't know about medieval people having a sense of superiority over people preceding them. Medieval Europeans had a LOT of respect for the Antiquity and loved to read about ancient Greeks and Romans. In Medieval thought, it was also often common for people to think that there was a "golden age" in the past that was simply better than the times they were living now. So yeah, I don't think Medieval people had the same sense of superiority over the people who preceded them, mainly because they culturally gave a lot of importance to everything ancient.

@@Knoloaify That's right, people in the Middle Ages knew about the great philosophers of antiquity and they knew they were standing on the shoulders of giants.

I would even go so far as to say the medievals were better in touch with the human experience than we are. They also wouldn't throw out the lessons of their ancestors at the drop of a hat, as others have mentioned.

I disagree. I think people have changed, on the extremes. Some got better, but the worse got much worse, with a stage to talk from.

Well that, and medieval people didn't have Facebook and Twitter. The village idiots didn't have a commons.

Yeah and even asserts the general claim that it's an ancient worldview. Stupid thought police lol. Heck it would be more useful to associate heliocentrism and geocentrism with a time period. Speaking of which, I'd love to see a Metatron video on that.

It's basically to debunk the doofus flerfs who will show up and deny facts.

@@astronichols1900 How is the worldview called where people thought that the earth was the center of the solar system, however they aknowledged that all other bodies rotated around the sun (which itself would rotate around the stationary earth)?

@@astronichols1900 Lmao. Flat earth nowadays is a very recent thing.

@@astronichols1900 I mean, the ancient Egyptians (like Bronze Age Egyptians) did have a flat Earth cosmology. It was an actual thing people believed in. To say that no group of ancient people believed the Earth was flat is false.

Pretty sure we have been regressing since the first "Enlightenment"

Well the accumulated knowledge and technological advences are growing, that's in a sense prograssion. But there there is no guarantee that this is a continous trend or that it's true for every little niche of knowledge. The modern man probably "knows" different things than a medieval man, but not neccerarily smarter.

@@SeriouslyAwesome Definitly. Imagine how we will be looked upon. A society that thinks gender is part of a social constract instead of biology. (However, being fat obviously is genetics...) Or what I have heard more and more in the last year: A normal woman can beat up a normal man in a fight. We have some amazing knowledge in some areas. And in others we are way dumber than we were just 50 years ago.

@@wedgeantilles8575 when everything is relative then there is no truth. The result is nihilism.

Yes, I love that

It just automatically does that for any video it detects flat earth being mentioned in even if the video is debunking it. It's easier than trying to manually give a basic rebuttal to every video supporting the idea.

@@BonaparteBardithion Yeah, no, it's just stupid. All attempts by Big Tech to police ideas and language is just immoral and moronic.

@@abraxas4261 I didn't say it was effective or even if I agree with the attempt. That just happens to be why you get those Wikipedia excerpts on certain topics.

OrwellTube

Columbus took a measurement from an Islamic Persian scholar, al-Farghani, that measured a degree of latitude in 57,65 miles (correcting the previous measure of 60,0). Then he decided that the miles weren't Arabic miles (a geodetic unit of measure refined several times during history, but always more than -1900m- EDIT for typo: 1800m ): no, the Persian Alfraganius was surely Roman miles, likely the shortest measure of the mile ever codified (1450m). Columbus made so many of these "optimistic misrepresentations of the sources" (let's not forget he conveniently placed an imaginary island, Antilla, just halfway through his route so he could refill his stocks) that it simply cannot be a coincidence. Mistakes tend to cancel out: Columbus was being straight out delusional. Still an awesome navigator: his knowledge of trade winds saved his own skin and changed history.

@@federicogiana7430 these "optimistic misrepresentations" happen so often to everyone so to attack him for that is somewhat petty he just wanted to be right because it would be his lifetime accomplishment and those that doesnt try cannot really accomplish anything most famous peoples in history are those that risked themselves tho obviously the schoolars obviously have to discourage him from doing so

@@kurokami5964 His contractual job was also to find and bring back wealth.

Didn't Columbus believe to his death that he actually discovered India from the other side, and that's the reason why we call native Americans "Indians" to this day?

Hell, a USA foot and a UK foot aren’t the same length.

well... Shad was partially wrong, most people didn't even think about the shape of the Earth in the early medieval period. So, no, some didn't know that the Earth is a sphere but they didn't know the Earth a disk either

It's turltes and elephants all the way down.

Millennium hand and shrimp

I see you are a man of culture

Five Elephants, according to Pratchett, you Heathens! 😉

The pratch

Which planet? Planet back then would mean the objects in the sky that moved differently from the stars. Generally, It would mean the classical Planets not including Earth: Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn but would include the Sun and the Moon. That's where the name came from, meaning wanderers.

More like: you wear weird clothes and you speak a language I can't understand. You must be French! We happen to be at war with the French you know, and we love to penetrate the French with all kind of tools! *maniacal laughter while drawing a sword*

@@AkatsukiEmpire well, i felt like a random peasant wouldn't know that the traveller meant earth as in the planet, not the literal ground.

@@AkatsukiEmpire To be precise planets were wandering stars, as opposed to the fixed stars. Dante's _Divina commedia_ ends: _The love that moves the sun and the other stars_ ( _l'amor che move il sole e l'altre stelle"_ ).

@@MarzoVarea Yes, you're right!

While many astronomers in Galileo's time were highly intelligent and had a great understanding of the apparent motions of stars and planets as observed from earth (at least the ones that didn't require a telescope to see), they were firmly entrenched the the Ptolemaic view of the cosmos. This view, while inaccurate due to being based on the false premise that the earth was the center of the universe, was very logically valid. Claudius Ptolemy, a 2nd century Egyptian scientist, was a skilled mathematician, and had developed a brilliant, well-constructed set of explanations for the motions of stars and planets that seemed inconsistent with how they would be if the sun, moon and five known planets were orbiting the earth. The astronomers through the 14 centuries between Ptolemy's time and Galileo's time would have been fully educated with this view, and would have faced terrible peer pressure if they went against it. A century before Galileo, Polish astronomer Nicolai Copernicus had advocated the heliocentric model we now know to be true, and was ridiculed and ostracized for it. Galileo's great contribution to astronomy and science were due to the fact that he proved Copernicus right, as he was able to use early telescopes to observe processes that were previously unobservable.

in Galileo's time, Astronomers like Kepler believed in heliocentrism and published it, but they didn't make a big deal about, didn't get jailed. Galileo made fun of his friend, the current pope in a book, represented the pope as a character in the book called "Simplicio". The church had a distinction between rhetorical, philosophical discussions of a topics, and discussion of a proposition as in fact actual truth. The universities conducted such "theoretical discussions" for hundreds of years, many topics. in fact a very clear discussion of the mechanical equivalence of a stationary earth and rotating earth was published 2 centuries earlier. Galileo insisted that the heliocentric view was in fact true. In the 16nth century there was no proof that the earth moved, in the 17nth century an aberration of light was discovered that showed it, in 19nth the parallax showed the distance of the stars, so in 1630, 75 -200 years til actual proof was found. So brilliant arguments but no proof by galileo that might cause the uneducaged (galileo appealed to the uneducated public by books in italian) vs waiting til actual proof showed up.

Copernicus published his book after he died so he was not ostracized. During his lifetime people who read pre-published versions of his thesis encouraged him to publish it, in fact a Cardinal wrote him and offerred to pay for publishing it. Copernicus didn't fear the criticism of the professional astronomer, just comman literate person who could barely read who's said its against common sense. Copernicus dedicated the book to the current pope. not something you would do if it was ridiciuled.

Thank you! I'm honoured by your words

@@metatronyt *Loud Fanboy Noises* :D

@@metatronyt why didnt you quote any flat earth earth sources from tht time period? A bit of a one sided presentation noble sir but I salute you for making the video

@Michael Terrell II probably due to the Max lifespan would have been less compare to now, For eg.if today it is 70-80 years, the adulthood age is 18 years, compare it to medieval the avg lifespan would be 60 years, so adulthood age would be 15 years. Following this pattern in the future it may be very much possible if the age of adulthood goes to 21-22 as our lifespan increase more due to better and healthy lifestyle.

@Michael Terrell II age of above 21 in pre modern era was not the adulthood age it was the age of when can a person can get authoritive powers, even today this practice happens, I think the marriage age in Roman empire was quite low 13-14 for both boys and girls. This only grew as time passed, at post "Dark ages" this number would have been higher.and now it is commonly 18-21 in majority of the countries. If you are above 14-15 in pre 17th century then you would be considered an adult not because you have influence on power, but you are a workforce, labor, soldier etc. Now this age has become 18-19 but still some 16-17 years old now thinks as they are adults and sometimes we treat them as this, similarly this can also be applied for pre modern world a 13 year may be considered as a young adult.

Most didn’t The few tend to prove the rule…

@@mpalfadel2008 I’d say most people in the Middle Ages reached the age of 40 and older, but there were certainly many who passed away very early, especially warriors.

"or all died brfore 30" was because in that video shad was addressing pair of misconceptions: one about shape of earth, and other popular misconception coming from the idea of "average lifespan in the medieval ages was 30" which may or may not be correct, but as shad explained in the video there is alot of factors that will lower the "total average" making the number misleading.

@@MehrumesDagon Biggest one being infant mortality.

@@mpalfadel2008 no, no, no. Most adults lived to about 55-65 even in medieval era. It’s children that skew the average to 27. 33% of kids don’t make it past 10 back then, and before you turn 16 you’re still more vulnerable until you reach majority.

Yeah, I remember being told that in elementary school. I was confused because I knew about people prior to that knowing that the earth was round. Also, the notion that seamen didn't know that the earth was round is frankly rediculous.

The primary cause of death was things like dysentry, essentially the result of poor hygienge during food preparation. There would have been a lot of death from bacterial respiratory disease as well. This would have affected adults as well as children, so life expectancy was still low. Some people obviously got very old, but it was much less common then than now. Improved hygiene standards and the development of antibiotics have drastically changed adult life expectancy in the last 150 years or so.

It's also is due to the age of the mother. Teenage mothers are more likely to suffer childbirth complications whereas young twenty somethings were the most fertile and more likely to survive.

@@Tugela60 You imply those people didn't know how to keep basic hygiene

@@blacktigerpaw1 Until relatively recently they did not. Not when it came to food and water. They had no idea what bacteria were, and believed that disease was caused by things like bad smells, magic and devine will.

@@blacktigerpaw1 Actually teenaged brides was more of an upper class thing. Among peasants marriage tended to be later because of the financial implications of leaving a parental home.

Funnily enough it did became en vogue to not bathe, but that was during the Baroque age.

@@Siegbert85 And this was mostly the noble. Common peasants still bathed because they worked with the dirt, and people don't like being caked in dirt all the time.

@Leilani Bexley I believe this is mostly a misunderstanding of statistics... statistically people didn't get old because the child mortality was so high.

"4 corners of the earth" also probably means the general directions North, South, East, and West

It's not a bad translation. No, it doesn't mean literal corners, it's figure of speech.

It's also likely it came from thinking about maps. A map is generally a drawn on rectangle, and maps were often only about the nearby regions. So coming from the four corners of the world might also mean from the "edges of the maps" .

@@fnors2 The reason why I believe is comes from searching in a room is the old expression "I'll search for x in the four corners of y., if I have to."

@@lloydgush "No, it doesn't mean literal corners, it's figure of speech" Yep: the same Bible speaks of "the four corners of the head", too.

Same here

This, taught wrong at elementary school. I am quiet sure it was at high school that they taught differently, but I might have read/seen it on a documentary instead. 30 years ago, so my memory is a bit hazy.

In my Grade School we're taught somewhat of the Washington Irving's tale of Columbus, but it wasn't that the scholars were ignorant but rather that Columbus fudged his calculations so it'd seems that the trip would be shorter also that he believes that there was some mass in between India & Europe sailing west. Plus we had the painting of Columbus trying to convince Queen Isabella with a huge globe next to her in the throne room in our text books. As well with his misadventures in The New World. Mostly in the Caribbean.

In the History of the World according to Flip Wilson Chris set sail to discover were the Ray Charles records came from.

Why nobody mentions the signature signficant influence of the Arab world and muslim world. Those info are primarily originally come from Muslim world in Baghdad or Granada or Damascus or Cairo or Isfahan. The monks and Catholic church until 1650s it just copy Muslim world science and discoveries for most of the time. Even the Americans is discovered first by the Muslims in Spain and later by Ottoman Empire before Columbus did ,but they didn't act abone it. Columbus used the Muslims maps and guides to reach America. A topic like this is a must to mention the superpowers of the time around Europe of the Muslim world, due to their massive science and the true Golden age that Europe is based it is science on and Industrial revolution and modern day. It can't be overstated how important to mention the link and influence as well as the context properly. The bible verses are not wrong if you are talking about the universe in all, the monks just deal it with something they can't understand yet. Earth here means the 7th heaven or lowest heaven or from human perspective first heaven bottom. Heaven i would say in sometime it means a universe or in other aspects it can means near God area where the angels or the heaven where the guardians and the price for the believers in God of mankind. Heven too can refer to the sky as well. It depends on the context. The Church didn't fight knowledge but they did fight many sciences from Muslim world and they did hide science from non church officials and high Nobility to control the masses. The idea that the church didn't fight science is also a misconception. You need to be in the middle. They fought science infront of the common folk whom most are not educated in academic.

Last time I was this early, Rome was still a little village on the Tiber.

Last time I was early, Rome was sacked by the Chad Alaric.

So it was under Napoleon ? (One of his puppet states in Italy, replacing the Papal States, was named the Roman Republic)

I've never chuckled at a "last time I was this early" comment. You didn't change this streak.

si Romania era Dacia

Yes and no. It's true that most people wouldn't care or consider it a relevant question. It's not true that they didn't have access to the information. Everyone went to church and priests had to be literate in Latin, so most of the population was only one step removed from the knowledge of the classical world. Depends a little on the time period and country of course. However as long as you accepted it through a Catholic lens information was available, just not necessarily useful or relevant enough for people to look for it

@@michaelkenner3289 Interesting fact, not everyone went to church. There's a channel on here that reads out historical writings, and one was of an executioner from...I want to say the 1500's, it might be earlier or later by a bit. He comments that some of the criminals he executed had never even seen a church in person. I also never said they didn't have access, but many wouldn't. The priests knew how to read Latin, and some of the elite, but the lower classes often only heard Latin, and the language is far removed from the content of the classical philosophy. Even if the priests were educated in the knowledge of the classical world, which was not a certainty, that doesn't mean they were passing it along, or agreed with it. Knowledge relevant to the Church's doctrine was available, but even then it was far from homogeneous, with many locals having a disparity in views on a number of matters (hence the need for inquisitions and the Church's self policing so that the position of the Church was clear). The Church was also much more interested in educating people in specific matters, the nature of the globe was not something an average joe need be concerned with (or from a certain perspective, should be concerned with) nor something a priest to a low class settlement would likely have the education to reflect on. Not all priests were of equal knowledge, or equally educated, and sometimes the gulf was quite large. That's if a place had a priest at all, they might have some other Church functionary, or need to go to the next town over. Like I said, if someone or their granddad had an interest, and sought out a book (or spoke with someone on the topic) they could probably find out what they wanted to know, but it's even odds they're gonna get some other explanation, or just consider it an idle fancy and go about their lives. There's also the big economic disparity to think about. Many people were dealing with rather extreme limitations on income, and things like books were not a relevant expense. So while the knowledge is accessible, the likelihood of many people in that circumstance getting ahold of it is low, simply because it's not going to dove tail with their needs. Pair that with your other access being dependent on the personal bias and education/interest of your local priest, and you end up with a lot of people who just wouldn't know, and might not even have an opinion, but if they did wouldn't have an informed one.

I don't remember if any of my teachers ever taught me "Columbus wanted to prove the world is round", but I do remember my family's 1990 edition of the World Book Encyclopedia said something like "A common modern misconception is that Columbus was trying to prove the world was round. He didn't have to. Most educated people in 15th century Europe already believed in a round Earth." Call that another example of "people from the past weren't as ignorant as we moderns think".

I learned that Columbus was told no by the Italians, so he went to Spain, and Queen Isabella said yes, and that he didn't realize how big the earth was.

They just pointed out that columbus was just trying to find a better trade route to India

@Will Aden I think we may have went to different schools lol

I think early on Columbus was used to push flat earth. Especially if you think about how prominent different christian groups were in American during the 80s and 90s. Create the mental association of Christian = Flat Earth. Once those died down the focus switched to denounce American for being a white imperialist country.

@Will Aden drop the con-servative propaganda. I was in elementary between 96 and 03. They taught how great Columbus was and didn't mention any of the facts surrounding his treatment of indigenous people.

@@kylewilliams8114 and what are the facts surrounding his treatment of indigenous people?

"early Church Fathers often made fun of them or at best argued that being so wrong about that shouldn't be considered heretical" I really would like a source for this because it sounds exactly like what I have been searching for, and it sounds hilarious.

True. Even Early Church fathers knew of a round or at least not flat Earth.

It looks like a LOT of teacher confuse the history and myths of Magellan and Columbus voyages, sad but true. Let me tell you about the first myth which is at least at the same level of Columbus one, Magellan's intention was to sail around the globe. No it wasn't, at any part of the voyage. What made Juan Sebastian Elkano take the decision to end the trip sailing around the orb was in fact the dead of Fernando de Magallanes.

Ian Fleming would have know far more about espionage and spying than Irving knew about geography and navigation given his background as a high ranking and influential member of British intligence during WW2

@@vonfaustien3957 Yes, but he wouldn't tell the TRUTH about his work in the Secret Service. You're right, he palled around with Fairbairn, Sykes, Applegate, and WerBell, but he didn't write about that. James Bond was a farce, comedy. Everyone that knows how it actually worked were laughing the whole time.

@@Psiberzerker the best parodies come from a understanding and subversion of the source material

@@vonfaustien3957 Oh yeah, non-spooks don't get half the jokes in the Bond books. Just the name Bond, the drink orders are an inside joke privy only to people that knew Flemming personally. (And uber nerds.) Same with Shakespeare. The vast majority of people miss the vast majority of jokes even in Tragedies like Julius Cesear. That whole dialog between the Centurion, and the Cobbler is a medley of puns for the Peanut Gallery.

I'm not a retired spook, but if I was, I'd lie about it.

I mean, "The Dark Age of Technology" in Warhammer 40000 is also called "The Golden Age of Technology" for that reason. It was a time of great prosperity but the Age of Strife that followed was so cataclysmic that vast amounts of knowledge and development from that time were lost. To the point where no one in the setting actually knows exactly what it was like.

@@bigmonkey1254 Yep. For all of the utter BS that comes out of Games Workshop, they of all people understood what was actually meant by historians using the term "dark age". I point this out constantly when people are talking about that aspect of 40k lore but don't understand why the _dark_ age was the high water mark of humanity. Not many people seem to even care why it matters, while at the same time they mourn the loss of STC tech and I just shake my head in dismay. edit: There are at least a handful of beings in the time of 40k that were around during the dark age of technology. At the very least there is the Emperor who was there for it. Also in theory there should be some sporadic activity from Necrons. In 30k there would have been at least a few more still alive. E.g. Malcador.

They would still produce erroneous results if they were given the same erroneous data. So I regret to inform you that machine brains would not help this issue. Though a machine might accept new data easier, depending on how that data selection is done. I am fun at parties! 🤣

Infelizmente no Brasil maioria esmagadora ou tem essa visão manjada da idade média ou o extremo oposto que beira o bizarro que chegam ao ponto de falar que a idade média foi o pináculo da civilização humana e deveríamos unir a igreja ao estado de novo. O tal filósofo tava mais do que certo quanto a muita "gente" ser como animais, seguindo mais pela intuição e sentimentos do que a razão.

Manda o professor tomar no cu. Onde ele aprendeu isso? No desenho do Pernalonga

What? This is just sad. How? Why?

What is the University you are studying at?

That would be legendary

It's not ideal, but Wikipedia is what most people know, it's not terrible these days (in fact, I have had professors point out specific articles on Wikipedia as being really good), and it can link to good sources.

@@InSanic13 I’m aware Wikipedia isn’t all bad, and admittedly you can find some sources there to get started researching a topic thanks to the citations. However, I have a big problem with KZfaq algorithms putting these labels/links to Wikis and treating them like warning labels of misinformation.

@@InSanic13 It peaked maybe a decade ago. It's getting worse these days. It'll change depending on the political climate rather than verifiable facts.

@@InSanic13 In many cases, it's fine, but it has a particular political bias, and KZfaq just loves to plop Wikipedia references on hot-button political points (mostly involving a certain problem the world has been facing for the past year and a half). This is probably the least political "context" blurb I've seen. Apparently, KZfaq thinks Flat Earthers are an influential force in society. Shows how out of touch they are.

@@ssholum Flatearthers usually are together with lots of anti-science conspirations, some of them with catastrophic consequences like anti-vaxxers. So I can see why KZfaq do this, even if the solution is ineffective.

I imagine it quite often. Usually when I'm hungry.

It's Raffaello.

It's spelled Raffaello, what's "ë" doing there.

If you like a stereotype people have about you, why not reinforce it?

@@AnotherDuck stereotyoes are underrated

When I can afford it, I'm tempted to get a brigantine as well. I recently acquired my first piece of armor, a gambeson, which I'm sure will be great to LARP in when I break it in. But I really want a nice brig like Shad and Metatron have.

I like that subtle way he has of saying, "I agree with this man of culture."

for a second, I thought essentialnto was a real word

The world is a disc under a dome. The globalists have lied to you.

@@LORDCTHULHU738 Bait.

@@LORDCTHULHU738 It's actually a giant doughnut. The Bible lied to you.

@@LORDCTHULHU738 actually its more like a potato.

True but it was not called science. Back then physics was philosophy, biology was natural philosophy and chemistry was alchemy. Everything was building off of the works of the ancient greeks and this was not challenged till the age of enlightenment

But how much a popular thing is "science" in medieval time or dark ages compare to religious dogmas, myths, & superstition?

@@crozraven well it depended on the people, time period and location. Though even prior to the fall of the empire it was commonly agreed that religion and superstition was not a substitute for reason and logic. Its just what they thought to be science was sometimes incorrect. But that's no different to the present time where new discoveries sometimes replace commonly outdated beliefs in the field of science.

Interestingly abrahamitic religions both helped sience and slowed it down. The one idea is "If god made the world, then everything in the world is touched by god, we can come closer to god when we observe and understand the world." This thought was common in the medieval arab world and in renaissance europe. The other position is that typical stereotype of the dogmatic theist rejecting new thoughts. This was fashioned in medieval europe and in the arab world after their golden age in medieval times.

Which he got from the screen of the iPhone that you gave him, where he was watching KZfaq Flat Earth videos and laughing. Alright, that was a bit too try hard...

That's evil. I like it.

And then the rats get the blame ...

I am amazed to see how few thumbs up you became and how many accounts commented on having been taught the wrong story. I heard the story of Columbus being the only one in his time to believe the Earth was round in this video for the first time ever. However, I have heard sometimes that Galileo Galilei was the only one in his time (17th century) who believed that the Earth was round, so if the narrative was at all consistent, it should have meant that Columbus didn't know it at all… But I believe the narrative isn't even meant to be consistent.

Also you can always see the spherical form if you live on the ocean or any large body of water, especially if there is a big peninsula stretching out into the distance and "diving" under the horizon like the big ships do if you watch them sailing away.

​@@raimohoft1236 This is just a theory but most people in the US who seem to believe in the flat earth are people from rural communities right? Maybe in addition to not having the best education they also rarely get to actually see the ocean

@@Raleyg This is either a language issue or a gross overgeneralization. At least in American English, 'rural' has no connotation with 'inland' as opposed to 'coastal'. E.g., most of Florida, including where I grew up, is quite rural (i.e., not urbanized), and all of it is quite coastal. I'll grant that most large cities in many countries are either on seacoast or have access to the sea, but that is not quite the same. I'd also want to get some data on the correlation between living in a rural area and being a Flat-Earther before I admit that proposition.

@@NemisCassander rural areas TEND to have lower education rates, so probably that. Atleast in my country and how It was taught to me.

She was caribian? (or is)

Well here's the thing... The first one is *mostly* right about Columbus's OWN treatment of natives. Columbus HIMSELF tended to treat them with kindness, noting in his own writings how he wished to SUBJEGATE them, NOT enslave them. He wanted to turn them into subjects of the crown, not whip the fuck out of them and force them to work. Columbus himself was never in the new world for very long periods of time (makes sense after all, he'd have to constantly return to Europe to report back to Spain since phone lines weren't a thing..) It was his Spanish subordinates who ended up doing all that horrible stuff. Since he wasn't even in the Caribbean very often nor for very long at a time, nor did he have the power to stand up to a bunch of Spanish generals and their loyal soldiers. Good luck asking the King of Spain to do anything about it either, Columbus wasn't Spanish, and the King of Spain certainly isn't going to slap his military leaders on the wrists for any reason.

This is simply untrue. Columbus was removed as governor of Hispaniola by the Spanish crown and returned to prison in Spain for brutality towards the local inhabitants. Reported crimes included rape, murder, torture and mutilation as well as enslaving the population to mine gold in such brutal conditions a third of those enslaved and set to work died within 6 months.

@@septimus7524 Ultimately, you are correct, in that the people he brought with him were undoubtedly worse. But, as we even see today the most public figure, gets the most generalized blame. Native Nations across the entire content cary the anguish brought by "his" ships, not just the Caribbeans, @lloydgush . She was equal parts Blackfoot and Sioux, actually.

Thank you, @@iainlovejoy2135.

They believed in a lot of possible shapes (those pre-Socratic philosophers had a lot of strange ideas) but most got abandoned by the classical era.

@@Segalmed the Earth is shaped like a Tetrahedron dont @ me

Thts not true the average greek never believed in a globe it was a very obscure and long forgotten theory until rediscovered by the Jesuits and the Freemasons. Christianity didnt purge a knowledge of the globe from the masses it was simply unknown and so when you say "even the greeks knew" thts simply a lie or a statement made from total ignorance

@@Madara-rz8hv I mean, this is false. It was common knowledge that the Earth was round long before Christianity was a thought in someone's head. The Romans already knew this. And where do you think they got this knowledge from?

@@minutemansam1214 wrong

Yep I was taught the false Columbus story in junior school back in the 1960s

the dark ages usually refers to fall of Rome to rise fuedalism and medieval cities (500 -1000 AD) . regular Middle Ages (1000-1500 AD) Scholars earliest worked to preserve knowledge. After 1000 AD they translated Greek texts into Latin and begin to try to master was was in the translated texts 1200 to 1500. "God's philosophers how the medieval world laid the foundations of modern science" by James Hannam

@@robertmurphree7210 Yeah, there was indeed a period of about at least three to four centuries (which is of course still much longer than any human lifetime today) after the fall of Rome where parts of Europe became like Australia in Mad Max. A book I read recently about the Habsburg dynasty and their empire, starting from the dynasty's foundation (unfortunately I can't remember its title; I just know it was by a British author, and it may have been just "The Habsburgs") stated that for a time, the Danube Valley in modern-day Hungary may have been completely depopulated in the face of repeated invasions by the Huns, Magyars, and various Germanic and Slavic tribes. And at least in Britain, it might say something about the societal breakdown required for proper recordkeeping in how we still don't know for sure whether King Arthur was just a myth, a real person, or a combination of several real people. Same with Robin Hood about 800 years later, despite European society and living standards having improved greatly by then.