Their dishonesty deserves the cancellation, but I cancelled MoFi out of my record buying circa 2015 when I received a poorly pressed Miles Kind of Blue 45 rpm box set. After this revelation, I'm so glad that I did!

@@The_One-Eyed_Undertaker its fine but they should put this on the cover thats it find a good name dont lie

@@The_One-Eyed_Undertaker What? So MoFi proved a question nobody was asking? The point of this consumer product issue is TRANSPARENCY. Period. It is NOT about analog v digital by any stretch. Had the On-Step MoFi releases been truthfully labeled, we wouldn't be here. Truth-in-labeling is the end game goal. Nothing else.

@@The_One-Eyed_Undertaker Digital cutting can sound really good, but it doesn't surpass all analogue. You may be willing to accept a second rate vinyl release, but there are those of us who hear the difference in all analogue and won't. I won't touch the Thriller release with a 10 foot pole and others who feel the same way should do the same.

@@mazzysmusic Correct. Absolutely. But instead of doing that one small thing in the beginning, now we have this whole thing coming out.

Esposito did a great job.

@@jamesmachado9366 yeah, I mean we now know for a fact that they use a digital source. Mike didn’t go to do an exposé on MoFi. I’m certain it was also fun to be there and see all the stuff. Shit I would geek out to. No blame on him for not getting all the specific answers that some might have. I think we all now know what they’ve been doing more or less.

They invited him only because they knew it was the easiest way to deflect and do damage control. However, it is true that with his approach he was able to get something out of them. If a journalist went there and started pounding them with the hard questions everyone wanted asked with specifics they would have said interview over.

Everyone is named Make. You get my like lol

​@@jivy2 Yes, this exactly how I feel. People seem to have this fantasy of an aggressive cross-examination where Mike would force them to answer every single question that people have, but that just doesn't seem realistic. I think the only way MOFI was going to start opening up about any of this was in a relatively non-confrontational setting.

BIGGEST FANBOIII

Fremer is a bought and paid for industry insider who's job it is to protect industry lies.

Batt, I really do like his reviews and find I enjoy most pressings he recommends, but his recent video tour and interview of the United Pressing Plant (one of the videos to launch his new channel) started to change my feelings for him. He had the exact same opportunity with United that Mike Esposito had with MoFi, and got MUCH LESS from them than Esposito did from MoFi! He did not address AT ALL the fact that many feel United are the plant with the worst quality pressings in the world! No ahead of time agreed to easy lead question allowing them to state they have taken certain steps to increase quality, and definitely no ”hard, investigative questions only a reporter could ask”. You think the guy that’s “just a record store owner” that he is going out of his way to bad mouth would have passed up that opportunity? Heck no. It was a total puff piece. I fear my trust for Mr Fremer’s word has changed just as much as MoFi’s, and that’s too bad.

@@jeffwhitehead6268 That's a very interesting and honest take. I have a feeling you're not the only person to now feel this way about Fremer. I have for a long time felt this way, but I'm a lot more cynical than the average bear. He always has to go out of his way to defend himself, the most visible sign of of a breakdown.

Yup. And it leaves the door open for other interviews

Yes, I agree. I dont understand why M.Fremer is so angry about all that. Maybe because it was NOT him going to MOFI to get information. Obviously, getting direct information directly from MOFI within a week, even if not 'perfect interview', is something that should be considered highly positive. Stop shouting at the screen and at everybody's else face, M.Fremer !!!

You two sound so self righteous, sorry my perception Mr Espisito opened the door and got Mofi to admit to doing dsd, in the first minute He then gave Mofi the ability to talk about there process For anyone watching this, it is obvious that there were concessions between the two parties That is why Mike got the interview and the answers Now let light be the disinfectant

Mike E and MoFi fanboys in the house...

@@zamkezambo observant ≠ fanboy

Skip to 37:00. Fremer gives a great explanation of his experiences at Sony regarding DSD vs live vs PCM 16 bit 44k vs 20 bit super bit mapping vs tape vs 96k 24 bit vs vinyl.

Fremer is THAT guy that can’t stop talking about himself. He is like that old senile uncle that doesn’t know how to read a room or know when to STFU.

Well written - Fremer can’t have paid attention to what was said. He seems to have lost is… Sad…

Eposito didn't accomplish anything in the interview, he made MoFi happy. That's all. Period.

This is the latest in a few ill-tempered videos from him.

Actually you're dead wrong- any journalist worth his salt would have done a FAR better job grilling Mofi and getting definitive answers from them. Watch the YT video by 'poetryonplastic'- the best video on this whole subject, he's a collector and a journalist. They are experts at research, getting answers, extracting info, and backing everything up with actual evidence. Mike was kind of winging things 'on the fly', in doing so he kind of lost perspective. We can all appreciate his video and effort, but he seriously let Mofi off the hook in many ways. They needed to explain the exact verbiage they have used in the past which directly implied all-analog (again, please watch the video from 'poetryonplastsc').

@@Matasky2010 I get it and I agree. Too bad any journalist worth his salt didn’t get the interview.

@@luizfcoimbra82 Mofi would never agree to it lol. But I encourage everyone to watch the video I mentioned-‘poetryonplastic’ provides exact examples of the misleading verbiage Mofi has used- some ppl still think they were simply ‘vague’, not really the case.

He probably won't because he is just arrogant and angry someone stole this scoop from him!

People were scammed ...............final !

Yep!

They didn't invite any journalists. Duh! A journalist knows how to ask follow up questions and not be sidetracked. By any definition of a good or bad interview, this one was bad. Just a fact.

@@trackingangle929 You are now free to ask your follow-up questions and report on them. Everybody wins.

@@trackingangle929 you've lost all credibility - you a journalist ADMIT to covering for mofi many times in your past dealings here 15:11 and 6:07. This is all I can hear when your lips move 14:37

'Duh!" is a personal put down. Please let's try to keep this discussion content focused and avoid personal slights, or that a technique to create engagement? Journalism also comes in many styles and techniques; lacking follow-up questions is not a mandatory definition of a bad interview. Judgment of the quality of an interview is subjective. It can be said the Layman truly scooped the Pro with this Mofi interview.

It's Fremer. All he can do is boast for himself. It's so obvious and constant.

Exactly Kris, Mike E. kept his balance throughout

Yep there was a reason Fremer wasn’t there, apart from who wants to be grilled by an a-hole?

Agree.

he claims very clearly in this IV here that he always knew and lied to us as well....he said more than once that he was "covering for Mofi" !!! so Fremer is to blame as well!!!

He can’t hear crap. The entire analog vs digital debate is a total hoax, a fantasy perpetrated by phony “golden ear” reviewers.

Fremer is full of shit, like most "audiophiles". I don't believe he'd even be able to distinguish between a direct feed from his turntable and a CD recording (from the same turntable).

maybe he just don't got paid... so nothing for him...

He know he had pie on his face

Exactly. Journalists have had years to probe this topic, yet they haven't.

Exactly. Mr Fremer is not doing himself any favors by behaving this way in public.

@@SC-29229 he’s been digging this hole for years, Mike Esposito just gave him a new shovel.

Yes

I can't help but feel that Fremer is jealous because the journalist was scooped by the record store owner. He got the scoop followed by the invitation and interview, not Fremer. Mike E did a great job with a story that blew up FAST and clarified things in a second video. And no, this isn't the end of the story.

@@jeremiahdrueke2610 100% Fremer comes off a bit butt hurt here. rather funny as he cannot drop it (bringing it up atleast 10 sep times over the course of this video) hhaa

@@JS-wi9mw Fremer seems upset that he knew all along, kept it under wraps to help MoFi and then MoFi allows a Record Store Owner to break the news and not give Fremer the time of day. LOLOLO I love it

I understand that record companies bear full responsibility for allowing their recordings to be used in this way.

I would hardly refer to Mike at the Inn Groove as a "lowly record store owner"

Me neither. I said that in reference to the narrative some are spinning - namely Mike is somehow not qualified to question the Mo-Fi team since he isn’t a professional journalist.

Not convinced Fremer really listened that hard to the interview, as he mispositioned what was said. Found him annoying after a while I’m afraid

Exactly

@@JonKentplus same here seems they didnt Listen to the interview

very telling eh...

Because Esposito has exposed Fremer as a crap journalist.

Thats what I got from the interview too - they qualified that some things in the pipeline during the transition were all analogue and some weren't but after the transition, all had a DSD step

Yeah, pretty sure they said the Miles catalogue was cut from DSD digital files produced from the master tapes.

They did indeed. Michael was too busy hurling insults at Esposito to notice.

Exactly right 👍

That’s what I heard too

Too true.

Indeed. There was no need for Fremer to criticize Mike E's interview skills. Fremer has had the access and the resources to investigate this story and he didn't do it. It's odd that Fremer insists on spinning this to be about Mike E, but I guess they have beef going back a ways.

@@nickfowler515 Fremer has the beef, because he knows people like and listen to what Mike E says. He just comes off as an old jealous pr*ck who yells at clouds these days.

And I was told point blank that they would use a "tape copy" for "Thriller" so ....

So is DSD digital? Or from Analog?

@@trackingangle929 looks like they lied right to your face

@@trackingangle929 I wonder if they created the DSD from a tape copy?!

@@daleclark4160 no “they” didn’t lie to his face. His alleged source did. There’s a difference.

I agree, I didn't get the over critisim of Mike, and how he should have pressed harder. He asked the question, and the answer was muddy but clear. It is all DSD, and it is kind pointless to ask about title by title. Some of these releases are amazing, and some are not. The thing is, if they can use a digital step and produce some as great as the Bill Evans one Step or Miles Reissue, then they should be celebrated. I am not sure why they are hiding it. It is innovative. All are we asking is just be upfront about the source

Fremer didn't want to believe what he heard.

@@luizfcoimbra82 doesn't seem like he understood what he heard. But he's the pro....

Good point. Also 4x DSD has only existed for a decade.

They said all their Miles Davis titles were from DSD. What did you expect them to say? What matters is the end result. I agree that they could have been more open about their process before this blew up but it no big deal really. Storm in a tea cup!

No big deal?

@@solomonstewart1025 What matters is the end result. Before "Mo-Fi Gate" broke, Mo-Fi customers were generally very happy with their purchases.

I don’t believe he mentioned journalistic integrity. He was it seemed, upset that the interview didn’t have a journalistic purpose and as a result didn’t chase down a story or get specific answers. I don’t know who Esposito is but if you are a journalist, you are there on behalf of your readers trying to ask questions and reveal a story that is informative and hopefully diverting or, engrossing. If in Michael’s opinion the journalistic brief was unclear or not being met, it’s fair comment. There seems to be a story about product branding and product integrity and that is a big story that needs discussion by the parties involved. When records can be bought new for four or five times the price of more mass produced ones but seem to be misleadingly described, some buyers would be interested in what MoFi does and how it does it. Michael was bemoaning the missed opportunity. I haven’t seen it yet but it begs a question, doesn’t it?

Fremer didn’t actually “know”, he only suspected based on his listening. He is on record (pun not intended) that Carlos Santana Abacus vinyl previous to Mobil Fidelity sounded better.

But is lower resolution in terms of the processing used. Not as good.

This 125 usd is price for adding pops, cracks, vinyl noise to dsd dude. Enjoy

@Pioneer Dude, you do understand that 1) The comparative resolution used for mastering is important. There are different resolution DSD files. The lower the resolution, the more information is lost in the process. 2) Ticks and pops aren't the music. It's like going to a jazz club and saying that tinkling of glasses lowers the quality of the music. The potentially more musically involving aspects of analog reproduction are separate from the physical imperfections. Sure, too many of them can become annoying. But with very sporadic ones, the better musical qualities come through for many of us. If analog isn't for you, then it's not for you.

@@jeffbellin8224 Imagine ignoring all scientific literature

yes, as someone pointed out, there is an upcharge for pops, clicks, surface noise and other vinyl attributes.

Exactly this!

Also he kind of claimed he new it the entire time, he would hear a difference, it would be a big deal, but apparently he just didn't think about sharing this knowledge with the public, or its simply not true.

@@moritzm.3671 He’s a complete gas bag at this point. So pleased with himself, he can no longer accept outside opinions, criticism or ideas.

Fremer is too preoccupied trying to bash Mike at any opportunity to notice.

My thoughts precisely. It will be interesting to see how Chad Kassem and others respond to all this. Will they reaffirm their AAA cred and be fully transparent, or will there be some backpedaling?

AP, IMPEX, INTERVENTION, CRAFT, etc need to confirm what their process is… I don’t think they’ve ever said their lacquers are cut directly from the master tapes. I beleive the AP nat king Cole stuff was tho. It says in the booklet that comes with the record .

Michael Fremer is very opinionated, he rubs people the wrong way. He doesn’t bother me at all.

Curious to see what the outcome would be if Fremer went to MoFi? Let’s stop with the bickering and support each other instead of unprofessional and childish comments towards fellow music lovers.

@@akosalbertoszabo honestly Mike did fine. Would Fremer ask some better questions, probably. Did we get the information we needed? Yes. The argument should be did we assume something or did they intentionally mislead. I think it's both. We assumed it was AAA and when things started to change, mofi didn't correct the record (no pun intended). Fremer is still acting like a child.

They said DSD 256 (4x), not DXD which is PCM 24/352 and sounds different.

@@chipsnmydip thanks for the correction!

Espo is entertaining and does a great job through his store but he is what Stalin used to call “a useful idiot” A naive person who can be exploited easily to advance a political or business objective. Hate to be so cruel, but you tube is loaded with them (anyone who creates a great niche and then builds followers who then thinks he’s an expert). Good on em but let’s be real

Esposito went there to entertain MoFi, ans he didn't achieve ANYTHING.

yeah, but you were listening rather than doing another video and trying to make it all about you. What's up with that?

@@scottwheeler2679 I didn’t get this comment, I was listening instead of making a video? Or are you referring to them?

@@augustoalvarez82 yes, you were paying attention. Fremer was busy making a video about the video.

@@scottwheeler2679 agree, I think he was too concentrated on trying to criticize what Mike E was saying and never paid attention to what the video was about

I thought it was just me. I thought I must have watched a different video to the one Fremer watched!

I totally agree but they said they want to put it on the website. Hell no. Put it on the box or vinyl cover like Neil young does for his music. Cancel thriller mofi did

Exactly. Esposito wasn't able to get all of the answers out of mofi, but he deserves so much credit for breaking this thing. Fremer clearly has a grudge against Esposito.

@@matthewjerome3496 he didn't really break this though. Michael ludwig did. If michael never made his video causing the discussion to start then he would have never made his. Mike constantly takes ideas and revelations from other youtubers. Someone called him out for not crediting michael and he smugly said he knew for years. So he was lying to all his customers that whole time saying he "doesn't speculate" as he speculates. If michael never broke the store Esposito would never made his video. He had no issue selling them as AAA while saying he thought they were digital himself. He didn't break anything. The discussion started, almost every youtuber was questioning it, so he had a source tell him they're digital and he made his video. Michael is the one to truly start the discussion and question thriller. Esposito was talking up thriller telling everyone to buy it and that 40k would sell out soon. Esposito is the toxic one. He hates michael ludwig just because he questioned him as in it for the money when discussing erc as a retailer Esposito made the same claim about fremer much more hostile and smeared him, setting the tone for his fans to trash him. So he can dish it but can't take it. Esposito is the petty one. In mazzys interview he wouldn't even mention either Michael's name when mazzy brought them up. He wouldn't even respond. He made a highly offensive video about ludwig the week before and was actively defending mofis shitty jackets fully knowing they always seem split and are subpar. He ripped up erc for their jackets yet defended mofi because he carried them. Michael ludwig is the nicest guy in the community and yet Esposito openly despises him. He wouldn't even mention his name in the mofi video, and chose to refer to him as "some youtuber" as he apologized for his juvenile Alan parsons video. He wasn't apologizing to michael but his offended fans. He holds grudges and hates both michaels for disagreeing with him. He makes his fans act extremely toxic.He constantly steals revelations and video ideas, never collaborating with or crediting other VC members. Without michael ludwig, this michael, we would have never known if mofi is digital. He started the convo not Esposito. Esposito cares about his buisiness first and foremost and prove that by said he knew they were digital all along when someone said to credit ludwig. He assumed they were digital yet told no one because he's one of the biggest retailers for mofi. He just defended their jackets in the most juvenile video and smeared ludwig. He only got the interview because he's a major retailer. And he acted as one by not properly questioning the guys at mofi. His whole focus is the store. He will be transparent but only so people go to him to then buy his products. He's not altruistic and he even said that himself by saying "I'm a retailer, I won't speculate". He was merely getting infront of a breaking story so he didn't look bad recommending them as all analog. But he does look bad because he himself said he assumed this for years. He defended the jackets and tried to make ludwig look like a fool. He praised thriller, didn't question a thing. Only when ludwig questioned it and got the whole VC community angry did he jump infront of the parade and act like he was the story breaker. Dudes toxic. He's the one who holds grudges. He won't even mention either Michael's names. He starts toxicity by getting personal and making degrading videos like the Alan parsons one. It's so awkward when mazzy brings up the Michael's because Mike just sits there and refuses to acknowledge their existance. After he made it personal with them. Literally half his videos are stolen from other youtubers and he doesn't credit them or collaborate, he just uses them as promotions for his store with ridiculous prices. Infact he's banned from local stores cuz he'd buy up their stock to go mark up at his store. Why should fremer respect Esposito when Esposito won't respect him? Esposito made things toxic and personal. Why does he deserve recognition for michael ludwigs breakthrough? Like I said Esposito was praising thriller and questioned nothing. Only when ludwig started an uproar did he reveal he's know for years that they're digital because his reputation was on the line. Which means he lied to his fans and customers for years to make money. Just like how he called out ERCs jackets yet defended mofis in a childish way only because he sells 100a of the mofis. He didn't break shit he was protecting his own reputation and hopped on the train. He only got the interview because he's a massive retailer who isn't a journalist and mofi knows he will put it I the best light as possible to keep selling records at his store. That's why he never challenged a word they said. He wants to be able to say "yeah they're digital but they're great! Preorder thriller!!!" He didn't break anything, this is all damage and image control. he was praising mofi and ridiculing ludwig for critiquing mofi not even a week before. A day before ludwig questioned the process Esposito was praising onesteps not questioning a thing. He only said something when he had no choice but to defend his reputation. Final thing in my ramble. Here's an example. Say there's a company lying to customers for years. A major retailer assumed they're lying for years yet continues talking up and recommending their products as the best, never once publicly questioning them. Then a reviewer thinks "this doesn't make sense" and questions the companies process by putting 2 and 2 together and realizing something is wrong. Sure they didn't have proof but they knew for certain digital or copies had to be involved and had the courage to say "wait a minute!" As a result of this viewer the floodgates open and all major community members start questioning it. Only then does the retailer, who knew all along, poke his head out to act like he's the breaker of the story and to protect his reputation. Yet he never said a thing all these years of making $10000s selling a false advertised product yet saying himself he heard rumors and assumed they were lying for years. He is then invited as a major retailer for a softball interview. Who deserves the recognition? The reviewer who put 2 and 2 together, had the revelation and courage to say something; or the retailer who assumed and heard rumors for years yet continuously sold and talked up the products, only saying something once the whole community was talking about it and his reputation was threatened. And ontop of all that he wont credit the reviewer and in the very same video he goes on to apologize to his fans for a hostile toxic video he made targeting the reviewer, yet doesn't apologize to him nor mention his name, referring to him as "some youtuber" in a disrespectful tone. Who deserves recognition and respect? The conversation starter/whistle-blower? Or the retailer who stole his revelation as his own? In his own words he assumed and heard rumors for years yet never said a word. Michael ludwig broke this story on youtube, and michael fremer first questioned it. Esposito talked up 40k thriller with no questions, saying to buy one fast. The two Michael's deserve the recognition. Mike doesn't deserve respect since he was so toxic and hostile to them. He picks on ludwig the nicest guy ever till this day for merely questioning his motives as a retailer as he did the same to fremer. His fans are often cruel, personal and toxic because he sets that tone. He can't even acknowledge them as mazzy mentions them 5 times in their interview and he just sits there stone faced. Maybe he's autistic or something but dudes very toxic and doesn't deserve respect since he won't respect other VC members as he steals their ideas and videos to promote is store, never once acknowledging their existances. Hed be happily selling mofis saying their AAA though knowing they're not if ludwig never said anything.

@@simonemurray1345 Thanks for providing some extensive context. Much of it I agree with, particularly in regard to Michael Ludwig, who I appreciate so much. I do disagree with some of your positions, but I won't belabor all that. Resent Esposito or not, he brought this controversy to the attention of a wider audience than it otherwise would have registered with and now an important conversation is taking place as a result. It took some measure of integrity for Esposito to do that, given his status as a mofi retailer who has consistently championed the label. You might speculate as to his motives in doing so and who am I to argue that point? I'll leave it at that, but I am glad this issue is being broadly examined now. Cheers. By the way, I also disliked Esposito's video mocking the people who were dissatisfied with the APP jacket. Didn't realize that was an attack on Ludwig, but it makes sense. My own copy of that arrived with 3 1/4 inch seam splits on the bottom of each of the gatefolds. Took 2 weeks of back and forth to get mofi to agree to exchange it for me. Still waiting for it to come back.

Agreed, Fremer is salty that he wasn't invited and the salt is seasoning his commentary. There is also bad blood b/t Fremer/45 RPM and In 'Groove Mike over the Electric Recording Company controversy a few months back.

The DSD is made from the Master Tape.

Mike E *looked* like he could have been rolled as it was presented but the Mofi team came clean. And good on them. Mike E didn't need to press them. And good on him for not acting like the fool inside investigator. He was their guest, he acted accordingly and they told him and us pretty much everything there was for us to know.

@@calebkeen8967 brilliant line “the salt is seasoning his commentary “. 👍

Especially when Fremer says in his own words he was covering for MoFi

How about. Why haven't you told the consumer after all these years that you use a digital step?

I thought they said they dupe a master tape (and digital) from the master tape if possible. If not, they source the best digital from the original.

Find the 40th anniversary of Bitches Brew the Best of Both world the Vinyl sounds great and CDs sounds very nice and it Release from Columbia

yes John Lamarca well played sir!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Fremer’s butthurt he didn’t get the scoop.

I don't think many will disagree,, however honesty & transparency is the only issue in question here.

@@512bb People want to say they were lied to, but no one has put up proof of a lie and they are looking. My only pre-conception when buying MoFi is that it is audiophile quality. I don't feel lied to.

@@TRamone01 Good, then keep on buying. However if you know something about the recording business then you know they're being less then honest.

Tapes are better storage medium than digital. Digital files fail all the time. Some tape recordings from the early days of vinyl are still producing astounding sounding records. I'm not saying digital is all bad, but if you want to archive something digital, put it on a tape.

it was a very quick one :-)

sounds about right

Just waiting for fremer to reply to you and act like a baby for no reason 🤣

Mike E. is a nice guy, but Fremer is telling the truth here. The reason Mike E. got the interview is that the guys at MOFI didn't feel threatened by him. There's no way in hell they would've agreed with an interview with Fremer.

Hey Fremer, doesn't matter if it's digital or analog, you obviously can't hear the difference

@@Diatonic5th yeah coz Fremer is exhausting and would’ve gotten the same info from them anyway

i think Mr. Fremer is not the biggest Fan of Mike E. What I think sucks is that he always acts like he's the expert and Mike E. is only a record dealer. You don't have to like everyone, but to deny someone indirect knowledge all the time I don't think is very great.

They stated near the end that 'all' one steps are digital.

Yes, and on their official website they state, that they use first and foremost only first generation original master recordings as source material for their (vinyl) releases. So they should put their admitted practice of doing 4x DSD copies for production, when not getting the original master tape at their location, also on their official website a.s.a.p. 😲

Which is why it's slightly amusing to hear Fremer say that a journalist should have been at that interview. HA!! For what?! They've been lying to you for 15 years and you kept it moving. Let me tell you something, nobody can lie to me about any subject matter where I possess expertise...

well said...

Absolutely to your point #poetryonplastic. The body language alone in that video showed there was a lot of passive-aggression on MoFi's part. I thought Mike did as well as could be expected under the circumstances, but no, he's not a professional journalist.

@@The_One-Eyed_Undertaker It is NOT about analog v digital by any stretch. Had the On-Step MoFi releases been truthfully labeled, we wouldn't be here. Truth-in-labeling is the end game goal. Nothing else.

@@The_One-Eyed_Undertaker yet no one could tell the difference

Better still, sell it and buy a Nottingham Analogue turntable!

Digital is taken seriously by audiophiles. I have a very good SACD player and an SSD NAS drive setup with 8000 file on it. You have a very wrong view of audiophiles.

Rose colored glasses

@@trackingangle929 amen the same here I don't want digital LPs and sacds are less

Digital is taken seriously by audiophiles. There’s always a segment of people who always make it about analog vs digital.

How’s that Santana Abraxas one step sounding to you now?

You’re right - Fremer has lost it.

Exactly