The way Jordan handled his team as an executive just makes me respect Larry Bird that much more
@ty88nyc352 жыл бұрын
Bird is just a dude who achieved at every level of his sport. As a Coach got the Pacers within 2 of the Title and took the 90s Bulls to their only other Game 7.
@kylerpeltier24982 жыл бұрын
@@ty88nyc35 bird did a lot but u can't glorify him for almost getting the pacers a title and almost beating the bulls
@christophergooding98202 жыл бұрын
@@kylerpeltier2498 why not? I think that if a team got swept you would trash them so why can’t we recognize that it’s good when a team accomplishing things that no one else accomplished and when he took the pacers to their best spot ever (as an nba team at least I think, I think they have an ABA title).
@withalittlehelpfrom32 жыл бұрын
While I probably don't buy into Larry as the GOAT player, I think he makes a great case for the GOAT basketball mind!
@TheNamesDitto2 жыл бұрын
Yeah. Larry showed he COULD win at all levels
@rasaecnai2 жыл бұрын
MJ: Wants to impart wisdom on the young players. Also MJ: Destroy a high school player he drafted himself.
@chrishandsome42672 жыл бұрын
Psychopathic mindset. A gift and a curse in that field
@mr.z62522 жыл бұрын
Lebron: Keep That same Energy come Playoff Time Fans: We did Keep their Energies *Bronsexual Goes Angry Keyboard Warrior mode*
@karmaskavern31312 жыл бұрын
@@mr.z6252 ??
@TheSands83 Жыл бұрын
Kwame was. A bum on any team he ever played on
@karmaskavern3131 Жыл бұрын
@@TheSands83 partially cause of MJ, also I found calling nba players bums is dumb since they could still hoop on All of our asses
@camus9452 жыл бұрын
Clayton I’m from the UK and 2 years ago at the start of the pandemic I had never watched a basketball game. Thanks to your videos I am now a fully fledged fan. Keep going man, you make great content
@bonerjoe12302 жыл бұрын
Holy shit, its the same thing for me. I randomly got his GOAT series recommended by youtube and it made me really interested in NBA history. So throughout the first pandemic year I basically studied NBA stuff and am now a huge fan. But it all started here
@brianbadonde92512 жыл бұрын
@@bonerjoe1230 hell yeah Bonerjoe
@BreadAccountant2 жыл бұрын
I had the same happen to me
@godnotavailable20942 жыл бұрын
@@bonerjoe1230 Same.
@squishyturtles16482 жыл бұрын
Better be knicks fans
@JamesMiller692 жыл бұрын
Man, how Jordan treated Kwame has always been one of the ugliest stains on his legacy for me. Great video!
@okeythegoat23322 жыл бұрын
Facts
@ImBarryScottCSS2 жыл бұрын
Mike annihilating Kwames confidence started a cascade of events that led to Kobe winning 2 more rings. 200 IQ play.
@tshiris17082 жыл бұрын
@@ImBarryScottCSS wtf 🤡
@kingamiiamking49152 жыл бұрын
Facts about Jordan's time with the Washington Wizards: - The Wizards the previous season were 19-63 (14th in East, 27th in NBA) and were the worst defensive team in the league. MJ was the only major addition to the team and at the All Star break, the Wizards were 3rd in the East with a 26-21 record, despite having a poor start to the season. They also were a top 5 defensive team in the entire NBA at the All Star break. This was all before MJs injury. Which occurred 46 games into the season. Before his injury, MJ for the first 46 games was averaging 25.1, 6.2 RPG, 5.3 APG, 1.5 SPG, 0.5 BPG on 42.1 FG%. He was getting better as the season went along. So were the Wizards team. In the last 20 games leading up to the injury, MJ was averaging 27.5 PPG, 6.4 RPG, 5.2 APG, 1.3 SPG, 0.5 BPG on 44.2 FG%. In the last 10 games leading up to the injury, MJ was averaging 29.7 PPG, 6.6 RPG, 6.1 APG, 1.2 SPG, 0.3 BPG on 47.2 FG%. People forget that MJ was on minutes restriction for many games after his injury. In his last 7 games, he didn't even start. He only averaged 21.0 MPG in those games. These games heavily brought down his averages. MJ had torn a tendon in his finger with a cigar cutter on accident after the Bulls won the championship in 1998. It never fully healed and he was never able to bend it all the way and it affected his ball handling and shooting when he came back to play for the Wizards. Another thing people forget is that prior to the season MJ had his ribs broken by Metta World Peace in a pickup game. So not only was MJ dealing with a serious injury before the season began, he also hasn't played professional basketball in Three entire seasons. Despite this, he was having a great season and only getting better as the season progressed. After his injury (46 games into season), the Wizards fell out of the playoffs and fell to the bottom 10 defensively. Jordan could've easily gone to a more talented Eastern conference team like the Heat, Nets or Celtics. Instead he played more for fun when he came back in 2001. Or he could've gone to the Spurs or Lakers and got an easy ring. Michael Jordan's mid-range game with the Wizards... Age 38: 51 PTS (24 1st Quarter) Age 39: 45 PTS Age 40: 43 PTS, 10 REB, 60% FG Age 40: 22.4 PTS, 7.2 REB, 1.3 STL while playing 39.9 MINS He also played all 82 GMS in his final season Michael Jordan was also sabotaged by Abe Pollin, Wes Unseld who was the GM and Susan O'Malley who was the President of Basketball operations. Jordan the former employee ended up surpassing both Jerry Reinsdorf and Abe Pollin combined in wealth.
@jaimep3432 Жыл бұрын
Because your soft
@PrometheusOfVideos Жыл бұрын
Anybody else here after watching Johnny Arnett's video that's a response to this video?
@BaXiStA8 ай бұрын
yup. What Johnny meant by underrated is that is not as bad as people think and there were flashes of Mj still being an effective player before his knee injuries, but never in his video did he say it was close to Jordan as a Bull nor did the vid say that Wizards Jordan was successful so I think somehow this response is a bit overblown especially referencing Johnny Arnett's video.
@dominicharris54898 ай бұрын
yeah and he overreacted and misunderstood Claytons video. like most jordan heads would predictably do...
@BaXiStA8 ай бұрын
@@dominicharris5489 Clayton actually was the one who misunderstood lmao again, nothing in Arnett's video said that Jordan's Wizards stint was great, but people saying he was a bad player with the Wizards, Arnett was trying to dispel that notion.
@dominicharris54898 ай бұрын
@@BaXiStA well that means clayton didnt misunderstand anything. he is the one who made the video intially, not in response to anyone elses video. so only a response to his video can be someone who misunderstood something. Claytons points here are all valid and all make sense. he didnt overstate or undermine anything. Arnetts video definitely reacted as if someone or people said jordan was horrendous on the wizards.
@BaXiStA8 ай бұрын
@@dominicharris5489 no, Arnett made the video first and he was combative in his second video which was his response because he respected Clayton yet Clayton sarcastically took a swipe at Arnett’s video entitled Michael Jordan’s UNDERRATED years as a Wizard.
@nick-ky7ql2 жыл бұрын
Kanye once said, “we should have never let Michael Jordan play for the wizards” . Gotta agree with that
@derekhiemforth2 жыл бұрын
I was especially glad to hear you invoke Kareem's name, Clayton. If you want to talk about a GOAT candidate who was adding to his legacy at an old age, the conversation has to start with Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. *_His_* late-career exploits were truly impressive, even if they're not as superficially impressive as his younger years. You mentioned eFG%, and that Michael was 15th worst in the league in his last season. In the equivalent season of Kareem's career (1986-1987), he had the 5th *_best_* eFG% in the league (including the best on the Lakers). Kareem at 40 was still a crucial piece of a championship team. Michael at 40 was putting up inefficient numbers on a bad team. Michael's supporters should be careful what they wish for if they want performance in the sunset years to count for much. If we start making those comparisons, Mike might slip behind Kareem, who already has a very compelling GOAT case of his own (as all of your viewers well know)...
@godnotavailable20942 жыл бұрын
Honestly I think you just confirmed what I already believed: Kareem has just as much of a claim to the throne as MJ and Bron. Maybe he wasn't as flashy as the other two, but the dude just kicked ass for the better part of two decades and never stopped getting it done on the court.
@coolfear3602 жыл бұрын
That doesn’t account for the games he was healthy though. Johnny Arnett made a quality video showing off how good Jordan was statistically before his injury.
@todd19282 жыл бұрын
Kareem got to ease into retirement because of Magic, Worthy and Scott. He wasn't expected to do anything more than get half a dozen rebounds and score 15 points. His situation is wildly different to Jordan who was expected to try and carry a garbage team and face double teams every night.
@brettb32 жыл бұрын
Well then it’s a good thing longevity is far less important than other factors when it comes to who the GOAT is.
@rokosoldat99122 жыл бұрын
@@todd1928 The issue with that point is that Kareem exceeded those expectations. And if he didn't have Magic & the crew, then he could get more of the ball, get more points and shoot inefficiently like Jordan did the Wizards. Bigger numbers, but no trophies. And in all likelihood, he would still have done it with a much better eFG% shooter with more PPG and rebounds than Wizards Jordan. Yes, the situation was different for them and that changes the style of play that is optimal for them. That makes it harder to compare. BUT.... But it is clear as day that Kareem was ready to mold himself to the team, while MJ was trying to forcefully mold a team to himself. He Wilt Chamberlained those Wizards and was surprised they didn't win titles, as if Wilt himself didn't realise that is what made him lose so many finals to Russel Celtics in his latter years back in the 70s. Would those Wizards won a trophy? Hell no. Would those Wizards gotten to the playoffs if MJ accepted the double teams, passed more and not shoot everything as if it was 1994? I say yes. We willfully choose to ignore Wizards years, because in comparison to Kareem and maybe even old Lebron, those Wizards years are detriment to his legacy of the GOAT, which is the highest possible level. One of his GOAT contenders was much better and successful at that point, and Lebron has the chance to be too.
@zelloguy2 жыл бұрын
I'm gonna have to disagree with you saying to pretend that these years never happened. We don't live in a perfect fantasy world where you could erase the past. He made that decision to go play with the Wizards and played those two seasons. Nothing can change that as bad as they were. I was 5-6 years old around that time and those were my first early memories of watching basketball and the NBA.
@Thanosdidtherighthing Жыл бұрын
They were a 19-63 team before he got there and he doubled their wins…
@jonathanglennon1325 Жыл бұрын
kzfaq.info/get/bejne/iL5_f7WWxrvTeYU.html this video proves exactly what this guy won't tell us
@shaunphillips3236 Жыл бұрын
Exactly with no help at all. U must be a casual son
@pokekaeus37926 ай бұрын
What are y’all responding to? Cause according to ya’ll this should help his legacy. So there’s no reason to ignore the wizard years
@ryanr200916 ай бұрын
@@shaunphillips3236 Richard Hamilton ? hes a major piece to the 04 championship kid know your history son
@BigDan21. Жыл бұрын
Jonny Arnett just destroyed Clayton on this video!
@autisticturtle8210 Жыл бұрын
I’m not lyin I came back to watch this and johnnys vid in order to see who right
@therealDJG2 жыл бұрын
As a Wizards fan it was great to have him on the team and I’m glad to of seen him play… but no he is not underrated as a Wizard. He is was properly past his prime. Not trash but definitely not great or underrated by any means.
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
Exactly. People should just be grateful they got to see a glimpse of him play again, but that's really all it is.
@Homer-OJ-Simpson2 жыл бұрын
He was a borderline all star reserve at best. Maybe 20-30th best player in the league.
@TypicalBlakk2 жыл бұрын
He Was In The MVP Convo Pre Injury Yall Hating Hard
@therealDJG2 жыл бұрын
@@TypicalBlakk His name got him somewhat in that MVP race. That Wizards team in 01-02 was shitty. Jordan could still score but he was not efficient. His name was mentioned but realistically, no.
@x-man9473 Жыл бұрын
@@therealDJG No sir. He was in the MVP conversation because he was about to be the first player in NBA history to turn a sub 20 win team into a winning team and playoff contender. This was despite the fact that the 2nd best player (Rip Hamilton) got injured and missed games.
@maxerickson40802 жыл бұрын
They say Michael Jordan, at his best, was better at his job than anyone has ever been at their job. But those people had never met Clayton
@skynyrdjesus2 жыл бұрын
If you consider his job only those 48 minutes of game time, you might be able to make that case. But that's a very limited view of being a basketball player, and more importantly, being a part of a basketball team
@maxerickson40802 жыл бұрын
@@skynyrdjesus Dude it's just a quote from the last dance i promise it is not that serious
@TheTariqibnziyad2 жыл бұрын
@@skynyrdjesus MJ was the best at his job as a player and teammate, what's your point
@skynyrdjesus2 жыл бұрын
@@TheTariqibnziyad No, no he wasn't. The man ruined by far more careers than he made, and that's saying something. He's the only athlete alive who could ever make "Jerry Kraus deserves more credit" a true sentence.
@TheTariqibnziyad2 жыл бұрын
@@skynyrdjesus when did he ruin any career lol, if you are good you become good inspite of MJ, otherwise you weren't that good to begin with, it's survival of the fittest...look at Scottie, Rodman who was lost before playing with MJ, Kerr, Kukoj...all MJ teammates benefited from his leadership
@TheSands83 Жыл бұрын
Kwame brown would have never been a good player. This guy is delusional
@fptrees9373 ай бұрын
MJ's last ten games before the meniscus he averaged 29.7 on 47% shooting. When he and Rip were healthy the Wizards went 15-1. A 39 year old had a 19 caliber win team in the playoffs if he didn't get injured and then play injured. The next season he was 40 playing on one knee and basically shot 45% from the field.
@dplunk132 жыл бұрын
One thing that’s funny is that last year shooting 45% is Kobe’s entire career average.
@warkunitale2 жыл бұрын
when you think about it it's kind of horrendous , even Pierce or Tracy Mcgrady had the same percentages , their shot selection was questionable
@dplunk132 жыл бұрын
@@warkunitale Someone had a good statistical analysis of Kobe that pointed out that he was a very average efficiency scorer aside from free throws. Free throws and pure volume are the only things that separate him from those guys you mention, at least as a scorer. The rest of his game was really good.
@Vipa56711 ай бұрын
Because Kobe took 3's and Jordan didn't.
@dplunk1311 ай бұрын
@@Vipa567 True. MJ's true shooting % was still higher.
@camerondavies8442 Жыл бұрын
Johnny arnett just son’d you young fella
@eternalboss10462 жыл бұрын
The Washington Wizards 2001-02 and 2002-03 seasons: Wizards won 47.2 % of the time with Michael Jordan Wizards won 31.8 % of the time without Michael Jordan +15.4% Jordan with/without (38-39 win pace with Jordan on 82 games. Bottom seeded team in 01/02 and 02/03 was at 42 wins) Wizards had a net rating of -0.9 with Michael Jordan Wizards had a net rating of -4.1 without Michael Jordan +3.2 Jordan with/without Wizards were -0.2 with Jordan on court Wizards were -2.8 with Jordan off the court +3 Jordan on/off court While the 01-03 Wizards were certainly better with Jordan than without, they still were not a good team even when he did play. They were negative rating with him, sub .500 with him, and were on pace to miss the playoffs with him both years.
@Chillboyhaad2 жыл бұрын
But apparently he was awful for them lol
@MWiatrakeightbillion2 жыл бұрын
@@Chillboyhaad Nobody's saying he was awful? The problem, and as was pointed out in the video, is that MJ on the Wizards did nothing to add to his legacy. He ran a heliocentric offense around himself under Collins, so of course his +/- splits are going to favorable towards himself; and the team around him was the team HE built. He wasn't a bad player in Washington, but he wasn't exactly a good/great one, either.
@Homer-OJ-Simpson2 жыл бұрын
Some of that’s stats make it seem he was better than you let on. 01-02 team was playing at 41 win pace with him but 26 win pace without him. That’s a huge 15 win difference.
@alexmotts Жыл бұрын
All you did was prove that they sucked with or without him. He literally made NO difference. Take a seat d rider.
@tupacalypse88 Жыл бұрын
@@Chillboyhaad if your comparing him to himself he was awful otherwise he was above average
@wingchun1719 Жыл бұрын
Nah man this video is wrong. You clearly did not watch the Jordan and the wizards and is just spewing stuff out of subjectivity
@RB-mb1ul Жыл бұрын
Michael Jordan tore his meniscus against Sacramento after 46 games his first year back. At that point the lizards were the 4th seed with a 26-20 record. They were also 21-9 over that 30 games. Jordan at this point was averaging 25.1, 6.2, 5.3, 1.5 shooting 42%. The only other player in the league averaging 25, 6, and 5 was Kobe. In his final 10 games before the meniscus tear he was averaging 29.7, 6.6, and 6.1 on 47% shooting. It would seem after shaking off the rust you would expect from taking 3 years off, both MJ and his team were finding their groove right before his injury. He tried to play through it and even came off the bench for a bit before he couldn’t go any longer and got surgery. His numbers tanked during this period.
@BU_TV11 ай бұрын
Facts
@witness2.5122 ай бұрын
Well said. Also that Wizards team was 15-1 when both Rip Hamilton & MJ were healthy. It just didn't happen enough... basically if he simply had 1 other competent player around him he had that rag-tag team playing as well as any in the league. Once he got into shape.
@bandamvhourgh8573 Жыл бұрын
Jonny Arnett just completely destroyed ur claims dude 😂
@handlebucket62852 жыл бұрын
* Facts about MJ's time with the Washington Wizards: - The Wizards the previous season were 19-63 (14th in East, 27th in NBA) and were the worst defensive team in the leauge. MJ was the only major addition to the team and at the Allstar break, the Wizards were 3rd in the East with a 26-21 record, despite having a poor start to the season. They also were a top 5 defensive team in the entire NBA at the Allstar break. This was all before MJs injury. Which occured 46 games into the season. - Before his injury, MJ for the first 46 games was averaging 25.1, 6.2 RPG, 5.3 APG, 1.5 SPG, 0.5 BPG on 42.1 FG%. He was getting better as the season went along. So were the Wizards team. In the last 20 games leading up to the injury, MJ was averaging 27.5 PPG, 6.4 RPG, 5.2 APG, 1.3 SPG, 0.5 BPG on 44.2 FG%. In the last 10 games leading up the injury, MJ was averaging 29.7 PPG, 6.6 RPG, 6.1 APG, 1.2 SPG, 0.3 BPG on 47.2 FG%. People forget than MJ was on minutes restriction for many games after his injury. In his last 7 games, he didn't even start. He only averaged 21.0 MPG in those games. These games heavily brought down his averages. - MJ had torn a tendon in his finger with a cigar cutter on accident after the Bulls won the championship in 1998. It never fully healed and he was never able to bend it all the way and it affected his ball handling and shooting when he came back to play for the Wizards. Another thing people forget is that prior to the season MJ had his ribs broken by Metta World Peace in a pickup game. So not only was MJ dealing with a serious injury before the season began, he also hasn't played professional basketball in 3 entire seasons. Despite this, he was having a great season and only getting better as the season progressed. After his injury (46 games into season), the Wizards fell out of the playoffs and fell to the bottom 10 defensively. - MJ could have easily gone to a more talented Eastern conference team like the Nets or Celtics. Instead he played more for fun when he came back in 2001. Or he could have went to the Spurs or Lakers and got an easy ring.
@jeffreyatienza6352 жыл бұрын
Marc Cuban actually revealed he was going to do whatever it took to get Jordan but Jordan already had a verbal agreement with the wizards. Jordan could have played with a Mavs team who was a consistent 50-60 win team in those years.
@Hazztech2 жыл бұрын
Yeah the issue I have with calling the wizard's tenure a complete failure as a player is the average statistics. Trending upwards across the board.
@tboss81572 жыл бұрын
This doesn’t change that he was a shell of himself. Injuries happen especially when you’re trying to lead a team pushing 40. In their totality his Wizards years were embarrassing. The raw numbers in those first 46 games don’t even tell the full story, he still looked washed, often chucking his team out of games like post Achilles Kobe. The defensive stat is mostly pace based, as the wizards were plodding, with MJ often stagnating possessions for 20 seconds at a time, they very transparently weren’t legit at all defensively. The efficiency was simply dreadful, and that’s antithetical to what Jordan was as a Bull period.
@dynamic66452 жыл бұрын
He missed the playoffs 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@dynamic66452 жыл бұрын
The difference between 38 years old Kareem and Jordan is that Kareem won 3 titles since 38 years old, 38 years old Jordan missed the playoffs 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@creed200569 Жыл бұрын
If MJ didn’t get injured, he could have took them deep into the playoffs, if not the finals. He went 15-1 his last 16 games with Rip, In the 46 games that Jordan played in 01/02 before the injury, he averaged 25.1 - 6.2 - 5.3 - 1.5 - 0.5 on 42% points - rebounds - assists - steals - blocks Jordan's numbers were also improving as the season went on. In his last 20 games up to the injury he averaged 27.5 - 6.4 - 5.2 - 1.3 - 0.5 on 44% In his last 10 games up to the injury he averaged 29.7 - 6.6 - 6.1 - 1.2 - 0.3 on 47% This improvement in his numbers could have been due to 1. healing from his tendinitis and knee problems 2. adjustment to joining a new team and coming off a 3 year layoff 3. or a combination of these factors
@raptor6869 Жыл бұрын
Jonny arnett just absolutely picked your video apart.
@jameelfuller4932 жыл бұрын
The Goat has returned I feel like I speak for everyone that we have been missing your videos!
@condorgaming40002 жыл бұрын
Nah, speak for yourself please
@TheSands83 Жыл бұрын
Don’t go overboard this guy sorely lacks a lot of knowledge about defense in basketball
@Youralwayswhining43675 ай бұрын
@@TheSands83like that Arnett kid, he's all laker and kobe bias is off the walls.
@Boheem Жыл бұрын
Got clapped by Johnny Arnett
@286mic Жыл бұрын
Bro just got cooked by Johnny Arnette.
@juanluis7310 Жыл бұрын
Johnny Arnertt done schooled you boy 😂
@garygnu8775 Жыл бұрын
It's Time at the wizards bought him two MVP contention and practically put the wizards in contention to be in the playoffs. We talkin about a non-active old man with bad knees. Compare that to LeBron with a stack team and his failure with the Lakers at that age.
@fortynights1513 Жыл бұрын
LeBron in 2023 was better than 2022 arguably. But point taken
@saiwaqa25732 жыл бұрын
So he led a less talented team to more wins than Lebron James did this year lol... UNDISPUTED GOAT JORDAN
@justhurricane5331 Жыл бұрын
Putting the failure of Kwame Brown's career on MJ is insanely unfair and there's absolutely no way you can know that MJ had any negative effect on him whatsoever. All intangible stuff.
@lankyhanky9772 Жыл бұрын
Ok, but it’s fair to assume MJ didn’t help
@Thanosdidtherighthing Жыл бұрын
Jonny Arnett 👨🏫 schooled you LOL!
@HOGISIMJAYUN Жыл бұрын
I'm here because of Jonny Arnett and waiting for his response 🤣
@manzac1122 жыл бұрын
The crazy thing was if he had retired and not played for the Wizards, he would have still been 8th all time in total points and #1 in PPG by a wider margin.
@subairali80752 жыл бұрын
33 points per game is so wild
@phillipschuman43072 жыл бұрын
I am fairly sure he wanted to pass Wilt for points, though. By playing the Wizard years, he accomplished that, while also holding onto the most ppg mark by an eyelash.... 0.05 more than Wilt.
@Michael-eq8th2 жыл бұрын
Been thinking about this video since i watched it. I think the danger of with either rewriting MJ's wizards run as a good effort or forgetting it as an undesirable end is that it denies the actual history. He was who he was, worts and all. As they say, if you can't appreciate him at his worst, you don't deserve him at his best.
@GoldenRNB Жыл бұрын
You got served by Johnny Arnett. Nexttime, don't be too condescending and obnoxious. Learn to respect people my guy.
@canadadry4609 Жыл бұрын
Im just here after Jonny dookied on this video in a respectful manner.
@fireshadowblade92 жыл бұрын
I have to say, I missed you doing one off videos like this. Making the Case is always incredible, but it's fun to hear you cover a variety of topics every video.
@elohkayeye62772 жыл бұрын
If MJ gets legacy credit for his Wizards tenure, then Lebron’s Laker tenure is absolutely mind bogglingly great 😴
@michaeladams56362 жыл бұрын
No Lebron has sucked and been washed up since he left the Miami Heat.
@gabj68162 жыл бұрын
@@michaeladams5636 what are you watching? you need to be tested.
@fortynights1513 Жыл бұрын
After watching Jonny Arnett’s video and this one: The points about the transactions or team culture weren’t exactly terrible (and Jonny Arnett’s video barely mentioned that). But statistically Jordan was performing at least ok before injury (and especially the ten games right before that Arnett points out). I would view Wizards MJ (at least the first year of it) as a bit of a what could have been. Those two years shouldn’t be considered among his better seasons, but due to the meniscus tear (as well as the fact that he was starting to improve right before it), I also don’t think we got to see the full potential of Wizards MJ. Washington didn’t necessarily have a huge ceiling, but if MJ doesn’t get hurt, I wouldn’t be stunned if Washington made the playoffs with him as the best player in 2002. I wouldn’t argue that this period necessarily adds much to his GOAT case or anything like that, but it’s not completely terrible in my opinion.
@jamesmitchell4594 Жыл бұрын
Johnny Arnett on ya head boy you have one week to respond my boi 😭😂💯
@Youralwayswhining43675 ай бұрын
Terrible take kid
@koolk21152 жыл бұрын
Averaging over 20 points in the NBA at age 40 is no easy task.
@lik79532 жыл бұрын
Yea, but his argument is that it doesn’t change Jordan’s legacy. Which I agree. Washington did nothing to make Jordan’s legacy better. He was the goat before Washington, and that time in Washington had 0 effect on his legacy
@Jaxxx432 Жыл бұрын
blud expected MJ to led that team in the Championship while tearing his meniscus.. 👎
@peltimies2469 Жыл бұрын
Bro what 😂 did you watch the fucking video
@20marvelman2 жыл бұрын
I think the only saving grace is the last 20 to 10 games leading up to that first injury, he definitely started to heat up and was looking better efficiency wise 29 6 and 6 on 47% 🔥🔥🔥
@OmgIsThatBruno2 жыл бұрын
Jordan years at the wizards is kinda the mid 90's Lakers with magic return for a season Was cool to have him back, but it's not relevant for the legacy
@mtgunst62 жыл бұрын
The best thing Clayton has ever said - MJ is Basketball Thanos
@Kage-jk4pj2 жыл бұрын
The best thing Clayton has ever said - MJ was a failure as a Washington wizard
@cynga60679 ай бұрын
I loved how MJ played his game with the Wizards. He showed us how great he really was even without all the physical gifts, how important fundamentals are
@adam172 жыл бұрын
Witnessing him do what he did night in and night out is what has him as my goat. No stats, no narritive, just watching him dominate the league made/makes it clear. ...With that same eye test, I can easily say those Wizards years were nothing special. There were moments, but the consistency was gone. For the first time in my life, he looked merely mortal.
@TrueAnakinSkywalker2 жыл бұрын
I'm 40 and live in DC so I remembers those years and it's amazes me how they use these years as a highlight. When Mj first started playing for the Wizards he had to take a few weeks to get agile enough to dunk again. Second they couldn't make the playoffs in the east and Jordan retired after everyone almost begged him because another season with the Wizards would have dropped his career scoring average to under 30pts a game. It's amazing how people give LeBron crap for losing in the finals but none to Jordan for NOT even making the playoffs. I consider MJ the goat and he had good Wizard moments but it was far from a highlight on his resume.
@calamorta2 жыл бұрын
Why would they give Jordan crap for not making the playoffs with the WIZARDS as a 40 YR OLD? I agree Lebron's finals losses shouldn't be used against him, other than 2011, but giving MJ crap for his years as a Wizard is much more stupid than doing the same with LeBron's finals record.
@TrueAnakinSkywalker2 жыл бұрын
@@calamorta I don’t believe Jordan wizards years were the worst thing ever because he did have some remarkable games. However, we got the Mj that was more downside than upside. Teammates can deal with Mj when he’s taking you to the finals and winning titles but this Jordan didn’t have that upside with all of stuff that made Jordan teammates want to punch him in the face. As a Wizards fan I thought they could at least make the 8th seed in the East…you don’t even have to have a winning record to do that most years.
@SmittyWerbenJagermannJensen2 жыл бұрын
Lebron has missed the playoffs more times than MJ. No one ever mentions him missing the playoffs though.
@TrueAnakinSkywalker2 жыл бұрын
@@SmittyWerbenJagermannJensen I love when people state facts with no context, so you gonna learn today… how many times has Lebron missed the playoffs, the answer 2 times with the Wizards. Lebron has missed the playoffs 3 times. What you didn’t throw in there is the years that Jordan missed when he stepped away from the game in his prime and the fact that Lebron has played longer than Mj. You stated that “fact” like Mj never missed the playoffs and Lebron only made the playoffs 50% of the time 🤣
@SmittyWerbenJagermannJensen2 жыл бұрын
@@TrueAnakinSkywalker what are you talking about? I didn’t say MJ never missed the playoffs. I said Lebron missed it more times. You’re the one who complained about MJ missing it as if Lebron never did. Talk about stating a fact with no context. Also, counting years where a guy didn’t play is laughably disingenuous. Fact if the matter is Lebron missed twice with the Cavs and once with the Lakers. MJ never missed with the Bulls, and twice with the Wizards. At the end of the day, no one counts missing the playoffs against either player.
@liamryan72392 жыл бұрын
“Failure” is a little strong, but I generally agree. It’s more like frosting than anything.
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
It's a failure from the standpoint it terms of what Michael Jordan set out to accomplish, which is discussed in the video. If the only expectations were that he proved he could still play, that's fine, but we are talking about Michael Jordan here.
@ChopJr_2 жыл бұрын
@@bensytaccount the Man was 39😐
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
@@ChopJr_ He said the expectations himself by trying to make the playoffs, improve the winning record and make the team more competitive. He set that standard. Watch the fucking video.
@thinkpctive80782 жыл бұрын
Jordan before Pippen and Goat Coach didn’t win anything. Jordan after Pippen and Goat Coach didn’t win anything 😂 I see a pattern.
@ChopJr_2 жыл бұрын
@@bensytaccount of course mj said that what tf else was he gonna say? I knows it’s hard to understand simple words but I implore you to try here: THE MAN WAS 39 I love how y’all just throw that out the window & say “we’ll he said they were tryna make the playoffs” No shit Sherlock, that’s the goal of basketball🤦🏾♂️ He was simply past his prime on a terrible wizards team Nothing more nothing less It’s not a triumph & it’s certainly not a failure To be doing what Jordan was doing at 39 was truly incredible And no within the the first 10 seconds of this video you can tell it’s biased & petty as hell I’m not watching that garbage
@rainier9504 Жыл бұрын
johnny bruhh
@jcplays38422 жыл бұрын
Guys guys Lebron’s 2011 season never happened, he was bribed by the mafia and the NBA CGI’ed him into the games
@kgosipule85502 жыл бұрын
The internet hates MJ so bad bro 🤣 They can't understand why Lebron isn't worshipped in the same way
@FreshPrincex42 жыл бұрын
Not a fan but lebron is worshipped if not as much as MJ is. Does he deserve it? Of course. Even if I can't stand his fanboys. I feel the same about MJ fanboys
@demisor97012 жыл бұрын
It's the opposite actually.
@YvngGoat_2 жыл бұрын
It’s not hate, it’s fax
@x-man9473 Жыл бұрын
@@YvngGoat_ Nah. It's hate. If you have to spend hours trying to downplay someone's accolades and trying to highlight any perceived failures, it's outright hatred.
@bradenstewart62702 жыл бұрын
I bet Brown wishes Jordan never played for the wizards too
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
Underrated comment lmao
@LaerteBorborema2 жыл бұрын
To me Jordan Wizards years is like Kobe years after the achilles injury, wished never happened.
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
@@kylerpeltier2498 uhhhh...ok...not really sure what that has to do with anything I said
@LaerteBorborema2 жыл бұрын
@@kylerpeltier2498 I agree, Mike was better but that was not point.
@ssj4galactus2 жыл бұрын
Note. Mj played the wizards years basically for free cuz he donated the contract to the 911 survivors
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
That really doesn't speak to his success on the basketball court, plus he had already played an NBA career with the Bulls and had a huge global brand. It was a very kind gesture but out of literally any NBA player at the time, he needed the money the least.
@adrianprince72662 жыл бұрын
No matter if he needed it or not he didn't have to do it at all. You miss his point.
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
@@adrianprince7266 No I understand the point perfectly. If the expectation was this was only for charity than it would obviously be considered a success, but it wasn't.
@ssj4galactus2 жыл бұрын
@@bensytaccount no one playing for free is really trying to win it all sad to say. Also its like 4 million or something
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
@@ssj4galactus Uhhhh ok. You know we're talking about Michael Jordan right?
@andrewvideogames2 жыл бұрын
You are an elite essayist period. Not just in the realm of NBA KZfaq. Keep it up brother.
@laszlokristof24312 жыл бұрын
He shouldn't have returnet after 2 years off. That was the mistake. He was still ok. He thought too much of himself. The other reason was he retired too early. He felt that too. Good video of somebody not being a real fan.
@emmanuelenyinwa14432 жыл бұрын
Jordan retired with the PUSH-OFF. That summed up his career, the refs turning a blind eye to his fouls. By the way, Jordan shot TWELVE free throws that 4th quarter. It covered up his finishing that game hitting his last 6-29 from the field.
@alexdelarge7032 жыл бұрын
Found the LeBron fan
@lukeithink63692 жыл бұрын
Hey Clayton I’ve been watching you for two years and just wanna say your great man
@809Mornelle2 жыл бұрын
I mean before he got hurt the wizards were doing pretty well .....
@Steelo8322 жыл бұрын
Mike wasn’t as bad as advertised in those years. Coming off a multi year layoff, already playing a full career prior to said layoff. Nobody (with sense) said he was competing for the best player in the league or even best wing player. He was more impressive than alot of players who played as long. Nothing wrong with giving context to ignorant people but saying “he wasn’t Chicago MJ!” isn’t a groundbreaking statement lol. He was a horrible mentor in Washington tho and a bad GM/Owner whatever it was. His eye for talent is also horrible.
@aaa.internet70142 жыл бұрын
some people would have you convinced he was still a top 10 player
@user-bw6pt9dy6f2 жыл бұрын
@@aaa.internet7014 thank u. A lot of people tried to convince fans he was a top 10 player in the league and i mean A LOT including people in the media
@nessy30982 жыл бұрын
That’s on him for leaving and coming back
@WittynotSilly Жыл бұрын
MJ was worse than advertised... truth be told alot of guys were taking it easy on him I really believe that only a handful of guys really went at him.. but 23 , 5 and 5 on 42% shooting and 18% from 3 is bad but not horrible on face value but it's worse when you take into account he took 22 shots per game , Rip hamilton was shooting the ball 17 times and scoring almost identical numbers on better efficiency
@greatwhitesufi Жыл бұрын
Jordan Wizards years > 90% of the players in the early 2000s of the NBA
@MMS-hn5ux Жыл бұрын
Historical perspective. Jordan at 39: 22.7 ppg, 41.6%FG Kareem at 39: 23.4 ppg, 56.4% FG, 1st Team All NBA, Top 5 in MVP votes
@ousamaabdu7942 жыл бұрын
When MJ was playing for the Wizards from 01-03 NBA teams were only averaging 95 ppg (compared to 110 today) and the overall league shooting percentage was 44%. These were the lowest overall totals in both categories since the mid 50s. For him to get an aggregate of 21/5/5 (that would equate to 25/7/6 in 2022) and shoot a little better than the league average as a 40 year old in one of, if not the most defensively dominated couple of years in NBA history says quite a bit. And take away MJ, those Wizards teams would have been lucky to win 25 games. He was still a top 20 player in the league at the time no question about it.
@vishbegamin2 жыл бұрын
Now we need a video like this with the same energy on LeBron missing the Play In Tournament.
@generull6552 Жыл бұрын
U salty and butthurt asf tryna defend daddy jordan
@gmailgmail6234 Жыл бұрын
And a video of him making the wcf and 38 while averaging 30
@visno2 жыл бұрын
the wizards years can be both underrated and also not add to his legacy. i would argue that those years actually hurt his legacy. but those two years were still great when put into context. dude was 40 and dropping great stats and the team was undeniably better with him on the floor. but his stats were also subpar from what we expected from jordan.
@hirshja2 жыл бұрын
Can I direct your attention to the 2nd half of this video?
@tboss81572 жыл бұрын
His stats were genuinely awful. One of the worst high volume chucking seasons in NBA history.
@flo-jofr11 ай бұрын
@@tboss8157he was 40 averaging over 20points a game and I believe he has a few games where he dropped 40-50points, the team was also better with him on the floor
@ignaciofuentes26429 ай бұрын
His stats were to the detriment of the team. Guys like Jordan, Iverson and Melo can always score 30,40 even 50 any time they want. Doesn't mean it's good for the team. Wizards Jordan was a ball hog that got blocked a lot because his fade away jumper wasn't fast and high anymore and it was predictable. Just like Iverson at the end of his career....Jordan should have been a 20 or 30 minute a night guy. But we all know his ego wasn't going for that.
@visno9 ай бұрын
@@ignaciofuentes2642 jordan era wizards without jordan also couldn’t win a game to save their lives without him
@joegibbskins11 ай бұрын
It’s because the levers of basketball played in the NBA had evolved too much since the 99s. Jordan had skills for the 90s but was wildly unprepared for the bigger faster teams of the 2000s
@Wisestomatoe10 ай бұрын
So imagine him playing today
@BoBnfishy2 жыл бұрын
I think the biggest thing is that they say "it's so impressive that he did it after retiring" Like bro nobody asked him to retire 3 times. If we count not playing as a goat case I'm the goat because I never played in the NBA. It's about being there and playing games
@georgigyurov7781 Жыл бұрын
no real basketball talks here
@PIEMAN1062 жыл бұрын
As a Wizards fan, I wish he never stepped foot in DC
@MS-it7fy2 жыл бұрын
didn't you have a 19 win record before him?
@thebaconbuizel35982 жыл бұрын
Holy I’m early, but I’m really interested to see what you have to say, this feels like the unspeakable truth in the NBA. Either because people are wrong, or because people don’t want to admit that he was vulnerable at some point in his career.
@jadenkelly59692 жыл бұрын
Without Jordan the wizards are lucky enough to win 20 games
@atomsk19722 жыл бұрын
MJ is the personification of our society's propensity for 'winning cures everything'.
@hirshja2 жыл бұрын
I totally agree. If you were to ignore his name then the counting stats might be impressive, but if he was anyone else, he wouldn't have been getting the opportunity to chuck the ball the way he did.
@eazymoneymane7789 Жыл бұрын
Sounds like a bunch of feelings instead of facts, MJ took the worst team in the NBA with the lottery pick and had them in the playoffs until he got hurt after being out almost 3 years, it just seems personal instead of what's being done on the court 😂😂
@overseer707 Жыл бұрын
whos here after arnett cooked this dude 🙋♂️
@HT-sm9dm8 ай бұрын
I missed that. You got the link to that video?
@user-hr9lp2jh5v8 ай бұрын
@overseer707 I am
@sandman10087 ай бұрын
@HT-sm9dm It's called "Setting the Record Straight About Michael Jordan's Wizards Years." It's actually Arnett's 2nd video about MJ's Wizards years, but the 2nd one is a direct response to this video. It's mostly pointing out the things in this video that was factually incorrect, which they are a few things about this video that are wrong, or at least not completely true. It's definitely worth the watch.
@user-hr9lp2jh5v6 ай бұрын
Me
@HorizonOfHope5 ай бұрын
Having watched both, this one is more convincing by a fair way.
@MNSonYT2 жыл бұрын
I totally agree that he wasn’t great thus those two seasons don’t add to his legacy I just have a problem with people who act like he was bad Love your stuff man every time I see a new video I rush to it. You’re one of my favorite KZfaqrs.
@thelameg6 Жыл бұрын
homicidally competitive is a fucking hilarious descriptor
@survivortheoneincharge78752 жыл бұрын
2002 is a different story, the wizards had a 26-22 record. They had won their last 5 games, and they were going at a 44 win pace (easily in the playoffs) but one of Jordan’s teammates knocked into him and he suffered a knee injury. After that the wizards imploded, they went 11-23 and MJ averaged just 15 points on a disgusting 39% field goal. Now prior to the injury they were doing what they had hoped for but unfortunately the injury happened and everything was done from there. 2003 I would agree, as good as 20 points is making the playoffs is the most important thing and MJ failed that (no major injuries involved) I would like to see one on this current Lakers season seeing as they can’t make play ins now.
@MistahUnknown2 жыл бұрын
@Survivor the one in charge What injury? It was just a collision that started some on and off knee soreness. It was the same thing LeBron played with this season. Its just that LeBron was a freak of nature when he had his. Heck, Jordan continues moving and jumping like normal, doesn't leave the game or miss the following games. He doesn't even miss a play. The report of him sitting of the rest of the season is from two months later at the end of the season
@survivortheoneincharge78752 жыл бұрын
@@MistahUnknown incorrect, Jordan had torn knee cartilage and I believe he had surgery and had liquid drained from it multiple times. Apparently it used to blow up “like and elephant”. LeBron did not have the same injury this season that is false, he had no structural damage whatsoever. It was a big shame that Jordan had this injury because the wizards were going very well and were definitely going to make the playoffs. Even after this injury the wizards would of made the play ins if it existed back then.
@MistahUnknown2 жыл бұрын
@@survivortheoneincharge7875 I was correct. The knee collision he had with teammate Eton Thomas has nothing to do with his swollen knee's being drained. As a matter of fact, Jordan got his knee drained 3 times that season leading up to that knee collision he had with Eton Thomas. From some sources that I've read, people can go back to working 24 hours after getting their knee's drained. LeBron literally had water in his knee this season. LeBron's diagnosis was "Knee soreness/effusion." D-Wade played in the 2013 NBA finals after getting his knee drained. From an article I just read: "Team physician Dr. Stephen Haas found and repaired torn cartilage in the 39-year-old forward's right knee, an injury Haas said was the result of normal wear and tear for an athlete of Jordan's caliber." It's literally *normal wear and tear* and many athletes both inside and outside of basketball have performed with those. Jordan was literally hopping and running all season. "It is good that he had this done now, not only for the end of the season, but it will give him hope even for next year," Collins said. "He knows that if he didn't have this done, he wouldn't be able to continue to play. More and more the swelling is coming back. There's something in there that is irritating his knee. If it's just a cleanup, hopefully he can be back. If it's something a little bit more severe, we'll have to wait and see." His coach spoke like as if it was an option to get his knee's looked at. According to the stat sheets, it seemed to be true. He dropped a 37 and 34 point game both shortly before and shortly after the surgery along with a bunch of 20+ point games. But his team was still catching defeats throughout all of those high scoring games. Jordan's last game that season was on April 2nd while the last game of the season for his team was April 16th. He scored just 2 points in his last game. Then he literally sat out with a swollen right knee and watched his teams catch a bunch of defeats for the remainder of the season.
@survivortheoneincharge78752 жыл бұрын
@@MistahUnknown it’s ‘normal wear and tear’ but you use it in the wrong context. Unless I am reading the text wrong the doctor seems to be saying that the injury was the result of normal wear and tear and not that the injury itself was normal wear and tear. I would agree with the doctor on this, as being bumped into by your teammate wouldn’t seem like it would cause such a big injury. His coach didn’t speak as if it’s option to look at the knee. In fact he stated that if he didn’t have it done he wouldn’t be able to play. And it’s easy to just name a few games where he did well post injury “37 and 34 point game” but the numbers are there and he statistically was terrible after the injury. Before injury: 25.1/6.3/5.2, Post injury: 15.7/3.8/4.8 the difference is huge whether or not you would like to admit it. So let me get this straight, LeBron didn’t have torn cartilage, he didn’t have knee surgery, he was still able to play fine a few games after. Yet the injury’s are just as bad and he’s just a “freak of nature” yeah idk about that. So overall, incorrect.
@ctoaun23 Жыл бұрын
Would you like a video on this current Lakers season too?
@ItsMeStrider Жыл бұрын
Lmao this guy got clowned on by jonny arnett. Watch the damn games next time lol
@unclejoe3338 Жыл бұрын
not really, just two losers bickering back and forth about one of the goats
@libfit9068 Жыл бұрын
@@unclejoe3338 More like one guy (clayton) clearly didnt do his research and got called out on it.
@vigneshsubramanian25112 жыл бұрын
Can you do a video on Magic Johnson's comeback in 1996? No one really talks about that. His comeback was way better than MJ's because Magic was out of the game for more than five years and then brought a laker team to the first round of playoffs and the Lakers were fourth-best in the western conference.
@rafikz772 жыл бұрын
Players like Magic simply make their teams better Guys like Jordan or Kobe don’t
@hitek9too255 Жыл бұрын
Wow! That's insane. People need to talk about that.
@WittynotSilly Жыл бұрын
Magic made everyone who ever played with him infinitly better he got them rings , he got them paid and he got them laid 😂 "allegedly"
@EM-et4jq Жыл бұрын
Talk about a guy that had NO help. Those wizards squads were terrible.
@trigun4426 ай бұрын
Why don't you talk about Jordan not being able to play with a top 5 all NBA superstar, any hall of famers, any formers superstars, any top 75 greatest player of all time, how come you don't mention any of that? Jordan at that old age didn't flop, didn't cry, he fought through adversity while getting his knee injected and drained every other game. Cmon boy
@gmailgmail62344 ай бұрын
He had stackhouse
@hardybryan2 жыл бұрын
As a lifelong Bullets/Wizards fan, THANK YOU! I wish I could say Jordan was the worst thing that's happened to this franchise, but that would be a lie. He still wasn't good.
@caieby22 жыл бұрын
He drafted Kwame and cost us a top 5 pick in the 03 draft, he's one of the worst things that ever happened to the franchise. Not the worst, but close.
@okeythegoat23322 жыл бұрын
@@caieby2 facts
@Hazztech2 жыл бұрын
It took like a while but I think he's finally learning how to lead a team. Asking a man to play, manage a team, and age gracefully into retirement is to much to ask of any man- sadly, that's what mj demanded from himself.
@hutonghustler53172 жыл бұрын
I love how his game winning shot came with 5.2 seconds. Josh Allen wins the game with 13 seconds in a sport that is completely more difficult to move into scoring range, and yet it’s completely results oriented as to who gets the praise
@andrewcook124610 ай бұрын
The people who consider Jordan's Wizards stint as successfull also criticize Bron for losing in the WCF.
@Wisestomatoe10 ай бұрын
Basically
@boonebeasley962210 ай бұрын
Exactly lol and say LeBron laker tenure is a failure with a champion and 3 playoff appearances lol vs Jordan 0 playoffs is somehow a success
@AugustusMichael2 жыл бұрын
This video is weird. I don't think i've ever heard anyone bring up the Wizard years as a meaningful part of MJ's legacy, if anything they are universally discounted or intentionally omitted. If you view it as what it was; a 40 year old once great player coming back for a swansong, then it was as noted in the video, pretty good, not great. The other examples of older players excelling (Kareem, Tim Duncan, LBJ now) have/had strong organisations around them, the Wizards weren't/aren't that. Again, the biggest contention I have with this video is that it is predicated on a discussion that I don't think, barring a few hardcore MJ stans, is really happening
@PredatorBunny2 жыл бұрын
The one thing that turns me off about jordan is exactly what you said early on in the video in that he’s not held to the same standards that he sets. Bc of this stance by his fans, nobody will ever surpass him as the GOAT in their eyes, just an unrealistic bar. I don’t think a guy like Giannis NEEDS to go 6/6 in championships to be considered the GOAT. Can do it with 4 or 5 titles as long as the other accolades are around & you don’t have to be perfect in the finals either. Say by some miracle LeBron finishes with 6 titles, it’ll somehow hurt LeBron that he lost some finals as well? What kind of logic is that? On those notes: would love to see a “potential GOAT” mini series. Like look at players in todays league that have the POTENTIAL to reach that status. Imo it’s only Giannis or Luka, but if there’s other players that’s your job to “Make the Case”
@Chillboyhaad2 жыл бұрын
The thing you're not getting is that Mike IS THE STANDARD. No one past or present as accomplished what he's done on the court in such little time. So nitpicking his career on the Wizards and using that as a way to "knock him down a peg" is holding him to an even higher standard. At that point you're comparing him to God.
@massdagod2 жыл бұрын
I’m glad he played for the Wizards. I hated him as a player for the Bulls. When I seen him comeback 3 years later at 39/40. I finally seen him as a human. Legacy wise, I don’t think it diminished him.
@jordanjreamer203 Жыл бұрын
I HAVE NO CLUE WHY HE WOULD COME BACK TO BE A WIZARD ID SAY GET ONE MORE TROPHY IF YOU COULD OR EVEN BOOST YOUR STATS BUT WHEN HE CAME BACK TO THE WIZARDS IT WAS OBVIOUS HE WAS UP TIME UP LOL HES A PHENOM BUT THAT WIZARD PERFORMANCE WAS JUST OVER WITH
@brianbadonde92512 жыл бұрын
If by failure you mean he didn't win a championship, then sure. But those Wizards years are underrated
@KOHoxton2 жыл бұрын
Wasn't he like the prime reason they they struggled with talent, coaching and management, though.
@jordandwiggins10262 жыл бұрын
They didn’t develop into anything remotely competitive either. You don’t have to win a ring to still succeed, but they only succeeded by barely sniffing the playoffs instead of gazing at it from a mile away like they would have otherwise. That’s not much success
@brianbadonde92512 жыл бұрын
@@bensytaccount subjective
@bensytaccount2 жыл бұрын
@@brianbadonde9251 I could literally say that about what you said earlier so that's not even a real argument.
@brianbadonde92512 жыл бұрын
@@bensytaccount exactly
@bluestone8002 жыл бұрын
50 points at age 39 is SUPER impressive but not something that really adds to a legacy. Jamal Crawford legacy wasn’t elevated after scoring 51 at 39
@Chillboyhaad2 жыл бұрын
Imagine comparing Jamal Crawford to Michael Jordan
@Ivantheterrible81280 Жыл бұрын
Quite a compelling argument. I’d dispute Kareem though, simply for the support element. He had Pat Reiley as a coach and a team that could (and did) win rings without him when he was 40. Magic is an all-time great, Pat has more rings than Bill Russell, Worthy was a HOFer. Jerry West was the executive. Manute Bol could plug into that team and be an all-star. Jordan’s team was in the basement both without him and with him.
@DrawQuick20142 жыл бұрын
I remember seeing people in 2011 youtube comments talking about how jordan wanted to return and would dominate at 50 years old
@lynnerose78912 жыл бұрын
“Past his prime” Kareem Abdul Jabbar played in back to back to back NBA Finals. Nobody mentions that bc it doesn’t fit the narrative that the Jordan Truthers want to pretend his Wizards years shouldn’t be part of the narrative for why he’s NOT the GOAT. If you’re the goat then you’re not playing past your prime, bc you don’t have a drop that severe. It absolutely needs to be included in the GOAT conversation bc there is nobody else whose case excludes multiple seasons. Your entire career is the case or you’re not in the conversation. And yes they DO tarnish his legacy BECAUSE HE WAS THE ONLY PERSON RESPONSIBLE. Had he quit after the Bulls, maybe there’s little to argue. But frankly the fact that there are other players with substantially better claims because THEIR ENTIRE CAREERS are used as evidence of their greatness pushes Jordan out of the conversation.
@Dotsetc2 жыл бұрын
Bruh are you honesty comparing the 80's Lakers that had a team with two or three superstars and a borderline All Star every year to the Wizards of the starting 00's? Add prime Magic and Worthy to this Wizards team and they go for a chip lol. C'mon now bruh. You're acting like Kareem was the main star on that team. Magic won them a chip when Kareem didnt even play as a rookie filling in his spot recording a 40 point near triple double with 14 rebounds. You also weirdly skip on Kareem having the same age as Jordan in which those last two years he was the 5th option on the team in scoring and was merely a big body on defense with zero to no mobility. He was merely a role player at that time and surely contributed but fell off a lot worse than MJ on the Wizards and thats while playing in a super team getting easy shots. And no I wouldnt discredit Kareem for it either so dont do the same for a bad team with an old MJ.
@JoseFernandez-mn6qt Жыл бұрын
Mr. Crowley, I'm sorry ti see this from you, as I normally like your videos. This was, sorry to have to say, a poorly informed, badly prepared, and tremendously wrong video. This looked more like a video from a LeBron fan trying to hurt MJ... You failed to privide the appropriate context to, specially, MJ's first season in Washington, where if not for an injury to Jordan, the Wizzards would have probably won some 52-55 games and even had a shot at making it to the NBA Finals (where granted, they would've provably lost badly to the Lakers). You are being grossly dissengenuous in this video. Really sad.
@marioantoniocrespoMexican923 ай бұрын
I’m a die hard Michael Jordan is the goat in the nba I lived in 90s I remember when I was a kid
@CavsFanDallasFanSinceFebruary2 жыл бұрын
This video was so flawed and this isn’t because of being a Jordan fan. 1. Jordan did not have control of any of the Wizards moves during his time as a player. He knew this, Collins knew this, the whole team knew this. He had no control of the Stackhouse-Hamilton trade. The wizards were just trying to be in win-now mode. 2. Jordan’s stats weren’t empty. Before his knee injury and the AS break, the Wizards were 26-21. That’s CLEARLY a playoff appearance. When Jordan and Hamilton played together, they were 15-1. 3. There have been many instances where adding/removing a defensive powerhouse clearly impacts the team. Jordan, Wallace, Chandler, Gobert, Draymond, Bill Russell, etc, etc. Defense is mostly a team effort yes, but it is possible for a single player to get his team to work farrrrrrr better on defense compared to without him. 4. More proof that Jordan’s time on the Wizards was insane: In his last 10 games up to the injury he averaged 29.7 - 6.6 - 6.1 - 1.2 - 0.3 on 47% In his last 20 games up to the injury he averaged 27.5 - 6.4 - 5.2 - 1.3 - 0.5 on 44% For comparison, Tracy McGrady was averaging 25/6/5. Had it not been for that knee injury, his Wizards years would have been even greater to his legacy.
@MaccaveliPL2 жыл бұрын
You can't rate 2 seasons based on the 40/20/10 game stretches. And also "if" doesn't exist.
@DevonDaVinci Жыл бұрын
@@MaccaveliPL By doing the 40/20/10 milestones it shows that he was improving as the year went on. So the fact that they were 26-21 arounds all-star break means they very likely would have had an even better second half of the season with a more in-shape Jordan.
@TheSands83 Жыл бұрын
Jordan’s wizards had a better record than lebron did with Westbrook Davis Carmelo etc
@gretchenlittle68172 жыл бұрын
Well-written and presented, as always! Glad you mentioned Duncan and Kareem (who's this Brady guy?) Just wondering, though, as a cynic, what impact MJ's years w/Washington had on ticket sales -- did he succeed by that metric?