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Mission 700 Leading Edge Speakers "Update" Trying New Caps (well some other used ones) Sound Test

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Michael Yates

Michael Yates

Күн бұрын

After a comment on yesterdays post I try some other capacitors to replace the ones already in
The results on my little Sansui were very noticable.
#speakers
UPDATE on 2 crossover versions here • Mission 700 Leading Ed...
Original video here • Mission 700 Leading Ed...
Link to crossover recap page speakerholic.b...

Пікірлер: 68
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 2 ай бұрын
Looks like there was two different crossovers for these speakers by comments here and the pair I have. Also reading comments on the forum here audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/mission-700-le-speakers-rebuild-upgrade.967086/
@steveoszman8746
@steveoszman8746 3 ай бұрын
I bought some smaller Mission speakers replaced the poor condition electrolytic capacitors with some better grade caps. They are nice living space speakers, not over bearing, very accurate. Your balanced quality set up is sweet.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Think I have learnt how much a recap can transform a pair of speakers I was not expecting it to be so vast as it was with these.
@peterskyes1267
@peterskyes1267 3 ай бұрын
Sorry to see you go Michael. I very muched enjoyed your videos you gave a fair review on what you thought and can not say fairer than that. Showing that you can get a decent little system for not a lot of dosh. Always pointed out that its only your taste and opinion. Good on you
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Thanks Peter very much appricaited. All the best Michael
@D1N02
@D1N02 3 ай бұрын
Well that is pretty much how mine sound. I'm glad you could fix them up.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Thanks, I have been going through my collection and quite nice that my little baby 331 is really sounding nice through these. Might experiment with a few different caps later on but for the time being I will just sit back and relax and enjoy the tunes for now.
@vvendetta721
@vvendetta721 2 ай бұрын
Synchronicity, as I gutted my old 1988 700 LE as the baffle was rattling and they sounded fragile and tinny. The chipboard construction is very 1985, the first year of production basically, the plastic injection moulded baffle has cross square ribs for strength but it lacks mass and rings. I applied countless layers of upvc glue until it was filled and flush. I then cut a 9mm ply interior carcass to reinforce the box and bonded it with layers of upvc clamped over night. Then tailored bitumen sound damping sheets to cover every inch of the inside interior to reduce unwanted resonance, then rebuild the crossovers using ICW polyester capacitor on a cork board and wired it with QED Bronze cable, vastly superior to the anemic 49 strand cables. The rear spring terminals have been replaced with binding posts for banana plugs, the baffles are now installed with a non shrinking polyurethane not silicone, it's never coming off again, the waddling was replaced with soft loose wool, new drive unit gaskets and soon a new veneers or potential epoxy coating the outside cabinets. The weight of each speaker doubled, mass is important for imaging, I may install a auxiliary resonator but I'll test the system first. The time taken has been ridiculous but I love these 700LE's
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 2 ай бұрын
Thanks for all the extra info here, you have done a lot of work on your pair looking at all the upgrades mentioned
@jimsregaturntableshifijukebox
@jimsregaturntableshifijukebox 3 ай бұрын
Another interesting one buddy and like number 12 from me. Jim🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🙂
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Thanks Jim, you was no7 last time your lacking lol. All the best Michael
@jimsregaturntableshifijukebox
@jimsregaturntableshifijukebox 3 ай бұрын
@@MichaelYates I'm setting slow in my old age. 😉😂
@matthewtaylor7355
@matthewtaylor7355 3 ай бұрын
Thanks for speaker recap Michael shame ur unwell. ur accent makes a change from the usual boring middle class types... Hope back in action soon
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Thanks Matthew. Ile have a little time away think that will help my eye a ton. Try and get a few elocution lessions booked up to lol. Hopefully be back with something soonish. All the best Michael
@mauanderuk
@mauanderuk 3 ай бұрын
At this vintage the ferrofluid goes hard in the tweeters this is easy to change, I always check ESR leakage and capacitance of the caps generally they hold up fairly well but I usually replace with high quality polyester caps that last forever and then I test the crossover for performance.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Tweeters here seem to be doing ok which is good as I think I might struggle a little with re-doing the ferrofluid, but I suppose don't know until I try. Got these caps in as temporary as they were to hand. Not sure how the 16 ohm ESR effected these but the cap change did make a great change. All the best Michael
@vvendetta721
@vvendetta721 2 ай бұрын
You can apply a low viscosity silicone spray that will liquify the ferror fluid.
@sp0001-i7g
@sp0001-i7g 3 ай бұрын
Hope you get this Michael. Nice recovery job I used polyester film caps a 2.2uf and 3.3uf as shown in artical and added 1/2 foam to all sides. They sound fantastic to my ears. Hope to see some more videos in the near future.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Thanks, I will keep a note of that. I wont go to expensive. I might get some foam and give that a go to. But for now happy with the sound and been listening since. All the best Michael
@scottlowell493
@scottlowell493 2 ай бұрын
Every speaker I have upgraded since 1998 from electrolytics to polyester, mylar or metal poly sound much better. Simply, more neutral and open. More detail/clarity. The weak link in budget speakers is often the cheap high ESR electrolytics and iron core inductors..
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 2 ай бұрын
These are the cheapest of the cheap I think, even for the low values they look quite small. I will get some decent caps for these.
@ryansmith7974
@ryansmith7974 3 ай бұрын
Have you ever listened to any Energy speakers 2.1e or 3.1e or 4.1e they are Canadian made around 1996. Keep your eyes open and make sure the tweeters are good and enjoy the warmth. Ive got a Sansui 551 and you know its got bass and the Energy go low but still have the highs and clarity to match. Cheers.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Thanks, until not heard of these speakers, but I see a few Energy speakers for sale on eBay here in the UK but not these model numbers, but I will keep an eye open now. All the best Michael
@van0tot100
@van0tot100 2 ай бұрын
super interesting, I have the same ones but one of them has issues under load. maybe i can replace the caps as well to see if this improves them
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates Ай бұрын
Replacing the caps made a big difference here so might be worth a try for a little outlay.
@AlexMitchell-sj4sb
@AlexMitchell-sj4sb 3 ай бұрын
Weirdly Mike, I have found that some of the Missions I had didnt go well with an Hitachi receiver I had, yet I remember pairing up a pair of Celestion DL4 speakers and they paired well and that receiver sounded a lot better. With the Missions it sounded dull.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Yes some speakers and amps are just made for each other and other not. I was a bit dissapointed that the 331 was struggling with these speakers as had no trouble with that unit on any other speakers I have had and they seem to need quite a bit bass power to get going.
@AlexMitchell-sj4sb
@AlexMitchell-sj4sb 3 ай бұрын
@MichaelYates I think it's the speakers Mike not the 331. As I said, had same with my Missions, don't like certain pairing with certain receivers or amps. Those Celestions I had brought that Hitachi to life, I was surprised it could sound that good.
@uksimonseye
@uksimonseye 3 ай бұрын
Going to miss your vids Michael. Much thanks as you made me play around with caps ect... next poject for me is some KEF C60's in mint condition but tweeters are poor. What will i watch with my morning coffee with out you ? top bloke and thanks for sharing.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Thanks Simon, dare say with this bug I be back lol. Think there is a lot of experimenting to be done with caps. Buying a few makes of the same values etc as they all sound so different. All the best Michael
@hugobloemers4425
@hugobloemers4425 3 ай бұрын
Hi Michael, if you like these speakers and want to keep them, it could be worth while investing in some really good capacitors.
@matthewtaylor7355
@matthewtaylor7355 3 ай бұрын
It's a budget channel... Not 1 pair of missions for the price of 1 audio grade mundorf
@D1N02
@D1N02 3 ай бұрын
@@matthewtaylor7355 a 5.6 uF clarity cap is les than 15 pounds. Long term that's almost nothing
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Think I will do just that at a reasonable price, quite liking how they sound at the moment
@kevinchew2594
@kevinchew2594 2 ай бұрын
Halo , Sir.! Can i ask do you change the original speaker at tweeter and woofer side ? tq
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 2 ай бұрын
These are still the same tweeter and woofer, I just replaced to two caps in each crossover
@CM-dw3gh
@CM-dw3gh 2 ай бұрын
Hi Michael. Do you know if theres any records/manuals online on speaker caps used on specific speakers. I know amps do with hifiengine. Its just id like to replace the caps in my cresta kef 2's. Ill prob have to just open them up first.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 2 ай бұрын
No I have not seen any about on the net. You might get lucky doing a search and chosing images, sometime you can can across stuff just looking at the images for certain stuff and find someone who has posted a picture on a forum etc with remarks or comments on that pic. Sorry I can not help further.
@CM-dw3gh
@CM-dw3gh 2 ай бұрын
@@MichaelYates im always doing that, infact i missed out by a day on ebay as a crossover was sold the following day and the photos arent showing now. Gutted. Just looks like a good all round speaker that most like to leave as it is. I just wanted to use film caps like ive done before. And id like to also add, it was you that gave me the confidence in doing this along with amp bias/idle which could be so useful for folk to preserve older equipment and keep it going for a few more years. Good luck in what ever you do my friend😉
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 2 ай бұрын
@@CM-dw3gh Thanks and glad you was brave enough to have a go. I know a lot of people would be very apprehensive. All the best Michael
@AlexMitchell-sj4sb
@AlexMitchell-sj4sb 3 ай бұрын
Oh yeah, I saw that website too you are referring to. Didn't he pair these with an 80s Rotel receiver? He said he was happy with the pairing. I can't remember which receiver it was but it was definitely 80s, the black faceplate era.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Yes looking further into the artical he had a Rotel RX-830 paired with these that he thought sounded really nice. Also on the main recap page he had a Realistic STA-84 paired up and said the midrange was to prominate but also liked the sound of a JVC R-S33 receiver with these.
@AlexMitchell-sj4sb
@AlexMitchell-sj4sb 3 ай бұрын
@MichaelYates that was the one Mike! The RX 830! I couldn't find it on ebay, so I wonder if it was only sold in N. American markets?
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
@@AlexMitchell-sj4sb I am not to sure TBH, though the Tuner and Cassette Deck in that range have been on sale on eBay, just maybe not a lot of them about
@jonboy9912
@jonboy9912 3 ай бұрын
So you got rid of the Celestion 3's?
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Well yes and no, they are on permanent loan at a friends and can get them back as long as I replace with another pair of speakers. Been looking for a mk2 version (ported at rear) as had a few tell me that they sound even better. Been quite a few on eBay either just a bit to expensive or pick up only. I will get them at somepoint that is for sure.
@jonboy9912
@jonboy9912 3 ай бұрын
@@MichaelYates They have shot up over the last year or so, I bought mine for £25 off the BHF website 3 years ago and I see them today from £85 to £150. The Mk2's are nicer for smaller systems and still well priced for what they are in today's mad World.
@hoobsgroove
@hoobsgroove 3 ай бұрын
I'm not sure what you're doing you just swap the capacitor for a different type!? it's only got a inductor on the woofer driver, and a capacitor and resistor first order as well on the tweeter. what you could do is try and get a 40k or around that figure 38-45k 3 Watt non-inductive metal film resistor across the inductor, this would increase the mid-range better, looking at it it looks like it's lacking in mid-range but very difficult to tell from a picture without hearing them, this will increase the upper frequencies as well so you might need to increase the resistor on the tweeters. try non-inductive 0.7 ohm 2W in line. What's in there about 1.2ohms? yeah the plastic baffle on the tweeter lets it down you can deal with this can you take it off or get to it from the back? make some plaster of Paris and PVA glue about 60% glue to 40% plaster mix. and pack in the back it's probably got ribs fill the ribs up half an inch, it will help a lot. I've done this before with these types of baffles rubbish there are. make sure you paint the plastic first with PVA glue and let it go clear before you put the mixture on so give it 6 hours before applying and should be a gasket round the baffle put a bead of blu tack as well when putting it back will prevent smearing. also I found if the plastic surround of the tweeter is to stick with contact adhesive a disc from an old hard drive works really well over the top. that makes it sound much more lively but not brittle or sibilance just gives it more presents sounds more real. let the plaster of paris go off give it 24 hours before tilting it or putting it back. oh and remove the tweeter of course find a bit of cardboard tubing or something similar some tape even around the opening. oh and where the gasket is don't put plaster of paris leave that untouched just the bead of blu tack. one thing with that plastic baffle it's square so you could put the tweeter to one side, this might actually sound better it might need crossover tweaks to achieve ultimate but it's worth trying! I always think the tweeter is better to on the side than directing line.
@sp0001-i7g
@sp0001-i7g 3 ай бұрын
Pretty much so I did the same just replaced the 2.2 & 3.3 with a polyester film caps of same value they are piggy back on top of each other. Mine sounded a lot better after. Think they sound just fine as they are now the baffle of these are specially made material with the main driver slighly forward to the tweeter. Also added a little 1/2 foam to the sides of cabinet as suggested in recap artical.
@hoobsgroove
@hoobsgroove 3 ай бұрын
@@sp0001-i7g I don't know what you mean by "specially made baffles" nothing special about them, they are fibreglass plastic I believe, yeah I know the bass driver baffle is slightly ahead of the tweeter I wouldn't say enough I would put it even further in front level with the front of the cabinet or sticking out of it. stiffening it up as I suggested will help and add dampening. so you think the mid-range is good on them?? what is the inductor value do you know? it's just the one isn't it. also another approach if you put the resistor across the inductor and a 1uF capacitor in parallel with the resistor to roll the top end off if the upper mid frequencies are becoming too prominent.
@sp0001-i7g
@sp0001-i7g 3 ай бұрын
@@hoobsgroove I was only passing on what I read on the artical I sent Michael that YT dont seem to want to display. He as put a link to that artical above. I have no idea what the value of the inductor is. I only got around to changing mine as they sounded a little dull when I bought them and came across the artical so just to a chance and recapped them and they sound really good now. Bass mids and top end are all fine to my ears.
@D1N02
@D1N02 3 ай бұрын
@@sp0001-i7g according to someone on audiokarma it is 670 uH for the iron core and 160 uH for the aircore.
@MichaelYates
@MichaelYates 3 ай бұрын
Yes as below I just changed the 2 parallel caps for each speaker for just 1 cap that I had to hand and the difference has pretty much amazed me was maybe expecting a little difference. Been listening since and happy with the sound. I might have a little tinker in the future but for now I am very pleased. All the best Michael
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