Hi Charlie, I dont usually comment on videos but I subscribed and just want to say thank you for sharing your knowledge. I have seen a number of your videos and I agree with your method of teaching 100%. I have an 8 month old female border collie that I struggle to loose lead walk and she loves to chase when I throw a ball but wont hand it back in my hand except if I have a treat. I'll keep on working with her keeping your videos in mind. Keep up the good work!

Well said. I think that part of the reward-reward-reward at all times comes from people who train dogs to do things that are not inherently interesting or meaningful to the dogs. You're working with dogs whose work is inherently self-rewarding and working with you is amazing. I think that what you have to say about good behaviour being something dog and owner do together as opposed to something to be bribed constantly for is a much-needed message. Finally, man, you have some beautiful labs. It's been a treat to see them. :)

Spot on there Charlie! I'm loving these videos. We are all learning every day training gundogs!🐕🏆

Best vid for me yet Charlie. So relevant and true. You explain how unstupid dogs truly are, and how they have the majority of public wrapped round their paws. True about kids too !

I like your analogy of paying your kids for what's simply expected.

Charlie, as a fellow Scot I'd just like to say a huge thank you to you! We have two WCS, one 10yrs and one 3 years. The younger one we were lax in training and paid the price when she caught a scent and took off for half an hour recently, despite being trained to the whistle. I have since gone right back to basics with her, but I realised that after she worked so hard and did so well she was crazy, after a sit/stay she would be running and bouncing like a nutter! Then I came across this video and after just 1 day of implementing the no praise, until training was over, she's a completely different dog! So calm and eager to please, but staying put now and walking to heel so much better on her slip lead (we're still to get to off the lead). Every other 'dog training' video I have seen of late advocates for positive reward based training. However, for a breed like the WCS this just isn't the right way to do it and the dogs simply don't respond well. Doing it your way and the dog improves greatly and responds so well with less excitement and more focus! Thanks again Charlie for sharing your wisdom from years of experience, it's really appreciated. Fran

Your videos are a revelation. They make so much sense. One thing I’d love you to clarify, is how easy this is with other breeds. I have a Newfoundland (4) and a 16 week old Lab. Newf is amazing in water but not so much at retrieving. Also very stubborn. Lab already showing signs of being easier to train all round 😆

This is a bit of a revelation.. maybe I should have thought of this before but it didn’t really occur to me until you put it so clearly. Extremely helpful!

nothing more happy than a working dog - working so glorious

Hi Charlie, your 100% bang on !! thanks for posting these videos...total common sense.

Thank you for this video. It’s often the little things which are overlooked and this makes so much sense as to me now. Obvious now I’ve seen it. Everyday I’m learning. Thank you 🙏

A brilliant clear analogy .

Describing Blue as handsome is a bit of an understatement! He really is magnificent looking.

Good video Charlie, so clearly demonstrated that over stimulation will break the dogs focus (guilty as charged) when they are training/working. In school and out of school as we say. Nice to see a good dog like Blue coming to New Zealand, thanks Howie.

Yet another video full of great ideas... I followed your advice this afternoon & got immediate results.. My pups retrieve was so much more disciplined without all the verbal congratulations...

And my favourite bit, ‘bollocks’……….😍😂

Great video and Goose and Blue are some seriously handsome boys!

Man is Blue a gorgeous dog! This is the first of your videos I've come across and it's an immediate subscribe. I'm a huge fan of the ideas you put forward here, and that's the type of style that has never occurred to me and I've never really seen used before. EVERYONE - including all these other trainers and behaviorists and whatnot - praises the crap out of their dogs, and it feels like it's what's expected of us. This is going to be my mindset on my next pup. Do all your work and learning, get tired, then we get the praise and rewards. So simple, yet so brilliant.

What a breath of fresh air this video is. I have always trained my dogs without treats. I praise my dogs when I train them but this lessens over the years especially if it is for reasons of retrieve or stopping at curbs to wait for me before I arrive etc... A dog is at its best when it feels ot is serving a purpose they love to work. Here and there praise is still there as a reminder since my dogs are family pets and not working dogs operating in packs or with the competition that makes them want to perform correctly so they do appreciate. KZfaq and advice in general on dog training pushes the idea of constant rewards with dog treats and I watch this knowing it is wrong. My dogs have always been a credit to the family, complimented on their behaviour and obedience everywhere they go, its always a compliment when none doggy people notice how well behaved and pleasant your 120lb Akita Rottweiler mix is, citing they wish all dogs were so.

Wow what a brilliant video. I probably like a lot of people have never thought of that, and how true you are. This is something that i do, and i wont do anymore. Thanks for the tip Charlie. I will certainly be watching more of your videos.

Very clearly put and explained. I must admit I am guilty of using too many treats but have dialed back a lot on them and my Flatcoat still loves to work with me. It's my first ever dog and am still learning every day. These videos surely help with that process so thanks for them!

Another great video and refreshing to see in my opinion the correct way to train and treat working dogs👏

Love this made me laugh in the best possible way 😂👍🏼

Bloody marvelous!

Thanks. Great advice

Love the videos, I'm paying very close attention - all makes total sense - sound common sense and so looking forward to putting into practice next week when pup home 😊! Want to say thank you & well done - or should I wait until all your videos are uploaded 😁 just kidding 😉 Cheers Charlie !!

This makes sense. My spaniel goes bonkers if I say good boy and takes it as a cue to rush off and do what he likes. After your last video where you said get rid of the treats, I’ve been getting him to do stuff for “love” haha. But I will try this now. Thanks Charlie!

Thank you Charlie for this lesson. I love watching your videos as I am learning a lot. I have a young Brittany Spaniel (just turned 12 months) so I know what you mean.

Absolutely spot on 👌

Love your videos, lots of great advice but delivered in a funny way. You make me chuckle! 😂

Again you make so much sense great work

Great advice Charlie 👍 makes sense, I like your methods

This video perfectly explains my Willow. Excellent, thanks again for making these.

Two Gorgeous Dogs!

The praise thing is a human thing, the mums don’t praise their pups! My dog gets affection when he’s being calm and quiet at home. He’s not the least bit bothered about praise. Being out working is all he needs. Great video 👍

Brilliant thank you - needed your help on Richmond Park over the weekend, the dog nearly pulled my arm out of its socket trying to get to the deer. Thank God for long lines!!

This is hysterical😂 Great video, really helpful !

Thank you Charlie

This is true to my experience. Thanks for the information which goes against all that poor advice I listened to the first couple of months I had this dog. I wondered whether those trainers had children? Your analogies to kids are crystal clear.

Another great video- again, really helpful thanks

I have a female black Lab with an insanely high play drive. If I had a pork chop in one hand and a ball in the other, she'd go for the fetch every time. It made her very easy to train because she'll do anything for a fetch. I do praise her, but not while we're working, I think it just distracts them. It reminds me of an old Family Circus cartoon where the kid stands up for the first time and his parents give him a cookie that throws him off balance and makes him fall down. It's kind of like that. She just wants to be treated right overall, she doesn't need or want instant gratification while we're focusing on a task :)

Thank you so much. You just validated how I naturally thought about it, but was about to change with my new dog since people keep promoting the reward focus

Your a great dig trainer and soooo useful hints. I was told off once for not saying good boy they said. I just laughed at their madness. Lol.

I think you have just made me aware of my mistakes with my lab, thanks. 🎉

Those labs are stunning looking. Great advice

Thanks, I have a 6 year old Cocker Spaniel and I've always found it difficult to train him. Your videos have helped so much!

Had labs all my life & this is good, old fashioned common sense. Sadly in short supply these days. Excellent video series (too much praise ? 😂)

Just remembered this today and it has definitely helped with my young Labrador, 💪

Many years ago i had a Border collie/Rough collie mix named Max, when he became an adult dog all he wanted to do was play fetch and he would sit and wait for commands, sometimes if i was talking to someone and keeping him waiting too long, then he would bark for me to get back to what we was doing. I never treated him for everything he did, nor any of my other dogs (only as puppies and not all the time). This is a common sense video and it works.

spot on beensaying this for yrs

This may be my first ever KZfaq comment. This video was amazing! I am a blind owner trainer and currently raising a puppy to be my next guide dog. I use treats at the moment for luring. I use toned down praise to use less treats but have paired it with the command so my dogs associate the good with whatever I asked of them. Once puppy calms and gets a longer attention span I Can't wait to be able to face food out. Being blind means I have to use things to make my training more tactile so treat work at the beginning, but my retired dog who was trained by Guide Dogs with treats gets very infrequent treats and only when he does something extraordinary or a brand-new skill. He's 12 and he works for The pleasure. I have a rescue that I also taught to Guide who is very suspicious of strangers and has fear aggression issues in certain circumstances. He is an absolutely fantastic guide and does not work for treats at all. He is not overly food motivated, except for things like bones and chews indoors, but like you were saying about giddy dogs he can become fixated on playing ball. I could've used as reward but chose not to and just use as play. I didn't want a dog that was fixated on the reward. The way I train is also limited by my living situation in a family setting with me as a carer for two elderly adults with multiple needs. However, if I lived alone I would be able to do more training like you do. Thank you for such a well described video and such good commentary that I can get as much from it as a sighted person.

2:30 our chocolate has been doing this since 4 months old, and she’s not even trained, but insane hunting instinct

Another great video treat “training” never works neither does over handling your dog. 👍

I don't mean this in a contradictory way, but I suspect a lot of this is because of the high standard of breeding you have in your dogs, and thus the innate desire they have to retrieve and the reward that gives the dog in itself. On the other hand I think it would be very hard to get my Old English Sheepdog / Poodle cross to retrieve all that well without praise. She isn't bad at retrieving either (to a pet standard).

Very good tip! I must admit i am a rewarder-boss! This is a good video to have a better insight with yourself. Imwill definately try sit before and after a cookie, and not rewarding with petting and praising.

I have a working dog and you are absolutely right. Rewards here are bites as my dog will ignore treats, lol. Simple bite on the tug is all she needs to be happy with the work I put her through.

I agree with you. From a purely training perspective, rewards are used to train the dog how to do something. Once he knows how to behave and what you want him to do, the activity or behavior is the reward. One minor exception is when teaching recall, rewards may be needed to proof the recall, to fine tune the recall from a hunt behavior, etc.

great info, makes sense

Hi, Started following your videos, all very good. Are you planning a follow up video to this one for removing treats if the dog has been brought up on treat rewards and the owner wants to move away from treats to where you are in this video? Keep up the great work. Cheers, ANDY... Every day is a school day! 😉👍

A former tipper, I now tell my dogs that I'm pleased with them when they do something well and the opposite when they do something wrong. This chap is quite correct.

Praise is for pets, I’ve had PPD and assistance dogs and they love their jobs. Especially with my assistance dogs it’s counterintuitive due to the amount of people trying to distract them. Do I reward them? Of course whilst they’re learning but I don’t need to throw food and praisr at them constantly. If you give it to them all of the time it devalues it. I love working my dogs and they love working with me and that’s something pet owners just don’t seem to understand.

Great video and very informative. Question, do you teach the dog to deliver toy back to your hands with food?

New sub from Mew Zealand

Thanks for the practical advice. It's good to see where I'm doing things wrong. I don't want to be seen as a treat dispenses

Brilliant video 😊

I watched this video the first time utterly distracted by looking at Blue and Goose. Second time I listened to the words. 😊 My (male) Lab gets zero motivation from “good boy.” He also “plays the fool” if you get too hyped up (like Goose). My wife loves to talk to him and high voice him and he just does what he wants with (too much) energy. I barely talk to him at all but I make sure he’s checking with me and I’m watching him. I’m certainly not as good of a trainer, but I’ve had a lot of Labs. Every one was different but my current guy (Bomber) is just like Goose! Love this guy and his approach, but his dogs are movie stars! 😮😊

I couldn't agree more, I use food rewards very occasionally and for very specific things, but I get off of them quickly and create an environment where the dog wants to do things for me

beautiful dog

thanks for confirming that I don’t do anything wrong with my dog. I don’t even bring treats. they stay at home.

Wow, Scout avoids me praising him when he’s looking for the next retrieve! He’s so focussed on it. Didn’t realise that’s what it was about.

This brings back memories of my first fetch training sessions with my pup. I'd offer her a treat for returning the dummy, and she'd grab it, spit it out, and stare at me like "there, now your hand is free for more throwing, let's go!"

I am curious about your approach with the dog in the video. Is the whistle effective, given the repetitive nature of your gesture andth enecessity of having a hand tapping for recall? What is the primary cue for your recall here? Your insights would be greatly appreciated.

😂😂 I was ready to criticise,,, ive never trained with treats but i do give praise where its due, have to agree with you on this one tho.!!!🤙

👍🏾🌺🐾💯

I love this, I took my well tempered but playfyul lab to a gun dog trainer and she just fed him with so much cheese he had diahherea after. He loves chasing, run and grabbing at things.

Blue (sp?) is a handsome dog!

It’s funny I totally get it my little Caveh poo is nine months old really good at retrieving and when he goes and touches it if I see anything he looks at me drops it and comes right back if I don’t say anything he brings it right back to me

Thanks I needed to hear this. IMO this is why so many doggos are too plump.

Hi Charlie, would you say this is all true for a three month old puppy? Or just an older dog you are training.

I know it’s a dumb question, these two dogs are beautiful. Where can I purchase one of this quality? I would love to have one like the red one.

So glad I have discovered for video I would talk with people about this all I got back was no no your wrong

My spaniel will not let me stroke him after he has fetched a ball. No way he just wants it thrown again! I find praise and treats are great initially and in certain cases, but then getting the gap between a good behaviour and a reward should be made larger and larger. Also, I sometimes made the mistake of saying "good boy" when he hadnt fully completed an action, like "down stairs" then giving praise for starting the action (ie when he is half way down) was usually followed by him turning round and running back up.

This actually a pretty basic principle: If you want your dog to be calm, be calm yourself. If you want your dog to go-go-go, get excited. Sidenote - a praise not necessarily a treat or high-pitched excited squealing. It can very well be that the dog can run for the dummy again :) Good content though, down-to-earth and clear.

You are constantly rewarding and praising the dog ...it's desire and reward is to go and retrieve and yes if you want a dog to do a sit and stay you have to reward it calmly especially if they are easily aroused ..once aroused they lose concentration on being calm and staying where they are ...and of course you reward kids the first time they do something new but once they have learned the behaviour the praise reward drops until the next new thing which is harder than the first ...the dogs you work with have a trait bred into them which is to retrieve so you work with that desire and make it a reward ..if you sit and wait you get to retrieve..now if you were to try that with say a terrier whose bred to chase catch and kill ..a thrown out dead toy won't cut the mustard as a reward .. for sitting still ..where as if you produce a long furry tug for them to chase an shake then you are rewarding that desire .. so although you say you aren't praising the dog ..you are rewarding the dog for performing a desired behaviour ..and the more you reward it the more you get ..so yes if you praise a dog and get it Highly aroused for doing a calm behaviour then the more it will get excited ...

For a Sheepdog, a quick pat or a 'That'll do' is all they need

Read don't "Don't Shoot the Dog". It will give you a different perspective on reward training. Treat training is great to get your dog to recall as fast as they can. You may not think you are not reward training, but all you have done is find what the dog really wants and rewarding a result with that reward i.e. retrieving.

I’ve probably missed an episode but why does he use the dogs names as a release command or how does he do that which video

People may get confused because these are working dogs that there reward is working. I totally agree with you but unfortunately most dogs are family and do not know work. I treat my dog now and again so he doesn’t always get a treat, because pavlovian conditioning can work for some dogs. And when you praise don’t over do it because they get to excited, I try a say it calmly it was the only way that worked to stop him lunging at other dogs now he’s so much better as I stop the treats he’s not interested just wants to walk. You have to do it slowly and they get used to hearing good boy. All they want to do is please their master and it’s a thin line and never give up, patience is the key.

Your conclusion was a lot better than the of the video, i gotta say. It's too specific of a case, to title a video "don't praise your dog"

Hi a great refreshing approach that I will take on myself Now do you think you could do the same with every other business that we all deal with asking how they did looking for praise

7:10 sounds like our tipping culture.

My fox red is five. Indoors he is a model dog. Outdoors… different story! Im still trying me get im calm on the lead.

It heavily depends on the dog, smaller dogs like toy poodles reinforce a lot better to praise rather than correction. It never runs off after getting a treat, it sits next to me waiting for the next command or treat. It's 12 weeks old by the way. Also dogs are different than humans. Comparing dogs to children makes no sense whatsoever.

At what age generally, is a pup able to start obedience training; we have a 4 month old gdoodle; full of exhuberance!

Clever savior 83

Good points but there is a huge difference between a reward and a bribe. With a “working dog’” the “work” is rewarding in itself because it is in their very fibre (pseudo predation). It’s not necessarily cos the dog wants to work for you, it’s because you are controlling the ‘natural’ rewards. There is also something called depravation. And this is the difference between a pet dog and a working dog. Rewards when learning (whatever they maybe) make learning more effective. Works for humans too!

Your videos are great and comedy when you pretend to be the dog 😂

I do this naturally with my border collie but if he does an awesome ball catch I will praise him, he definitely hates any affection when he is 'working' aka focusing on tennis balls!

I disagree. At the end dogs are individuals. I have trained a couple of dogs during my life and I can tell you that some dogs do not need much praise and some need more. My actual Lab is a very sensitive one which needs a lot of reassurance and encouragement

Well youre using the dogs toy as a reward instead of praise and food. I wish my dog would pay attention to me were werre outside but shes more interested in the environment. Any tips on how to train without treats if you arnt a professional trainer?