Just a few things I want to further clarify as I am sure they will be common responses to this video in the comments and I may add to this if I notice any which I did not specifically address in the video or in this pinned comment. I do ask that you first watch the video in its entirety though as I will likely cover what you are going to comment about. 1. My community post following the upload I certainly could have worded that better and it was perhaps a bit too much of a knee-jerk reaction as I left it fairly quickly after watching the response video. I do stand by all the facts I shared in that video however I should have clarified in the post that I did not stand by the tone of that video. The more snarky sarcastic tone is something I tend to use in those comments videos to make them more entertaining especially since most of my responses to comments aren't scripted, but as I did script the LazerPig section and it was meant as criticizing what is likely a genuine mistake I should have done it more professionally. 2. Why didn't I reach out to LazerPig before making my original response? I do not feel that it should be necessary to reach out to someone prior to making a piece critical of their work. I understand why many feel it is a better approach and I do agree that it in some cases it can clear up misunderstandings between parties. However, in this case I had already seen posts critical of the mistakes which LazerPig had responded to yet no changes had been made to the video outside of one minor correction (which I do applaud LP for doing even if it was only one of many). These are the main ones I did not touch on in my video but as I said I may add to this so if you see the comment has been edited you know why. Thank you for taking the time to hear me out and I hope we can all learn something from this situation.

Lets just all move on and all agree that the Bob Semple could easily 1v1 a tiger.

tankgirl tries to help resolve the dispute between a guy in a gas mask and a pig with laser eyes

I believe this drama needs to be taken a step further. A violent oiled up twerk off between Lazerpig, Redeffect and ConeOfArc. That way we can see who really is the winner

Refusing to give sources is the deal breaker for me. That's not something a real historian would do I'm here for facts not megalomania.

props to the tank driver, who listened to the whole thing while you recorded his vehicle.

The fact that this is even considered a "drama" instead of "a few KZfaqrs disagreeing about a barely important minor tank fact" is so strange to me Disagreements like this only devolve into "Drama" when all parties involved decide to make it one

The "I won't cite sources because you should look for them like we did" really rubbed me the wrong way. At best it's absolutely petty bullshit that is 100% against the goal of a useful and civil academic discussion, at worst it's him saying "trust me bro I have tons of sources, you just can't see them because they're in a school in Canada".

"youtube drama" has to be some of the petty highschool level drama on the internet. While it is a "discussion", it becomes drama once one or more parties start making personal attacks.

The dad of tank history is mediating this, and I love how everyone is starting to calm the hell down because of this.

I'm mighty disappointed in LazerPig in general. The first thing he does in every video is to build a strawman, ridicule and mock a madeup opposition to his argumentation, compiling the character that is a caricature of all stereotypes one can think of. He then proceeds to make his point, and sometimes it's quite humorous, funny, I get it, comedic effect. But it also creates this notion that whoever disagrees with him is like this dishonest caricature or aligns in some sense with it. And then instead of just correcting data or disputing with your points, going only facts and sources... the first thing he made in his rebulat video, was to color RE and Cone as some sort of tricksters, playing mind games with the viewers for all sorts of reasons, while he himself can barely start a video without 5 minutes of pre-emptive attack on a strawman.

"You're only calling me out for making mistakes in my video because you want clout!" and "I won't show my sources because you should just trust me not to make stuff up and it's unfair to me and my team if you don't have to go through the same process of finding them than we did." are easily the worst takes any self-titled academic and public intellectual could possibly give in response to criticism. Until LazerPig admits he's in the wrong on those and changes his views on how research should be handled and shared, I unfortunately do feel that I have no other choice than to unsubscribe to him. I say that as a fellow historian who strongly disapproves of how you handled your initial complaint, and of how he responded. I approve of this calm and measured response. It also appears that the facts are currently on your side.

Pig literally broke the first rule of historians by not providing sources lmao average LP L

i remember lazerpig saying that he hated misinfo in a older video... that backfired hard

I know a lot of people are saying you should just have moved on or not have addressed this, but honestly I think you did the right thing. LazerPig is absurdly unreliable and ever growing in popularity. Combine those two things with his obvious biases and you have a recipe for disaster if left unchallenged. Please don't feel bad for challenging misinformation just because some feel like it is "drama". You did the right thing.

"Such criticism is unfounded. Things like that have to be dealt with. Before that guy disabled the commentary on that video, I read some of it. And there was a lot of commentary about how people percieved that I was incompetent or stupid. And there was various versions of "I've never heard of Paul, but I'll make sure I'll never watch any of his stuff, and I'll tell other people not to." Left unchecked, those kind of lies can do a lot of damage, and I had to get out ahead of it." -Paul Harrell You did the right thing Cone, responding to his criticism in a polite tone and apologizing for when you broke your own professionalism, while also pointing out how quick he is to resort to ad hominem and accusing anyone who disagrees with him of being a vatnik - the classic "everyone who disagrees with me is a nazi" approach of bad-faith actors. Hopefully this is the end of it. We support you for all of your hard work in producing genuinely informative history videos.

Lazer really needs to stop insulting people, then running into community notes and saying it was all for humor's sake.

Watching the cone drive around was strangely fun.

I actually think a little back and forth about this kind of thing can be very beneficial, but the tone must be that of a collaborative search for the truth. Towards that end, disagreement and competition are good; confrontation and combativeness are not. Laser Pig's tone can range from dismissive to scathing--which makes for good comedy, but poor historeography--and your initial response was openly combative. Your appology is appreciated, and hopefully Laser Pig responds in kind (and shares his source material). I hope to see further constructive arguements between reasonable adults.

In order to stop the drama I recommend buying eachother lego sets

Arguing with LP is like when his argument turns out to be right, most likey he will reply with "Gacha!!", but if he loses an argument, he will respond with "chill bro, why so serious..."

In my opinion LazerPig has been extremely petty during all this drama, with his response video and his comment under Chieftain's video. Like accusing Cone of "Clout chasing for views"? Come on Pig.

I had an inkling that Laserpig was a bad faith actor when he spouted that nonsense about Russians using an engine stolen from a WW2 tank. His response just confirmed it to me, albeit the people he hangs around with made me think he probably was a propagandist.

As far as I'm concerned LazerPig lost his argument when he said your channel is failing.

Oh wow, Lazerpig just went "it was all a prank bro"

The laser pig response fell like "okay i m wrong, but i will have the last word".

Why the heck is there always conspiracy and drama and stuff between every single KZfaqr and person on the internet ever. You're just the guy I watch videos to learn about tanks and stuff from even.

Holy shit, I massively respect you for the tone of this. Takes massive balls to stand up and apologise

As a fan of both of you, I believe there is only one way to solve this. On the field of honor with wet noodles at dawn.

Lets just hope that this will be the last video/response regarding this drama and everyone should just move on regarding it.

I think a laser tag is speed running losing all of his credibility by choosing this, as the hill he’s gonna die on instead of just admitting it’s unknown

Never liked Lazer Pig, and now I like him even less.

Lazerpig calling you and redeffect vatniks just makes his russophobia come across even stronger. He's just a propaganda parrot, repeating overly pro-western and pro-ukranian takes and he doesn't hide it. You and red are way more professional, not taking any political side, which is refreshing to see in this polarised age. I can enjoy your content perfectly fine, I particularly like your cursed by design series and I like redeffect's content too. Lazerpig, while being a good entertainer at times puts bad politicised jokes (and russophopic comments) in his videos which throw me off and annoy me during watching, when I've watched several videos of his in the past. Not to mention many, many inaccuracies.

Mistakes on all sides aside, I am at least glad lazerpig was forced to eat some humble pie.

Personally i don't think that coneofarc was in the wrong and doesn't need to apologize for having the correct information

You've greatly added to my respect for you with this video. Still, I think we can all see what Lazerpig's response to this will be, and he will almost certainly do absolutely nothing to defuse the situation

Lazerpig being an unprofessional, sensationalist, biased youtuber? Shocking!

I salute your honesty and humility to acknowledge any mistake you might have incurr during your response to this incident. It speaks highly of you. I'm not really a fan of Lazer Pig and the way he presents his videos, he is too aggressive and sometimes incurring in gross mistakes without proper prior research. Despite everyone is entitled to their own opinions, they should do with respect and as objective as possible.

I'm just puzzled at how anyone could think that anyone would re-use an engine from WWII in a modern tank. The amount of progress in engine design we've seen as a whole would make doing so a gigantic blunder. Just because an engine shares a shape, and even number of pistons and displacement, does not mean the engine is the same. If we compared a V8 from the 1960s-1970s to a modern V8 of the same displacement, the differences in horsepower and design would be incredible. Even something like what's in my car, a 2 liter inline four, is incredibly different from one built even 20 years ago. It's like taking an MP-18 and comparing it to a modern submachine gun, and saying a modern submachine gun is a copy because it's a submachine gun. I really don't understand it.

Holy shit Lazerpig actually said "I won't site sources, go find them yourself"! That is the death nail of credibility. No one should ever listen to him again. This is the good thing about drama, you see what people are about. LP decided to die on the stupidest hill ever.

I get the feeling that Lazerpig doesn't know what he's talking about.

Still waiting on LazerPig's response to the 5 part reddit post someone made on r/BadHistory dismantling every bit and point of his crappy T-34 video.

I watched a few LazerPig videos before stumbling on this drama. I never liked the persona he uses in his videos. Now it seems his true personality is much closer to his persona than I thought. I work in academia and I think nothing is more important than being rigorous and nuanced. Keep the good work: I have been watching the channel for a long time and I will continue to do so.

The idea that the T-14 would use a Porsche Tiger engine is stupid on it's face. This is why I don't waste my time on LazerPig. He does garbage research and just tries to chase trends.

LP'S Engine argument basically boils down to "Eww the f35 has an engine from the 40's because it has turbines and impellers"

Man who knew Lazerpig was an insufferable weirdo? Very hard to tell

Unfortunately after this whole debacle I can no longer consider Lazerpig a legitimate or trustworthy historian. Hopefully he apologizes and proceeds in a more mature manner. Genuinely aggravating watching how Lazerpig has been handling this, and how confidently wrong he is.

ARgh I had never watched the Lazerpig video but what he said in the clip included at the start of this is so unbelievably dumb that my brain wanted to unhear it. The engine was designed for pumping stations not heavy vehicles? The hell kind of claim is that? Even if this was 100% true, that doesn't mean the engine characteristics aren't suitable for heavy vehicles. Stationary engines are usually designed to produce a large amount of torque and power at relatively low RPM and are meant to be run continuously at their max rated power for a very long time reliably, which surprise surprise are characteristics you want out of an engine in a heavy vehicle such as a truck, or a tractor.. or a tank. I dislike that statement so much. Now sure it could be a failure of an engine, but that's beside the point

I really hope this doesnt get out of hand

Lazerpig's argument about only using online sources is not a valid argument especially since most of what he considers 'Published' articles are also being posted on the internet.

I’m sorry, but Lazerpig got THIS angry over some throw away minor criticisms over a tank engine and not providing sources, made a 40 minute response video and then said YOU were doing clout chasing when you guys get similar views? Hilarious

Lazerpigs fans being a menace as always

It's honestly beyond me how anyone can conclude that Lazerpig's research is more legit than yours or RedEffect's who both painstakingly layout the sources and/or chain of logic in the video

While Lazerpig's video was entertaining my bs detector kept ringing off when I watched that video, now I know why. From the amount of time, I have been watching this channel for years. I never at all assumed you could lie. In the context that is. So impressive that you passively rip his video apart most respectfully and calmly as you can. Drama sucks honestly.

To say this pissing match was kicked off because of a tractor engine

Lazerpig is the type of guy to believe every 2.5L inline 4 cylinder is a copy of each other

It is great to see you come out and talk about the situation in a honest way. Have a great day bro, hope to see new videos from you

Laserpig attacking a small and much Newer channel about low view count is unsurprisingly very immature. His attack videos are like watching some angry psycho drunk at a grungy bar in the 1980s, the kind of drunk who is illogical, incorrect, incognizant and digs his heals in that he's right about everything even when proven wrong with FACTS. Trying to have a logical journalistic discussion with laserpig is simply just not worth any time or effort because he's turned into that old angry incognizant drunk at a rundown bar.

I hope you and Red never back down, I like his content but, he is basically trying to bully you guys out of credibility, views and wont bother to present real sources( because he does not have one tbh) and do real research, he is so lazy that is clear he does not watches your or red videos, not even to effectively criticize you.. I lost a lot of respect for him and killed part of the enjoyment I had from his videos.. He is trying to pull people down to prop himself up its that simple..

As someone who simply stopped watching laser pig simply because I found things he said did not line up with books I read I'm glad someone is finally catching him on his mistakes

I do admire you for apologizing for your tone, but I don’t think Lazerpig would even care. Most of these “Historytubers” and “Ukrainian War” KZfaq channels deserve every single bit of criticism they get. The amount of lies I’ve witnessed over the past decade coming from these channels disturbs me deeply and fundamentally, especially with how they treat their opposition (I.e. holding them with contempt/overt hatred).

16:51 It would also make sense to test a new engine on a Jadgtiger as the Jadgtiger would have more space to Mount it as it doesn’t have a turret That would take up valuable space. It is, effectively speaking, a box, which is perfect for testing new engines.

Now that I've watched the video on full, let me elaborate on some points. I appreciate the lengths you go through to be respectful and acknowledge your perceived faults. You have shown that you are a good actor insofar as not contributing to drama and trying to further explain your positions without attacking the other. However, I'll say unequivocally, that lazerpig is not acting in good faith, after having seen not only his rhetoric across many videos, but that of thousands before him, who've conducted themselves similarly. He (as you said in the video) injects biases into his content, against a federated geopolitical Eurasian landmass, declaring anything put forth by them as a outdated mess of inferiority, while promoting the counterparts as the greatest implements of warfare ever conceived. Lazerpig isn't a good-faith actor, and shouldn't be treated as such honestly. If anything he should ask for a salary, which may be the motivation behind his content if we're being serious.

As part of my university learning, I was taught the correct method of locating and annotating information from peer reviewed and archival sources. I was also taught to avoid common pitfalls such as out of context quotation at the skimming stage. Having watched this video, I would say that Cone of Arc's comments in source selection and evidentiary hygiene is spot on and I find his comments very fair and justified. I agree that his initial response was very unprofessional and not only let himself down but also the cause of serious academic researchers as well. This having been said, I suspect that this reaction was emotionally instigated and having seen a number of laser pigs offerings I would not blame him and I think that his reply is overly charitable considering laser pig reply. For the record, I dislike laser pigs style, It is brash unfunny and is clearly geared to appeal to the less educated and ignorant. As mentioned I have grudgingly reviewed a portion of his output on various subjects to get a balanced sample of his work with the result that I have concluded that his methodology is shaky, his conclusions are dubious. As an avid amateur weapon ologist, I would rather trust cone's data than laser pigs any day.

I am going to come out and say it, LP lost me as a viewer long before this. I used to enjoy his content.

When LP went after you like he did, I lost all respect for him. :(

I don't know, Cone. A 40 minute response to a response video seems to be a little... excessive, don't you think? You've made your arguments and made your case, I think the subject can be dropped now and sent to the audience to form their conclusions.

Don't take lazerpig too seriously, his entire talking point is basically "everybody is stupid except me"

Since he doesn't want to cite sources it is safe to assume he doesn't have any. Also there is no way he is an actual historian.

On the differences between the SLA-16 and A-85, the displacement per cylinder is fairly close. Adding or removing groups of cylinders is a long-standing and frequently used trick to save on things like engineering costs and tooling. Changing around bore and/or stroke is also a pretty common thing for the same reason. It looks like the Germans at least designed a bored and stroked version of the SLA-16. So displacement differences can pretty much be hand-waved away. And the X configuration is extremely unusual. All that adds up to the A-85 maybe being based on the SLA-16, with the design tweaked over the years. The sticking point for me is that one is air cooled and the other is water cooled. That suggests a HUGE amount of redesign, if the engines are actually even related. Lazerpig is wrong to call it a copy. At most, the Aramata's engine is a long-removed descendant of the German one. BTW, you misspoke talking about the displacement. Cylinder bore diameter determines piston size. You're looking for crank throw or stroke, which is the other half of what determines a cylinder's displacement.

LaserPig lost me as a viewer mostly because of how often I caught him actually getting things wrong in his videos, and not in a oops he got something wrong but intentional way. I'm not a professional, but I do know some things about propaganda films, and he shows a clip saying Michael Wittman stared in it, which is false. Because the footage he was using showed Panzer Uniforms, not SS Panzer Uniforms, and the commander on top of the Tiger II was obviously not Micheal Wittman and didn't look like Micheal Wittman. I spent a little while looking up the source of the footage, and the footage was for a propaganda film that was film AFTER WITTMAN WAS ALREADY DEAD... There is no way I'd call it an "Oops" and it was intentional, likely hoping his viewers are too ignorant to notice.

All I can say is LaserPig was for sure wrong about Cone of Arc who I've watched a lot longer than LP. LP really said some things that went beyond reasonable. If he believes his research is good then I get why he was upset but he also clearly makes mistakes, as everyone does at times. And while Cone of Arc did come off as rude and belittling to LP, it really wasn't justification for the significantly more hostile response, which I did enjoy watching for the record. I do think the guy is hilarious, he's not wrong about everything but he clearly makes mistakes and I'm not the type who's going to check his sources so it's important to have things accurate or correct them if they're wrong. I agree with why Cone of Arc responded to the claim that the Sla. 16 was the Armata's engine, myths spread like wildfire. And I think your response was well thought out, Cone. You understood why he was upset and did explain why some of what he said hurt and upset you. I think LP owes an apology for how mean spirited he was and for refusing to provide his sources as that's a serious mark against his credibility, even if I somewhat understand he did that out of anger and feeling disrespected. That still is important to knowing if someone's research is remotely accurate no matter how upset you may be so he really shouldn't have done that. I don't know much about Red Effect so I won't say much about that. I am presuming LP is off base with him as well. For all I know Red Effect may take Russian and Soviet information too serious and without a critical eye but that doesn't make the man a propagandist for Russia. So if nothing else I just think that's an unfair label for the guy and I think him making a video that shared the information for the T-14 as he knew it was reasonable. If that's what Red Effect has researched and knows, it's reasonable for him to make the video he made. It doesn't mean he's biased, though that also doesn't mean he isn't. Just that it was a reasonable thing to do. LP should make an apology, genuinely, for how upset he got and how personal he took a lot of these things. He's acting too proud and if nothing else sincerely owes an apology to Red Effect and Cone for saying they're clout chasing. That's disrespectful and I sincerely doubt they're here for anything except for sharing information and knowledge they've found. Sure, it's nice to find a living for researching the things you love but nobody reasonable gets into a fight to further their channel's growth. That's the shit you see on reality TV shows and it's nonsensical for anyone to claim that. And LP was not the only one saying that, there's people in these comments saying that drivel. That LP, Red Effect and Cone are all just engaging in drama for clout. If you live in an environment where people do that, there's something wrong with the environment in which you exist.

Lazerpig acting like a pig, who woulda thunk

lazerpig is a propaganda maker, his videos can be summed up as "Russia bad, Russian tanks suck, haha" what do you expect.

wait, im in this video at 13:40! I now realize how wrong I was tho

I have always enjoyed both you and Lazerpig. Tank nerds ARE scary, but fun to watch.

I never really liked Lazerpig and his content all that much. He makes me cringe at how he does things. So props to Cone of Arc for making a proper response.

It’s impressive that people can actually admit they were wrong and correct themselves unlike others (LTT) who accuse and blame others for their own mistakes.

We seriously having drama over minor details on a fucking tank now?

So if this info is wrong why didn’t you make a video about the Tank Museum? Cause they said the same about the engine

Didn't realize there was any drama with LazerPig. Mostly ignore LP due to his opinions on the T-34.

Lazerpig is always a clout chaser and drama queen

I dont think your comment about his lack of research was uncalled for, hes a history of doing this shit

It's not drama, it's Lazerpig being childish, look at the noises he uses to make fun of redeffect, and then he ignores loads of points while hyperfixating on a few that he can defend, but still makes mistakes about those points. And then he just calls redeffect a Russian propagandist because he uses Russian sources for russian tanks 😭. It's a joke, he's disrespectful and childish

Fantastic video, Though I like both of you content styles, my bigger issue LazerPig's was not only how he went about it, but how it was structured, he put his responses to you and RedEffect's videos between his rants on Russian Propaganda. This is a simple tricked used to connect Y'alls two content with that of literal propaganda. That tells me, he knew he was wrong and didnt want to address it. On a side note: I'm in both of Y'alls discord servers and I find his quite hostile to most things

Good points. I have stayed away from this. From the view of an old Cold War tank commander about all this. Most of what is being argued is complete stupidity. Tanks are a BALANCE of firepower, protection, engine power, and speed. The Armarta was designed, like almost ALL modern Russian weapon systems, with stand off distance a PRIMARY focus. That means the ability to detect, target, engage, and kill from a distance outside the range of an enemy ability to respond back. PERIOD. NO ONE knows the Armarta's true capability but we have seen Russian T-90 tanks engaging targets out to almost 7000m range with a HEAT round. (SABOT rounds at that distance have bled off to much kinetic energy to penetrate armor). Why the Armarta would not be able to do the same, and with the tube launched missile system connected to the Netcentric interface it has, the T-14 is said to be able to be commanded to fire the missile, even though the target is not in its direct view and can be handed off to another system to bring it to target out to 12000m. IF true, that is way out of any NATO Tanks Main Gun range. IF the Armarta itself is able to use that system, on its own, it means that it has a targeting system that can "SEE" to out to 12000m. Most optical targeting systems can only actually see out to 5000m. After that it is hard to engage via direct fire beyond that. You are shooting at little dots, and the boresight of the gun is for 1200-2500m. 5000m you are relying on the experience of the gunner to adjust for the extreme distance. Bitching that the engine idea is from a Tiger tank is idiotic. Are we saying no NATO weapons systems was influenced by what they learned initially from German Armor and design after WW2? IF it saves room, weight, and still delivers the power, you are an idiot for not using it just because of who originally came up with the idea. I could go on and on about this. We DO NOT KNOW ANYTHING about the T-14 serviceability to determine ANYTHING about it. Its like determining the taste of ice cream you already think you hate,but you have never had before, based on the image on the packaging. It is just weak.

its funny how LazerPig says all this is to make money while all his videos are click baity meme videos that sound really condersending towards people who actually want to learn

I feel that no party came out of this spectacle better off for it. While Red's initial video came across as a deliberate drama piece, Cone's felt out right hostile. The Pig's response could have been (a lot) better, and I especially disliked how he refused to show his sources because I am very much of the 'pics or it didn't happen' mentality. Out of all the responses, though, I think Cone has been the bigger man about it. It take a strength of character to admit wrong doing, especially when it isn't followed up by an excuse about why it was actually justified. Good on you. Genuinely, you have impressed at least this faceless person on the internet.

Reminds me when writing on the WT forum and you start to argue with others that have a completely different opinion 😅

I may not be a fan of the Chieftan (certain takes of his and trends he has spawned I disagree with vehemently) but I absolutely appreciate and applaud the calming effect he has tried to have on this debacle. I also applaud how you are also taking on the same calming effect. It is by far more professional and mature than what LazerPig has done thus far.

So funny to see the transformation in your channel, I found you when you did your interview with Toshio Thunder back when you were Mr Steve Gamer, and Ive stock with you for quite awhile to see you transform from gameplay to history, and now I get to see you get into KZfaq Drama. You are a real youtuber now.

Regarding the whole topic, roast pig is delicious.

Even after all this drama, I still like and will watch both channels, even though it is disappointing to see fights like this

I always love your content, and believe you do very good research. To me it really speaks to your credibility that if there is ever an error to your past research, you always correct it. These are very tricky things to research, and you do a great service to bring us the content that you do.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you described Lp style as "infotainment".Thats it exactly,and your style is more technical.Good on you for the apology.I'm subbed to both you and Lp and enjoy the different presentations.Hopefully we can put all this nonsense behind.

What did you choose as your ocean liner for the battle?

man, at this point i dont care what kind of engine this tank had

this wasnt even drama...just a discussion. Why is everyone so sensitive these days

Thanks for being professional on this issue. I've been on a long time viewer on all three of your channels and hope all of this will turn out well!

Calling a video critical of him and his work, clout chasing, is very convenient for LP. Irregardless, proving cone of arcs intent is all but impossible. At the very least LP could’ve qualified the statement but the fact he accused Cone of Arc matter of factly is pretty disingenuous of itself.