Finally, the reduced lumber cost on Freezing breath the game desperately needed

That polymorph change seems kind of extreme; didn't elf use cyclone to essentially neuter orc for 10+ years? And cyclone at least makes whatever it targets invulnerable.

I think PM's owl should be able to take dump on enemy's units

Well Infi and Fly both agree that the polymorph change won't matter at all, at least for 1v1, because everyone will still prefer master priest's inner fire over polymorph given limited resources, and you won't mass sorceress just because of one skill that requires 200+ mana. The same goes to tauren, because the major issue is that it costs too much lumber and 5 food supply, no one can afford tauren at tier 2 anyway if you still want some raiders

MK bolt, bash + poly. Kinda worried.

If someone had of told me ten years ago that Tauren would one day be a Tier2 unit there’s no way I would’ve believed It

Why even upgrade grunts with berserker strength on tier 2 when you can get Tauren. Hex, raider, and tauren on tier 2 will be ridiculous in most match ups.

Crypt Lord needs a buff according to Grubby. Give beetles the benefit from armored carapace upgrade and have that give them dispel resistance as well.

Meat wagons are now speedwagons

Aboms could do with a buff. They are UD's toughest ground unit and quite inferior to other races equivalent (tauren, mountain giants, knights).

Why are they nerfing volcano? I ve never seen it in any tournament :/

Meta gonna be wild making for some really interesting matches

I love the buff on potm! Hope we’ll see her more

Wand of negation being added to undead may open up there tree a lot - don’t have to rely on statues only.

so basically i can chain hex an enemy hero for 20 sec, cool. Guess this is just a trolling ptr.

Wand of Negation is a really cool but also dangerous change. Cool because having dispell in an accessible item without the need of a unit is special. Dangerous because that basically opens up supply that you otherwise kind of need for destros (for their dispell not for their strength). UD armies could be so much stronger if no need for destros. So, the item must be expensive, but not too expensive to avoid rendering it unplayable. I would almost dare to bet that figuring out the right balance will take a while and, until then, the item will not be popular (either "gamebreaking" or "useless"). But once it is fixed, I think it will be a very healthy and cool change.

Important to keep in mind that fairie fire, purge, and slow also affect siege engine, curse is the only one that doesn't.

Poly is obviously silly. Blades is good and needed imo. I am not sure what the solution to taurens are but I don't think this is it. POTM will still be bad. MG and glaive changes are whatever. UD ghoul frenzy is a good change. Good to see that UD casters get some sorta buff. Taking out scrolls makes sense but what else will UD get from their shop beyond an orb? Wand of negation? I guess. Destroyers are one of the absolute best units in the game and that item will not take the place of their usage accept the earlier parts of the game when they are unavailable. Freezing breath? What units use that again? LMAO. Wagon speed is good.

I think POTM change actually is a bit more impactfull than you predict. The most POTM usage is with AP rush, so you won't have tier3 for orb. Also vorpal blade upgrade change supports AP rush. I think it will make AP rush with POTM much stronger.

Personally I like the Polymorph changes. Gives a form of 'stun' that isn't just MK hammer.

Neo... You worried about tauren killing ghouls when nova and frenzy ghouls will DEMOLISH tauren. Worst case scenario, destroyers will destroy tauren. Its not going to change anything, und will still win every tourney even if they get outplayed.

grubby didnt talk that much about wand of negation, but that change is as big as having taurens in t2. as you said, ud will no longer be relegated to destroyers to dispell things, which means more strategies become available!

I think Searing Arrows should have some additional utility or it will never be good and never better than Venom Orb. Maybe it could grant a small damage boost against targets for a time like +5%/10%/15%, but I don't know if the "team" can implement that

If yiu want to fix glaives lower the repair time. It is currently higher than both meatwagon and demolisher, meaning if it takes damage you can't repair it in time.

Nobody plays Taurens ^^'. Also Not on Tier 2. Change the Movemetspeed, Delete the Totem and transfer the Taurens into the Baracks and the Spiritwalker into the Spirit Lounge. That were a Change that helps Orc!

No need of Taurens at tier 2. What Taurens really need is somewhere between 15-30% magic resistance, to be able to sustain vs magic dmg and spells. That's it.

polymorph change is overstated. it's basically cyclone (likely why polymorph never effected heroes)--effectively removes the unit from play.

Love this patch!!! 🎉

I think everyone in this comment section forgets a few things about Polymorph: - It costs 50% of the Sorceress maximum mana - Every source of Dispel is either free or costs considerably less mana (even considering lvl 3 Brilliance) - It breaks upon taking damage (it's not Hex) - To effectively 'chain CC' an enemy Hero, you'd have to mass Sorceress, and then you'd probably lose for that reason alone I'm much more worried about Taurens being on the battlefield at T2.

First take for me: Polymorph should heal up the unit they used on and brake immediately on damage taken. Like the same way in WOW. That would at least give consideration to the human if they dare to use it or not. Tauren main problem still not fixed, they are slow. Give them a charge ability in tier3. That would allow them to get close to the desired targets. wand of negation is clearly a counter to the new polymorph. other updates looks fine

Although I am new to the game and have no clue about balance, I don't think allowing polymorph on heroes is a good thing. Hex is casted by a hero unit, it makes sense that they would work on heroes since you can't spam them. I don't see how that's going to make up for good interactions and fun gameplay. Let's wait and see but I'm skeptical of those changes

Curse being able to target mechanical unit might be a huge nerf in some case, after human gyro finish off undead destroyer, they can now act as spell absorber to deplete banshee mana

Is this April fools

Crazy patch , omg :) i need to see that fast . B2W ❤

I do like the idea of undead not being dependent on destroyers. I mostly played back in the very long patch several years ago. Before the destroyer nerf. Played human, so that is kindof matchup specific. But that unit always felt over-centralizing. Air and magic immune. So many things can't kill that. Not that bad against bats. Dragon hawks are mediocre against it. Overall kindof a boring unit. The fewer destroyers I see on the screen, the more fun the game

Good thing they are changing gargs match up through removal of scroll of healing. At some point NE can't keep up with buying heal scroll, so I think it is a step in the right direction. The negation wand does make destroyer optional, although t3 is still a must for ud

These are some crazy changes😅

Finally Sundaring blades is upgrade again. It wad dumb that it was already researched. Do orcs have a Tier 3 unit anymore?

Tier 2 taurens seems way too strong

Double checked it's not April 1st

Seems like more than half of the comments aren't showing.

Some of changes are wierd like the curse which is already broken Esp when used on heroes with such long duration . Some changes are good like the healing scroll remove from ud shop . Tauren change is big ? But might be good for the game we will see Ghoul frenzy right direcetion but how Neo said it is not enough . In my opinion polymorph is might be right thing because it cost so much mana , but can be potential broken. The night elf changes did not gonna change anything , but maybe they just need other races like ud to be nerf to get better .

It looks wild, I like it.

Maybe poly for 1 sec heroes... big cost, small debuff... a trade off Crazy Tauren proposal If course and cripple are used on mech, it should be half time and half the strengh Ghoul frenzy debuff is not enough NIce shake up in general

When does this patch become available in online matches?

Ah nice just what we all needed, a new patch to massively buff und LOL. How out of touch can these devs be?

Late game boost for human. Human struggles with undead at top tier in the early and mid game. So a boost in late game solves nothing for that skill level.

Tanks need massive nerfs but they could buff its AA. Potm rework is a joke, elf heros still all F tier besides DH.

Thanks!~

Everything useless changes, UD even more OP, NE that needs buffs got useless changes. Human interesting, orc wierd

Whos in charge of balance these days ??? They trying to kill the game off now?

Honestly? Big changes are welcome, it would be refreshing for the players imo.

The "neat thing" that Orcs get at tier 3 is tiny great hall, which is a pretty good unit. Overall I'm okay with Tauren at tier 2, but I think maybe they should have say 1200 HP and the pulverize upgrade should also increase hp by 100. Tauren are still expensive in terms of food and build time taking 9s longer than grunts, 2 food more expensive, +80 gold and +80 lumber over grunts. Tauren and Shaman sounds really fun though. I think Tauren are still weak to Banshees and Destroyers in the UD matchup.

I think the pm owl should be able to pick up moon wall healing to have in a fight but make to where you can kill the Owl one of ne biggest problem is they have no healing in a fight unless they are home

It seems all this balance patch turns arround Happy. If they continue nerfing ghouls they are going to kill them, and they know it. They are strong in T3 but if cross the line they become free XP. Curse is a good way to reduce 1/3 tank damage, and is good to see how they realize this unit is boring and abusive (poor risk great damage potential) I would personally prefer they cant be targeted by staff. Would be nice a useful and situacional T3 item in UD shop replacing the scroll. Dispell on T2 is not mandatory, you make destros because is the best dispell in the game (and free.) Ud had played without dispel in T2 for many years, i cant see the point. Good change for taurens, i like it. Elves... meh, dissapointed. Polymorph is not going to be used. 175/200 single target spell that can be dispelled easily is not realible enough. Maybe for temporary stop a TC stomp or similar... but slow is way better way to spend sorc mana.

Give Soul Burn a snare for it's duration! Would be OP! ;)

Imagine Hex on a hero with 4 sorcereces for 12s straight hahaha. Can you TP in that form?

Mass dispell needs a nerf of some kind, if necros should ever be viable. Either make it more expensive, or give it a target cap. Will also help A LOT against the tauren armys that will march against the undeads in the ptr. RN necros just feeds the opponents heros with skeletons, and cripple is pretty expensive as well. Not to mention, that when you get cripple, every race has dispell already. I'm torn about the curse change. I think it's a problem that the only counter UD has against gyros is a hero abillity. Curse could be cool the see against gyros. On the other hand, it's broken vs. tanks. Polymorph seems crazy strong, I'll rather let it stay as it is and make it cheaper in mana. Neo's take on taurens I rly agree with. If they should be avaliable t2, then nerf them a bit, and give them an extra upgrade at t3. It will still be really strong, and I bet we will see tauren rushes. Potm is a hard hero to balance due to it's design. It's the kind of hero that either feels super bad, or super broken. An effect on her fiery arrows could be cool. Maybe let the target burn for the damage recieved by the fiery arrow over 10 seconds. Then you'll get rewarded for microing her (least micro heavy hero in the game atm), and spreading the burn by her auto attacks. Ofc the damage would need to be nerfed a bit, or it would be too broken. For reference the orb of venom does 9dmg pr. second for 6 seconds, meaning 56 dmg to the target you hit. Alternatively it should get a secondary effect. Increase the dmg the burning unit take from spells by x%. That would make it a cool support hero for the DH, to make mana burn more effective, or make wardens nuke better (also since you can spread the effect before a fan of knifes). If it's a scaling effect it could be 10/20/30. Meaning that if you get hit by a lvl 3 fiery arrow, followed up by a lvl 3 mana burn, you'll lose 195hp and mana. Could be a pretty cool dynamic. Most importantly, it will provide the potm with an abillity the NE player will have to actually micro to be effective. Crypt lords damage return when hit should be way higher. Make him a terrible target for melee units. Give tinkers engineering upgrade a mana regen bonus or buff the hp of pocket factory or give him more base int.

We Need a Nova Cap!

is this an early 4/20 April fools joke? Maybe HU has a chance vs. UD now. No more mass tanks

Abom +1 damage. Warden +1 intelligence.

Thank God for the volcano nerf! I have been campaigning for this nerf

thanks neo

wait they actually try to update this game now??? LOL! great!

Doesn’t T2 Taurens make Grunt Berserker Strength kinda pointless now?

Polymorph on heroes has to be close to the worst idea I have seen in a while. Taurens on T2 is bonkers. Wand of negation.... yeah UD sure needs more shit to just fuck up the game. Ghoul frenzy nerf is not enough. Scroll of healing removed from UD shop is actually something good. Night elf "buffs" are just random stuff. Doesnt matter at all.

any change welcome tbh

Orcs ARE só strong now, It Will be Impossible 😅😅

FFA human mass priestess!!!!

We Need a Curse Nerf against Heros!

Can an Artilery unit even miss? Curse is useless on Mortar Teams, isn't it?

Take away the stacking and buff the entire race to help them out... Just need to see how comparatively how trash the heroes are to the other races. Why would moon well get nerfed when they already have the worst healing? :/

Hi Neo, Chaosfr0nt here ;) Comments on your comments: Polymorph: If polymorph is now already “incredibly” strong - why is it also the least used HU spell as you said? If we are talking pro play here, like we always focus on, we are talking about a dispellable cast on T3, where every race will already have dispel, so I strongly disagree with that making it overly powerful. You see sorc master training and have your dispel ready, this is just mechanics at that point. Sundering blades: is It clear at which tier the upgrade becomes available? I don’t see a problem with knights being too strong. Tauren: this is maybe THE least used unit in the game, so something had to be done there. maybe change the armor type and only let them upgrade on heavy at T3 alongside pulverize? Potm: agree, this will not change much, but appreciate the effort MG: agree, won’t change much, but in general, 7 supply is just ridiculous for any unit. 6 should be the top. Vorpal blades: Don’t have any opinion on that either xD Ghoul frenzy: has to be nerfed, doenst impact the lumber harvesting “upgrade” within frenzy, so guess it’s a start, have to see how it plays out Curse: I don’t get the intention on the mechanical stuff, cant be just against tanks, but it has to be nerved on heroes. 33% miss on heroes is too strong. Either don’t let it last as long or make it 15-20% miss chance Cripple: not the right move to get cripple played more often Scroll of healing: agree Wand of negation: I agree UD could use dispel on T2, but this is too easy and early. Don’t even need any T2 building is crazy. Is keeper even going to be playable any longer? If the prize for going out vs keeper earlier and less risky is 200 gold UD will pay it any day of the week… Meat wagon: Don’t get the reason; wasn’t necessary Frost wyrms: Yeah could use something else as a buff

I don't get it. I have been saying this for years. Skellis from Rod and Dark Ranger need to give more XP. At least 20XP. That should be the first and foremost change for UD. Human buff is ridicolous. Won't last. Humans are fine as they are. Tauren need to be more playable. I would suggest to make them 10 Gold / 10 lumber cheaper as a start. Or increase the movement speed by 5. POTM change is a refreshing sight. The rarest played hero of all the four races.

They should stop calling these balance changes. The game will never be balanced and it never should be. These are just changes to create new strategies and make the game more interesting

So in team games someone goes mass sorcs and polymorphs heroes non stop? This is trash and will be reverted in 1 week

Lol ghouls are already free tombs of xp Tauren the strongest melee unit at t2 when they already have kodos is just crazy Looks like the game is gonna go back to ud having to play 350 percent better vs orc to stand a chance, what do u make ghouls? Lmao...fiends will ve tauren NP, ok lets make unarmored garga into bat/raider then???? Lmaaao fire whos ever in charge of balance.

Tauren change is stupid. Not a buff.

Since Orc does not have a tier 3 unit anymore, Blizzard should give orc dragons again.

😳

night elf are the weakest? 39:00 wtf are we watching same games?

HU nerf. ORC buff. NE buff

Frenzy should work in a similar way as berserk, great bonus, but with a flaw ( more damage taken). Also add a tier 2 tech that increases ghoul survivavility). That way, without frenzy they can stay in the fight for longer and if u want them to hit harder, take the risk.

For Human-Players this PTR looks kinda bad. Even if Polymorph would be insane you still have no usecases for sorcs on T3. Then Knights get a huge nerf. Human is the only race which will get nothing to work with out of this patch if this goes through. Again: Polymorph sounds insane but there are no usecases for sorcs armies on T3. If you think different tell me pls which Matchup and which Army-Composition.

UD noobs whined too hard now they counter tanks too, these people NEVER want to lose fairly 😂😂😂

Why comment quorantine is so long on this video?

i mean come on, if your giving undead t2 despell without any upgradecost/time whatsoever, then atleast nerv destros..... otherwise what are you supposed to play against this goddamn race. YOu cant attack the base most of the time. Now your hero summons become ass the moment they reach t2 which makes the situation worse..... I mean come on Neo 200 gold is a lot? If uds play ghouls how much money do they actually spend on t1 on economy only? They build 2 accos and are done. How is that fair exactly? Not only do they save PoP, they also save all the money that other races spend on workers...... ghouls being a viable strat at t3 is a mistake.... PS. Maybe give the defense upgrades like 5% mag resist for each tier? Along with the armor? I never understood why you get 0 tools to deal with mag dmg. Also watching an ud hit and run killing atleast 1 unite with coil+nova isnt just bullshit, its also lame...

Stop buffing undead my god...

ne still needs to be nerfed ud needs mine built time back to 100s orc spirit walker a bit mana buff like shaman and catapult buf, maybe oil buf human footies defense passive armor add, so immolation and nova still works, but heroes auto attacks are less effective, and breakers back to heavy armor, may be animal training t2 for hawks

POTM needs stats change not just sear arror