Remo's PTR 1.36.2 Patch Review & Balance Suggestions

  Рет қаралды 5,211

Back2Warcraft

Back2Warcraft

2 ай бұрын

PTR Patch 1.36.2.21070 us.forums.blizzard.com/en/war...
🏆 PTR 1.36.2 Videos • WC3 - [UD] Sheik vs Kr...
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#warcraft3 #back2warcraft #patch #PTR1362

Пікірлер: 92
@MeatforceSD
@MeatforceSD 2 ай бұрын
Only 30 minutes? Was expecting 5+ hours mate
@KorisnikBr1
@KorisnikBr1 2 ай бұрын
We need stuff like this, it makes the game interesting.
@denisr.8248
@denisr.8248 2 ай бұрын
you need to buff mana burn for elf to even have a chance vs UD later game UD hero's DK LICH + 1 beat whole army of elf alone ....
@randomname9723
@randomname9723 2 ай бұрын
Not a good idea. I do NOT think Mana Burn should be nerfed but it also should NOT be buffed. Ultimately I would have the Frost Nova slow last less long so it doesn't annihilate bears and add a damage cap to mainly prevent it truly murdering air
@SmoothJK
@SmoothJK 2 ай бұрын
Agree with removing fairy fire's "map hack" property. The same goes for whatever is in the belly of a kodo, makes no sense. What, is the unit using a walkie talkie inside the belly, somehow accurately reporting its location back to base?
@masterofdizzzaster
@masterofdizzzaster 2 ай бұрын
a lot of mechanics dont make sense lore wise. does it make sense balance wise though is the more important question
@Thorgard360
@Thorgard360 2 ай бұрын
Get rid of magic immunity and make those units just 75 to 90 percent magic resitance. That would sure shake some stuff up then caster would be fun again with diverse armies.
@hannesmeier8625
@hannesmeier8625 2 ай бұрын
How will hu be able to play against DK into gargs if you now can dispel water eles on T2?
@evg3nius
@evg3nius 2 ай бұрын
Based on the info posted so far, the dispel damage won't be enough to kill even Lvl 1 water ele. Info discussed so far said 200 damage to magic units, where as lvl 1 Ele has 500 hp. This is more of a problem for Farseer wolves
@StankoAx
@StankoAx 2 ай бұрын
But for example HU has only 1 source of dispell. I am not talking about tech tree now, just saying that having only 1 dispell does not necessarily have to be bad. Maybe move dispell to statues, with reduced dmg to summons? Keep everything else as it is. You would still want Destroyers because they benefit from dispell by gaining dmg and are much stronger fighters than statues.
@Germandave39
@Germandave39 2 ай бұрын
Remo, your opinion on the current PTR is always much appreciated. I like how you manage to separate your opinion as a player vs caster
@Thorgard360
@Thorgard360 2 ай бұрын
Can you coil nova tanks? Maybe make mortars have an upgrade for 50% or some resistance to magic maybe make all dwarf recieve and upgrade for magic resitance. That would be interesting
@IrvinLep
@IrvinLep 2 ай бұрын
I think people are not considering trade-offs when analyzing changes. Yeah, poly on heroes can be insane but how late in the game would that be? What are you giving up in terms of tech paths, unit composition, timing and resources to get to sorc master training? How many poly can you cast considering how expensive they are? Does the opponent have a good enough dispel? How expensive is the dispel compared to the poly? Just saying poly on heroes = imba is not the right way to go about it, in my opinion
@frederikgoogel5611
@frederikgoogel5611 2 ай бұрын
yeah a lvl1 hex on a unit is bad but banshees having dr ultimate is ok. Locks the unit in place and can only be staffed. So we fight and you eihter staff out 12 supply, or its not just insta killed, but mine. would be good, if a possessed units must be hit once, to be yours again (that way you make them leave the fight as ud) , or could be microed back, when possession is channeling (still plenty hard to do).
@xtremelemon8612
@xtremelemon8612 2 ай бұрын
you wont have to go mass sorceresses to get enemy heros killed because of being permanently hexed I think, a few times should be enough if you focus him with your other units. Now if it happens in the late game it will be even stronger because if you hex a stronger hero its even more powerful and handicaps the enemy even more. If add that up with the slow of the sorceresses and the stuns of the MK imo im sorry its too strong, it will quickly become too much to dispell and it will overwhelm players. Its a dangerous change.
@travisdunlap4526
@travisdunlap4526 2 ай бұрын
I do agree, that sorc poly is so very expensive. I mean how many slows are you giving up for that cast? They cast poly, you cast dispel, and now the sorc is out of mana. The main question will be those last second polys, where even a second is enough to snipe a hero before they activate an invul or TP or XYZ. At that point your dispel speed may simply not be fast enough to counter it. But at the end of the day, all players have to learn how to counter hex play, and so those skills would be directly translatable to poly.
@xtremelemon8612
@xtremelemon8612 2 ай бұрын
@@travisdunlap4526 the problem is that when voodoo hunter casts hex you have only one caster, if someone goes for numerous sorceress how many polymorphs is it possible to dispell before it becomes impossible to dispell all of them? Depending on which race you play it is going ti be very difficult regardless
@IrvinLep
@IrvinLep 2 ай бұрын
@@xtremelemon8612 the number of poly is necessarily limited, since each sorc will be able to cast just 1 before going out of mana, and if your opponent has like 6 sorcs then he is giving up a lot of army supply to be able to poly heroes. There are many ways to counter it, including invul potions: invul, fight, your army is stronger because you did not waste supply like the human did, and you have the advantage
@maxpower586
@maxpower586 2 ай бұрын
9:35 Ghoul frenzy right now doesn't take 60 but 45 sec to upgrade. Should be 60 to put the power spike a bit later.
@jaredhazlett3809
@jaredhazlett3809 2 ай бұрын
A dramatic suggestion would be to increase the cost and time to research and couple this with buffs to aboms which some feel need improvement: e.g. +30% attack speed +80 move speed ghouls, 15% attack speed and +20 move speed to aboms. Play around with the numbers but make this upgrade similar to cannabilize.
@maxpower586
@maxpower586 2 ай бұрын
@@jaredhazlett3809 The numbers for aboms would need to be smaller, but yes, could be interesting.
@RiffandRoll.
@RiffandRoll. 2 ай бұрын
Firelord Lava spawn should cost 135 mana and Blood Mage flame strike 125 mana
@MasterFeidn
@MasterFeidn 2 ай бұрын
Ud have frost armour to counter taurens on t2? You serious? I like the change. But human and ne will have it far easier to deal with that than ud.
@safd930
@safd930 2 ай бұрын
I really appretiate remo advocating very interesting and fun change every single patch. I especially like the firelord suggested change.
@tobiasbki443
@tobiasbki443 2 ай бұрын
I think they should remake the searing arrows, they should make it the longest range activatable skill shot with ~100dmg a cd of 10 seconds and mana cost of 100 or so. Then Potm can buy the orb on t3 and doesnt have a wasted skill. I think to have it as a skill shot makes sense in the phantasie of an hunteres that has the best aim. :)
@maxpower586
@maxpower586 2 ай бұрын
2:00 How are chims a counter to polymorph? xD
@WizardyDylan
@WizardyDylan 2 ай бұрын
what if they locked wand of negation behind having a temple of the damned or something like that
@travisdunlap4526
@travisdunlap4526 2 ай бұрын
perhaps they add a cooldown, where the wand starts its first cooldown when tier 2 hits, so it still takes some time before the item can be purchased.
@roflawlmao123
@roflawlmao123 2 ай бұрын
Blizzard had 3 major design mistakes for WC3:TFT: 1. Mana burn. This could still be fixed if they decreased mana burnt and gave it more damage so it's more like a nuke (e.g. 50/50/50 burnt but 100/150/200 damage). 2. Magic immune units. It would have been better if destroyers, dryads, and breakers had built-in status resistance like MGs. Too late to change this since the game is designed around them. 3. Armor type values. Casters have very low attack values so heavy armor takes 200% from magic, but that makes them countered too hard by heavy air (so heavy air is locked behind onerous tech requirements). Also too late to change this. I think the issue of magic immune units and armor types issues arose from WC3:ROC where mass casters was the prevailing strategy.
@FlameEcho
@FlameEcho 2 ай бұрын
Hmm I think if we're looking for comp variety for NE, the place to look might be hunts. Their RoC design kind of had NE heading towards either archer + hunts, or Dryads + Bears, but hunts were the best T1.5 unit in the game and they got the nerf of unarmored in Frozen Throne. Except the NE army just doesn't have any durable core units to replace the with the exception of Bear and at one point in time the overtuned MGs. Even historically durable frontlines have been a struggle for NE as a result, the old DH+Beastmaster+Tinker comps come to mind. Give them something to mitigate there crippling weakness to ranged at T3 so they can actually be used in a late game army comp, maybe something like giving them Elune's Grace as a researchable upgrade, they would still trough in the midgame.
@chopstikz127
@chopstikz127 2 ай бұрын
Tauren t2 is so good. Synergy with spirit link builds
@JuliaoMota-yq4jn
@JuliaoMota-yq4jn 2 ай бұрын
Dont touch dh mana burn range please. Why u do this to us?
@MsJavaWolf
@MsJavaWolf 2 ай бұрын
I actually like the DH as a concept and he doesn't seem too strong at the moment either.
@randomname9723
@randomname9723 2 ай бұрын
Remo is not very smart tbh. His suggestions are consistently some of the worst in the entire community
@laujack24
@laujack24 2 ай бұрын
mana burn r op as shit late game, specially against undead 3 hero with no mana lol. only hero that can deal with dh and his bullshit r blood mage.
@JuliaoMota-yq4jn
@JuliaoMota-yq4jn 2 ай бұрын
@@laujack24 Oh yeah, just burn 3 heroes mana and youre ok, gtfo!
@bethnor
@bethnor 2 ай бұрын
polymorph on heroes basically makes the spell cyclone (effectively removes the unit from the game). so it's not broken in that sense... but do hu need any hero disable? they already have by far the best in the game (storm bolt, clap). no amount of toggling potm arrow will make her useable. bottom line, it will always be better to have damage + effect over damage alone. and for the 10000th time. arrow should stack with orb! heroes with arrow skills are unfairly penalized by orbs. that means one of their skills is basically useless late game. heroes without orb abilities do not have this weakness, and none of the arrow heroes are even s tier. it will not break the game. there is no hero that blizzard is as oddly afraid of as the potm.
@randomname9723
@randomname9723 2 ай бұрын
I do not think they can change the orb mechanics with the current "team". Unfortunately I think only stuff that can be accomplished in the editor (without Lua) is stuff that can be considered
@bethnor
@bethnor 2 ай бұрын
@@randomname9723 i don't honestly think any real changes will be implemented. bottom line is that ne needs to be redone from top to bottom. they were the first race that blizzard made, when they didn't really have any experience. that's why ne seem so hard to balance (little changes can make them from too weak to too powerful). for example, ne have no altar hero that wrecks whole armies like level 3 nova, stomp, blizzard do. it was supposed to be potm because in theorycraft sf is the most powerful aoe spell in the game. in real game it's the worst. so they are stuck trying to fiddle with warden or dh fok or immolation, and it goes from too powerful to too weak with very small changes. meanwhile, dh is most used altar hero, while potm barely practical in pro games.
@ozzz3752
@ozzz3752 2 ай бұрын
@@bethnor The Warden's Knives can destroy armies, stop telling such blatant lies.
@MrLPSousa
@MrLPSousa 2 ай бұрын
U need to start thinking about other matchups that are not 1x1
@archmaesterofpullups
@archmaesterofpullups 2 ай бұрын
I think that they should completely redesign potm. Even replacing her with a clone of Mirana would be an improvement.
@johnnyenglish1652
@johnnyenglish1652 2 ай бұрын
Human has no solution to level 5 dread lord. Need to fix this!!!!
@youngmasterDX
@youngmasterDX 2 ай бұрын
they should make searing arrows stack damage like troll warlord or ursa in dota then we’d be cooking! also curse on gyros and tanks not getting enough attention XD
@dearberlin
@dearberlin 2 ай бұрын
Sexy Remo-Demo giving his insights! Thanks a lot, was cool!
@MsJavaWolf
@MsJavaWolf 2 ай бұрын
Tier 3 changes like polymorph are always hard to evaluate because you often don't reach a situation where they make the difference, so it will be hard to say how polymorph changes the dynamic. Taurens on tier 2 feel weird but in theory it makes, sense. I don't think they are super strong without pulverise anyway, but having them at tier 2 might make them viable with the plan to get pulverise later. Maybe polymorph will be a viable counter, if HU now has the additional ability to hex heroes, it might make the counter viable even if it were not worth it against taurens alone.
@grizzlypaws461
@grizzlypaws461 2 ай бұрын
Remo is the man.
@brandonkellner2920
@brandonkellner2920 2 ай бұрын
I would argue why polymorph shouldn't work on heroes, but I think they'll probably reverse it once they see a few games end because a hero got chain polymorphed and died instead of TPing out.
@dantonkull6491
@dantonkull6491 2 ай бұрын
The big issue will arise in team games where one guy can just mass sorcs and spam it on heroes.
@brandonkellner2920
@brandonkellner2920 2 ай бұрын
@@dantonkull6491 You're absolutely right, but there are already cheesy ways to kill heroes in team games, and Blizzard doesn't care much about team game balance.
@FunguyFungusO7
@FunguyFungusO7 2 ай бұрын
Nova mustn't be able to hit flying units and its damage shouldn't be instant.
@damo9961
@damo9961 2 ай бұрын
Undead doesn't need human getting polymorph on DK
@user-bm8lb9se3l
@user-bm8lb9se3l 2 ай бұрын
Massive destroyers will be in place.
@evg3nius
@evg3nius 2 ай бұрын
And human doesn't need coil nova on AM. What kind of logic is that?
@manta567
@manta567 2 ай бұрын
Tier 3 should unlock new units. Period.
@twassell25
@twassell25 2 ай бұрын
Ah nice, und gets to go from winning every tourney to.. Still winning every tourney. Why not give orc wand of negation so they can counter all the skellies and tier 1 entangle?
@nicksavoon
@nicksavoon 2 ай бұрын
Thanks for the changes! You'll find a way to make UD NE matchup more fun.
@hylianlegends
@hylianlegends 2 ай бұрын
So happy about the firelord nerf. It’s been op for too long
@xlatheblackdragon705
@xlatheblackdragon705 2 ай бұрын
the firelord / chemical rage is so dota inspired that this makes all of your arguments thus far groundless -.- come on, this is RTS and not HERO CRAFT
@ryanborn7026
@ryanborn7026 2 ай бұрын
main ork, only tauren
@user-bm8lb9se3l
@user-bm8lb9se3l 2 ай бұрын
With tanks being nerfed, Happy will be invincible, correct?
@SmoothJK
@SmoothJK 2 ай бұрын
The ghoul frenzy nerf isn't enough. Like Remo said, if they increased the research time, it might give the opponent a reasonable chance to be ready for the push.
@twassell25
@twassell25 2 ай бұрын
Yeah, und gets massively buffed with this patch...und goes from winning everything to still winning everything even easier. How fucking out of touch can the devs be?
@daveevangelist4633
@daveevangelist4633 2 ай бұрын
I’d make it burn less mana and do more damage, more like a nuke than a drain
@VelvetDarkness-
@VelvetDarkness- 2 ай бұрын
wtf polymorph on heroes?!
@Ge_n_Ge
@Ge_n_Ge 2 ай бұрын
Our community give so much good suggestions for potm and we got that... elf heros still F tier besides DH. Unfun tanks need still more nerfs but buffed AA.
@phillixkillix
@phillixkillix 2 ай бұрын
stop the mana burn whine and start the coil nova nerf
@DannyB0y257
@DannyB0y257 2 ай бұрын
Imagine ignoring an actual problem to complain about Coil Nova
@phillixkillix
@phillixkillix 2 ай бұрын
Imagine seeing 300dh mana burn range as a problem and not seeing coil nova being too strong 😂
@DannyB0y257
@DannyB0y257 2 ай бұрын
@@phillixkillix happy makes it look strong, but I have no problem beating Undead online, Coil Nova never feels too strong do you honestly have trouble with beating it?
@phillixkillix
@phillixkillix 2 ай бұрын
Probably cuz you play grass league bro
@tamaslengyel1497
@tamaslengyel1497 2 ай бұрын
- Magic immune units should receive 50% of heal from coil/holy light/tranquility etc. - Web autocast should be removed
@pianotorious47
@pianotorious47 2 ай бұрын
Neo you worked so hard to establish yourself as a pro-UD Happy fanboi, and now you just throw it all away by complaining about all the UD buffs 😂
@pianotorious47
@pianotorious47 2 ай бұрын
On a more serious note, adding single target dispel to unholy frenzy is a genius idea.
@luckylarry71
@luckylarry71 2 ай бұрын
I wholeheartedly agree with every balance change idea + logic behind Remo's rant. One more thing to add and it's a radical one. *Farseer* The "Farsight" ability is a complete meme, that's never used outside of maybe campaign. Obviously, the two wolfies + the old timer himself are an amazing scouting tool for the Orc and the main reason why he's so popular that we barely even see Orc go for a BM first these days. The challenge here, is that reworking an ability could seriously shake things up for the other Orc heroes, so the below proposition takes into account the current state of the FS where I think he's "overperforming" a bit, to put it mildly. > Idea: 1) Make the Farseer's *default* attacks melee instead of ranged 2) Re-work his basic ability (i.e. Farsight) into an orb effect so he can activate ranged attacks for -a/-b/-c mana per shot, with some moderate +x/+y/+z damage, albeit not too exciting and with no special ability (just pure damage). > Reason: Currently, the FS's wolves can easily slip through where no Grunt or BM can fit, and effectively harass workers early on, so having an additional source of ranged DPS should come at some price. This not only fixes the 3rd ability problem, but also makes the SH and more importantly, the BM more attractive because currently FS is broke as a 1st hero in comparison. > Implementation: Thrall's model wields a hammer, so remodeling one arm should be a piece of cake + plus I already tested it in editor and whacking units with a hammer that makes the same sound as the MK's weapon is really sweet. I'm happy to hear your thoughts on that. cheers
@MsJavaWolf
@MsJavaWolf 2 ай бұрын
I think FS is really well balanced. When you look at tier lists, people usually don't rank him that high. Grubby ranked him in S but tons of people disagreed. I agree that he can be annoying in early game, but he really needs that because he isn't that strong later. The whole idea with the FS seems to be to have a good early that will give you enough momentum to carry you through the midgame, but that is also easier said than done in practice.
@MWcrazyhorse
@MWcrazyhorse 2 ай бұрын
One thing they can never figure out is to NERF the fing statues. Now they can purchase mass dispell and curse tanks. Broken. Terrible patch.
@azaratmitrionzintos161
@azaratmitrionzintos161 2 ай бұрын
They nerfed statues 1 or 2 patches ago
@1cedric1
@1cedric1 2 ай бұрын
Troll post
@pedro1161
@pedro1161 2 ай бұрын
With all respect, I love you remo and b2w, but ur sugestions for balance, 90% of them, are dogshit completely no sense
@twassell25
@twassell25 2 ай бұрын
I though his suggestions in this video were well thought out and personally I agreed with him.
@evg3nius
@evg3nius 2 ай бұрын
says a noname on the internet and doesn't even provide a single better suggestion. Wow some people these days.
@ryu-ken
@ryu-ken 2 ай бұрын
This is terrible. Blizzard needs to wake uo
@Eddy_111
@Eddy_111 2 ай бұрын
As usual, worst balance suggestions on the market. Obsessed with mana burn range for some reason, just camt let go of that stupid idea. Wants frost wyrms to be easy to get .. basically the strongest unit in the game
@pinthecool1
@pinthecool1 2 ай бұрын
The biggest problem with tauren, is that they are being kited. Instead of putting them at tier 2, making T3 for orc even more useless, give them a passive resistance to slow (sorc gives 50% slow and tauren only gets 25). And the problem with Frost Wyvern is that they get wrecked by piercing attacks. Give them a passive 4 damage decrease to every piercing attack, so that they still die to mass air (hyppos, gargs or human air), but live a bit longer against mass archers or rifles
@koldyn2193
@koldyn2193 2 ай бұрын
night elf struggles ahhahaah dont even think about moonwell buff, elfs dont even drop items for better heal, humans strugled so much and now playing with happy with good odds, make elfs play serious and not lazy, kaho is one and only good night elf rigth now
@tortovroddle2782
@tortovroddle2782 2 ай бұрын
IMO, mana burn is problematic due to its limited counterplay opportunities. To address this issue, I propose at least halving both the cooldown and damage of mana burn. This adjustment would result in less but more frequent damage to mana. Consequently, Night Elf players would need to engage in more micro-management to consistently focus on executing burn cycles effectively. Additionally, it would force Demon Hunter players to make riskier decisions, as they would need to pursue targets more aggressively and stay attached for longer periods. All this would also provide opponents with more opportunities to counteract and evade repeated burns.
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