My favourite comment on one of Winger's videos was someone complaining how Aron is "over educated". As if knowing less about a topic somehow makes you able to have a better grasp of a subject.

Dr Bowen is unreal. I don't know why he thinks he'd be no good in a live debate. I reckon he'd be fantastic. He clearly has heaps of knowledge at his disposal and sounds very confident, honest and convincing. I hope you have more talks with him discussing and explaining the bible.

Is his bed really high or is his stool really low? Or am I high?

That's why you ought not to learn Hebrew If you want to keep your faith. In Israeli secular schools, they taught us the Hebrew Bible, but in religious education, they mostly study the Talmud and Mishnah and only a small limited selection of biblical texts, because of anyone can understand these fables in their original form would not be able to maintain his religion.

It always makes me laugh when hardline fundamentalist Christians insist that the bible is the literal word of god, personally dictated and inviolate, and then have to interpret every word to make it even halfway appear to work. If you think God meant to say what you are trying to read into it then why didn't he just say that instead of what was actually written?

This was an excellent guest speaker on your channel. I appreciate his candor and knowledge.

When you're spewing what Christians believe and you claim to be one than they love you but as soon as you start thinking and finding out the truth and start speaking the truth they say you were never a real Christian.

Clearly a gentleman and a scholar.

Thanks both for sharing the wonderful chat. Simply marvellous work!

Altogether, a damn fine video! Thanks to Aron & Dr. J for a very pleasant, erudite, facinating 90 mins. Bravo! Encore!

The best hosts don't interrupt their guests. Guests keep the content fresh and the viewers from getting bored of the same voice and ideas all the time. Dr Bowen, you have some awesome information that the layperson needs to know about. I don't think there are enough people in your field and similar doing what you do. You mentioned a colleague of yours who reviewed your paper and was stunned that people actually take that prophecy that way. Don't be apologetic (no pun intended, lol) about sharing the information you have. I was gobbling it all up and am hungry for more.

Last year, when I was a sophomore in HS, the only thing we were taught about evolution in a period of 9 months was antibiotic resistance. I believe my teacher taught the minimum standards for Kentucky. Your videos on evolution and the systematic classification of life helped my knowledge and passion of evolution skyrocket. I want to pursue a career in evolutionary biology/zoology thanks to you sir. Thank You.

Dr Josh and Megan make all this stuff very accessible. Well done Digital Hammurabi and thank you Aron.

Dr.Josh is such a wealth of knowledge!! I'm always just so impressed w/ him & how he is able to communicate so much information, w/ ease & make it accessible to pple like me! Bravo!! Two of my favorite channels on yt, in one stream! This was incredible! Thank you Dr Josh & Aron Ra 💗

Stop apologizing for being technical. Some of us like it! XD

"When your ego is tied to it, it's very problematic." So true. For the apologists it's their ego, for the believer nextdoor it's their identity. I came from religion and I wouldn't mind so much if the text were taken, as dr. Josh said, for the literary genres they are. If the whole fear of hell was taken out from behind reading them. Some of those texts *can* provide comfort or food for thought. They can intellectual challenge and spur spiritual growth. And in that regard they don't have to be thrown away, like dr. Josh said too. In the meantime we base our day to day actions and decisions on solid evidence and reasoning like Aron tells us. I so hope we can one day move away from the "fight". And those really disingenuous voices, like the Hams and Hovinds and televangelists etc. of the world, can be silenced. If any miracle was possible to be asked for and occur, then that would be my wish.

Anyone doing video on that American missionary on remote Indian island? His faith was strong, but the arrows were apparently stronger...

The entire argument of prophecy is dead as soon as you come to the fact that the writers of New Testament had access to the Old Testament when they wrote it.

Hammurabi meets Ra! When old worlds collide.

Joshua Bowen, how about you make a video where every time you say "Well that would take too long." or "That's a bit complicated so I'll just skip that." you instead DON'T skip any of it! I for one won't be bored if you ramble on, because it's still super full of knowledge I'd like to know. 🙂

2 scholars who openly admit when they are out of their own area of expertise yet still know a lot more than the scholars in that particular field. Humility is a virtue!

On the matter of humans are apes, i'm with Sir Terry Pratchett: “The anthropologists got it wrong when they named our species Homo sapiens ('wise man'). In any case it's an arrogant and bigheaded thing to say, wisdom being one of our least evident features. In reality, we are Pan narrans, the storytelling chimpanzee."

Christian's one moment say it has to be taken literal what's said, then they say it has to he taken poetically So much for God not being the author of confusion

It was difficult for me to follow because I don’t know a bunch of what he mentioned, but I’d LOVE to hear from this gent again.

22:30 When I was pregnant with my son, I cut a pretty deep gash in my finger while cooking. My great-grandmother (who would've been 95 this year) dramatically screamed in horror & tried to cover my eyes, exclaiming, "Don't look at the blood! It'll mark the baby!!" She legitimately believed that the mere sight of blood would cause my son to have a birthmark.

As much as I am entertained by the drama, it is nice to see that sanity still prevails. Whenever I need a break from the stupidity, it's always enjoyable to visit your site, as well as Dr. Josh (as Skylar Fiction calls him), and Megan. It instills my hope for humanity. Keep up the good fight.

Oh man, I feel bad for this guy, having to deal with the ancient alien freaks all the time.

Ok ok what about this. 1v1 debates can't get me off anymore. WHAT IF we do: Aron Ra, Dr.Josh, Paulogia and Hugo and Jake VS Kent Hovind, Ken Ham, Ray Comfort and Mario. ALL ON THE NON SEQUITER! >:D

Very cool Aron! Joshua is such a nice and smart guy. Great to hear this. Thank you.

Dr Bowen is very polite. Every time Aron interrupted him right before he was going to make a main point and aron got into a tangent that really had no point to it, he was able to carefully get it back to the topic without showing frustration or impatience. Good job dr Bowen! Better than i

I love the way Dr Bowen corrects himself as he's talking. "No one believes th... No one in academia believes that-" To me, that's a sign of someone who knows what his words sound like to a listener, and is also a sign of someone willing to adapt and correct and, basically, be open to the idea of being wrong. Something sorely lacking in some quarters. The "I'm right no matter what!" position is not one that a seeker of truth ought to ever take.

I'm a Christian but I am drawn to this channel and videos like these. I'm learning alot

Dear Dr Bowen, please stop apologizing. You are a great scholar and do not need to apologize for your conclusions. As a listener it get a bit annoying when the apologies take up more time than then presentation of facts. That makes it unneccessarily lengthy. Love your facts, love your scholarly knowledge, would appreciate if you would just get on with presenting your facts with less apologizing. Keep up the good work!

Poor guy, having to deal with 'ancient aliens nutters' Hahahahaha A genuine guy, a genuine doctor too. Makes a refreshing change. ☺

So cool, he is a great resource.

I like what he sayd about taking genre in to account. Otherwise it would be like humans 10,000 years from now reading a sci-fi novel or fantasy novel as if they were non-fiction.

Forrest Gump got smart

It's almost 2 in the morning. What am I doing?

"Like a lion, has surrounded my hands and my feet..." OMG! Awesome prophecy!!! That is what my cat is doing to remind me it's getting close to cat feeding time.

Very interesting hearing from a genuine expert. Very informative video. Many thanks.

"How do you worship a god that writes this way?" Lol. Best emotional appeal against religion ever.

Love your content

The ONLY reason I watch this content is the clear understanding that Truth is Evidence ...

Ok. Is it that the bed is really high or is he sitting low to the ground? Liked the video

Dr. Josh's channel is amazing. I'm addicted to it.

Dr Josh killing it again ... Man really knows his stuff !

Great Podcast - Please have him on again for another chat!

Wow! What a great discussion! I went over to Digital Hammurabi, and their channel is fantastic! Thank's for having Dr. Josh on Aron, he seems like a great guy and seems extremely knowledgeable in a field that is a such a great resource for someone who debates creationists all the time. Go support Digital Hammurabi guys, go sub to their channel if you enjoyed this video!

I specialised in sumerian and studied hebrew for two years, along with six years of new testament greek. I also teach to graduate level. I got a feeling some xtians are about to get pawned.

To me failed prophesy is some of the best evidence against Christianity. I truly believe that the verse where Jesus says that he will come back with angels to judge every person and then that some of the people standing in front of him won't die until they see him return is one of the most damning verses against the narrative. But Christians will never see it that way. Some will either argue the transfiguration or the Pentecost; but Jesus isn't coming in his kingdom in either of those and he didn't judge every person on earth. People sometimes argue the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD but he didn't return to his kingdom and he didn't judge every man alive or dead in that either. The only somewhat valid explanation is that when John had his apocalyptic vision he saw all of that. But that is still only one person and the probability of John the apostle writing Revelation is about 0%. Even if he did it can't be the same person who wrote the Gospel of John because of differences in spelling, grammar, and so on. Anyway Christians who know the Bible well usually have an excuse for this failed prophesy that suits them.

Keep them coming AronRa ! Love your video's and it is refreshing to hear you talk and explain !

If you ever come to Vegas I'd love to see you speak.

Aron, thanks for presenting to us a former preacher who finally saw the light, the enlightenment of atheism.

Jesus was supposed to return in a cloud before the High Priest died (“you will see...”). Mark 14:61-62. Caiaphas was apparently the High Priest then and he died about 36 CE. So Jesus is just 1,982 years late.

Very interesting video. I love when accedamians, specializing in the Biblical languages can point by point disprove so many false beliefs concerning the Bible. Keep posting AaronRa.

Wonderful discussion! You gentlemen are both “A great resource.” When combined..... Formidable!

I seem to recall somewhere mentioning that the penalty for giving a false prophesy was, just like everything else, stoning. HOW were these so-called "prophets" allowed to continue making up this stuff?

I think a live debate could be possible debate team style. 4-6 research and SME on each side, all armed with laptops. 1 moderator, 1 speaker per side, and one scribe per side (writes out or takes a stenographic record for the researchers and SME's to access if they question wording or articles cited). The moderator would be there to hold each side to whatever agreed upon time limits, prevent or fault for debate infractions like Gish galloping, straw-manning, and especially "what aboutisims" (a complete list I'm assuming is already in place for such debates, or do they even allow debates with live research teams? It just seems like it would happen I just am too lazy to look that kind of thing up), oh and gods of the gaps.I personally think moderators should have the ability to mute a speaker if they are going over time, or are not acknowledging/answering the question, reask the question or rephrase it if clarity is needed as needed to ensure the question is best comprehended if needed), and only the speakers may present the arguments, but the researchers and SME's either send their information to the speaker or they can speak with them via closed-loop communications (wifi, or Bluetooth, etc..) . SME's would be credentialed and peer-reviewed experts in their field and researchers would be... general researchers, preferably good ones with experience and speed. My suspicion would be the apologetics wouldn't accept because it stacks the game against them, but maybe glazed grandpa Ken, would consider it if he could bring his yesmen and woman up against an equally qualified opposition with similar rules. I dunno, it's just a weird fantasy billing it as the "debate to end all debates", lol, watching and seeing how each side actually would fare. Heck, I'd pay for a plane ticket and seats to that. (I didn't lay out all the "rules", but I hope enough to make the general concept understood, not that anyone reads this far on comments on youtube, LOL.

Most of the "prophesies" were actually written after the events they claim to be predicting. (e.g Daniel) We should call them "retro-phesies"

I dont understand why people think that the people who have nothing to gain by lying to them are dead set on lying to them, but instead choose the think the people who profit from lying to them are the only ones telling them the truth.

This dude is awesome!!!!! Thank you AronRa for bringing him to my attention, I would never have known about him if not for this video. THANK YOU one more time!!!

As a theist , I pretty much acknowledge everything stated in this presentation. Evangelicals are pathetic and completely destroy their own credibility by, well, I wish it was just ignorance but often some degree to outright dishonesty.

This went in a totally different direction than I could've expected.

I've had a number of debates with apologists about Tyre and it's rewarding to see others with more experience than I using the same conclusions.

Here's a prophecy for you: No religious prophecy will ever come to pass.

The amount of misquoting from mikes video is just insane lol at the very least mike plays Arons video as he’s commenting on it, this guy just repeatedly misquotes mike for the sake of “time” and it’s just ridiculous

Mining your back catalog ⛏️⛏️⛏️

Aaron likes to throw insulting facts, but Bowen is so good at stating facts without throwing shade, it’s refreshing.

I think this topic is of more interest to ex-Christian atheists than to atheists like me who were never believers. I generally find atheist-Christian debates and atheist-Muslim debates fascinating because I learn things about apologetics, each religion, etc., but the prophecy debates always get bogged down in ridiculous details I can't bring myself to care about. It's such obvious bullcrap that I have a hard time wondering why anyone believes the "fulfilled" "prophecies" of their own religion.

Hey brother how you doing? Love the conversation, and I say keep your foot on their necks because as much as they say religion isn't divisive...🤨I call b*******, and tell my family that. Hay I was wondering if you have received my email? Anyway thanks a lot for speaking to me a few weeks back on The Atheist Experience. You and Traci really helped me to process the whole coming out as an atheist thing to friends and family. Unfortunately haven't talked to my brother yet and it still hurts me like a son of a b****. but I guess it is what it is.

Nice one Dr Joshua and Aron!

Great work. Thanks Aron.

I always thought of the many nations passage from Isiah about Tyre was in reference to Babylonians style of Empire. The king of Babylon was the ruler over other rulers(king of kings), hes and her empire was made of meany nations. IE. the armies of Babylon are made of meany people from all around the Babylon and the nations it holds. thanks Bowen for confirming that I'm not crazy.....

I've seen this guy on Skylar Fictions show, he sure knows Hebrew and Greek.

Why does AronRa depict Mike as "complaining"? I just finished watching his videos, and he clearly goes over how he asked if he could make a response, then calmly and respectfully goes over Aron's points. There was no complaining in either video.

I like Josh's "Oooh, a squrrel" moment near the end, LOL 🤣

I mention this whenever someone tries to argue fufillment of prophecies to me. Have you ever looked into prophecies that were told by soothsayers and Oracle's that came to fruition. If you're going to argue that demons are the result, then why is it that the Devil can seemingly outdo everything God can?

Is it just me or does Dr. Bowen's bed look really tall?

RUN FOREST RUN !

great video! very interesting to listen even learned some new things it's nice to hear a fairly in depth conversation about this will have to watch more on his channel :)

Woot!

1:31:09 "if i have seen further it is only on the shoulders of giants" :)

This is my first encounter with Dr Bowen; he is fucking awesome.

I think it’s hilarious of Christians will dismiss other ancient religions as myth when their book has the same kind of situation stories parables in it, and they believe those as truths

Wow, Aron cleans up well.

I call the typical, boring "You should go see [Apologist N]" stuff Fanboying for the Champions of Christianity. Or whatever religion is relevant, anyway. Champion-Fanboying is, I believe, due entirely to the messianic nature of religion. Prophets and chosen ones and... whatever term you want to give the magical figures, it infects the thinking of theists into believing that what is being said matters not one bit because it's who is saying it that matters. We've been seeing it for ages. "Oh, you're making videos about Kent Hovind? He's low hanging fruit, you're too scared to address a REAL apologist, like Ray Comfort". It usually has that loaded, demeaning language attached to it, too. As if Ray Comfort's arguments, which are functionally identical to Hovind's, are better because Ray Comfort is making them instead of Hovind. It also seems to come in waves. When one apologist lose favor (I.E. is no longer considered the current Champion, the chosen fighter defending the honor of the faith) and you've thoroughly exposed Ray Comfort for the idiot he is, people replace 'Hovind' with 'Comfort' and 'Comfort' with the next guy. "You're afraid of a REAL apologist, like Ravi Zacharias". And the cycle goes on... William Lane Craig stayed at the top for a long time, mostly by avoiding any obvious scandals like going to jail, exposing his banana fetishes, getting caught snorting meth out of a male prostitute's ass crack, building a giant rotting boat-shaped warehouse and admitting in public that he's too stupid to ever accept being proven wrong, but then he was replaced with the most unsophisticated one of the bunch, Sye Ten Bruggencate, whose argument boiled down to "I'M RIGHT AND YOU KNOW IT YOU LIAR" followed by pooping in his diapers, but there are always fanboys of other Champions waiting to point at the next dunce waiting in the wings for his big moment. Like Winger. The whole thing is boring. It wouldn't matter if Bill Gates or Adolf Hitler is making the argument. An argument isn't wrong just because a man is making it, or right just because a woman is making it. An argument isn't wrong because a tax-fraud is making it, and an argument isn't correct just because you've never been caught abusing kids. Arguments stand on their own merit. The same Champion/Messiah worship of religion is often seen in the way theists try to attack people like Darwin or Dawkins. "Oh yeah? Well Darwin was a racist!" and such. So what? I mean, no he wasn't, but even if it were the case, how would that make evolution false? Theists are so trapped in that way of thinking that they can't seem to understand that attacking a famous scientist means nothing. If a child molester tells you it's raining outside, and it's raining outside, the rain doesn't stop just because a rapist said so. If a murderer says 2+2=4, the entirety of Mathematics doesn't get invalidated just because a bad guy used math one time. If Kent Hovind goes to jail for tax fraud and then gets out nine years later and starts selling fake cancer medication to gullible morons who'll end up dead because of him, it doesn't mean the Earth wasn't surrounded by a magical water bubble in the past. An apologist being a piece of shit (as they all are) is entirely separate from the apologist being right or wrong. Was there at some point a magical water bubble surrounding the planet? No. Why? Because magic isn't real and stuff falling from orbit wouldn't cause a flood, it'd sterilize the planet with superheated steam and water isn't a stable enough substance to float above the atmosphere for any length of time before de-orbiting. So who the hell is Mike Winger? It literally does not matter. He could have fifty legitimate PhDs (and I say legitimate because apologists rarely do) or be caught giving handjobs to the homeless in front of a pre-school and it wouldn't matter. His arguments are what matter, and if he's arguing that biblical prophecies have been fulfilled, his arguments are gonna have a bad time.

Great guy, great video, thanks Aron!

A youtube channel about assyriology?? Oh happy day. Been wanting to learn in that field Have sunscribed.

21:00 He has MS... Is he in a wheelchair? That certainly explains the level. 1:26:00

80th

You can't go around calling yourself a doctor in the UK like you can in the states. So many quacks

Seems like even people at the time might have disagreed about what words meant, and how phrases were meant to be interpreted, so for people looking at the text now, differing opinions about the meaning could be equally valid. Dr Joshua Bowen was great and I'd love to see more videos of him talking about how the Bible can be interpreted in different ways.

Ohhh. You can so tell the Bible is the word of God. Got people who hate God studying the Bible more than follows

Hello AronRa!

Yay! I love Dr. Bowen. Thanks for the vid.

Great video Aron! Thank you!!

Literally the first veiw

He's so small. How does he get into that giant bed?

We are always told that we have to take the Bible in context and adjust for the times. But THEN we are told that the Bible is timeless and appropriate for out time. Well, which is it?

I come from a very fundamentalist background (Baptist) and yah, the Bible should not be taken literally.