Being part of a group playing and learning O Group, I think it would be impossible to play early games without making errors or overlooking things. Now we finally found the National rules, listed on each country's Battalion page, for example. It is a tremendous game but there are many little moving parts (eg lose 2 firing dice if moving but lose only 1 dice if moving less than 4") that it takes time on the table, the rule book and the forum to make things come together.

Cheers Chris, I did read the PDF whilst waiting or the hard copy as well, so I was ready and waiting to go pretty quickly.

Cheers, I'm glad you enjoyed it, the next part will be along later this week!

Cheers, I am glad you've found it useful. I found the rules took a little getting used to and reading them took a while, but once it is on the tabletop they are incredibly simple.

Hope you enjoy it!

Cheers, it will be along soon enough, in the next couple of days.

Glad you enjoyed it! O Group is a great game and I'm sure you'll enjoy it

Thank you, glad you found it of some use (I do make loads of mistakes though!)

Cheers buddy, thank you for that. Yeah, shocks and suppression can really make a mess of your plans if not dealt with, but then of course that means you can't do everything else you want to...

Thanks Phil! I am glad you enjoyed the video and the table!

Cheers, yeah, they are easy to hold in your head and after a few turns the basics are pretty simple.

Cheers, I don't think you'll regret it at all, its an excellent set of rules and there's a lot of interest in them at the moment.

Cheers buddy! I'm glad you enjoyed it!

No problem, I'm glad you found it useful either way. I guess it all depends on what level of command you are interested in.

Cheers!

Thank you, I am glad it was useful!

Cheers, be warned though I get quite a lot of the rules incorrect in this video, but it gives you a good idea of overall play.

@@StormofSteelWargaming reading rules wrong ha! Join the club. It usually takes a smug 6th former to point it out. The advantage of Solo gaming ;-)

You're welcome, glad you enjoyed the video.

Cheers Ian, you can't learn without making mistakes!

Enjoy!

Thank you!

Glad it was helpful! Don't take this as instructional though, there are plenty of mistakes!

Well, in some ways that can be helpful in itself, makes me go and check stuff for myself- all part of the learning process ....(then I can bask in self satisfied smugness and say to myself “ha! I thought he got that wrong!” ).

Indeed, it mirrors friction very well and the abstraction of battalion command, it plays smoothly once you follow the basic tenants and is an exciting and enjoyable game. I wouldn't worry about other people getting upset at how someone wants to play with their toy soldiers TBH.

It's possible that you're right since I've yet to play 'O' Group. But I have played General D'Armed by the same designer and while that's for Napoleonics, those rules are fantastic for actually playing the period so my current money is on Mr Brown doing more of the same. And like I said, I've read the rules twice and found them very simple and well thought out. What rule set would you suggest is better for a battalion-level WW2 game? I've played Bolt Action which doesn't do a good job of abstracting unit size and doesn't represent the historical period of military doctrines well at all.

Personally, I think that the assumption that reality can be captured by shoving toy soldiers around a generally very ‘2d’ board and rolling dice to determine who is ‘dead’ is strange no matter what set of rules you are using. For me (been wargaming ww2 for 40 years and even wrote my own set of rules) it is about the ‘feel’ of the period. It’s all very subjective. I play 40k too very occasionally. There’s a reason why that game probably out sells every other wargame ever so I wouldn’t be too hasty to denigrate it - it is what it is.

@@davidwasilewski Certainly wasn't denigrating 40K as a fun game. But it's really not trying to model anything which is for the best since Chaos Marines and Orks aren't really a consideration in our reality :)

@@vryc you’re right on one level but not at another. I’ve been immersed in the ‘lore’ of the old world and the 40k universe and dungeons and dragons for as long as I’ve been reading books about napoleon, Alexander etc. It is just as possible to ‘re create’ famous battles for those games as it is to re fight Waterloo etc. Of course I know that’s not everyone’s cup of tea. Me, I like both. Fantasy and historicals.

Thank you 😊

Cheers Bill, glad you enjoyed the game and the video. The matt is from Tiny Wargames, it's their standard grass matt.

Cheers Chip, I would definitely suggest reading the rules properly as I forgot loads of stuff, but I'm glad it helped! The roads are by Miniature World Maker, based in Australia, but I got them in the UK from Magister Militum and the game mat came from Tiny Wargames, based here in the UK.

@@StormofSteelWargaming Thanks Alex. Really appreciate the information. I enjoyed part 2 as well.

I agree. If you are modeling individual buildings (like for BA or CoC), use the same scale as the minis. If you are modeling BUA’s, drop the building scale. This allows you to make some really nice mini-dioramas for the BUA’s, instead of just throwing buildings onto the table. It also adds to the “zoomed out” feel of this grand tactical game, rather than the “in your face” feel of a skirmish game.

I'm used to using 15mm scale buildings in battalion level games, such as Rapid Fire, so the size discrepancies don't worry me so much. I just use one building to represent a number of buildings.

I'm glad it was of use for you. Yeah, you're probably right, as I said don't take this as instructional, I make loads of mistakes throughout it.

@@StormofSteelWargaming be the same for everyone to start off with, then we’ll all be asking for add ons like smoke grenades, better shooting factors for Lugers and Italian tanks with 5 reverse gears. 😂😂😂. Keep up the great work. Love your videos.

I did keep forgetting about the 'training' attributes for the British and Germans as well, it would have helped the British advance if I'd used their smoke mortars... Thanks, I'm glad you enjoy the videos!

@@StormofSteelWargaming Credit to you. You’re doing it solo, whilst commentating. We can’t get it right when there’s for or five of us sat around a table playing rules we’ve used for years!!! 😂😂

I will do, I just need more time!

Cheers Chris, I just airbrushed them in various colours, then used a ripped sponge to dab Oily Steel and German Camo Black Brown Vallejo paint on as rust and chips.

@@StormofSteelWargaming great thanks, they look very effective

Cheers, I am glad you enjoyed it. I got some of them from various places, but I also scratch built a few of them.

Check out the rest of my videos and you'll see plenty more 15mm WW2!

There's no basing requirements in O Group, so you could easily use your existing FoW based figures anyway. There's a video on the channel about organising your forces for O group, I think I cover basing on that.

Thanks, glad you enjoyed the video! I use the same figures, but these ones were originally based for Rapid Fire. I have a load of single based WW2 figures that I am using more often in CoC as well.

@@StormofSteelWargaming thank you for the reply. Yes, I think for me, finding a sabot base for 15mm with three men in a row shouldn't be too hard. That way I could do both. I guess for O Group the main thing is having a uniform size for both sides of the engagement.

@@bonddizzle it is something I considered myself, but already having millions of multiple based figures it didn't seem necessary. It works well for allowing both games to be played, but I have also never had an issue with using multiple based figures in CoC anyway, especially not at 15mm. Even having as uniform size isn't critical for O Group, as long as they in the same ball park. My Soviets have a slightly larger four man base than my three man Germans, for example, mainly cos they were originally, originally based for Grey Storm, Red Steel, which used different sized bases and I never changed them for use in Rapid Fire and now IABSM and CoC and O Group...

Cheers, I cleared these up with Christopher Brown the other day, and I did say in the intro that I would make mistakes as I am still learning myself. Firing at Combat Patrols: page 58, in the modifiers table second to last entry.

I'm just learning the rules myself (obviously!) so it's good to see examples of play. My comments are as much by way of trying to ensure that my understanding is correct. Looking forward to part two>

@@peterclarke527 Part two coming soon (possibly tomorrow...)

Yes it does.

If I might be allowed to add to my post, I guess one way for the Brits to win this one is to "ignore" the scenario objective of taking 2 of 4 BUAs in the town, and focus on the Core Game Rule of forcing a defeat by inflicting 12 losses (3 Fubars), as we saw in a later two-player game with Alex on the losing end with the defenders, despite that nasty Panther.

Yes, I wondered about that option for the Brits too. Reading on the actual action I found the Howards failed to carry the day against stout defenders, not surprisingly. After a few games when I host I generally reduce the defenders by at least several squads (including at least one full platoon) - and I also give the attackers 10 orders. After all, it's acknowledged defenders needed a 3:1 advantage to reasonably guarantee success, so finding a sweet spot for a balanced game is tricky. I also need to try some meeting engagements where this issue largely goes away.

Keep watching, I realised that myself

Thank god, I've been waiting three years for that clarification.

Yep, every time...

@@StormofSteelWargaming 😂😂 No worries, we’re all on the learning curve.

Friction. 😂😂

Yeah, I said at the beginning of the game the hedges were just purely decorative.

@@StormofSteelWargaming this is a tremendous video - I have my pdf but am waiting for my full copy; btw, does the book include extra copies of the QRS such as came with General d'Armee? Always a lovely bonus

@@Vlad65WFPReviews hi Vlad just answering for Alex, yes rules come with a copy if the QRS in a very similar format to GdA. The rule book and rules also have a similar feel and look as Daves previous rule sets. Building up into a lovely collection of excellent rules for various periods.

Thanks Vlad, as Nick says, yeah they come with the QRF.

@@nickjennings8757 thanks, Nick! Yes, the QRS was the very first thing I spotted in a box-opening video and I was delighted. Been playing it solo a bit and it looks like a cracker of a game - many, many elements but with 4+ simplicity - and so many decisions. David has another winner.

No problem, I'm not sure why you think that, it is pretty streamlined and works perfectly well for the level of command it is replicating, IMO.

@@StormofSteelWargaming Obviously diluted by not having read them myself and only the video to form my impressions it just seems overly "busy." That setup and deployment takes a while, there's a lot of dice adding-and-subtracting in addition to rolling with little effect (though the spotting die being integrated into the roll is cool), the beloved Lardie Random Movement Rolls return, the whole two types of order resource management, and tokens all over the place. I'm kind of dreading what armor combat will be like in part 2.

@@SpringfieldFatts set up only takes time in the video cos I was explaining it, in reality it's probably about ten minutes, roll a set of dice and put your figures and combat patrols on the table or in reserves, and you start. This way is far better than just setting up figures on opposite table edges and marching toward the centre. The little effect of dice rolling was due to my poor dice rolls, the majority of dice are rolled against a 4+ factor, so there's a 50% chance of success with pretty much every roll (apart from obscured units or elites). The dice addition and subtraction is equally streamlined with only a handful of factors at play, once you understand them (moving, firing into cover, being shocked are negative modifiers) they come very quickly, far quicker than looking up modifiers on a chart in other similar level games I've played. There's nothing wrong with random moves, and in fact, if having now used them, I would hate to go back to fixed movement rates, it seems pretty ancient and boringly predictable IMO. If you accept firing as a randomised event, then why not movement? There are so many factors at play. Armour is pretty simple, you roll to hit, then roll for effect. I'm not sure there are any rules that make it any easier than that. No need to dread it at all. And you can always replace the tokens with any other means, such as a roster, markers using spare figures, anything really. At the end of the day, you can either buy them or not, choice is yours.

@@StormofSteelWargaming Thanks for extrapolating. Are the Brits you used on this video from your 15 minute challenge a while back?

Indeed they are!