Agreed, but I think it'd also be fair for an ST to let it happen, it's and interesting tactic and I feel like it wouldn't mess with balance too much

@@KeenX72 I don't think encouraging play like this would be an interesting tactic, especially if it is forcing players to reveal information that they don't want outed. That doesn't sound enjoyable for the players involved. It could be viewed as a strategy, yes, but coercing others to do something for your benefit is not exactly a kind thing to do or something that makes people want to come back and play again. I think it falls more under "exploiting the mechanics" than "strategy," tbh.

@@KeenX72 But then it essentially 100% nullifies the pyschopath. Pressure everyone to psychopath kill themselves, if they refuse, they are most likely evil/psychopath (if w'ere assuming try harding to win for your team, which coercing people definitely is). Good people and non psychopath evil can do it, and then you're left with 4 outcomes 1) everyone but 1 person does it, and so you know who is the psychopath and try to exe him 2) everyone does it, and so you, for NO COST, learned that there is no psychopath, and thus can more accurately pinpoint what minions are in play 3) the psychopath kills themselves 4) the psychopath kills someone else on day 1 So yes, it is a strat that 100% beneficiates town without any chance to obfuscate it. The only caveat would be to have a poisoner immediately poison their minion on D1, but that's just so counterintuitive because you risk doing more harm as you don't know what your minion is. The last option is, theoretically, quite close to how people might play it already, but you're still forcing the psychopath to come out, nullifying any attempt at concealment. It nerfs the psychopaths by making it unconcealable, but also by narrowing down the minions in play if it is not. So balancewise, it does mess with it quite a lot. Finally, it's a game, and that kind of strategy would probably be socially disastrous, and would definitely risk people feeling unwelcome and not coming back. Finally, it's not just an issue about the psychopath because sure, you could just not play any script with the psychopath in it, but if you're willing to do that kind of strategy, I doubt it will stop at the psychopath, and it feels like a meh way to play and enjoy BOTC with your friends.

@@KeenX72 Two other people have already said why but I really feel it necessary to clarify: no, it absolutely is not. Forcing people to claim and/or act (same with Damsel guesses) is a quick way to make everyone in the circle miserable.

@@KeenX72 It would break certain abilities completely, like the Damsel. As @berdyie said, town could just force everyone to claim Minion and guess "X is the Damsel" day 1. So great call on Ben's part, this should be nipped in the bud.

I once had to ignore a Mutant claiming outsider because the person they were talking to coaxed them into it through a really convoluted thing and would not let the conversation end until they put Outsiders in their claims.

@@cghensi Yeah no that's pretty crappy from the coaxing player. I mean it's a pretty evil move so I can't say I've heard of a whole town allowing it to happen without the coaxing player becoming an outed evil, but regardless of alignment that's definitely something that needs to be clamped down on. It's not really fair, and definitely not fun.

It completely breaks the damsel if you go around and ask everyone to guess themselves as damsel on day 1. Yes it's helping the good team, but why play a damsel script if you do that.

@@whocares2277 Oh yeah, if a round damsel robin starts I'd shut that down with "I am not accepting any coerced claims of minions picking Damsels." This is a social deduction game, not Simon Says.

Metas can be okay because players can just choose to play against the meta. But running town by a committee and forcing public acting roles to act for a check is just boring and unpleasant and not fun for everyone apart from the person who's forcing people to prove themselves. And I don't like autocrats like that in my games.

Happy Birthday Nicky!!!

Almost as good as Keytar Velociraptors

It had "et tu, Brute" energy. She felt so betrayed lol

When this is the comment KZfaq displays under the video, spoiling the end 10 minutes in :(

@@BatteriesNotRequired Sorry. :(

I was sooooo betrayed! #RalphWiggumValentineMeme

@@katherineinskip9056 Oh no! 😆 For what it's worth, one of the real highlights of the episode is you solving the most nonsense, made up Amnesiac info in a way that would have been super thematic to the grim and could totally have been plausible. ❤

@@katherineinskip9056 that moment had strong "et tu, Brute" energy. It was amazing

Aweeeee thank you

Same! I don't usually like rewatching games so soon, because I remember everything and it's not as fun, but this one was an exception, I enjoyed it so much I was waiting for it to uploaded so I could watch it again honestly

We've played 'blind TB' a few times on stream, where nobody is given their roles. It was predictably chaotic, haha. - Ben

As I understand the wiki, the Po retains the charge if picked by the Exorcist. However, the Exorcist was also Minstrel drunk that night, so their ability should not have functioned. Unless I'm missing something, I agree that the Po should have lost their charge during the Minstrel night.

From the Wiki, I'd say you're correct, even though the Po was drunk, the Po should have been asked to select 3 players, which consumes the charge. Small ST error, but understandable given a complex intersection of a drunk Po being selected by a drunk Exorcist

That came out of me asking Kohav to pick three and Kohav asking if she could hold - in that moment I was like "umm, I guess that sounds like a more fun game for you" - but that's definitely not within the rules 😅

@@Miraxik Fun only happens when the rules are followed, imho. :-(

It's quite nice for a number of reasons actually! For the ST, it lessens some of the audio pressure around the circle, so actions in the night are less noticible to sleeping townsfolk. For the players, it's nice to just be able to chit-chat while the night happens, otherwise you're just stuck there staring at your own eyelids for 5 minutes

@@efarien140 i think they were referring to how, in the games on this channel, the st wakes players by pulling them into a private chat in the middle of the night

​@comp.lex4 that makes perfect sense lol, yep

Had some time to wake up, meditated on the idea, realised it’s bonkers. Considering an alternative… “There are two Mirror Spirits in play. During setup, Minions only learn one Mirror Spirit and only one Mirror Spirit learns the minions. At night, both choose a player. If both choose the same player, that player dies. At any time during the day, a Mirror Spirit may privately guess the other Mirror Spirit with the Storyteller. If correct, any player chosen by a Mirror Spirit dies if chosen at night. [-1 Minion]” Finally giving the evil team a reason to visit the Storyteller helps reinforce a Fisher/Savant/Artist bluff.

Oh, I’d need to acknowledge what happens if one Mirror Spirit dies. Either the other can’t kill if they didn’t find the other Mirror Spirit, meaning good just needs to find and execute them; or the remaining Mirror Spirit can kill one per night with no extra abilities.

Nope.

The ST would choose one of the idiots to die.

If you sign up for the app at www.patreon.com/botconline, you will get access to the official Discord server, which has a community of players who'll be happy to introduce you to the game. - Ben

Funnily enough it would have probably lost the game - it would have given JoJo credibility, confirmed Jacqui as evil, Minstrel day would still happen, so no kills and then people would turn towards Kohav who was confirming Jacqui.