+Rudevald serious douth and blacksmith are filthy rich for the first to make and amour off any kinde take lot of time, if you make 5 amour a year your if you are goode. seconde if and faction are amoring and lot of soldier will not use singel blacksmith but will use armor factory vare and hundred if not tusen of blacksmith are working two way for and blacksmith to be rich are be corupt or to have lot of skill and more reputation

Omg reading that made my brain collapse

+Connor Turton I think he was supposing the idea that armour takes months to make. Clearly he's never actually seen how much most armour is just flat surfaces bolted together and occasionally beaten into a curve. Arming hundreds of men takes months yes, but a half dozen will only take a couple weeks.

Alright thanks for clearing that up fam

+Laurence Martin Well it depends on what kind of armour we're talking about. An ordinary soldier in the later part of the history of metal armour would be wearing munition armour: Mass-produced and of reasonable quality. Making a full, custom plate harness for a knight is something else entirely, and could take a good smith quite a while, but with marked improvements in comfort and mobility, if not necessarily in protection (it'll probably all be made from similar steel). I can imagine a master smith being paid well to make custom harnesses for wealthy customers, with a large group of apprentices under him making munition armour for the common soldier.

Sweeping cavalry charges , that’s chivalrying

Not until, THE WINGED LANCERS OF KISLEV ARRIVED!!!!

@@daswordofgork9823 lol! In lore, a winged lancer does not even come close to a grail knight. Its like comparing a phoenix guard to a goblin

​@@jonstalin5992 damn savage rebuke. Virgin hussar vs chad grail knight

Grail Knights should be some of the best horse cavalry (i.e. excluding monstrous cavalry) in the game.

leiah2 they definitely feel like the current updates have tweeked them a bit to make them more effective....though pegisus knights are still underpowered.

amusing... i've read on the Forums that the Bretonian air force is absolutely disgusting... personaly i wouldnt take htei rcurrent stats as granted until after they become a full fledged faction in february

There has been a few balance changes. And I think the pegasus knights are really strong if you use them correctly, but if you can't spend a lot of micro on them, they often get swamped behind enemy lines without support.

That became Estalia, no?

peasants are still over taxed now they live in filthy hamlets in the shadow of castles.

@@RocketHarry865 Typical peasant whinging

Indeed he was pretty close with most of it

He'll do that somewhen between tomorrow and the heat death of the Universe.

@@MizantropMan Cut that, he’s doing it after the next Big Bang.

Congratulations

math2222322 purty much, but the bretonnian knights are core choices so you can have as many of them as you want while the empire knights are limited. Weather or not that is going to be implemented in any way in TWW is anybody's guess thou.

Arch Warhammer Yeah, but Bretonnia hasn't been updated in forever. They're only crap because of the codex creep. I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to update it, that they'd make life a little less bleak for the peasants too. Being cavalry centric, the big thing the Brettonians would have is a cavalry unit for every situation. Knight's Errant and Knights of the Realm for the numbers game, Questing Knights for... I guess Questing... maybe a unit that tires slowly and being good at running down and chasing enemy units about, and/or perhaps some sort of zone capturing bonus. Grail Knights for anti-elite and punching holes. Mounted Yeomen for scouting, quick strikes, anti-skirmisher, and lighting fast cycle attacks. The Bretonnians want to gain cavalry superiority by quickly slaughtering /all/ the enemy cav /away/ from the enemy infantry support and then launching concentrated attacks on vulnerable enemy units. They'd also have prefer the Alexandrian school of strategy, where the infantry merely holds off the bulk of the enemy forces while their general runs straight for the enemy commander. Most horde style armies get pretty panicky when their big boss dies.

DracoAvian Sadly the bro-tonnians aren't getting an update and will most likely be merged with empire and dwarves in 9th edition. The entire world was destroyed in the end times so who the frogglers knows what will happen next :/

I have no idea what's going on in Warhammer anymore... I kinda stopped after Storm of Magic ruined tabletop for me. Something about my style of play being ridiculously bad in a storm of magic fight.

DracoAvian I think they retconned storm of magic. Tho if you don't like giant magic balls of death that end the game in a single turn you won't like end times. I feel like they're murdering my childhood. Goodbye Bretonnia, tomb kings, and beastmen. I hope that if they do get merged there's options to continue using them as separate entities.

Kaiser Louis-Philip V sad but true, we should not buy it...nvm..long live the king ffs

Kaiser Louis-Philip V I'm bloody willing to pay their chopped up content, as long as they actually make the game good. And I'd pay 20 for bretonnia :P I wouldn't pay a single $ for orcs or skaven though :P

Kaiser Louis-Philip V the game will be sold with 4 to 5 armys and will later sell 2 addons to the map with new armys

#notbuying until Bretonnia released/modded

Kaiser Louis-Philip V Hey if its a concentrated faction exclusive campaign with the faction with some good content shubed in their id pay happily......a fuck their the grail knights id pay if it was a unit pack

Me to, I also really like his more relaxed/laid back way of talking.

TerranGaming and it seems that flying units are in, along with magic and the current nations are empire chaos orcs vampires and also heroes are a thing

Dwarves? Elves? Stalin led Medieval France.? I was looking forward to all of them. You think they will be DLC? Or just not made at all

yeah dwarfes are in too, there are also going to be 2 expansions that will make the map bigger and add factions so i do think elves will be added

Hey are a few suggestions of fantasy books, should you want any more. There are good 40K novels but you prefer fantasy. Omnibuses The Brunner omnibus (although you'll probably read it) (All around the world) The Witch Hunter omnibus, (Empire) The Sundering Omnibus (Elves), The Calard the Knight (of Knight Errant, Knight of the Realm, Questing Knight and Grail Knight) they are also combined in a single book (Bretonnia), The Tyrion & Teclis omnibus (Elves). The Ambassador Chronicles (Kislev/Empire) Novels Iron Company (The Empire), The Enemy Within (Empire/Chaos) Necromancer (Empire/Undead) The Red Duke (Bretonnia/Undead) There are other good fantasy books but I haven't finished reading them (like all the chronicles) However if you are watching the Slayer series (Gotrek and Felix), I would suggest stop reading the series after Vampire Slayer I hope that helps

Ideally in the fluff, what would happen in a Bretonnian Army Skirmish/Battle: The enemy would mass up as they do. Consider Bretonnia's major enemies are Orcs, Vampires, Beastmen, and Skavens, all "Big Blobby" armies. They don't really fight the Empire all that often to deal with formal ranked formations. Nor do they fight Kislev's hit and run horseback skirmishers, or all that often fight Chaos and Lizardmen and it's heavy Grindfest and attrition. When considering Fluff Tactics and how an army is "Supposed" to fight, you always have to consider who their real enemies are. In the case of Orcs, Beastmen, and Skavens you typically have very low Leadership enemies for the most part. Orc Boyz/Goblins are terrible at Combat Resolution, meaning once they take a charge, it's very likely that Orcs will break and flee, leaving the bretonnians in the area to consolidate again. Granted in tabletop this tends not to happen due to clunk with the Rules, and you just charge again, picking your mark. But in Fluff they'd wheel about to consolidate with the Men at Arms and Longbowmen, to set up another crushing charge... unless they were like Knights Errant and thus so full of Glory Seeking that they'd just charge the fleeing orcs can run them down. The same applies for Skaven, the danger with Skaven is that they WANT you to bog down on their rank and file slaves and such. But as long as you can inflict terrible enough casualties the enemy breaks, then you won't get bogged down, swarmed, and taken down. In the case of Undead this usually means the knights will be picking off the more mobile units on their list. The various beasties that can run around. The rank and file Zombie and Skeleton blocks are just going to get hammered with a ton of arrows from the Peasants. Since the Knights are more likely to be engaging mobile elements they are similarly unlikely to get bogged down in a protracted combat, giving them the ability to punch, scatter/slay an enemy, and regroup again. You wouldn't be going after the undead as the undead are immune to psychology, and thus won't break. Well, unless the undead unit is weak enough that you feel confident in sweeping them completely with that initial charge and maybe a short clash afterwards. Now the enemies that they don't normally face... that's where Lore wise the Bretonnian tactics tend to fail. Then again... it's enemies they don't normally face. Chaos Warriors are unlikely to break, and able to take the charge unless weakened significantly at first they'll grind it out, because that's what they do. And Bretonnians aren't exactly the best at grinding it out. Not against super heavy elite infantry blocks like Chaos Warriors, or Saurus, etc. But against the enemies that they do face normally? They can hit and run quite well. Just keep in mind lore wise they're not running themselves. What they are doing is the Fantasy equivalent of "Tank Shock", hitting something so hard, so fast, that it scatters. And that scattering gives them time to regroup after the initial clash, pick their target, and do it again. Considering the enemies that they normally fight (Orks, Beastmen, Undead, Skaven), they can't "Grind it out" like Chaos, Lizardmen, The Empire, etc. It's feeding into the sort of fighting that those forces want and excel at, pinning you down to where the raw numbers game matters, either in terms of fighting against things like genetically bred super soldier Incan Dinosaurs with more years of military service than your Kingdom has even existed and hides so tough that they can turn aside sword strikes, or just facing the Skaven nightmare of "For every 1 I kill, 3 more take its place!", or Undead Hordes that are just replenishing bodies faster than you can grind through... or heck just the simple fact that Orc Boyz (Feral and Not), are just really, really good at Melee and that's where they want to keep you so they can crump you. The Empire doesn't hit and run with its forces because while yes, they do face some of the same enemies (Orcs and Vampires), they also don't face others (Skaven) and some are more of a "nuisance" than a proper army they face regularly (Beastmen). But more inparticular it's Norscan Raiders and Chaos Warriors that define their tactics. Enemies that don't break right away, and you do have to grind it out against them. Thus why they have a far more static army, with knights trained less to be Linebreakers as it were, and more to be meat grinders. Carroburg Greatswords that never turn their back to the enemy, under any circumstance, and of course the massive gunlines and Halbred/Spear formations. It's just interesting to think about. The Empire is defensive, no question about it. Their entire army and tactica is based on being under siege effectively. That's just how they roll, and they gear their units accordingly and drill them as such. Bretonnia however is not a defensive army. When they fight wars they don't fight from Walls and Towers, fortified positions and wooden palisades and earthworks. They fight crusades and errantry wars. Their culture and faith gives them a sense of superiority (Then again if I can bounce cannonballs off my chest because I pray to a Lady who gives out magic kool-aid to the worthy... I might feel a bit smug too, particularly over those lesser Knights to the Northeast who CAN'T bounce cannonballs when they pray to a Guy with a Hammer...), and they subscribe to that adage "The best defense is a good offense", always keeping enemies off kilter and trying to respond to them.

+Christian Palm Forsgren Trebucheeets and Pegasus knights shrekt walls

+Tom Awesomeface Dont be afraid. This will probably be the free faction that they will give us! 99% chance that this will be the one.

+SteveTheDruid you're right! From the campaign video they released, Brettonia is a fully realized faction that even has at least one legendary lord, so it's most likely that they will give us this one for free as they're already so much done.

+SteveTheDruid You think i'm gonna buy their game? Hah! Not after Chaos, its like a WW2 game and making Germany a buyable DLC faction

+Tom Awesomeface You'll probably get them as mercenaries

Laurence Martin Its a shame what they've done to the game, Martin, it really is...

Agreed with you #skavenfanboyhere

TerranGaming Do you feel like being zerged? #TheSwarmIsComing

no #AllHereticsShallBurn

TerranGaming Let's just stick to the Skaven.

Rush4in why does almost everyone like the skaven that much? actually, they are just oversized junky rats that love to murder each other right.

+side_burned Nah, Bretonnia has superior mounted knights by far. The basic troops though, the Empire is better.

+TemplarX2 In the snuff yes, in the table top no - Bretonnia are underpowered in Warhammer itself. If we based it on lore, Bretonnian knights would most certainly hold their own against Imperial knights and even defeat them, but in a straight up fight with the Empire (who would be using all their advanced weaponry and artillery) the Bretonnians would get completely fucking decimated. I say this with a heavy heart as the Bretonnians are my favourite race in the Warhammer universe.

Jezzails are the skaven equivalent of sniper rifles, but require two skaven to use it.

Tristan Bigornia Ok, thank you

Jakob Schöning It’s basically a long intricate rifle they were originally made by the Arabs and the main purpose of them was just to show off how much money you had similarly to the five fingers brought dagger that the Italians made its purpose is to show off your bling while also being useful as a murder implement or hunting

+Timothy Easton Well in the Total War franchise you are able to dismount mounted units at the start of combat (or at least you could in some games), so maybe in the game you'll have Grail Knights on foot.

+rhemorigher that's actually a decent idea, only problem is that cavalry units are half the standard infantry size, but then again they are elites so should be able to hold their own against most tier 1 and 2 inf

Especially considering how expensive it was for a knight to be fully equipped for war. The Destrier which most think of the warhorse of the knight were too expensive to for the average knight who would had to settle for lesser horses such as a Courser or Rouncey. If the Knight was particularly poor he would of had to go on foot

Your right but the bow helped a lot due to the fear it instilled because of other battles Poitiers for example. In agincourt the French had maybe 8000 men at arms and lost to an army of just about 1000 English men at arms with 5000 archers most untrained and ill equipped with melee weapons and armour

Experienced men-at-arms become yeomen or sergeants and captains for men-at-arms companies

***** yeah the dragon knights are the high elves super heavy shock cavalry, they hit incredibly hard and fast but are almost double the price XD

Thoose are knights, so have only nest hopes :)

I'm surprised the peasants are allowed to possess longbows to begin with,as those would pose a threat to their overlords.

Rellana1 And also rival lords and imperial knights.

Xatalion they'll officially be playable in the campaign at the end of the month

@@InquisitorThomas And getting a dlc

Theron Black Might be good to bog down the peasants with wraiths and other etherials whilst I try to get rid of the knights.

There's a dismount button?

At least in Shogun 2 there is. I suppose there must be in other TW games. But cavalry units are pretty crappy on foot. But bretonnian knights could act as powerful foot soldiers when dismounted.

I never use it but the A.I does in siege battles.

insert boner joke here he said what he'd like to see, not what it is in the lore. Also Byzantine was just Eastern Roman no holy

Okay that was a typo I didn't mean holy romans ill edit that "holy" part out. Thanks for clearing that up I didn't even notice there was a typo there or I woulda fixed it by now. Thanks.!

+Jacob Dischert They were movement 8 as usual but they had a special rule that allowed them to ignore the movement penalty for barding, so they were faster than most other heavy cavalry.

+Baller Larva thanks for clearing that up!

They couldn't utilise the same type of warfare as the Romans as they did not have the industry or the population to make all the stuff or supply the troops. Also medieval armies were not professional. The peasantry were mostly levied militia men and the only real profesional soldiers were of a born caste (knights). The medieval society was entirely different to the Romans and so their armies could not be the same.

ThreeDog You do realize that pike and shots became a thing because of medieval warfare yes And secondarily I’m gonna go ahead and state that a fully armored war horse and they are knight would generally be enough to break the Roman army it’s only for the fact that they would have Sapir your armor weapons in training combined this of course with the fact that they have anti-armor weapons such as the poleax

Si Wi for the Grail knights why don't you have a quest line with the general and his body guard in witch your general starts with questing knights as bodyguards and after he kills a lot powerful dudes or wins a bunch of battles he and his bodyguard become Grail knights? But that shouldn't be the only way to get them either so maybe some sort of quest line or maybe a upgrade system, like if after a unit get X amount of x.p. they become then next tier unit starting from knight errant and ending with Grail knight or maybe like what you said you can only have 2 or 3 of them witch is probably the most likely thing that's going to happen

Sir Dude Well in my vision of Wh TW (read here more if you want to: forums.totalwar.com/showthread.php/140687-My-Personal-vision-for-a-Warhammer-Total-War) there are no bodyguard units, but you do it like in the Tabletop and chose which unit a chars joins. Overall I do like your idea (upgrading units for exp, should be a thing anyway...) as well as the quest reward, but still I would say that this unit is so important for the Bretonian army (since what else does really hurt from them? Compare to let's say big daemons), I think excess should be reliable.

Si Wi I sorry man but are you a native English speaker?

Sir Dude Enope (sorry), is something in particular you don't understand and I shall try to make clearer?

Si Wi no i can put the missing pieces together but i think you're just missing a couple words here and there and it makes it a little hard read to but i'm no English teacher! :D

+Laurence Martin where there any dismounted knights in the fluff?

+khalid bin ghaith Nope, but it's almost guaranteed they'll make them in Total War because cavalry is almost always useless XD except in Attila when it was a lil broken

Laurence Martin I hope they make the cavalry good here since i want to use some imperial knights

+khalid bin ghaith Well if it's about as good as it was in Rome 2 then sure cavalry will be handy but unless they go full Attila and make it so the only thing you can't the front of with melee cav is pikes then I'd expect it'd only be helpful on your flanks for killing their cav and then acting out rear charges.

well roman times werent the age of cavalry so i hope they emphasize more on cavalry here cuz those demigryphons are looking damn sexy

Not anymore, CA confirms they offcially implemented the Lance Formation to Bretonnian Knights for the Free-DLC of Bretonnia that's coming out in the 28th. Also Green Knight is confirmed a Legendary Hero.

I agree, Men at Arms can actually be a pretty solid unit, they're as well equipped as Imperial soldiers when it comes to armour and weaponry, the voulges they carry are pretty nasty and like you said, their shields are also very effective, on the tabletop all shields are the same but in a total war game I can easily imagine them offering more protection than the ones used by orcs or Imperial swordsmen. The lore talks about them forming huge, Roman style shield walls to hold the enemy down whilst the knights countercharge them, since despite what a lot of sources say, the main bulk of a Bretonnian army will be made up of peasant soldiers. They're very easy to underestimate too, and you can catch a lot of foes off guard by supporting them with magic.

+Aldous Jose A. Castro Not quite, 90% taxes is absolutely insane. Medieval serfs paid around 25%. There is no way a tax rate of 90% could be sustained without having the country in a permanent state of rebellion or everybody simply leaving. Low tech agriculture does not allow people to produce 10 times what they need to survive.

Good joke, these guys have a decent army. I'd say the tomb kings are pretty lame

Not worst since they still have so many knights.

actually the tomb kings are pretty bad ass I'd say the beastman army is pretty lame

Peasants are Basically slaves to the Lord who owns the land they work simple

Its almost identical to our medieval feudal society. And that made alot of sense.

Ewan Brain it's exagerrated to a pretty insane degree though