Appreciate the kind words. And your assessment of the situation is a good one: the protective case is like an airbag - hopefully you'll never need it. But in the rare cases when you do, it's a potential life saver. The ZARGES cases have rubber seals inside the lid so they achieve water protection IP ratings. This will likely give you the flexibility to squeeze in a cable for charging with lid closed. If not, I'd drill a small hole through the rear wall somewhere close to one of the upper corners. Here you could either use a rubber grommet and run the charging cable through, or you could permanently install a plug: on the inside it is connected to the front end of your charging cable, on the outside you'd simply plug the "remainder" (= charger and first half of the charging cable). Because the ZARGES has the Cirrux cushions inside, these will still "seal" the small hole from the outside in case of thermal runaway inside the case; either way, unless there's something flamable right behind the case, it shouldn't be a problem and will elegantly solve your charging needs. On the 2nd part of the series, there is a lengthy thread where someone called ZARGES, and while less professional their standard case will still provide great protection when you line the inside with plaster board; could be a more budget alternative. Maybe check out that conversation.

Thanks we will look into these possibilities!

@@HeliGraphix I emailed Zarges to ask about it and this is the reply I got: "We are often faced with this question and our research suggest that charging within the case could actually initiate a thermal catastrophe. "The batteries are best stored in the case at 30% state of charge, but this is not required. Anytime the batteries are charging they should be monitored. "To clarify, you can certainly charge in the case with the lid open, but as far as a solution fully integrated with a charger etc… we have not developed a solution for this yet."

@@amyoleary484 This is a "legal" reply as they haven't officially tested this solution. Surely you will charge with the lid closed, that is the whole idea of it 🙂 As said before, one ot the proposed solutions should work for you.

I’m too risk-averse to try that! I think we’ll use the BAT-safes outdoors when possible, and away from anything that burns when indoors. Thanks for your guidance.

Good question. In this prototype box yes, in the production version not. The latter has compartments and the fire will not spread from one compartment to another (however all batteries within one and the same compartment are of course affected). They have a video online where they explain such details about the product. Our testing footage is even part of it.

Nomex blanket may work

Actually no, never heard of these - thanks for the heads up! This sounds like it could work.

One was the Li-Ion Guard by Genius (massive though, like a waste bin). The other one I don't remember the name right now but was a plastic box with a double-wall, inside of which were pyro bubbles; not sure how well this one would have worked under prolonged real-life use, depending on the application.

Same here. I'm now using 2x Zarges lithium battery box and they swallow all my many lipos. This is as safe as it gets, however I agree the boxes are a bit bulky. Zarges do offer custom sizes which is great but I'd prefer if by "default" they also offered a somewhat smaller version which is better for transport. By far not as small as the BAT-Safe but also not as big as their standard battery box. That would be ideal. Someone should pitch this idea to them. Many would love it!

⬆My channel has a new lithium technology, It will need steel shields for some scenarios!!!

In this prototype version of the Battery Box I guess it was vermiculite. They changed it in the production version, there it is a much fluffier, wool-like material in cushion form. You can see it in the video footage I borrowed from their info video (it's in their channel). I think it was a good move as it will "encase" the batteries better, seal openings and also damp rough handling. As stated previously I'm using two of their production versions for all my batteries. Luckily no fire test yet .....

​@@HeliGraphix "much fluffier, wool-like material" most likely something like Cerachem 2600°f Thermal Ceramic wool.

@@anned8634 I presume you could do similar with rock wool insulation. It's just rock.

​@@fretbuzzlymaybe a good idea?! I'm thinking of a DIY solution. also wondering about adding in sodium bicarbonate somehow - which releases a lot of Co2 when heated. I believe this is used in fire extinguishers for that reason, this could reduce ignition of the combustible vapour

There is a longer thread on such topics in the comments section of part 2. Someone there even called ZARGES and asked them a bunch of questions. You may want to check it out and can also ask one of the guys who posted there what their solutions looks like. By design the ZARGES Battery-Safe is for storage and even certified for transportation, but home-made solutions for charging should be possible. Also, it should be possible to close the lid while a cable goes through - there should be just enough gap and a rubber seal so that a cable could fit through. But again, check out that other thread I mentioned, to see what the guys there did.

@@HeliGraphix thanks, I will!

That should be fine - nominal voltage of a Li-Polymer pouch battery is 3.7 V/cell, i.e. 11.1 V for your 3s pack. Fully charged, depending on the exact cell chemistry, your pack will be 4.2 V/cell, i.e. 12.6 V in total. Please note that storing the pack fully charged will shorten its life time; same when storing it at elevated temperatures. Therefore, ideally only charge shortly before usage - this will also give you the best power. Ideal storage is 3.6 - 3.8 V/cell, however for long-term storage you should charge to 3.9 V/cell because any battery will self-discharge, and deep discharge to around 3.2 V/cell or lower will harm it (below a certain point it can even reverse its polarity). Thus starting with a somewhat higher initial voltage for longer-term storage is advisable; then you only need to check/recharge a bit every 6-9 months.

@@HeliGraphix thanks for this

As they say: most important thing, if you go down you go down swinging ... :-D

hahaha.... please let me know where you live... Seriously though, I'm in a condo in an urban area, and anything is possible so I just try to minimize the risk. I once travelled over the ocean wearing a swollen gen 1 apple watch battery strapped to my wrist.... that I'd cluelessly worn in the swollen state for a week, because I was too busy to google, "what's going on, and should I be concerned". Nice way to be for 9h in an environment with continuous changes in pressure, and nowhere to go.

​@@lyndagabriel6539 I'm surprised not more accidents happen due to those lithium batteries ..or they do - and we just don't hear about them..

Depending on the cell chemistry, the gases may be very toxic. On airplanes, the passenger and cargo bays are separated, though - meaning it should not be possible for any fumes of a lipo fire to reach passengers.

The ZARGES box is meanwhile 3rd party certified for 1000+ Wh. You won't explode it :)

One battery per box? These are like a few hundred dollars per box, aren't they?

@@InvisiMan2006 yes but if one goes boom it will not take others with it.

The final production version has compartments. According to the specs the fire won't affect the adjacent compartments, at least not to a degree where the other batteries will go off, too. Since the cases will handle e-bike batteries of several hundred Wh it should easily also work even for large RC batteries. I meanwhile own two of them and store many lipos in there. Luckily I cannot say anything more specific at this point (and hopefully it'll stay this way).

@@HeliGraphix Anyway I have giant batteries that I can only fit 2 of them in the big zarges box

OK wow, they must be real big then. What are they for and what are the ratings?

By being brave 😜

The bag will not filter anything. How well the filtering with the BAT-Safe works is a good question. It certainly is better than no filtering. If the filtering is enough to really remove all toxic gases (which will also depend on the cell chemistry) is up for debate - chances are that this is not the case. So after any fire incident, you need to make sure that the affected area is well ventilated. It may take several weeks until the smell is really gone.

I have to use Google the same way you do .... zargesusa.com/pages/liion-batteries

and zargesusa.com/products/batterysafe You need to check which variant is the one you need. Quality is really fantastic, it is 3rd party verfied ratings (so what they claim is true), but price tag is quite something.

yes.. combustible vapour.. I'm thinking of screwing a water proof box to our garden wall.. to get at least a few meters distance from any building and flammable objects..

​@@laus9953the problem is not so much combustible, INCREDIBLY POISONOUS AND TOXIC. You will pass out in a closed room lithium fire and maybe not wake up in time to exit. Yes the vapors are combustible, but the volume of toxic smoke is immense.

In a nutshell, yes. However, they should not get wet. Plus, you should warm them up before use as otherwise they might get damaged. Also, you should never charge lithium batteries when they're really cold (typically below 0 deg. celsius) as this may cause formation of dendrites in the cells that may punch through the separator material. The result would be an internal short circuit and the cell may - as a worst case - go off at a *later* point in time unexpectedly.

@@HeliGraphix Thank you for this reply. I don't have a basement or garage with concrete. I have an ammo box and a shed. That'll have to do I suppose. 👍

Well, that would then be a container I guess 🙂

No kidding. My mom's friend lost their entire garage due to Tesla fire in it. Firefighters can't even put out a fire that intense chemically. Look up Tesla factory fires, the fire department just has to let them burn when there is that much stored chemical energy. Not to mention you can't get anywhere near it.

This would work from a safety standpoint, but I doubt it's a practical storage. Lots of dust/dirt and same procedure time and again.

Good decision! Many of us used to store them in the bags until realizing these do not provide a suitable protection. The bags should be banned from sale.

@@HeliGraphix Yep they should. New setup is: Lipos in bags, inside ammo cans with the rear section of the seal by the hinge cut out, inside a metal cabinet. Short of storing in a concrete bunker I should be good to go.

As said in an earlier comment, it was the only way I managed to get this work wrapped up, otherwise I'd probably never haven found the time to finish and publish it. I've got great and very interesting newer footage, and it's lying around for 2 years ...

As said in the video, there are cases (with small batteries) where they worked, but you cannot rely on that if you want to be safe.

Check out the thread on the other video, someone called Zarges USA for a more budget solution (but even the expensive is not 1k).

As title and thumbnail says, this part 3 of 3 is about the box. Watch part 1, it's about the bag.

Not sure if maybe you missed the answer to your same question on the last video. For your convenience here it is once more. Hope it helps: "The thermal runaway unfortunately works its way to disaster state without outside air. The seal will cause even more ballooning of the ammo box (you see it clearly in the video despite the real thick metal walls), eventually it will burst somewhere with a sharp fire jet or worse. It definitely won't stop the process. Your thought is a good one, but rest assured the seal will not stop anything. You'll also see that in the next video with the professional industrial solution; lid with seal closed, same reaction (but different effect due to different case design)."

Wrong! A lot of things burn without oxygen. And the ammo can with the seal will simply explode.

Well Siegfried Polypus. You can have a chemical reaction without oxygen but you have to have oxygen for a fire. Better google it before you make yourself look any more ignorant.

I'm under the impression that a burning li-ion cell doesn't require external oxygen.

Doesn't need external oxygen to start a chemical reaction but does require oxygen for fire. Light something on fire put it in a jar with a lid it will go out. Halon fire suppression systems used in computer battery rooms remove all oxygen from the air.