i guess the russians will practice it a lot maybe japan too but no other countrys :)

I think it will depend on ISU :) If the jumps continue to be a huge source of points, more athletes will focus on them

well figure skating is firstly sport and ability to make multirotated jumps is a way to show it and to evaluate sportsman's performance. Triples can be done by many, but if a person can do quads why should you stop him and say: "No, don't do quads, just do triples like thousands". Look how figure skating started with no more than doubles and where it is now

i can't imagine quads becoming common in ladies - at least not for long. with these girls starting quads as 11-12 yo, we're just not going to have competitive ladies over the age of 16 at major championships. it's not sustainable, i could see ISU raising the age for sr and splitting jrs into two age groups - just for safety if nothing else.

When quintuples become routine jumps the quads will go down

they can stop a galloping horse and enter a burning house.

Ice skating is very important to us :>

coaches Eteri Tutberidze and Professor Mishin know how to teach how to jump a Quad!!!

@@archimedespalimpsest1697 exactly!!!

hopefully she’ll be able to manage landing 3Axel

It's scary though. It shows how much force that the skaters must take to land those quads. Landing quads take tolls on the body so hopefully those young ladies can survive puberty and live a healthy adult life after retirement.

Yohanes K tes i think that’s why they plan on retiring by the time they’re 20

Well most of the time they don’t do it correctly even tho it looks pleasing and I agree I love the sound but I wish they would do it right and hopefully this won’t affect them too much in the future sry my comment is all over the place

Mahathi Muthiah I agree! But Kamila and Trusovas quads are technically not that bad

I personally don't like the look of them. The skater has to spin so tight and fast. In fact I think it's very unsatisfying to watch.

Only she doesn’t land with her back straight

@@zubrowska9017 Do you want her to overburden her joints? She jumps more quads than anyone on a daily basis.

Somehow an under rotated jump that has a fall gets deducted less than a full jump with a fall ISU EXPLAIN

@ً alexandra

Yes, noticed it 💖 She now has to work on getting speed before the entry.

Highly doubt it

@@erkeasx6217 well she has

@@trusobot no, she hasnt. She hasnt gotten through puberty yet. So she will most likely, lose it unfortunately

@@francesatea5796 ye she has not fully but almost and mostly

@@trusobot i disagree. Despite her age she doesn’t appear to be going through it yet. I believe shes starting to, but i doubt shes anywhere near half way through or completely through it

Fair point. The forces from landing a jump are often five to eight times the athlete’s body weight. That’s a lot. I worry about an athlete’s joints and connective tissue long term. Perhaps advances in technology should be applied to routine testing (imaging, ultrasound, etc) of their joints... & any undesirable changes can be confronted early and proactively before real or irreversible problems develop. It’s a pet peeve of mine when athletes’ bodies are destroyed as a result of their sport - as I feel guilty and partly responsible for having partaken of the spectacle that caused the damage. Anything that prevents or mitigates that possibility is an improvement as far as I’m concerned. Even if the improvement is unseen to fans and judges as far as competition goes. I think the organizations that certify and regulate sport- the ISU, in this case- should ALWAYS be open to incorporating changes that will make their athletes safer.

I’ve watched a couple analysis videos so I’m in no way an expert, but it seems like several of the girls, especially the ones trained in Russia, aren’t training for good technique. Instead, they try to have a really low weight to get height and slightly pre-rotate or under-rotate their jumps, in a way that the judges won’t see (or at least pretend to not see, depending on who you ask). That’s why all the students of Eteri Tutberidze, the coach of many of the world champion Russian skaters, don’t skate past the age of 18. The way that they’re jumping puts so much pressure on their bodies that they literally can’t after 18, unless they switch coaches before their “expiration date”. I always thought that it was weird that Russia has so many champions in women’s skating and then they just disappear after like two years, and apparently that’s why.

totally valid concern, and i think we'll start to see the effects many quads per program have on athletes bodies in a couple of years, for women as well as men. some answer might be found in pairs ladies? i wonder if the forces in a throw jump would be relevant to singles doing regular quads. but with the way eteri "trains" and pumps and dumps her students, none of the girls in this video will be anywhere near competition by then 🥴 as the above comment mentions, eteri's girls have an expiry date in their late teens, which means theyre only expected to be on top of the world for a season or two. so i highly doubt their training is focused on longevity and good technique. those 11 year olds only need to burn bright for three or four years, not ten like most other federations might hope for. so one can imagine what physical shortcuts that timeline might require.. its not a coincidence that the only russian ladies from the last couple years with any amount of staying power do not train under eteri

They are having shows in the russian tv after ice skating or other performances or they do one or two diploms after ice skating,so they are not forgotten.I don't know what is the differences between russian and other coaches.

It's only the lutz and flips the 11 year old zhilina can jump a textbook quad lutz even today. She been jumping it for 3 years but never attempted it in comp sadly

Thanks for the suggestion, that's definitely a video I will work on!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISU_Judging_System Actual GOE table: www.isu.org/figure-skating/rules/fsk-communications/24331-2323-sp-sov-changes-for-season-2020-21/file check it

GOE means grade of execution. The judges add or detract points to a jump depending on how well it is done. PCS means Performance component scores, which deals with things like skating skills, transitions, choreography and interpretation of a program

@@MsLeLaNayChannel Communication 2323 (together with 2324) were revoked (which is fantastic :), those were stupid changes), so 2253 and 2254 are still in effect: www.isu.org/inside-isu/isu-communications/communications/21210-2253-s-p-sov-2019-20/file www.isu.org/inside-isu/isu-communications/communications/21211-2254-s-p-levels-of-difficulty-and-guidelines-for-marking-goe-2019-20/file

@Iris zhang In figure skating there is TES (technical element score) and PCS (program component score). For start, forget PCS. In single skating elements are jumps, spins and step sequence (plus choreo sequence, but forget it now as well). Every element has its BV=base value (e.g. triple Lutz - 3Lz - has BV=5.9) which is corrected in program by the judges according to how well executed the element is. That's GOE (Grade of Execution). Basically there is a grade from -5 to +5, every point corresponds to 10 % of the BV of the element (there are rules, so called "bullets", what the elements have to comply to get this or that value from the judges and also list of errors and the deductions for them). So let's say that a skater jumps 3Lz relatively well and receives all +2 from the judges (20 % of the BV). Than the skater receives 5,9+(2x0.59)=7.08. That's just the basics, but I think you will get the rest soon, start with the documents linked in this thread.

All the full blade and prerotation, it looks so ugly.

*Snort* what about Akatievas

@@abc_7717 your lying mug loks much uglier

This video is on quads jumped this season only. The video only showed clips of the skaters in past seasons as background info. Lizbeth was injured this season thus she wasn’t included.

Just stop watching figure skating in slomo.

yet those jumps received +3 goes 🤢🤮

"Prerotation" is not called in current rules, no matter what brainless idiots like "koola" says.

@@spicy_kitty7983 I think it's fair to respect actual rules, since they are same for all skaters. It's crazy when some fans say something like "Poor Polina/Yuna/Tomoe, she has little underrotation, but she jump lutz with zero prerotation!".. I mean, who cares, do the opposite! Prerotation ALWAYS was unlimited, but quads in ladies FS are new. Maybe, because even prerotation doesn't make jumps easy? Shoma or Lilibeth, they used to struggle even with so-sayed prerotated quads. If quads would be so easy to "cheat", Medvedeva would be jumping quads since 2018.

do you realise this is the first generation that lands quads and competes them consistently? It takes time to develop and adapt the technique. These ladies are making history, while you're whining to the screen.

@@feyanormorfol2457 i agree that koola isn't the best youtuber for skating, but imo prerotation is still an issue. with prerotation in the technique of your jumps, it'll be harder to maintain that jump once you grow or hit puberty :/

@@vanessazhang1961 why do you think that? It seems that all skaters have issues with their jumps after 20. Just because of chronical injures and chronical pressure. Yuna lost her 3Lo, Tsurskaia begun to pop her jumps... Prerotation always was unlimited. It's just Koola who was pissed off Medvedeva and her scores. Koola's fake analyzing video is the same like if some Lipnitskaia fan would stand with "Onlly Julia and Sasha Cohen used to have true I-spin with perfect split position!!!.."

just try to recall the first male quad jumpers. Were they as nice and smooth as quads these days?

Most of them look forced. It's impressive if they can really do them well, but otherwise it detracts from the beauty of their skating.

do you see the pre-rotation on Sasha Trusova’s quad flip (slo-mo at 6:30 ) or is that just me??? edit: spelling error

i wouldnt say perfectly* but her quad toes and quad sals are all the legit jumps but she did change technique when she changed coaches

Thank you Tuktamysheva✨

That’s the thing-many of them grow and now they CANT do them

Only Tuktamysheva's 4T in practice was smaller. But both skaters rotate fast so they don't need as much height.

better than sherbakova but not textbook

Pre-rotated and under-rotated. Hardly 'clean' as they call it.

@@alessandroaiello4778 Quite opposite. Liu does both UR and PR. Scherbakova at worst does only excessive PR. The only minimal PR quad is 4T of Trusova

@@alessandroaiello4778 Anna has PR on her 4Lz and sometimes flat edge, but her 4Lz is also the biggest (more than Trusova's) and has the best air position. Also best landing, it's light with flow and no big "clunk" that is bad for the knees - something both Trusova and Liu have.

Helen Anna does not have a bigger lutz than Trusova. It is of course easier for Anna to land effortlessly and jump high when she leaves the ice on a flat edge, in comparison to Trusova who leaves the ice on a deep outside edge. You can only compare the jump effortlessness and height between the two of them when Anna is able to do a proper deep outside lutz like Trusova.

I thought I was the only one!!

I cannot jump at all .....but I'm old 😂😂😂😂

^^ this

its a difficult jump to execute even with a cheated take off you could underrotate it

Well, Yuzu landed quints in a harness.....but what cannot Yuzu do ☺

the cleanly landed quad toeloopsand quad salchows are legit

Great for you thee 12 yo girls are damaging their bodies

I'm sixteen and I can't even stand on ice, you're not that bad

@ how

@@myz1c835 malnutrition, dehydration, insane levels of physical stress required to do quads. Many training and preforming while injured. At least according to their interviews. pictures.

DEFINITELY. Some people still think a quad loop is easier than quad lutz and quad flip, hence shouldnt have a raise in base value. Zzz

The typical understanding is that the hardest quads are lutz and flip. HOWEVER, these girls are doing cheated takeoff which makes the hardest quads into the easiest quads. There is a reason why some of these girls can do 4Lz, but cannot do 4T, is the cheated takeoff. Look at their 4Lz and 4F in slowmotion, in these jumps you are supposed to takeoff from the toe pick, but they fake the toepick and keep the blade on the ice, turning the jump into an edge jump. None of these girls have the explosive power to pull off a legit 4Lz, compare their Lutz with a legitimate one from Nathan Chen or Jin Boyang. Not at all the same jump. ISU needs to crack down on these fake toe jumps and clarify in the rule books how these should be called, but they wont because the russian skating federation has too much pull and at the moment their girls are the biggest beneficiaries of this.

I'd say quad axel is the most difficult one. As for legit 4Lz -- I don't see how Trusova's ones are much more illegitimate than an average one by Nathan Chen or Jin Boyang. Yeah, perhaps not as good as their best ones... but again, her 4Lz is like the 3rd quad in her program; come on.

Archimedes Palimpsest yes, i agree with the quad axel, but nobody landed it yet

@@archimedespalimpsest1697 Obviously the 4A is hardest, thats not even up for debate. But the 4A never enters these discussions as it has never been done and nobody knows whether it can even be done in the first place. With regards to Trusova's 4Lz. They are not toe jumps, it is completely obvious that they are not Lutz's. You can absolutely not compare it with Nathan. Nathan has the proper technique, he takes off from the toe pick, his 4Lz has deep outside edge and uses the toe pick to propel into the air. Trusova doesnt propel with the toe pick, she fakes the toe pick, but keeps the blade on ice and turns the jump into an edge jump. Most Eteri skaters use this cheated technique and Alysa Liu does this also. When all these girls start learning 4Lz as their first quad it is obvious that this cannot be legitimate! It is complete fantasy to believe these jumps are proper, any slowmotion clip shows otherwise. Just watch in this very video the jump starting at 6:29, toe pick at 6:31, yet full blade is on the ice at 6:32 and she finally takes off at 6:33

Only Lz and F must have less than 90 degres PR. That's said, the less PR on all jumps, the better.

even her triples shouldn’t be considered as triples

Kat Ao Tai obviously not I could give you an entire list of all of her mistakes and you definitely don’t have to be a judge to notice these

< means underrotated. Underrotated jumps are jumps that are missing a rotation of 1/4 to 1/2.

I wouldn't say it's missing 1/2 a rotation on the landing. I agree with tech caller

It was called < and it's correct to me.

It was discussed many times before: there are no such mistakes as "full-blade assist" and "prerotation" in official rules. They exist only in Koola's imagination.

@@feyanormorfol2457 Apparently you havn't seen the rules update. Full blade assist IS now in the rules!

@@benbailey159bb not anymore they did go back to old rules this week i think

@@benbailey159bb it WAS in the rule. However any definition of what is full-blade assist wasn't given. Judging by the name only - it should mean when skater uses full-blade at take-off. However, I have never seen such a case - even in edge jumps skaters uses half-blade or 3/4 blade at worst. It's impossible to take-off when all of a blade's surface touches the ice. So what ISU officials meant by that - remains a mystery.

@@feyanormorfol2457 there's no PR ri3le in the part of the rules that deals with "take off", although there's mention of toe and axel. On the other hand their videos showing how to execute a jump shows Lz and F are the 2 jumps which needed to be executed with less than 90 degres PR. I agree judges don't penalise excessive PR, but well, they should. KK was mean and she only went after Zhenya because she breaked Yuna Kim records with a wrong-edge Lz thst was never called. But it's not Zhenya fault.

Maybe you just don’t know what you’re talking about.

Maybe it's coz they all lack a good running edge out of their quads.

Agreed. Quads always look strained and painful but at the same time unimpressive somehow. I honestly don't see any beauty in them. A clean triple performed by a tall, mature skater is SO much more beautiful and impressive.

Too much PR, yes

Again. All that "prerotation" and "full-blade-assist" are nonexistent mistakes thal live only in koola-like bot's imagination.

@@feyanormorfol2457 I mean...pre-rotation and full-blade assistance for what is supposed to be a toe-pick assisted jump with minimal pre-rotation is a mistake, and it is considered poor technique. It's just that the judging system has no rule against pre-rotation, so there isn't really a way for judges to penalize skaters for using improper technique like this.

@@taylorlefevre3491 no special rules for calls for prerotation - so prerotation is not a mistake. End of the story.

@@feyanormorfol2457 “A clear forward (backward for Axel type jump) take-off will be considered as a downgraded jump. The toe loop is the most commonly cheated on take-off jump. The TP may only watch the replay in regular speed to determine the cheat and downgrade on the take-off (more often in combinations or sequences).” That was from the ISU technical handbook. There is a rule, but it generally isn't applied because it's hard to see pre-rotation without using slow motion, which the technical panel isn't allowed to use. That's why people get so mad about this issue, because it is a mistake, the skaters just aren't being penalized for it so they see no reason to have to fix their technique. I simply believe that a skater who uses only the toe-pick and has minimal prerotation should be awarded higher GOE than a skater who has excessive pre-rotation and uses a full-blade take-off, but unfortunately this just isn't happening under the current judging system.

and what will happen when those girls are 90 years old? they all gonna die and not will be able to land those jumps at all. what a shame, it's all worthless. but i must admit, it's hilarious when you call trusova a little girl, while kihira suddenly becomes a big girl. the same kihira who is 153 cm high and 40 kg heavy, and who is looking like a midget next to trusova. btw kihira has so much quad power that she had landed zero fully rotated quads at international competitions. trully a jumping guru with a lots of quad skills.

@@alexanderbakulin8836 it seems like a bad take to equate a 20 year old to a 90 year old. 90 year olds have 10-20 years ahead of them if they are lucky. 20 year olds are so young they can't even legally rent a car on their own in some places. How much would it suck to train your entire childhood away and when you finally reach the age to be able to legally have complete control over decisions of money, health, and employment to discover that the way you trained means your injuries or techniques can't do the one thing you spent all your life training to do? And you still have 80 years left of adulthood before you die of old age. I personally would feel a bit used. Back in the 1990s many of the women having olympic skating carriers retired around mid 20s some much later. That's about 5 more years to be able to make sure you aren't being fleeced by your coach or family. 5 more years for fans to follow you on your journey, which is what draws a lot of people to the sport. One more Olympics shot but this time as an adult. It's also a decent amount of time to start thinking and preparing for life outside of skating as an adult rather than as a teenager.

@@LC-sc3en who are you talking about? at the age of 17 (will be 18 in a couple of months) sasha trusova has the biggest jumping arsenal in the world, she didn't lost a thing, her jumping power only get stronger over the years, she learns new jumps every year and gets more consistent, she can do elements that 99% of elite men skaters can't. while when she was a little girl, doing quads at 13, the prophets like you were saying that she will lose everything as soon as she grows. guess what. she's not "a little girl" anymore. she's taller than all of japanese top skaters, all of korean top skaters, and most of US top skaters (excluding bradie tennell). she's 166 cm high (5.5) and full of muscles. rikia kihira at her 20 has a body of 12 yo child, which is not unsual for an asian, and that's why asians are advantageous at this sport, although nobody talks about that, and not trying to restrict asians from competitions, they are only talking about "age". kihira is tiny and thin, and unlike trusova don't resembeles athlete at all. her skating is childish as well as her technique. no to mention that she hasn't competed in a year, she's badly injured (and was suffered from injuries her entire career) and i doubt that we will ever see her on the ice again. it seems like her career has ended at 19.

@@alexanderbakulin8836 hmm for short careers ended before adulthood? Let's see there's Sotnikova last competed in 2015 when she was 18 due to chronic back injuries and officially retired in 2020 saying "I’m done with professional sport, that’s for sure, because at the moment I want to be healthy, happy,” Zagitova, left December 2019 at 17, Lipnitskaya retired at 19 due to struggles with Anorexia brought on by training. Elizabet Tursynbaeva retired at 20 due to chronic back injury Medvedeva retired at 22 due to a chronic back injury. Rafael Arutyunyan, coach of Olympic men’s champion Nathan Chen, likened Russian skaters with short careers to single-use coffee cups in a 2020 interview with a Russian sports website. "In young bodies, bones are not formed. If you do so many quads, they get damaged..."

@@LC-sc3en None of those ladies, except Tursynbaeva, were doing quads. So your argument has nothing in relation to the theme that we are talking about. As of Tursynbaeva, she spent 70% of her career in Canada, had started to jump quads, and got her chronic back injury, under "good" canadian coach Brian Orser, who is very vocal about longievity in the sport, just like Raf, although never coached a female athlete for a succesful long career (his only succesful student Yuna Kim left him at the age of 19, while Tursynbaeva and Medvedeva got even more injured, and reitired soon after)