I do have to give credit to the Tornado team for figuring out how to battle with Razer. However, I'm very surprised that the robots don't have to fit within a certain footprint that would allow them to be put in the pit.

I think this may have been the first “sport” upset that affected me as a child. I couldn’t believe Razer lost haha

The Tornado guys are so fucking petty 😂 I love how by the 5th battle they're still arguing, and Razers like "here, take the trophy. I've got like 20 of these."

Tornado said at the end of fight #5 "You're in the pit when all 4 tyres are over" In fight #4 that happened, all 4 Tornado tyres were over the pit and they still claimed the win. Tornado are bad losers and bad winners. I'm amazed that the rules allowed them to do what they did.

Anyone noticed that Jonathan Pearce made a mistake in the second fight? 9:55 "They simply cannot get that 2000RPM spinning disc into play!" And yet Tornado had it's scoop on. Not the disc. Besides that, this video was great. Despite the controversy regarding the infamous "Tornado Frame", seeing all of their fights one after the other really shows off the rivalry between the two teams. As far as I know, the only other robot that was considered to be a rival to Razer was Pussycat. And it only got the chance to fight Razer twice.

God I forgot how much I hated tornado for that frame!

Funny how in the 4th clip that they were declared "in the pit" yet win, yet in the 5th clip reiterated that if they were "in or over the pit, they lose"

The Chad tornado has always been a favorite just mean machine that hits hard with what ever it can always enjoy there fights.

We were going for the transmition ,we got it in the end 🤣

JESUS class sportsmanship

Tornado had to cheat and exploit the rules to beat razor it was embarrassing. Razor was amazing and easily the best robot that's ever been on robot wars .

Razor should have just kept him over the flame pit when he had him suspended. Although technically weren't tornado immobile when they over the pit ? They couldn't go anywhere ?

Apparently the judges thought Tornado's weapon motor was Razer's tire.

For those who feel the need to constantly tell people supporting Razer that Tornado didn't cheat, just stop. You're so pedantic with the definition of cheating that you're missing the point. No, Tornado didn't cheat as what they did was within the rules. But rules aren't automatically justified just by the fact they exist, and in this case they were an inconsistent mess that allowed for Team Tornado to get away with their cheap, unfair and unsporting tactics to steal victory from the real deserving competitor. I'll explain... Firstly, the judges saw how unfairly protective Tornado's anti-spinner was for specific use against Hypno-Disc and they banned it, yet they wouldn't do the same with the anti-crusher because the latter had a moving weapon on it. Why? So what if the device has a moving weapon on it? If your robot is unfairly modified to render a specific opponent's attack methods useless, it should never be allowed whether it has moving weaponry or not. And I don't want anyone pointing out the significant damage Razer was able to cause even without preparation of its own in the International Championship - that's just a lucky convenience that wasn't foreseen and not a valid excuse. Nor is it an excuse that the modifications were declared in advance - it doesn't make the idea any more moral. Nor is it an excuse that Razer went along with all this with adaptations of their own. They felt they had to because of a situation that Team Tornado and the officials were responsible for in the first place. Also, Tornado's anti-(insert specific robot's name) devices ARE NOT the same as srimechs, side-skirts or entanglement weaponry. Those are for use against ALL OPPONENTS, or at least all of a certain type. They're not designed for an unfair amount of protection from a specific opponent. And I don't want any arguments that Tornado couldn't have possibly defeated Razer without its anti-crusher. Tazbot, Rhino, Voltarc, Chaos 2, Behemoth, Pussycat, Attila the Drum, Gemini, Firestorm, Cyrax (a rookie robot that only appeared in its Heat of Series 6) and 13 Black didn't need to be unfairly modified to show they had what it took to beat Razer, so Team Tornado had no excuse not to work on out-driving Razer to make proper use of either its cutting disc or wedge. Secondly, what is the point of the pit being in the arena if competitors are allowed to be big enough to prevent going in? Yes, you could still be counted as pitted by being placed over it (which I'll touch more upon in the next point) or being stuck on the edge (like with The Morgue in Series 4), but that's just something to fall back on (no pun intended) in case for some _unexpected_ reason the robot won't fit. The pit's designed for robots to be dumped down into it, not to be strategically placed on top. The latter's what the grilles in Series 1 were for. Thirdly, Razer DID have Tornado over the pit by all four of its wheels! You can blatantly see it at 21:20, and that should've been a loss for Tornado right there. But it wasn't, because Razer couldn't detach itself and drive away. Again, why? I understand the rule of not immobilising your opponent simply by pinning it anywhere in the arena, as that'd be too easy and you can't always tell if a robot can escape under its own power or not. But whether Razer was holding on to Tornado or not at 21:20, the latter blatantly couldn't have possibly escaped that dead spot under its own power. Regarding Simon Scott and Vincent Blood's decision to withdraw for Tornado to take their place in the final of the European Championship, I'll never agree with that either. Look, I understand they were just being fair by admitting to their immobilisation. In fact, it's even more surprising to me that Razer got the win when Blood once said himself in one of these comment sections that it was more than half the entire unedited battle that Razer was immobile, yet _still_ the officials never seemed to notice and gave it to Razer regardless. However (and this also goes for the complaints of the House Robots attacking Tornado in the International Championship when it was Razer that got pushed into the CPZs), why should anyone play fair with Team Tornado when they certainly weren't doing so themselves with their cowardly modifications? The team were such hypocrites to complain about unfairness, and additionally so in the European Championship when (according to Andrew Marchant) they apparently weren't all that bothered about winning that time. Also, even though I admit this is a personal problem of mine, I don't like it when robots only win because of a technicality when it was their opponent that did the real work to win, which is why I hated it when Spikasaurus won the Northern Annihilator for no other reason than the fact Dominator 2 just died out on its own despite doing all the work. Here was a good chance to avoid this cheapness, but no. Razer withdrawing wasn't like the time Ultor did for Big Brother in Series 3. The difference there is that Big Brother _was_ objectively the better robot in that fight despite the damage it took. And yes, apparently the Ultor team had to get out of the competition anyway because they only made themselves available for their Heat, not expecting to win it and therefore not taking the competition too seriously. But conveniently, they had a genuine cover-up for this in that Big Brother was the better in the fight and should've been given the decision. Tornado in the European Championship was not the better in the fight. It got one push on Razer and got dominated for the rest of the bout. Oh well, at least Razer still won that last battle. Make no mistake from what Team Razer said - the official decision went to Razer and was never reversed, and Tornado going through just because Razer withdrew without obligation isn't the same as winning. Razer won and deservedly so. No, it wasn't counted as immobile, but the only reason Razer's motors burnt out was because of exertion against a device that never should've morally been allowed in the first place. One last thing - anyone who's thinking of replying to me by calling me a Razer fanboy can go fuck themselves. My argument is to do with logic and fairness, not favouritism, and if you've got nothing to dispute anything I've said, you've got no proof that I'm wrong. Besides, if you're only behind Tornado here because you're tired of Razer being so dominant, you're fucking hypocrites to think I'm a Razer fanboy when you're just as biased _against_ them. You're the same people who bitch about battles being boring, one-sided and predictable because you're too stupid to get it into your heads that roboteering is real-life competition and not professional wrestling, therefore it plays out naturally, whether it comes off as dramatic or not. And just remember that Storm 2 got fucked over in Series 7 because the producers only wanted robots they considered to be entertaining. I'd rather see the most boring, predictable, one-sided battle with a deserving winner than a highly tense back-and-forth battle with an undeserving winner. And Razer was as dominant as it was because it EARNED all those victories, and it did so fairly. That's what you're SUPPOSED to do in roboteering, you morons! I'm not a Razer fanboy, I just hate it when dirty play is allowed (let alone rewarded) rather than punished, REGARDLESS of who does it.

Those house bots really helped tornado in #1

"They've got some work to do" yeah they won the most battles over and over

Team Razer...wow! They give class a whole new meaning! Very awesome robots in Razer and Warhead bringing that destruction, yet keeping it classy! The ending showed something you don't see a lot of other winners do, that being passing their win onto the team they beat. Nothing against Tornado as I liked its earlier design but that frame was a bit over the top as it allowed for them to avoid being put in the pit altogether.

tornado would of fit in the pit corner to corner simple

This is why kids in school are taught what a hypotenuse is. All Razer needed to do was angle Tornado into the pit diagonally :P

Everyone here is complaining that Tornado's anti-crusher cage was unfair or unsportsmanlike. Guys. Come on. Think about this. While I agree that the cage was cheap due to it not being able to be pitted, I think it was a GENIUS way to counter Razer, and my hat is off to them for thinking of it. And of course everyone remembers the infuriating second battle in which Razer barely failed to pit Tornado, but look at the fight before that. Razer did pretty good. It tore out Tornado's weapon motor and the judges only gave the win to Tornado because they thought the weapon motor was Razer's tire, and they apologized to both teams. Razer lost the final match purely due to bad luck. Their anti-anti-crusher device, the hooks, worked extremely well. Razer unfortunately broke down before they could get Tornado into the pit. I don't know how that happened, but even if you're gonna argue that Tornado's cage was cheap, then at the very least, Razer used its hooks so well that you can't say they didn't get their revenge. Razer did win that match officially, but Team Razer gave the match to Tornado.

how did the organiser allow robots bigger then the arena and have one robot becoming two

I think it's well established that the robots everyone loved and respected is chaos 2, hypnodisc and razor...with razor and chaos 2 being the top dogs. Tornado could be one of the top robots in the eyes of the fans. But their desperation kinda fucked them.

I want to see storm 2 vs razer

The rules were BEND to be more competitive, Tornado in its original form wouldn't stand a chance. The show had to step in to give other builder a chance.

Tornado were soundly beaten in their first two contests. No contest in either fight. The third fight with the cage, Razer broke Tornado's spinning bar early on, meaning they had no weaponry, but they still won. Then we get to fight four and they get pitted by Razer, but the cage is too big. On that basis alone they should have had a DQ. They won instead of Razer. Lastly we get to fight 5, and now Razer has an anti cage weapon to combat. They are able to immediately hoist them up, and then it becomes a case of pitting them. If that cage wasn't as big (an inch or less) they would have been pitted. It should have been a 5-0 in Razer's favour. The fact that they conceded to Tornado in fight 5 is bullshit, and I understand why it was a split decision. It was a bad team who didn't deserve to win.

Remember robot wars fans Quoting craig Charles "All is fair in love and Robot Wars"

Razer should've won, it was ridiculous that these stupid added weapons were even allowed.

31:04 I have to say, I've started to respect the idea of countering your opponent and I've started to give credit to the tornado team for coming up with a legal way to counter a robot that sort-of countered theirs, but this lack of grace in defeat is pretty sad. Razer team was very gracious in defeat when the tornado guys beat them with the "anti-razer" "weapon", and responded not with poor sportsmanship but with a counter of their own. Basically, live by the counter, die by the counter. Tornado team didn't seem to upset to completely nullify razer's ability to fight them, but when razer modified their weapon to completely nullify tornado's "weapon", oh now they're upset. Funniest part is, the hook on razer's tail specifically used the "anti-razer" cage against tornado: it gave them something to hook onto, and also prevented tornado's wheels from touching the ground when they were lifted. The whole point of the "anti-razer" cage was to exploit a weakness of razer (its lack of reach and lack of horsepower), but created a weakness for tornado (the ability to be lifted and to lose traction with the ground). Razer exploited this weakness just as tornado had exploited razer's weakness. Tornado also should have seen this coming - in the fourth fight, razor managed to lift tornado and prevent its wheels from touching the ground. Tornado saw this obvious design weakness but did not take any steps to minimize it, so they had no right to be upset when the exact same thing happened in the fifth fight (only even more so). TL;DR: Live by the counter, die by the counter. Razer sort of counters tornado, so tornado developed a counter to razer. Razer, in return, developed a counter to tornado's counter (that specifically used their counter against them), and tornado had a chance to respond but did not. Given this, it's really sad to see that tornado was all-to-happy to employ their own counter against razer, but were pretty upset when they themselves were completely countered.

Tornado are genius with what they done, Razer should of just given up after a few minutes when it was pretty much all done. Plus, as a non razer fan, I am SO GLAD they lost, this is one of my favourite Robot Wars battle of all time. I am a chaos 2 fan at heart but this is my fav final ever.

Personally, I never found razer that interesting. They almost never let go of their opponents and the whole thing is generally pretty dull.

how the fuck did tornado win Razer is a legend and all ways will be

15:30 Is that Mick Foley?

the uk final tornado lost, the cage was fine but theyre machine was in the pit, the add on should be removed for that bit, theyre original machine is in and thats that.

That third battle was a joke. Where was the offense from Tornado against Razor?

Just wanna say that Razer exploited the fuck out of pinning rules when it fought just about anyone. If turnabout it fair play, then so is that frame 😁

How did tornado win that third one. It literally did nothing. No damage. Definitely no style (anyone lose some scaffolding?) and aggression? It pushed a bit about it

So they were allowed to build their robot big enough that it doesn't even fit in the pit should someone grab them? That is really cheap.

There is nothing wrong with altering your robot for a fight

Tornado were desperate. DESPERATE to win and be the best, sore losers, terrible winners, 0 sportsmanship especially from the tall nob head, couldn’t beat Razer by normal means. Razor were a true class act. And if anyone disputes Tornado were anything short of cheap with that cage, then the last three fights would be like Anthony Joshua wearing a full suit of body armour from head to toe and steel boxing gloves against regular boxing clad Tyson Fury.

robots should not be allowed to be made bigger than 15% you can't double the size of your robot from one fight to another

TWO RULES WERE BROKEN BY TORNADO: 1. YOUR ROBOT WILL BE CAPABLE OF HAVING SUFFICIENT COMPONENTS IN THE PIT, AS TO BECOME IMMOBILE; 2. YOUR ROBOT SHALL GIVE SUFFICIENT NOTICE PRIOR TO AN ENGINERRING CHANGE TO ALLOW THE OPPONENT TO COMPENSATE PROPERLY.

I'm about to trigger the people who like the frame... Razer 2 - Tornado 0

razer is win

Okay let's settle this once and for all. Did Tornado cheat? Well let's look at the arguments that it cheated and analyse them. First it had interchangeable weapons. This was incredibly unique but it wasn't the first robot to do this. For that we have to go all the way back to the first wars and to Plunderbird. Yes, the comedy competitors made a robot with interchangeable weapons way back in series 1. What was the reaction from the producers? Did they label Plunderbird as cheats? No, they gave Plunderbird the award for best design! Right from the start being able to modify a robot for different fights was something applauded and deemed as clever design. So the interchangeable weapons aren't a problem then. Nobody complains about Tornado fitting the scoop on the front to deter Hypnodiscs deadly disc after all. So what makes the cage different? Ah yes, the pit or course. Now ignoring the fact Tornado dominated the fight before the pit incident people always focus on the final minute of the match. It looked like Tornado couldn't fit into the pit, but is this against the rules? Tornado themselves say that their robot was well within the maximum size allowed and that the maximum size is actually bigger than the pit. Despite this some still call it cheap, but is it really? In the early wars the most common way to win a fight was to immobilise your opponent by putting them in their back. Often "cease" was called the moment this happened. But in series 1 TRACIE competed as an inverterbale machine and had a distinct advantage as a result. Was this fair? Of course! People thought it was a good idea so bots like All Torque, King Buxton, SMIDSY, Storm 2 and of course Tornado copied it. What about other robots that couldn't drive upside-down, were they automatically eliminated? Well yes, they used to be. The moment Cunning Plan upended Demolisher that match was immediately over because Demolisher had no way to get back into its wheels. Then Cassius happened. Moments into its Semi Final pinball Cassius we flipped over and we all assumed it was all over. A robot was put onto its back and cease would be called as usual. Except this time Cassius spectacularly flipped back onto its wheels and survived. What was once a way to eliminate an opponent had been overcome thanks to great design and ingenious creation. Even for robots that couldn't self right being flipped over wasn't the end for certain. In series 3 Behemoth flipped over Pitbull and the dog was done for. "Please Turn Over" was written underneath Pitbull and an act of kindness was their only hope of staying alive. They got it and they won the heat as a result. The only reason why the pit was still so fateful and being overturned wasn't was because nobody had come up with a way to avoid it yet like Rex Garrod did with Cassius when he created the SRIMECH. Well actually even before Tornado created a way to avoid the pit Cassius waS already one step ahead of them. Cassius lost the series 2 final after falling into the pit, but Rex was back in series 3 with Cassius 2 with a spike which he claimed could push Cassius back out of the pit. He already tried escaping in series 2 against Mortis so the idea was clearly in his head even then. What was the reaction? Was Rex called a cheater? Of course not! Just like inventing the SCRIMECH creating an anti pit device was hailed as a great idea! Sadly we never saw it as Cassius ironically went into the pit headfirst and couldn't use its spike to escape. So creating an anti pit device is obviously not against the rules but for some that is irrelevant as some claim Tornado was over the pit and was immobilised. Is this true? Well yes, but only for a short while. Razer by dragging Tornado to safely rather than leave it over the pit mobilised it. Yeah it's a tough break but Behemoth did the same to Pitbull when it saved it in series 3 too. In series 5 a robot was only deemed immobilised when Refbot counts to ten and that didn't happen. It fights ended the very second a robot was immobilised then SCRIMECH's would be nullified completely as a robot is immobile upside down. So clearly you have to be immobile for a noticeable amount of time before you've lost. People think falling into the pit is an automatic loss but that isn't true. Heck you could make your robot turn into a plane and fly into the arena after an OOTA and that would be fine! You are only immobilised if you are deemed unable to continue fighting in the arena and clearly Tornado was able to continue. In series 1 rather than a pit there was a grate that acted in the same way. Robots with their wheels couldn't get any traction on it and thus were eliminated. However if Mortis with its tracks feel on the grate it likely would have been fine and that would be okay with everybody. Stinger actually did fall into the pit in the pinball but simply drove out of it and continued when others would have been eliminated. People only think the pit is an automatic win because nobody ever escaped from it just like we used to think overturning a robot was an automatic victory too. So looking at all the history did Tornado cheat? Of course not and even Razer don't think they did.

So genius, I really love how Razer team show Tarnado was cheating. Grab Tornado and show the world that shame Tornado cage ia larger than burning pit was brilliant idea!

lol

Look at all these salty Razer fans

Razer lost fairly to Tornado and its frame. First: Tornado used the rules to their advantage. It's common place and not cheating. Look over at Battlebots. Son of Whyachi, No Apologies, and T-Minus all used the rules and/or legal modifications to win. Second: Tornado could have been pitted if Razer had gotten free of its grapple on Tornado when it had it over the pit. This was the reason Tornado was not considered pitted and instead still under Razer's grapple time limit. Third: Razer should have lost earlier in the match because it was stuck in the wall for over 30 seconds.

Tornado, a shitty version of storm. Yet the producers love Tornado but hate storm.

#tornadocheated

Haha tornado outsmarted razed

#tornadocheated