They also invented the Mongolian script

The Xian Stele.

​@@bobbobb4804 believe, pay and or die was the moto wasn't it 🤷

Yes, this Assyrian Church of the East is very active in our country Iraq. Most of our Muslim people at one time belonged to this Assyrian Church of the East.

Lol. The church was already split way before protestants came along. Try reading for once.

@@johnsambo9379 never said they were not

@@johnsambo9379 i think you misunderstood. they know perfectly well. i think they were saying protestants attempt to reconstruct to recreate the first century church and they miss out by not looking at these ancient churches.

@@watcherwlc53 nailed it

Well, surely a lot of cultural traditions are lost, but the Bible does say that the Scriptures are able to: Make us wise unto salvation by Faith Make us to know (thoroughly furnished) how to do every good work, so we are in fact able to know how to keep things God wants us to keep just by reading it. 2 Timothy : 3 : 15 - 17 “And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.”

I'm a Syro Malabar Mar Thoma Nasrani, nice to hear from you brother

How do people join ? I am Protestant I am just curious on if it’s like how people join Catholicism

@@Mrchungus11C-OIR Tbh I would not know, I have looked it up and there are know sources online. Your best bet is asking a Chaldean Catholic priest or Assyrian Catholic priest for a detailed explanation. In the chaldean church, St. John, Located in San Diego, I have seen attendance from non Chaldeans/assyrians. They were most likely also Catholic previously attending the Latin Mass. We do speak the language of Jesus Christ and sing hymns during mass. The language is a Mesopotamian dialect of Aramaic (Sureth).

@@Mrchungus11C-OIR Before we joined the catholic church in the 16th century, we were orthodox and practiced eastern christianity. Assyrians are many of the first travelers to spread the gospel after his resurrection. We went as far east as china. our church almost saw extinction after the reign of the khans.

Assyrian orthodox here my grand grandparents fled from the genocide out of hakkarri (literally the Most southeastern corner of turkey) to syria khabour rivers

Sorghatani Beki, daughter in law to Genghis and mother of Kublai Khan was from the Church of the East and buried in a Christian funeral in a Christian church. If any of her sons and descendants has adopted her faith, history would be very, very different. The Church of the East had multiple opportunities with the Mongols and the Ilkhanate of Persia, all of which they flubbed, sadly.

​@@jacobbaradaeus6250 Yeah, and the rise of Islam only added insults to injury.

The only reason they were able to maintain their genetic identity was because they maintained their religious identity, minimizing intermarriage with other groups.

@@bigscarysteve True, but that’s not the only reason

@@basedchaldean Maybe. What are the others?

@@bigscarysteve you can find the second reason in the Bibel Isaiah 19:23-25 God Has a plan for us 🙏

@@bigscarysteve Many Assyrians emphasize marriage within the ethnicity more than marriage within the faith. Although ethnicity and faith are one unity for a large number of Assyrians, there are also many Assyrians who aren't religiously-affiliated at all. But even the latter will emphasize marrying an Assyrian to their children, and it's not an easy thing to disobey an Assyrian mother!

The Japanese Orthodox Church is really just a branch of the Russian Church in Japan.

You have the holy Catholic Church. You have 40,000 man made protestant CULTS including the orthodox CULTS NOT churches! Only Jesus can found a Church. Only Catholic’s go to Heaven because there’s NO division’s in paradise!

not to mention them burning valuable records of how nazranis worshiped then cause it was not "right"

@@albertjose8879 True!

Keralited everywhere 😂🤭

@@zenjm6496 like I would kill to know how my ancestors would've practiced and I'm still going around churches looking for ancient records....lmao

@@amalp9784 we are everywhere!!!

There are some ACOE in Engaland I believe I don’t know where though since I’m in America

I am an Alevi-Zaza living in Turkey, and a significant minority of my ancestors, the Daylamites, belonged to the Church Of The East.

No your church affirms Nestorian heresies. Return to communion with the Eastern Orthodox.

You have a new BIshop Mar Awraham Youkhanis, Bishop of London and Western Europe. I am going to a talk that he is giving on June 18th at St Albans Cathedral. My own priest has met him (I am Eastern Orthodox) and he is very impressed with His Grace.

No it doesn't.​@@victormargulius632

I don"t understand how that happened. Suddenly you start believing in purgatory, indulgences, pope supremacy, legalistic view of salvation, filioque, and original sin? How?

@@haroldgamarra7175 the chaldean catholics have their own christian tradition but they happen to be communion with rome

@@haroldgamarra7175 afaik, patriarchal succession crises led to a group of Assyrians to get legitimacy from the Pope

@@haroldgamarra7175 Not suddenly, but after years of debates and conversations. Also, the only doctrine most of them had to adopt among the ones you noted would be Papacy. The doctrine of Purgatory and Original sin was already believed by most Orthodox Christians, Oriental or Eastern. The Catholic Church doesn't really hold the legalistic view of atonement, in fact, the Church doesn't have ANY official theory on that topic, the Church only has 'theories that are 100% false'. In other words, the Church rejects some theories and allows Catholics from holding any of the other theories that have not been called 'heresy' by the Church. Filioque is mostly just a linguistic misunderstanding and linguistic limit. Both the Oriental Orthodox and Eastern Orthodox and Catholics agree that they don't disagree with any fundamental points and that the controversy is mostly about the word from which language is more accurate to the meaning of the doctrine.

Why do you follow a pedophile?

Hello, I'm a curious scholar and I was wondering if you could provide more specific identifying information about the incident in question with the patriarch you mentioned as well as the liturgical books that make these kinds of references. Thank you!

Simply put, they don't make the difference between sacrements and and what Catholics call sacramentals.

they are effectively Orthodox in practice and appearance, except they are in communion with the papacy and not the Orthodox Church.

@@jamiehayn Exactly.

4th century is according to written records. It's very possible for the ties to have been even older considering the fact that Kerala was the spice centre of the world and we had great spice trade ties with Middle Eastern Empires.

They also did not amass wealth and power, form armies, and attack other nations to forcefully (rather than persuasively) convert them, all to gain more territory, wealth, and power, nor did they cut off heads to force conversion, or burn dissenters at the stake, and they never led crusades to kill fellow Christians.

​@@aguest4408 Correct

And persecutions also from catholic church . Franciscan missionaries of catholic church made divisions in church of east in an effort to bring church of east under pope and formed chaldean catholic church. It weakened the church of east in particular and Christianity in general and that also give rise to islamic fundamentalism!!

ماعلاقه اضعاف كنيسه المشرق بظهور الاسلام؟​@@ponnusdumbiesadikarilla3232

@@aguest4408that’s not true.

The ancient church being the most modern one is pretty funny

Awesome comment. I'm Easter Orthodox and have been trying to read the Bazaar. We share so much and I love Mar Yaballaha III and Mar Rabban bar Sauma a lot. Mar Alopen's story in China also means much to me. I pray we can reunite one more time, once and for all on this earth.

@@djnth0llmnjeremygan694 It’s a shame that the controversy holds the union back. If terms are put aside, ACOE’s christology is near identical with EO’s. May EO and ACOE unite one day

@@AryaXVII May the Lord hear our prayers. As a Chinese person, the Church of the East is part of my homeland's heritage, so there's no way I can be antagonistic to the ACoE.

We aren’t nestorians but some of our patriarchs where

Used to be all in India as members of the Assyrian Church of the East up until the religious persecution inflicted on the Assyrian Church of the East in India forced many to convert to Catholicism. But as I mentioned above, Mar Thomas was the open who converted Indians to become Christians in unity with the Assyrian Church of the Eat. For further information that you can follow read this historic book about what I stated above."The Holy Apostolic Catholic Assyrian Church of the East -A Short History written by Professor K. A. Ignatius. (The word "Catholic" here means a Universal Church because it spreads across many continents).

​@@WilliamGMalek Assyrian is an ethnicity. The heritage of the Church of the East much beyond that. It encompasses not just Assyrians but Indians, chinese and so on.

Very true, but we have to remember the founders were Assyrians and it was established in the Assyrian holy city of Edessa, with the Assyrian king Abger O'Kama. Notice that the language that was spread to those non-Assyrians in India, and you will understand my conclusion.

I agree with that point of view.

Nestorian is a misnomer though. I’d suggest “The ‘Nestorian’ Church: A Lamentable Misnomer” by Sebastian Brock if you want to know more

@@basedchaldean I looked up that title on Amazon and did not find?

@@basedchaldean I'm probably wrong, but I've always understood that Nestorian was applied to the Assyrians but received as an insult by them. Despite the antiquity of this tradition, it remains all but unknown.

@@watcherwlc53Google it, it is a paper that Dr Brock, who is an expert on Syriac Christianity, wrote, it has been published in several academic journals. It is a fascinating piece of writing

Also, I'm aware that there's a very sensitive issue of Syriac / Aramean / Assyrian identity. I would also appreciate some good proven sources on the issue of their ecclesial / national identity in history.

@@Arman-ir1nm Hello! You are correct about the identities, although I must add that there is now also a minority who claim a Chaldean identity. As an Assyrian from the Chaldean Catholic Church, I would be more than willing to answer any questions you may have about these identities and I am able to provide sources to substantiate my answers.

@@basedchaldean Hello, I'm not the same person you made this offer to, but I'm in the process of starting a research project at my university about the historical identity of Middle Eastern Christians before the Crusades, covering their whole culture from identity, architecture, customs, institutions, cuisine, music, and more. I would love absolutely anything you could offer about the Syriac/Assyrian/Aramean identity, including traditions or practices that make you stand out from Arabs, regardless of whether or not they are relevant to religion. If you have any sourcing to corroborate this, that would be great too! It seems surprisingly difficult to find good sources of information for some of this stuff.

The book of Marganitha (The Pearl) is a good book

Very uncharitable way of putting one of bravest outposts of Christendom in one of the most hostile regions on earth.

What about most evangelical church in the USA... Most of them are nestorians

@@mortalkombaty7960 im orthodox

“Nestorian” is just a misnomer. I highly suggest that you read “The ‘Nestorian’ Church: A Lamentable Misnomer” by Sebastian Brock to learn more

@@highviewbarbell One would never know. I will pray that you will repent and be forgiven for your unkindness.

In addition to the Roman Catholic Deuterocanon, they also accept Third Maccabees, Psalm 151, and the Prayer of Manasseh. Until A. D. 616, they excluded 2nd Peter, 2nd John, 3rd John, Jude, and Revelation from their New Testament.

@@bigscarysteve Thank you for the information!

@@jeyoungryou3585 You're welcome!

@@bigscarysteve you forgot to also add one of the writings of Josephus.

@@matthewmencel5978 I think you're referring to book VI of _The Jewish War._ It's my understanding that this turns up in some of their Biblical manuscripts, but it's not canonical. There are also some other works that turn up in some of their manuscripts, but those aren't considered canonical either, so I didn't mention them. It's kind of like the situation with 1st & 2nd Esdras & the Prayer of Manasseh in the Latin Vulgate and with 4th Maccabees in the Greek Septuagint.

424 AD The Assyrian Church of the East is formally excommunicated from the western Christians. (These “nestorian” Christians separate to survive politically from Zoroastrian Persian persecution in Iraq/Persia and all eastward, since now they were “enemies” of Rome.) This church spreads eastward to convert some Jews in India right away, and by 500 AD to Ceylon, later into Central Asia & 635 into China. c. 600 AD Assyrian Church of East Christian traders visited in Pegu (Burma), Siam, Champa (S Vietnam) & Dai Viet (N Vietnam) - and by 800 AD Java - however no known church from those areas developed. At this time Assyrian Church of East was larger than Arian tribes who controlled Spain, Italy and the Maghreb , than the Miaphysite/Copts from Ethiopia to Armenia, or than the Orthodox Catholic (who were still combined). From Iraq though Central Asia through China and symbols from Church of the East churches have been found in Japan and Korea. But God put in persecution from Taoist emperors in China, by Buddihsts in Japan/Korea, and from Muslims conquered, they were killed by murderous Mongols (even though some Mongols were also Church of the East) like everyone else, hit by Black Death with more persecutions by Muslims (as causing by poisoning the wells), then again severe persecution by muslim Tamerlane. They had shrunk to a remnant. Furthermore, since the 1500s Catholics and later Protestants who found them in China and India tried to "convert the heretics".

@@tommy-er6hh interesting to know, thank you. 🙂

Are there people in the ACOE that are against the use of icons in the modern liturgy?

@@GraceforLight I haven't heard the debates. I wouldn't understand the logic of not having them. Our Churches walls are empty. If you walked into a service you would think it's an Orthodox Church that just moved into the building. God willing someday it'll happen. Not sure in my lifetime, however 🤷

​@@peterbahi0227 you are an idolator ? I am sick of it. It is an abomination to our Lord!

@@ponnusdumbiesadikarilla3232 Is it? Then, do me a favor. Take away every picture you have of your family at your house. It's idolatry and it needs to be removed ASAP!

Catholic church even agree the use of "Mother of Christ" title in Catholic church COMMON CHRISTOLOGICAL DECLARATION OF POPE JOHN PAUL II AND HIS HOLINESS MAR DINKHA IV, CATHOLICOS-PATRIARCH OF THE ASSYRIAN CHURCH OF THE EAST Friday, 11 November 1994 Common Christological Declaration between the Catholic Church and the Assyrian Church of the East His Holiness John Paul II, Bishop of Rome and Pope of the Catholic Church, and His Holiness Mar Dinkha IV, Catholicos-Patriarch of the Assyrian Church of the East, give thanks to God who has prompted them to this new brotherly meeting. Both of them consider this meeting as a basic step on the way towards the full communion to be restored between their Churches. They can indeed, from now on, proclaim together before the world their common faith in the mystery of the Incarnation. * * * As heirs and guardians of the faith received from the Apostles as formulated by our common Fathers in the Nicene Creed, we confess one Lord Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, begotten of the Father from all eternity who, in the fullness of time, came down from heaven and became man for our salvation. The Word of God, second Person of the Holy Trinity, became incarnate by the power of the Holy Spirit in assuming from the holy Virgin Mary a body animated by a rational soul, with which he was indissolubly united from the moment of his conception. Therefore our Lord Jesus Christ is true God and true man, perfect in his divinity and perfect in his humanity, consubstantial with the Father and consubstantial with us in all things but sin. His divinity and his humanity are united in one person, without confusion or change, without division or separation. In him has been preserved the difference of the natures of divinity and humanity, with all their properties, faculties and operations. But far from constituting "one and another", the divinity and humanity are united in the person of the same and unique Son of God and Lord Jesus Christ, who is the object of a single adoration. Christ therefore is not an "ordinary man" whom God adopted in order to reside in him and inspire him, as in the righteous ones and the prophets. But the same God the Word, begotten of his Father before all worlds without beginning according to his divinity, was born of a mother without a father in the last times according to his humanity. The humanity to which the Blessed Virgin Mary gave birth always was that of the Son of God himself. That is the reason why the Assyrian Church of the East is praying the Virgin Mary as "the Mother of Christ our God and Saviour". In the light of this same faith the Catholic tradition addresses the Virgin Mary as "the Mother of God" and also as "the Mother of Christ". We both recognize the legitimacy and rightness of these expressions of the same faith and we both respect the preference of each Church in her liturgical life and piety. This is the unique faith that we profess in the mystery of Christ. The controversies of the past led to anathemas, bearing on persons and on formulas. The Lord’s Spirit permits us to understand better today that the divisions brought about in this way were due in large part to misunderstandings. Whatever our christological divergences have been, we experience ourselves united today in the confession of the same faith in the Son of God who became man so that we might become children of God by his grace. We wish from now on to witness together to this faith in the One who is the Way, the Truth and the Life, proclaiming it in appropriate ways to our contemporaries, so that the world may believe in the Gospel of salvation. * * * The mystery of the Incarnation which we profess in common is not an abstract and isolated truth. It refers to the Son of God sent to save us. The economy of salvation, which has its origin in the mystery of communion of the Holy Trinity-Father, Son and Holy Spirit-, is brought to its fulfilment through the sharing in this communion, by grace, within the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church, which is the People of God, the Body of Christ and the Temple of the Spirit. Believers become members of this Body through the sacrament of Baptism, through which, by water and the working of the Holy Spirit, they are born again as new creatures. They are confirmed by the seal of the Holy Spirit who bestows the sacrament of Anointing. Their communion with God and among themselves is brought to full realization by the celebration of the unique offering of Christ in the sacrament of the Eucharist. This communion is restored for the sinful members of the Church when they are reconciled with God and with one another through the sacrament of Forgiveness. The sacrament of Ordination to the ministerial priesthood in the apostolic succession assures the authenticity of the faith, the sacraments and the communion in each local Church. Living by this faith and these sacraments, it follows as a consequence that the particular Catholic churches and the particular Assyrian churches can recognize each other as sister Churches. To be full and entire, communion presupposes the unanimity concerning the content of the faith, the sacraments and the constitution of the Church. Since this unanimity for which we aim has not yet been attained, we cannot unfortunately celebrate together the Eucharist which is the sign of the ecclesial communion already fully restored. Nevertheless, the deep spiritual communion in the faith and the mutual trust already existing between our Churches entitle us from now on to consider witnessing together to the Gospel message and co-operating in particular pastoral situations, including especially the areas of catechesis and the formation of future priests. In thanking God for having made us rediscover what already unites us in the faith and the sacraments, we pledge ourselves to do everything possible to dispel the obstacles of the past which still prevent the attainment of full communion between our Churches, so that we can better respond to the Lord’s call for the unity of his own, a unity which has of course to be expressed visibly. To overcome these obstacles, we now establish a Mixed Committee for theological dialogue between the Catholic Church and the Assyrian Church of the East. Given at Saint Peter’s, on 11 November 1994. MAR DINKHA IV IOANNES PAULUS PP. II © Copyright 1994 - Libreria Editrice Vaticana

But when I visited Roman Catholic Church, the priest doesn’t allow to get holy communion because I am church of the east

I guess in historical context it would be, but If I remember correctly, Lutherans also do common absolution as well.

Anglican also give common absolution during the Eucharist and the Divine Office of Mattin and Evensong. But private confession with absolution (with the attitude of some may, all could, none must) also practice in some high Anglican Church

Hey! This is actually my growing area of speciality as a PhD candidate in ANE Archaeology! Check out Christof Baumer’s Book on the church of the East and work by S. P. Brock if you are interested in a good starting point.

The towns of the Nineveh Plain just to the north of Mosul, Iraq are worthy of research in their own right. You may already be well aware of them, but these towns (Al Qosh, Qara Qosh, and others) are sites of a number of their ancient monasteries. Al Qosh for example is the town one of the minor prophets resided in, Nahum and is buried in. His book prophecies the destruction of Nineveh (now Mosul) in vivid detail.

@@sillysyriac8925 Thanks! I just checked and my seminary's library has an ebook of it. I'll check it out!

Highly recommend 'Patriarch Shah and Caliph,' which was the Phd thesis of William Young studying in Glasgow. Just checked and you can download this as a pdf. Young was a Church of Scotland ( Presbyterian) missionary in Pakistan. On the formation of the Church of Pakistan ( a union of Presbyterian, Episcopalian, Methodist and Lutheran churches) he became the first Bishop of Sialkot. His work on the Church of the East, which retained a strong missionary mindset despite minority status under Zoroastrian and then Muslim rule, has great relevance to many Christian communities today. I own a rare hard copy printed in Pakistan.

@@sillysyriac8925 I don't know if you'll see this lol, but would you possibly be interested in hopping on a podcast to discuss the church of the east? Some seminary buddies and myself are doing a series through the first seven councils and want to have an episode on what led the East into schism after the 2nd council.

The hate comes from U two: as Traditional Roman Catholics and Orthodox call us Protestants heretics. Don't be blinded by the log in your eye.

the channel "useful charts" has a video comparing different English translations of the bible

There are plenty of such videos--way too many to attempt to even begin a list. As for the Church of the East, they do have their own English translation--sort of. A member of the Church of the East named George Lamsa produced an English translation of the Syriac version of the Bible--but he omitted the extra books from the Old Testament. I'm not sure if the Church of the East holds Lamsa's translation in any higher regard than other English translations, though.

@@bigscarysteve I meant a video from this channel.

If Mary is not the Mother of God then who did she gave birth to? Is Jesus not God?

The reason why they reject the title, “Mother of God,” is due to the fact that they inherited Nestorian beliefs which was condemned by the early Church.

The reason why the Church of the East denies the Theotokos label stems from their christology. They believe in a two subject christology whereby the the Word of God and the Son of Man are two distinct persons that come together to form the unified person of Christ.

@@dicknig1054 I've heard enough of your side. Time to hear the perspectives of others in order to be fair. Truth always prevails. Good-bye

@@dicknig1054 God as trinity doesn't have a mother: only Jesus Christ does in his incarnation. I think it's more accurate to say Mary is the mother of Jesus Christ who IS God the second person of the trinity.

They knew about the other churches, but they were geographically so far apart, a schism was bound to happen.

Archaeologists recently found an ancient church ruin in Israel, with an inscription asking St Peter for intercession. The church dates to the 5th century.

Church of the East is a continuation of the Nicean Christianity. It separated only from the Roman Byzantine Imperial Church

Not only Assyrians but also Indians and some Americans, Chinese. Also there is Vietnamese believer in America, and some Mongolians were trying to restore Assyrian church of the east. I am Korean who want to be a member of Assyrian church

Ancient church of east

Christ the good shepherd church

Yes.

No

syriac orthodox use west syriac traditions while Assyrian CoE use East Syriac traditions