Yeah the Fourier Addition needs a sub but ... we can get a forward mid.

And down 20 hz is not needed for that.

@Click-Here-To-Massage-___- Ok, send it....................

every now and then i run without sub bass for a few minutes just to remind myself How the Other Half Live

Do give us your take on this sub pairing with the CW IV. I was about to switch to T9x. but Rel told me to stay with the HT-1508. Much respect for REL for giving the best of what they believe in than sale me another sub.

Conventional wisdom suggests that could be a challenge, ie., big sensitivity mismatch, a 4.5x difference in cone area, ... and most challenging would be phase alignment between sealed and vented. It's not ideal, however it may be ok.

Personally, I would not recommend pairing this particular REL sub with your Cornwall IVs. At RELs recommendation (2 years ago), I paired my Heresy IVs with a single S/510, and it was pure heaven. However, REL has since changed their guidance and now recommend either a single or a pair of their HT 1510 subs for all Klipsch Heritage line speakers. Thus, my recommendation would be to try a single 1510. Per another commentator, I believe the 1510 would be a better match as well (vs the Classic 98) in view of the Cornwall IVs main woofer area vs the sub woofer area (generally, those should be matched for ideal blending). Note, you can use the HT 1510 using high-level speaker level inputs if you pair it with their Airship II wireless connector (i.e., a first for their HT subs, which historically had been limited to low level inputs only, even with their wireless modules...but, that has now changed with the 1510!). Good luck.

I found the old email. Me. "Would the TX9 or TX7 a better match for my Cornwall IV? I am using the HT/1508 with Cornwall IV at the moment. Thinking moves the HT to theater and replace it with TX. Thank you" REL response: "Unfortunately neither model is going to match well with those speakers. Your Cornwall speakers are very efficient, and you need really high output for those speakers. The HT1508 is a great choice for those speakers. "

@@slowestrider4918 My conventional wisdom would be right in line then.

REL may be UK-based, but the subwoofers are made in China.

@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac Were the subs not UK-made at one point?

@@williamevans9426 Yes they were. They were sold by the Welsh owners in 2005.

@@jim586 Many thanks, jim586!

Fitting that they still design things that go boom

2.2 is even better.

Volt drivers were actually made in the same factory as the British EMI (record label) woofers. But the British Sound you know, had worked with their own stuff and what amplifier did you use with your Volt?

ATC SCM7 MK2 are Billy Woodman's stuff and people don't know what sort of community that stuff came from but tubes and their speakers don't work well with the wrong amplifiers. It's like somebody buying a used Rolls Royce and pulling a trailer with it. I mean why not buy a used Jeep? So we fit something to the Rolls Royce to make it pull better but it was never designed for that.

'Cornwall 4s?' Well, I was looking at Barney's Collaro precision cloth turntable mat located in Motherwell, Scotland, the Audiophiliac System of the Day. You know Motherwell used to be one of those coal mining places like our Ehrenfeld, Pennsylvania near Pittsburgh. Well back in the late 1950s you know the British had the world's finest console piece of wooden Audio furniture known as the DECCA Stereo Decola and it had a transcription turntable by Collaro of olden times and it has just such a red, rubber mat. But as for Cornwall IVs, they take up even more space.

I'd really love to experience a Cornwall dual sub setup.

I have a pair of REL Predators II with CWIVs (music only). These were the preferred pairing coming from REL. I was skeptical but have now seen the light. With an invisible transition the wall of sound is even bigger and deeper.

Yeah but Sonus Faber doesn't really need a Sub, these belong to a community of you know, what would we say in New York? We'd say Sonus Faber owners are a crew and they use very powerful Krell amplifiers that you must have the stuff that that yacht owning crew use. otherwise you'll be using a sub.

Yes, because it just came out! Few companies offer review samples of older models.

@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac not complaining

It's an uneventful subwoofer

@@ryanschipp8513i think thats sorta what REL was going for, honestly. It’s an articulate bottom firing instrument.

@@chrisfoxart it's a lousy value for what you get for $1,400. All it has going for it is a vintage look for the Vintage guys out there. Other than that I could list multiple subwoofers for a fraction that price that would murder it performance-wise

Yeah I wouldn't trade two sealed SVS subs for REL subs either. SVS subs are a bit more in your face, but that's no doubt solvable with tuning and careful integration. I don't dislike REL, but they're overpriced for what they are.

@@KimmoJaskari I can see your point... And yes, the SVS ap is very easy to use to dial these SB3000's in. I run that vintage Sansui 4000 that happens to put out a phenomenal amount of bass with my Zu DW6's. I have the subs really dialed back to darn near zero, with the crossovers set just around 40Hz, as the Zu's really dig deep with the Sansui.

Noticed this 98 says it is made in Wales.... maybe by BK?

dude, that's quite interesting info. REL does claim most of its performance lies in its filter. how fast are these BK's?

But the drivers used by BK are not as good as the ones we can find on the REL's sub.

The left and right speaker level channels from the power amplifier were connected to the subwoofer!

Yeah, we use a Y connector, that combines the two channels into one but you subs with a single input usually use an output from a 'sub' socket on the amplifier and it's already combined. We could make our own sub filter because we can't put full frequency into a sub. We filter off the higher stuff and ground it via a resistor, unless you want it for other uses. But ... there are 'dead areas' in rooms that negate a sub's contribution. It's not a straightforward thing to set up.

Thanks for the info, looks like I can stop worrying!

was the subwoofer you are referring sold to the general public ? . the phase linear was from the early to mid 70s. from 1977to 93 I sold thousands of pieces of classic audio equipment at a stereo store I managed . from mcintosh mc 275 to marantz model9 and even a couple of jbl paragons.@@keplermission

That's what a good sub does, it doesn't draw attention to itself, you just magically seem to have speakers that can reproduce the full spectrum of sound. If you tune and integrate it well, anyway.

@user-tp7xq1kc9b oh wow! That’s amazing. Please post

I'd love to open them up and video the sub/amp' 😆

LOL Like low frequencies, from a sub with drivers that aren't downward firing, don't touch the floor.

Two smaller subwoofers

It's well ballance and sounds really good but need to get the power supply 😁

Zu has had this exact design for a few years

😂

A few years ago, I tried a pair of Magnepans. I just bought a pair because I couldn't get a good demo, and I always wanted to try them. After keeping them for about a year, I decided they weren't for me. However, I thought the bass was excellent. It was the speakers best aspect. It sounded like they were going for bass quality over quantity. I think so many people are used to HT bass, they forget what good quality bass sounds like. I know you're going to ask me which ones I had. I'm pretty sure they were 1.7's.

@@AT-wl9yq No you know I have the Realistic Optimus X-100 and they're better than any subwoofer, it's a true woofer that goes to 800Hz and they weren't top of the range but were very expensive back in the day. I also use Pioneer speaker, similar to the CS-656 that I recommend. Really good ... awesome memories of those terrible days when they were sold in places. The CS-656 was very hard to buy, they weren't in most stores, just the best, forget subwoofers.

@@AT-wl9yq Well put. Quality over quantity. Going from my 1.7i's to a higher end box speaker, LF can often sound flabby in comparison, and especially so with a slow sub.

Yes, the 98 just came out a few days ago.

'A partner?' You know in New York, they have dozens of partners, one for every week in the year and side tables ... wow, they're auntie Beanie and so would cover it over with a black sheet making it hide in the LARGE listening place. (Not like in your trailer park I know). But trailers could use sub-woofers that turned on their sides would double as a bench chair. Used to be we could build sub-woofers into sofas.

@@keplermission You did it again.... 🤔

Ive purchased my RELs through a dealer in Vancouver, Canada. Some of the best audio purchases that I’ve ever made.

Better than the one shown here, as long as it has been looked after properly of course.

@@martinfarinha of course, it is in mint condition.

i do like the down firing driver. down firing drivers are elegant af

Yes!

@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac a pair of them at Lyric w Tympanis w a think about six or eight Mark Levinson classA - think that wss 79 or 80

Probably not. Theater subs are set up different than music subs. The connections to start with. The speaker level connection is the best way to go for music, while a HT system has separate channels just for bass. How you have to adjust them is also different. You have to make some choices. Is music more important than movies? If yes, then get a pair of music subs and set them up for music. You'll still get improvements on movies. Or you can do the opposite and get HT subs if music is a secondary. Or, if you have the room and money, get a pair of music subs and put them on your main front speakers, and get HT subs for your LFE channels. You asked for a recommendation. I can only recommend something for music. While I have a HT system, the speakers I use just don't need subs, and movies aren't my primary concern. I'm not the right person to ask for that type of sub. For music, I recommend Vandersteen without any hesitation. The Model 3's are great, and if you can find a pair of 2's you'll be happy with those as well. They're more expensive than REL, but nowhere near as expensive as some other high end brands. I can afford subs that cost a lot more, but I still pick the Vandersteens as my first choice. If you go over to his website, he has a lot of information on how they are made, and why he makes certain design choices. Even just reading the owners manuals will give you a lot of information.

@@AT-wl9yq I have an older pair of sealed MK subs. They work great with any kind of music, and they are fine for home theater. Line level connections, too. Audyssey does a great job integrating them with my other speakers.

Output vs fidelity

@@ns387241 there is no reason a good sub can't have both.

That's why there's a wireless option

Who are they ?lol

I was talking to a motorcycling man on road safety just recently and he said when it's your time to go, you know? It's your time to go and you know the Rolling Stones ... Let It Bleed and all the rest will Bite the Dust soon enough. Wow ... 70s and 90s integrated amplifiers, who says trickle down doesn't work?

Very nice, good points. One benefit a subwoofer brings is performance via placement flexibility. Room's behave differently above and below the transition region, ... ~200hz depending on room size. Thus, the best loudspeaker location for sound and performance is rarely the same location for the bass range. With subs seperate from mains the flexibility exists to optimize both ranges.

Yeah, but putting an SVS PB 16 Pro at ear level where your couch goes has its challenges.

@KimmoJaskari I've got a Tannoy Definition sub myself. Unfortunately it rattles the rest of the house. No rattles in my room though. In any case due to complaints I am forced to use a little Bose Bluetooth speaker for my listening.

Interestingly, this method is not how REL recommends setting up their subs. If you do try RELs, I'd highly recommend watching their set up videos. Also, stereo pairs with REL really make these shine- each draws the sonic info from the main amp- left and right channels respectively and adds to the space and sound stage. I personally wouldn't use the crawl method as RELs set up for stereo subs worked spectacularly for me. In the world of good home audio, there are almost never any absolutes though- every system, every listening environment is unique.

Why what's wrong with class d for a sub

@@carlitosgomez71 I always liked the fact that REL continued to use AB for their subs when many others use D. Thanks for making me question that though! I actually take issue with people posting negatively when they haven't even heard a piece or given it a chance. So yeah, that was a little hypocritical of me!

@@dwymer86 no I get your point the only thing I can think of is that class A maybe more reliable long term and perhaps a little more musical subjectively but you loose the efficiency and weight associated with class d

Quakes? if you have two pair, then do you get Quad Dmg

@@WeeWeeJumbo Haha yeah something like that. The Quake is a small mosfet amplified sealed Subwoofer that offers quick response and deep bass for a very reasonable price

That should be in your phono preamp

If you like to fiddle with your subs, REL is not for you. John Hunter, of REL shows how RELs, pulling the sonic information from your main amp (via the speakons), then tuned just right, will blend in with your speakers. Done right, you won't know they're there. It becomes a speaker system. I have 2 RELs supporting Magnepans, the stereo pair blends so well, you don't even ever think about the bass level. I had SVS before, and yes, I constantly tinkered with the level. This is all about music BTW, like Steve said, you wont have thumping, in your chest bass.

Even large, full range speakers benefit from subwoofers that are appropriately specified and tuned