Avro Canada C102 Jetliner - The World's 2nd Jet Airliner

Рет қаралды 48,797

2 жыл бұрын

How do! :D
An aircraft I've long been wanting to talk about, the Avro Canada C102 Jetliner is another truly tragic example of opportunity missed, the C102 being a sturdy and well performing little jet which could have easily found a niche for itself with many different airlines, only for circumstances to conspire against Avro Canada's promising new model, and thus leading to its demise before it even got started.
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References:
- The Avro Canada C102 Jetliner by R. Dixon Speas (and his respective references)
- Air & Space Magazine (and their respective references)
- Wikipedia (and its respective references)

Пікірлер: 165

@C2K777 2 жыл бұрын

My god, Howe had a passionate, and interfering, disdain for this poor plane eh. History tells us that Hughes was rarely impressed with anything so having seemingly attained the rare achievement of getting the man actively interested this was clearly a missed opportunity brought about by Howe's hatred of the thing. As ever you've provided an insightful bit of history to us for a Saturday morning.

@davehitchman5171 2 жыл бұрын

howes was clearly a twat and wrecked the company

@TIMMEH19991 2 жыл бұрын

@@davehitchman5171 Meddling politicians. No use to man nor beast.

@jamiecanivet66 2 жыл бұрын

I think that with Howe's tremendous pul politically, he could have handled the US government if he had gotten the licensing arranged. On must wonder if Howe had connections to US aircraft manufacturers...he was after all An americam living in Canada.

@donaldstanfield8862 2 жыл бұрын

@@jamiecanivet66 Wow, I didn't realize his nationality, that's fascinating

@BobbyGeneric145 2 жыл бұрын

Its amazing how badly the Canadian government handled AVROs brilliance.

@markdoldon8852 2 жыл бұрын

Canadian government had very little to do with this plane. The timing was just off. Arguably, if the Korean War hadn't come along ,their priorities would have been different, although fighting against/caving in to US protectionism (as they did later with Arrow) would possibly still have doomed it. The Us has always treated Canada like a little sister: "give them a few jobs so they can back us up when needed, but don't do anything that might affect US companies."

@swamprat69er 2 жыл бұрын

@@markdoldon8852 You can thank Diefenbaker (the former Prime Minister of the day) for cancelling the AVRO project after pressure from the U.S.

@jamiecanivet66 2 жыл бұрын

@@swamprat69er and the fallacy/myth continues.

@mothmagic1 11 ай бұрын

No worse than the way the British government our aviation industry

@papaloongie 10 ай бұрын

Diefenbaker got a phone call . Uncle Sam says “nooo!!” They had just put in a whack of bomarck missles so that was that. Happily for the US, many of those engineers went to NASA and many other companies. Lockheed springs to mind. Not surprisingly, many Jaguars were purchased;-)) Lol We’re still bitter about it…

@raynus1160 2 жыл бұрын

The Jetliner arguably held greater potential than the CF-105.

@markdoldon8852 2 жыл бұрын

"Potential" vs an order for 100 ACTUAL orders doesn't get you much.

@raynus1160 2 жыл бұрын

@@markdoldon8852 Which had been scaled back to 20 pre-production and 17 production aircraft for testing and evaluation. As you're likely aware, only five were fully completed.

@uzaiyaro 2 жыл бұрын

Ah yes, a classic aircraft built with four dimensions. Span, length, height, and politics.

@donaldstanfield8862 2 жыл бұрын

The sad truth!

@greateraviationgl91 2 жыл бұрын

"Which got the first three right, but ultimatley feel out for the last one" -Curious Droid

@emaheiwa8174 2 жыл бұрын

Such a shame

@jocelynhurtubise2420 2 жыл бұрын

Very interesting post, It could had been the world first Jet Airliner but it missed being the first by one week or two. And according to Jim Floyd book "The Avro Canada C102 Jetliner " the Comet flew only a few feet in the air for is first flight. The CF-102 flew a few thousand feet on it maiden flight.

@Tom-Lahaye 2 жыл бұрын

Absolutely a good looking plane, what a shame this project did not get the support it deserved.

@nairbvel 2 жыл бұрын

I'm amazed at how Canada seems to keep getting whacked upside the head with a 2x4 for developing advanced aircraft... Aviation history would be very different if not for the decision of just a very few individuals concerning production or certain Canadian aircraft.

@donaldstanfield8862 2 жыл бұрын

It plays out like a cartoon, so sad and ridiculous, looking back at it.

@eat_a_dick_trudeau 2 жыл бұрын

Its the Canadian way. If we create something good, we scrap it, bury it, or give it away. We are the perpetual losing team.

@None-zc5vg 2 жыл бұрын

The British aircraft industry was wrecked on U.S. orders, it's widely believed: the U.K. has a quisling Parliament.

@muchorelaxo5580 2 жыл бұрын

Canadian government bowing to the American government. Americans don’t like compilation. They will force you out of business and collect all the assets.

@torchris1 2 жыл бұрын

One of my Dad’s close friends actually had a flight engineer's license for the Jetliner. Unfortunately he passed away quite a while ago and I have no idea what happened to to the paperwork. BTW, in Canada we would normally pronounce CD Howe's name like "how" in "How are you?".

@torchris1 2 жыл бұрын

I also wonder how much the tragic explosions of the original Comets depressed interest in jet passenger planes - at least for a short while.

@donaldstanfield8862 2 жыл бұрын

@@torchris1 Oddly, it didn't seem to keep Comet passengers away, as they continued flying for a time until the grounding to find the cause.

@deltavee2 2 жыл бұрын

Re the pronunciation of Howe's last name, ho is entirely appropriate since he was one.

@PaulR1200 2 жыл бұрын

Incredible shame, such a handsome aircraft that was witch hunted by terrible short sighted human influence. Thank you for your work mate. Cheers NZCH

@markdoldon8852 2 жыл бұрын

Witch hunt? I see a manager who sees a LOT more need for military aircraft (in the midst of a "police action"/war) than he does in a new concept. That's not a witch hunt, that's a (perhaps short sighted,) legitimate bet). When the US began applying protectionist cold war policies, Canada's chance to take a real leading role was essentially gone. Hundreds of aircraft have come and gone over the years, often failing for much less logical reasons.

@joshuaharlow4241 2 жыл бұрын

Wow! Always learning something new! The C102 was not in "catalog" of aircraft... thank you for making the video!!! Well done as always! Love the format.

@martentrudeau6948 2 жыл бұрын

It seems there was a conspiracy to kill Avro Canada C102 Jetliner. To bad, it should have had great success. Thanks Ruairidh, great history and video.

@leftcoaster67 Жыл бұрын

The Korean War was on and C.D. Howe wanted Avro to get the CF-100 Canuck in production as fast as possible. But he didn't understand you could easily have built both at the same time. TCA was never really invested with the C-102. It's sad that Rolls Royce said that the Avon engine was only a military aircraft. Yet later on the DeHavilliand Comet would use Avon engines.

@wraithconscience 2 жыл бұрын

Hi Ruairidh, another fantastic video. Thanks so much. 😊

@macjim 2 жыл бұрын

While you're on the subject of Canadian aircraft, and it's aircraft industry, the next aircraft to cover would be the Avro Arrow... One of two great losses (the Arrow and the TSR2).

@donaldstanfield8862 2 жыл бұрын

All these aircraft were such exciting and capable examples, it makes it very sad for what might have developed from them. Their loss was a horrible blow to the industry and families associated with it, it's disturbing to think American political influence caused these loses.

@drewthompson7457 Жыл бұрын

I have wasted some time wondering what Avro Canada's 4th aircraft would have been.

@TheHylianBatman 2 жыл бұрын

What a storied development, and what lost potential. I always like learning about missed opportunities like these; who knows what might've gone different if things had unfolded in a different order? I know this doesn't have much to do with the video, but it is so odd to see British troops firing in lines in color footage and contemporary uniforms, instead of re-enactment uniforms. They really clung on as long as possible to their tactics, huh? I also don't normally think of Canada when I think of developing new things, so that's good. I'm always glad to learn more Canadian history.

@zanelindsay1267 Жыл бұрын

A really fascinating documentary on a facet of jet aircraft development which I had never heard of before. I have found all of these "Motion History" stories to be really interesting and well done in a concise format.

@trevorhart545 2 жыл бұрын

From UK. Canada punching above its weight. Avro Arrow a threat to US Aerospace. Canada and Australia have always been Innovators and this is not because the UK "taught you aerospace skills" they were already there but that cooperation produces more than the sum of the individuals. Canadian company working with the UK on a new style Fusion Reactor is another example. Just stop beating us at the sports we invented, please!

@dalecaldwell 2 жыл бұрын

A sad story I had neve heard before. Thank you fo this fascinating video.

@roymanzini2521 Жыл бұрын

Avro C102 Jetliner was probably the biggest commercial missed opportunity for Canada. Unfortunately, AVRO was managed by C.D. Howe's handpicked managers who would not dare stand up to him. AVRO is a cautionary tale about industry totally dependent on government contracts and their whims.

@RonJohn63 2 жыл бұрын

As an American: thanks, C.D. Howe!!

@drewthompson7457 Жыл бұрын

I'm pretty sure Canadian politics would have messed it up even without C. D. Howes' help.....

@britishfilmguy 2 жыл бұрын

Do like these aviation films really detailed and quite accurate to.!

@None-zc5vg 2 жыл бұрын

The Canadair 'North Star ' was a pressurised, re-engined version of the Douglas DC-4, not the DC-6.

@viscount757 2 жыл бұрын

The North Star did have some DC-6 features, including the pressurization system, landing gear, and a very similar cabin layout and the rectangular windows of the DC-6 on the pressurized airline model (not the unpressurized RCAF military transport version). Apart from the engines, the airline vesion was a hybrid of the DC-4 and DC-6 but is generally considered as being more closely related to the DC-4, acounting for its official DC-4M1 (unpressurized RCAF version) and DC-4M2 (pressurized airline version) designations.. The first 6 aircraft for the RCAF were built with airline interiors and temporarily operated by Trans-Canada Air Lines while waiting for their pressurized North Stars about a year later.

@TomLuTon 2 жыл бұрын

Quick correction: Victory Aircraft/Avro was not in Hamilton, but Malton Ontario

@daviddunsmore103 2 жыл бұрын

Exactly, on the site of the current Lester B Pearson International Airport, in Mississauga.

@cellpat2686 Жыл бұрын

This is the little jetliner that could...... But they wouldn't let it.

@donaldstanfield8862 2 жыл бұрын

The Jetliner and Arrow are all the more brilliant against the bitterness of their abandonment, it's so frustrating to see these fantastic aircraft thrown away. Sad in so many ways. Did the US influence it to grab the aerospace workforce? Politics are harsh, damn. Peace. 🙏🇺🇦💙💛

@maryrafuse3851 2 жыл бұрын

Yes the US did grab great engineers for NASA but Canadian Politicians were gutless as well. No moral fiber/backbone protecting Canadian national interest. I say this as a Canadian.

@None-zc5vg 2 жыл бұрын

@@maryrafuse3851 Maybe 'corruption' had more to do with it than 'gutlessness': nobody gets into Big Politics without that essential lack of integrity.

@quailking8265 2 жыл бұрын

Awesome video as always - you are literally the David Attenborough of Vehicles. Just for a question - are you planning to make a video about the antonov an 225 which was just destroyed in Ukraine?

@donaldstanfield8862 2 жыл бұрын

That would be awesome!

@britishfilmguy 2 жыл бұрын

Good shout there

@BobbyGeneric145 2 жыл бұрын

He doesn't respond.

@MicrophonicFool 2 жыл бұрын

A bunch of years ago someone was working on an MS Flightsim model of the C102, but I don't think it was ever completed. I would very much like to fly it

@t5ruxlee210 Жыл бұрын

As the Korean War ramped up, a major roadblock for all "nonessential aviation projects" did as well. The allocation of American aluminum alloy sheet for aircraft became more and more restrictive. Avro Canada could only get access to the material needed when building CF-100 interceptors for Canada and Europe. Developing and mass producing domestic lighter, stronger, aviation aluminum alloys at competitive prices, in a timely fashion, was well beyond the country's 1950's strained resources.

@viscount757 2 жыл бұрын

You say the aircraft was so large it couldn't be parked at the terminal on its visit to New York in April 1950. That comment doesn't make sense as the Avro C-102 was significantly smaller in both overall length and wingspan than the DC-4, DC-6 and Constellation which were all in extensive use at Idlewild airport then. Even compared to the smallest of those models, the DC-4, the Avro C-102 was 11 feet shorter and wingspan was 19 feet less.

@canamwing6999 Жыл бұрын

Looked a lot like the Avro Ashton!

@davidgill2592 2 жыл бұрын

Looks very similar to the UK's Avro Ashton

@anair70 2 жыл бұрын

What is it with these Canadians...they can design and build great and innovative aircraft but these are then shot down by their own government!

@rugosetexture2716 2 жыл бұрын

It's politics, I'm afraid. C.D. Howe was a 'Liberal'.

@georgebarnes8163 2 жыл бұрын

Same in the UK, the UK government killed of practically all UK aircraft manufacturers in a very short time.

@TheOldGord 2 жыл бұрын

Politicians and bureaucrats in Canada have a history of suppressing Canadian business and innovation. The Jetliner, Avro Arrow, the whole Canadian petroleum industry are just a few examples.

@eat_a_dick_trudeau 2 жыл бұрын

Our government likes to keep up our record as the losing team.

@anair70 2 жыл бұрын

@@eat_a_dick_trudeau a lot of countries are torpedoed by their own leaders!. Have a great week ahead!

@chasermalloy7406 2 жыл бұрын

Look like it would have been the pick of the two designs. At lest it had round windows !

@grahamhufton7715 2 жыл бұрын

Avro (victory) was in Malton Ontario not Hamilton. Sight of the current Pearson airport (YYZ)

@drstevenrey Жыл бұрын

So, the C102 was actually a better built and better engined Avro Ashton. That would mean that is was not the second, but the third jet airliner in the air, since the Ashton was a year ahead of the Comet.

@drstevenrey 16 күн бұрын

I just found out that Clarence D. Howe died in the same hospital and on the same day as I was born. I hope I did not inherit any of his failings, as there are so many.

@uzaiyaro Жыл бұрын

8:20 and that’s why we perform first flights with the landing gear down. Not sure about the second flights though.

@mikelarin8037 2 жыл бұрын

What's the tailess jet at 2:00? Edit: found it. The DH 108

@robertbalazslorincz8218 2 жыл бұрын

"DC-3" *Actually, that's a Lockheed L-12 Electra Junior if I'm not mistaken. oopsies.*

@viscount757 2 жыл бұрын

No, it's a Lockheed 14 Super Electra.

@cellpat2686 Жыл бұрын

By the time the 707 and the DC8 entered the picture, it became impossible for everyone else to compete.

@melvyncox3361 2 жыл бұрын

Such a looker of an aircraft.Such a shame the events went against it.lt would have changed the aviation sector irrevocably!

@hjhkgjfawdferyyurv1222 2 жыл бұрын

ngl have the search it up to know it

@barryervin8536 2 жыл бұрын

Why would it have to be parked way out away from the terminal because it was "too large"? It was smaller and lighter than a DC-6. Just some general paranoia about those new-fangled jet engines?

@drewthompson7457 Жыл бұрын

Ive wondered what Avro Canada's 4th aircraft would have been, had they survived long enough

@viscount757 2 жыл бұрын

The lack of swept wings would have made it very uncompetitive in speed with the other early commercial jets then under development such as the Boeing 707 and Caravelle. Even the original Comet 1 had modestly swept wings.

@drewthompson7457 Жыл бұрын

It was built as an early short haul aircraft. Ultimate speed wasn't as important as being able to use existing airports. It was chopped up before the 707 flew.

@ahmedahm1 2 жыл бұрын

We need someone to bring back Canadian ingenuity ! This project AVRO was going to hurt Big American corp

@kidmohair8151 2 жыл бұрын

oh Canada

@papaloongie 5 ай бұрын

I just discovered that C.D. Howe was American born!!

@andyrob3259 2 жыл бұрын

Says everything about Canada and its government and people that not one finger was lifted to preserve the air frame. Couldn’t find anyone anywhere to store it - ffs. In a nation that has no problem with over abundance of shopping malls and drive through restaurants and finding land for them, no one has an acre of land to build a warehouse?

@None-zc5vg 2 жыл бұрын

The same in the U.K.: not one of the thousands of WW2 'Halifax' bombers was preserved intact after the war: it took Canadians to raise a damaged airframe from a Norwegian lake and restore it to near-perfect condition. A similar one found by the Brits was left as found, rusted and damaged.

@ydhirsch Жыл бұрын

Canadair North Star was a DC-4 variant, not DC-6.

@TropicTrdr Жыл бұрын

The nose and cockpit resembles a Lockheed Jetstar.

@s.kirtivasen15699 2 жыл бұрын

Hi.

@an_asian_guy 2 жыл бұрын

dam I never knew how the country I was born in made the second Jetliner

@drewthompson7457 Жыл бұрын

Canada likes to keep quite about it's achievements. Have you heard of the HMCS Bras d'Or? It had to use an American engine, as Canada shut down jet engines along with Avro.

@barrydysert2974 2 жыл бұрын

AVRO is indeed a sad tail

@georgebarnes8163 2 жыл бұрын

Yep, both of them.

@andrewallen9993 Жыл бұрын

I always thought it was the first?

@nikoscosmos 2 жыл бұрын

Bombardier isn't what it used to be having sold off all aircraft lines except Global Express.

@randyblu25 Жыл бұрын

Bombardier is gonna be in the history books by 2030, the direction they are going will bankrupt them

@coreyandnathanielchartier3749 2 жыл бұрын

Rolls-Royce torpedoes yet another project. They screwed Bristol, Saunders-Roe, Avro (CF102, CF105), Westland, and others, I suspect. CD Howe finally drove in the last nail in the coffin. This Jetliner could have made some money for AVRO. Same with the Orenda line of engines.

@scootergeorge7089 2 жыл бұрын

0:50 Not a DC3, Lockheed Electra?

@viscount757 2 жыл бұрын

Yes, Lockheed 14 Super Electra.

@Banglish123 2 жыл бұрын

He even sketched in the chem trails

@kiwitrainguy Жыл бұрын

They were speed lines to make it look like it was going fast. zoom, zoom!

@michaeloreilly657 2 жыл бұрын

Did someone say, war is good for innovation?

@refiandikrisnawan Жыл бұрын

hello Ruairidh MacVeigh, I'm admin of the modelkitindo channel, I ask permission to hanging this video on my channel as a teaser, and I will enclose your channel name on the video and link in description ... thank you

@GreatPolishWingedHussars 2 жыл бұрын

Too bad the Canadians don't produce jets anymore. In any case, in the 1950s they were they build first-class jets, not only in the civilian sector but also in the military sector, such as the fighter jets Avro CF-100 "Canuck" or CF-105 "Arrow".

@edshed6009 2 жыл бұрын

These Motion documentaries are superb and the research incredibly thorough. Is Mr McVeigh an AI creation? The pronunciation of Howe as Ho is not English. It's more like a voice generation mistake. Perhaps the mysterious Mr McVeigh could include himself as a subject?

@21stcenturybohemian Жыл бұрын

Spoken like a true Canadian who has become dummied down by Americanisms. Howe, in the UK, is indeed pronounced "Hoe". Parts of Canada are infamous for mispronunciations, like in Peterborough, where one of the main roads with the Scottish name Monaghan, is locally mispronounced as Moniggan. I blame it on the Irish. And I am being serious. It seems only in places the Irish settled in numbers that you get stupid shit like two roads intersecting that have the same name, or two roads intersect another road, where each of the two roads have the same name with one being called a lane, and the other street, or a contiguous street has one name on the left of an intersection, and another name on the right. Its frikkin lunacy and it drives me crazy.

@amniote69 Жыл бұрын

Um... Well... Only if UK pronunciation has changed significantly recently. I clearly remember Chancellor of the Exchequer Sir Geoffrey Howe being pronounced as "How".

@jimsvideos7201 2 жыл бұрын

Howe in this context rhymes with cow.

@nikoscosmos 2 жыл бұрын

Northstar or Argonaut was DC4 based, not DC6.

@terencewong-lane4309 2 жыл бұрын

The Northstar was technically a DC-4-sized DC-6 with Rolls-Royce Merlin engines......

@nikoscosmos 2 жыл бұрын

@@terencewong-lane4309 a bit of a mongrel!

@viscount757 2 жыл бұрын

@@terencewong-lane4309 Yes, it was a hybrid of the DC-4 and DC-6 with several DC-6 features. Also, North Star is two words, not Northstar.

@gkjsooley 2 жыл бұрын

Oh Cana-duh. We never miss a chance to shoot ourselves in the foot... P.S. "Howe" is pronounced the same as "how," as in "How you doin'?" Greetings from the G7's least world class/most boring capital.

@anthonyxuereb792 2 жыл бұрын

How many occasions have there been when the undercarriage has failed, more than I have hair on my head. Is it that difficult to make it work 100 per cent of the time (99% won't do) knowing how important it is?

@smorris12 2 жыл бұрын

100% is readily achievable. But about a 100 times more expensive!

@donaldstanfield8862 2 жыл бұрын

@@smorris12 No doubt!

@anthonyxuereb792 2 жыл бұрын

@@smorris12 I just remembered, recently watching a video on a German WWII prototype aircraft, the makers gave it a FIXED under carriage whilst testing because they knew the potential of it failing, smart thinking.

@CDBC 2 жыл бұрын

I'm sorry to hear of your hair loss ...

@anthonyxuereb792 2 жыл бұрын

@@CDBC just call me Yul Brynner

@samuelsmith6281 2 жыл бұрын

Once again poor management and politics sets back an industry.

@reinhardlehmann8161 2 жыл бұрын

Great pity !

@edletain385 Жыл бұрын

C. D. Howe's name is pronounced How, not Ho.

@21stcenturybohemian Жыл бұрын

Wrong. English comes from England, England is in the UK, and in the UK, Howe is pronounced Hoe.

@21stcenturybohemian 2 жыл бұрын

It is pronounced C. D. 'How' (the 'e' is silent), not Hoe. It is not so much bad management by government or industry... it was, and still is, American protectionism and corporate corruption that hurt(s) our industry. America has always been a country which government is "for business, by business", not people. As far as it is concerned, Canada is a wholly owned subsidiary.

@drstevenrey 11 ай бұрын

I never understood the concept that an engine needs to be either civil or military. Both aircraft fleets fly over my personal head and none of the two has the habit of crashing and burning in my face. Hence, why on earth would I not be able to use a so called military engine in a civil aircraft. That is just plain stupid.

@thomasburke7995 2 жыл бұрын

Imagine. Steve jobs going to his boss .. look at this cool music player.. it's all digital. Thousands of songs to listen to. And no cassettes to carry. . That's quaint says the boss .. now go back to your cubicle and pour all your skills in to making our New phonograph smaller so it can play compact disks.. that is exactly what happened here.. a shorter sighted politically motivated leader only concerned with his own best interests..

@BobbyGeneric145 2 жыл бұрын

Who was Steve Jobs' boss?

@kiwitrainguy Жыл бұрын

The difference is that someone went to Steve Jobs with an idea for the iPod and he went ahead with it. The reverse of what happened with AVRO Canada. Maybe Steve actually thought of the iPod himself but it suits the comparison.

@ralphbalfoort2909 Жыл бұрын

The Canadian government screwed Avro Canada at every turn, both the C-102 and the CF-105.

@None-zc5vg 2 жыл бұрын

The film-clip at 9.24 shows a mass-shooting of prisoners by a firing-squad of South Korean troops or police.

@kevgermany 2 жыл бұрын

Easy to look back and see how dumb guys at the top can be. Large companies destroy themselves this way. Air, transport, electronics, all have too many examples. Government interference usually makes things much worse. Thanks for the insight.

@hurri7720 2 жыл бұрын

That was funny to claim the Gloster Meteor engine lacked power on purpose. That of course is not true, it was simply bad. It is also a bit funny to call the Meteor a fighter jet of WW2 as it never took part in any fights in WW2.

@richardcovello5367 2 жыл бұрын

I thought Meteors were used to shoot down V-1s. I understand your point that it wasn't used on the continent, but doesn't that qualify as combat?

@hurri7720 2 жыл бұрын

@@richardcovello5367 , I would think there has to be two to have a combat, but it really doesn't matter. The thing is that the British desperately try to claim the Meteor was something comparable to the ME262 in the war.

@sandervanderkammen9230 2 жыл бұрын

@@richardcovello5367 The Gloster _"Meatbox"_ was the most effective British aircraft ever used against the RAF... Flying Coffin pilots were too busy just trying to keep the POS plane in the air, no chance it could survive in combat against any Luftwaffe planes.

@kiwitrainguy Жыл бұрын

The way I've heard it was that they used the Meteor toward the end of WW2 but only in UK skies as they didn't want the Germans to find out about this "new and innovative" aircraft.

@deltavee2 2 жыл бұрын

So that's two politicians that get a good one in the ghoulies when I'm out of here... C.D. Howe for the 102 and John Diefenbaker for the 105 Arrow. All of our brilliant designers, indeed the entire industry moved south of the border where they could find work. Canadian aviation was dead and these two @#$%! are responsible, both of them undiscerning political animals of the worst stripe. And I'm sorry to the animals for insulting them.

@ManuelGarcia-ww7gj Жыл бұрын

Dirty pool played by the Americans.

@nicolek4076 2 жыл бұрын

"Howe" is pronounced "how", not "ho". What does neologism "competency" mean? Does it any nuance of meaning not already covered by the existing "competence"? Does "beating out" mean something different from the more succinct "beating"? Or are you inebriated by the exuberance of your own verbosity?