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Should We Abolish Fossil Fuels to Stop Global Warming? A Soho Forum Debate

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ReasonTV

ReasonTV

3 жыл бұрын

Authors Jeff Nesbit and Bjorn Lomborg on the threat of climate change and what should be done about it.
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To combat climate change, the world's nations must make it their highest priority to completely replace the burning of fossil fuels within the next 20 years.
If governments don't completely eliminate fossil fuels by 2040, society is doomed, says Jeff Nesbit, author of This is the Way the World Ends.
That kind of apocalyptic rhetoric "Costs Us Trillions, Hurts the Poor, and Fails to Fix the Planet," says Bjorn Lomborg, the author of False Alarm.
Are fossil fuels an imminent threat to human life, or are attempts to eliminate them more destructive? That was the subject of an Oxford-style online Soho Forum debate hosted on Sunday, October 18th, 2020.
Arguing in favor of the complete elimination of fossil fuels over 20 years was Nesbit, who's the executive director of Climate Nexus. He went up against Lomborg, who's the president of the Copenhagen Consensus Center. The debate was moderated by Soho Forum director Gene Epstein.
Narrated by Nick Gillespie. Edited by Ian Keyser. Intro by John Osterhoudt.
Music: "Under Cover" by Wayne Jones
Photos: Gina M Randazzo/ZUMA Press/Newscom; SEBASTIAN SILVA/EFE/Newscom; imageBROKER/Jim West/Newscom; Stefan Boness/Ipon/SIPA/Newscom

Пікірлер: 967
@tonydecentblackman1327
@tonydecentblackman1327 2 жыл бұрын
Why don't we hear more about the negative costs and consequences of climate change mitigation? This goes to show how much propaganda we are faced with.
@aud9152
@aud9152 3 жыл бұрын
What about nuclear though? Why renewables in 15 years when we can have nuclear plants in 2?
@gregorybyrne2453
@gregorybyrne2453 3 жыл бұрын
Just take all of the fresh water running back into the salt sea and give it to humanity. Co2 +. H2O + SUN = LIFE
@CortezBumf
@CortezBumf 3 жыл бұрын
because NIMBY's still think nuclear isn't safe after watching Chernobyl on HBO. edit: also, nuclear plants take *years* to plan and build, you cannot afford a single fuckup. That being said, the technology is lightyears better today. It really is a public perception issue for Americans.
@Ninjaeule97
@Ninjaeule97 3 жыл бұрын
@solaroid55 or idiots, remember Fukushima?
@bachvandals3259
@bachvandals3259 3 жыл бұрын
I dont really care about way people producing energy, let the free market decide. Nuclear electric price is 5-6 time higher than solar, 3-4 time higher than wind. Coal and oil receive 450 billion dollar each year in subsidies, stop feeding them and let them die, free market is the best market. Bunch of commie asking for free money.
@duplexdown
@duplexdown 3 жыл бұрын
expensive $
@thorddespace2773
@thorddespace2773 2 жыл бұрын
Jeff argued from in essence anecdotal data and his rebuttal time was a repeat of his first five minutes. To top it off, Germany and the cost of energy are splendid examples of how right Bjørn is.
@kayakMike1000
@kayakMike1000 2 жыл бұрын
People in favor of the AGW hypothesis can only use anecdotal evidence because actual scientific evidence doesn't really exist.
@jaixzz
@jaixzz Жыл бұрын
News i saw was that Germany closed down reactors without much of a renewable initiative -- so is now dependent on Ruszian gaz
@HR-yd5ib
@HR-yd5ib Жыл бұрын
@@jaixzz US gas you mean.
@jaixzz
@jaixzz Жыл бұрын
@@HR-yd5ib "A total of 1,449 TWh of natural gas were imported into Germany in 2022 (1,652 TWh in 2021, or a 12.3% decrease), with the largest volumes coming from Norway (33%) and Russia with 22% (52% in 2021).9 Jan 2023"
@HR-yd5ib
@HR-yd5ib Жыл бұрын
@@jaixzz , how much Russian gas is imported by Germany now?
@wbaumschlager
@wbaumschlager 3 жыл бұрын
Jeff thinks he's science based but in the end he's just part of a network of wishful thinkers.
@Franklin-pc3xd
@Franklin-pc3xd 2 жыл бұрын
He's a self-admitted corrupt lobbyist - in other words - a paid liar.
@93jElwood
@93jElwood Жыл бұрын
Wishful thinkers? Don't you mean doomsayers making the problem far worse than it is, or making a problem when there is no problem. As Bjorn points out humanity is not on the point of extinction, death from extreme weather is but a tiny fraction of what is was yet jeff wants us to believe that right now we are living in apocalyptical times. Jeff shows the change from horse to car took 10 years in New York, true. Why? Because they were far superior. If the electric car is far superior it will happen without legislation. Bringing in legislation to force a change does not make it a goo change. Evolution brings about good change.
@vegasvibes5643
@vegasvibes5643 3 жыл бұрын
Bjorn really did a good job showing the disingenuous of Jeff's argument. Which is the standard milk toast pie in the sky version of the problem.
@justicar5
@justicar5 2 жыл бұрын
He earned his pay from the genocidal masters of the fossil fuel and church pedo rings..
@nmn8829
@nmn8829 2 жыл бұрын
@@justicar5 this totally negates anything he has to say
@marylouleeman
@marylouleeman 2 жыл бұрын
Sort of like the Darwinians, no substance or logic.
@kayakMike1000
@kayakMike1000 2 жыл бұрын
It's because the problem isn't really a problem, nor is it under humanities control.
@menieber
@menieber Жыл бұрын
It's not disengenuous to argue for tackling the problem of ocean acidification right now. Bjorn said: we have to ask ourselves, what is the "good stuff" that we want to leave behind for our kids? I would say that there is nothing better than a healthy earth to leave behind. The idea that we should leave behind a higher GDP, or more knowledge, rather than a healthy earth is utter foolishness in my opinion. We can afford to slow down economic progress if it means that we reduce the damage to the planet. I agree with Bjorn though that it's probably not going to happen, because we're unwilling to make that kind of "sacrifice".
@Publius7619
@Publius7619 3 жыл бұрын
I like that they were actually talking. Maybe Soho should run the presidential debate.
@edwinmartinez1241
@edwinmartinez1241 3 жыл бұрын
Haha! I agree!
@garysarela4431
@garysarela4431 3 жыл бұрын
Bjorn got many things wrong. Expect 15%-25% reduction in global per capita output by 2100 with 2.5-3.0°C of global warming. www.nature.com/articles/s41586-018-0071-9 On our current path, the likely global temperature increase by 2100 is around 3.2°C. www.nature.com/articles/nclimate3352?foxtrotcallback=true
@danieljames7984
@danieljames7984 3 жыл бұрын
@@garysarela4431 what did he get wrong?
@garysarela4431
@garysarela4431 3 жыл бұрын
@@danieljames7984 Bjorn got many things wrong. Fossil-fuel-related emissions account for about 65% of the excess mortality rate attributable to air pollution. www.pnas.org/content/116/15/7192 @23:20 Bjorn incorrectly states 20%. Air pollution from fossil fuels are responsible for "an excess mortality rate of 3.61 (2.96-4.21) million per year" .. "a rapid phaseout of fossil-fuel-related emissions and major reductions of other anthropogenic sources are needed to save millions of lives."
@noshowerforweeks797
@noshowerforweeks797 3 жыл бұрын
@@garysarela4431 Nc Copy pasta
@m.hughes8605
@m.hughes8605 3 жыл бұрын
Bjorn Lomborg clearly presented far more cogent arguements in this debate. Thank you Reason for hosting this.
@daviddavison2582
@daviddavison2582 2 жыл бұрын
Agreed.
@dougcard5241
@dougcard5241 20 күн бұрын
He has no cogent arguments - same as all other honest humans. He knows nothing about AGCC.
@BobWidlefish
@BobWidlefish 3 жыл бұрын
Book guy: “I’m not a statistics person, I’m a writer.” Also book guy: “THE TAIL RISK PROVES WE MUST ACT NOW!”
@garysarela4431
@garysarela4431 3 жыл бұрын
Bjorn got many things wrong. It's possible for each state to replace fossil fuel energy with entirely clean, renewable energy by 2050. www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/06/150609093025.htm pubs.rsc.org/en/content/articlelanding/2015/EE/C5EE01283J#!divAbstract Wood Mackenzie backs up the fact: "We estimate the cost of full decarbonisation of the US power grid at US$4.5 trillion, given the current state of technology." www.woodmac.com/news/feature/deep-decarbonisation-the-multi-trillion-dollar-question/ That works out to around 1% of GDP. Putting that into perspective, the U.S. currently spends 7% of GDP on energy & around 20% of GDP on healthcare. www.forbes.com/sites/jeffmcmahon/2019/08/05/how-the-clean-energy-transition-could-save-more-than-it-costs/#2ed988c06c92
@BobWidlefish
@BobWidlefish 3 жыл бұрын
*@Gary Sarela* Bjorn might simply disagree with those you cite, it’s presumptuous to assume he’s wrong. Besides, he did acknowledge we could end fossil fuels in 20 years (or whatever timeframe), it’s more a question of if that’s a good goal to have. He thinks it’s not a good goal to have. We could end all fossil fuel use inside a week with a carefully considered mass extermination program using the world’s military technology. Just because a thing is possible doesn’t mean it’s good, obviously. If you want to eliminate most fossil fuels in your life I think you could do it within 20 years if you tried hard enough. I’m not interested in that goal. Cheers!
@RevoltingPeasant123
@RevoltingPeasant123 3 жыл бұрын
@@garysarela4431 If it were cheaper it would have already happened. Companies would be undercutting fossil fuels left, right, and centre.
@garysarela4431
@garysarela4431 3 жыл бұрын
@@BobWidlefish Bjorn got many things wrong. Fossil-fuel-related emissions account for about 65% of the excess mortality rate attributable to air pollution. www.pnas.org/content/116/15/7192 @23:20 Bjorn incorrectly states 20%. Air pollution from fossil fuels are responsible for "an excess mortality rate of 3.61 (2.96-4.21) million per year" .. "a rapid phaseout of fossil-fuel-related emissions and major reductions of other anthropogenic sources are needed to save millions of lives." Ending fossil fuels within the next two/three decades is both astute and necessary. -Over all 50 states, converting to renewables would provide 3.9 million 40-year construction jobs and 2.0 million 40-year operation jobs for the energy facilities alone, the sum of which would outweigh the 3.9 million jobs lost in the conventional energy sector. -Converting would also eliminate 62 000 U.S. air pollution premature mortalities per year today and 46,000 in 2050, avoiding $600 bil. per year in 2050, equivalent to 3.6% of the 2014 U.S. GDP. -Converting would further eliminate $3.3 tril. per year in 2050 global warming costs to the world due to U.S. emissions. -These plans will result in each person in the U.S. in 2050 saving $260 per year in energy costs and U.S. health and global climate costs per person decreasing by $1500 per year and $8300 per year, respectively." pubs.rsc.org/en/content/articlelanding/2015/EE/C5EE01283J#!divAbstract
@garysarela4431
@garysarela4431 3 жыл бұрын
@@RevoltingPeasant123 The fossil fuel industry continues to avoid paying for the externalities of their product - you pay for climate change and healthcare costs related to pollution. Global subsidies for fossil fuels were $5.3 Trillion in 2015 or 6.5% of global GDP. www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0305750X16304867
@hackerj23
@hackerj23 Жыл бұрын
Originally I was undecided, but Björn showed me just how costly and perhaps dangerous it is to pursue extreme climate solutions.
@Kunfucious577
@Kunfucious577 3 жыл бұрын
You know when, people moved from horses to cars, the government didn't come in and force everyone to change. Cars were economical superior and people switched on their own. It was efficient and it helped the worlds economy grow exponentially. This is obviously not the case here. Its extremely inefficient and the people are fighting it instead of supporting it.
@Franklin-pc3xd
@Franklin-pc3xd 2 жыл бұрын
Exactly - in fact my great grandmother, who was a self-made wealthy entrepreneur/immigrant in the early 20th Century, was the first woman in the City of Chicago to own and drive an .... wait for it... electric motorcar.. sometime around the turn of the century. Nobody forced or paid her a subsidy to do that.
@CortezBumf
@CortezBumf 2 жыл бұрын
awful take, cars were lobbied into existence thru government funded programs and infrastructure packages (as well as laws passed to rip out existing train infrastructure in places like LA) to bolster the car industry. And now look where we are a century later, over-reliant on a few countries for some magical ground juice.
@kandipoopipants1794
@kandipoopipants1794 2 жыл бұрын
The World Economic Forum owns cable the the majority are plugged into.
@earlthepearl4161
@earlthepearl4161 Жыл бұрын
Not too versed on history, especially the dismantling of the effective mass transit systems in almost every major city in the United States by the fledgling automotive industry to make sure growth of their monopoly was assured.
@earlthepearl4161
@earlthepearl4161 Жыл бұрын
What car companies killed public transportation? None other than General Motors (a leading bus maker as well as an automobile retailer), Firestone Tire and Rubber Company, Standard Oil of California (now Chevron), and Phillips Petroleum. The streetcar system, as the theory goes, was deliberately destroyed by the companies who stood to gain the most from its demise.Dec 17, 2019
@cebukid70
@cebukid70 2 жыл бұрын
Hey so Tesla, the technology leader in alternative energy, uses *no fossil fuel* to run their car and battery factories right? 🤔
@eddiedelisio
@eddiedelisio 2 жыл бұрын
And to source lithium, copper, Rare minerals needed which are open pit mined…
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
yes gigafactory uses no NG or coal plants, only in the initial manufacuring of the building material and its transportation.
@SourDonut99
@SourDonut99 2 жыл бұрын
Also their cars use no fossil fuels to charge mainly at night when the sun doesnt shine and wind doesnt blow as hard because people go to work in the morning and charge at night.
@johng6637
@johng6637 2 жыл бұрын
right, and they don't use fossil fuels in the mining industry for the their Lithium and Copper needed for their batteries. Green energy is nonsense, if people really want to go green, then nuclear energy is the only viable option. And yes, there are problems with nuclear energy but we should put our minds to solving them rather than waste time with renewables
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
@@johng6637 of course that is the case! But after the car is built, almost no co2 is produced on a DAILY bases...which is white its essential.
@alexanderx33
@alexanderx33 3 жыл бұрын
Woah, the market share of critical thinking was really one-sided on this. Jeff sounded like a politician using sensationalism, Bjorn sounded like an engineer looking at the bigger picture. And the undecided percentage shift showed it.
@dannydelacruz7303
@dannydelacruz7303 3 жыл бұрын
"Category 6 hurricanes don't exist and we have seen some already"
@gregorybyrne2453
@gregorybyrne2453 3 жыл бұрын
The more the earths axis tilts towards the sun the more DIRECT sunlight the higher latitudes poles receive. Warming the southern hemisphere heat sink oceans and thawing the northern hemisphere frozen co2 continents. Which is why temperature rises first and co2 follows. Cause and effect. ClimateChange is has and will always be caused by the changes in the earth's axis, north star and proximity to the SUN. Collectively known as the Milankovitch cycles.
@gregorybyrne2453
@gregorybyrne2453 3 жыл бұрын
The more the axis of the earth tilts towards the sun the more DIRECT sunlight the higher latitudes poles receive. Warming the southern hemisphere heat sink oceans and thawing the northern hemisphere frozen co2 continents. Which is why temperature rises first and co2 follows. Cause and effect. Warner oceans means more severe weather events. Just energy. ClimateChange is has and will always be caused by the Milankovitch cycles. Planets are affected by planet things. EARTH is a closed loop that self regulates co2 with LIFE.
@dannydelacruz7303
@dannydelacruz7303 3 жыл бұрын
@@gregorybyrne2453 that explains why we seen a c6 hurricane that hasn't happened yet
@nustada
@nustada 3 жыл бұрын
Hurricanes need a temperature shear, if it was global warming hurricanes should be decreasing. EG, why is September the peak of hurricane season and not August if it was simply temperature.
@dannydelacruz7303
@dannydelacruz7303 3 жыл бұрын
@@nustada those c6 hurricanes that have yet to be seen happened in September?
@qb4428
@qb4428 3 жыл бұрын
Anyone who wants to ban fossil fuels must be forced to live without them for a week.
@gregorybyrne2453
@gregorybyrne2453 3 жыл бұрын
Banning fossil fuels would be like banning the sun. Fossil fuels are nothing but trapped energy from the sun. Earth is a closed loop that self regulates co2 with LIFE.
@buzzlaw
@buzzlaw 3 жыл бұрын
so basically starve them
@GeorgWilde
@GeorgWilde 3 жыл бұрын
@@buzzlaw One week without food is no risk for health if you are not already starved. It can be healthy.
@Windsweptzariel
@Windsweptzariel 3 жыл бұрын
In the cold too. They’d have to use wood burning fireplaces to keep warm & only natural fibers to wear. No plastics at all.
@buzzlaw
@buzzlaw 3 жыл бұрын
@@Windsweptzariel wood burning stoves create more pollution than gas lol
@mrmelkor1
@mrmelkor1 3 жыл бұрын
Guy mentions his book a lot.
@paulkim1011
@paulkim1011 3 жыл бұрын
From green to blue yet another nonsensical slogan from a money hungry elitist
@justifiably_stupid4998
@justifiably_stupid4998 3 жыл бұрын
Why would you accuse him of greed? Isnt he just advocating the morality of the anti-industrialist? Maybe he authentically wants to send himself and others back to the stone age.
@nicoleblack438
@nicoleblack438 3 жыл бұрын
He got one billion dollars for battery research and the energy density hasn't changed in at least 15 years. I wonder what is commission was on that billion. $$$$$
@aritragupta161
@aritragupta161 2 жыл бұрын
Bjorn Lomborg was merciless! Jeff didn't stand a chance. Love the nuance that he brought to the debate. We need more men (and Women) like him to tackle the climate problem smartly and intelligently.
@9879SigmundS
@9879SigmundS 2 жыл бұрын
You are correct we need more men like him.
@justifiably_stupid4998
@justifiably_stupid4998 3 жыл бұрын
First speaker says that climate change is enevitible. In the next breath he says green energy is enevitible. So, problem solved?
@sirrathersplendid4825
@sirrathersplendid4825 3 жыл бұрын
When I hear of my local scout group worrying whether it’s ethical to have a singalong around a camp fire I know this has gone too far...
@paulmcgreevy3011
@paulmcgreevy3011 2 жыл бұрын
It’s called hysteria
@TheCosmo63
@TheCosmo63 2 жыл бұрын
@@paulmcgreevy3011 Another name for it is “ Mass Formation Psychosis “ Collective Hysteria.
@woodchuck003
@woodchuck003 3 жыл бұрын
I like how Jeff Nesbit disproves his own claim in the first 10 minutes. His first claim is that hurricanes are getting stronger and references category 6 hurricanes. Then he admits that the research actually states hurricanes may drop more water; they will achieve this by slowing down so they would actually be getting weaker, not stronger, but since they are slower they may do more damage due to being prolonged in the time span. However, these studies ignore the fact that more people live next to the coat. So if a hurricane does twice the amount of monetary damage compared to hurricanes 20 years ago that is to be expected when you consider cities like Miami have roughly doubled in size since then. being more expensive doesn't mean stronger.
@andrewpriest9403
@andrewpriest9403 3 жыл бұрын
There is a way to normalize hurricane frequency, size, and power; its called "Accumulated Cyclone Energy". This derived value can be tracked globally (Atlantic + Pacific). The accumulated energy per year has been effectively flat (+/- variability) since 1972. The data says that hurricane storm season have not significantly changed. The number of Category 5 hurricanes are also tracked. It also hasn't changed in decades. Increasing storm intensity and quantity has, so far, been a failed prediction.
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
Speed of a hurricane forward movment is not a function of its streaghth where did you read that from? Trade winds push hurricanes and they are slowing down because the Arctic is loosing not only loosing its ice, but the temperature difference between the Arctic and Equator is shrinking and that is causing a global slow down of global wind speeds. Jet stream is also slowing down and that is dangerous! Hurricane Harvey is a example as it dropped 50 inches of rain in one location! not over 100 miles! it was moving at only 5 mph.
@woodchuck003
@woodchuck003 2 жыл бұрын
@@climeaware4814 you should probably reread what I wrote. I am criticizing the person for thinking that forward movement is an indication of hurricane strength.
@EMO_alpha
@EMO_alpha 3 жыл бұрын
Clean energy is the future. Thats why we should be fighting for nuclear lol
@EMO_alpha
@EMO_alpha 3 жыл бұрын
@@ForzaJersey Dude once i heard the facts on nuclear; i was like "wait what?". We gotta accept the fact that the left wants devolution so things they think are bad, are good for people who want growth.
@AKlover
@AKlover 3 жыл бұрын
Marxist want population reduction ............................. cheap nuclear would do the opposite. Then there is the cold hard reality nuclear tech cannot be allowed to proliferate outside of first world developed countries. A certain religion comes to mind when speaking of why nuclear should not be widespread.
@EMO_alpha
@EMO_alpha 3 жыл бұрын
@@AKlover if your talking about islam. The worst of them want caliphate on earth which means there needs to be an earth to conquer. They are just as bound to mutually assured destruction as any other faith/affinity group.
@gregorybyrne2453
@gregorybyrne2453 3 жыл бұрын
Not disagreeing with you but lying about co2 causing ClimateChange is not the way to go about it. Especially when you consider the climate cycles of our water planet are continental glaciers brought on by Global tsunami's every 13 k years when the Precession of the north star aligns the equator with the solar orbital plane and the gravitational pull of the SUN pulls tsunami's around the planet East to west because the planet spins west to east. Milankovitch cycles have always caused ClimateChange and always will. Planets are affected by planet things like changes in the tilt of earths axis, north star and proximity to the SUN. The source of all energy in our solar system. Collectively known as the Milankovitch cycles.
@EMO_alpha
@EMO_alpha 3 жыл бұрын
@@gregorybyrne2453 i have not heard any lying about co2 in order to push the discourse towards nuclear. Hydro carbons are cool with me. But i do think nuclear is the next step.
@JohnboyCollins
@JohnboyCollins 3 жыл бұрын
Real debates are so good. Also, I can't believe it looks like the entire world is going to side with Jeff.
@lukegibson9410
@lukegibson9410 2 жыл бұрын
Why are they siding with Jeff?
@cantweallgetalong
@cantweallgetalong 2 жыл бұрын
@@lukegibson9410 Mass psychosis?
@thatguybrooke
@thatguybrooke 2 жыл бұрын
@@lukegibson9410 I know someone who isn't worried about global warming…Obama. OHH & all the banks doing 30yr. mortgage loans for waterfront properties ! Hmm 🤔 *INSERT BIG EYE-ROLL HERE*
@santallum
@santallum 2 жыл бұрын
It's not a "real debate" though ! .. both of these bozos are pushing the manmade climate change BS agenda
@daviddavison2582
@daviddavison2582 2 жыл бұрын
@@lukegibson9410 Because those who are not in the climate hysteria camp don't get a megaphone and billions of dollars of research money.
@lindamaxey3827
@lindamaxey3827 Жыл бұрын
I'm also in support of cost effective and new in ovations that won't cause people to suffer, Bjorn's spot on!
@jpsmith5898
@jpsmith5898 Жыл бұрын
A shame that debates of this intellectual caliber are not held in our governments.
@The.world.has.gone.crazy...
@The.world.has.gone.crazy... Жыл бұрын
You need intellectuals of that caliber in the governments to have those. 😁
@PlzNo25
@PlzNo25 10 ай бұрын
@@The.world.has.gone.crazy...fr
@hunterhunter106
@hunterhunter106 3 жыл бұрын
Man people are hating on Jeff but he seems like a good guy. He's very polite and he seems very honest, even if he may be wrong. I'm kinda in the middle, but I think Jeff is immensely better than any of the climate change alarmists out there. Good guy.
@Ulyssestnt
@Ulyssestnt 2 жыл бұрын
He is a shameless alarmist if you ask me,panic does noone good,to go zero fossil fuels in 20 years is will kill way more than it saves...nuclear power phasing out fossil fuels over a responsible period of time.
@kurtispealo454
@kurtispealo454 2 жыл бұрын
Unfortunately he has some of his facts very wrong. To think that batteries aren't an issue anymore is complete nonsense. The only thing batteries currently do is smooth out the transition between wind or solar (intermittent) to natural gas or nuclear. In California for example, where the largest battery systems currently reside, it wouldn't be able to supply more than a couple minutes of power.
@Ulyssestnt
@Ulyssestnt 2 жыл бұрын
@@kurtispealo454 agree,the people are building castles in the sky while the problem remains..its not like most of them will suffer anyway.
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
Hunter is IS a Crisis I monitor Global Temperatures in 198 countries and also from 3,000 Ago floats in the Ocean. Ocean temps are reaching 31-32 c or 91F near the northern part of Vietnam. The Dead Sea sees 35C these are HOTTER then a Jacuzzi
@nonyadamnbusiness9887
@nonyadamnbusiness9887 2 жыл бұрын
Anyone who thinks fossil fuels should be abolished should volunteer to be one of the billions who will die as a result.
@kirstinstrand6292
@kirstinstrand6292 Жыл бұрын
I believe fossil fuels should be abandoned, yet we cannot; people will die from not having air conditioning, or they will freeze to death without adequate heat. Then, there's the industrial uses that most know nothing about, since oil is necessary for industrial use. In reality, it's quite simple: we will need energy fueled resources and are nowhere near not needing them.
@shlomosnodgrass8890
@shlomosnodgrass8890 3 жыл бұрын
I tend to agree with Bjorn. The human species is more important than the rest of the other species. I'm walking proof of that.
@theragingmoderate7797
@theragingmoderate7797 3 жыл бұрын
How can Bjorn stay so calm and nice in the face of INSAIN lies from the other guy.
@nickventi8927
@nickventi8927 2 жыл бұрын
Insain lol
@MMAoracle
@MMAoracle Жыл бұрын
*insane
@Silentfire77
@Silentfire77 3 жыл бұрын
Great to watch, I do wish Reason would post them more zoomed in, less black box around the outside. It would be much easier to read graphs
@DrTodd13
@DrTodd13 3 жыл бұрын
I've watched numerous debates in this series and Nesbit's arguments are the lowest quality I've ever seen.
@soulfuzz368
@soulfuzz368 3 жыл бұрын
Richard Wolff was worse but I feel you
@idesofmarchUNIAEA
@idesofmarchUNIAEA 2 жыл бұрын
No we should not abolish fossil fuels. We should build thorium molten salt reactors. We could use the byproducts. Molybdenum 99 for cancer diagnostics research and therapies. Xenon for interstellar space travel, for NASA and Elon Musk. The excess heat could be used for water desalinization and petroleum distillate manufacturing. Just a thought
@VincitOmniaVeritas7
@VincitOmniaVeritas7 Жыл бұрын
1:03:14 “I’m not wrong. Those were nice statistics you threw out there” I’m suprisse he didn’t put his fingers inside his ears and started yelling “La, La, La, La… I can’t hear you!!!” Statistics don’t care about your ego, Jeff.
@petermerchant
@petermerchant 3 жыл бұрын
I have no way of "voting" but glad to hear that Bjorn won the debate in a landslide. With perfect English.
@DanielWoike
@DanielWoike 3 жыл бұрын
Bjorn easily won. Also to Nisbet, the internet was before the world wide web.
@HR-yd5ib
@HR-yd5ib Жыл бұрын
If renewables are so cheap then why do the countries with the most renewable energy (aka Germany and Denmark) pay the highest price for electricity? Something doesn't add up.
@KingComputerSydney
@KingComputerSydney 3 жыл бұрын
Bjorn wiped the floor with this alarmist. Data and real information vs hyperbolic narrative
@seandepagnier
@seandepagnier 3 жыл бұрын
actually the opposite. He is only looking at maybe the rest of his own life and not considering a longer term future. He claims we can just adapt, but this is not possible.
@KingComputerSydney
@KingComputerSydney 3 жыл бұрын
@@seandepagnier why not? We've always adapted through worse climate change in the past. The historical information is all against your claim we can't adapt, and we will have to anyway. We've adapted through 120m sea level rise in the last 20k years, why can't we adapt to 30 cm in the next century?
@seandepagnier
@seandepagnier 3 жыл бұрын
​@@KingComputerSydneyWe face far more than 30cm of sea level rise, but this is not the issue: there is nothing historical about the rate of changes in the planetary systems going on today. You say we will have to adapt, then the first step to adapting is to cut emissions. Americans emit more than 20 times more than people in many countries, the obvious solution is to cut the high energy wasteful lifestyle out.
@KingComputerSydney
@KingComputerSydney 3 жыл бұрын
@@seandepagnier You must not have studied the history of climate change very thoroughly. The current rate of change is has been exceeded numerous times in the past, and it on par for this stage in the cycle. Cut emissions of what, CO2? That won't have any noticeable effect. The rate of human CO2 additions are a minor warming driver and only add a beneficial amount from previous levels over 5000ppm when life flourished on earth. The plants a loving it. I don't know why you want to starve the plants and stop making the planet greener. We should try to get CO2 up to 1000ppm, but never will.
@seandepagnier
@seandepagnier 3 жыл бұрын
​@@KingComputerSydney It is true the earth is greening for the last few decades. I do not deny the truth as others and I expect the same from you. Due mostly to reforestation efforts in china and the melting ice caps and crop yields. This is a positive thing, however evidence shows the soil is drying from higher temperatures and the trend will not continue without additional measures. These measures should be seriously considered to promote the greening trend but no one seems to discuss them. There are bounds in water, nitrogen, and other minerals that will prevent the trend from continuing. meanwhile, amazon, congo and indonesia rainforests are all browning. "The annual rate of increase in atmospheric carbon dioxide over the past 60 years is about 100 times faster than previous natural increases, such as those that occurred at the end of the last ice age 11,000-17,000 years ago. " -- www.climate.gov/news-features/understanding-climate/climate-change-atmospheric-carbon-dioxide Why not give evidence for when the rate of change was exceeded in the past as you have claimed? The total amount of co2 is not so much the problem as the rate of change is a shock to ecosystems as it is happening 100 times faster than in the past. We end up with far fewer species and as a result are in a mass extinction event. The populations of wildlife has decreased 60% in 40 years. If 1000ppm is really better (and humans have never lived in such a world) we need to do it over a 10,000 year time span in a controlled manner. Furthermore, many (most) use of CO2 is used inefficiently and for wasteful purposes to do things we dont even need (like cars and planes) that even without emissions make people lazy and weak, and spoil the world through globalization as well as spreading viruses around. The excessive use of energy is a negative effect on society even if it were free. If fusion power ever came to be, the abundant energy would be abused and cause many new problems we dont have to worry about today. The combustion engine is maybe 30% efficient, in most cases much worse. Future tech could allow 80-90% efficiency. Wouldnt it make sense to save the oil for now until the technology can use most of the energy rather than waste most of it as today?
@adammell9499
@adammell9499 Жыл бұрын
So refreshing to see a debate done properly. No interupting and responses were made directly to each others queries, while both stayed on topic without childishly insulting each other. Its both amazing and sad how rare this is.
@nicoleblack438
@nicoleblack438 3 жыл бұрын
Hey everybody let's trust the lobbyist.
@hawaiianknight6004
@hawaiianknight6004 3 жыл бұрын
I lived on an island for over 50 years and the oceans haven't risen at all...in fact, in other parts of the Pacific, islands have gained area.
@taucetii3412
@taucetii3412 3 жыл бұрын
You are a true scientist , by believing what you have experienced and not some unproven theory. ( no sarcasm meant, )
@hawaiianknight6004
@hawaiianknight6004 3 жыл бұрын
@@taucetii3412 Evidence is a huge part of science. While theory and hypothesis are also parts, they are very small parts that can only rely on proof and evidence to take the next step.
@Jc-ms5vv
@Jc-ms5vv 2 жыл бұрын
Sea level rise is the least of our worries
@Sabotage_Labs
@Sabotage_Labs 3 жыл бұрын
So..jeff just made a point contrary to his argument. Water shortage issues aren't because of the environment...but politics. War lords as he put it. California is a prime example of mismanagement on top of normal environmental fluctuations. Droughts happen all over the planet from time to time.
@adamdewitt6430
@adamdewitt6430 Жыл бұрын
On top of that, most of the regional conflicts he attributes to water conflict have little or nothing to water shortage at all; e.g. Kashmir (India and Pakistan laid claim to it at their inception), Syria (the revolution was an outgrowth of the Arab Spring because there's an oppressive dictator), Arizona (out of control urban expansion into the DESERT), China (natural geographical water issues coupled with hydroelectric projects, and they slaughtered nearly all of their swine herds sure to disease and are trying desperately to rapidly rebuild them). His opening argument is painfully absent of any historical or current geopolitical contexts and facts.
@scottfranco1962
@scottfranco1962 3 жыл бұрын
On the global warming side, natural gas has already decreased the carbon output in the USA dramatically. Thus it makes no sense to continually go after fracking like its the enemy. Further, all of the renewable energy sources need backup power to level off their peaks and valleys. Gas turbine generators can serve that purpose for decades, and if we stop blocking nuclear power, this will serve as a backup to renewable energy permanently. What is going on right now is the perfect as the enemy of the good. Decide: Fracking and nuclear power is the end of the world or global warming is. You can't have both at once.
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
Scott, co2 of any kind "Coal Oil and NG" are all contributing record levels of co2 into the atmphere. 198 countries contribute 37 billion tons of co2 on a anual basis.
@scottfranco1962
@scottfranco1962 2 жыл бұрын
@@climeaware4814 And NG is the lesser of those fuels. So you prefer chasing imaginary fuels to real solutions. This is how Germany ended up burning coal.
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
@@scottfranco1962 Yes I am aware of that. But no co2 is better way to go. The sun provides far more heating and power ability per square foot then all fossil fuels. Germany needs to find other ways to get away from Russian oil and ng.
@scottfranco1962
@scottfranco1962 2 жыл бұрын
@@climeaware4814 NG makes the ideal backup for solar and wind when the sun is not shining and the wind is not blowing. There are compact NG power generation plants that can be turned on in a moments notice. The other sources of backup like nuclear and pumped hydrostorage both have been targeted by the greens. This is not rational.
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
@@scottfranco1962 Yes I fully understand but at the same time, do you relize in the last two decades the RATE of temperature change on Earth? I have been monatoring the temperatures word wide and countries are starting to go uninhabitable! Kuwait and Southern Saudi Arabia are now seeing temptresses of 50C and other areas of the middle east are close to reaching those temperatures. The Arctic is warming at 2-3 times faster then the rest of the planet. It is caused the Jet Stream to slow down, to become fractured and deadly heat waves are occurring much sooner in the season and are more deadly to wild life. If a NG power plant can pump the co2 back into the crust I have no issue with that model.
@chriskshaw7601
@chriskshaw7601 3 жыл бұрын
Hard for Bjorn to argue with Jeff’s emotion. Pity Bjorn couldn’t take the gloves off and recommend estrogen to help with Jeff’s hot flashes.
@ryemccoy
@ryemccoy 3 жыл бұрын
Grand solar minimum. Global cooling is starting... Will last for decades... And is way more dangerous than a warning period. Warming periods are actually good for plants and people.
@stargazerspark4499
@stargazerspark4499 2 жыл бұрын
indeed, don't try telling these useful idiots that. they work for their NWO totalitarian masters. they can't regulate the sun or water vapor, but regulating the output of human activity like co2 allows them to control those humans and their activities. never mind the fact that manmade co2 has close to zilch in affecting climate or temperature. how can you implement global totalitarian control without a good crisis to give them more power?
@Jc-ms5vv
@Jc-ms5vv 2 жыл бұрын
While solar activity was down the planet kept rapidly heating. Solar activity on the rise now :)
@Kabodanki
@Kabodanki 3 жыл бұрын
removing high density energy source = using more less dense energy source, which for most population are wood/charcoal, these are terrible in terms of pollution and impact. Or renewable, renewable is costly, not stable (we can't store energy, and the sun doesn't shine 24/24), have huge impact on earth or animal life. Energy cost rising = Less competitive industries = less buying power = more poor people.
@gregorybyrne2453
@gregorybyrne2453 3 жыл бұрын
Earth is a closed loop that self regulates co2 with LIFE. Energy is neither created nor destroyed. On this planet. All energy comes from the sun. Milankovitch cycles cause climate change
@midi510
@midi510 3 жыл бұрын
Our climate and environmental issues are a manifestation/expression of the incredibly low level of consciousness of the average person on earth. I'm daily amazed at how inefficient people are and how little they really care about anything. Saying you're "for the environment" means absolutely nothing. It's your actions and how much you go out of your way to do what's better for the environment that determines how much you care. We need to stop making so much crap. We need to value quality over quantity. Make things that last a long time and can be repaired when necessary. I'd like to see all packaging be made of materials that can be recycled easily. There are hundreds of things each person can do every day to make the world a little better and it adds up. Plus, if you pay attention to what you do and value improving the world around you, you develop a frame of mind that recognizes solutions and improvements. We really need the enlightenment of earth's inhabitants. I'll never depend on a government to fix anything in my life.
@udz39
@udz39 3 жыл бұрын
Book guy loses big time. Making a lot of money out of alarmisme. Horrible Lobbyist. „Nobler“ energy - such BS.
@johns.7297
@johns.7297 2 жыл бұрын
Nesbit addresses the #1 environmental problem--declining biodiversity. Lomborg does not--economists have trouble putting dollar values on values like biodiversity.
@eddiedelisio
@eddiedelisio 2 жыл бұрын
You think open pit copper and lithium mining will bring back species? Another issue that isn’t solved by globalists agenda unless you go with the mass depopulation genocide they think is necessary. Lomborg addresses it by showing even if we went along with the “green” agenda it barely makes a difference in its supposed goal
@danielhanawalt4998
@danielhanawalt4998 2 жыл бұрын
Very good debate. Good points from both. I don't see electric vehicles, wind, solar, and batteries as the answer. There will be a place for them but I'm thinking nuclear. Small reactors, thorium, and molten salt seems to me to make sense. The technology is there, just needs a few bugs worked out. Self driving cars have bugs too but it's not stopping it. They'll get worked out. Small modular reactors can be made in factories and shipped to locations and set up. Wouldn't take as much money or time to get them running as conventional nuclear. From what I've seen they would be very safe. Certainly safer than polluted air and water. In my mind, poverty and education is high on the list. Lifting people out of poverty means they eat better and education would produce more innovators.
@ramonkikochaves6854
@ramonkikochaves6854 2 жыл бұрын
I agree with the nuclear solution. Technology is there, and it is safer and cleaner than people think. Wind and solar has failed in many parts of the world (spain, germany, california, etc). I think there is a place for wind and solar, but they cannot be considered the solution. CO2 is not a a death sentence for the environment per se, but the excess amount is. A mix of nuclear, wind, electric would make CO2 manageable. There are bigger problems that could soon be irreversible. Plastics , industrial waste, drugs and other things polluting fresh and sea water will kill us faster.
@daviddavison2582
@daviddavison2582 2 жыл бұрын
There is no technical issue with nuclear, only political.
@a.k.4o
@a.k.4o 3 жыл бұрын
Polar Bears. Is the lamest thing to bring up in this argument
@censorshipbites7545
@censorshipbites7545 3 жыл бұрын
I get that this is a debate and an entertaining intellectual exercise, but *calling for the abolition of fossil fuels is about as sane as amputating an arm to treat a paper cut* . Anyone advocating such a destructive and deadly policy should be treated like a Flat Earther, roundly ridiculed and dismissed out of hand.
@stargazerspark4499
@stargazerspark4499 2 жыл бұрын
indeed, oil and natural gas aren't actually "fossil fuels" to begin with, they aren't created from dead biomatter, they are formed from the high pressure and temperatures at the mantle-crust boundary and are as close to a "renewable" form of energy as we're going to get. the climate alarmism is equally bullshit, as its entirely driven by solar cycles and cloud formation, co2 has very little input.
@theonionpirate1076
@theonionpirate1076 Жыл бұрын
Jeff gives actual evidence for how the climate is going to cause immense consequences, Bjorn basically just says “no” and the audience sides with Bjorn 😆
@nancyeggen3812
@nancyeggen3812 Жыл бұрын
What about the cost to the environment in the production of batteries and the disposal of them? And our dependence on another country to provide the uranium.
@aaronbrown8377
@aaronbrown8377 3 жыл бұрын
12:00 Do you realize how insane that is? An incomprehensible amount of money to just toss out like that.
@Dan16673
@Dan16673 3 жыл бұрын
these are MMT folks. printing = wealth
@scotthix2926
@scotthix2926 3 жыл бұрын
Dont worry we just spent 7 trillion in Covid relief, that we just snapped our fingers and created.
@justicar5
@justicar5 2 жыл бұрын
Way less than the forever wars cost,
@misha.michael
@misha.michael 3 жыл бұрын
Why don't they understand that battery energy storage in current form is an environmental disaster.
@GeoFry3
@GeoFry3 3 жыл бұрын
Polar icecaps and all the glaciers all already melted wiping out all the coastal cities and we are all blind from UV exposure after the ozone layer was destroyed and suffocated from all the trees dying due to acid rain some twenty years ago. Where has this guy been?
@NewPolishScientist
@NewPolishScientist 2 жыл бұрын
He was eating onion while he was admire his solar panels on top of his house.
@oddajkredki
@oddajkredki Жыл бұрын
The core of this debate is that Lomborg has hard data, research and expertise behind him, while Nesbitt has rounded, nice-sounding phrases that fail to pass the litmus test of reality. That said - it's very symbolic of how this debate looks like generally (actual data versus made-up apocalyptic, fantasy-driven narrative). And as for the risks, there's a great quotation from Herodotus that sums up the fallacy of Nesbit's viewpoint: “Plan and prepare for every possibility, and you will never act. It is nobler to have courage as we stumble into half the things we fear than to analyse every possible obstacle and begin nothing. Great things are achieved by embracing great dangers."
@MightyElemental
@MightyElemental 2 жыл бұрын
13:50 of course it's wind and solar. Never nuclear. We need more nuclear plants! Also, of course wind and solar are cost competitive, the government is pumping money into it!
@getthechristoffherson7611
@getthechristoffherson7611 3 жыл бұрын
Bjorn, a political science major, employs what is known as the 'lukewarm' strategy to impede climate change mitigation.
@tommy-jy5ig
@tommy-jy5ig 2 жыл бұрын
He should be in the cherry business. he's a good picker
@BlondieSuperdog
@BlondieSuperdog 2 жыл бұрын
Nesbit failed to connect higher temps with a harm. In the middle ages ; Lief Erickson colonized Greenland - it was green and half the ice shelf was melted off; it was green, usable land; then the little iceage expanded the ice sheet causing them to leave. Most of the ice is still there. So what if it melts? What if the arctic melts - there was a legend of the North West passage - is that it? If more of Siberia and Canada are productive lands is that bad? The chicken littles all screem the sky is falling - so? Prove that won't be good; humanity has been though similar high periods before - if anything it was good for mankind.
@nateypecks
@nateypecks Жыл бұрын
The extinction of species, mostly insects, is much more likely due to the use of glyphosate and other insecticides, etc. in our agricultural practices than it is due to the 1degree increase which is reported to have occured at this point.
@pavelow235
@pavelow235 3 жыл бұрын
No, another manufactured crisis will be created. But I do think IPHONES should be abolished. 😂
@scotthix2926
@scotthix2926 3 жыл бұрын
Great debate. I just wish that in the before polling there was no "I dont know" answer. I feel that everyone has even a slight bias one way or the other and they need to committ to one side or the other. The "i dont know" vote hides those people, then you see a big swing in the after polling as that bias gets confirmed (not transformed) by the arguments made by presenters. For a debate winner, if you transform a bias that is a clear winner. The "I dont know" vote after maybe (because I have never seen it) a good thing becuase thou someone may not be ready to commit to the opposite view, the opposite view made good points, again trying to show the transformed opinion not the confirmed opinion.
@bearcubdaycare
@bearcubdaycare Жыл бұрын
I got the impression that essentially that was what was done? The before numbers didn't add to a hundred, the after numbers almost did.
@matthewrogowski8526
@matthewrogowski8526 3 жыл бұрын
What is your opiniom regarding nuclear power? Especially the 3rd amd 4th gen small modular reactors and molten salt small modular reactors? Using them to replace all incinerators and fossil fuel burners?
@LChavez7007
@LChavez7007 3 жыл бұрын
No such thing as fossil fuels. It's just oil.
@petermerchant
@petermerchant 3 жыл бұрын
Nesbit makes a number of assumptions that the "disasters" he is referring to have to do with climate issues, as opposed to population growth, mis-management (i.e. forests, water control and sanitation, wars, etc.) that are HUMAN-caused. Climate related human deaths have declined by 95% in the past 100 years. Nesbit is WRONG, but he won't admit it. Extinctions may well be predominantly caused by human EXPANSION, pollution, and other issues, like longer term climate shifts like the end of the ICE AGE, and especially the changes in the Arctic, and not the use of fossil fuels. Lomborg absolutely buries Nesbit in this debate. Neither one talks about how the planet is GREENING because of rising CO2 and increasing food production in many places, helping to reduce big problems with human starvation.
@NeverSuspects
@NeverSuspects 2 жыл бұрын
No one ever bothers to consider how the planets going to need to warm quite a bit before it becomes a negative instead of a general positive for human civilization for it to be warmer. Warmer climate causes evaporation and that provides fresh water run off and fill ground water aquifers, available drinking water exceeding the entire humans populations needs in excessive use cases is a pretty good thing and it is far easier to channel liquid water then frozen water. It will mostly get warmer on the far northern and far southern regions of the planet and in all relative to our perception of the degree or two claimed by an average of a few close source climate models ran for a century from now the fewer people who live in the regions will have minimal impact as when it's more then a few degrees below freezing a few degrees in typical current temperatures changes nothing that matters and is going to be entirely subjective 'feels' as there isn't anything changing enough at any general chemical process effecting such as water freeze point at sea level with a degree or two change. Whats frozen is still frozen and the chemistry for the environment is essentially exactly the same as it is 1-2 degree cooler and will be until specific thresh holds of temperature start to alter the chemistry for common elements and molecules of biological and ecological processes.. A lot of energy is needed to survive just 100 or so miles north of the US Canada border, where it will be necessary to import energy from a distance on wire or burn a fuel almost constantly for every occupied space. No one is walking around in shorts and a T shirt and sleeping on the sofa with the windows all open all night all year round in these regions. Slightly warming the planet will actually probably be massively beneficial to a significant portion of the population while at best offsets a minimal area of land that is currently occupied and developed and inhabited giving 100 years of time for the populations effect to move anywhere on earth that is slightly higher relative to sea levels or plan for and build infrastructure projects that deal with such changes. I bet with 100 years to work with and a government budget to address we could literally jack up the entire Manhattan island of new York 25 feet, hell we could move the damn buildings off the island and place the whole city back from the ocean a building at a time, piece by piece.
@midi510
@midi510 3 жыл бұрын
I've seen some really good debates through this forum. I'm not always impressed with Reason TV, but these debates are usually really good. I just watched one on the electoral college vs. popular vote.
@tupacalypse88
@tupacalypse88 2 жыл бұрын
I have to watch that I never understood the electoral college
@davidgillman5368
@davidgillman5368 2 жыл бұрын
As an actual fact, we can easily afford to scrap using all fossil fuels if we only have the political will to do it. It is true that we have caused the world's levels of CO2 to rise from an almost critically low level of about 180ppm, where all plants die at about 150ppm, to the present 415 or so ppm. This latter level is infinitely better for agriculture and has resulted in increased worldwide food production and in regreening some semi-arid planetary zones such as Sub-Saharan Africa. What is much less clear is whether or not this has actually had anything much to contribute to any charge in the world's climate and most experienced scientists who have not been "brought off" believe it has not. What is more relevant and certain is the immense quantity of pollution we have pushed up into the atmosphere by burning all the fossil fuels and this we must certainly cease whatever you believe about the climate. By "going green" we can move in that direction while bespoiling our landscape with solar and wind farms. There is a much superior new opportunity to avoid this problem along with also not extending the ugly, expensive and vulnerable electric grid. This is achieved by quickly rolling out the new and so much more efficient NUCLEAR FUSION POWER of the "SAFIRE REACTOR" as produced by "AUREON ENERGY.COM" If you know nothing of this please don't be surprised because it is not in the interest of the present dirty fossil fuel or green industries to tell you about it, as it makes all else completely cost-ineffective and redundant. Learn all the new ELECTRIC UNIVERSE THEORY science involved at "Thunderbolts Project.com"
@1986Sane
@1986Sane 2 жыл бұрын
Bjorn speaks like a native English speaker. Was he educated in America or something? He doesn't sound like a Swede.
@JTStonne
@JTStonne 3 жыл бұрын
Stop calling it "man-made", it's human assisted but will ultimately change on its own.
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
JT, since 1860 or the Start of the Industrial Revolution total co2 output was then, 006 billion tons of co2. Today it is 36 billion tons of co2. co2.earth explains the graphs. Humans are REVERSING all that carbon that was stored by plant life that made life extinction on earth and re releasing it back into the atmphere. 55 million years ago was the last Carbon Emissions mass extinction.
@JTStonne
@JTStonne 2 жыл бұрын
@@climeaware4814 plants will evolve, as life does, to balance the levels. They grow bigger to absorb more.
@climeaware4814
@climeaware4814 2 жыл бұрын
@@JTStonne That is again, a ignorant comment. Earth is slowly growing more uninhabitable. Terrestrial land that is normally more arid is seeing less and less rain during LaNina Cycles "its called Positive Indian Ocean Dipole" in the Indian ocean. Horn of Africa has not had any moisture in several years! 55 million years ago co2 levels were so extremely high that all wilf life that would escape earth that was turning into a deadly oven did and migrated into the Arctic. The Arctic was full of Tropical Pants and Alligators. In the Bellingham Washington Chuckenut formation is petrified Tropical Palm Fronds and Tracks left behind by Alligators.
@JTStonne
@JTStonne 2 жыл бұрын
@@climeaware4814 there was a time when all continents were attached, Pangea, so of course there was tropical life. Why do you think there was a period where trees and plants grew unusually big?
@edwinmartinez1241
@edwinmartinez1241 3 жыл бұрын
Wow great debate and man we’ll done B! Let’s be responsible individuals on how we keep our world clean and focus deeper issues like poverty around the world and the greatest threat of all our selfish selves. We have to begin with taking responsibility for our own ignorance and errors.
@kennyd6738
@kennyd6738 Жыл бұрын
If you’re talking about the greatest good for the greatest amount of good then it’s affordable, reliable and plentiful energy and fossil fuels are the only one that can fit that bill. The quality of life only rises with fossil fuel use.
@joehfletcher
@joehfletcher 2 жыл бұрын
Jeff claimed we could transition in 20 years using the Internet as an example. While we did do that, the difference is profit motive. People transitioned because it was more profitable. Renewables are not more profitable, if they were we wouldn't need to subsidize them. The government wouldn't need to "invest" in them because individuals and businesses would do so on out of their own self interest.
@timfallon8226
@timfallon8226 2 жыл бұрын
We would be better off if we eliminated the climate alarmists .
@freedome405
@freedome405 3 жыл бұрын
Oil don't come from fossils
@petersouthernboy6327
@petersouthernboy6327 3 жыл бұрын
We are getting there already in the US in terms of decreasing carbon and particulate emissions. I'm not sure that the US needs to completely stop using fossil fuels all at once - when the net benefit would be dwarfed by highly polluting countries that will continue their high reliance on fossil fuels like China and India.
@gregorybyrne2453
@gregorybyrne2453 3 жыл бұрын
Energy is neither created nor destroyed. On this planet. All energy comes from the sun, including gravitational pull. The best we can do is capture utilize the captured sun's energy. Earth is a 4.5 billion year old closed loop that self regulates co2 with LIFE. Dinosaurs didn't live of off the little bit of co2 unthawed released right now.
@gregorybyrne2453
@gregorybyrne2453 3 жыл бұрын
Co2 is a Strawman. ClimateChange is real and caused by the changes in the earth's axis, north star and proximity to the SUN. The source of all energy in our solar system. Earth is a 4.5 billion year old closed loop that self regulates co2 with LIFE.
@dillonfinessin5127
@dillonfinessin5127 3 жыл бұрын
@@gregorybyrne2453 i’m very interested in what you’re talking about right now, as i’m pretty uneducated on climate change. could you link some sources ab this? thank you
@billfromthe442ndtranscompa2
@billfromthe442ndtranscompa2 2 жыл бұрын
Where are those, who want us to do the most, that can help seawater plants that lower sea levels by 300,000,000 gallons of water per day, while giving us that much freshwater, for our people. Imagine, making as much “renewable green energy” as 12.5 nuclear power plants 24/7/365 days a year, while we get it for half as much as people spent in 2021, instead of just keep building only wind and solar. One big problem with wind and solar is, they have to use huge battery arrays which will all be ending their lives in about ten years. How do I get a chance, to address a climate change forum, and I agree the Republicans need to do their part.
@doranmaxwell1755
@doranmaxwell1755 2 жыл бұрын
And yet.... all the alarmists are buying ocean front mansions.
@MrAndrew535
@MrAndrew535 3 жыл бұрын
So many wise people on social media, it's surprising the world has any problems at all.
@a.k.4o
@a.k.4o 3 жыл бұрын
🤣
@johncampbell829
@johncampbell829 3 жыл бұрын
Amen...just wish more were in positions of power instead of the corrupt 'lifetime' politicians running the show, making their own families rich.
@BLASTIC0
@BLASTIC0 3 жыл бұрын
3 minutes in and I already lost count of the lies.
@tandemfandom1
@tandemfandom1 Жыл бұрын
i can't help but picture a "Water War" as a cross between Water World (except without the water), and Mad Max
@samueldelaney385
@samueldelaney385 Жыл бұрын
Liars, cheats, frauds, and anti-human.
@DanHowardMtl
@DanHowardMtl 3 жыл бұрын
Nesbit is yet another in a long line of grifter catastrophists who have been wrong every time.
@lexsherman2664
@lexsherman2664 3 жыл бұрын
Love this kind of conversations! Jeff Nesbit was much more convincing in my view . We need go blue, we need go solar, wind and nuclear without the endless waiting for technology, because it does already exists, it's just a question of a political will
@jacobeberhart7739
@jacobeberhart7739 2 жыл бұрын
Definitely sounds good in theory but the fact is we aren't even close to there yet
@frankweber272
@frankweber272 2 жыл бұрын
I’d like to see either or both of these guys debate Thomas Malthus. Malthus would likely say something along the lines of: Predicting the future beyond a very, very short time frame is impossibly difficult, and he, more than anyone would have the data to back up his claim.
@frankweber272
@frankweber272 Жыл бұрын
@@paulthomas963 That is part of it. Neo-Malthusians, whether or not they realize that’s what they are, might counter that with something like, the accuracy of our predictions have not borne out so far, but just wait, the cataclysms are still just around the corner. I don’t buy it. The fallacy in their argument seems to be their continual underestimation of the human capacity to expand the resource base through trust and collaborative effort. The anti-Malthusians, in turn, sometimes underestimate the human capacity to lose faith in the ongoing validity of a synergistic ethos and turn to zero sum outlooks.
@drstrangelove4998
@drstrangelove4998 Жыл бұрын
Oh Jeff seems like a nice guy, I agree, but he’s utterly wrong and his arguments will bankrupt is all for generations.
@marioalosangeles
@marioalosangeles 3 жыл бұрын
The first guy has more knowledge on the subject.
@roncoyle6296
@roncoyle6296 Жыл бұрын
Fossil fuel is not going anywhere. CO2 is a small percentage of the atmosphere, less than 1%, a life sustaining gas, and is not causing warming. Electrification will do more damage than good, and is a boondoggle
@joebiz4824
@joebiz4824 Жыл бұрын
It's too bad the greater populations of the world aren't given to this kind of debate. I'm more in Lomborg's camp on this and I would contend that most would agree with him. As such the draconian policies officials in places like the U.K. and Germany would never have been implemented. And calmer measures might have succeeded to win the day.
@pablorages1241
@pablorages1241 2 жыл бұрын
Carbon Tax is a BAD IDEA ... all that will happen is that a global carbon trading market will emerge that will be manipulated, carbon credits moved from 3rd world countries and the net effect on carbon production will be negligible
@fhoofe3245
@fhoofe3245 Жыл бұрын
he didn't pick the titles of his 27 books? did he even write them in their entirety? what a scammer
@mikesaunders1688
@mikesaunders1688 3 жыл бұрын
No, we should replace animal meat with plant and lab grown meat. Farm animals are a major contributor to ozone depleting methane. And thanks to the expansion of market economies more people can afford meat. So the need to satisfy that demand is the #1 contributor to deforestation. So they cut down vegetation and replace it with methane producing farm animals. Plus , farm animals consume a great deal of water and produce diseases that threaten humans. A global effort to join the lab grown and plant based meat revolution would result in a huge and immediate environmental and human health benefit.
@nathanroyster1324
@nathanroyster1324 2 жыл бұрын
We do not have a great track record for creating food and individuals long term health. This is about as whimsical an idea as going 100% green on energy.
@DavidSiegelVision
@DavidSiegelVision 3 жыл бұрын
I don't understand how decarbonization gets us anywhere. It costs a lot and provides close to zero benefit. Why don't we work on pollution, which actually kills people?
@ralphcox7128
@ralphcox7128 Жыл бұрын
We've had 2 ice ages on this planet that means we've had 2 massive warm UPS
@mrunning10
@mrunning10 Жыл бұрын
the climate scientists (you know, the one's with the PhDs) and the climate models fucking KNOW this numbnuts.
@kennyd6738
@kennyd6738 Жыл бұрын
Jeff lied so much in his fist five minutes that I was extremely skeptical of the things I wasn’t sure of. Things I’ve looked into personally and at length, like the fact that electric cars will be better for the planet. To maintain our standard of living and continue to bring the most people closer to that standard is impossible to do with so called “sustainable energy”.
@netdummy
@netdummy 2 жыл бұрын
California won't have electricity by 2025.😂🤣😂🤣🤣😃
@hermanvanniekerk1270
@hermanvanniekerk1270 3 жыл бұрын
And then enters the magnetic pole shift and all fall apart.
@nateypecks
@nateypecks Жыл бұрын
There're several more fundamental issues in my mind: 1. Solar Panels and batteries in particular require mining and refining, both of which consume massive amounts of fossil fuels; 2. In order to make steel, coke is necessary; coke is made by burning coal without oxygen. How will steel be made without burning fossil fuels? If steel isn't going to be made, how will solar panels, batteries, motors, and literally every other thing be made?
@ryanpagan1032
@ryanpagan1032 Жыл бұрын
I’m not saying global warming is causing this but I need $90 trillion!!
@N3CR0T1C_V3N0M
@N3CR0T1C_V3N0M Жыл бұрын
As a poker player, I'm constantly weighing the outcomes of my decisions, trying to balance the risk:reward into a scenario where the outcome is favorable. In the climate "debate" I find it astounding that the bare bones of the matter simply equates to outcome: if it's wrong, life goes on; if it's correct, the punishment is catastrophe. I can't help but believe that playing Russian Roulette with the future of the planet and perhaps more, the future of humanity itselfis nothing more than a bad bet. One we, as a species, would be foolish to take. With limited time and resources, cost, in the end, if the worst happens, will be the very last thing we are talking about outside of how ridiculous it was to think that money somehow had more value. In the worst-case scenario, the economy/GDP/created monies go with it anyway, therefore the best bet would clearly be taking action since the Ev of the negative outcome is essentially zero. For everybody.
@peacepoet1947
@peacepoet1947 Жыл бұрын
The bees are dying from insecticides being used on the crops!
@poxpower
@poxpower 2 жыл бұрын
lol local extinctions. Man that one would make me go "wait what the fuck am I even talking about anymore?" if I was a global warming alarmist. Now animal populations can't even die in a place? Holy shit.
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