The Appearance of Toads on Ancestral Cherokee Village Sites in the Appalachian Summit

Рет қаралды 6,782

7 ай бұрын

This is a summary of some experimental archaeological research done by Tom Whyte (Appalachian State University) and Matt Compton (Georgia Southern University) on the appearance of Bufonidae (toads) on sites in the Appalachian Summit region believed to be affiliated with Cherokee communities.
Instagram: / nfosaaen_archaeology
Citation:
Whyte, Thomas R. and J. Matthew Compton. “Explaining Toad Bones in Southern Appalachian Archaeological Deposits - Corrigendum.” American Antiquity 85 (2020): 405 - 405.
Abstract:
Toad bones, sometimes occurring in great numbers in pit features and other contexts in Native American village and mound sites in the Appalachian Summit, have been interpreted as evidence that toads were consumed, used for their purportedly hallucinogenic toad venom, placed as ritual deposits, or naturally entrapped/intrusive. A paucity or lack of bones of the head in
some contexts is suggestive of decapitation and consumption of toads. Alternatively, bones of the head may be less preservable, recoverable, or identifiable. This study examines toad remains on Appalachian Summit late precontact and contact period sites, reviews previous experimentation, and presents a new experimental study undertaken to identify agencies of accumulation. We propose that toads were regularly consumed and possibly as part of ritualized events associated with village and mound construction. The temporal and geographic restriction of this practice to the Pisgah and Qualla phases of the Appalachian Summit suggests subsistence ethnicity as alluded to in historical accounts.

Пікірлер: 92

@markbothum4338 7 ай бұрын

Regardless of topic, what I love about these presentations is the insight into how professional archeology is done, and the interpretation of results. As opposed to the, "...there's a hill that's kind of pointy so it's got to be an Egyptian pyramid."

@kariannecrysler640 7 ай бұрын

Loved all the toad & frog pics. The happy frog on the leaf & shaved had me rolling in laughter! 🤣

@SimonORorke 7 ай бұрын

They were amusing. But I found them distracting. I’d rather do without.

@kariannecrysler640 7 ай бұрын

@@SimonORorke I normally watch twice🤭. Always getting information worth watching twice here anyways.

@SimonORorke 7 ай бұрын

@@kariannecrysler640 That sounds like a good strategy for learning, and not just in this case, as you say. I rewound the video a couple of times to make sure I got important points. And, likewise, I'm likely to do similar even when funny frogs are not waving at me. 😁

@MarcosElMalo2 5 ай бұрын

@@SimonORorke Relax, dude. It’s Wednesday. I have no idea what that means. I just know it has something to do with frogs or toads and COD.

@SimonORorke 5 ай бұрын

@@MarcosElMalo2 And I have no idea what COD means (in this context). Relaxed Wednesday version of Simon.

@AbsyntheMorstan 6 ай бұрын

I’m Cherokee (Oklahoma, family in Coweta and Tahlequah) and in the process of learning more about my ancestors’ homelands and their ancestral villages. Videos like this aren’t the only resource I have, obviously, but knowing that research like this is even *happening* means a lot to me. Thank you for the overview!! My family neither eats frogs (crayfish yes! frogs no) nor has any family stories about frogs, so I can’t offer any help there, but I’m now fascinated. I’ll have to read the research paper myself!!

@NathanaelFosaaen 6 ай бұрын

Welcome to the channel! I was just in Tulsa this weekend. Went to eat at NĀTV in Broken Arrow.

@yankeegonesouth4973 7 ай бұрын

Loved that bit about the Chickimaugas' apparent derogatory term for hill Cherokee as frog eaters. Love the literary/narrative reviews.

@fgcbrooklyn 7 ай бұрын

This is a lot of fun, like a real wudonit, with theories and suspects and the final discovery. Thank you, you are a great story teller. I appreciate your scientific integrity and the passion you bring to your work. If anybody ever asked you 'who cares about Indian frogs', tell them there are lots and lots of us.

@lorddraxxos964 7 ай бұрын

Shell mounds are so last year, the new hip thing are frog pits. Also, nice Burzum reference.

@MarcosElMalo2 5 ай бұрын

I know this is a controversial opinion, but I think frogs prefer dancing to ska over hiphop.

@mikeimbrogno4150 7 ай бұрын

Super interesting! I really like the walk-through of the evidence in the paper. This channel is the best!

@harrycarter1722 7 ай бұрын

When I was a kid in south east ga, if a rainstorm came up, the road would be covered in 1000s of frogs. Was a squealie, squirty short trip. Large frogs, as food would usually be killed by smashing or decapitation. As most small animals.

@budgreenjeans2001 7 ай бұрын

Either food source, or hallucinogenic source, the toads specifically the Colorado river toad, as it is identified, was very important to people in what is currently North America in the past, as evidenced by its dipiction and remains of harvest documented in North America from the Colorado river south to Mexico and east to Cherokee land

@randysmith5435 6 ай бұрын

I have that cookbook! It says to remove head and skin under water to prevent the meat from being bitter.

@jimmartinette9655 6 ай бұрын

The hallucinogenic aspect interests me because my cousin Dr. Paul Pascarosa went to live with a tribe near the Mexican border for a year. The tribe used peyote extensively. They used it as a medicine and for every aspect of life. These people seemed healthy and robust with very little symptoms of illness. Ofcourse, my cousin had to live as they did for one year following a grant. He later wrote an article in the American Medical Journal regarding his journey and the effects of peyote on the human mind and body. It was very well received. Circa 1970's.

@murraywagnon1841 7 ай бұрын

Very interesting, as usual.

@smokeeater8387 7 ай бұрын

Very interesting. The breeding season would be about the only time you could easily gather a large bounty of toads. Any other time they are spread out far and wide and will hide anywhere. I wonder if they were after eggs as well. Even though I’m fairly certain that would taste disgusting. But during the breeding season they sure pile up and and they can’t outrun you, large quantities and minimal energy expense. Who knows really but very interesting.👍🇺🇸

@EchoLog 7 ай бұрын

Frog caviar good

@julyjuniper573 6 ай бұрын

I’m so happy I found your channel, this is a fantastic breakdown, and I can’t wait to watch more of your stuff! Thanks for making this sort of fascinating content.

@NathanaelFosaaen 6 ай бұрын

Welcome!

@artharrison9586 6 ай бұрын

As a total amateur and poorly educated person with an interest in archaeology, I immediately jumped to conclusions before the video was even 5 minutes in. This is the process most people go through. I, on the other hand, quickly realized that I am an idiot and don’t have the education or experience to come to any reasonable conclusions. Really good video, Nathan. Love your videos.

@coldstone01 7 ай бұрын

An excellent review of an archeology article that gives more information about some of what wildlife was used within the civilization(s) from pre-Columbus sites. This thinking has also put another stone in some of the missing knowledge of the various Native American cultures. thank Nathanael

@user-wl4qr4yz1p 7 ай бұрын

Love the artwork behind you on this episode. To whom it may concern. May your travels be safe and fruitful DF.

@Mockingbird_Taloa 7 ай бұрын

Hugely appreciate not only this incredible analysis, but the mean frog meme game you've got with it. 10/10 One of the first things I wondered was how were they catching the frogs to eat, and would that have an effect on preserving the head bones? If you used something like a rabbit stick to knock a frog dead, and you were aiming for the head, the head bones probably would be shattered. Method of capture alone might account for why so few head bones were found--even if heads were twisted off and disposed of in the same pit. eat: spelling. Stupid autocorrect.

@lewisdoherty7621 7 ай бұрын

In about a year, an ANCIENT ALEINS' episode will air in which Giorgio Tsoukalos and David Childress will reveal that "recent archeological work" indicates that Native Americans may have been providing meals to space aliens that eat frog brains. I think about all of he amazing things that weren't known when I went to college.

@standingbear998 6 ай бұрын

an then the real crazies show up. pure ignorance. we crossed the galaxy to visit but need someone to feed us

@pedenmk 7 ай бұрын

I live in Cherokee n.c. thanks for sharing

@deidrasmith542 Ай бұрын

Great work!

@willhalt01 7 ай бұрын

In another video, you mentioned there was an exodus of sorts in the southeastern US for a few hundred years. Could you explain that and what theories there are as to why it happened? Thanks for all your videos!

@johnirby493 7 ай бұрын

My grandmother, who was half Native American kept toads and black snakes on her back porch. One to control flies, and the other to control rodents. Toads in food storage pits could have been to keep maggots from infesting meat.

@MarcosElMalo2 5 ай бұрын

You can keep a bunch in your glove compartment in case your car gets a flat or experiences other mechanical problems and you need to get it toad.

@MrJsv650 3 ай бұрын

😂😂😂😂😂 @@MarcosElMalo2

@barrydysert2974 7 ай бұрын

Toadally awesome Wednesday my Dude !:-) 🐸

@cynthiadugan858 7 ай бұрын

Thanks!

@sarahpassell226 7 ай бұрын

Before they were considered endangered, when I was a child, I ordered sautéed frogs' legs whenever my parents took us out to dinner at a restaurant that had French dishes on the menu -- a very rare treat. They were delicious, tasting like exceptionally moist white meat from chickens, swimming in garlic butter. I have to wonder if the Cherokee ate some of the toads's innards, as well i always felt bad about how much of these presumably farm-raised frogs went to waste. I don't think I would have enjoyed frog liver or heart, but you never know. Maybe they were as delicately flavored as the leg meat.

@susanpatterson7088 7 ай бұрын

Very interesting!

@jimmartinette9655 6 ай бұрын

Ethnobotany has been an interest of mine for a long time.

@Dovid2000 3 ай бұрын

Interesting. I once saw a video showing a Vietnamese woman roasting a frog that she had caught. She relished its taste so much, that after she concluded her meal, she proceeded to lick her fingers. As Colonel Sanders would say: "That's finger-licking good!" Jokes aside, I stumbled across your channel, and since I am part Cherokee, I wanted to hear what this was all about. Your analysis is most-likely correct. By the way, archaeology is a fascinating endeavor!

@glbaker5595 7 ай бұрын

They were dissecting frogs to teach the kids like we had to do in high school ,😂

@erics2506 3 ай бұрын

Given the fact of so many missing head parts which you explained quite well. A few questions. Why a pit to store or dispose de headed toads only? Seems to me they would use pits to raise as other creatures as well for the future and as renewable food source, possible self renewing in the case of either frogs or toads. Somewhere I heard they would flip turtles onto their backs to immobilize them for months sounds kind of crazy a stone lined pit with cover heavy stones would work better. And then there are catfish or smaller bullheads a pit perhaps a few feet deep with wet mud and little water they keep alive long time even over winter. If for waste disposal seems all sorts of creatures present in a pit . I have a bit of life experience on these edible delicacies. We would catch so many bullheads we kept them alive for days in an old bathtub outside in the shade before cleaning them. Snapping turtles which for some home owners of small ponds hate them. We catch and keep alive in a large galvanized feed buckets covered with a heavy storm drain grates and some concrete blocks, as they are super strong. We keep them this way feeding them cracked corn to cleanse out their system. Frogs I have speared since childhood. We would pull the skin off the lower part to expose the meat a clip at the leg joint and clip off the feet the rest is thrown away. I forgot a favorite eels lol. Great learning on your channel... Peace.

@katipohl2431 6 ай бұрын

Reminds me of Nepal where frogs/toads still play a role in rituals and are eaten too. A kirati shaman told me that they are part of the spiritual naga group. Specific frogs and toads can be caught, dried and stored for later ritualistic use.

@HallyVee 7 ай бұрын

You... got Ron Swanson to read a quote?

@aspiceronni4462 6 ай бұрын

Archaeologist. I would have guessed bass player. Interesting video.

@harrycarter1722 7 ай бұрын

Also, if eating frogs, you usually go some distance away, after killing, to prep, cook and eat. Again, any creature.

@user-yo1pk4ky4k 7 ай бұрын

This is the final definitive proof that the French were the first people in the Eastern Woodlands. Gotta love those frog legs, and like Smokey Bear said about Boy Scouts -- taste just like chicken!

@davidstanworth5543 6 ай бұрын

Very interesting thank you. In the South they eat a lot of bull frogs. So I guess that would keep someone alive.

@AncientAmericas 7 ай бұрын

Do other animal remains like fish, birds and small game show similar patterns? Are head bones and skulls missing for them too?

@NathanaelFosaaen 7 ай бұрын

with most fish and birds the preservation and identification biases are pretty different, but more importantly, when you get 500 turkey bones on a site there's no question that they were put there by people. it's more obvious for fish. so there's no impetus for the same kind of experiment on those kinds of taxa. I will say that in my own analyses, the fish heads were pretty well represented compared to the vertebrae, but the turkey skull fragments were very rare. they're also SUPER thin by comparison to their limbs and so on.

@AncientAmericas 7 ай бұрын

@@NathanaelFosaaen thanks!

@gnostic268 7 ай бұрын

The fact that this was a more or less just a "hill Cherokee" thing makes perfect sense. LoL

@MarcosElMalo2 5 ай бұрын

That’s what cracks me up. The “textual” support kind of buries the lead. This is the archaeological evidence for a slur. “Frogeaters”. 😂

@jimmartinette9655 6 ай бұрын

Is there any indication that they used the Bufo toxin as an hallucinogenic? I know that my dog gets sick and foams at the mouth and gets dizzy when she picks one up in her mouth.

@iainmc9859 7 ай бұрын

Two froggy observations, well ones not about frogs really. Firstly, I read that there was a mystery, on an island, about gull chicks having the back of their heads and brains removed, nothing else, just the back of the head. Turns out it was rats that were specifically targeting the gull chicks brain due to its mineral content. We tend to presume human action because its in a pit dug by humans, its possible it was just an easy meal, like a bucket of KFC, for birds. Secondly, frogs/toads have migration routes that have been followed for multiple generations. If a pit is dug across the route the frogs/toads will just continue to try to use that route. My house was built over thirty years ago, I still, during the autumn, have to pick up multiple frogs from the hall, they just can't climb steps it seems. Perhaps by luck or judgement these pits were dug where they were by the Cherokee.

@interstellarsurfer 7 ай бұрын

I've never been hungry enough to eat a toad. Now I'm wondering if I've been missing out.

@brianmorris364 7 ай бұрын

Im part cherokee and my yard was so onfested with toads this year it was crazy, wnd im in ohio now. They actually dug out around my house foundation and somehow shredded my welcome mat at the front door. Theyve been pestering the dog all summer. Wtf?

@DrDjones 7 ай бұрын

Hell man yeah

@damnyankeesdaughter5427 6 ай бұрын

Maybe they were used to keep parasites off the stored food or beheaded, gutted, and skewered then left to dry

@ArmandoLopez-qt6vz 6 ай бұрын

Yoooo is that a Blackbraid patch? Hell yeah!

@kidmohair8151 7 ай бұрын

it's been a while. thanks for the tarot image of the Kermit. (ps: do you live in a motel room?)

@NathanaelFosaaen 7 ай бұрын

I live in many hotel rooms. They can't bring archaeological sites to me, so I have to go to them.

@kidmohair8151 7 ай бұрын

@@NathanaelFosaaen now, why is that do you think? the nerve of those ancient peoples to not live near your home. really...

@douglasboyle6544 7 ай бұрын

So if the toads were beheaded...where are the heads? Were they beheaded at the time of capture so the heads would just be scattered out in the wilderness and lost to archaeological history?

@barrelsniffer6596 7 ай бұрын

Can you explain the Discrepancy between equating Mississippian sites with Ancestral Cherokee? Is it your stance that precontact Cherokee were a non-Mvskoke speaking Mississippian culture?

@NathanaelFosaaen 7 ай бұрын

Mississippian is a religious and social complex that coalesced through the interactions of many groups of identity and ethnicity. It's not an ethnicity itself like Cherokee is. And confusingly Archaeologists tend to use "Mississippian" as a quazi-time period, regardless of whether the people we're talking about were part of the Mississippian cultural complex.

@jamestaylor3805 6 ай бұрын

A cruel childrens play similar to the 20th century one that included a rhyme and popping the head off of various flowers. 😂 It's a strange form of "survivor bias" to jump to intentional decapitation without attached reason.

@paul6925 7 ай бұрын

I’ve always wanted to try frog legs but frogs are one of my favourite animals so I feel conflicted 🐸

@brianmorris364 7 ай бұрын

Its dat boi, oh shit waddup

@lostpony4885 9 күн бұрын

Why is the thumbnail toad riding a European unicycle?

@NathanaelFosaaen 9 күн бұрын

If you know, you know. If you don't know, you don't know.

@houseofsolomon2440 Ай бұрын

10:20 😂

@MrJsv650 3 ай бұрын

Bird trap, throw all the old frog parts in. Possible

@lostpony4885 2 ай бұрын

Maybe just ...frogget about it?

@hatcherhollerhoodlum4418 7 ай бұрын

Lol tastes like chicken!!! Frog leg feast👍🏻😍😝

@lesjones5684 Ай бұрын

You need Alcoholics Anonymous 😂😂😂

@wmickinley 18 күн бұрын

I live a few minutes from Coweeta Creek and you are parroting mainstream media talking points. These pits are 45,000 years old, artifacts of highly advanced civilizations with granite molding technologies that are beyond the most advanced technologies of today. They also align perfectly with the equinoxes, of course.

@NathanaelFosaaen 17 күн бұрын

It sounds like you smoke really REALLY good weed. Can I buy a dime off you?

@lesjones5684 Ай бұрын

Hows your uncle Scott doing 😅😅😅

@lesjones5684 Ай бұрын

You can make frog 🐸 wine 🍷 😂😂

@FacesintheStone 7 ай бұрын

For a person who became a “Archaeologist” because of a video game- you sure are passionate about spreading only what others have documented. Keep an open mind, there’s many citizens that have boots on the ground, communicating with each other, and putting together the pieces of indigenous history that academia missed.

@poopy_pants_joe1194 7 ай бұрын

What kind of nonsense was that? This show is about a frog who became the first "God" of the Cherokee nation. It was this very amphibian who inspired the eastern woodlands tribes in music and ritual chanting. Please, sing along with Froggy - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/oKuJhpmkzMWYl6c.html

@altair458 7 ай бұрын

Get help fast...I looked at your channel. You are delusional. You see things that aren't real. Get help.

@juniperpansy 7 ай бұрын

Which video game was it?

@masunrise7471 5 ай бұрын

Oh for the love of god. edit forgot my eyeroll. 🙄

@MarcosElMalo2 5 ай бұрын

You’ve had too much buffotoxin, friend. Are you going to accuse Nathanael of perpetuating the archaeology orthodoxy because he toad the line?

@standingbear998 6 ай бұрын

when you say before colonization? do you mean after columbus or the colonization from the north by the so called 'native' Americans overrunning the pre clovis peoples. you talking about toads or frogs? none of these 3 explanations makes any sense. animals would fall in that ya had to 'dig' out? where are the blow guns for poison darts? there aren't any poison frogs in that area. if for food why would the bones only be in those certain spots left scatterd?

@NathanaelFosaaen 6 ай бұрын

Clovis is a tool type, not an ethnic group. The Clovis technology is based on the same methods as pre-clovis lithic technology, and based on all available genetic data there is no reason to suspect that there was any replacement of pre Clovis populations by an invading Clovis population.