THE CHAINS OF TERRA! THE SACRIFICE OF ROGAL DORN!

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Жыл бұрын

Hey everyone Rho here! Today we're discussing the Praetorian of Terra Rogal Dorn, and his duty upon the throneworld...
General Spoiler Warning to begin as the events we're discussing today are from across the Warhammer 40,000 universe. So you have been warned!
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Пікірлер: 102

@amargwari2431 Жыл бұрын

His grandpa's blanket shielded him from the malice of the galaxy

@nathangillispie51 Жыл бұрын

Dorn is much more interesting to me now than before the siege of terra books.

@theroadstopshere Жыл бұрын

I'll admit that Dorn and Guilliman becoming two of the most human and relatable Primarchs were not at all an outcome I expected from the Heresy, or the direction taken by the Dark Imperium novels, but I've loved seeing them struggle and strive in a very human way. Even moreso when you get to contrast their internal worlds with how others experience their presence. Rogal's insistence of being in the room with the Astropathic Choir during the scene here is a deeply relatable feeling as a brother, but those around him feel his very presence like a blazing sun and his words hang in the air with the psychic presence only a demigod or a true powerhouse within the warp could match. And this from the Primarch whose very being was so antithetical to demons and warp-spawn that they weaken in his presence. Imagine the effect the psychic presense of Magnus would have had, or the golden aura of Lorgar so nearly identical to the Emperor's? And yet despite their presence as Warp gods made manifest in human flesh, and the speed and scope of their minds, they're deeply troubled and even relatable-- especially those who were always previously seen as either Mary Sues or boring automata of logistics or defense like Guilliman and Dorn (well, until he went full revenge mode post-Heresy). It's not like there wasn't a lot to be said for having Primarchs as mythical figures and their full list of deeds and thoughts unknowable, but I've really enjoyed seeing the humans inside them contrasted with the legends that surround them

@TheSpicyLeg Жыл бұрын

Dorn has risen in my estimation to where I now think he is my favorite Primarch. He got the only loyalist clean kill on a brother, fought ascended Fulgrim to a tie, and shows his humanity in so many ways.

@Rostov_red_beard Жыл бұрын

some could argue the emperors finest creation.

@jakeoconnor2014 Жыл бұрын

Do you think it was a tie with fulgrim? I thought he slapped him ?

@TheSpicyLeg Жыл бұрын

@@jakeoconnor2014 I call it a tie. Fulgrim is no joke (I mean, he is most of the time) during duels. Along with being ascended, he was toying with Dorn during the duel. I can’t rightly say Fulgrim was trying to kill Dorn more than play his stupid games. It isn’t as if this was Fulgrim and Ferrus Manus.

@bennetttan8535 Жыл бұрын

@@jakeoconnor2014nah dude fulgrim was an absolute monster that can kill dorn any time he wants hes just messing with dorn trying to get a rise or reaction out of him by destroying the wall when all that failed he was like aight fck it I'm out you're boring.

@TK199999 Жыл бұрын

Dorn, Guillemin and the Khan (the Alderi laughing God is said to made sure the Khan landed on Chogoris, instead of Fulgrum as was Chaos intent) had the most 'normal' upbringing of all the Primarchs. Which makes them more 'human' than their brothers in many ways. Without all the mental illness.

@Griffinmore Жыл бұрын

Speaking of Dorn's frustrations, there is also his relationship to Sigismund and his path to becoming a warrior of faith instead of a follower of the imperial truth.

@NoName-lo9ym Жыл бұрын

It's like Gulliman, Dorn and Perturabo's personalities are on a spectrum whilst they have similar abilities mentally and physcially. They're all geniuses of organisation, strategy, tactics and warfare but their personalities shape their approach. Gulliman being the most diplomatic, conciliatory and tolerant; Dorn a mid point of solidity, stubbornness and tactiturnity; Perturabo - perfectionist, calculating (to the point of deception) and likely to overreact to those who fail to meet his often unreachable standards.

@yeoldchief7711 Жыл бұрын

Dorn was pushed so hard, he almost declared "Blood For The Blood God" while lost on the Vengeful Spirit

@KV-oq8qs Жыл бұрын

Rogal Khorne

@DeathrocketX Жыл бұрын

I find it funny to see/hear about this frustration. It reminds me of Pertuabo's anger at his brothers during the seige. Both had brother primarchs/forces that acted out of emotion not logic, and no one followed orders.

@Steezyjo510 Жыл бұрын

This makes me want Dorn to come back out of all the still missing Primarchs I want to see his character growth the most. I'm still shocked that The Lion went from a prideful warlord to an old man just trying to do right by his family.

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

I want to see Dorn return as a true worshipper of the Emperor leading a horde of Black Templars on a revenge mission.

@chrispilkington8662 Жыл бұрын

Rowboat would make a better Lord Commander, Dorn a better Praetorian. We see one of his sons lecturing Rowboat about fortifying Macragge and he has MASSIVE blind spots when it comes to permanent long term defence

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

Dorn would be great to come back as a total believer in the Emperor's divinity and the utmost Black Templar.

@henrypaleveda7760 Жыл бұрын

@@piercebrosnan9528 that would be wonderful, especially with his anti warp presence.

@Erebdai Жыл бұрын

Think how things would have changed if the emperor would have made Horus the warmaster and brought Dorn and Magnus to terra. Dorn to be Praetorian and Magus to work on the webway.

@robertflynn4215 Жыл бұрын

Even through rogal Dorn isn't my favorite primarch, he deserves mad respect ✊️

@ryansauchuk7290 Жыл бұрын

This is true

@julienstam Жыл бұрын

Dorn is an underrated Primarch for sure.

@exspiravit6920 Жыл бұрын

That's odd to hear for an old school 40k lore reader. Before the whole "the nighthaunter beat his ass" thing was inserted, Dorn was top 3 and the Imperial Fist for almost anyone I spoke to. Russ was hugely popular back then, and the Angel but Dorn also. Vulkan, Alpharius, etc were virtually unknown.

@henrypaleveda7760 Жыл бұрын

@@exspiravit6920 I learned about vulkan first, but I like Dorn more.

@burnpitcav1519 Жыл бұрын

The writing is already on the wall for his story arc. He’s not dead, he’s not the same, and we will see him 11th or 12th edition to face the full might of the hive mind. He will come back more emotional yet still pragmatic. He will take more spontaneous action while being tactically sound. I am not going to type a novel but if you pay attention you can see how each primarch is going to come back and there temperament. RG said in dark imperium novels he needed a legion and a stalwart ally to help. The lion has changed to become more understanding and reserved. Dorn will return to be the thing to crush the hive mind with not only sound tactics but true random movements to throw off the final showdown. GW has done great work by allowing the authors to clean up the timeline and have a plan moving forward. The big E can back with all his sons and still have plenty of enemies. The ghoul stars could carry the story for decades with a returned Big E and still be awesome.

@timothylyons5686 Жыл бұрын

He's not dead,true, he's in a stasis field, sorry a pokeyball and a guest of Trazyn the Infinite.

@henrypaleveda7760 Жыл бұрын

@@timothylyons5686 no i think he's still in the warp and is looking for leman, possibly keeping some places more stable for ships to pass through.

@a15thcenturysuitofgothicarmor Жыл бұрын

Dorn is best primarch

@ryansauchuk7290 Жыл бұрын

This is true

@Miron_Marnic 10 ай бұрын

YES!!!

@moleculeCody Жыл бұрын

From the thumbnail I thought for a second that this was "The chins of terra"

@xz569 Жыл бұрын

For Rogal!

@jbcollins5781 Жыл бұрын

Rogal so mighty, so brought low

@cody1570 Жыл бұрын

Could you imagine if all the primarchs met while the battle of istvaan was going on? The emperor showing up with all his power and horus not strong enough to face him yet. The heresys would have been very short

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

My aunty would be my uncle if she had a pair of balls.

@curbnug3487 Жыл бұрын

I must say Dorn. It's probably down my second favorite, Behind Magnus of course.

@henrypaleveda7760 Жыл бұрын

Dorn is my favorite with Perturabo being second place.

@curbnug3487 Жыл бұрын

@@henrypaleveda7760 those two don't get along so well.

@henrypaleveda7760 Жыл бұрын

@@curbnug3487 I am aware.

@sawyeratkinson Жыл бұрын

Cant help but notice dorn was all about defense. Then after the seige of terra and his time with khorne in the desert, all of a sudden his sons are all about endless slaughter..i mean "crusading" such as the black templars. Makes ya wonder.

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

The crusades in our world were a defensive action in themselves.

@sawyeratkinson Жыл бұрын

@piercebrosnan9528 that's so incorrect it makes me think you have to be joking (not to mention is the complete _opposite_ of the actual literal definition of the term, noun or verb, crusade)

@ryansauchuk7290 Жыл бұрын

The best offense is a good defense

@henrypaleveda7760 Жыл бұрын

@@sawyeratkinson they were all retributive, some were meant for good reasons, otehrs were not, most were dictated by the nobles, like all of history.

@tomdolan9761 Жыл бұрын

What if the Emperor had chosen Perturbo to be Praetorian? It would have done much to repair their relationship and it would have left Dorn in the field to counterbalance the corruption of Horus.

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

Pertarabo's pettiness would have lead him to focus more on how he could gain glory than on the task at hand, Dorn really was selfless for the Emperor.

@tomdolan9761 Жыл бұрын

Perturabo’s pettiness is born of the Emperor’s lack of recognition for his accomplishments. If he had indicated an early appreciation for his talent and not engendered hostility and jealousy toward Dorn and his legion Perturabo might not have transferred his loyalty to Horus.

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

@@tomdolan9761 Look at the way Pertarabo treated his adopted Father on his home planet, sure he was used as a weapon of war as the Emperor would use him but his adopted Father gave him everything and tried his best to love him as a son only to be rejected and spat upon from Pertarabo.

@tomdolan9761 Жыл бұрын

Strong relationships are built through repetitive trust. Had the Emperor brought Perturabo into his close confidence by charging him with the defense of Terra he would have made it clear he valued his skills. By using him as he did he made him the distant ultimately disloyal creature he became. The Emperor is to blame for many of his scions being easily corruptable.

@tomdolan9761 Жыл бұрын

@tauras3108 Жыл бұрын

What if Perti had of been chosen. If Dantioc was anything to go by then Horus would have been really up against it .

@blackbuddha9997 Жыл бұрын

A 14ft demigod is going to kick my ass if I don’t get the WIFI up! No one is remaining calm 😂

@punec Жыл бұрын

Aaand after the siege came the pain glove or as it is more commonly known - the gimp suit

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

Rogal is so based, absolutely mogged those astropaths.

@Kristian.B.Kristiansen Жыл бұрын

Why is he based? He is nothing here but a bullying boss. The astropaths are doing the work and supremely well.

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

@@Kristian.B.Kristiansen The astropaths are beta twinks with no eyes.

@spacedoubt15 Жыл бұрын

The word is excised, not exercised.

@DD8842 Жыл бұрын

They for all there power are human.

@BerathorPainting Жыл бұрын

I still hold to the theory that the Emperor knew the Heresy would happen, even orchestrated some of his sons to fall to temptation. So I fully believe taking Dorn back to Terra was a calculated move by the Emperor. He knew he would need Dorn's skills.

@mersenniusprime Жыл бұрын

It's worth pointing out that Dorn had nothing to do with the Webway project and was famously ignorant of the Warp. He was brought to fortify the physical, material palace. If not against Horus, then who?

@BerathorPainting Жыл бұрын

@mersenniusprime another great take! I also just look at how Big E treated the loyalists vs how he treated the sons that would fall. Not to mention that at Nikea Magnus commented on how Big E looked upset. And I feel that's because he didn't want to do some of his sons dirty but he needed to in order to make them prime targets for temptation. I truly believe his plan all along was to destroy the Chaos Gods and become the one true Warp Power.

@mersenniusprime Жыл бұрын

@@BerathorPainting A bit outside of the topic of this video, but I've always found it odd how infrequently the interaction between the Emperor and time travelling healing coma Horus (during his Erebus field trip on Davin) is mentioned when talking about the Emperor's motives. At the very moment that the primarchs were scattered, the Emperor saw Horus, accompanied by beacon of corruption that is Erebus, in the room. There was no way that the Emperor couldn't see what was happening there. Horus even said that it looked like he calculated the entire fate of the galaxy right before his eyes, right before walking away from Horus. Whether his original plan was to orchestrate the Heresy in order to become a god or not, I find it dubious that his plan didn't change in that moment. Also, I never bought the idea that his goal was to construct a new webway. Chaos was obviously deeply afraid of him. Why? Building a safer means of warp travel would hardly destroy chaos, and the Great Crusade didn't seem like a realistic way to eradicate superstition, at least not on the scale required to be a real threat. If you take the stories at their word, nobody's motivations or actions make sense. The Emperor has to treat half of his sons like shit, tell absolutely nobody (including Magnus) about Chaos, do virtually nothing to stop Lorgar from making a cult in his name, not recognize the extreme corruption in people like Erebus and Kor Pharon, and think that Chaos wasn't going to mess with his little pet project after pissing them off. All to build a giant road. On the other hand, Chaos had to pull out every single stop, use a huge amount of their power, and risk their very existence in a fight with basically the only person who could actually destroy the immaterial...why? Because he was building a giant space road? Meanwhile, if the Emperor's true plan was to use his sons' betrayal to create a galaxy-wide ritual to empower himself, then get himself mortally wounded so he would be free to live as a god while maintaining a human body (and therefore his free will, unlike the Chaos gods), it explains all of his actions and why Chaos was threatened enough to act the way they did. I think the whole thing was a huge gambit from both sides, with both the Emperor and Chaos knowing exactly what was going down, because it was inevitable. It was too good of a chance for either to pass up, and the risk was worth the chance to destroy the other side once and for all.

@BerathorPainting Жыл бұрын

@mersenniusprime 100%!!! I doubt we'll get the entire answer ever, but man, I hope we get close.

@BloodyArchangelus Жыл бұрын

@@mersenniusprimethat’s why Sanguinius did everything he did. He saw it too. He agreed that mankind can not survive without it.

@thatotherguy8138 Жыл бұрын

I don't think Dorn had it any harder than any of the other Loyalists, he just had the least amount of freedom to act because his every action would have Imperium-wide repercussions in ways that none of the actions of other Primarchs (not even Robute) would have.

@janelandin9356 11 ай бұрын

Erm what about Nathaniel garro???????

@Zambles Жыл бұрын

Now if only someone would find him hideing in the palace, being dead, in pretend

@wellhungindung Жыл бұрын

You defeated the orks?! Lol, no!

@user-dn6oi6dt7U Ай бұрын

I am the Fortress!

@KrisToCool Жыл бұрын

Do you believe Malkador is the true architect of the Hersey?

@piercebrosnan9528 Жыл бұрын

Malcador sacrificed himself on the Golden Throne when the Emperor faced Horus, what would he gain from it?

@henrypaleveda7760 Жыл бұрын

@@piercebrosnan9528 the only way to truly stop the tyrant and still let humanity spread?

@trajanfidelis1532 Жыл бұрын

Hydra Dominatus!

@scrotusmaximus3043 Жыл бұрын

Dorn!!!!

@christopheraaron1255 Жыл бұрын

Perturabo would done a better job.

@henrypaleveda7760 Жыл бұрын

oh? Do tell?

@emirhaneksioglu4503 Жыл бұрын

Considering how well Rogal did at the battle of the iron cage, I wager it was a good thing the emps kept him on terra. Otherwise the man would've wasted a legion's worth of marines on an offensive.

@Shatterfury1871 Жыл бұрын

Are you that ignorant as to why he attacked head on at the Iron Cage?

@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623 Жыл бұрын

The iron cage was a campaign conducted by a broken man. Considering that the Emperor sat on the Golden Throne throughout the Heresy, including the siege if the Imperial Palace I'd say that the entire Imperial campaign to fight the traitors and the defense of the Imperial Palace was Dorn alone and a measure of what he could do when not broken by grief.

@markmooney9416 Жыл бұрын

Iron Cage is just weak lore, doesnt make sense seems mostly just lazy

@Shatterfury1871 Жыл бұрын

@markmooney9416 It isn't weak lore, people are simply too retarded to actually read it. The Imperial Navy started shooting at the IF fleet to comply with Guilliman's dictate to break the Legion into Chapters. After a lot of meditation Dorn relented and realized that he had no good alternative and broking up the Legion would help with protecting against large scale rebellions. The thing is he knew his Legion wouldn't accept it even if he came to accept the inevitability of it. So he tried to get two birds with one stone: a) Get Perturabo, to attone for perceived failures at the Siege of Terra. b) Let the Legion take heavy losses so that the remains accept the break-up. Dorn knew that the fortress set before him was waaay to much for one Legion, but it helped with point b). The twisted IF Legion reasoning makes sense if we keep the character of the Legion in mind.

@markmooney9416 Жыл бұрын

@@Shatterfury1871 Now that you mention it I do remember reading that stuff before. It's still just not a convincing argument for me, so many better options... and from all possiblities the one Dorn chooses is just silly, same with all the pain glove lore its just... best retconned out. Because as it stands, Guilliman basically pressures Dorn into making awful choices with the threat of another civil war. Guilliman is truely the worst.