The core creation myth east of the Ural mountains - links to and differences with the cosmic hunt.

Madagascan creation myth

English please

@Skydaddy Myth-Busters Thank you and next week they'll be a video on Genesis, and its connection with the PIE. I hope you like it.

The older, the better in my opinion. Though I am especially curious to know if there are any truly ancient traces in African mythology.

Yes, exactly, it seems very unfair. The gods were too scared to talk to the serpents, and so made the assumption they should be slain. This says a lot about the gods.

Agreed

​@@CrecganfordIt also says a lot about their views on parenting, marriage, and conquest

​​​@@Crecganfordwe make our gods in our own image, imo. that "We will make them in Our image" is something like a self-referential projection onto "the gods/God"...imo

Lol, just like Yahweh

Thank you, there is the story behind Genesis next week, and they'll be more comparative mythology in the future. So please ask any questions or if you have any requests and I'll see if I can help.

@@Crecganford Thanks again. I am very interested in the history of Genesis and its similarity with previous myths so I am looking forward to your next video.

@AlxKrex Funny. I call myself a Heathen, too. lol

Skills! Hailsa!

I believe there's a Chinese creation myth too where Pangu the giants body becomes the earth and sky, like Tiamets does

Thank you for your kind words.

Thank you for your kind words.

I do try to make sure my subtitles are as accurate as possible, and so thank you.

Hahaha! I hadn't even considered that, it would be doubly so as everything was written in clay!

I'm sure I could make that, it may be a few months away, but I will put that on my list. Thanks for watching so many of the videos.

@@Crecganford your welcome my friend.your videos are awesome.excellent knowledge of widespread polytheism ill always promote your channel its one of my favourite

Ah, perhaps I shall change the intro, I was thinking of doing that. And thank you for the feedback, it is always appreciated :)

@Blanc Neige thank you

Thank you!

@jmarsh5485 Here is some Pie in the Sky for you to enjoy. You people, as in atheists, are truly the most ignorant people. To believe everything came from nothing is the truest sense of insanity. Our Heavenly Father has the most incredible sense of humor, and the joke is on all you poor hellbound Souls. I will show you, but Lord knows it's probably too difficult for you to understand. The Lord Created the earth and the heavens in Six days and rested on the Seventh. The number 7 represents Divine Completion. Do you really believe everything comes from nothing? Lol, that's funny! What you are about to read is 100% accurate. No dates have been pulled, pushed, or stretched because our Creator, Our Father, is Perfect in everything. That said, when you check the dates, you will see a little box that says inclusive non-inclusive. Some dates below are inclusive, meaning the last day is counted. Also, read carefully when checking these dates, and take the time to make sure you are using the correct starting date. When you are done, be sure to hold yourself in the same Contempt as you have held believers in and understand that the joke is on You. The 777 Anointing of President Trump 1. Donald Trump was born exactly 700 days before the founding of Israel on May 14, 1948, and on his first full day in office, he was exactly 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old. 2. If you count the day he was born as 'day 1', he was inaugurated on his 70th year, 7th month, and 7th day of life. He was elected on Prime Minister Netanyahu's 7th year, 7th month, and 7th full day in office! (Prime Minister of Israel) Netanyahu was sworn in just before midnight on March 31, 2009, and his first full day in office was on April 1, 2009. 3. He even beat Hillary Clinton by 77 votes in the Electoral College because of 7 "faithless" electors. (Two voted against Donald Trump, while five voted against Hillary Clinton, bringing the final tally to 304-227 votes.) 4. Exactly 7 months later, from his first full day in office, January 21, 2017, a total solar eclipse occurred - the first since before the nation was formed in 1776 to be seen exclusively in the United States. All these most recent events occurred in the Hebrew year 5777. (October 2, 2016 - September 20, 2017). A small side note about 1776. Jesus' personal number in the New Testament is 888, and 2x888 = 1776. 5. July 7, 2017 (7/7/17), Donald Trump met with Vladimir Putin for the first time, face-to-face, when Vladimir Putin was exactly 777 months old to the day, in the Hebrew year 5777. On the 75th anniversary of Israel's independence, Vladimir Putin will turn 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old on May 14, 2023. 6. July 11, 2018, in the 77th week since Donald Trump's inauguration, he was the 777th richest person in the world, according to Forbes. 7. On Donald Trump's 700th day in office (December 20, 2018), his defense secretary, Jim Mattis, resigned on the day Israel turned 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old (December 21, 2018). He was due to depart exactly 70 days later, on February 28, 2019, on Donald Trump's 770th day in office; however, this has since been brought forward to January 1, 2019. 8. On President Trump's 777th day since the election, November 8, 2016, Israel announced that they would dissolve Parliament and hold elections 7 months early on April 9, 2019 (November 8, 2016, = day 1 - December 24, 2018, = day 777). 9. On Donald Trump's 770th day in office, Israel's Attorney General announced that Benjamin Netanyahu would be indicted on bribery and fraud charges, pending a hearing. This marks the first time a sitting Prime Minister faces criminal charges, and the announcement comes exactly 40 days before Israel's elections on April 9, 2019. 10. The Senate impeachment trial of Donald Trump began on January 21, 2020, exactly three years to the day from his first full day in office when he was 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old. He was 73 years, 7 months, and 7 days old on his first trial day. Exactly 7 weeks after the U.S. House of Representatives voted to impeach him on December 18, 2019, Donald Trump was acquitted in the Senate on February 5, 2020. 11. Exactly 49 weeks after Donald Trump was acquitted in the Senate from his first impeachment trial on February 5, 2020, he was impeached again on January 13, 2021, for "incitement of insurrection." How about them apples, jmarsh Lol, are you laughing yet? Lol! Give your life to Jesus Christ before it's too late. We are watching the Psalms 83 war come together that will lead to Ezekiel 38 and Isaiah 17 will all take place as soon as this kicks off. America will be nuked off the map within the next 30 days or less before the new year.

Sorry, I have found my videos are getting longer... and thank you for watching it :)

@@Crecganford I like longer videos. Most of what you talk about could probably fill several hours with details. Keep doing what you're doing.

@@elischrock5356 Thanks, to be honest, now the University is open again for students to be taught face to face in the UK, I will have to go back in and so will have less time. So was thinking of doing maybe one or two videos a month, but longer, more in depth, as that would be easier to manage time wise.

@@Crecganford are you a teacher?

@@ariaxrose1 I used to be, I still work in Higher Education, but in a supporting role.

There could be something in that, as the catalyst to start the event that solidified the myth. But let’s not forget the Persian Gulf is quite young, I think around 10k years old, and the formation of that may have had something to do with it as a result from rising sea levels. And so I am firmly on the fence, saying neither I am 100% happy with.

I find your reasoning pretty appealing, some quite attractive hypotheses there on a certain power-politics level of analysis... I'll need to think about your last paragraph once I see more of this video, but in what you write above it, it strikes me as very good insight how the form of this story justifies raising one own city's god (at first Enki but then Marduk with the Babylonians rise to power) up above other cities' dieties, granting your city a theological claim of right to rule over them. A bit of a related kind of analysis I've done regarding polytheism in general: it really makes sense as a system whenever you have one state becoming an empire and engulfing other states and peoples.. everyone you conquer will all have their own gods and so if you subjugate them but match/add their gods with/into your pantheon then you'll have an easier time pacifying and integrating those peoples. The Romans were good at this and it must have aided their expansion and administration efforts. I think that once you have a polytheistic empire like with the Romans then there grows a game theoretic opportunity for monotheism to subvert and consolidate power in that empire, using its openess, infrastructure, shared language and institutions, politics, common grievances, etc. to spread within it and have furtile ground to appeal to its citizens, to point out the apparent contradictions and confounds that exist with what's manifested around everyone in society (while the contradictions and confounds of the monotheism is not yet as apparent since those problems would only emerge as clearly once it become the dominant system in widespread practice), to not say "my god is one god among many, and I recognize the legitimacy of those other gods" but make a strong case that "there is only one true god and you worship false gods, are deceived by self-enriching priests and prophets and all the problems with this society stems from not following the one true god". Christianity of course did something like this within the Roman empire. Once monotheism is spread to a significant extent and level of influence that it gets official state backing, it can start to consolidate power for one god, religion, priesthood, etc. takeover the temples and possessions of other gods that have much weaker support, especially if that monotheism has a growing populist movement with powerful backing and strong idealism. It helps centralize power for the state and expropriate wealth, remove polytheist enemies from their holdings and startions and place people loyal to you and your cause in their place, etc.

I just got to 14 minutes in the video and he says that a process of consolidation was already going on with Marduk as the Babylonians were many tribes cone together and their gods were being merged into a single god with the attributes of them all (and I suppose with 10 halos having a halo from each maybe?)... makes sense that would help unify a people, presuming they have a lot that makes them want to bind together and cooperate eith each other, like being in the same/very close genetic lineage/ancestory, shared language, customs, culture, mutual enemies, etc. He notes this consolidation is a potential step towards monotheism.

Marduk was depicted as Enki's son so there was a definite shift towards him as the Babylonians patron god. Previously Enlil (Enki's brother)was depicted as Tiamat's foe and before that it was Anu (Enki and Enlil's father) who fought her.

@@jtzoltanYou people, as in atheists, are truly the most ignorant people. To believe everything came from nothing is the truest sense of insanity. Our Heavenly Father has the most incredible sense of humor, and the joke is on all you poor hellbound Souls. I will show you, but Lord knows it's probably too difficult for you to understand. The Lord Created the earth and the heavens in Six days and rested on the Seventh. The number 7 represents Divine Completion. Do you really believe everything comes from nothing? Lol, that's funny! What you are about to read is 100% accurate. No dates have been pulled, pushed, or stretched because our Creator, Our Father, is Perfect in everything. That said, when you check the dates, you will see a little box that says inclusive non-inclusive. Some dates below are inclusive, meaning the last day is counted. Also, read carefully when checking these dates, and take the time to make sure you are using the correct starting date. When you are done, be sure to hold yourself in the same Contempt as you have held believers in and understand that the joke is on You. The 777 Anointing of President Trump 1. Donald Trump was born exactly 700 days before the founding of Israel on May 14, 1948, and on his first full day in office, he was exactly 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old. 2. If you count the day he was born as 'day 1', he was inaugurated on his 70th year, 7th month, and 7th day of life. He was elected on Prime Minister Netanyahu's 7th year, 7th month, and 7th full day in office! (Prime Minister of Israel) Netanyahu was sworn in just before midnight on March 31, 2009, and his first full day in office was on April 1, 2009. 3. He even beat Hillary Clinton by 77 votes in the Electoral College because of 7 "faithless" electors. (Two voted against Donald Trump, while five voted against Hillary Clinton, bringing the final tally to 304-227 votes.) 4. Exactly 7 months later, from his first full day in office, January 21, 2017, a total solar eclipse occurred - the first since before the nation was formed in 1776 to be seen exclusively in the United States. All these most recent events occurred in the Hebrew year 5777. (October 2, 2016 - September 20, 2017). A small side note about 1776. Jesus' personal number in the New Testament is 888, and 2x888 = 1776. 5. July 7, 2017 (7/7/17), Donald Trump met with Vladimir Putin for the first time, face-to-face, when Vladimir Putin was exactly 777 months old to the day, in the Hebrew year 5777. On the 75th anniversary of Israel's independence, Vladimir Putin will turn 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old on May 14, 2023. 6. July 11, 2018, in the 77th week since Donald Trump's inauguration, he was the 777th richest person in the world, according to Forbes. 7. On Donald Trump's 700th day in office (December 20, 2018), his defense secretary, Jim Mattis, resigned on the day Israel turned 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old (December 21, 2018). He was due to depart exactly 70 days later, on February 28, 2019, on Donald Trump's 770th day in office; however, this has since been brought forward to January 1, 2019. 8. On President Trump's 777th day since the election, November 8, 2016, Israel announced that they would dissolve Parliament and hold elections 7 months early on April 9, 2019 (November 8, 2016, = day 1 - December 24, 2018, = day 777). 9. On Donald Trump's 770th day in office, Israel's Attorney General announced that Benjamin Netanyahu would be indicted on bribery and fraud charges, pending a hearing. This marks the first time a sitting Prime Minister faces criminal charges, and the announcement comes exactly 40 days before Israel's elections on April 9, 2019. 10. The Senate impeachment trial of Donald Trump began on January 21, 2020, exactly three years to the day from his first full day in office when he was 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old. He was 73 years, 7 months, and 7 days old on his first trial day. Exactly 7 weeks after the U.S. House of Representatives voted to impeach him on December 18, 2019, Donald Trump was acquitted in the Senate on February 5, 2020. 11. Exactly 49 weeks after Donald Trump was acquitted in the Senate from his first impeachment trial on February 5, 2020, he was impeached again on January 13, 2021, for "incitement of insurrection." How about them apples? Lol, are you laughing yet? Lol! Give your life to Jesus Christ before it's too late. We are watching the Psalms 83 war come together, leading to Ezekiel 38 and Isaiah 17, which will all occur as soon as this happens. America will be nuked off the map within 30 days or less before the new year. The election was stolen, and the Lord let it happen to show how corrupt the godless abortion-loving left really is. God is the Kingmaker.

Thank you, it’s quite an epic

It is on my To Do list

@@Crecganford I'm sure you are extremely busy and I've just discovered you're channel so got loads to catch up on in the mean time 😉

You people, as in atheists, are truly the most ignorant people. To believe everything came from nothing is the truest sense of insanity. Our Heavenly Father has the most incredible sense of humor, and the joke is on all you poor hellbound Souls. I will show you, but Lord knows it's probably too difficult for you to understand. The Lord Created the earth and the heavens in Six days and rested on the Seventh. The number 7 represents Divine Completion. Do you really believe everything comes from nothing? Lol, that's funny! What you are about to read is 100% accurate. No dates have been pulled, pushed, or stretched because our Creator, Our Father, is Perfect in everything. That said, when you check the dates, you will see a little box that says inclusive non-inclusive. Some dates below are inclusive, meaning the last day is counted. Also, read carefully when checking these dates, and take the time to make sure you are using the correct starting date. When you are done, be sure to hold yourself in the same Contempt as you have held believers in and understand that the joke is on You. The 777 Anointing of President Trump 1. Donald Trump was born exactly 700 days before the founding of Israel on May 14, 1948, and on his first full day in office, he was exactly 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old. 2. If you count the day he was born as 'day 1', he was inaugurated on his 70th year, 7th month, and 7th day of life. He was elected on Prime Minister Netanyahu's 7th year, 7th month, and 7th full day in office! (Prime Minister of Israel) Netanyahu was sworn in just before midnight on March 31, 2009, and his first full day in office was on April 1, 2009. 3. He even beat Hillary Clinton by 77 votes in the Electoral College because of 7 "faithless" electors. (Two voted against Donald Trump, while five voted against Hillary Clinton, bringing the final tally to 304-227 votes.) 4. Exactly 7 months later, from his first full day in office, January 21, 2017, a total solar eclipse occurred - the first since before the nation was formed in 1776 to be seen exclusively in the United States. All these most recent events occurred in the Hebrew year 5777. (October 2, 2016 - September 20, 2017). A small side note about 1776. Jesus' personal number in the New Testament is 888, and 2x888 = 1776. 5. July 7, 2017 (7/7/17), Donald Trump met with Vladimir Putin for the first time, face-to-face, when Vladimir Putin was exactly 777 months old to the day, in the Hebrew year 5777. On the 75th anniversary of Israel's independence, Vladimir Putin will turn 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old on May 14, 2023. 6. July 11, 2018, in the 77th week since Donald Trump's inauguration, he was the 777th richest person in the world, according to Forbes. 7. On Donald Trump's 700th day in office (December 20, 2018), his defense secretary, Jim Mattis, resigned on the day Israel turned 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old (December 21, 2018). He was due to depart exactly 70 days later, on February 28, 2019, on Donald Trump's 770th day in office; however, this has since been brought forward to January 1, 2019. 8. On President Trump's 777th day since the election, November 8, 2016, Israel announced that they would dissolve Parliament and hold elections 7 months early on April 9, 2019 (November 8, 2016, = day 1 - December 24, 2018, = day 777). 9. On Donald Trump's 770th day in office, Israel's Attorney General announced that Benjamin Netanyahu would be indicted on bribery and fraud charges, pending a hearing. This marks the first time a sitting Prime Minister faces criminal charges, and the announcement comes exactly 40 days before Israel's elections on April 9, 2019. 10. The Senate impeachment trial of Donald Trump began on January 21, 2020, exactly three years to the day from his first full day in office when he was 70 years, 7 months, and 7 days old. He was 73 years, 7 months, and 7 days old on his first trial day. Exactly 7 weeks after the U.S. House of Representatives voted to impeach him on December 18, 2019, Donald Trump was acquitted in the Senate on February 5, 2020. 11. Exactly 49 weeks after Donald Trump was acquitted in the Senate from his first impeachment trial on February 5, 2020, he was impeached again on January 13, 2021, for "incitement of insurrection." How about them apples? Lol, are you laughing yet? Lol! Give your life to Jesus Christ before it's too late. We are watching the Psalms 83 war come together that will lead to Ezekiel 38 and Isaiah 17 will all take place as soon as this kicks off. America will be nuked off the map within the next 30 days or less before the new year.

Thank you.

Egypt is planned, but it is a huge topic and I'm meeting up with a number of PhD from around the world to piece it together. But I do hope to start by the middle of the year.

@@Crecganford Great news. Cant wait

Looking further down the comments and finding answers and more to read in your list of papers! Thank you!

I will do a video about aspects of this in the future, as like Gobekli Tepe, it is a subject one has to be careful about. I have already started researching this, and so this will be made sooner rather than later :) Thank you for all your comments so far.

A great suggestion, and I will try and publish something in the next few weeks.

How do you know you're Assyrian?

@@garlandjones7709 I spoke ASSYRIAN and I am have ASSYRIAN DNA my culture celebrate New year

@@kkKey-py7lk Nice! I was under the impression that was a dead culture and language, so did some quick Google searching after your post.

I meant "wine"

We imagine "creation" in a very western way. The idea of creation in Ancient Near Eastern cultures is different. Creation entails the idea of splitting or cutting something pre-existing and then spreading it to fill with something else to create something different. It always seems to cause a destruction and a complete conversion of what's being used for the creation process. We don't have an English word for it all. This is the idea in the Bible when God created the heavens and the earth it's by "cutting" and "seperating" the waters to make the seas and the skies. This is the same idea behind the slaying of Tiamat and what is done with her corpse. Conversion is a good way to understand it. I believe it was Arabs that understood it as like cutting or splitting rocks to extract gemstones. The rock is ruined, the gemstone is sperated out, and is complety different than the rock.... Their word for that is Cognate to the Hebrew word for create, and Akkadian is extremely close to Hebrew, even in Enuma Elish they share alot of Cognate words from one creation story to the other.

Yes, l'll try and do this at the weekend as it may take a little time to arrange. Thank you for the suggestion.

@@Crecganford awesome! thank you for listening and replying to your subscribers. btw what does Crecganford mean?

One other thought: it kind of makes sense that migration over those mountains would be without horse, as that’s a pretty imposing physical barrier. It also explains why this is usually missed among the other PIE expansions, because it did not bring the horse. The word for ox and the words to yolk an ox in Sumerian are from this hypothetical language, it would seem, so it would make sense if they brought a version of the primeval cow and the twin slaying myth, as well as the dragon slayer (which is cattle theft). If you think about, this earlier PIE influence would make the later influence from Iran (which we also know did happen) easier. The Iranian PIE based mythology would find fertile ground, have some amount of common ancestry and common thematic ideas behind the Mesopotamian mythology already in existence. Much like how Scandinavia was able to comprehend Christian salvation very easily, since it is so similar to Odin mythology. Cheers

@@DavidLightbringer So in short, yes to some of your thoughts as I'm not saying PIE influenced 100% of the myth as there will be Egyptian influence, and independent cultural growth. And I'm also not saying all ideas started with PIE as some were around before this. But the more we ask the questions and compare the more answers we may get :)

@@Crecganford absolutely, and the bit about the creation by spoken word coming from Ptah is particularly insightful. Egypt also has the chaos dragon idea in the form of Apep and Set, as well as the waters from the waters creation story. Bottom line people all over this region were cross crossing for the last 20,000 years. But I thought you’d find this research about an earlier PIE presence in Mesopotamia particularly interesting in light of you having drawn the link between the Babylonia myths and PIE.

Thank you!

@@DavidLightbringer so good of you to mention APEP I found this story fascinating interesting that it was particularly revered during the hyskos dynasty and King Aphopis. There is most certainly a link between the duality of order and chaos. I do believe that Nigshidza *sorry for name butcher* is actually Thoth. Both carrying the entwined serpent and that the stories are like like with cultural appropriation

Have a watch of my Dragon video I released a month ago, I do talk about this a little in there.

@@Crecganford Thank You! Just finished watching it. Follow-up question: Wouldn't that make Ea (and/or Marduk) the representation of order rather then Apsu? Considerung Apsu is the cosmological twin of Tiamat?

There is more to come on this, and so watch this space.

Apsu is definitely about the rivers, and flooding could have influenced his story, and this could have happened when there was warming. I'm not sure about the etymology of the names though.

The etymological link here definitely worth considering

Hello again! Yes, I do, and one day I will make my own video on the story of God, the God of the Old Testament, and the God of the New testament. So I hope to welcome you back to watch those when they're made.

@@Crecganford That'll be a good video to see. Also, your stuff is a figurative goldmine for the Proto-Indo-European people and their Mythology; I've been just going through your videos and binging them

Yahwe would be a quite big part, i mean the caanite one

@@samuelesanfilippo222 Yawweh, Baal (Lord). El Elyon. Most. Also I believe proto storm gods HUBAL, ADAD had an influence on the Semitic God of the time. Elohim which can mean plural gods and El shaddai which in my opinion is one of the biggest influences in semtism SATURN

@@ownero1 yes likely but the christian god is literally yahweh, just that for some reason it is never said, i find it somehow umiliating that while being rised as a christian i learnt that he actually had a name only way later in life.

As you watch more of my videos things will become clearer, with the IE influence around cattle as opposed to being the ultimate root of splitting a twin or dragon to create the world. But the topic is vast and I will be shortly making more videos explaining Mesopotamian’s influence of the Indo-Europeans too. It wasn’t just a one way thing.

Iranian Neolithic Farmers from Zagros seem most likely, given the proximity to Mesopotamia. There are a lot of Sumerian and Akkadian words that have been identified as not originally belonging to either of those languages, several of which are thought to be Indo-European.

I don't really watch films, I don't even own a television... but if you want book recommendations then that I can do!

@@Crecganford ok, can you recommend a few books that describe what life was like in ancient Babylon and Mesopotamia?

Because that's the predominant academic view of the migration from PIE to Venice based on the various sources I use.

A good question, but one that doesn't have a simple answer. I think most scholars would agree that there is some Indo-European influence, but trying to understand what amount the religion was influenced by the Indo-European religion is difficult to say due to the influence of Egypt on the region, and we are talking up to 4,000 years ago. I think this would make a great topic for a future video, and so will look into this. Thank you for the question :)

Yes! Please make this video!

I touch on this in the Dragon video I’ve just released, and it does look like before these times it was the sources that influence Mesopotamia also then influenced IE culture. Have a watch and let me know what you think.

We don't, it is just a wishfull thought of Indo-Eurocentrists. It is much more probable that the Mesopotamian myth spread to a bunch of people, including some speaking languages of the Indo-European family which has already split up then.

While binding Tiamat sounds more like Fenrir, of course.

Yes, Tiamat and the Jörmungandr have similarities, although the former is a primordial being used the create the world, the later is an evolution of the dragon who represents our enemies.

@@Crecganford of course these stories can be conflated, and they don't necessarily evolve in linearly ... The way they are both lifted "by the middle" just seems like an interestingly similar detail (I refer to the myth of Thor trying to lift the cat), as well as the reference of someone "spanning" or going the 'length' of the earth ... The creature being subdued and put in "mortal danger", and the whole setup of these two characters being "arch nemeses", in something that both sounds like a prophecy and a myth. Of course the contexts are very different, though there are similarities. During Ragnarok, Thor will kill Jormungandr, and he will in return die from it's poison. Out of Ragnarok, a new 'world' is born, though. So while it is "the final battle to come", it also sounds like, at least in part, a cosmogenic myth. The killing of two by a warrior (even if the warrior is one of the dying) sounds Indo-European, too, but yes; these ARE of course different contexts. Though Jormungandr, Fenrir and Hel all three reflect at least thematically what you said about Tiamat: Lifted by the middle, bound, and mortal danger. All three are of course going to fight in the Ragnarok (Hel too? Unclear). Fenrir will die too, killed by Vidar "the widely ruling", which to me sounds like a king. Again, three is all over, sacrifice is all over. A warrior, a king, and a sacrifice. The shoe Vidar wears while killing Fenrir is made of leather, thrown away by humans; supposedly this can be interpreted as the offerings of humans playing a role, hence cementing the point of a sacrifice. I'm just writing down thoughts as I have them, but I think it could be interesting to look into. Another thing I thought of just now; the idea of a new world where crops grow freely and humans and gods live again (return from Hel) reminds me of the resurrection story of the fertility god which is found in several indo-european mythologies; Persephone in Greek mythology, Telipinu in Hittite mythology etc. Baldir returns from the underworld too after Ragnarok, if I am not much mistaken. Of course he can't be 1:1 fertility god since that role is taken, and since he'd be dead until ragnarok, though his title as "the shining one" could correlate somewhat with a solar deity (which in Northern Europe surely must have been seen as connected with fertility, much more so than the harsh sun of e.g. Anatolia). I reiterate: I'm only writing my thoughts down as they occur. Does not seem farfetched, though, that the poems of e.g. the Vøluspa should be a collection of stories, maybe local or foreign myths and folktales, made to fit into one coherent text/prophecy.

It is in the fact that we have older copies of those than the Hebrew. But as far as content, no. That was argued for over 100 years after finding Enuma Elish but is slowly being backed off of as wrong. They do seem to draw off of a common source, though... I e. Neither original as in both have been tampered with.

Well I have been called worse, and so thank you.

No, I should set up a tea drinkers anonymous organisation...

I do reference papers in the description, but probably best start with Lincoln's paper on the IE myth of creation.

@@Crecganford Ok. I will look into. But I cant imagine that this is accepted in Mainstream.

"The five major Indo-European subfamilies - Celtic, Germanic, Italic, Balto-Slavic and Indo-Iranian - all emerged as distinct lineages between 4000 and 6000 years " www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4112997/

Yes, you see it in the centre of Hinduism, and then in Europe it was eventually replaced by the horse, although the cow remained a symbol of nourishment.

@@Crecganford The more I learn, the more it pains me how ignorant we are of our spiritual foundations. It's more important to me than my individual identity, b/c I will die soon, but religious influence continues to twist our lives in ways that make no sense to modern men. I'm certainly _not_ singling religion out as the sole purveyor of confusion, but it ranks up there with bad water.

The etymology of the bull is so symbolic for it is the Alpha and we still use it upside down as the "A" to represent the ox. List of references is endless

That sounds good, but I'm not sure the timelines match. I am researching this, and will publish a paper, or maybe a book based on my findings. It is certainly a complex topic to ensure all options are covered.

Also, at 22:53 when Marduc at the height of his power approaches Tiamat, Kingu and their host, you say that "but when Kingu looked at Tiamat he became confused, had trouble moving, etc..." don't you mean that when Kingu first beheld the approaching Marduc he lost his confidence and was fearful and this was noticed by his army of monsters and those gods that bound themselves to fight for him and Tiamat? There was an edit just before you said this, so maybe you accidentally cut out some part where you describe how Kingu looks at Marduc and is shook with fear and uncertainty? It might then make more sense for Kingu to next look at Tiamat in confusion and being frozen in fear (not of Tiamat but of Marduc).

Yes, this is an important motif, and one we see in comparable myths such as Indra vs Vrtra in the Vedic culture.

@@Crecganford thanks for the reply. I was familiar with the PIE roots of the Vedic culture, but that the Enuma Elish might ultimately take root from PIE also was astounding. I'd need to see what the next closest story was, because otherwise I'd guess that it must be more accurate to say that the PIE creation myth was one major influence to the Enuma Elish among probably several others' (including Sumerian/Akkadian/Amorites/etc.) and surely some original additions of their own.

It's not the oldest. Its very agenda driven in its current form here.

Also they are full-bodied why did they bury them

When did I say they were Indo-European? I said they were influenced by the Indo European creation myth, but please explain how Tiamat is a cow, and we have twins at the creation, and the building of the world from a body, if it is not influenced by the Indo Europeans?

@@Crecganford Tiamat wasnt a cow - where did you get that from? Also the first two were not twins - they were male and female. Husband and Wife. Why would the semitic babylonians have adopted any part of the indo european myths - the Persian and Kurds were less advanced people compared to them at that time. Its not impossible but you need to provide better arguments for this. I suspect that any (minor) similarity is probably coincidental or possibly goes back to a previous time before semites and indo europeans split. Eg the world being created from a body probably goes back several thousands of years if not tens of thousands of years.

@@johncale1849 I reference the academic paper that identifies the cow in the video description and mention it in the video. Did you actually watch it? Plus in a number of my other videos I provide ample citations backing this up. And the next 3 videos I release will also contain many citations to support this.

@@Crecganford Sorry I stopped 10 minutes in ... I have now watched and checked. I think at best you are reaching. I will watch the other videos. Dont get me wrong. I like your vids and have been binge watching since yesterday. But I think you are in danger of pushing the argument too far. Semites were civilised long before indo europeans. And were not conquered by them until the the Iranians became basically middle easterners. Same with the Hittites before them. There is always two way cultural exchange but normally it goes from stronger to weaker. More civilised to less civilised. Ruler to Vassal. Iranians were allies of Babylon but were more like Vassals. But what actually happened is more important than theory. As I said I will watch the other videos. Dont be offended by my comments. But of course defend your ideas as I am saying these things publicly and you have worked hard on your ideas and on your videos - Which I mostly find fascinating.

@@johncale1849 I appreciate your comments, so please don't stop, and would like to say the 1961 Paper on Tablet V of the Enuma Elis is cited by Lincoln in his Indo European studies, and Lincoln is cited by Anthony in his IE studies. So what I am quoting isn't a new theory or something left field, it is well established. A video I'll post in about 4 weeks time on the IE Creation Myth will have this information in, and the one in 6 weeks will talk about this too if you want specific references. But please challenge me, as it forces me to validate my citations and further understand other challenges to the work I research.

So an 8,000 year old language, is predated by a 5,000 year old culture? Interesting… What would be more accurate is to say that Neolithic Farming culture influenced to a degree the Indo-European culture.

u missed the moral values conveyed with the descriptors of the names.

@@C0Y0TE5 Didn't miss it, it was a lousy job.

Sumerians were from Sumer, and there was interaction and trade between Indo-Europeans and Mesopotamian cultures. That is academic fact.

As a European, I must insist that here it is probably the Mesopotamian myth that spread to various European and Asiatic cultures, like many other small things that we call "civilization"... not all Europeans are Indo-Iranian-centric, the problem is those who are, are quite popular and get wider press often with a pseudo-scientific mumbo-jumbo to back them up.

@@Crecganford Well, I wouldn't call it an academic fact, given that we don't know where the Indo-Europeans were actually located at the time of the Sumerians, although there are many speculations about their geography in the third millenium... If you locate them in Europe a direct trade with the Persian Gulf is quite unlikely...