Will it be on Audible?

@greenjack1959l good question. Not sure. I'll see if I can find out

​@@pwhitewicksomething to ponder Paul. These books, that describe it. Are they printed? Do they look written or block printed?

@@theRhinsRanger we are talking about an Anglo Saxon Charter from 900AD.

I've just pre-ordered my copy and very much looking forward to it after April 30th. 🎉😊

Wow, thank you!

Seconded

@@hedleythorne Thirded

100%, good reference to Hastings aswell

There’s no such thing as a “hoar-apple tree”. It’s the tree that’s hoary, not the fruit on it.

@@peterkitson2843 well, that's how the sources describe it.

@@neiloflongbeck5705 You haven’t gone to the sources, you’ve relied on the wording of translations which use modern English phrasing.

@@peterkitson2843 in Old English hoar mean grey haired with age. But then again, the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle translation that I have access to gives William of Normandy the title Earl not Duke. This OS a modern translation and after almost a 1,000 years shouldn't have such an error. Unless it is a true translation of what was originally written and I have no doubts that it is. Which means I find your argument fatuous and pointless.

Well, that's funny, since the British sort is spelled... Archaeology.

@@neatchipops3428 is that due to that 'ash' letter æ? A few Greek words were brought into English with it.

@@leod-sigefast It's a diphthong.

Wonderful. Thank you Pauline.

Cheers for that Zip will visit 👍

Can you tell me your source ?

And perhaps double check spelling of super simple words before hitting the "post" button…

@@mikeharper3459pact?

A source would be fab, I’m fascinated by King Mark. Ignore stupid comments about spelling. It’s a comment section not a spelling bee. Also I thought you were going for a pun - CERdic CERmented his power. Brilliant.

Prove it, reference exactly where you have evidence.

Many thanks!

people have been excellent at chronicling time for many millenia. just a small example - i saw a book in Melk, Austria this year that was written in the 1100's and had a 1 sentence summary of every year's events across Europe. A check on Wikipedia showed it was completely accurate, for events in Italy, England, Istanbul and eveyrwhere in between. Humans have always craved to know what happened far away, and important people made sure their own deeds are written for posterity. Even tyrants like Putin are doing exactly the same today.

@@idjles True, but the period between 410 and around 550 is the one in which we have almost no written evidence pertaining to southern and eastern Britain. In essence proto-History had returned, so there is no evidence that Cerdic existed, any more than King Arthur existed. The best we can say is that this may be the tomb of a man who might have been the first king of Wessex.

Or maybe a name change? Wouldn’t be the last time the ruling class had a rebrand

Another possibility -.definitely

The last Cerdicing king to have a Brythonic name was Caedwalla (Cadwallon) who reigned in the 680s; also Cynegils looks Brythonic - Cuneglassus/Cynglas, meaning 'blue-hound'. There is absolutely no reason for any overthrow, but every reason for later kings of the house to claim descent from incomers coming across the North Sea. I doubt that the ancestry of a successful war leader was of any account to his followers, just as long as he was able to supply land and plunder.

@@urseliusurgel4365 I was specifically talking about Wessex Kings - and I agree there is no reason for a overthrow - but Usurping was a very common practice - so no reason to rule it out either. History in this era is not well documented and even the best sources are subject to speculation.

@@stevegasparutti8341 I also was specifically talking about the kings of Wessex, the royal house of Wessex was called the 'Cerdicings', after Cerdic. However, before the reign of Caedwalla they were usually called the kings of the Gewissae. There is plenty of evidence that the Cerdicings were split into various branches and it is probable that subkings existed within Wessex. It is more likely that political instability was the result of internecine feuds between branches of the Cerdicings, than that they were usurped.

Thanks Davie

i guess by the time such trees had disappeared for whatever reason, the boundaries were well established to those who needed to know ?

Thank you 😊

Hi Peter thanks for your comment. Very interesting that you mention Graham Phillips as after my research on battles between warlords and kingdoms believe his theory on Arthur being Owain Danwyn is fascinating, it could certainly explain the Camlann aspect of the legend!

@@PaulHarper82- Sorry to disappoint, but I traced all of the 'dark ages' using historical records, and I can tell you there was never a Welsh King Arthur.There was a Somerset King Arthur, and a Pennines King Arthur (the one where we get Arthur's Seat in Edinburgh, and then he went on to Camelon fields near the old Roman fort near Sterling.). They found Arthur of the North's grave years ago, but because of secrecy, we now no longer know where it is. They found a ring baring Arthur's name, that could only be read after casting it into a fire, and this is believed to be where Tolkien got the idea of the One ring. We knew more about Arthur in Tolkiens day, thanks to using genuine sources and not modern hear-say. Cerdic did fight with Arthur of the South, most likely. Here is my notes with rough dates. 514 Cerdicesora / Cerdic's Ore Arrival of more West Saxons in Wessex who fight for Cerdic. in three ships, at the place that is called Cerdic's-ore. And Stuff and Wihtgar fought with the Britons, and put them to flight. The Saxons Stuf and Wihtgar landed and defeated the Britons. 519 - Charford, Hampshire (Nennius) West Saxons fought with the Arthur and the Britons at a place now called South Charford on Avon, Som. Charford (Cerdicesford). King Cerdic of the West Saxons, with his son Cynric, defeated the Britons. From that day have reigned the children of the West-Saxon kings. 518/19 - Natanleaga / Netley This year Cerdic and Cynric slew a British king, whose name was Natanleod, and five thousand men with him (now Hampshire). Uther was ill and appointed Nathan to take care of the landing. The Saxons swept the field with ease. After this Cerdic owned the land from Cerdic's ford named Natanleaga (Netley) from him, as far as Charford (now Hampshire). Cerdic and his son Cynric defeated the British king Natanleod at Netley, Hants. 519 Cerdic was crowned King of Wessex. Cerdic and Cynric undertook the government of the West-Saxons. 520: Saxons took control of Sussex, Kent, East Anglia and part of Yorkshire, West Saxons now founded a Kingdom in Hampshire under Cerdic. 527 This year West Saxons Cerdic and Cynric fought with the Britons in the place that is called Cerdic's-ley. 533 Death of Cerdic of Wessex. This year died Cerdic, the first king of the West-Saxons. Cynric his son succeeded to the government, and reigned afterwards twenty-six winters. And they gave to their two nephews, Stuff and Wihtgar, the whole of the Isle of Wight.

Hi thanks for your view, Arthur is a whole other debate, and there are many many theories but I find Graham Philips' one concerning Owain Danwyn very compelling! Support Dumville's view that Cerdic reigned later between 538 and 554. I theorize he was either a British or part British-Jutish ruler who employed Jutes confederates. The chronicle doesn't actually say a battle was fought at Natanleaga, it was almost certainly North Charford - there's a reference to a 'battle ford' in this location in an very old charter and it was also called 'Cerdeford' in the Domesday Book. Moreover, the 'leod' element of Natanleod means 'prince, chief, leader' in Old English. It is, however, all open to considerable interpretation with the lack of historical records - that's why I find this discovery so exciting! @@lifeschool

@@PaulHarper82- As compelling as it may be, Owain was named Owain (pronounced Euwan) , not Arthur. People also get confused with Athrwys ap Meurig (c. 605-655), with Athrwys ap Mor/Mar (c.450-520). As for Cerdic, we only have Nennius and Wendover as a reference for him, and I find the truth is usually 100 times more boring than the fantasy stories.

Arthur is the Old Welsh for 'bear', which Gildas uses when referring to Cuneglasus (Owain's son). Maelgwn (Mordred) killed his uncle (most likely Owain) says Gildas, Owain's father matches Uther Pendragon. Philips suggests Camlann was fought on the border of Powys and Gwynedd near the River Camlad. Many other theories are plausible as well and as you say probably more boring than the legend! I wouldn't equate the interpreter in Nennius with Cerdic who seemed to reign much later. This is a more convincing reference from a Royal charter to Cerdic's actual burial site which seems to have been very deliberately placed.

Thank you Colin. Very kind

Wonderful. Thanks Chris

Well that would be something.

No drugs that would take care of the smallest infection being available I’m sure wasn’t a factor. Even drinking water could kill you.

Battles, disease, even an infected cut...a harsh year with crop failure or dying livestock, getting soaked and freezing whilst on a journey. Many reasons life could be all too short, for a great many at that time. Not to mention raiders of every ilk !!! Hence, his apparent age is quite noteworthy.

Correct survive childhood and 50 was more probable cheers

About a quarter of women died in childbirth

These people were genetically identical to us. In pre-urban Britain, without the crowded living conditions that would exacerbate the spread of infectious diseases, there is no reason to suppose they wouldn't have had similar lifespans to us. Only birth problems (bad design) and violent death would have provided higher mortality figures.

Thanks James.

Ah ok... So Cher - Dich ?

@@pwhitewick yep, that’s it.

This is consistent with the pronunciation of Vulgar Latin in the 6th century and with the reconstruction of proto-Welsh, but I would not be so dogmatic, especially about the pronunciation of the final -c especially if the following word began with a back vowel.

It is a Brythonnic (Welsh) name not English. Saying that, I think “ch-“ when I read it.

@@AllotmentFox do you feel grundy (and paul) were close to the truth here with the main clues highlighted? Clearly your wheel house!!

Thanks Robert

Thanks, I definitely try

Thank you! -Wes

There doesn't appear to be unfortunately, nor Gildas, but Bede mentions his grandson Ceawlin and calls him the second Bretwalda. Thanks!

@@PaulHarper82 Thanks for your very prompt reply it has beaten me, to looking up the Book of Bede as I rewatched your video!

Thanks Fiona

haha... now there is an image!

You are correct: the average age was low because of child-mortality. So you could live to a venerable age then as well

Hi thanks for your comment the whole timeframes are questionable. The periods of Cerdic are given 39 years, Cynric 65 and Ceawlin 35. Yet other more plausible sources say Cerdic 22 (16 year reign, from six years after landing) Cynric 27 and Ceawlin 7 or 17. And it's likely the shadowy Creoda, Cerdic's son, should be placed there somewhere. Found the Roman emperors between 193 and 476 averaged 46 years. The study of six contemporary Anglo Saxon sites found the age ranged from 31.6 to 40.3 for men and 30.2 to 42.2 for women. In the main it seems the life expectancy was relatively low, and you have to factor in the impact of the volcanic winter and plague also. The most logical conclusion is that the reigns of most if not all the sixth century Wessex kings were extended. Thanks, Paul

Very welcome

Hi thanks for your comment. There is a barrow in Stoke of the same name but this doesn't fit with the charter at all. I believe the connection stems from how a Willow Tree Farm - a Willow Tree Grove is the next landmark after Cerdic's Barrow in the charter - is situated next to this particular barrow in Stoke. The site I believe was once called Cerdic's Barrow fits with the charter and is in a very prominent place next to ancient trackways and an Offa's Dyke style ditch. Thanks, Paul

Very welcome

Thank you kindly

Yup it is quite a tricky one. Indeed the notion that the average age is low because of infant mortality is definitely a thing. However in an unsettled era probably 1000 years before most parish records I think living beyond 50 would have been rare. In fact arch records from burial chambers and such often show this to be the case.

Hi thanks for your comment. From research it does appear the average age was between 30-40. As you rightly say, there are surely examples of people living much longer but in the main life expectancy appears very low compared to modern standards.

There's suggestions Challow (Ceawan Hlewe) in Wantage is named after the burial place of Cerdic's warlike grandson Ceawlin and Cuckhamsley Barrow (Cwichelmeshlaew) after the 7th century Gewisse king Cwichelm.

@@PaulHarper82 Paul, thanks for this info. I will follow it up.

As a descendant of Alfred the Great, who claimed descent from Cerdic, I am very interested in this. Cerdic has a British name, but led a band of Saxons, which is intriguing. The author Rosemary Sutcliffe, who wrote books for schoolchildren aged 9 to 16, and was my favourite author at that age, hinted in her book The Lantern Bearers that Cerdic may be the son of the British king Vortigern and his Saxon wife Rowena. Vortigern was the one who invited the Saxons to Britain to fight the Picts and afterwards they demanded Kent as a reward for winning. Vortigern also was connected to the Hwicce tribe in what is now Gloucestershire, who may also have German origins. This makes sense.

There does seem to be a link between Vortigern and Cerdic. Foederati associated with Vortigern were later described by Bede as Jutes in Kent while Jutes were also present on the Isle of Wight and associated with Cerdic. These two groups seem very close culturally and may have arrived at a similar time. Both Vortigern and Cerdic appear to have employed Germanic confederates to help fight their wars, but Cerdic seemed to arrive much later than Vortigern and his father is listed in the Anglo Saxon Chronicle as Elesa. I do cover this possible connection, it's fascinating and confusing as Cerdic appears to be fighting rival local warlords for territory not Picts or Scots. Thanks.@@AnneDowson-vp8lg

Hey there, welcome to the channel. A Holloway, is essentially a very old route that has sunken down over time. Either due to a lot of traffic use, or re-flattening of the road to create a level surface. Both these combined with weathering create this sunken lane feature.

@@pwhitewick - Thanks very much for the explanation!

Well, I think the Norman invaders also set the country on an inextricable path towards imperialism. Their aristocratic rule post-1066 was pretty much all about expansion. I think that is where the empire DNA of the English came from.

@@leod-sigefast The Scots were heavy enthusers and exporters of Empire too, don't forget.

Cheers Lawrence

Nope... but I'm now intrigued

Haha... the pleasure is all mine Cob. You have my mind racing about Stone Circles in Dartmoor!