The greatest naval operation of Antiquity: Cape Bon 468 AD.

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2 жыл бұрын

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In this video, we are finally discussing in more detail, one of the largest fleet operations of Antiquity, that unfortunately is not talked about often: The battle of Cape Bon in 468 AD. This was the final try to restore the Western Roman Empire, and it failed only due to the stupidity of one single man.
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@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

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@OptimusMaximusNero 2 жыл бұрын

It is a crime that there are no big blockbusters movies about the collapse of the Roman Empire. At most, there is the movie "The Last Legion", but it is quite deficient.

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Yes, absolutely agreed. We should have epic trilogies about Stilicho, Constantius III, Aetius, Majorian and Anthemius. It would be insane.

@OptimusMaximusNero 2 жыл бұрын

@@Maiorianus_Sebastian And do not forget a REAL movie about Romulus Augustus. His story absolutely deservers a proper adaptation

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

Somebody got to get it started with new sets & props etc once it’s been done once and done well it’s much easier to build outward. What we need is someone with some money to commit to a say three film series to build the background and image in general audiences’ minds and compel or at least test viewership then if successful build a constellation of similar around that core. It’s been a dream of mine to make films from some of the great dramas there-would love to do a series on Herakleios especially. Maybe we here could collaborate and pool our ambition?

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

@@Maiorianus_Sebastian it can be done, and if done well, in this current media environment with so few truly novel stories, could make one’s reputation in film.

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

I know what you mean there are just so many good stories from real history. The novel was really good though, I really wouldn’t mind more Conan-esque fantasy set in this era either it serves well as a base

@alfredosauce1 2 жыл бұрын

Finally! I'm so glad you did this. Barely anyone talks about it. Cape Bon has blown my mind since I found out about it, a real head-scratcher that should've been an easy victory for the empire and could have changed the outcome of the West and history overall! Rome's memory is eternal, Greetings from Phoenice Maritima, Dioecesis Orientis.

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks :) Yes, this is one of the most overlooked important battles in history. Rome could have easily won this, but sometimes the luck of an entire operation stands and falls with the decisions of one man. Greetings back to Phoenice Maritima!

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

It’s not a very long part of the novel, but the way Michael Curtis Ford describes the leadup in Fall of Rome might be eye oprning. Lots of intrigue between vandals-goths-wre-ere-basiliscus-leo lots of maneuvering lots of fault lines

@giannisgiannopoulos791 2 жыл бұрын

The outraged Leo I, wanted to put to the sword Basiliscus upon his arrival to Constantinople. The general fled and hid in a church. The Emperor's brother-in-law was saved after the intervention of his sister, Empress Verina.

@LordWyatt 2 жыл бұрын

Shame on the house of Basiliscus, shame.

@giannisgiannopoulos791 2 жыл бұрын

@@LordWyatt Believe it or not he looked promising though! At first...

@LordWyatt 2 жыл бұрын

@@giannisgiannopoulos791 ah. So did John of Armenia and Narses😬

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

Probably should have but there are no good guys on any side of the story Leo was in no less a hard place than Anthemius really all the factions he had to placate and balance

@giannisgiannopoulos791 Жыл бұрын

@@henripentant1120 Absolutely. It's just that the West lost its last chance for survivai.

@neutralfellow9736 2 жыл бұрын

Basiliscus usurping the throne shortly was just icing on the cake lol

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Hehe yes, Basiliscus will forever be remembered for his incompetency.

@septimiusseverus343 2 жыл бұрын

@@Maiorianus_Sebastian Even the manner of his death was ironic. Upon being defeated by Zeno, Basiliscus said he would surrender should the Emperor give his promise that not a drop of his blood should be shed. Zeno promised. Basiliscus and his family were sealed up in a well in the Anatolian desert, to die of thirst. Somewhat fitting that the man whose decisions sent tens of thousands of Romans to a watery grave, died of lack of water.

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

All part of a longer narrative

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

@@Maiorianus_Sebastian i have to have some sympathy for him his perspective was not Leo’s imperial bird’s eye view, he was a man of and a representative of his class and from his perspective it was a dire moment for his constituency and to not act would be to lose the moment forever to the Gothians and others

@nobudgetfilms4628 2 жыл бұрын

Basiliscus was most likely bribed by Aspar to fail as a way to so sabotage Leo I. Here, it began to look like Leo was getting more independent, something his puppet master Aspar did not want to happen.

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

There musr have been many parties who wanted this to fail in one way or another. Imo Basiliscus had his own interest group without involving Aspar. Leo had many more parties to placate or neutralize than did basiliscus as a potential usurper-the isaurian problem loomed especially large with what was going on in the west, italy and gaul particularly

@JOGA_Wills 2 жыл бұрын

YES! Geiseric never gets credit as one of the best leaders of all time. Who else took their people from a Swamp to a Jewel?

@lacintag5482 2 жыл бұрын

As somebody who supports the position that the fall of the Western Empire wasn't inevitable (a position I wholeheartedly agree with as well), I'd love to see you react to the take that it was. Specicially a video by another favorite Romaboo youtuber of mine, Tominus Maximus I used to like and agree with that video before I discovered your channel and learned more about the late Roman period, so I'd love to see you take on it (in a respectful professional way, of course).

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Salve Amicus ! Thanks, and yes, I of course agree that the fall of the West was not inevitable, and of course I also know Tominux Maximus, I really like his videos, they are humorous and contain a lot of interesting info, at the same time. Great idea, I could make a video about his video :)

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

If Odoacer had never taken the drastic step he did there were still many more ways for it to fail than maintain by the 460s

@Gecko.... Жыл бұрын

I think we are missing massive amounts of history relating to the decline and eventually fall of the empire. There are just so many inconsistencies, like here it can still assemble massive armies and fleets yet they could never push those on their borders back and still fell.

@budwyzer77 2 жыл бұрын

This is the first *good* video on the Battle of Cape Bon on all of KZfaq.

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot friend :) The Battle of Cape Bon receives far too little attention, and is very often completely forgotten. Let's hope this will change in the future.

@lacintag5482 2 жыл бұрын

Episode ideas A "rogues gallery" or even top 10 Late Roman enemies. Talking about the Vandals, Goths, Suebi, Huns, Sassanids, etc. And not just as enemies of Rome, but a bit about their society and culture too.

@silverchairsg Жыл бұрын

I want to draw attention to a parallel situation in Chinese history, which probably not many Westerners know about. During the Three Kingdoms period of Chinese history (220-280 AD), China was divided into three warring kingdoms (lol): Wei in the North under the warlord Cao Cao, who is commonly potrayed as cunning, ruthless and selfish; Shu in the Southwest (today's Sichuan province) under Liu Bei who is commonly portrayed as benevolent and virtuous and treats the common people well, and Wu in the South under Sun Quan. Basically at one point Cao Cao had amassed a huge army and had built a gigantic fleet to cross the Yangtze river, to conquer the Wu kingdom in the South. At that point Liu Bei and his genius military strategist Zhuge Liang were in alliance with Wu. So Cao Cao had chained his ships together to prevent seasickness, because his men, being landlubbers from the north, had little experience on the water. The Wu-Shu alliance got a general to feign surrender to Cao Cao, while ramming fireships into his fleet. Because the boats were all chained together they all went up in flames, and Cao Cao lost a huge portion of his army and his plans for conquering the rest of China were put to a halt, and this marked the southernmost limit of his expansion. This battle is known as the Battle of Red Cliffs, and it is fictionalized in the famous historical novel Romance of the Three Kingdoms.

@alfredosauce1 2 жыл бұрын

Video suggestion: Late Roman Army (The Post Dioclitian-Constantinian army) was is better than the earlier army or worse? was the army a factor in the fall? (IMO I think the late Roman Army was quite effective, just the other issues plaguing Rome (civil wars, usurpation, political/economic decline, etc) inevitably wasted the potential of the army and the willingness of Romans to join it.

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Hello friend ! Yes, don't worry, that topic is of course on my long to-do list :) And I agree with you, the late roman army was much more effective, than it is usually credited for.

@paprskomet Жыл бұрын

As a guy propagating misconception and over-demonising myths about later Roman armies I would also add that people often ask on this in very black and white terms,asking what was "better" but such clear simple comparsion is too problematic as it was not black and white simple.Both were better and worse on some levels if compared with each other.People should rather ask in what they differed,what they had still in common and if that popularly demonised later army was really that bad-here answer would be correctly simple and blacka and white:no.it was not.

@alokinrainborn Жыл бұрын

Finally someone who knows how to pronounce Latin properly! Subbed!

@nikolaistavrogin2529 2 жыл бұрын

East and West united for one last time. They failed but general Belisarius would rise the Roman banners in north Africa some years later.

@craigmiller6297 2 жыл бұрын

Another amazing video This sea battle seems to be the best kept historical secret. A great point that the death of Empire was a bit premature. Notice that the breadbasket was North Africa an area that is desert today

@paprskomet Жыл бұрын

Nothing is sescrete on it.That majority of people are ignorant of history and even if interrested in the Romans,often very ignorant of late antiquity Roman history,is just theirs fault.

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

Well the other commentator makes a good point none this is secret and europe and russia have different narrative traditions than the usa for example where Rome is concerned, different points of emphasis. One thing I’ll say about Africa is that if you follow Haldon it was not just about grain and corn production. Africa especially after the vandal advent was transitioning to simpler agriculture schemes of organization of production, which eventually led to real desertification, as opposed to large tracts of agri deserti that were not profitable financially. The shock to the financial side of production was as severe as the shock to actual agricultural production. Many lands were at this time signed in usufruct over to the vandals as a legal nicety and they had different incentives to produce and order cultivation than did the previous landowners. A very delicate manmade ecology was already being upset with no easy way to perceive it or act on it in that time.

@jorgeluiscapiello414 Жыл бұрын

First time to hear about this battle even though I've always been fascinated by ancient Rome! So much to learn yet.

@hondakubo9399 2 жыл бұрын

Even the narrations is insanely good 👍🏹❤️🚩 love in it so much ⚜️⛵️🔥 GREAT CHANNEL 🔱

@andrzejmaranda3699 Жыл бұрын

Maiorianus : this is SOOO INTERESTING & VALUABLE!

@samhudson333 2 жыл бұрын

this was great, you know your stuff

@themaskedman221 11 ай бұрын

You have the city of Rome on the map here, but the capital of the Western Empire in 468 CE (actually, in 402 until the very end) was Ravenna.

@apersonontheinternet595 2 жыл бұрын

Can you do some videos on the what would be the foundation of the 1054 schism? You could talk about monophysites and stuff like that. Great video!

@scottphillips3008 2 жыл бұрын

Great video

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot, friend of Rome :)

@LREY888 2 жыл бұрын

The voice sounds great!! Subtle improvement but you sounded very clear!!

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot, I really appreciate it :) I am glad to read that, because speaking clear English takes quite some practice for me.

@teslaoliveira2195 Жыл бұрын

Super!

@salonez91 Жыл бұрын

In the peak of Rome empire, even if you tried, it was hard to find not capable commanders. But as any empire falling its the often "unlucky" factor that is talked about but not the decay of knowledge, virtues and capability of their people that in turn produced low quality commanders. That doas not mean there were no capable ones. Its just they were rare and had less and less probability of leading armies.

@badgamemaster 2 жыл бұрын

This would have gone down in history as one of the greatest moments of the Roman Empire....

@danmichaelabad1338 Жыл бұрын

damn you Ricimer Damn you!

@nowthenzen Жыл бұрын

one of the great what if's of the classical world

@kaloarepo288 2 жыл бұрын

Actually I have heard of it and about a couple of years ago made exactly that point about the largest naval battle in ancient Mediterranean history when a particular video had claimed that a battle during the First Punic War was -Mycale i think.

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

I’ll never be able to prove it, but apart from the very apparent problems of command hierarchy and conflicts of authority, there must have been some more to this story in terms of intrigue than we allow for.

@kencusick6311 2 жыл бұрын

The history of events that never happened will never be written. That such incompetence can rise to such heights is a testament to the extent of corruption throughout the empire.

@jasoncuculo7035 Жыл бұрын

Why was Ricimer even still alive, shouldn't he have been assassinated or executed for killing Majorian, why would Basileus chose to give five days? In a conquest you need to destroy the enemy army and ability to fight. As long as Geiserik is around he is a threat?

@Maiorianus_Sebastian Жыл бұрын

These are exactly the Same thoughts that I have. Ricimer should have been executed by Anthemius and Leo directly after Majorian's murder, and Geiserich should have been mercilessly destroyed.

@geordiejones5618 Жыл бұрын

Ricimer is just hilariously evil but you gotta give him credit for staying alive during this time. He was an asshole but he was a survivor too. All time favorite anime villain, because he's just short of being entirely cartoonish.

@jasoncuculo7035 Жыл бұрын

I believe he wanted to destroy the Roman Empire because he was secretly siding with the Germanic tribes. Arminius lured three Roman legions to their destruction in the Tutoberg forest in 9 AD for this reason as well. He was Hermann the German acting as loyal to Rome but actually loyal to Rome's enemies in Germania.

@halsnyder296 2 жыл бұрын

See a lot of the fall of Rome today, politicians only concerned about their individual standing regardless of the state of the state around them.

@sterlingcampbell2116 Жыл бұрын

Exactly

@Stelios.Posantzis 2 жыл бұрын

13:58 Basiliscus - not Heraclius ! 🙂

@waynemcauliffe-fv5yf 2 ай бұрын

Go you Vandals

@Jolynmanymeafy4449 2 жыл бұрын

There are so many blockbusters and epic movies that. Could be made if actual events from the fall of Rome I wonder why not??

@Koopinator Жыл бұрын

16:05 Why did Heraclius abort the operation? He still had an army, couldn't he have made an attempt on his own?

@geordiejones5618 Жыл бұрын

Marcellinus was an impressive general for his time, but he very well could have been a total legend if he wasn't given the least important job.

@panintegral5536 2 жыл бұрын

I would donate all the money I could to the channel, the problem is that I am a teenager of 16 years and my parents wouldn't let me to do that 😭

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Hello and thanks a lot, it is nice to read that. Don't worry, your support by just watching the videos is more than enough :) It is really, really appreciated a lot.

@panintegral5536 2 жыл бұрын

@@Maiorianus_Sebastian ok I just already watced all the videos and I will keep doing that! 😁

@ragael1024 2 жыл бұрын

it's times like this that i sing to myself "what could have been". after which i have a decent urge to smash smth. the incompetent moron, chosen as Magister Militum!!!!!!!!!! and to make it worse, he had his own ambitions. as if he was worthy of any. R.I.P., Western Rome. R.I.P., mate :(

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Yes, really brutal ! It is also hard for me to read about the last 20 years of Western Rome. So many wasted opportunities, it's heart wrenching. But alas, at least we have some epic stories to tell.

@sudetenrider-pili6637 2 жыл бұрын

So sad

@septimiusseverus343 2 жыл бұрын

The true nail in the coffin. What a trainwreck.

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Yes, it's so sad, it was in reach, but then it all fell apart quickly :/

@septimiusseverus343 2 жыл бұрын

Actually, perhaps that should be _shipwreck._

@iDeathMaximuMII 2 жыл бұрын

Basiliscius royally FUCKED the greatest opportunity the West had at saving itself Leo I was always heavily invested in helping the West (for his own benefits or not, doesn't matter) & this was the greatest Force assembled for a Military campaign in a LONG time Trajan was able to gather 200,000 Roman Soldiers for his Parthian Campaign Leo with some help from Anthemius, scraped together a force of between 50,000/100,000 Men to retake Africa. Seriously, 100K! And his brother in law destroyed an easy victory because of his incompetence No wonder he didn't last very long after overthrowing Zeno

@timothylee2772 Жыл бұрын

It makes you wonder: What was Basiliscius thinking to act in such incompetent manner?

@henripentant1120 Жыл бұрын

Deliberate incompetence is a common theme in Roman/byz history. Priscus the magister militum is one of my favorites who made half a career out of it.

@timothylee2772 Жыл бұрын

@@henripentant1120 In the case of Cape Bon 468 AD, I am not sure if it was deliberate, but certain incompetence in the highest order. The irony is that Basiliscus ended up being a Roman emperor a few years later.

@loulou345waw 2 жыл бұрын

What do you think Basiliscus should have done to conquer Africa? Just head for Carthage as quickly as possible, overpowering the Vandals?

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

I think he should have anchored east of Cape Bon, wait for Heraclius and Marcellinus to arrive, and then take Carthage. Marcellinus was killed, so he would not come, but even so, together with Heraclius, he still could have taken Carthage. And he shouldn't have listened to Geiserich. He also should have unloaded all troops to land, and march south to meet Heraclius.

@causantinthescot 2 жыл бұрын

Bad-siliscus

@Wolfen443 11 ай бұрын

So, the Romans had their own D-Day?. I am sure that had it been successful, it might have bought 100 to 200 years for both Roman Empires maybe.

@drusik 2 жыл бұрын

This video... Really pissed me off.. (Not the production, that was great, but Ricimer and Basiliscus.

@starcapture3040 2 жыл бұрын

The north african Romans spoke no Latin but Phoenician and Amazgi languages mixed with latin

@gasmonkey1000 Жыл бұрын

Why did Aspar want Bitchboy Basiliscus to spare the Vandals?

@mango2005 11 ай бұрын

Aspar himself was probably a Goth or a Scythian. Not entirely sure which because in those days, the Romans used the term "Scythian" to include anyone from Eastern Europe, which at the time include the East Germanic tribes when they were living in Eastern Europe.

@jamessnee7171 2 жыл бұрын

See what happens when you hire your brother-in-law.

@septimiusseverus343 2 жыл бұрын

The lesson being that you should never cave in to your wife's henpecking.

@semregob3363 2 жыл бұрын

your wife must be really hot and got you simping for her

@darthwizzywizard 2 жыл бұрын

Love the Akbar meme. Ricimer really screwed Rome royally. Talk about bad leaders.

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Hehe, thanks :) Admiral Ackbar is a hero, I will always love the old Star Wars movies. Yes, Ricimer's intrigues and assassination plots easily hastened the Fall of Western Rome by 20-30 years, or possibly more.

@starcapture3040 2 жыл бұрын

Haha Al Maqadima Hate towards timberland is nothing compared to your hatred towards Ricimer

@Maiorianus_Sebastian 2 жыл бұрын

Heheh, yes, I admit, I really do hate Ricimer and I let it shine out in my videos XD

@starcapture3040 2 жыл бұрын

@@Maiorianus_Sebastian it is easily felt! :D

@semregob3363 2 жыл бұрын

the question is, is it possible NOT to hate Ricimer?

@starcapture3040 2 жыл бұрын

@@semregob3363 logic say we should haha

@nikhtose 2 жыл бұрын

Fascinating, but a little far-fetched with the "what if" speculation. Even if Carthage had been taken and the Vandals subdued, the Western empire, already in a state of advanced decay (it fell 8 years later), would have only had its death agony prolonged a few years (as happened several decades later with Justinian).

@sterlingcampbell2116 Жыл бұрын

Maybe, but not certainly. Majorian, in less than a decade, restored vast swathes of land, passed reforms that turned the west around financially and provided a major hit to political corruption. The only reason this alone didn't give the west a new lease on life is because he was murdered and and his reforms immediately undone. If one man can have that affect in less than a decade imagine the effects the events depicted in this video could have done if successful...the chain reaction it could have caused (butterfly affect). Rome had been on the verge of collapse before (second Punic war) and turned it around. It's silly to assume they couldn't do it again I feel that assuming the west couldn't have been saved is a shallow hindsight bias in the same way that people assume Abraham Lincoln becoming president was inevitable, when in reality it could have gone very different very easily.

@nikhtose Жыл бұрын

@@sterlingcampbell2116 Comparing a culture at periods centuries apart in its arc of ascent and decline is pointless and ahistorical. Rome in the 3D century BCE was ascending, that of the 5th CE declining. Tweaking with what-ifs changes little in the broad sweep.

@timothylee2772 Жыл бұрын

@@sterlingcampbell2116 Had this military operation been successful and North Africa re-conquered. We would not be looking at the 476 A.D. timeline for the death of Western Rome. Western Rome would have lived into the 6th century at least.

@soldiermeyer2790 Жыл бұрын

@@sterlingcampbell2116 I was thinking the exact same thing as you. Very good point you have there!

@matthewm9987 Жыл бұрын

I'm just glad someone is speaking Latin not Christian Latin

@silveryuno 2 жыл бұрын

What is wrong with KZfaq! Your videos do not deserve so little views...

@teslaoliveira2195 Жыл бұрын

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_fire Hallo Majoranus The betrayal would not be from the Byzantines? It seems to me more likely that at this time the Byzantines had already invented the GREEK FIRE. !!!!

@teslaoliveira2195 6 ай бұрын

Super!