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I am just an average 58 year old South African woman feels so profoundly blessed and grateful to have the opportunity to learn from Jordan Peterson and his guests and all his other lectures that are freely available on KZfaq, what an extraordinary gift you have given! Thank you! 😊

Great seeing Iain McGilchrist get some more recognition.

It always blows me away we can get this caliber of content for no charge - PhD level discussions, which are probably more enlightening than about any PhD level university lecture. This goes for every single one of JP's podcasts. It's amazing.

More of Ian’s insight is desperately needed. He’s a huge piece of the puzzle to fixing the mess we have got ourselves in. The man changed my life profoundly for the better.

Great Conversation! Here are some notes that may help: 4:00 The Matter With Things expounds on The Master and His Emissary via the experiential variations between left/right hemispheres + explores this in relation to the modern material reductionism 5:30 most brain structures have a divided brain - two forms of perception 7:30 right v. left hemisphere - complexity : theoretical 10:50 “believing the map v. the world that’s mapped” - one fault of current society 17:00 Divisions of “The Matter With Things” Book 18:20 severe delusions → likely disorder of right hemisphere. Also, unique opportunity to advance w/ theoretical models of the left/right hemispheres applied in the context of neuropsychological/psychiatric complications 21:00 Maps of Meaning 21:30 science, reason, intuition, and imagination (second part of “The Matter With Things”) 24:30 significance of dreams mapped onto right/left hemisphere proclivities - “we need something to fill the gap between the consistent and narrow, and ultimately unknown.” 28:00 throughline of “The Matter WIth Things” 29:28 similarities of OCD and Anorexia 31:20 misconception with making things explicit 32:50 theoretical etiology of the gender identity arguments 34:00 optical illusions and intuition 35:20 COVID and political intuition 37:50 defining/categorizing intuition and imagination; distinction between fantasy and imagination 40:00 rehabilitating conceptions of intuition and imaginations + its significance 42:05 “fantasy is the misuse of imagination to replace reality” 45:00 imagination differs from the propositional 46:29 - right hemisphere alloys things to come into being (spontaneous ideas pop into our mind) and the left hemisphere categorizes this 48:00 second part of the book is epistemology, the third part is metaphysics - the concept of opposites, the concept of the place of the individual in a whole, and the concept of the constituents of reality (time, space, flow, matter, consciousness) 50:30 values, purpose, sense of the sacred - we don’t invent them, we discover them (meaning of life) 51:05 arguments w/ people like Dr. Richard Dawkins and their shortcomings relative to religion 52:30 importance of awe and wonder 57:00 collapse of the wave function, its relation to attention, and the potential mapping onto the right brain 59:00 attention is an active, open receptivity - not passive. “Key insight to make is that attention is a moral act.” 1:00:10 logos: “truth in language and imagination serving love.” 1:01:10 “all that exists is in relation.” this is like Dr. Carlo Rovelli’s point from Dr. Brain Keating’s podcasts, where he discusses, “The world is not made by things with properties, but by things that interact with one another and they only have properties when they interact - relations, not properties.” Video Title: “Carlo Rovelli: How Heisenberg’s Hay Fever Gave Us Quantum Mechanics” Timestamp 18:23. 1:06:15 “myths were the only ways in which you could embody and communicate the really deep truths.” science has its own myths and narratives. 1:07:20 conundrum with people like Dr. Richard Dawkins regarding faith, truth, and narrative 1:10:10 “science was embedded in a narrative tradition that was at least implicit” 1:14:15 science actually hasn’t explained the concept of beauty 1:17:55 music has intrinsic meaning, depth, beauty. Goodness, truth, and beauty - most important values by Dr. Iain McGilchrist. Very interesting how many other scientists like Sir Roger Penrose and Dr. John Vervaeke point to this delineation 1:24:30 linguistics came out of the musical and why music is meaningful 1:27:00 why have we become so left-brained in a sense? 1:33:40 important to note what’s going on in our culture isn’t capitalistic malevolence so to speak, but a manifestation of something deeply rooted in our nature 1:34:25 framework of “Master and His Emissary” seen cross-culturally 1:36:55 “denial is key feature of left hemisphere’s take on the world” 1:38:30 categorizing the left hemisphere relative to left-leaning proclivity. another tendecy of the left brain is to deny the existence of something existing - out of sight, out of mind. why smart people still tend to fall on the far left spectrum (where intellect is circumvented). 1:43:30 when you see the world as mechanistic and devoid of meaning, this leads to a susceptibility towards control and sporadic emotion. Ultimately, this would lead to a culture of intolerance and totalitarianism. If you think about it, people still need an identity because it gives them some grounding/purpose - so whether they’ll use extrinsic supply of nonsense to form beliefs that loop an intrinsic sense of meaning or develop intrinsic principles and represent it extrinsically based on their goals, it’s the same mechanism (fundamental way of how “weaponizing empathy” works). 1:44:50 Sam Harris → rational atheism to meditation. Doesn’t want to associate a narrative with the spiritual observance of a meditative state/practice. 1:46:00 the function of a narrative system 1:48:00 instrumentalization/commodity of meditation 1:49:25 “isn’t anything more important than understanding the processes by which attention is directed.” bird’s eye view is essential. 1:50:45 patients with schizophrenia “see the eye of Horus” - the disembodied eye 1:52:30 there is some purpose that is transcendent, that is sacred, and is not deterministic 1:53:00 Sir Roger Penrose on non-determinism and that biology and physics point to this

The authors of 2 of the most powerful books I have read. The master and his emissary and maps of meaning. I truly look forward to The matter with things. Bravo gentleman.

Jordan Peterson is /so/freaking/good/ at what he does. He is so well versed in mythology, psychology, history, politics, and so much more. He has exponentially changed my life for the better just from listening and understanding him. And this is coming from a guy that thinks he had it all figured out. Seriously, God bless you and thank you. I thought I knew how to think, but listening to you expanded my mind on the level of how psychedelics would. Keep talking.

Dr McGilchrist’s work has been an amazing discovery for me in the last few months. Thank you Dr Peterson.

McGilchrist's magisterial tour-de-force The Master and his Emissary is a masterpiece and easily among the most important works of the 21st century. He is in a class all his own and deserves (we need him) to be in public consciousness. His ideas in M&E and The Matter with Things are vital to our survival. - Thanks for inviting him, Dr. Peterson.

Iain is one of my favorite living psychiatrists to read!

I can’t believe this content is free. Astonishingly insightful. Thank you for sharing.

Hard to overstate how valuable this is to me.

For me, The Matter with Things truly is a masterpiece, a deeply transformative experience that should be read for centuries to come. I would love to see more of Iain McGilchrist & John Vervaeke in conversation as they explore similar areas in different ways.

Very humbling that a human being can create such a magnificent work as The matter with things. Great to hear him on a big platform like this to get attention for his most needed work.

Can I just say... Jordan, your interviewing skills have come along way, this was an absolute joy to listen to

The ability to have intelligent, civil discourse is imperative. They both exemplify the saying, "assume the person you are speaking to may know something you do not."

Iain is one of the few guys that can ‘tame’ Jordan in a conversion.

I've got a free 2 year College Education from Peterson and his guests. So indebted to their efforts...the podcasts bring these ideas to life. Clearly proving their point...and should support the narrative point!💯

Yassss! This is exactly what I want to listen to right now! Thank you!

McGilchrist has the patience of a monk and the ways of a great teacher.

I am reading your incredible compendium on the Master and his Emissary. This was after I listened to Dr. Peterson’s discussion with you on the subject of the brain divided. Thank you for such a profound work! And to you Dr. Peterson, you’re making me a better nurse 😊

I'll have to go without food and switch the lights off for a time, but I think I'll actually go out and buy Mr McGilchrist's book. A price worth paying methinks.

I’m about 300 pages into the book and so far loving it!

Brilliant. Jordan, you pitched this perfectly - I was a bit disappointed with your previous discussion with Iain (you didn't seem to appreciate his ideas and cut him up too much) but this was spot-on - teeing Iain up to explain and illustrate and adding brilliant points, examples and summations yourself throughout. It's amazing and liberating to listen to such exceptional men of knowledge!

Professor McGilchrist is amazing! When I first encountered him my initial thought were....”Wow I’d love to see a conversation with him and Dr. Peterson!”.....& here we are! 😍😍👏🏻

2 of my all time favorite thinkers! Babylon Bee interviewed John Cleese and at the end asked him if he could add any book to the Bible, what would it be. His answer was the Master and his Emissary by Iain McGilchrist. 😄

Just a sheer privilege to hear these two wonderful men speaking. Thank you.

Shout out from Soweto, South Africa. Huge fan of Ian's work. These books and The Master and his Emissary were deeply profound with how I look at things.

What a privilege to be allowed to listen to the dialogue between two luminous minds. Sparks everywhere and so many new understandings. Full of gratitude

Always a breeze watching and listening to these two gentlemen. Iain's calm nature and Jordan's lateral thinking (connecting ideas and/or events) are always beautiful to see.

This could have gone on for another 2-3 hours and I would have been glued to my seat.

The Master And His Emissary is the most important book written in the past 500 years. It is a breathtaking, groundbreaking, all-encompassing, philosophical, spiritual, scientific and academic revelation, covering all aspects of life and existence. There is no area of science, philosophy, psychology, or any discipline of human life, that is not covered by TMAHE and its successor, TMWT (The Matter With Things). Both of these books are essentially Part 1 and Part 2 of Iain McGilchrist's paradigm for the two ways of viewing the world, one via the left hemisphere, one via the right hemisphere. All of it is brilliant, all of it is amazing. Every word that Iain McGilchrist utters is like poetry, metaphorical, yet absolutely relevant. Centuries later, historians will look back upon this book and Iain McGilchrist as a turning point in civilization.

Brilliant and beautiful conversation. This made my evening. Thank you both. Luv ya Jordan ✝️❤️

“Fantasy is something that covers up reality and takes one away from it. Imagination is one’s only chance to feeling one’s way into reality”. Thank you!

I listened to a podcast with Iain McGilchrist on 'unherd' and I was spellbound. No doubt this man is exceptionally talented, but he can bring his understanding across in a manner that a nobody like me feels inspired. I'll be looking for him when I feel desponded, which happens regularly these days...

I feel very privileged to observe and hear the thoughts and discussions between two extraordinary men.

How do you know someone fully understands a subject? They can break it down into layman's terms. That is where Dr. Peterson shines. That is his gift to those of us that not fully ingulfed into this type of study. I enjoy the way he introduces me to thought exercises and gives me fact based knowledge. I find myself constantly looking up words and people or books he references.

Love it when these two get together! My favorite Canadian and British thinkers. What a treat! Thank you both.

One of the key spiritual teachings to understand is that every action has an equal and opposite reaction. You can apply this law to physical human experiences of pain/pleasure. However, the mind can act as a gatekeeper to which thoughts we choice to give life to. We can decide to ignore thoughts of our past that are causing us depression, for example. With enough training the mind can block out negative self chatter etc. At this point the individual is essentially living without conscience. Life will become much more fulfilling on a sensory level without the mind blocking your perception of life. I think fulfilment and peace of mind is the best medicine to suffering.

absolutely brilliant i haven't even watched the video yet but my favorite ever Jordan Peterson interview is with this man Mcgilchrist, it was only around 30mins long but it was so insightful and riveting and the two just had great chemistry, no doubt this will be the same cant wait!!!!

Good call on the WEF at 1:34:00, Jordan. McGilchrist provides some major clues as to why our civilization appears to be going into a tailspin. Profound, yet straightforward. Great discussion. Thank you.

It is an absolute honor and immeasurable experience of growth to have just listened to this discussion with Dr. Iain McGilchrist and Jordan. Thank you so much for this. Iain is a real wonder to be exposed to.

Jordan, I have to say I think Mcgilchrist is the first person you have interviewed that is your actual peer and has the deep understanding of ALL the literature in both nerophsycolgy and philosophy that makes you so fundamentally profound.

Less than a month, and this type of intelectual content has over 300k views. This is what gives me hope in humanity. If only these 300k+ type people can learn to communicate even a fraction as good as these guys, we would help pull the world out of this pit of insanity.

Watching these interviews redirects my focus onto important matters I often let slip away. I recall reading about a syndrome called "Alian Arm Syndrome" back in the 1990's. It's a very interesting experiment that started in cats and lead to human patients back in the 1950's I believe. They cut the corpus callossum so the two hemispheres could no longer communicate. The outcome in human subjects was extraordinary.

This is so valuable. Thank you for educating so many of us at once. Thank you for looking into the depths of the universe and explaining what we might think about it.

Although we are going through major civilizational shifts that could lead to some very dark places, we are very fortunate to be able to watch two minds like this meet. Iain is clearly a genius, I look forward to reading his book.

Amazing conversation; it took the full power of both my hemispheres to keep up. Thank you gentlemen!

Nothing is more interesting than when biology and physics meets psychology and philosophy

So, roughly 9 minutes and 20 seconds in, where Ian talks about how the left hemisphere breaks things up to make them more manageable, this is a really good insight when overlayed on management structure like he's doing. The Roman Empire, for example, had a famous saying, "divide and conquer," totally a left brained approach.

One can learn more in one of your interviews than if half a semester in college.

I love Iain's work. His thoughts and books have had such a positive effect on me. Every time I read his work or listen to him speak there is just insight after insight, incredible. In such a increasingly worrying world of extreme polarity, fixed absolute thinking and conflict, his work and wisdom is really needed.

Outstanding session, thank you to both Dr. Peterson and Dr. McGilchrist! I appreciated Dr. Peterson allowing Dr. McGilchrist lengthy periods to articulate his thoughts. Excellent articulation of complex concepts. Greatly appreciate the discussion about meaning, philosophy and current social pathogens as they relate to the functioning of the human brain.

McGilchrist’s point about the value (and implication) of where one places one’s attention - so important. Since things tend to cluster (people, people with various hobbies or beliefs, types of art/music, youtube videos and the ‘suggested videos’ which follow them, etc) it places even more importance on that initial choice of what to attend to, because the things around it, which will vie for your attention too, are likely similar in nature and shape your life by the ideas they espouse and the culture they create. So start every day by thinking about and learning about the things that are truly important to you. Put yourself on the right path at the start, because if you’re gonna go down a rabbit hole, make it one you’re passionate about.

I just finished volume one of "The Matter With Things". I can't wait to start the second volume and also to listen to this podcast! Ian has become quite possibly my favorite living philosopher alongside Ken Wilber. Religious fundamentalism, scientific materialism, and postmodern relativism are the three dominant philosophical worldviews of the modern world and someone has to point out how and why all three failure epically at their attempts at describing/explaining existence while ALSO pointing to something beyond those limiting worldviews rather than merely criticizing them without offering any alternatives. McGilchrist and Wilber are the two thinkers who have best accomplished this feat imo, and it is sorely needed.

Wow. A few college-level courses here with lots to consider. Thank you both.

Always a pleasure to hear these men's thoughts and conversations. Things I wish this conversation explored more directly, and I hope future talks will address: - Process vs Substance and the primacy of relation. - Imagination as single greatest determinant of the scope of individual freedom. - Temporality, actuality and the opening/closing of possibilities.

Really enjoyed this discussion. My response to your question to Ian about intuition I believe it’s the brain’s way of using all the data it has absorbed over a lifetime to inform whatever you’re facing in the present. As always, thank you.

I love Ian's work.

This is a brilliant conversation. I needed this today more than I realised, thank you so very much. JBP & IM

Thank you all in advance to uploading this masterpiece. This kind of scientific stuff and paradigms have been encouraging me to immerse myself into it more and more over nearly 2 years in a sense I'd been able to sharpen my knowledge and discover a few more aptitudes non-eligible for me but at last I begun to define what I should have done beforehand. I appreciate all of your work and from now on, I'll be more profoundly getting involved in it by a means of these inevitably vital records. God bless you all

This is just brilliant. This is the most cohesive line of thinking I have come across to align our post-modern predicament to our human experience. Just fantastic.

Had been patiently waiting for these two to get back together. Gratitude gentlemen 🙏

What a great conversation!! Thank you gentlemen.

Stunning. Thank you both. 🙏🏽

Thank you, Jordan. This was a beautiful conversation ❤️ sending love from South Africa 🇿🇦

Thank you for all your hard work Dr. Peterson, I really appreciate everything you do!

Another great talk. Thanks to both participants.

I meant to read the Master and His Emissary after the last McGilchrist / Peterson interview because he was so compelling. I didn’t read it, and now I have his second book to read, too! Wow - what a conversation.

This conversation is has found a place in my all time top ten discussions. I almost cried at some points.

Jordan has clearly taken the interrupting criticism to heart

This is a new one of my favorite conversations.

I'm really looking forward to this talk. I've managed to watch almost all of what Jordan has uploaded which is a massive undertaking for anyone other than long haul truckers who don't listen to country music. Iain however is hitting at something really profound and I've often wondered whether Iains work is actually the key to understanding the conflict between Jordan and many of his critics. Or even much of the anger in academic circles surrounding many of the social sciences. I hope this discussion is everything I'm expecting and more.

Brilliant conversation. Made my day. Thank you gentlemen! 🙏🏽

"If you let me, I'd like to tell you my idea about music, I think you might like it." I loved that line, like he respects the man's mind and expertise so much that he just had to tell him, like showing your dad what you learned on your own

Looking forward to this part 2!

Excellent guest, great conversation. Worth paying my attention to.

There are many many people out there, that no nothing of this great man. He is a true gift to the world. I mention him alot while I drive my taxi.

I'm only an hour in and this conversation really speaks to me, thank you both

Glad to see McGilchrist back. His new book is desperately important. I hope Peterson doesn't talk over McGilchrist as much as he did the last time he had him on.

Amazing conversation! Iain McGilchrist is a genius. I was waiting for this podcast since last year when his new book came out :) Now I want to see him talk to Sam Harris, Joe Rogan, Lex Fridman and Curt Jaimungal.

Many months ago, you introduced us to this very guest and I was fascinated and learned a lot from that conversation! I can't wait to listen to this one.

Dr Peterson is generally a very respectful and skilled interviewer. Having watched two of his interviews with Iain McGilchrist, a particular reverance and respect struck me, which is completely understandable.

Fantastic, I just wish I knew how to take the knowledge they discuss here and have a way to implement it into my life

I read The Matter With Things and it was brilliant and life-changing. I plan to re-read it many times.

Thanks for this - my two favourite thinkers together.

What an absolutely wonderful conversation! It has taken me several days to get through it and my notebook is full of notes and it has been incredibly rewarding to go on the journey of watching this video. I didn't know anything about McGilchrist before but I'm sure to read his book now. His deep analysis of the differences between the hemispheres and its consequences it mind blowing. I wonder if the lack of right hemisphere thinking is hindering us from making truly fundamental breakthroughs in engineering and science and that our relience on the left hemisphere causes most of the work to be incremental and shallow (not to say that it's not useful).

So meaningful conversation!

The Coincidence of Opposites lecture by Dr McGilchrist and also his discussion in his great tome The Matter with Things brings much needed understanding to the agony of ambiguity not recognized in institutions etc. Ambiguity resolved by imagination and intuition and humour etc needs to be radically accepted in order to be able to actually live in the real world. We live in a Borderline Personality Disordered paradigm today, which is essentially the unresolved ability to accept ambiguity in a left hemisphere dictatorship: emotional dysregulation particularly for the highly sensitive, the artistic trait openness types. The comedic aspect is that the left hemisphere can’t see that it’s powerful engineering ability is no longer working for real people. The young people we are losing to suicide, addiction etc are the canaries in the mineshaft screaming to us that we are in grave trouble and we pathologize their behavior instead of wondering why they are dying in our great Third War.

Absolute gold! Grateful for this.

Clearly both intelligent and educated men with the added bonus of great memories. One, wise, thoughtful and patient. A great listener. The other: interruptive, impatient and trying to prove something. A teenager.

This is an EXCELLENT conversation... 😁

Really amazing content. Thank you!!!

What a fantastic conversation. Thank u guys so much

I absolutely love this conversation. What a great intellectual exchange, it gave me great new perspective and understanding. Thank you very much!

McGilchrist is so right: everything IS relationship, that’s why God IS love. And that’s why God is both one and three (the lover, the love and the beloved).

I've not being pulled Into one of these podcasts as much as this in a long time, if ever. I must look into Iain Mcgillcrist and his work more. You know Jordan is talking to someone he admires when he calls back all interruptions. His dialect seems to come out more during this conversation ey. I think us Yorkshire folk are much like the canadians, we have lot of the same manorisms only different ye ;)

I have listened to this podcast in it’s entirety on DailyWire / KZfaq three times now… This content is so rich - I could listen many more times just to try and glean - the information shared here. Love the interplay and dialogue between you two. One of my favorite all-time podcasts! Amazing! 🤔 WOW! Much to Think about and ruminate on. Thanks for sharing. **I wish we could add comments like this on DailyWire.** 🙏👏👏👏

This conversation is SO GOOD. I might have to read McGilchrist's book.