I FORGOT TO MAKE THE START AND END BLACK AND WHITE! I apologize for this grievous error. I understand if some of you could never forgive me, or even unsubscribe for such a damaging mistake. This entire video is essentially worthless now, I know. I hope one day we can all recover and move on.

Classic Vector never showing up in Classic media again feels the most wrong tbh, like bro he was legit created by Naoto Oshima for Sonic 1 making him one of the oldest Sonic characters ever, and this is how he's being treated, smh.

My best guess they don’t use classic Chaotix is because they don’t want to admit Knuckles Chaotix exists

Picture of Sticks with text "Nepotism???" is absolute gold

Seeing "Forced segregation" text with a bunch of Sonic characters is hilarious

Iizuka mentioned the Chaotix members’ redesigns in an interview prior to Heroes (I believe) and was super adamant about Chaotix not being a Sonic Team game, hence why they wanted to remake the characters. Like another commenter stated, it’s odd because Sonic Team wasn’t actually a real division prior to NiGHTS. Even if you retroactively add Sonic 1-3 into ST’s softography because of Naka’s involvement, CD was developed without him. And if they say, “Well, Ōshima directed that title and he was a key member of Sonic 1’s team and later joined Sonic Team,” Hoshino was part of Chaotix’s development team and is one of the leaders of the current Sonic Team. I think it’s not as cut and dry as “Sonic Team” and “not Sonic Team,” and it’s more a matter of what Iizuka personally likes lol.

Modern Mighty is my favorite Sonic character, and it's a shame he's not around. His iteration in the post-reboot archie comics specifically, such a bad ass.

Modern King -- Classic Peasant -- I'm dead 💀

Sonic Team not wanting to bring back old non-Sonic Team characters does line up with Ian Flynn stating often on the Bumblekast that Sonic Team isn't too keen on referencing older material (i.e. the freedom fighters). Also with the IDW cast at least, I'd say they're essentially game characters. The IDW comics have a significant amount of Sonic Team oversight, and some Sonic Team artists like Yuji Uekawa have even made covers for certain issues.

I honestly enjoy this type of editing instead of gameplay quite a lot, the drawings and shit are really funny lol

I knew Pariah was gonna do something funny for april fools but I did not expect it being him throwing the word "nepotism" into the sonic team conversation

I think a lot about how different the franchise would be if Sonic Heroes released with its original concept. We'd have modern counterparts of Fang, Bean, Bark, Mighty, and Ray. Shadow would stay dead so there would probably be a completely different game made between Heroes and 06 and that could have had huge ramifications for the series. Since every character was modernized, maybe we'd have Sonic Team taking a completely different approach to Classic characters than they currently do. When you think about it, Heroes was a huge branching point in the timeline for the series. I'd love to get a glimpse of that alternate timeline.

Classic Espio last appeared in Sonic The Fighters but Classic Charmy and Classic Vector last appeared in Knuckles Chaotix AKA, their debut game.

Weren't Vector and Mighty character designs created during the development of Sonic 1 though? That would make them Sonic Team characters....

Nintendo does the same thing; people always ask why Waluigi isn’t in mainline Mario games and it’s because he was created by Camelot, not in-house at Nintendo.

Man that makes SOOO MUCH SENSE this man really cracked the code I wish sega would be more transparent about this stuff I think the reasons why sega does this stinks but I would respect it more if they would say it out right

Honestly, I think this is just the byproduct of the Chaotix being retconned for Heroes. I'm sure something similar would've happened to the other classic characters if they stuck to the original plan. As a result, if they did stick with this whole "Classic Sonic universe" thing, it'd probably only just be Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Amy, Metal Sonic, and Eggman without any of the other obscure characters, even as cameos.

The argument that Sega only wanted to use Sonic Team characters before Mania is a moot point because Mighty and Ray were designed by Manabu Kusunoki, who was a member of Sonic Team. I think the only reason they're not using the classic Chaotix characters is that they just haven't gotten around to it yet, I don't think there's some big grand reason. We'll probably see them soon, and classic Espio has already also had a cameo in one of the IDW classic issues on a Fighters arcade cabinet, in addition to the art you mentioned. Sonic Team still has involvement with pretty much every game that uses the Sonic brand. Even The Murder of Sonic the Hedgehog had involvement from Sonic Team members even though it was largely developed by the Twitter social media team and their friends. There's no grand conspiracy or a rivalry between Sonic Team and Sega, and if they wanted to use them they would. It's not at all the same issue as the Freedom Fighters because those were characters created either by American cartoon writers with little involvement from Sega or by the early Archie team that they wanted to distance themselves from for obvious reasons. Sonic Team didn't develop Tails Skypatrol and 4 characters from that game just showed up in the comics recently. This video is jumping to a lot of conclusions and honestly this issue is not that big of a deal. We'll see them sooner or later, just like eventually Knuckles' Chaotix will probably get a rerelease, it just hasn't happened yet. If they can bring back an official redesigned Elise, anything can happen, and Sega can do whatever they want with their characters.

I would honestly love a team chaotix game where they actually do detective work and solve a mystery.... Bumbling through it all the way of course, but accidentally solving the mystery.

I would’ve just said that Sega noticed all of the Classic fans who felt alienated over the years. So when they started bringing back Classic characters in only Classic material, they did it to create a version of Sonic just for those Classic fans so they aren’t alienated as much, and can have their Sonic. The Chaotix isn’t is only because the roster of Classic is already decently sized, and they didn’t want to overflow it with more characters, remembering the old complaint of too many Sonic characters from Classic fans.

The problem is that Sonic's world has a distinct lore, and we see whimsical/weird environments in modern Sonic and more realistic ones in Classic(esp. in the artwork). It's clear that they're both the same world, but as stated, the Island nations tend to be pretty weird & anthro populated and the continents are more human and "earth" like, albeit with some of the same odd geography, presumably shaped by the various god-like forces through the millenia. Shadow, Chaos, Dark Gaia, the Ancients all exist in "Classic Sonic", he just hasn't encountered him yet. A lot of people want to keep them truly separate, as if nothing from the modern era ever happened, but that doesn't make sense with how they explained it. If the timelines diverged and Classic Sonic DOES exist in his own timeline as a result, it SHOULD go on to have alternate versions of the plots of the various games - which would be kind of cool, Sonic Adventure 2D? Why not. If Classic Sonic was ALWAYS a separate Universe that just so happened to resemble Modern Sonic's past, it just feels like trying too hard to appeal to the retrowank. Like I get it, Classic Sonic has a certain appeal and as of Sonic Adventure, it did take a slightly different direction. But at the same time, it's hard to pinpoint for *sure* exactly where that happens. Sonic 3 & Knuckles already edged towards a more modern style. The "Classic Sonic" a lot of people imagine is very distinctly Sonic 1-CD-2, but Knuckles is somehow there too. Sonic 2 was in many ways the Zenith of Sonic, when he was at peak cultural relevance(into 93 with the cartoons). But even then, the modern "Santiago" Classic Sonic is it's own weird little Disneyfied thing - he's cute alright and very toyetic, but in reality Classic Sonic pretty obviously had the same implied personality as modern. I nearly feel like the "Classic Disney Sonic" should be his own thing altogether. Lean into the bastardised classic style and do something with it. You can even do some of the modern characters in that style, why not? I feel like I'm more of a modern Sonic person even though I did grow up with the 16 and 8 bit titles, and recognise that that it some ways peaked with 2 and 3 & Knuckles. There's just something about the approach - which I blame as much on the "fans" as anyone - that rubs me the wrong way.

Unrelated, but the April Fools game was actually pretty good, you should play if you get the chance. Spoilers BELOW.....! The train was surprisingly a great sonic bad guy with the type of motives that you would find with other characters in the franchise. He just needed to be reasoned with, and when he finally comes to terms with his pain, it was too late. Also loved the Sage, Metal Sonic, Eggman image at the end. Had me DYING!

*R.I.P Heavy and Bomb. You will.. maybe be missed.. you both were in one game*

To be honest I respect this decision. It makes the franchise more focused and easier to tell of what's canon and what's not. You have no idea how many Sonic fans STILL unironically think that Sonic lives on planet Mobius.

I believe on of the reasons we don't see the old chaotics is a combination of reasons. First of all the original designs and personalities were supplanted by the current designs. Heroes was probably the first time that many saw or even played as the chaotics and thats how a good chunk of the fan base knows those characters. In addition the old designs of the chaotics dont exactly fit the style of genisis sonic and the new ones dont exactly play nice with those designs either. Espio horn/noseless features kinda clash with alot of the old style, Vector would have similar issue with how old vector is designed. And while its not an issue with Charmy, those characters are a trio and such have to be group as such. While in the chase of Amy and Sonic their designs being supstainally different from thier older version I think they can get away with that because those old forms are so iconic that people accept it. That would be the case with the chaotics. As for a why the older characters havent made theier way back into the main line game is also combination of things. The shift to Sonic Solo games ever since 06's failure has made it difficult to reintroduce older characters into the series. Characters like Ray and Mighty can't just enter the franchise again without being playable on some level. Nack as a villian did have the potential of popping up in Forces admittedly, but as he might have just been forgotten or considering what they wanted to do with infinite they chose to skip over Nack. We will probably never see Mordern characters get a Genisis version, simply because of how those characters are introduced nito the series. You cant have a classic Shadow playing a long a classic sonic because of How shadow was introduce same goes with rouge and other mordern additons

Ian Flynn does say in one of his bubble cast podcasts that Knuckles Chaotix is still considered cannon to make everything cannon.

Very fun video! Your usual podcast-y analysis style of videos meshes surprisingly well with these character-centric, isolated projects (like with the Amy video). Hope to see more of these goofy side-projects sprinkled in more often!

*Shows Sticks on screen* NePoTiSm??? Jokes aside I'm enjoying seeing your humor shine through visually! This was quite compelling for an April Fools day video. You could even turn this into a series. Pariah, Private Eye!

My guess is that Knuckles Chaotix conflicts with the direction the wanted to go with certain characters, so using their classic designs would just conflict with the direction they are going with for Knuckles, Mighty, and the Chaotix themselves, it is especially true when you realize that they have different abilities and skills compared to their modern counter parts, especially noticeable for Mighty, showing that the game was very different compared to what they are doing now.

They got busted along with Yuji Naka for insider trading.

Sonic Team should start appropriating more characters. The Hooligans are already mercenaries, make them the Chaotix's rivals or something

This has been bothering me for a while, but your theory really does make the most sense versus anything I've come up with

You do honestly have a nice theory as to why the Classic versions of the Chaotix haven't been seen. However I do feel like there are some gaps here & there as we don't really have a definitive answer until someone either from Sonic Team, Sega or even good ol Ian Flynn himself can confirm it. Also (and I personally wanted to point this out) the main reason for why the Archie Comics mainly got tossed was due to some controversies surrounding a particular man. If you know, you know. But hey, I'm at least happy that there's a new set of Sonic comics with even newer characters to keep up with the blue blur & his many adventures.

Ok, but the real tragedy is the complete neglect of the other classic knuckles chaotix stars, robotnik mechanix: heavy and bomb. I miss those little goobers

Watching the intro after listening to team chaotix theme is just such a perfect fit. I like those little details you took from that song and the game itself. I know you will not respond, but I just want to tell you that you did a fantastic job, be proud with what you have done.

Incredibly insightful and informative video as always! I didn't even know of their existence until now

I never really questioned any of this. So practically Classic Chaotix are dead permanently and doesn't have a Classic counterpart. Their solely Modern. That doesn't really get under my skin. I understand why Modern can't go to Classic, but there's no excuse why Classic can't go to Modern. That gets under my skin I guess some characters like Fang, Bean, Bark and I guess the non-existent Honey simply won't fit in the story but they could go AROUND that and make the story fit them. Find some way. They can go make a game practically reintroducing them in a new light that makes them feel like new characters and yet we know that they existed in the past(except for Honey) And most importantly Mighty and Ray definitely should be a part of the Sonic Heroes(Modern cast) no question. I would insist that they look back at the Archie Comics and use some of that back. Like literally this is perfect Ray and Charmy can be best buds while they connect with Team Chaotix too😣 There is this one bright side though I guess. Sticks will be in a game( a NOT Boom game ) someday 🤟

Fun fact: Knuckles Chaotix's is canon because in the new Fang the Hunter mini series they brung Neutronic High Zone back in issue 2# and since IDW Sonic is canon to the games this means classic chaotix's is still canon. And in Sonic Seasons of Chaos on page 40, when eggman is sleeping, you can see a Sonic the Fighters cabinet with classic espio next to classic knuckles. And in the recent tails tube the acknowledge the events of knuckles chaotix's along with mighty and ray still existing somewhere on earth. I think the reason why we can't see classic chaotix is because SEGA mandates and brand confusion and Sonic Heroes confusion. But classic Vector does make a small blink and you miss it appearances in Amy 30th adventure comic so...

I don't thing saying "Sonic Team wants" makes a lot of sense as Sonic Team's staff has been a revolving door for years now. Far more likely that its just a few high ranking members with in Sonic Team that want there own work to feel valued higher that block most stuff that wasn't develop by them. This becomes especially noticeable ones you remember that Sonic CD is about as much true Sonic Team as Chaotix yet Amy and Metal are still very much around in both Classic and modern form. (Hell both Amy and Charmy debuted in a Sonic manga before the games) Archie wasn't Canceled by Sega. Archie didn't renew there license as they wanted to drop the Sonic comics to focus on there own properties. One more thing worth mentioning about the Sonic Channel Bio's are that they are often really lazily done. Almost every character that was in Sonic X got the pin-points copy passed from Sonic X Eye-Catcher cards. This is especially noticeable with Cream and Eggman. Cream because it states her favorite things is "The Next Show" a element unique to Sonic X while all game manuals always state her favorite things are Chao and Ice Cream. And Eggman because it states his true name is unknown. A thing they still haven't updated despite the Japanese version of TailsTube 2 still giving us his real name as Ivo Robotnik. And all non Sonic X eye-catcher card profiles share that they are for characters introduced AFTER Sonic X. I suppose it also worth noticing that because Classic Sonic is back to being Sonic's past do most newer characters make no sense to appear in the classic era. Like they won't meet Cream before Advance 2, Shadow on't wake up before Adventure 2, Blaze is doing her own things in her dimension until Rush, No one know Silver before Rivals and so on. The Chaotix are really the only other modern characters that could logistically appear in the classic era.

This turned out as a pretty fun vid. I appreciate trying to go with a different video style/editing/format(?) for a random topic, and while it isn't my cup of tea; it is a nice change of pace for you, Pariah. What you talked about was really interesting as well. While I don't agree that reason why so many characters from the past, like the Freedom Fighters or the StF cast don't show up in Modern iterations or media isn't because Sonic Team has some bias to the ones that made and didn't made. I just think Sega is too lazy to realize that they have so many fan favourites to bring back, and yet they just kinda don't, lmao. But it could be a possibility, and does also explain why recent Sonic media have been more faithful to the games; and not having the creative freedom for the likes of Archie, Fleetway, the Manga, or the DIC cartoons. Personally I do hope we get obscure characters make a comeback into Modern and become officially canon (you can tell from my pfp that I love Honey), but I agree that it'll be unlikely (I mean I won't stop believing, but at the same time I can't do much). And ig this is whole topic was very dumb and silly; but it was uploaded on April Fools, so might as well have some fun

With the release of the murder of sonic and this video you remind me how much I want an not ironic ace attorney-like kind of game with team Chaotix. I mean they are detectives only in name, I want to resolve mysteries with them.

i read the publishing date and knew i was going to have fun

funny that you propose that sonic team dismisses stuff that wasn't created by them, because i feel like this is the same thing with the kirby series. kumazaki's first game where he was director that wasn't a remake was return to dream land. HIS characters have appeared dozens of times and been made central to the lore, yet side characters not created by him have been ignored. take gooey, for example. shimomura is, for all intents and purposes, the creator of gooey. yet, despite being kirby's housemate and very likely best friend, he has been left in the dust and basically supplanted by bandana waddle dee, who is a kumazaki character since he first appeared in super star ultra. this extends to the main characters, too. shimomura's kirby displayed emotions a lot, and he had romantic interests. kumazaki's kirby is a little hungry kid who can barely crack a smile or frown. what i'm saying here is that kumazaki has the same intentions as sonic team - they aren't HIS characters, but they were made and put in games, so he can't simply wipe them all out to make way for his characters. instead, he shoves them off to places where they won't be able to intervene in the stories of his games. yes, i am aware of auxiliary materials. no, they don't count. nor does the shameful pile of steaming garbage that calls itself star allies.

I was introduced to these guys in Heroes. ... Heroes was my first Sonic game. Might be part of why I look back on it significantly more fondly than many.

Reminder that Mighty and Ray came back before the classic Chaotix

I always liked the classic Vector best but I like the idea that he just grew older and got bigger. I guess this is why we won't see Chaotix get a remake/remaster etiher. Though while Sega doesn't want to use these characters, that kind of opens it up for the fan creators to make something with them. I mean, they probably won't care if someone makes a Sally Acorn game for instance though they usually are good about everything.

Now it makes sense why Sonic Origins is handled so badly, because Sega doesn't give a f*ck about classic stuff

Fun Fact: Christian Whitehead was really close to make classic Silver and classic Shadow real in Sonic Mania, but this idea got scrapped like a lot of Taxman's ideas (like True Final Boss for Sonic CD or new zone for Sonic CD). Also I really don't like idea of separate universes, because we can cleary see Sonic growing up game-by-game (like in 1991 Sonic, he can't spindash, but in Sonic CD he learns it with peelout, in Sonic 2 1992 he learns way more better way to use his speed without need to charge it and in Sonic 3 1994 we can see him looking different and more similar to his Adventure look, also he learns instashield, in Adventure he learns homing attack etc.), so Phantom Ruby being merged Time Stones from Sonic CD would make much more sense than multiverse thing

Interesting watch. This does make a lot of sense. You only touched on this briefly, but making Classic Sonic (capital C) just Modern Sonic's past again was a terrible decision IMO. Not gonna get into it with my injured hand, but it's honestly about as bad as "two worlds" was and I feel like I'm taking crazy pills, seeing everyone praise it like it's a fix.

I love how this whole video is just a conspiracy that keeps going like “OR are they”

I wish they would just make the classic games official just younger versions and earlier in the time line, and just bring in the classic characters to the modern sonic, and let sonic team update their visual designs if they want

Perhaps this is about to change with Iizuka's mentioned "unified Sonic experience," as well as with (what seems like) more post-Frontiers creative freedom.

Then there's the latest Tails Tube which decided to acknowledge Knuckles Chaotix

The argument falls a bit flat when you remember Gemerl, the Deadly Six nor Infinite have profiles on Sonic Channel either. Edit: also Elise. I mean, we know they are official characters, and Gemerl , Elise and Infinite did receive artwork (the first thanks to IDW; the latter two with that weird what-if thing on Twitter). Heck, despite becoming a staple in the series, the Wisps don't have a profile. Sticks DOES, and she has never properly debuted in the games made by Sonic Team. 16:47 Archie cancelled the licence because they wanted to move on from licenced comic books. Sega didn't really have much to do with it. IDW did denied the FF or any american character just because paying for licences is too much of a gamble, especially as IDW doesn't have the money Archie used to have. IDW cannot even reference the movies to not pay licences. They kept it safe with creating their own characters and using only game Sonic material. Hell, this can work too with Japan: the reason we don't see Cosmo, the Metarex, or Old Owl from the OVA is to not pay extra fees for characters not created in-house, despite Cosmo being designed by Sonic Team. Ultimately everything is about money and paying the creators. For example, the Pokemon company couldn't really use Mewtwo from the first movie again because he is owned by the writer; they had to introduce a second Mewtwo just to use the character again. And the character was used again...because the movie got a remake.

It could just be a copyright issue, since in those spin-off classic games Sonic Team they didn't make the characters themselves

19:58 Heh...SEGA-gregation... Also the chart with the Sonic class system with Shadow as king was fun. "All Hail Shadow" amirite? Great video. I love Espio's classic design so much..

surprised they don't just rerelease knuckles' chaotix and just retcon the classic biographies for all the chaotix crew. i don't know who's gonna tear down their walls over classic charmy being 9 years old instead of 16 or whatever

Well we do know that according to Ian Flynn, that Whisper and Tangle were actually approved by Sonic Team when crafting the characters, and that they had a hand in their overall design. And we also know that the first Sonic movie had a lot of help from Tyson Hesse, who changed a lot of the design and a few things in the script. So it’s not all too surprising that the owl character is in Speed Battles, as Sonic Team did possibly collaborate with them a bit

The whole "adding every Sonic character for Heroes" thing has me thinking about a non-canon Sonic Heroes 2 that does just that and has and lets you customize teams ala KoF. I think I remember you saying that you thought the story for Heroes was like a fighting game story, so it works. The whole thing with Classic Sonic and external media has me thinking about how Atlus treats Persona 1 and 2 (and SMT IF). It's not nearly as bad as with Sonic, but it's still sorta similar. Outside of costume DLC, the occasional vague background reference on TV, and the butterfly, those games have like no presence in modern Persona games. Marketing is a bit nicer nowadays, though since they do feature 1 and 2 alongside the rest even if not as prominently.

Ngl it would be really cool if Sticks actually appeared in a game, considering she was actually mentioned in Frontiers, which is set in the Modern universe and not the Boom universe.

Who new that a 20 min video about mobian segregation would be so interesting? 😂😂😂 Great video pariah!

What mysterious disappearance? Knuckles' Chaotix came out mid-way through 1995, roughly 2 and a half years before the release of Sonic Adventure and essentially the "death" (more like hiatus) of the Classic Era to make way for the new Adventure Era. Even still, the Chaotix were very relevant in the franchise, still being a relatively large part of the Archie comics continuity consistently ever since being introduced in the Sonic the Hedgehog Triple Troubel Special released the same year as Knuckles' Chaotix. As well as having a HUGE impact on Sonic the Comic immediately after their introduction in issue 53, again in 1995. Aka they became kinda big since their inception. Sonic didn't have much to provide in the years 1996 and 1997, only providing occasional spin-off nobody cared for. Even still, the Chaotix prevailed, not only through their Archie and StC presence but also Espio's appearance in Sonic the Fighters in 1996. Regardless, Sonic Adventure happens (first mainline game since S3&K), then Sonic Adventure 2, all the spin-offs in-between and surrounding these games either focusing on the main 4 (Sonic, Tails, Knuckles and Amy) or new characters like Cream and her friends and family in the Advance games. Then boom, there comes Heroes 2 mainline games after S3&K and whaddya know, the Chatotix aren't only here but are 3 of the 9 protagonists of the game, having their very own campaign. Then you know how it goes, they remain to this very day (ShtH, Rivals 2, Free Riders, Colors DS, Forces, TSR, all the Sonic Channel stuff, IDW, Murder of), appearing in other continuities like Vector in Sonic Boom, all of em in Sonic X and again all of them in the movie universe (they're in the official canon prequel comic released with the second film). "But these are the Modern Chatotix" but I'll pull the "UH-HA!" card on that argument by stating SEGA and Sonic Team's official word on the matter, that Classic = Modern, Classic is Modern's past and Modenr is Classic's future, they're both the same timeline, same cast, same everything. My point being? There was never a mysterious "Classic Chaotix" disappearance, they quite literally never left. Even in the franchise's most uneventful years they managed to have a presence. Even if anyone where to use the "still their Classic interpretations are different" I think Sonic the Fighters, Archie and Fleetway (all depicting the Chatotix's quote on quote Classic versions) are testament to how factually false this overall statement truly is. Nothing personal, fun video and you seem lovely, just saying ✌️

I mean I honestly think if Sonic Team wants the Chaotix to be their own so bad they should retcon the Classic Chaotix to be like their modern selves. Have the reason they were in Knuckles' Chaotix was because they were on a case investigating what was up with this island that suddenly showed up out of nowhere. Sonic Team are no strangers to retconning shit out of nowhere like the two worlds and Classic characters being from another dimension retcon and then suddenly retconning it back to normal. Just release a TailsTube episode where he interviews the Chaotix and they clear this whole thing up. (and then re-release Knuckles' Chaotix for Origins Plus.)

This is a great video. Makes a lot of sense.

The thing is that the whole sonic team theory is that Vector was a Sonic Team creation long before Sonic 1 was even released. He was a part of Sonic's Rock Band. So clearly, someone at Sonic Team designed those characters and hell back to the Japanese website, Even Sticks The Badger, a strictly USA creation, has her own page. So, I don't think that theory works as well. Even Charmy Bee was a creation from the early Sonic Manga, and he got into Knuckles Chaotix so.

16:41 the reason of the archie sonic comics cancellation is actually related to the second crossover with megaman, they bougth somany ip's for this event but the crossover didn't sell well so they lost profit instead of recovered it , this is also kinda confirmed thank to the megaman comics also being cancelled and then archie making kickstarters for their comics

Chaotix was actually made by the same branch of sonic team who made cd, so they all are sonic team characters

I liked the video and I do think you bring up a good point, but I think to put it simply the reason why the way it is to keep the brands stand out and separate, is if Classic-only characters appeared in Modern then what’s the point with keeping Classic around, and SEGA still wants to keep Classic Sonic around cause it still makes them money (well they are probably not gonna do much with him after Superstars sales) But after recent events like how TailsTube and the Fang 30th anniversary comic confirms Knuckles Chaotix is indeed canon on top of all that Vector making a small cameo in the Amy 30th anniversary comic, it seems like the Classic Chaotix is slowly making a comeback and SEGA is slowly opening up to Knuckles Chaotix, I think it was canon before because of Knuckles’ Chaotix poor reception and SEGA doesn’t want anything to do with it at the time, but with the announcement of a Knuckles 30th comic by IDW that should be coming out around October is where I think we will finally and properly see the return of the Classic Chaotix, with the only difference being that the Classic Chaotix’s characterization and personality will be more in line with how they are in Modern.

Perfect April fools day video, it’s technically discussing real annoyances but it’s treated overly seriously

Vector and Charmg were designed by Naoto Oshima at Sonic Team Vector was there in 1991 with Sonic, Mighty, Ray, and others. Charmy was made in 1992 at ST by Oshima for the manga. Plus, Vector and Espio's personalities weren't changed, they were just added to in Heroes. So your theory is pretty broken at the core because they ARE Sonic Team Characters

i forget if Penders is a problem for the archie characters or something but if not i think it’d be cool to re-purpose them in some way. At the very least in the new comics. Seems like a waist to just completely erase characters people like.

Penders basically throws a whole wrench into this scenario as this divorce was likely a knee-jerk response to drugged bees and a lawsuit. As in, a lot of humans from Sonic X are finding their way back into the films, while completely omitting the DiC Trio entirely since one of them happens to be attached to a notorious comic that features said drugged bees and a lawsuit. Thanks, Penders.

Id like to imagine that knuckles was just helping them out and after the game he just never spoke to them again

I know it's sort of an April Fool's joke, and of course I want to come in and dismantle your entire argument, but I've actually gotta strengthen it. Those mobile games you mentioned with the non-SonicTeam characters aren't SonicTeam games, they're Hardlight- the inclusion of comic and movie characters is between Hardlight, SEGA, and the rights holders for the characters themselves. Additionally, SEGA has been known in the past to be extremely strict with rules and mandates and regulations, to the point a friendly rivalry between SEGA Japan and SEGA America during the 90s quickly turned brutal, with the death of the Saturn and Hayao Nayakama reportedly abusing his staff, verbally and physically, for not keeping up with the American branch's output. And finally, as much as I hate to enforce stereotypes, I've seen far too many Japanese companies exhibit xenophobia for it to be a coincidence- and it makes sense, Japan is factually and historically a very xenophobic culture. So since a large chunk of these non-SonicTeam characters are produced by Americans and Europeans, it's not gonna fly. There's a reason there's a specific word for "filthy foreigner" in Japanese...

Yeah, this splitting of continuity is so dumb. The series continuity is already so fucky that they might as well just have fun and use any characters they want; like late Archie did.

It could also be that the creator's of non ST characters want royalties for the use of said character(s) in the games, so they restrict them to art and social media use to reduce the costs they have to pay to the creators. The Chaotix most likely had their majority ownership transferred over to ST.

babe wake up the goat just posted

Pointless minor spoiler that I'm going to dig deep into for no reason: Knuckles claims to have known Vector for a long time in The Murder of Sonic the Hedgehog. The thing is, if Sonic Heroes is the first canon game to feature them, then he would either have to be talking to Barry the Quokka (the player character,) Blaze the Cat, or Knuckles Chaotix is canon. Tbh the first one is the most likely.

Have you read the post reboot Archie comic? There all of the characters you mentioned from the classic continuity (minus the Chaotix obviously) have modern re-designs in line with the main game cast

I imagine this might also be the reason why Knuckles Chaotix has never seen a rerelease since its initial 32X launch. Similar to the other Classic characters in Heroes, since Chaotix missed that rerelease chance in Gems Collection, Sonic Team no longer wants to acknowledge that game’s existence.

Great video, one of my favorite you have made so far. Very fun.

I'm POSITIVE somewhere ST OUTRIGHT STATED they made a distinct separation between the classic & modern iterations. They technically alluded it by sayin somethin along the lines of the Chaotix in heroes bein their version since knuckles' chaotix wasn't made by them. This makes sense but as a freedom fighter fan THIS FUCKIN SUUUUCKS! I couldn't care less bout "classic shadow" & wut not but 1 of my big hopes may have been crushed to dust & oblivion. great investigation tho😢 edit: when I heard Origins plus might add new games(which it did) I KNEW knuckles' chaotix wouldn't be there & low & behold ppl R now askin "y no KC?" lol. They really don't see it as canon at all by this point & would rather u forget bout it

this is more recent, but in the idw Fang the Hunter comic series, which is a prequel to sonic superstars, Fang goes to one of the knuckles chaotix locations

Nintendo also does not ‘like’ non nintendo made characters for axemple daisy and walawugi

I Like Classic Espio, He Looks Cooler Than His Modern Counterpart

I hope someone asks Ian Flynn about this on the Bumblekast, would love to know

This rule would explain a lot why The Hard Boiled Heavies aren't allowed in Modern Sonic. That also means if the Freedom Fighters returned they would most likely be classic characters.

7:34 i know that archie sonic is technically not canon but mighty and ray actually got the same ''modern design'' remake in some sort of a way. they appeared on issue #264.

8:06 We already have a lot of Rouge "Love" by the fans,we DO NOT need a CHILD ROUGE,WE DO NOT

If this is the case, then...wow, that's fucking depressing. It just seems like such a petty reason to do something like that, if that is indeed what's happening here. Like, I *get* not having the Freedom Fighters around anymore. Their creation in the Sonic SatAM cartoon and NOT the Archie comics or Ken Penders notwithstanding, they are very much remnants of the early Americanization attempts of the franchise back when lore was barely a thing. So while it does my heart a big sad to see them disappear, that always seemed like an inevitability. But fucking Classic Khaotix? Vector is LITERALLY a character designed before Sonic 1 even released. He's a legacy character, so why erase that part of the character and franchise? So stupid...

looks like the tides are changing these days 😂

Missed the part where Tangle is referenced in Frontiers as well!

Fun fact: Vector The Crocodile appeared in sonic boom tv Which mean he's the only member of Team Chaotix to appear in classic,modern,and boom

The fact that the Chaotix are classic characters (with Vector being there BEFORE the first Sonic game) is weird but awesome to think about!

Kishimoto has noted that we could see the Freedom Fighters in a future game.

Modern Mighty appears in a Knuckles chaotix anniversary image and in minecraft dlc, So yea

Pariah did you try the Murder mystery Sonic that SEGA released yesterday?

I hope they'll appear as DLC characters for Superstars

i remember sonic posted a piece of artwork on twitter for knuckles' chaotix 20 something anniversary with a picture of the japanese box cover but replaced with modern versions of all of them, including mighty.

That Siri is so good and it kind of annoys the heck out of me