All grandstand/spectator questions answered in this video! kzfaq.info/get/bejne/h8WfoqtyqrmmdIU.html

Pretty sure the lack of spectators in gt7 is because youre in time trial mode. There are always way more spectators if you do an actual race

The fact that there’s a crowd during a time trial in Forza just means they only have one version of the track scenery whereas GT has more than one

Honestly I never even paid attention to the crowd. I’m to busy trying to not miss my braking marks 😂😂

I always thought the lack of spectators in GT7 was because nobody would come out to watch me race.

He knows the stands in GT7 are more empty due to time trial; he has said it in other videos!

Really focusing on the amount of spectators of all things???

Gt7s crowd population changes because your in time attack mode it appears less populated but that would be the case on shitty test day time attack day so pretty realistic I think

If you played GT7 this much you should already know that the spectators in time trial are always sparse..you know like in real life lol....the people only show up in mass for actual races....this is on purpose and you know it lol....if you wanted to see full grandstands just do a race

During a race I can confirm the grandstands are full, including the Mercedes stand in GT7. Use the 24hr version on GT7 and watch the trackside, very, very, very different to TT mode, you get smoke from the BBQ's, everyone is having party's etc, very cool.

I do think it's silly that FM added Track lights for night racing. If you watch Porsche: Road to Le Mans you'll see that Nordschliefe is pitch black at night.

The crowd in Forza also reacts to you and the race. Try crashing in front of the stands they will react, if you make passes close to them or slide in a corner they react...You will hear the go wild, or be in shock, all depends on the situation...

Little Detail: The first Corner of the NOS isn‘t called Hatzenbachbogen, it is Sabine-Schmitz-Kurve 😊

Digital foundry already debunked this is because you're using a time trail and GT7 also represent more accurate track details

RE Simcade/Simulation: I've only been sim racing for a few months now but I feel that if a game prioritizes the controller, it can be classified as a simcade. That out of the way: these both look phenomenal. GT has always looked really good and now that T10 has pulled their heads out of their butts, Forza is starting to really shine as well. Let's hope it continues!

Forza has that distinct grey-ish tint which looks better in my opinion

Visually speaking I think Forza looks quite a bit better than GT7 here. And I’m saying that as a PS5 GT7 player. Besides the tint, forza’s lighting seems better. There is way more detail in the track and even if you actually do a race for the higher population of spectators, Forza actually feels like a better ambiance.

In every video that compares any racing game to Gran Turismo 7, I am amazed every time how detailed Gran Turismo 7 is, from the cars to the race tracks

Looks a million times better in Forza. Beautiful rendition of the course.

Weirdos in comments getting triggered over a game I'll play both who cares 😂

I played ALL the GT series, I always hated the camera "static" feeling: no tilt, no shake, no zoom, it does not enhance the sense of speed in any view. It's almost stuck on the car like glue. This is one of the very few things that I like more in Forza games

Everything looks so much better in Forza 😍

In order whst matters to me 1.driving realism; sounds, a.i, physics, damage and wear. 2. Car roster/track roster 3. Visuals and attention to detail; shifter movement, handbrake, wipers, lights, and environment. 4. Upgrades and customization. 5. Online features; custom lobbies, class lobbies, track day lobbies, endurance. 6. Offline progression; by far my least concern, but still needs to be implemented for the longhaul and boast reasonable credit rewards to make it worth the time.

5:29 populating without any sense. T13 is closed years ago and is not allowed to use. And not at the 24h race. Simply never!

I don't see the grandstands full in real life when it's just track day without a race event going on. Unless you're a prime Michael Schumacher in Maranello doing time trials, no one will pay to watch a bunch of normal dudes doing trial laps lol.

Great Video! I live next to the nbr and visit Nbr very often. Even though Forza did a lot of things wrong at the time of release, I have to say that they did everything right with the Nordschleife. This is the first digital Nbr version that gives me the 24h nürburgring feeling that I have every year at the Ring. The backdrop, the neon signs, the smoke, the tents, everything fits. It all really comes into its own at night. However, they could have used a little less floodlighting on the Nordschleife. It's downright very dark on the Nordschleife but i think it is to make it less difficult for casual gamers... Nevertheless, a great job by Turn 10👍 Forza Motorsport is slowly but surely getting incredibly good.

I am regularly going to the the Nordschleife for some Tourist drives and Trackdays and IMO Gran Turismo has a better representation of the Track. Forza in this example has more the 24H vibe but there are areas where placing of camp sites are wrong, for example when you approach Schwedenkreuz the big Camp site is on the Left hand site of the Track not the right. And what is with those Flags littered around the sides of the track, nobody would Walk around NS and place them in the middle of the forrest. Also just from looking the Track in Forza just feels a bit of, like there is just something not quit right.

Digital Foundry already did a great “head to head” video with these games. He must’ve never seen it. It’s over an hour long very in depth, he even compares both track to real life using google earth💯 its really a must watch🙌🏾

I've been blown away by FM7's Nordschliefe in the best possible way. I've just spent the last few months watching the 2023 24 hr Nordschliefe a little bit at a time, and to me, the FM7 version feels far more like what I saw and felt while watching. Especially at night, where the side crowds and tents and signs just come to vivid life. I think it's incredibly well done, and I can finally start to get a real feel for the track through FM7. (I have both, loved GT7 first got the Xbox to try FM7 and FH5.)

Correction 🙂 GT Sport "was" built from the ground up. GT7 is not and is recycled and repolished GT sport code upscaled on the PS5

Time trial mode has less spectators than in a race for gt7

It pains me to say this as a die hard Gran Turismo fan, but Forza has become the better game of the two. GT7 is still amazing though.

It literally feels like a Japanese game vs a Wester game and I love the differences and competition!

"Man, in GT7, I feel like I'm all alone on the track and no one's watching me." well, I mean, you were when you recorded that.

Forza 8 might not be perfect but I have never played a game that plays so amazingly well on a Game pad ever before

For me, the feeling that the car is stopped, and the TRACK is what turns in the GT7...it doesn't change

Been driving this track on forza and it feels really dynamic, not sire how it feels on GT7 but Forza has done well, Gran turismo usually has better tree and bushes, more realistic, but Forza has actually replicated it pretty well here, the colours of the track surface and grass looks nice, ray tracing effect is a subtle enhancement but definitely nice.

I have to say that Forza looks better here... more alive . Well done Forza definitely right direction!

With your relationship with Logitech and with Turn 10 watching your videos it would be awesome if you could talk to either of them and see if True force is a possibility in Motorsport in the future

How many spectators you had when you drive Nürburgring Nordschleife touristenfahrten in real live?

Shocked Forza looks so much better. Well done

The Forza graphics look really good in this video

GT7 have a Nordschleife 24h version with some tents and NPCs along the circuit.

And the reason you break earlier in Forza is because of the wide angle lens in chase cam, which artificially increase the sense of speed (making far things even farther) BUT is not ideal for driving because you misjudge distance

When you do time trials in GT7 all of the tracks are way less populated. You need to start a real race to see more visitors on the grandstands.

Forza have really knocked out the park with this one

Forza ring is spectacular, everyone that's been in Adenau in real life or 24h can tell the massive difference and the amount of detail it has

I've been to VLN races (not 24h yet) and never seen stand as packed as on Forza, especially the AMG stand. In general, GT gives you more realistic feel of how it is to drive TF on the Ring.

It would be a lot better comparison if you actually focused on things that matter in a racing game, rather than crowds and trees, and shadows, we can all see that. Corners, curbs, textures, wobliness of the surface, plains and layers of memorable background features is what matters.

I wish the cars in Forza were as beautiful as the trees

Kinda feel like DigitaFoundry already settled this but why not. So yeah 100% FM23 has more stuff plastered along the tracksides. GT7 generally speaking is more IRL accurate at least for the time they captured the track data. When I say that it means correct type of foliage that’s there and not some random artist interpretation hindered with stock assets they place in a similar arrangement but are the wrong types. Also FM23 to my eye comes off way more grey/washed out in a lot of spots but the angle of the sun may have something to do with it. Something else I recall when there was the recent Manufactures Cup race there at night you could see smoke from the BBQ grills before Lauda left kink.moving over the track.

@Kireth so this is comparing GT7 vs Forza running on a PC correct? You mentioned a specific graphics card, so I believe that’s the case. What difference would it make running Forza on an Xbox instead?

I still believe Gran Turismo 4 has a very accurate Nordschleife

Forza ring looks so damn good especilly on PC, it looks generations ahead of GT7, as it should.

FM looks way better, much more detailed track surface whereas in GT7 it just looks flat, and better lighting and shading in FM as well

Forza more realistic.

8:21 Cuz you're in a time trial and not in a race. I feel like this guy can't make good comparisons at all

They are both great representations of the track and can't wait to see how they each feel to drive

Nice review thank you. My only suggestion would be you should do Xbox series x versus PlayStation 5 for this particular comparison.

So bassically GT 7 is more realistic anf Forza looks way cooler. And of course u get more detailes in Forza... U compare a 4090 against something like a 2070... x) I would like to see Xbox Vs Ps5 to make it more fair. Great stuff. =)

i want to say that ever since GT5 came for the PS3 i dont like the handling/gameplay/carmovement of Gran Turismo anymore, thats personal for sure but Forza is just driving better nowadays

Wow, FM is awesome!

Could not care less about track side graphics. The track itself is a lot more accurate in GT7, which makes it better to actually drive one, which is all that matters.

Flowers caled "Unkraut" in Germany🖖

The Gran Turismo video shows the logo that is displayed during the replay, and I don't think it is an equal comparison because Gran Turismo is processed with the replay video and the detail enhancement

When you say you prefer the control pad on Forza is that not just because the wheel physics are bad? Or is it mostly that you have to use 3rd person because of the lack of a radar and you just default to 3rd person n00b mode? Or both?

I'm surprised Forza actually looks better to me in this video

Forza definitely looks more accurate to real life.

How about playing forza on a xbox not on a pc at max settings

There’s less spectators in GT7 because your on time trial mode

This is bullshit. GT7 adjust number of spectators regarding the „seriousness” of the race - there would be almost no one during time trial (touristefahrte) and plenty of people during the race. Forza completely misses this detail.

Gt7 is the better driving simulator forces the better arcade driving game

GT7 looks smoother as if the game is running at a higher frame rate. Why is Forza Motorsports stuttering, is it running at 30 fps?

The fact that the stock nismo is shooting flames everytime you down shift is irealistic

If you actually play GT7… you would appreciate the different atmosphere you get and also from the Nurburgring vs the 24 Hour Nurburgring… they make it an actual event/party durning the Nur24 in FM they give you one setting like it’s always a huge event. GT7 wins I my opinion. FM Looks good though. Do a video at night!!!

I prefer the Forza side and if you play it and midnight with thunderstorm ⛈️ is just WoW 😲

Never thought GT7 would be so steril to watch at. Overly blue tint. Perfect painted curbs. New placed barriers. Overly green grass. Sony can have its battle of pixels. They have made this track so boring. Theres no vibe.

You're in Time Trials in GT so no filled stands, races have them filled. The added buildings and random filler in FM is just that, the fake hills and incorrect type of trees in FM are used in some locations to fill unscanned portions of the background that usually aren't missed in GT series. You have the advantage of a 4090 and the graphical fidelity is not anything that it should be with it maxed out and ray tracing on. But at least the track isn't 10% oversized anymore like in prior GT iterations. A better review would be FM on SeriesX so it would be an apples to apples comparision. Doing a comparision with one game being driven by a considerably higher amount of RAM and a GPU that is easily doubles the price of the whole unit the other is being played on seems a bit biased. As a person who has played both games on console, FM is far less impressive than it is on a higher end game rig.

I always thought that gt revolved around a more realistic looking game but I'm seeing here that forza's quality looks really good

Yeah stands are never filled up during time trials in game and real life but nice that Forza can’t spend that extra like GT7. Race in the Nordschleife in GT7 and all stands are filled and spectator tents are there as well as it should be when racing. Also make sure the you choose the same time as Forza. I do like the trees in Forza. Nice comparison though but I am glad fire isn’t constantly coming out the cars in GT7. Yes I could tell very easily from both games. Also stewards are in when racing. When practicing they are not in place, like real life.

Interesting comparisons I will say that looking back on Forza Motorsport 7 I never noticed the graffiti on the track!! To me that game had awful lighting and everything looked washed out. I feel like the lighting is much better here at least on the track surfaces. The floodlights being on the track here they don’t seem to actually be there in real life BUT I don’t mind them here it’ll make driving a little bit easier at night. I’m honestly loving it ❤ I’m grateful for what is here and I got the car I wanted most being the 2022 Cayman GT4RS❤❤❤

Population is normal in GT7, they already said before that championship races are more populated, why? Because it's an actual race, not a trial, in real life time trials are not populated either or barely

Did I get it right or you are actually comparing a maxed out version of forza on a 4090 with a ps5 game?it would have been wiser to use the xbox version...it just doesn't make sense especially analizing distant objects and general level of detail

Forza Motorsport for the win.

Idk if its me but my forza looks way better than his on this vid idk if its just the video doing this

IMHO Forza in general looks better, especially the trees, GT7 is too blue-ish-green .. Event decoration in Forza is nice and a bit over the tops, somewhat too Horizon-Festival-ish ..

Forza car looks like it has rear wheel steering. When the car swerves or turns right or left, the rear of the car swings out to the opposite direction.

Forza wins on this one

GT7 went with real to life down to tree lines. Forza added things

GT7 for me. I will say Forza foliage looks more natural which I prefer. GT7 looks a little more saturated colors.

Forza currently is the latest scanned version till competizione's version comes out, so GT cant compare to FM currently

Gran Turismo 7 takes you to the Nurburgring Nordschleife, Forza takes you to Nurburgring Disneylandschleife.

Obviously, enough people have said it already, but trackside density in GT changes depending on what type of event you're doing. You've said this before yourself, and it's pretty common knowledge that's shared across all sorts of videos like this from sim racing channels. The fact that you suggested it was something related to GT7 being derived from GT Sport would normally make me assume you don't know. And maybe you just forgot. But I'll be honest in that I've got a SLIGHTLY icky feeling that you actually just presented it that way for engagement. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt though, since I don't think you'd have belabored the point THIS MUCH if that was the case. Either way, I would personally really appreciate it if you did more research on this type of thing in the future, before potentially spreading misinformation. Same goes for when you pointed out the reflections in Forza and suggested that's the benefit of ray tracing. You can get those exact types of reflections from cube maps, which both games have on offer. Environmental cube mapping is very commonplace and has been for a long time. They're great at doing static objects that don't move... like curbs on the track. Their weakness is that they don't do dynamic objects... like rival vehicles. For those, you'd need screen space reflections (which wouldn't work well at all here), or something like planar reflections... or ray tracing. The reason you can't see the same reflections near as clearly in GT7 when you pointed it out, isn't because of the ray tracing. It's instead a combination of where you're at on the track surface, the license plate you have covering it, and the ways they handle paint differently. GT's paint system is far more complex than Forza's, and has a tendency to simulate level of gloss much more realistically. That paint, on that car, isn't glossy enough in real life to show those reflections that clearly. Find a glossier car in GT, and you'd see the same reflections you do in Forza. It's also worth noting that generally, when comparing GT's tree types and treelines to real life, they're more accurate than Forza's have been in this latest game. Same with trackside details like signage, though Forza does sometimes have GT beat there. Forza here looks pretty great. This comment isn't about suggesting that it doesn't; this is a track that seems to gel particularly well with Forza's rendering pipeline in this specific weather/time of day/etc. And for all I know, they could've heard the feedback about the sometimes shockingly inaccurate trackside details from the launch tracks, and really worked hard to make this one better. It looks great, and I mean... I'd HOPE so when you're using such a high end PC. But generally there's more attention to detail put in by Polyphony's track team, and I think that - as well as a lot of the knowledge needed to make a comparison such as this - was missing from this video. Color me disappointed, not because I need one game or another to """win""" to feel validated or whatever garbage. But simply because this video feels rushed in a way that can too easily spread unnecessary misinformation. It's kind of a mild slap in the face to the days and days, if not weeks or months of work some others have put into really making sure their similar comparisons are as fair as possible to both game. Especially when some of those channels AREN'T dedicated racing game channels. If they can get it right, I feel like you have a responsibility to try your hardest to do the same :(

Funny he goes on about crowds in the stands when everyone knows it's because in time trial in GT there are none so makes a vid acting like he doesn't know so people will comment about it and pump up interaction and views funny guy

Digital Foundry pretty much already put this to bed.

In a race they are way more people in the stands in GT

Great video! Can you also please make a comparison in night?

I have both games and like both in their own ways. It depends on what console you own and if it’s your only console. If you’re an XBox fan you have Forza. If you’re a PS5 fan you have GT. Either game will give you the racing fix that you desire as a racing fan.

The feeling of the elevation changes is so much better in the gt7 footage than in forza, it looks like it would feel a little more realistic. Also all these banners in forza around the track are quite unrealistic, never seen (or noticed) them before in real life

Both are amazingly done. But to my opinion FMs lighting system comes a bit too strong on this hot-summer-day color scheme. I mean, it makes most of the tracks look less colorful than they should be. GT7, on the other side, oversaturates the colors, which sometimes makes the track look borderline real, but in others - like plastic toy. If Turn10 will someday add the option to saturate colors manually, it will be an instant boost to realism IMO