@TheGodEmperorofMankind He stole your sandwich, didn't he?

@@acar7468 ah for fk sake everyone knows not to steal the Emperor's sandwich

ThatOneGuyWhoHasA KZfaqAccount he threw off his groove

😂

@@acar7468 I think he diiid

sudanema mimikiki Nope. Thanks to the Ecclesiarchy, the traitor primarchs are taught and were painted to be the ‘evil’ counterparts of the ‘good’ primarchs that the chaos gods made to oppose the God-Emperor. Even if the censorship went through, the Imperium’s religion would let it see light again.

@@gizmatalcoholic4113 only traitor primarch common folk know about is horus.

I understand why you're making the assumption, but I don't think this is necessarily true (I actually don't think BL has their ducks enough in a row to even have an actual story of what really happened but anyways...). It's possible that Horus just did too much to actually hush up and not that it was somehow less worse than whatever the two "lost" primarchs did. There's a big difference between having to hush up what ONE legion does and what 9 of them do (or 8...sorry can't be bothered to look). Plus the emperor was slightly fucked up at the end of the HH and Malcs was gone so it ain't like they could hush it up anyways. Not to mention it probably being hard to quiet something up when it's STILL a problem 10k years later.

Alexander Rüpke he’s talking about Molech.

Very good translation. Thank you for sharing that

Man that’s clever

Well it’s a good theory, but it has a couple holes in it, mainly that it’s evident that the two legions did get involved in the crusade, and I doubt they’d have been involved at all if they were THAT hard lined against it. Also, the state of the modern imperium really isn’t because the emperor is evil so much as it is because he was hesitant to kill his son. The lords of terra can say they speak for the emperor all they want but they’re full of shit. He has had little to nothing to do with the physical state of the imperium once he was interred in the golden throne, he instead acts only within the warp.

@@nikik5567 Good points, but the fact that they had joined the crusade does not tell anything about whether their behaviour was compliant, also the emperor has proven to be quite unpredictable and contradictory in his decisions. For example, Lorgar was allowed to act as a zealous missionary for literally hundreds of years, worshipping E as a god, until he was even sanctioned. Some of the primarchs eagerly presented their father with their own interpretation of his philosophy to please him, like children would do (e.g. Magnus, Lorgar, Roboute) - at least the ones who were not only pragmatic and obedient, that is. My personal view is that one of the primarchs succumbed to chaos due to his doubts about the emperor's ways and the other one tried to stop him. He had forged alliances with Xenos (compare the Interex) and learnt much about the warp and alien "magic", allowing him to defeat (kill?) his brother "lost" to chaos (demon prince?). Proudly (and foolishly in hindsight) presenting his successes achieved through a confederate/democratic system to his father, the emperor was not amused and purged the primarch and a part of his legionaries from history. This would fit the, say complicated, psychology of the emperor, as he was trying to hide the truth about the warp even from the primarchs, revealing it only to Horus (despite most of the primarchs already had more or less experience with the immaterium and just played surprised when E at last introduced the concept). The Rangdan Xenocides would in this scenario be a cover-up story for the events described above. Humans meddling and mixing with aliens was an abomination for the emperor, so purging this primarch excommunicatus-level was a no-brainer for him. It tells a lot about the emperor that the traitor primarch would only be referred to as "lost", even when he in this context was the real bad guy and threat. Falling to chaos seems to be more excusable than having business with Xenos. Big E has an at least twisted idea of moral, trust and loyalty - he demonstrated that and it resonates a lot in the behaviour of the remaining primarchs later in the crusade. But this is just my head-fluff I am sharing here.

@@nikik5567 iirc they do contribute to the war,the document just got purged,the legion also got redistributed to other legion after the purging also isnt emphaty sanguinus tho?

Danang M. Fauzan I think u misread my comment.

+

.

Sanginius on vacation oh, maybe a hive beacon? That or a system wide overmind? Or even some sort of gateway portal like in the expanse

I think he already did the subject

Patrick Milewski the jungle world of Ziaphoria, a little bit outside of ultima segmentum. The codex theorizes it's a homing device, but also says it radiates the hive mind to a extreme degree .

It was mention by Sanginus, that He feared to Tell the Emporer about the Gene Flaws inside his Legion. Indicate further He dont want his Sons purged for this. Like it is Not the First time.

Sapradon yeah I caught that. Maybe the legions had some kinda mutation that couldn’t be reigned in like the angels, so the emperor purged the legions, and since it’s the lost primarchs that the gene seed came from, he purged them as well knowing any new astartes in those legions would have the same issue.

@@nikik5567 I guess too, it had to be something dramatic. When even Malcador, state that they would had been no help during the HH.

Sapradon flesh change on steroids maybe?

Perhaps I'm recalling a theory from someone else, but my thoughts have long been that one of the legions is the "Lost" (physically or morally) and the other "Purged". Same outcome, but different reasons. One had some sort of gene flaw/mutation that required the entire legion destroyed. The other either committed an offense so grave that it was somehow considered worse than the Horus Heresy, or was potentially literally lost in time and space due to alien tech, magic, or a warp storm.

You mean the inquisition?

No thanks, don’t expect 3 naked custodes posing within my door

SuperAdamska64 too bad you are a furry HERETIC LION LOVING BITCH! YOU NEED TO SPEND MORE TIME BEING RAISED BY WOLVES!

Sam A. This is the second time I’ve had to explain this, I’m not a furry... furries are heresy, does having an animal as your profile picture make you a furry... NO

Another theory is...one of them are now the legion of the dammed, some sort of warp accident?

Oooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nice thinking.

You Guys have to read the Ferrus Manus primarch book. To tell if there was a warmaster before Horus Lupercal.

MiggeS what book is that??

Actually Lionel Johnson was supposed to be warmaster

@@em4rtzz Ferrus Manus primarch book from the horus heresy primarchs series

exactinmidget92 i would not report to what you monkeigh call commisar i would take his heart and soul to feast on

Get back in formation Guardsman

Oh by Isha..

Commissar Chaplain Radke yes get back to your slave pen commisar

For the love of- Eldar cosplaying was banned last week private!, now get back in line before the watchmeister verbally abuses you for something you didn't do, and take that Yarrick-wannabe off already.

I tend to think the same way.

That's what I thought Even Russ on his way to but prospo says it's not the first time he had to take care of brother marines

Russ doesn't seem like the type to fight guerilla wars.

We know for sure that the Space Wolves have already erased a Legion before they were sent to destroy the Thousand Sons. So it can be true for at least one Legion. The other is more secret, so that GW may utilise it later. I did create something for my own RPG campaign about it with a VERY good reason to delete the primarch from the records.

My thoughts exactly!

serioushamster YOU ARE TEARING ME APAHT LEMAN!

I know I'm late but... I DID NAHT CENSOR, IT'S NAHT TRUE, IT'S BULLSHET! I DID NAHT CENSOR! I DID NAAAAAHHT!!! O HAI MALCADOR.

And why he returned to Terra? To watch this Room of course

Comparing Big E to Tommy Wiseau is the ultimate heresy

michael howell if they had, any witnesses would have been purged by the ordos chronos and Hereticus. There's also that ordo whose entire purpose is to edit/falsify history, hopefully soon to be purged themselves by Papa Smurf (since re-establishing a true, uncensored history is one of his side gigs)

The Inquisition was founded way after the Horus Heresy, and had nothing to do with the lost legions

I believe even after their leaving of Imperial Service, the subject of those 2 Primarchs was still something of a terrifying subject. I recall a book that had a discussion between the traitor primarchs before the rebellion started, and Lorgar mentions the possibility of seeking out the lost legions, but Horus shouts down his suggestion and reminds him that they "don't talk about them."

Well as mentioned in the video, Flavius Alkenex does talk about one of them briefly to Fabius Bile. While they can speak of them it's more of a case that none of them have had a reason to.

xCaptainCrunsh but by the time the traitors could think about anything aside from conquering the Imperium and not getting killed by thier former brothers, the Inquisition was in full swing (being started by Malcador before he took the golden throne for the Emperor during the battle of Terra)

Zeparoh Everyone is Omegon, we get it already. ...No wai-

I can firmly say that I’m not alpharius, weather or not you believe it is up to you.

@@Sigmar_Heldenhammer we are all alpharius

I am Alpharius. He too is Alpharius.

@@OgamiClan Fuck you bitch, I am Alpharius. (No offense)

Fuck man they can't even stitch two pages back together.

Just gotta wait for the Mechanicus to find the legendary Duct Tape STC.

@@KertaDrake no the FLEX TAPE one

@@actualgorilla5573 Now I'm just imagining them finding a Billy Mays infomercial for Oxy Clean and weaponizing it against the forces of Nurgle.

@@johnathanblackwell9960 that would be a funny TTS episode

I've long thought the same, than one fell to Xeno influence and the other refused to kill his brother.

Primarchs were lost and purged. Legions had no fault and were saved by Dorn and Guiliman. Thats why UltraMarines grew big. That why Soul Drinkers had unknown geneseed. Their gene father was classified.

Ajehy that’s the perfect explanation for the carcarodons!

Even more ironic when you realize the biggest Legion/Chapter is the UltraMARINEs... the guys literally called "beyons the sea" have no knowledge of naval warfare.

@@KyrieFortune void warfare is considered naval warfare in a space setting, hence the imperial navy.

In my back story for the 2nd Legion, their Primarch and Horus were being considered for Warmaster, but a Mutation affected the 2nd Legion's Primarch that forced the Emperor ( under the advice of Rogal Dorn, Sanguinius and Lorgar) to place the Primarch under house arrest and order most of the Legion's strength transferred to the command of Lorgar, Guilliman and Vulkan.

@@williamamely7038 Eh, my backstory is that the 11th legion had previous encounters with The Rak'Dan, and while he had a bit of a grudge match going with The Lion, was called in as a temporary warmaster, while the Emperor focused on other things.

With what we know from Fulgrim's novels and other EC stories that lay hints about the Second (and notably comes the closest we have ever gotten to hearing one of them speak when Fulgrim recalls that 2nd called him arrogant for thinking he could take a planet with so few Space Marines, and Fulgrim thought he was a hypocrite), and recent talk from the Custodes basically outright confirming the 11th Legion was the Purged of the two and manipulated by their Primarch into treason, I think it went down like this: The second is discovered very early on into the Crusade, we know he was 3rd only after Leman and Horus. Even with this, his Geneseed isn't the most compatible for most people, so his recruitment remained lower. In response to this, the Second Primarch turns far more to securing better Wargear, Air Supperiority and advanced technology for his Legion to offset their numbers disparity. This soon turned into far increased cooperation with certain newly discovered Forge Worlds, and they became far more reliant on the Mechanicus and tied to parts of it. Not as a whole. It is known the Second Primarch was poking around the Ygma Monolith early on in the Great Crusade, and with them being closer to the Cult Mechanicus of course they try and study it. Possibly with some success later on, if they needed to be completely retgonned. The 11th Legion also had Geneseed issues and with a later found Primarch, they never really became a true full Legion. They spent almost 200 years watching their cousins win Glory and Honor and Hundreds of worlds. While they were sidelined with bad Geneseed and no Primarch . Aka Iron Warriors but far far worse as at least the Iron Warriors get to fight often, even if its thankless. This leads to inexperienced leaders, and a willingness to prove themselves no matter the cost or reason. The 11th himself has a bunch of different statements as to when he was found, but we also know that Big E didn't announce to everyone when a Primarch was always found, and their official reveals were not done in order of when they were actually reunited. So Big E dismissing the Lost and the Purged when meeting Corax could be just the Big E already knowing that those two pieces would not make it to the Heresy, and with how large the Galaxy was and how busy all the Primarchs were, Corax wouldn't meet either before their fates had been sealed. To top it off the decrees of not speaking about them at all, and mind wiping means any of those possible doubts or questions the Primarchs had would be gone. Which also tracks with Rogal and Guilliman ordering the mind wipes. More on why this makes sense after we talk about what just about everyone assumes the lost 2 were lost in: Space Carthage Or er the Ragdan. Considering this is GW, and Xenos in any era post War in Heaven means they run into Humans and can't really have more than a few paragraphs where they are winning. So of course Space Hannibal isn't going to be a Xenos. Space Hannibal was the newly found and eager to prove himself 11th Primarch, who rushed into the worst Enemy the Imperium would face until Chaos and got corrupted by Ragdan Biotechnology in the Second Punic War. This, being a Primarch boosted by Horrifying Xenos tech and with knowledge of the Imperium and the arrogance of the era, his corruption went unnoticed or unreported when he returned to Imperial Forces. From there, he uses this position to direct devastating counter attacks into Imperial space, and direct the Imperial assaults into the absolute worse fortified systems outside of Sol. This of course prompts more Legions to join in, bringing back in the Dark Angels when they hear that they didn't actually finish off a foe, the Space Wolves, the Second, and possibly even the Word Bearers alongside the rest of the 11th Legion coming in. Here the 11th sees an opportunity, having actually read the Imperial Truth and Lorgar's book (who we know he gave to everyone). Declaring Lorgar to be a traitor and saying he was religious, he ordered his own Legion to attack the word bearers before they could come into the conflict zone. This finally drew attention, and exposed the 11th as a traitor ordering Imperial forces to attack Imperial forces. With that, the 11th is eventually cornered and defeated by the Lion, Leman and the Second. Seeing what the Rangda are capable of, the Second orders the full use of all of their technology to combat them. Tech based off of the Ygma Monolith studies and possibly some (aka knowing AdMech (yes yes pre admech times but you know what I mean) a shit ton) of excavation of tech. Necron tech. Not exactly something to be showing off in public, let alone in the mass produced hands of an entire Legion. I mean the Dark Angels get away with it, but thats because the Big E said so. 2nd place tried to do what big Brother did, but found out like all little siblings, different rules for different kids. This is Big E, let's not act like he doesn't do that. Or possibly the 2nd just made it a little too public, so Big E couldn't ignore it like he did a lot of his sons other faults. Or my personal option that Big E didn't give a shit and secretly approved, but more or less had gotten pressured by Mars into erasing him. So instead he turned the 2nd into the lost Primarch. However the 2nd Primarch had a role that needed filling, and just because Big E finally got railroaded in politics by a screw up one of his sons made didn't mean he wasn't going to take revenge on the AdMech (yes, I know, fuck you its shorter to type and we know what I'm talking about) To add more headcanon, I also think the Second was an undiscovered Psycker or the counterto Magnus. So with a level of Aint Psychic removal now completely gone and someone to point the figure at (even if they couldn't remember it thanks to mindwipes), in retaliation for a lost son, the Emperor orders 25 Warlord Titans from Mars to replace his role, but more importantly for petty revenge even if they don't know it. At the height of the war its implied the Big E unleaded the Void Dragon, and this may have been prompted, so I can see it being any or even a mix of all the above. The corruption of a full Primarch by the Ragdan and a full Legion of Tech Heresy are very much counter to Golden Boys Rogal and Robert's views, let alone in the Great Crusade. Rogal says they would have lost if the two stood beside him still not because they were gone or wouldn't make a difference. But because their methods would have run counter to the Imperial Truth. They would have lost by becoming a different type of traitor in using xeno tech, and this is right after Old Night and with none of the Primarchs knowing of Chaos. This would be by and far the biggest sin of the times.

@@ssjjshawn I like it. And bonus points for bringing the Ordo Sinister into it, too.

Corvus has confirmed that that is NOT true.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA-!!!!

No no no, Sly Marbo is source of the genetic material Cawl used to engineer Primaris Marines.

no, being a primarch would be a demotion for him

Nah sigmar from fantasy is one of the lost primarchs because fantasy is a pocket dimension consitung of only 100 worlds but we only see one of those 100 because it could be the world that one of the lost primarchs landed on

Or they mutinied in response to their legions being all but wiped out in a pointless campaign. Some of them must have survived because they were sent into the ranks of the Ultramarines.

I'm amending my theory. It occurred to me that the Emperor might have had a far less petty reason for expunging his sons after their defeat. If word of two Primarchs and their entire legions being wiped out reached the greater Imperium, the myth of the Legions' invincibility would be shattered forever and could have potentially lead to mass revolts throughout the Imperium.

In the HH 30k book containing 1k sons, it said that the lost primarchs was exiled for deliberately throwing his legion away. Magnus used his sorcery to conquer the system within a year by reading the minds of the xenocide leaders and figuring out their weakpoints.

first of all the 11th primarch was rediscovered many years after the rangdan xenocide ended.

MiggeS they both participated in the campaign as far as I can I tell

TheGreatVakama112 Explain how that is possible.

You lost me. What do you mean explain how that's possible. Firstly, we know for a fact that their records were actually purged DURING the Xenocides, as all records of them were purged 43 years before the Drop Pod Massacre, whilst the Xenocides ended 6 years before the drop pod massacre, and started 45 years before the drop pod massacre, thus we can assume that they took part in the conflict, seeing as their legions did. Frankly I see no flaw in this theory. And following up to your statement that the 11th was rediscovered many years after the xenocides, again, from what I could find the xenocides ended 6 years before the onset of the Heresy, so it's immensely doubtful that statement is true.

thats what I'm thinking perhaps a great blunder of command, flawed gene seed or even corruption lead to the loss of an entire legion

So he was named a warmaster but the whole campaign was one big screw up so they decided to forgot that this ever happened. Could be.

I think it's more like Horrus is a replacement for the original one that was either killed in battle or executed for treason... it is theorized that one lost primarch got killed in battle and the other lost one was executed for treason pre-Horus heresy?

that exactly what I was thinking.

I do recall in one of the older 40K Theories videos about the lost legions (can't remember the name of the video) it was mentioned that the Ultramarines grew in size that eclipsed other legions. The theory was that perhaps the primarchs committed a crime but the space marines were innocent so they were absorbed into the Ultramarines legion. If that's the case then perhaps the legions were not lost but the primarchs might have been executed or otherwise killed. My theory is that perhaps they plotted against the Emperor of Mankind, he caught wind of it and had them executed in secrecy. This theory is flawed but I think it's possible.

Joshua Dowdall that's sadly impossible as they are purposefully built to be blank slates for the player to fill in.

Blood Ravens have essentially been confirmed to be successor to the Thousand Sons

TheMagicalPinata can you tell me where that was confirmed? I'd like to read about it

I saw in a carcharadons lore video that they will start getting shit done on a bigger scale should their founder/primarch return. Twist: the carcharadons refer to their founder/primarch as "The Forgotten one"

Thus the marines.

That's pretty dark and grim.

I was just thinking that too

Yes but a lore reason has been hinted at throughout the Hours Hersey books.

That is the official reason, though people usually avoid creating their own legions out of fear of Gary Su accusations.

Yes, but this does beg the question why do you need two lost legions?

There are 2 because there are usually 2 players in a single game. You can both make up your own legion that way and it won't mess with anything... until your next game of course.

Eric Grieve In modern canon that wouldn't make sense. None of the modern chapters come from open background templates, they all came from one of the legions, whether loyal or heretic. There would have to be some story mechanism which could tie them back to a heritage unique from the known legions. Even if those astartes were simply rolled into the Ultramarines, they would still be vanilla-marines. You could still make your own chapters in a chapter based 40k system without needing mystery primarchs.

No they were all males. Though it has recently been theorized that the Emperor didn't create Female Space Marines as a way to prevent natural births of Space Marines which is less controllable then gene seed.

TTS Emperor quote: "No girls allowed. They are yucky."

Patton528 that's actually a really good reason

None of that. The primarchs were all male because the emperor DNA is of a male. Since the primarchs were all male, the geneseed implantation only reacts to males. Simple as that.

also arent they sterile?

6 + Stevo Not gonna lie, I wish GW wouldn’t keep it a mystery anymore. It’s quite annoying.

Timothy Weller trust me they need to keep it a mystery. We THINK we want to know. But if we did it would only dissapoint. Mystery keeps our imagination going. And we can speculate on the snippets of information they give us.

Absolutely. If GW did publish info on the lost legions the fan boys would split between “love it, I’m buying both” or “ hate it, I’m leaving 40K” or “I shall choose to ignore this retcon”

I definitely agree with that, I actually went on to read other comments and someone said that GW told HH writers to stop saying anything about the lost legions because the lost legions were created so that people can role play their own legions of first founding chapters. Can you link me a source for this?

timothy weller I first discovered 40k in the early 90's. in the codex I read it had a list of the legions with 2 and 11 labelled as 'expunged'. that was it, no hints or clues and it's only now that we are being drip fed hints! at this rate I may find out the truth on my death bed!

someguy527 there not, when alpharius was found, the emperor said he would take control of the XX legion and would soon meet his 17 other brothers, then alpharius asked “arnt there 19 other legions? Wouldn’t I have 19 other brothers” the emperor than stated “that is a story for another time”

I do have something planned on thunder warriors in future

Sorry one more thing....when he emperor of mankind was going to name Horus Warmaster of the Grand Crusade he should have rounded up all the primarchs in one bastion to tell them if not about this project but of his plans that way there shouldn't have been any hard feelings and some understanding. But then we wouldn't have 40k what it is today. Just a thought

maybe they're known as the Lost because Angron got so pissed he threw them into space

Louis Johnson Well. . .probably not since Angron lost the Night of the Wolf. So I doubt that's why 2nd primarch was forgotten for that reason, since it was still somewhat early in the crusade, and the 2nd primarch didn't become "The Lost and the Purged," until after the majority of the Crusade was over and before Alpharius was found.

Angron kind of was a psychic healer with a shitty ability to absorb others pain if that counts

As one of the children of the 40K equivalent of Bane would put it. "Fenris breeds heroes like a bar breeds drunks -- loud, proud and spoiling for a fight."

Death to the wolves. Onwards for the red king of prospero!

...and his spiky tits. (!)

*ehem* There will be no dogs of war set loose this day.

SPF 80 deflects all lasgun strikes

Clearly it is to shoot it with a bolter.

Pedro Joao Well, first you make sure the beam has indeed finished being projected. If the wound is not fatal, you apply a clean bandage over the entire burned area, wrapping around the ligament in question and tying firmly. Be sure to pull away any cloth from the burnsite so as it doesn't touch the area, barring any material already seared to the skin. Ignore this rule in toxic areas where skin contact with the air/other would be dangerous in its own right, and instead field dress right over all clothing. If it is fatal, cover the wound just as before, but now instead simply for the moral of the one shot and for the surrounding troops. It is advised that once dead-dead has been reached, you search their pokets for loose power packs and rations. Be avised that flak armor absorbs energy, so it is best to avoid touching the metal parts of the armor. If your field medic isn't too busy, you may ask for his/her assistance- provided you follow this simple-to-follow chart to measure the severity of the incident. Time is a very important resource, private. regimental-standard.com/2017/09/20/so-youve-been-shot-a-flowchart/

Yer the mutation theory dons't make a lot of sence because it if was that bad it would almost certainly have shown to some extent during the creation of the legion and in that case why continue. Battle losses makes a lot of sence but in that case the purging from records seems a bit harsh, mybe the impirum wouldn't want legions being defeatable to be discussed among the common man but would surely have hurt the moral of the other legions. From the description of there enemy I wonder if it was some kind of technolog induced betrail i.e. they got borged.