Hello Joe thanks for checking us out. The reason for vacuum advance is because of part throttle at Cruz the cylinder fill is very low. At idle is the same. There are occasions when it's not the way to go. I've had it before were there was a hesitation on initial throttle movement also it might when idle is set and with a automatic put in gear the vacuum drops off enough to set the idle to stall In any case back in the 50s most were tide directly, not ported vacuum. Ported was a way for some smog to be met with federal smog standards and not for proper idle. When full time vacuum works the throttle is snappier and it does help economy especially in town. Sorry for the essay.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 Not at all, Always looking for a thorough answer. Not to knock the 50's but definitely antiquated by todays engines and components. In all the years I've built engines, too many trust me, I've found constant vacuum to be unreliable. Idle drop off with an automatic can be a torque convertor problem, however I've found that with ANY engine issue - vacuum leak, bad plug wire, bad plug ect. , if the engine struggles and you lose vacuum you will lose timing, making it worse. If with constant vacuum your timing is say 20*, if you have an issue, your timing may drop to say 13/14*. If I use ported, and the distributor is SET at 20* and a cylinder goes awry, I still have 20*. In a street/drag situation, neither has any vacuum when the throttle is slammed open, but the ported setup will start out at 20*, where will the constant vacuum set up be when for that second or 2 there's none/little vacuum to draw from? It's easy to see you know what your talking about, I respect your answer, that's why I ask.

Joe very cool and good points. I'll go further on idle drop and vacuum falling off the timing dropping to initial of 14....most people go by the book so it's probably going to fall to 0 or 6 or 8. But I should have clarified that the initial is at 18 or higher which is part of the point to all this series of vids. If your running a large cam that idles at low vacuum the full time is almost the same as ported so there is little or no advantage to full time. But depending on the carb (size) ported timing comes in so late because very little throttle is needed to go 45 to 50 because of the large throttle bore. vacuum is not going to be there on the port and helps for economy and when using a colder plug, fouling is hopefully avoided with the high timing. One other thing the carb on the 440 is a spread bore and with the tiny bore, it is right at the transfer to idle making the mixture screws almost useless. And ful time vacuum helps to avoid drilling the throttle blades. I hope that makes sense. Thank for the great comments and your rebuttal. 👍

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 Definitely Have had ALL those carb situations! Thanks for your insight and response.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 U make so much sense! Thank you, both, for the discussion. 👍

I agree

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Thanks for the kind words! Chris and I feel the same about ignition. Get it right and then carb. That is true for all makes. As far as gm ignition is concerned, you guys have an advantage as far as ease, so take advantage of it. Ford and mopar guys probably won't take the time to fix it right for them, and it's way more important than carb tuning, although carb tuning is very important. Thanks for watching!!!

Hey as far as GM tuning goes, go check out wolf wenglers one car garage. This guy is spot on and some of the best carb stuff out there. Even if you don't use a holley you can apply the thinking.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 I am a Holley guy. So I will check it out. Thanks 👍

Felix he love the tinkering. Nothing pulls the kids these days away from the computer or Xbox. But I don't have to, if he's not asking as soon as I tell him he turns it off and here we go. Cars saved me from the riff raff when I was in school I hope it does the same for him and I believe it will.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 thank you for taking time to sharing! He looks very smart too! I really feel proud of you both. Remember me my grandad and myself.. Wish you great week...

Thanks ....your next my friend them youngins will be ready soon

This vid is what you been saying for along time

I new it work on all models lol

When me and the boy went get are hair cut, he got his cut first and had it spiked up. The same lady cut mine next and when she asked how do you want it cut I pointed at Jacob and said just like that. When Jacob seen my hair he just busted up laughing and it was worth it instantly.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 hahaha...

Thanks i love the comments and these are the best. Keeps us motivated

Hey, jsherman, thanks for watching. Yes I have had to adjust the vacuum and I show that in the vid, Mopar distributor curve make yours right part 4. Check it out tell me what you think. Thanks again for watching.

That dist vacuum is 12 degrees so 34 is the total at idle initial plus vacuum

Ya there's always something new to deal with. We used a new camera and when I'm editing i just turned the sound level not realizing the result. I guess it's always a work in progress

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 No worries on the sound John it was still an excellent video. Back to the second part of my question what does your initial timing look like with the vacuum pod hooked up at idle? I presume it's higher then 22 with it hooked up. Also do you run your /6 hooked to manifold vacuum as well?

@@blakegaddis946 im sorry for the delayed answer. 31 degrees initial plus vacuum timing. the barracuda is not the same . the barracuda is ported cause thats the only vacuum port available. its a car i take to shows for display so i want it looking stock. i would past that

Hope ta c ya soon going to Sikeston race the off to cruise n the coast so getting busy but we gotta work something out

The sound thing we were working with a new camera and just get the sound le el right always something new to improve on

All is well here, just busy with racing and work. Jacob and I have been filming, so some stuff soon, I hope. Thanks.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 thank you!!

I'm not sure if this is what your after but when the gun is at zero you will see the degrees on your timing tab. So if your timing is at 10 btdc the line on the damper will line up with the 10 on your tab or vice-versa if your degree marks are on your damper. But when your program the gun at 10 the marker will line up with zero. So if you program the gun at 30 or were you deem it to be necessary and turn your distributor till the mark lines up with zero (which is not on your tab cause they don't go that high) then you know your timing is at 30. Hope that helps

Will save a dime

I'm not sure what your meaning is by max base timing. I'm guessing your meaning total minus vacuum. Total is found at wide open throttle with hopefully the carburetor tuned properly. After the 3 points of timing are found, initial, total and total with vacuum, all these are installed in your distributor so that your initial is correct and wide open is correct and vacuum is correct in one distributor. If you change anyone of these points in your timing, all others will change with it. So your distributor curve needs to be readjusted so you can have the change and keep your other numbers the same. This vid is how to find just the 2 numbers so you can have the right curve and have it all, excellent starting, best economy keeping plugs clean and ready to race

I have never personally work with 1 Rob but I have friends that have them. They love them. They have been very reliable. I don't know about what the factory curve looks like but that would never stop me from using 1.

If I'm reading this right, if you need to change the settings just disconnect it. The engine will slow but that's OK, make your change. If you meant something else type away. Thanks for watching.

It is a demon. I don't know what the size it is. I'll have to check but I love it. No dead spot starts easy about 15 mpg. I set idle mixture and idle speed and it worked great. I've taken it off tobtune a thermoquad and I'm gonna try a few more carbs but so far out of the box its been good.

Anyone that says the only way on most subjects is limiting themselves so be careful you might lose out on a chance to improve yourself bob

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 I'm 73 and tried them all. The vacuum gauge came out on top, Bob.

Curious . . "if every engine is different" , why do you use 2 constants of 2500rpm and 34-38* joe bob ?

@@joemancini3258 I only work with small and big block chevy street engines, it works for me. But as a rule, every engine I've tuned ended up around the 34 to 38 total timing all in by 2500 rpm.

@@joe-hp4nk Sorry . . . . didn't realize sb and bb chevy was "every engine"

This video is for finding where your initial should be and where your vacuum advance should be. You will need to find your total minus vacuum, and then you need to perform a recurve with all 3 results. So if you advance your timing until the engine kicks back on startup, then back it off until the kickback goes away. That right there will be where your initial should be set. The hard one to find is total without vacuum. But once you find that, then you will curve your dist so it has your initial that you found and then total out to what you found minus vacuum. Then the last step will be to adjust your vacuum pod with your alan wrench till you achieve the highest rpm minus 2 degrees.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 perfect. Thank you. Tomorrow’s task is to get my ‘69 F250s timing dialed in. I already made a substantial improvement switching from ported to manifold. Engine runs waaay cooler and quieter and my mpgs went up from 14 to 17. I was under the impression that retarding the initial advance would make for better startups…. But then I came across your video. Initials sitting at 14 right now so I’m interested to see where it wants to go up to from there.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 Hi Tall John. I’ve been fiddling with the timing on my truck today. I started off by advancing my initial to where it kicks back on startup. I got up to 26 degrees without kickback before my canister bumped into a hose clamp and I couldn’t go any farther. I wondered to myself what’s the difference between advancing my initial way up to at least 26 vs. just letting the vacuum advance take care of it? Well, I left the initial at 26 and drove down the road listening for pinging at WOT. It pinged. So, according to your videos, I knew I had to limit my mechanical advance in order to take that ping away. Again, I thought to myself, instead of messing with the mechanical advance, why don’t I just leave the initial at 16 and let my vacuum advance canister take care of the extra advance at idle? With my mightyvac on the canister, I determined that the engine likes to idle at 32 degrees because it gave the highest rpm there. So, I set the initial back to 16 degrees and the vacuum advance canister brings in the other 16 to make 32. It idles well and doesn’t ping at WOT but my exhaust stings my throat. Tall John, what do I do and is there a benefit to getting my initial up like you explained in your videos rather than just letting the vacuum canister take care of it? I want to get the most out of this truck so I’ll do whatever I need to do. Or, is it better to get the initial up to at least 26, limit and dial in the mechanical advance by possibly putting a 10L plate in there (it’s set to the 13L slot right now), and then adjusting my vacuum canister down to bring in that extra 6 degrees to get 32 at idle? Is it going to be worth it to make all those changes?

It's a fix, just move all your plug wires 1 at a time all the way around to the direction of advanced the rotate the distributor 45 degrees retard and then now plenty of room

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 yes but why don’t I just let my vacuum canister take care of the extra timing instead of advancing my initial? Is there an advantage to having higher initial with lower vacuum advance vs. lower initial with higher vacuum advance?

They engine temperature is lower. When the timing is low, it forces you to open the throttle to maintain speed. This produces more heat. I drive this truck every day and tow a trailer to the racetrack almost every weekend. In the summer and the gauge never comes off the normal running mark. The radiator is old and original. Temp wise I can't say but it has a 180 degree thermostat. This has always been the situation on all my cars. Roadrunner, challenger, GTX.

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 I ended up with 47 all in like you which kind of scares me. My gauge reads low but don't know if I could trust a 50 yr old unit. My infrared gun reads 240 at the block and I'm running straight water with hyperkool, don't know if I trust that reading either..

Trying a new camera. It always sounds good when I'm editing but your right

@@talljohnsfunshop2722 your just to tall for the sound to get to the mic LOL

Lol I wish that was the excuse...second thought ill take it.

I'll check it thanks

Thanks for the input

Thats the norm for a long time. and that were i always start. depending on caming and compression and stall speed it will very. the dist in the truck currently has a lighter then stock spring so that the timing is max at idle but it starts at 18 with full time vacuum. I can get away with it because the compression is 7.4 to 1. If your running higher compression you might not be able to do that so all in by 2000 is a great place to start. thanks for check the channel out!!!